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Violet forfeits WCS AM Ro16 Season 2 due to Visa Issues -…

Forum Index > SC2 General
269 CommentsPost a Reply
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Shellshock
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States97276 Posts
August 04 2013 17:38 GMT
#161
On August 05 2013 01:46 AgentW wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2013 01:27 Shellshock1122 wrote:
just change region

Can't do it until 2014. Why he didn't change after getting his visa denied for Season 1, I have no idea.

I would be fine with an exception being made for a player that is consistently unable to play in the region selected or having him sit out season 3 instead of wasting a spot
Moderatorhttp://i.imgur.com/U4xwqmD.png
TL+ Member
Kyhron
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United States945 Posts
August 04 2013 17:40 GMT
#162
On August 04 2013 20:13 Kyselin wrote:
Is it easier to get a visa for Canada or the US ? Guess if that's the case Canada should host the NA finals.

It has less to do with US policies and more to do with Violet staying in the US way longer than he should have last time he was here......
Dingodile
Profile Joined December 2011
4133 Posts
August 04 2013 17:40 GMT
#163
On August 05 2013 01:46 AgentW wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2013 01:27 Shellshock1122 wrote:
just change region

Can't do it until 2014. Why he didn't change after getting his visa denied for Season 1, I have no idea.

Maybe this applied only to WCS KR S1 members.
Grubby | ToD | Moon | Lyn | Sky
Earawen
Profile Joined February 2011
France51 Posts
August 04 2013 17:42 GMT
#164
Well...USA are ruining E-sport once again. Well next season you need to play WCS EU sir. It's harder but at least you can stay :-)
AgentW
Profile Blog Joined July 2012
United States7725 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-04 17:44:28
August 04 2013 17:42 GMT
#165
On August 05 2013 02:28 farvacola wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2013 02:04 zaxx wrote:
On August 05 2013 01:56 sitromit wrote:
On August 05 2013 01:20 zaxx wrote:
On August 04 2013 23:44 tree.hugger wrote:
This should surprise nobody. Last time the US let viOlet in, he abused his visa and overstayed. He broke the law. That's their perspective and it happens to be correct. I know online we're all one big happy family, but countries take this stuff seriously. viOlet and his management really screwed up. Honestly, viOlet should probably try to switch regions, because it's going to continue to be hard/impossible for him to get into the US for years.


Your information is just plain wrong. viOlet NEVER broke any US laws during any of his stays in the United States. "Their" perspective is that even though he did not break the law, and he was well within the technical rights to stay when and as long as he did, it was still suspicious that he stayed for the lengths of times he did. The US has the right to deny anyone at their own discretion, regardless of whether a law was actually broken or not. "Right to deny anyone service" applies to them as well as US businesses. To say viOlet broke the law without any actual facts is purely speculative and damages more than it helps. Sometimes it is better to not say anything at all.

No, he overstayed.

I remember thinking when he was living here, "How is he staying here so long on what's probably a visa-waiver that he used to get in?". I thought he might have signed up for an educational program and changed his status, but he hadn't. His rights were to stay in the US for 3 months. He stayed far longer than that. When you overstay your status, it becomes extremely difficult to get back in the country once you leave, which is what happened to him.


What first hand knowledge or facts of the situation do you know? He stayed on an ESTA waiver, which allows you to stay for 3 months at a time (you are correct there). However, the time resets when you leave the country for a certain amount of time. If you do your homework, you will realize that he always had a foreign (European or otherwise) event that reset the waiver to 90 days. Going to those events for that 5-7 days allowed him to come back to the USA and stay for a brand new 90 days before resetting the waiver again. In accordance to the laws and permissions granted to the ESTA, he was within his rights to stay the lengths of time he did.

ESTA waivers are denied all the time, even ones previously issued without problem. I am curious though, where are you getting the information that ESTA waivers renew indefinitely when one leaves the US? I'm almost certain that this is not true.

If what the guy you quoted said is true, that's a really, really stupid law.

On August 05 2013 02:35 JJH777 wrote:
They need to have it in the rules for WCS (and have needed it in GSL for ages it's a joke that they haven't added it) that if someone forfeits the group changes to a 3player group with round robin format. Keeping the same format and giving walkovers is so ridiculous dumb.

GSL does not do this. Remember when Rain went to participate in the MLG open bracket?

On August 05 2013 02:38 Shellshock1122 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2013 01:46 AgentW wrote:
On August 05 2013 01:27 Shellshock1122 wrote:
just change region

Can't do it until 2014. Why he didn't change after getting his visa denied for Season 1, I have no idea.

I would be fine with an exception being made for a player that is consistently unable to play in the region selected or having him sit out season 3 instead of wasting a spot

Agreed. It's a shame that a player is being denied the ability to play as well as a tournament having a blank slot, whatever the cause may be.
Who's the bigger scrub, the scrub, or the scrub who loses to him?
BlitchizSC2
Profile Joined August 2010
United States306 Posts
August 04 2013 17:46 GMT
#166
Hate when visa issues happen. I wish there was a way around them for players, like a 'travels alot type flag' or something.... T.T
www.twitch.tv/blitchizsc2 | http://www.youtube.com/BlitchizStarcraft ~ fighting!
Rafterman
Profile Joined July 2013
United States4 Posts
August 04 2013 17:47 GMT
#167
This is just all the more reason WCS should be based upon the residency of a player, not just which region the player thinks they should qualify for.
ladysman09
Profile Joined June 2013
237 Posts
August 04 2013 17:49 GMT
#168
This probably happened because he left azubu
JJH777
Profile Joined January 2011
United States4406 Posts
August 04 2013 17:55 GMT
#169
On August 05 2013 02:42 AgentW wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2013 02:28 farvacola wrote:
On August 05 2013 02:04 zaxx wrote:
On August 05 2013 01:56 sitromit wrote:
On August 05 2013 01:20 zaxx wrote:
On August 04 2013 23:44 tree.hugger wrote:
This should surprise nobody. Last time the US let viOlet in, he abused his visa and overstayed. He broke the law. That's their perspective and it happens to be correct. I know online we're all one big happy family, but countries take this stuff seriously. viOlet and his management really screwed up. Honestly, viOlet should probably try to switch regions, because it's going to continue to be hard/impossible for him to get into the US for years.


Your information is just plain wrong. viOlet NEVER broke any US laws during any of his stays in the United States. "Their" perspective is that even though he did not break the law, and he was well within the technical rights to stay when and as long as he did, it was still suspicious that he stayed for the lengths of times he did. The US has the right to deny anyone at their own discretion, regardless of whether a law was actually broken or not. "Right to deny anyone service" applies to them as well as US businesses. To say viOlet broke the law without any actual facts is purely speculative and damages more than it helps. Sometimes it is better to not say anything at all.

No, he overstayed.

I remember thinking when he was living here, "How is he staying here so long on what's probably a visa-waiver that he used to get in?". I thought he might have signed up for an educational program and changed his status, but he hadn't. His rights were to stay in the US for 3 months. He stayed far longer than that. When you overstay your status, it becomes extremely difficult to get back in the country once you leave, which is what happened to him.


What first hand knowledge or facts of the situation do you know? He stayed on an ESTA waiver, which allows you to stay for 3 months at a time (you are correct there). However, the time resets when you leave the country for a certain amount of time. If you do your homework, you will realize that he always had a foreign (European or otherwise) event that reset the waiver to 90 days. Going to those events for that 5-7 days allowed him to come back to the USA and stay for a brand new 90 days before resetting the waiver again. In accordance to the laws and permissions granted to the ESTA, he was within his rights to stay the lengths of time he did.

ESTA waivers are denied all the time, even ones previously issued without problem. I am curious though, where are you getting the information that ESTA waivers renew indefinitely when one leaves the US? I'm almost certain that this is not true.

If what the guy you quoted said is true, that's a really, really stupid law.

Show nested quote +
On August 05 2013 02:35 JJH777 wrote:
They need to have it in the rules for WCS (and have needed it in GSL for ages it's a joke that they haven't added it) that if someone forfeits the group changes to a 3player group with round robin format. Keeping the same format and giving walkovers is so ridiculous dumb.

GSL does not do this. Remember when Rain went to participate in the MLG open bracket?

Show nested quote +
On August 05 2013 02:38 Shellshock1122 wrote:
On August 05 2013 01:46 AgentW wrote:
On August 05 2013 01:27 Shellshock1122 wrote:
just change region

Can't do it until 2014. Why he didn't change after getting his visa denied for Season 1, I have no idea.

I would be fine with an exception being made for a player that is consistently unable to play in the region selected or having him sit out season 3 instead of wasting a spot

Agreed. It's a shame that a player is being denied the ability to play as well as a tournament having a blank slot, whatever the cause may be.


I know they don't. I said they have needed it in GSL for ages.
AgentW
Profile Blog Joined July 2012
United States7725 Posts
August 04 2013 17:58 GMT
#170
On August 05 2013 02:55 JJH777 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2013 02:42 AgentW wrote:
On August 05 2013 02:28 farvacola wrote:
On August 05 2013 02:04 zaxx wrote:
On August 05 2013 01:56 sitromit wrote:
On August 05 2013 01:20 zaxx wrote:
On August 04 2013 23:44 tree.hugger wrote:
This should surprise nobody. Last time the US let viOlet in, he abused his visa and overstayed. He broke the law. That's their perspective and it happens to be correct. I know online we're all one big happy family, but countries take this stuff seriously. viOlet and his management really screwed up. Honestly, viOlet should probably try to switch regions, because it's going to continue to be hard/impossible for him to get into the US for years.


Your information is just plain wrong. viOlet NEVER broke any US laws during any of his stays in the United States. "Their" perspective is that even though he did not break the law, and he was well within the technical rights to stay when and as long as he did, it was still suspicious that he stayed for the lengths of times he did. The US has the right to deny anyone at their own discretion, regardless of whether a law was actually broken or not. "Right to deny anyone service" applies to them as well as US businesses. To say viOlet broke the law without any actual facts is purely speculative and damages more than it helps. Sometimes it is better to not say anything at all.

No, he overstayed.

I remember thinking when he was living here, "How is he staying here so long on what's probably a visa-waiver that he used to get in?". I thought he might have signed up for an educational program and changed his status, but he hadn't. His rights were to stay in the US for 3 months. He stayed far longer than that. When you overstay your status, it becomes extremely difficult to get back in the country once you leave, which is what happened to him.


What first hand knowledge or facts of the situation do you know? He stayed on an ESTA waiver, which allows you to stay for 3 months at a time (you are correct there). However, the time resets when you leave the country for a certain amount of time. If you do your homework, you will realize that he always had a foreign (European or otherwise) event that reset the waiver to 90 days. Going to those events for that 5-7 days allowed him to come back to the USA and stay for a brand new 90 days before resetting the waiver again. In accordance to the laws and permissions granted to the ESTA, he was within his rights to stay the lengths of time he did.

ESTA waivers are denied all the time, even ones previously issued without problem. I am curious though, where are you getting the information that ESTA waivers renew indefinitely when one leaves the US? I'm almost certain that this is not true.

If what the guy you quoted said is true, that's a really, really stupid law.

On August 05 2013 02:35 JJH777 wrote:
They need to have it in the rules for WCS (and have needed it in GSL for ages it's a joke that they haven't added it) that if someone forfeits the group changes to a 3player group with round robin format. Keeping the same format and giving walkovers is so ridiculous dumb.

GSL does not do this. Remember when Rain went to participate in the MLG open bracket?

On August 05 2013 02:38 Shellshock1122 wrote:
On August 05 2013 01:46 AgentW wrote:
On August 05 2013 01:27 Shellshock1122 wrote:
just change region

Can't do it until 2014. Why he didn't change after getting his visa denied for Season 1, I have no idea.

I would be fine with an exception being made for a player that is consistently unable to play in the region selected or having him sit out season 3 instead of wasting a spot

Agreed. It's a shame that a player is being denied the ability to play as well as a tournament having a blank slot, whatever the cause may be.


I know they don't. I said they have needed it in GSL for ages.

Sorry about that, I read it as "have had it in GSL for ages." My apologies.

And I agree. It's silly to give an advantage to one out of three based upon one of them dropping at random.
Who's the bigger scrub, the scrub, or the scrub who loses to him?
Canucklehead
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada5074 Posts
August 04 2013 18:01 GMT
#171
They told the visa people to watch the wcs finals next week to see the passion of the fans and players and reconsider the denial for next season, but they said they were going to watch the international next week.
Top 10 favourite pros: MKP, MVP, MC, Nestea, DRG, Jaedong, Flash, Life, Creator, Leenock
BlueFlames
Profile Joined February 2011
Germany1756 Posts
August 04 2013 18:06 GMT
#172
On August 04 2013 23:23 TotalBiscuit wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2013 23:21 Lonyo wrote:
On August 04 2013 22:48 Spectralx wrote:
Region Lock for heavens sake please.

What region do you lock Chinese players into?
Or Australians?
Or South Africans?
Or Euros in the US, or Americans in Europe?
Or Koreans in Europe or the US?

Saying "region lock" is the most pointless thing in the world and IMO should be something that there's a rule against.


China, it has it's own scene, give it the support it deserves.


Blizzard is a business that is interested in money only. If supporting the chinese sc2 scene will get them financial benefits, they will do it. Until then they dont give a shit.

And to make this clear, i totally agree with you, they deserve way more support than they are getting.
Dreamsmasher2
Profile Joined August 2013
Canada38 Posts
August 04 2013 18:09 GMT
#173
Violet needs to marry a American girl already... Kappa

User was warned for this post
Canucklehead
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada5074 Posts
August 04 2013 18:11 GMT
#174
On August 05 2013 03:09 Dreamsmasher2 wrote:
Violet needs to marry a American girl already... Kappa


Oh damn, hurry and delete before the anti twitch cops come and see that...oh wait, it's a one post throwaway account.
Top 10 favourite pros: MKP, MVP, MC, Nestea, DRG, Jaedong, Flash, Life, Creator, Leenock
Rhaegal
Profile Blog Joined July 2013
United States678 Posts
August 04 2013 18:15 GMT
#175
On August 05 2013 02:40 Kyhron wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2013 20:13 Kyselin wrote:
Is it easier to get a visa for Canada or the US ? Guess if that's the case Canada should host the NA finals.

It has less to do with US policies and more to do with Violet staying in the US way longer than he should have last time he was here......



haha, so it's 100% Violet's fault to begin with? Maybe let the players do a blind vote to see if he can play the rest of his tournament online? Elsewise just kick him from WCS AM for good, this is the 2nd straight season he ruined a group.
http://www.twitch.tv/agonysc
Buddy168
Profile Joined June 2012
United States157 Posts
August 04 2013 18:31 GMT
#176
Again?

What the hell.
"You're being a useless fucking asshole" - Day[9]
RyLai
Profile Joined May 2011
United States477 Posts
August 04 2013 19:45 GMT
#177
This is fucking bullshit. Almost exactly a month ago, LoL got recognition for being a sport, therefore making it extremely easy to get a visa in Violet's situation for his needs. This is fucking bullshit that LoL is the only game that has gotten this treatment. As far as I know, LoL players haven't had nearly as many visa issues as SC2 players. (They've had more issues of players getting drunk, oversleeping, or having other obligations.) I'm not going to get into arguments of games, numbers, viewership, etc, but I'm a bit pissed when a game that has has very little issue with visas gets recognized when the game that has been around longer and has had plenty of visa issues gets ignored. If at least HoN was recognized as a sport, I'd be less pissed because that's been around longer too.
mikumegurine
Profile Joined May 2013
Canada3145 Posts
August 04 2013 19:48 GMT
#178
League of Legends players get salary from Riot Games themselves, (ESPORTS)

which is a reason why LoL ESPORTS has less visa issues
AgentW
Profile Blog Joined July 2012
United States7725 Posts
August 04 2013 19:52 GMT
#179
On August 05 2013 04:45 RyLai wrote:
This is fucking bullshit. Almost exactly a month ago, LoL got recognition for being a sport, therefore making it extremely easy to get a visa in Violet's situation for his needs. This is fucking bullshit that LoL is the only game that has gotten this treatment. As far as I know, LoL players haven't had nearly as many visa issues as SC2 players. (They've had more issues of players getting drunk, oversleeping, or having other obligations.) I'm not going to get into arguments of games, numbers, viewership, etc, but I'm a bit pissed when a game that has has very little issue with visas gets recognized when the game that has been around longer and has had plenty of visa issues gets ignored. If at least HoN was recognized as a sport, I'd be less pissed because that's been around longer too.


1. I believe LoL has been around longer than SC2.
2. LoL has nothing to do with this discussion. I suggest giving this thread a read: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=423939.
Who's the bigger scrub, the scrub, or the scrub who loses to him?
one-one-one
Profile Joined November 2011
Sweden551 Posts
August 04 2013 19:52 GMT
#180
Visa issues...

Can't he just use MasterCard or Amex instead?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=1BFY4R7IIP4#t=1710s
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