• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 13:53
CEST 19:53
KST 02:53
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners5Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview5[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21
Community News
[BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June2Weekly Cups (May 25-31): Clem doubles, 2v2 circuit heads toward finale0StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th151Weekly Cups (May 18-24): MaxPax wins doubles0Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League6
StarCraft 2
General
TL Poll: How do you feel about the 5.0.16 PTR balance changes? Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview
Tourneys
Douyu Cup 2026 Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV Mondays
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 529 Opportunities Unleashed Mutation # 528 Infection Detected Welcome to the External Content forum
Brood War
General
Data needed Quality of life changes in BW that you will like ? BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW fans in southern Sweden, look here! 25 Years Since Brood War Patch 1.08
Tourneys
[BSL22] Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CEST [ASL21] Grand Finals [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2
Strategy
Why doesn't anyone use restoration? Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread PC Games Sales Thread Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread Summer Games Done Quick 2026!
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Trading/Investing Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
NBA General Discussion 2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
How Streaming Impacts Game P…
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7402 users

[Interview] iloveoov on coaching philosophy, the state of…

Forum Index > SC2 General
107 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next All
OtherWorld
Profile Blog Joined October 2013
France17333 Posts
January 01 2016 17:50 GMT
#41
On January 02 2016 01:41 amazingxkcd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 02 2016 01:36 HolydaKing wrote:
On January 02 2016 01:33 amazingxkcd wrote:
Brood War was the top esports game for a time, but it gave up that spot to other games, and not that many people play it any more


Is iloveoov still living in his fantasy world?? You can't be this moronic to make such a statement

What are you talking about? To my knowledge LoL is the top esports game atm, even in Korea. And if you don't count ONLY Korea, then BW isn't even played by many. Hell, I'm not even sure if many play BW in Korea. More non progamers than SC2, probably (I'd say definitely but I don't have numbers), but that's not a lot.


bw is still the starcraft game Koreans play. There has been huge strides made over the last couple years by the people to re-vitalize the scene through online and offline leagues, fantastic content being put out by various people, the awesome starleagues going on right now, and alongside some of the ex-pros and tournament organizers reaching out to the foreign community. It's been a grass roots movement that I'm quite proud of and I'm just astonished that iloveoov somehow thinks that people aren't active in it for whatever reason. I'm not even trying to state a game flame war, but it is completely disrepectful from iloveoov to disregard the grass roots bw scene that has been well on its way to revival, disrepecting the streamers, the amatuers still trying to make it into the KSLs and SSLs and now NSLs, people playing in pc bangs with their friends, the causals chilling out on UMS maps, the good ol balloon matches and all the awesome online leagues going on. To me, he wants all of that to stop because that is pulling away from SC2's prescene in Korea which is the wrong way to go about it.

How did you go from "not that many people play BW anymore" (original, factual statement by oov) to "I piss on BW because it's shit and not a single soul on this earth plays it" (what you seem to think he said)?
With all due respect to BW - the very fact that there is still a competitive scene so many years after its golden age is definitely a proof of its greatness -, and independently of what should be, I don't think that factually, you can say its active playerbase is high in numbers compared to other eSports, be it RTSs, MOBAs or FPSs.
Used Sigs - New Sigs - Cheap Sigs - Buy the Best Cheap Sig near You at www.cheapsigforsale.com
Ingvar
Profile Joined April 2015
Russian Federation421 Posts
January 01 2016 17:52 GMT
#42
On January 02 2016 01:33 amazingxkcd wrote:
Show nested quote +
Brood War was the top esports game for a time, but it gave up that spot to other games, and not that many people play it any more


Is iloveoov still living in his fantasy world?? You can't be this moronic to make such a statement


Dota 2 features two digit million dollar prizes. LoL casually breaks 100.000 viewers on Twitch. CS:GO majors break viewership records. A handful of players plays BW in Korea for peanuts. iloveoov can see the difference between them and BW.
MMA | Life | Classic | Happy | Team Empire | Team Spirit
Cele
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Germany4016 Posts
January 01 2016 17:58 GMT
#43
Nada streaming BW get's more viewers than the combined featured sc2 stream List. That is, what he is pointing out. In comparison to Sc2 BW is still a lot more attractive to the majority of korean viewers. We all know the Sc franchise as a whole isn't playing in the same league as Lol CS or Dota anymore.
Broodwar for life!
Ctesias
Profile Joined December 2012
4595 Posts
January 01 2016 18:02 GMT
#44
Very interesting interview, thanks for translating!

I hope to see something similar from the KT coaches, going into 2016 without Flash. Should be super interesting to see what they think about it.
Flash | Mvp
c0ldfusion
Profile Joined October 2010
United States8293 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-01 18:09:46
January 01 2016 18:08 GMT
#45
On January 02 2016 02:52 Ingvar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 02 2016 01:33 amazingxkcd wrote:
Brood War was the top esports game for a time, but it gave up that spot to other games, and not that many people play it any more


Is iloveoov still living in his fantasy world?? You can't be this moronic to make such a statement


Dota 2 features two digit million dollar prizes. LoL casually breaks 100.000 viewers on Twitch. CS:GO majors break viewership records. A handful of players plays BW in Korea for peanuts. iloveoov can see the difference between them and BW.

Yeah I don't get why that set him off. The quoted statement by oov is purely factual.

BW is no longer the top eSports game and, relatively speaking, not that many people play it anymore.
Thouhastmail
Profile Joined March 2015
Korea (North)876 Posts
January 01 2016 18:09 GMT
#46
On January 02 2016 02:58 Cele wrote:
That is, what he is pointing out. In comparison to Sc2 BW is still a lot more attractive to the majority of korean viewers.


Well..no. You`re excluding the fact that SC2 is on telly. There`s little demand for SC2 streaming because you can easily see the best guys playing on telly.


"Morality is simply the attitude we adopt towards people we personally dislike"
Cele
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Germany4016 Posts
January 01 2016 18:11 GMT
#47
On January 02 2016 03:09 Thouhastmail wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 02 2016 02:58 Cele wrote:
That is, what he is pointing out. In comparison to Sc2 BW is still a lot more attractive to the majority of korean viewers.


Well..no. You`re excluding the fact that SC2 is on telly. There`s little demand for SC2 streaming because you can easily see the best guys playing on telly.


i have no sources on Television Viewership of sc2 in korea. But we need to factor that in true. Still if you look at amount of feedback bw get's in Korea, i think it is exaggerated by oov to say "very few" or whatever he said exactly :>
Broodwar for life!
Elentos
Profile Blog Joined February 2015
55581 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-01 18:18:30
January 01 2016 18:12 GMT
#48
On January 02 2016 02:58 Cele wrote:
Nada streaming BW get's more viewers than the combined featured sc2 stream List. That is, what he is pointing out. In comparison to Sc2 BW is still a lot more attractive to the majority of korean viewers. We all know the Sc franchise as a whole isn't playing in the same league as Lol CS or Dota anymore.

Flash streaming SC2 got more viewers than the most viewed BW streamers. It's not just the game, it's also the players, for the streams at least. And the actual top SC2 players are on KeSPA teams and don't get to stream (or only rarely or only on minor services like Azubu).

But that goes besides the point, oov was saying that not many people play BW anymore (relative to BW's prime where it was #1 eSport). The viewer numbers aren't that important, not everyone watching still plays. And obviously relative to BW's prime the scene today is pretty small.

And all that distracts from the fact that this is a good interview.
Every 60 seconds in Africa, a minute passes.
EatingBomber
Profile Joined August 2015
1017 Posts
January 01 2016 18:17 GMT
#49
Oh dear God, hasn't the SC2 vs. SC:BW horse been whipped raw already? BTW, I really have never understood this ridiculous trench warfare; as someone said, the only thing to defend here is StarCraft.
Karis Vas Ryaar
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States4396 Posts
January 01 2016 18:31 GMT
#50
great interview. He danced around the questions about conditions needing to improve though. I guess if your a coach you can't say that it's partially the organizations fault for not taking care of their players.
"I'm not agreeing with a lot of Virus's decisions but they are working" Tasteless. Ipl4 Losers Bracket Virus 2-1 Maru
Kerence
Profile Joined May 2011
Sweden1817 Posts
January 01 2016 18:37 GMT
#51
Thanks for taking your time to translate this Waxangel! A really interesting read.
I am here in the shadows.
BisuDagger
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Bisutopia19366 Posts
January 01 2016 18:43 GMT
#52
On January 02 2016 03:17 EatingBomber wrote:
Oh dear God, hasn't the SC2 vs. SC:BW horse been whipped raw already? BTW, I really have never understood this ridiculous trench warfare; as someone said, the only thing to defend here is StarCraft.

This. Please stop going at it from this point on guys. We do not need this debate to continue. Thanks.
ModeratorFormer Afreeca Starleague Caster: http://afreeca.tv/ASL2ENG2
Heyoka
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Katowice25012 Posts
January 01 2016 18:56 GMT
#53
On January 02 2016 01:41 amazingxkcd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 02 2016 01:36 HolydaKing wrote:
On January 02 2016 01:33 amazingxkcd wrote:
Brood War was the top esports game for a time, but it gave up that spot to other games, and not that many people play it any more


Is iloveoov still living in his fantasy world?? You can't be this moronic to make such a statement

What are you talking about? To my knowledge LoL is the top esports game atm, even in Korea. And if you don't count ONLY Korea, then BW isn't even played by many. Hell, I'm not even sure if many play BW in Korea. More non progamers than SC2, probably (I'd say definitely but I don't have numbers), but that's not a lot.


bw is still the starcraft game Koreans play. There has been huge strides made over the last couple years by the people to re-vitalize the scene through online and offline leagues, fantastic content being put out by various people, the awesome starleagues going on right now, and alongside some of the ex-pros and tournament organizers reaching out to the foreign community. It's been a grass roots movement that I'm quite proud of and I'm just astonished that iloveoov somehow thinks that people aren't active in it for whatever reason. I'm not even trying to state a game flame war, but it is completely disrepectful from iloveoov to disregard the grass roots bw scene that has been well on its way to revival, disrepecting the streamers, the amatuers still trying to make it into the KSLs and SSLs and now NSLs, people playing in pc bangs with their friends, the causals chilling out on UMS maps, the good ol balloon matches and all the awesome online leagues going on. To me, he wants all of that to stop because that is pulling away from SC2's prescene in Korea which is the wrong way to go about it.


The end of this comment gets into some super tinfoil hat stuff, I have no idea what it's even getting at here. There's absolutely no evidence he's trying to kill a game because of where he works man.
@RealHeyoka | ESL / DreamHack StarCraft Lead
y0su
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
Finland7871 Posts
January 01 2016 19:14 GMT
#54
Thanks for the translation. Very enjoyable read!

Would like to see more behind the scenes stuff - especially strategic prep, that really brings out the S in RTS.
waiting2Bbanned
Profile Joined November 2015
United States154 Posts
January 01 2016 19:15 GMT
#55
"Blizzard wanted the same system as 2015 but esl rejected. They had no choice than taking the new route. I personally think its the best way because you support streamers (because more time between tournaments)."

I fail to see how it is ESL's fault for Blizz reducing korean tourneys/seasons strangling the emerging korean scene.
"If you are going to break the law, do it with two thousand people.. and Mozart." - Howard Zinn
riotjune
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States3394 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-01 19:55:20
January 01 2016 19:53 GMT
#56
Koreans vs foreigners


Of course Blizzard has to step in and do something!
First they made Koreans jump through extra hoops to deter them, now blizz just axed them altogether completely :D
lastride
Profile Joined April 2014
2390 Posts
January 01 2016 19:56 GMT
#57
On January 02 2016 04:53 riotjune wrote:
Koreans vs foreigners

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJuNR6kECoY&t=0m26s
Of course Blizzard has to step in and do something!
First they made Koreans jump through extra hoops to deter them, now blizz just axed them altogether completely :D

wtf man ...
WhaleOFaTALE1
Profile Joined April 2015
47 Posts
January 01 2016 19:58 GMT
#58
RIP bullfrogs
Dungeontay
Profile Joined December 2015
126 Posts
January 01 2016 20:25 GMT
#59
Oov described Blizzards current thinking towarda korean players and the game itself probably in the most accurate way possible. I also love that he wants to get SOo on top of the world, as he described it. Oov really seems like one of the strongest personalities in esports. THUMBS UP!!
Zzz
jinyung2
Profile Joined November 2014
Luxembourg1455 Posts
January 01 2016 20:28 GMT
#60
On January 02 2016 01:33 amazingxkcd wrote:
Show nested quote +
Brood War was the top esports game for a time, but it gave up that spot to other games, and not that many people play it any more


Is iloveoov still living in his fantasy world?? You can't be this moronic to make such a statement

I don't understand, what he says is absolutely correct. I don't think he's talking about just starcraft or RTS I'm sure he's factoring in all the other games koreans play. I'll use PC Cafe statistics from gametrics.com

[image loading]
+ Show Spoiler [english] +

1. LoL 39.73%
2. Sudden Attack 12.6%
3. Fifa Online 3 8.6%
4. SCBW 3.55%
5. Lineage 3.17%
6. Dungeon and Fighter 2.91%
7. Blade and Soul 2.15%
8. Aion 1.83%
9. Maplestory 1.82%
10. Warcraft 3 1.59%
11. Tree of Savior 1.55%
12. Cyphers 1.4%
13. Kart Rider 1.27%
14. Diablo 3 1.03%
15. Starcraft 2 1.01%
16. Lineage 0.77%
17. Mabinogi Heroes 0.75%
18. WoW 0.73%
19. Special Forces 0.61%
20. Icarus 0.55%


now I understand PC cafe usage will probably differ slightly from overall usage but with how small korea is how numerous PC cafes are and the fact that this site takes a very good geographically random sample size (of 12000ish PC cafe's they compile data from 4000) i'll just assume this usage statistic is correct for overall game usage in korea.

with that said, I don't think any sane person would argue 3.55% is many people playing the game. it's not. it's a tiny, niche population of fans. its insane and amazing because of how old the game is and how its still able to maintain users after all these years but what oov says is true. 3.55% is not a lot of people. it's a tiny sliver.

sry xkcd but it maybe you in the fantasy world :l
Argentina
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Maestros of the Game
15:00
Playoffs
Rogue vs SHINLIVE!
RotterdaM1319
ComeBackTV 1059
IntoTheiNu 962
TaKeTV 525
LamboSC2234
IndyStarCraft 186
SteadfastSC173
Rex128
EnkiAlexander 75
3DClanTV 70
CosmosSc2 54
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 1319
LamboSC2 234
IndyStarCraft 186
SteadfastSC 173
Rex 128
ProTech79
UpATreeSC 66
CosmosSc2 54
elazer 41
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 1908
Shuttle 671
firebathero 146
sorry 75
Hyun 29
Sacsri 21
Shine 17
GoRush 16
IntoTheRainbow 16
soO 15
[ Show more ]
NaDa 8
Dota 2
Gorgc7362
qojqva2605
Counter-Strike
fl0m9650
zeus474
byalli415
x6flipin213
Other Games
Grubby3346
singsing2319
FrodaN1476
B2W.Neo836
C9.Mang0172
ArmadaUGS145
JimRising 134
mouzStarbuck121
Hui .101
KnowMe85
XaKoH 74
Mew2King61
Trikslyr57
MindelVK6
OptimusSC23
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 23
• 80smullet 13
• Michael_bg 12
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota234
League of Legends
• TFBlade938
Other Games
• imaqtpie519
• WagamamaTV349
• Shiphtur211
Upcoming Events
OSC
4h 37m
Replay Cast
6h 7m
OSC
19h 7m
Maestros of the Game
20h 7m
Classic vs Maru
Serral vs herO
TBD vs Clem
Replay Cast
1d 6h
CranKy Ducklings
1d 16h
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 21h
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
2 days
eOnzErG vs Mihu
Messiah vs XuanXuan
Jaystar vs TerrOr
Dewalt vs Bonyth
eOnzErG vs XuanXuan
Mihu vs TerrOr
Messiah vs Bonyth
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
[ Show More ]
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
3 days
Jaystar vs Dewalt
eOnzErG vs TerrOr
XuanXuan vs Bonyth
Mihu vs Dewalt
Messiah vs Jaystar
eOnzErG vs Bonyth
TerrOr vs Dewalt
OSC
3 days
Wardi Open
3 days
Replay Cast
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL Season 22
2026 GSL S2
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
Acropolis #4 - GSB
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
Maestros of the Game 2
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Murky Cup 2026
Heroes Pulsing #2
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026

Upcoming

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
Douyu Cup 2026
Heroes Pulsing #3
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.