• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 00:22
CEST 06:22
KST 13:22
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S Season 2 - RO4 & Finals Results (2025)7Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy4Code S RO8 Preview: herO, Zoun, Bunny, Classic7Code S RO8 Preview: Rogue, GuMiho, Solar, Maru3
Community News
Weekly Cups (June 9-15): herO doubles on GSL week0Firefly suspended by EWC, replaced by Lancer12Classic & herO RO8 Interviews: "I think it’s time to teach [Rogue] a lesson."2Rogue & GuMiho RO8 interviews: "Lifting that trophy would be a testament to all I’ve had to overcome over the years and how far I’ve come on this journey.8Code S RO8 Results + RO4 Bracket (2025 Season 2)14
StarCraft 2
General
Code S Season 2 - RO4 & Finals Results (2025) Nexon wins bid to develop StarCraft IP content, distribute Overwatch mobile game Rain's Behind the Scenes Storytime Firefly suspended by EWC, replaced by Lancer How herO can make history in the Code S S2 finals
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series SOOP Starcraft Global #22 $3,500 WardiTV European League 2025 [GSL 2025] Code S: Season 2 - Semi Finals & Finals WardiTV Mondays
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] Darkgrid Layout
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 478 Instant Karma Mutation # 477 Slow and Steady Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target
Brood War
General
ASL20 Preliminary Maps BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion Recent recommended BW games FlaSh Witnesses SCV Pull Off the Impossible vs Shu
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL 2v2] ProLeague Season 3 - Friday 21:00 CET Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL20] ProLeague Bracket Stage - Day 4
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason What do you want from future RTS games?
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread Echoes of Revolution and Separation
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
A Better Routine For Progame…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 33128 users

GOAT Community ranking - Page 14

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 12 13 14 All
FrostedMiniWheats
Profile Joined August 2010
United States30730 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-05-01 23:17:18
May 01 2018 23:06 GMT
#261
On May 02 2018 01:51 Fango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 01 2018 08:40 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:There was also the 2014 Blizzcon where MMA, Life, and Taeja rolled Zest, soO, Classic, and Bogus. MMA, in particular, is of interest considering he hadn't looked like a title contender since early 2012 but he followed up his surprising Blizzcon performance with an even more dominant code S run. Really makes you wonder if a lot of the older players simply aren't as driven anymore and absolutely could be dominant again if they really desired.

Oh and Marineking randomly deciding to be a TvP beast again (and a Kong...)

Really, most of 2015 had a healthy amount of both Kespa and pre-Kespa players posting relevant results. Which is important as I would say that was the most competitive sc2 year overall with 2014 narrowly trailing.


The Kespa players dominated in korea especially and raised the skill level significantly. Many of the pre-kespa players couldn't keep up with them in korea and started competing elsewhere. Even the best pre-kespa players were mostly weekend warriors. With exceptions being the absolute best (Life, PartinG, Maru etc)


Yeah, I've heard this one before. All throughout 2013-2014 about the "Korean runners" fleeing from the "true pros". When in actuality that was probably only true for a small percentage of them (pains me to say it, but NesTea would fall into that category ;; ). The vast majority were probably just looking for easier money and a little travel adventure in foreign lands. You have to remember these guys are also doing this as a job. I'm sure a lot care about being the best but their are of course financial considerations as well that take priority. All 3 WCS regions paid the same amount of money from what I remember, so try to see it from their perspective:

Would you rather try your luck in a group like this that isn't even code S level... or play a bo5 against Catz to make it into WCS AM Premiere for the same amount of money?

Do you remember what the dawn of 2015 was like where we had all kinds of mid - top tier Koreans scrambling to get on foreign teams because they wanted to travel to foreign events? Rain, Fantasy, Soulkey, Hydra, etc all passed up other Kespa teams for foreign opportunities instead.

The dawn of 2015 also had this little season that you conveniently danced around (21/32 of Code S are pre-Kespa players).

In fact, I don't believe Kespa players held the majority of spots in code S until the beginning of 2014 which again, was due to the pre-Kespa players having more leeway to travel to other regions. I will, however, concede that in time that the Kespa pool of players have had more ro8+ representation and many more starleague wins since their arrival. So it is fair to say that they're considerably more top-heavy.

tl;dr: Kespa players ofc raised the skill level. The injection of 7 Korean teams worth of them into the scene is bound to do that.I just don't believe there was a big disparity in skill when comparing the average Kespa player to non-Kespa player.
NesTea | Mvp | MC | Leenock | Losira | Gumiho | DRG | Taeja | Jinro | Stephano | Thorzain | Sen | Idra |Polt | Bomber | Symbol | Squirtle | Fantasy | Jaedong | Maru | sOs | Seed | ByuN | ByuL | Neeb| Scarlett | Rogue | IM forever
TelecoM
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States10668 Posts
May 02 2018 01:32 GMT
#262
I'm a little confused by NesTea being in the top 10 to be honest lol, but I haven't been following SC2 in awhile, is this just due to overall votes because of his overall awesomeness in the past?
AKA: TelecoM[WHITE] Protoss fighting
ROOTCatZ
Profile Blog Joined June 2005
Peru1226 Posts
May 02 2018 03:18 GMT
#263
Would you rather try your luck in a group like this that isn't even code S level... or play a bo5 against Catz to make it into WCS AM Premiere for the same amount of money?


Savage
Progamerwww.root-gaming.com
Prev 1 12 13 14 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 5h 38m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 473
RuFF_SC2 19
StarCraft: Brood War
Leta 178
JulyZerg 146
Snow 90
Sharp 47
ajuk12(nOOB) 13
Icarus 12
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K548
taco 411
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor111
Other Games
C9.Mang0994
shahzam917
JimRising 525
WinterStarcraft490
monkeys_forever306
Mew2King154
Maynarde137
Trikslyr50
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1133
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH272
• practicex 91
• Hupsaiya 77
• Migwel
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• RayReign 142
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota2216
League of Legends
• Doublelift4934
• Lourlo1153
Other Games
• Scarra1372
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
5h 38m
herO vs sOs
Zoun vs Clem
Replay Cast
19h 38m
The PondCast
1d 5h
RSL Revival
1d 5h
Harstem vs SHIN
Solar vs Cham
Replay Cast
1d 19h
RSL Revival
2 days
Reynor vs Scarlett
ShoWTimE vs Classic
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
SC Evo League
3 days
Road to EWC
3 days
Circuito Brasileiro de…
3 days
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Road to EWC
4 days
Online Event
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #3 - GSC
2025 GSL S2
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
Acropolis #3
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
RSL Revival: Season 1
Murky Cup #2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025

Upcoming

CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
BLAST Open Fall 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.