So Katowice and the 2021 EPT circuit are finished, and we're due for at least one more year of structured pro StarCraft. But what's going to happen after? Will we get another year of EPT, or even several years? Is Blizzard interested in SC2 as an esports? Could the scene survive independently with tournaments like TSL, HSC, etc.?
Michal Blicharz aka Carmac talked about StarCraft's role at IEM Katowice, and according to him, "StarCraft is an integral part of the fabric of Katowice". Arguably that's exactly what he needs to say when he's in large part responsible for the event. Is this a polite PR answer, or does he actually support having SC2 as part of the tournament, even with possibly less Blizzard involvement?
Link timestamped to relevant part.
So what will the future look like? I'm assuming ESL are currently negotiating with Bizzard about continuing EPT, and we might not find out for a while.
But what do you think will happen? Independent, fan-funded tournaments, another series of EPT, or something in between?
I think there will be another series of EPT. There might have been already without Microsoft buying ATVI/Blizzard but surely they will invest in the different IPs if they showed it in their promotional picture. Sc2 was also the #2nd "most profitable" game behind CS:GO (although quite far behind) in the twitch leaks a few months ago, in terms of twitch subs / ads / bits, which does not mean that much except that it's still a successful game for ESL. I heard the viewership was not as high this year for Katowice sc2, but it's probably a combination of bad time for NA viewers as well as the current situation in Europe.
On March 02 2022 19:43 Poopi wrote: I think there will be another series of EPT. There might have been already without Microsoft buying ATVI/Blizzard but surely they will invest in the different IPs if they showed it in their promotional picture. Sc2 was also the #2nd "most profitable" game behind CS:GO (although quite far behind) in the twitch leaks a few months ago, in terms of twitch subs / ads / bits, which does not mean that much except that it's still a successful game for ESL. I heard the viewership was not as high this year for Katowice sc2, but it's probably a combination of bad time for NA viewers as well as the current situation in Europe.
Yeah, I was thinking the same I mean big news on Europe and Ukraine, and for America, times were not so good I was watching at 5 am in my time zone.
That's awesome we still have a higher up championing Starcraft. Even if its profitable, I fear there's still opportunity cost to keep going with its inclusion.
On March 02 2022 19:43 Poopi wrote: I think there will be another series of EPT. There might have been already without Microsoft buying ATVI/Blizzard but surely they will invest in the different IPs if they showed it in their promotional picture. Sc2 was also the #2nd "most profitable" game behind CS:GO (although quite far behind) in the twitch leaks a few months ago, in terms of twitch subs / ads / bits, which does not mean that much except that it's still a successful game for ESL. I heard the viewership was not as high this year for Katowice sc2, but it's probably a combination of bad time for NA viewers as well as the current situation in Europe.
Yeah, it started @ 2 AM for me so I had to watch replays.
Also, there are YT numbers that pay out quite well, on top of twitch numbers. I think the base has a loyal enough following to turn a decent profit from both platforms.
I think the base is there, I could certainly also see the fan base doing more funding, if it ever comes to being no pro Starcraft or dipping the hands in the pocket
We can probably get another "ESL" type tournament series. The budget will almost certainly get slashed in the near future, to be fair it does make a bit of sense, the last few years have given out more money than most in all of SC2, but it's pretty clear at this point that it did not really managed to foster a lot of new talent. With that said, ESL can probably keep going at least one more year, the circuit is already well iron out and the viewership is ok if not great.
I think that GSL is probably done after next year though, almost every Korean players will have retired come 2024 and I just don't really see SC2 having a BW-like renaissance with post military guys. Plus I'm not sure how easy it will be for Afreeca to reach out to Blizz and negotiate a new deal with all the changes of personnel. Maru better get that G5L quick.
Starcraft is fortunate to have the history it does. Arguably built the ground for all of modern esports. People who matter care for it even if the masses don't. So I think there's a chance it carries on even if it doesn't make perfect financial sense.
On March 03 2022 11:48 Nakajin wrote: We can probably get another "ESL" type tournament series. The budget will almost certainly get slashed in the near future, to be fair it does make a bit of sense, the last few years have given out more money than most in all of SC2, but it's pretty clear at this point that it did not really managed to foster a lot of new talent. With that said, ESL can probably keep going at least one more year, the circuit is already well iron out and the viewership is ok if not great.
I think that GSL is probably done after next year though, almost every Korean players will have retired come 2024 and I just don't really see SC2 having a BW-like renaissance with post military guys. Plus I'm not sure how easy it will be for Afreeca to reach out to Blizz and negotiate a new deal with all the changes of personnel. Maru better get that G5L quick.
I see Brood War itself being at least a contributory factor in SC2 not having a Brood War-risqué renaissance.
Some of these folks may have unfinished business there. I’m not an expert in that scene by any means but from what I gather guys like Inno, Stats, soO were either already solid Proleague fixtures, or well on the road establishing themselves that way, extremely talented players who didn’t get to maybe fully mature due to the switch to SC2. Or at least win big individual honours.
I could see the combination of a considerably larger (potential, I’m not sure what the actual market for an Inno/Stats would be) streaming revenue, on top of a new challenge in a field they’re rather familiar with being very attractive.
Assuming they come back to gaming in any capacity. They are all individuals with their own motives and aims, much of which is unknown to us.
Maybe soO is done, maybe he burns for a 7th time lucky in a GSL final. Maybe TY wants to become a postman while he’s not casting games, maybe Inno plans to donate his body and truly become a cyborg.
Who knows? There may be some retention but I’d wager that at least a few of those real S-class pros who are currently in military won’t return to SC2, for whatever reason.
With no internal development of Starcraft I don't see how ESL will continue after next year. The talent that built SC2 is long gone and Frost Giant just received another round of funding for their RTS. The games at Katowice were so awesome this year, maybe the best games i've ever seen. Perhaps the current quality of games and rich history of SC2 will carry it onward, but in my mind you need some sort of development to attract people back to the game. Warchests, balance testing, something.
On March 04 2022 00:45 Ctone23 wrote: With no internal development of Starcraft I don't see how ESL will continue after next year. The talent that built SC2 is long gone and Frost Giant just received another round of funding for their RTS. The games at Katowice were so awesome this year, maybe the best games i've ever seen. Perhaps the current quality of games and rich history of SC2 will carry it onward, but in my mind you need some sort of development to attract people back to the game. Warchests, balance testing, something.
No you don't. Brood war doesn't have any of that and it barely functions and it's made a massive comeback in korea!
On March 04 2022 00:45 Ctone23 wrote: With no internal development of Starcraft I don't see how ESL will continue after next year. The talent that built SC2 is long gone and Frost Giant just received another round of funding for their RTS. The games at Katowice were so awesome this year, maybe the best games i've ever seen. Perhaps the current quality of games and rich history of SC2 will carry it onward, but in my mind you need some sort of development to attract people back to the game. Warchests, balance testing, something.
No you don't. Brood war doesn't have any of that and it barely functions and it's made a massive comeback in korea!
Doesn't BW has control over their mappool? And SC2 doesn't?
On March 04 2022 00:45 Ctone23 wrote: With no internal development of Starcraft I don't see how ESL will continue after next year. The talent that built SC2 is long gone and Frost Giant just received another round of funding for their RTS. The games at Katowice were so awesome this year, maybe the best games i've ever seen. Perhaps the current quality of games and rich history of SC2 will carry it onward, but in my mind you need some sort of development to attract people back to the game. Warchests, balance testing, something.
No you don't. Brood war doesn't have any of that and it barely functions and it's made a massive comeback in korea!
Doesn't BW has control over their mappool? And SC2 doesn't?
what controls BW's ladder map pool is ASL. And by that I mean whenever Bli$$ard decides to make another ladder season, they will be using current ASL maps.
On March 03 2022 11:48 Nakajin wrote: We can probably get another "ESL" type tournament series. The budget will almost certainly get slashed in the near future, to be fair it does make a bit of sense, the last few years have given out more money than most in all of SC2, but it's pretty clear at this point that it did not really managed to foster a lot of new talent. With that said, ESL can probably keep going at least one more year, the circuit is already well iron out and the viewership is ok if not great.
I think that GSL is probably done after next year though, almost every Korean players will have retired come 2024 and I just don't really see SC2 having a BW-like renaissance with post military guys. Plus I'm not sure how easy it will be for Afreeca to reach out to Blizz and negotiate a new deal with all the changes of personnel. Maru better get that G5L quick.
I see Brood War itself being at least a contributory factor in SC2 not having a Brood War-risqué renaissance.
Some of these folks may have unfinished business there. I’m not an expert in that scene by any means but from what I gather guys like Inno, Stats, soO were either already solid Proleague fixtures, or well on the road establishing themselves that way, extremely talented players who didn’t get to maybe fully mature due to the switch to SC2. Or at least win big individual honours.
I could see the combination of a considerably larger (potential, I’m not sure what the actual market for an Inno/Stats would be) streaming revenue, on top of a new challenge in a field they’re rather familiar with being very attractive.
Assuming they come back to gaming in any capacity. They are all individuals with their own motives and aims, much of which is unknown to us.
Maybe soO is done, maybe he burns for a 7th time lucky in a GSL final. Maybe TY wants to become a postman while he’s not casting games, maybe Inno plans to donate his body and truly become a cyborg.
Who knows? There may be some retention but I’d wager that at least a few of those real S-class pros who are currently in military won’t return to SC2, for whatever reason.
Bogus aka Innovation and Stats streaming BW would be huge and I'm sure they would have no problems at all with making a living via BW streaming and playing tournaments here and there. I really hope it happens.
On March 04 2022 00:45 Ctone23 wrote: With no internal development of Starcraft I don't see how ESL will continue after next year. The talent that built SC2 is long gone and Frost Giant just received another round of funding for their RTS. The games at Katowice were so awesome this year, maybe the best games i've ever seen. Perhaps the current quality of games and rich history of SC2 will carry it onward, but in my mind you need some sort of development to attract people back to the game. Warchests, balance testing, something.
No you don't. Brood war doesn't have any of that and it barely functions and it's made a massive comeback in korea!
Very true, but will ESL continue to invest if Blizz barely looks at the game? I guess anything is possible, and I hope EPT sticks around!
On March 04 2022 00:45 Ctone23 wrote: With no internal development of Starcraft I don't see how ESL will continue after next year. The talent that built SC2 is long gone and Frost Giant just received another round of funding for their RTS. The games at Katowice were so awesome this year, maybe the best games i've ever seen. Perhaps the current quality of games and rich history of SC2 will carry it onward, but in my mind you need some sort of development to attract people back to the game. Warchests, balance testing, something.
No you don't. Brood war doesn't have any of that and it barely functions and it's made a massive comeback in korea!
Very true, but will ESL continue to invest if Blizz barely looks at the game? I guess anything is possible, and I hope EPT sticks around!
Idk, I think its apples and oranges. Brood War doesn't have that, but it has all this infrastructure located around Seoul where they had concentrate resources. I think SC2 being way more global makes that a harder sell, since you need money to get players together. As opposed to korea where you're just a train ticket away.
EPT
