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It's a dog eat dog world. Some people make it, some don't. Not everyone can succeed. Personally, I was a fan of his and always rooted for him, but I'm not going to blame Blizzard. Either sacrifice everything you have in life for your dreams, or don't... but don't blame Blizzard.
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That Waylander guy is a dick...he only has a twitter to troll? Was a fan of yours Theog, best of luck with whatever you choose to do.
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On August 01 2013 11:17 Doodsmack wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2013 11:12 Moochlol wrote:On August 01 2013 11:07 AKIRADEATH wrote:
I just don't get why we're discussing professional streamers in a thread about a retiring progamer. Destiny and Maximus aren't progamers.
I don't imagine progamers who want to be competitive in today's scene have the time to try and also be a streamer of that caliber. They turn on their stream for some ladder games, but a lot of real practice needs to be done offstream. Well the reason I am arguing this is because I feel like most NA players are just missing a piece of the pie if they are not the TOP TOP TOP players, and feel to ignore the entertainment side of things, is just always going to result in retirement. Not to take anything away from what Theo did, dude played some sick games, and if he had fun doing it and feels its time to move on then so be it. He hasn't made an official statement so like i don't really know the real deal of why he quit. I can only assume its income related/life goals and whatever other personal stuff he may have with the game ie burnout and shit like that. Trust me bros streaming is a legit job, it's just like Walmart, you compete against thousands or millions of others for 50 or less slots paying minimum wage.
Give me the choice of making minimum wage @ fucking Walmart or playing games, ill choose games 100%. Fuck i'd choose games over something that even decent money. Buying cars and excess bullshit just doesn't seem right to me, and in fact most people are so fixated on money. You know why? Because that's what the man wants you to do. Society forces these ideas of excess income on people. If you can support yourself, ya know eating, being clothed, roof over your head, not living in shit conditions. What in the actual fuck is wrong with that. Do you really put materialism over happiness? If so that's sad brah.
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Northern Ireland27464 Posts
On August 01 2013 11:24 Moochlol wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2013 11:17 Doodsmack wrote:On August 01 2013 11:12 Moochlol wrote:On August 01 2013 11:07 AKIRADEATH wrote:
I just don't get why we're discussing professional streamers in a thread about a retiring progamer. Destiny and Maximus aren't progamers.
I don't imagine progamers who want to be competitive in today's scene have the time to try and also be a streamer of that caliber. They turn on their stream for some ladder games, but a lot of real practice needs to be done offstream. Well the reason I am arguing this is because I feel like most NA players are just missing a piece of the pie if they are not the TOP TOP TOP players, and feel to ignore the entertainment side of things, is just always going to result in retirement. Not to take anything away from what Theo did, dude played some sick games, and if he had fun doing it and feels its time to move on then so be it. He hasn't made an official statement so like i don't really know the real deal of why he quit. I can only assume its income related/life goals and whatever other personal stuff he may have with the game ie burnout and shit like that. Trust me bros streaming is a legit job, it's just like Walmart, you compete against thousands or millions of others for 50 or less slots paying minimum wage. Give me the choice of making minimum wage @ fucking Walmart or playing games, ill choose games 100%. Fuck id choose games over something that even paid more! Buying cars and excess bullshit just doesn't seem right to me, and in fact most people are so fixated on money. You know why? Because that's what the man wants you to do. Society forces these ideas of excess income on people. If you can support yourself, ya know eating, being clothed roof over your head, not living in shit conditions. Then what the actual fuck is wrong with that. Do you really put materialism over happiness? If so that's sad brah.
Desiring to have enough money to live independently doesn't equal being materialistic.
They're not making a decision between spending on excesses, or doing what they love, but between struggling to afford the basics without outside help and pursuing their careers as gamers.
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On August 01 2013 11:24 Moochlol wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2013 11:17 Doodsmack wrote:On August 01 2013 11:12 Moochlol wrote:On August 01 2013 11:07 AKIRADEATH wrote:
I just don't get why we're discussing professional streamers in a thread about a retiring progamer. Destiny and Maximus aren't progamers.
I don't imagine progamers who want to be competitive in today's scene have the time to try and also be a streamer of that caliber. They turn on their stream for some ladder games, but a lot of real practice needs to be done offstream. Well the reason I am arguing this is because I feel like most NA players are just missing a piece of the pie if they are not the TOP TOP TOP players, and feel to ignore the entertainment side of things, is just always going to result in retirement. Not to take anything away from what Theo did, dude played some sick games, and if he had fun doing it and feels its time to move on then so be it. He hasn't made an official statement so like i don't really know the real deal of why he quit. I can only assume its income related/life goals and whatever other personal stuff he may have with the game ie burnout and shit like that. Trust me bros streaming is a legit job, it's just like Walmart, you compete against thousands or millions of others for 50 or less slots paying minimum wage. Give me the choice of making minimum wage @ fucking Walmart or playing games, ill choose games 100%. Fuck id choose games over something that even paid more! Buying cars and excess bullshit just doesn't seem right to me, and in fact most people are so fixated on money. You know why? Because that's what the man wants you to do. Society forces these ideas of excess income on people. If you can support yourself, ya know eating, being clothed, roof over your head, not living in shit conditions. What in the actual fuck is wrong with that. Do you really put materialism over happiness? If so that's sad brah.
You just missed the entire point that only those 50 make minimum wage, the rest make pocket change.
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On August 01 2013 11:12 Moochlol wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2013 11:07 AKIRADEATH wrote:
I just don't get why we're discussing professional streamers in a thread about a retiring progamer. Destiny and Maximus aren't progamers.
I don't imagine progamers who want to be competitive in today's scene have the time to try and also be a streamer of that caliber. They turn on their stream for some ladder games, but a lot of real practice needs to be done offstream. Well the reason I am arguing this is because I feel like most NA players are just missing a piece of the pie if they are not the TOP TOP TOP players, and feel to ignore the entertainment side of things, is just always going to result in retirement. Not to take anything away from what Theo did, dude played some sick games, and if he had fun doing it and feels its time to move on then so be it. He hasn't made an official statement so like i don't really know the real deal of why he quit. I can only assume its income related/life goals and whatever other personal stuff he may have with the game ie burnout and shit like that.
I think that would be possible if it wasn't the reality these days that an NA progamer has to compete with Koreans that practice ~10 hours a day. It's simply not possible to be both things in this current environment. That's my feeling anyways, maybe some amazing person could be capable of running a YouTube channel, streaming every day and winning WCS matches.
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Nooooo 
Good luck
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On August 01 2013 11:30 Wombat_NI wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2013 11:24 Moochlol wrote:On August 01 2013 11:17 Doodsmack wrote:On August 01 2013 11:12 Moochlol wrote:On August 01 2013 11:07 AKIRADEATH wrote:
I just don't get why we're discussing professional streamers in a thread about a retiring progamer. Destiny and Maximus aren't progamers.
I don't imagine progamers who want to be competitive in today's scene have the time to try and also be a streamer of that caliber. They turn on their stream for some ladder games, but a lot of real practice needs to be done offstream. Well the reason I am arguing this is because I feel like most NA players are just missing a piece of the pie if they are not the TOP TOP TOP players, and feel to ignore the entertainment side of things, is just always going to result in retirement. Not to take anything away from what Theo did, dude played some sick games, and if he had fun doing it and feels its time to move on then so be it. He hasn't made an official statement so like i don't really know the real deal of why he quit. I can only assume its income related/life goals and whatever other personal stuff he may have with the game ie burnout and shit like that. Trust me bros streaming is a legit job, it's just like Walmart, you compete against thousands or millions of others for 50 or less slots paying minimum wage. Give me the choice of making minimum wage @ fucking Walmart or playing games, ill choose games 100%. Fuck id choose games over something that even paid more! Buying cars and excess bullshit just doesn't seem right to me, and in fact most people are so fixated on money. You know why? Because that's what the man wants you to do. Society forces these ideas of excess income on people. If you can support yourself, ya know eating, being clothed roof over your head, not living in shit conditions. Then what the actual fuck is wrong with that. Do you really put materialism over happiness? If so that's sad brah. Desiring to have enough money to live independently doesn't equal being materialistic. They're not making a decision between spending on excesses, or doing what they love, but between struggling to afford the basics without outside help and pursuing their careers as gamers.
Well yea man, if you are having a hard time making ends meet, then gtfo! Its the right move! I was trying to make a point that if you can independently sustain yourself though your channel, then that is all gravy! Going above and beyond to try to bank crazy amounts of money in this industry would be hard reach most definitely.
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United Kingdom14103 Posts
Best of luck
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That's honestly really too bad, I had a lot of respect for his ability to hang around for so long
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Northern Ireland27464 Posts
@Mooch. I don't care about personalities though, if I wanted to have a conversation with a witty urbane person I'd start up a conversation with myself. I enjoy the competitive side of the game, it's why it's E-sports and not E-chatshow or something.
There's so much talent in this scene, both at the game and at other activities that it pains me to see how it is structured at present and how many of these people are invested wholeheartedly into it.
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TT
Really liked theognis and I'll sure miss watching him play! GL in the future, wherever that takes you.
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On August 01 2013 11:30 Doodsmack wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2013 11:24 Moochlol wrote:On August 01 2013 11:17 Doodsmack wrote:On August 01 2013 11:12 Moochlol wrote:On August 01 2013 11:07 AKIRADEATH wrote:
I just don't get why we're discussing professional streamers in a thread about a retiring progamer. Destiny and Maximus aren't progamers.
I don't imagine progamers who want to be competitive in today's scene have the time to try and also be a streamer of that caliber. They turn on their stream for some ladder games, but a lot of real practice needs to be done offstream. Well the reason I am arguing this is because I feel like most NA players are just missing a piece of the pie if they are not the TOP TOP TOP players, and feel to ignore the entertainment side of things, is just always going to result in retirement. Not to take anything away from what Theo did, dude played some sick games, and if he had fun doing it and feels its time to move on then so be it. He hasn't made an official statement so like i don't really know the real deal of why he quit. I can only assume its income related/life goals and whatever other personal stuff he may have with the game ie burnout and shit like that. Trust me bros streaming is a legit job, it's just like Walmart, you compete against thousands or millions of others for 50 or less slots paying minimum wage. Give me the choice of making minimum wage @ fucking Walmart or playing games, ill choose games 100%. Fuck id choose games over something that even paid more! Buying cars and excess bullshit just doesn't seem right to me, and in fact most people are so fixated on money. You know why? Because that's what the man wants you to do. Society forces these ideas of excess income on people. If you can support yourself, ya know eating, being clothed, roof over your head, not living in shit conditions. What in the actual fuck is wrong with that. Do you really put materialism over happiness? If so that's sad brah. You just missed the entire point that only those 50 make minimum wage, the rest make pocket change.
Again coming out with this minimum wage thing, where are you getting these numbers, can you post a source? You know what Demu or Idra or Maximus or Destiny, or any popular streamer makes? I have not seen a public statement...please enlighten us. Ill be glad to see it. My overall point is that playing solely as a competitive gamer in SC2 in NA is pretty fucking ruff (Blizz not making it any better without region locking) and I would not be surprised if they average minimum wage. This is why i'm arguing that pulling back from the competitive side and focusing more on entertainment is the smarter choice. Again it comes down to what that person wants to do. If they have to pull out because it's not sustainable then whatever it is what it is. If they don't want to entertain, and try to live purely off winnings from this scene, then imo that's the RISKY choice. But hey do what you want right.
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Northern Ireland27464 Posts
It's the smart choice for certain individuals. However, most probably got into competitive gaming for competitive reasons, because that's a fire at the core of their psyche, if it shifts that way, it's no longer an E-sport title, just a title that people stream with webcams with.
I mean, personally I'd genuinely rather work in Walmart or our UK equivalent than have to stream many hours a day and interact with the community. If somebody gave me the chance to pay for my expenses and let me try to make it as a player, or as a caster I'd grasp that with both hands. I find those activities fun/engaging, dealing with people not so much.
Horses for course though, as you say.
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On August 01 2013 11:39 Wombat_NI wrote:
@Mooch. I don't care about personalities though, if I wanted to have a conversation with a witty urbane person I'd start up a conversation with myself. I enjoy the competitive side of the game, it's why it's E-sports and not E-chatshow or something.
There's so much talent in this scene, both at the game and at other activities that it pains me to see how it is structured at present and how many of these people are invested wholeheartedly into it.
Yea sure, The way things are pains me as well. I don't know what we are even talking about @ this point. Somehow I got involved in talking about this but its been a blur. I am really sad about the foreign SC2 ESPORTS scene as well. But you cant ignore that a lot of people are into the entertainment side of things as well as purely tourney stuff. Like my perfect streamer doesn't exist, one that would be competitive yet really entertaining @ the same time. Like Maximus is really fun out of game, but when he plays he just bores me to death. Destiny left sc2 and was one of my fav's back in the day but I just cant get into LOL. And well the closest thing would be Demu for me, but hes a little too PC and bland ( No hype) for my taste, not that I blame him hes on EG and cant really go crazy. And well idra......its old getting old brosif. I really believe you cannot entertain and try to play this game seriously, its just too much. Which is why i prefer a little bit of both, more entertainment than competition, yet I still enjoy when the people try to show good games, with some actual skill. I find myself watching less and less tournaments as time goes by. WCS just leaves a bad taste in my mouth at the moment.
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On August 01 2013 11:24 Moochlol wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2013 11:17 Doodsmack wrote:On August 01 2013 11:12 Moochlol wrote:On August 01 2013 11:07 AKIRADEATH wrote:
I just don't get why we're discussing professional streamers in a thread about a retiring progamer. Destiny and Maximus aren't progamers.
I don't imagine progamers who want to be competitive in today's scene have the time to try and also be a streamer of that caliber. They turn on their stream for some ladder games, but a lot of real practice needs to be done offstream. Well the reason I am arguing this is because I feel like most NA players are just missing a piece of the pie if they are not the TOP TOP TOP players, and feel to ignore the entertainment side of things, is just always going to result in retirement. Not to take anything away from what Theo did, dude played some sick games, and if he had fun doing it and feels its time to move on then so be it. He hasn't made an official statement so like i don't really know the real deal of why he quit. I can only assume its income related/life goals and whatever other personal stuff he may have with the game ie burnout and shit like that. Trust me bros streaming is a legit job, it's just like Walmart, you compete against thousands or millions of others for 50 or less slots paying minimum wage. Give me the choice of making minimum wage @ fucking Walmart or playing games, ill choose games 100%. Fuck i'd choose games over something that even decent money. Buying cars and excess bullshit just doesn't seem right to me, and in fact most people are so fixated on money. You know why? Because that's what the man wants you to do. Society forces these ideas of excess income on people. If you can support yourself, ya know eating, being clothed, roof over your head, not living in shit conditions. What in the actual fuck is wrong with that. Do you really put materialism over happiness? If so that's sad brah.
I don't think you understand the fact that you have a 99% chance of never making a dime off streaming unless you get extremely lucky and even then you aren't guaranteed to make much money. Actually judging by your posts I am convinced you think making money streaming is an entertaining personality away which couldn't be more wrong.
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On August 01 2013 11:30 AKIRADEATH wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2013 11:12 Moochlol wrote:On August 01 2013 11:07 AKIRADEATH wrote:
I just don't get why we're discussing professional streamers in a thread about a retiring progamer. Destiny and Maximus aren't progamers.
I don't imagine progamers who want to be competitive in today's scene have the time to try and also be a streamer of that caliber. They turn on their stream for some ladder games, but a lot of real practice needs to be done offstream. Well the reason I am arguing this is because I feel like most NA players are just missing a piece of the pie if they are not the TOP TOP TOP players, and feel to ignore the entertainment side of things, is just always going to result in retirement. Not to take anything away from what Theo did, dude played some sick games, and if he had fun doing it and feels its time to move on then so be it. He hasn't made an official statement so like i don't really know the real deal of why he quit. I can only assume its income related/life goals and whatever other personal stuff he may have with the game ie burnout and shit like that. I think that would be possible if it wasn't the reality these days that an NA progamer has to compete with Koreans that practice ~10 hours a day. It's simply not possible to be both things in this current environment. That's my feeling anyways, maybe some amazing person could be capable of running a YouTube channel, streaming every day and winning WCS matches.
Yea man I agree, its ruff as hell. How can you really do both is my argument. Given the way shit is, Korea and all. No region locking, WCS mismanagement and a general waning interest in SC2 as a game.
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Theognis was a great player, best of luck to your next chapter in life Mike!
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On August 01 2013 11:50 Esoterikk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2013 11:24 Moochlol wrote:On August 01 2013 11:17 Doodsmack wrote:On August 01 2013 11:12 Moochlol wrote:On August 01 2013 11:07 AKIRADEATH wrote:
I just don't get why we're discussing professional streamers in a thread about a retiring progamer. Destiny and Maximus aren't progamers.
I don't imagine progamers who want to be competitive in today's scene have the time to try and also be a streamer of that caliber. They turn on their stream for some ladder games, but a lot of real practice needs to be done offstream. Well the reason I am arguing this is because I feel like most NA players are just missing a piece of the pie if they are not the TOP TOP TOP players, and feel to ignore the entertainment side of things, is just always going to result in retirement. Not to take anything away from what Theo did, dude played some sick games, and if he had fun doing it and feels its time to move on then so be it. He hasn't made an official statement so like i don't really know the real deal of why he quit. I can only assume its income related/life goals and whatever other personal stuff he may have with the game ie burnout and shit like that. Trust me bros streaming is a legit job, it's just like Walmart, you compete against thousands or millions of others for 50 or less slots paying minimum wage. Give me the choice of making minimum wage @ fucking Walmart or playing games, ill choose games 100%. Fuck i'd choose games over something that even decent money. Buying cars and excess bullshit just doesn't seem right to me, and in fact most people are so fixated on money. You know why? Because that's what the man wants you to do. Society forces these ideas of excess income on people. If you can support yourself, ya know eating, being clothed, roof over your head, not living in shit conditions. What in the actual fuck is wrong with that. Do you really put materialism over happiness? If so that's sad brah. I don't think you understand the fact that you have a 99% chance of never making a dime off streaming unless you get extremely lucky and even then you aren't guaranteed to make much money. Actually judging by your posts I am convinced you think making money streaming is an entertaining personality away which couldn't be more wrong.
Random statistics AGAIN! And your last sentence could use a nice edit, so I could respond to it.
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lol @ Mooch's troll...I'm sad I responded to it twice. Maybe I should gift you TL+ just for that.
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EPT
