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BisuDagger
Bisutopia19299 Posts
On December 16 2014 10:35 Shellshock wrote: probably something like real geniuses play starcraft because other RTS are watered down or something Things could be worse. What if sc1 was released as the sequel to sc2 instead of how it is? | ||
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Jaaaaasper
United States10225 Posts
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BronzeKnee
United States5217 Posts
On December 15 2014 22:59 mki wrote: It's a numbers game. When StarCraft II came out and became the largest game (numbers wise) DH picked it up as their main game. Now CS is doing the same thing. Yes, but what drives numbers is the quality of the game, people like good games better than bad games... Try to read between the lines. Blizzard has a lot of work to do, does anyone really think HOTS is more exciting to watch than WOL with Photon Overcharge, Widow mines instead of Siege Tanks and Swarm Hosts? | ||
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lolmlg
619 Posts
On December 16 2014 08:30 Pr0wler wrote: Yeah , it was on TV... In one country. It had big crowds... In one country. You don't get a "scene" just by having lots of players. There are guitar players in every city on Earth but the vast majority of them don't have a "scene". You get a "scene" when people come together beyond the bare fact that they do the same thing, find more common ground, encourage each other, grow together, and succeed in a way that inspires and draws in others. Brood War succeeded because of grassroots support and organization. | ||
digmouse
China6330 Posts
On December 16 2014 11:27 BisuDagger wrote: Things could be worse. What if sc1 was released as the sequel to sc2 instead of how it is? Only with the systems and units, not the controls imo | ||
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Jaded.
United States125 Posts
On December 16 2014 08:30 Pr0wler wrote: Yeah , it was on TV... In one country. It had big crowds... In one country. I'm not talking about eSports and organisations behind it. I'm talking about the most basic casual level. Worldwide CS 1.6 was always bigger - more people were playing it. Hell, even now(when CS:GO is so popular) if I want to play 1.6 I can do it with no effort on the numerous private servers that still exist and are well populated. I'm not hating on BW and it's legacy. I like CS and I love BW, but that is how it was. And that one country had better viewership for BW than CS 1.6 did across the entire world. I'm not saying CS 1.6 is bad either. Quake CS1.6 and BW were the pinnacle of skill based e-sports, everything here from now on will be a disappointment compared to them(though CS:GO is pretty good). But regardless the BW scene was more developed and had a wider audience than 1.6 did, one country or not. Now if 1.6 had large corporations sponsoring teams and had mass viewership on TV or on the videos (it didn't really compare) then I'd concede 1.6 was larger. But it wasn't. If you're saying that CS was more popular in say EU and the US, then yes I'd say that's true. But it wasn't larger than BW. | ||
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wptlzkwjd
Canada1240 Posts
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klipik12
United States241 Posts
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Jett.Jack.Alvir
Canada2250 Posts
On December 16 2014 11:52 BronzeKnee wrote: Yes, but what drives numbers is the quality of the game, people like good games better than bad games... Try to read between the lines. Blizzard has a lot of work to do, does anyone really think HOTS is more exciting to watch than WOL with Photon Overcharge, Widow mines instead of Siege Tanks and Swarm Hosts? Are you implying that DH switched the mainstage from CS:GO to SC2 because the former is a "good game" while the latter is a "bad game"? Don't get me wrong, I don't think SC2 is near perfect, but it is hardly a "bad game". I agree Blizzard has a lot of work, but I do think HOTS is more exciting to watch than WOL most of the time. I don't like PO and SH also, but there are other facets I do like. In TvZ, I think its very exciting to see early game reaper vs. lings/queens. Will the reaper scout the zerg? Will it get a drone or some lings? Can he keep it alive to join up with 2 more reapers and a boat load of hellions? Will this group of hellions/reapers manage to recede the creep? For the zerg, can he keep his drones alive? Will he morph that drone in time? I can go on about the different interactions between some units, but its not the time. HOTS may have its issues, but I hardly think its a bad game and I think DH feels the same. If DH thought SC2 was bad, I doubt they would even keep it in the circuit. | ||
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Jett.Jack.Alvir
Canada2250 Posts
On December 16 2014 12:39 klipik12 wrote: So does SC2 not get the open circuit anymore? Will DH Valencia, Stockholm, Moscow, Bucharest, France, etc be CS:GO tourneys now? Because that would really suck. Its unclear what this means yet, but I don't think DH will drop SC2 completely. They might reduce the number of tourneys, but definitely not drop it. | ||
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jojos11
Korea (North)314 Posts
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KeksX
Germany3634 Posts
On December 16 2014 11:52 BronzeKnee wrote: Yes, but what drives numbers is the quality of the game, people like good games better than bad games... Try to read between the lines. Blizzard has a lot of work to do, does anyone really think HOTS is more exciting to watch than WOL with Photon Overcharge, Widow mines instead of Siege Tanks and Swarm Hosts? Swarm Hosts are a hots addition, I don't know what you exactly you want to say. Are you implying that broodlord/winfestor was more exciting than this? Hots is far from perfect but man, just take this year's Blizzcon. Has never been more exciting if you ask me. Imho, it's only natural that SC2 is the unpopular eSports. It's a 1v1 RTS(already unpopular), it's hard, it's complicated. A dead unit does not equal a win, but a kill in LoL and CS:GO is easy to comprehend and also always a good sign towards winning. It's just easier. And easier usually wins in terms of publicity. As long as DH does not drop SC2 completely, it's fine. I'm upset that things are the way they are, but there's little we can change. Ball is in Blizzard's court for many things, we can only do what we always do. | ||
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Veldril
Thailand1817 Posts
On December 16 2014 11:52 BronzeKnee wrote: Yes, but what drives numbers is the quality of the game, people like good games better than bad games... Try to read between the lines. Blizzard has a lot of work to do, does anyone really think HOTS is more exciting to watch than WOL with Photon Overcharge, Widow mines instead of Siege Tanks and Swarm Hosts? If you say that then you kinda do not know a lot about marketing. There are a lot of factors that drive the number of viewers up and quality is only part of them, even maybe a small part. Quality of the games is very abstract thing to judge from consumer point of view and can be judged very differently for each individual. You can have the best quality game in the world but if the consumers/watchers/players cannot distinguish or see it then it is pointless. I would argue that the main reasons why CS:GO and other team games like DotA or LoL or soccer have a lot of viewers because it better tap into unconscious psychological needs to be part of the successful team to increase the self-esteem needs. Although I would need to conduct a consumer research to be sure about this, I can certainly say that this should be the main reason why team sports/games are more successful than individual ones. The rational that the game is better is more like afterthought to justify their choice of favorite e-sport. And if you go by the logic that quality of the game matter the most, then "better" games like BW should have the highest number of viewers and be on the stage since it has the highest quality of players and skills need to compete but it is not. DOTA2 should also have higher number than LoL but it is also not true. Quality and skill requires to play the game does not really matter that much as people want to believe. Each game has it own appeal to different people and that is the beauty of marketing for me. No single product is for everyone and not everyone will like that best product (because it is not the best product in their eyes). Starcraft and RTS is preferred by a segment of gamer who like to watch individual competition and pushing oneself to limit. The segment is smaller than people who like team sport but that is fine to be honest. This does not mean Blizzard does not have to improve but to think that the viewers for RTS game should be higher than team games is an incorrect assumption in the first place for me. | ||
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triforks
United States370 Posts
On December 16 2014 14:14 jojos11 wrote: make sense actually,dreamhack CS:GO are like what Blizzcon is to SC2 are you saying that dreamhack developed csgo? | ||
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Hotshot
Canada184 Posts
On December 16 2014 06:23 SetGuitarsToKill wrote: Completely different swarm hosts though Doesn't matter, 95% of the time fighting free is not fun no matter what the game... Besides, these new SH can fly... I think this change will make SH games a lot shorter, at the sacrifice of making them a lot more frustrating. | ||
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ETisME
12536 Posts
On December 16 2014 12:18 Jaded. wrote: And that one country had better viewership for BW than CS 1.6 did across the entire world. I'm not saying CS 1.6 is bad either. Quake CS1.6 and BW were the pinnacle of skill based e-sports, everything here from now on will be a disappointment compared to them(though CS:GO is pretty good). But regardless the BW scene was more developed and had a wider audience than 1.6 did, one country or not. Now if 1.6 had large corporations sponsoring teams and had mass viewership on TV or on the videos (it didn't really compare) then I'd concede 1.6 was larger. But it wasn't. If you're saying that CS was more popular in say EU and the US, then yes I'd say that's true. But it wasn't larger than BW. Being popular in one location won't be attractive for an international tournament organizer such as dreamhack anyway which is the dominate form of esports events. Not that bw isn't impressive of cause | ||
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Zerg.Zilla
Hungary5029 Posts
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Silvanel
Poland4733 Posts
With the way WCS, LCS, TI are structured theres is no way that DH will be ever the main tournament in those respective games. There is no such obstacle in CS scene so its a good way of moving forward for DH. | ||
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Luolis
Finland7140 Posts
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Luolis
Finland7140 Posts
On December 16 2014 03:24 johnbongham wrote: I think it ispretty accurate. It also doesn't take into account the swedish television viewers CSGO had. Also doesnt count Finnish tv viewers of CSGO | ||
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