• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 09:57
CET 15:57
KST 23:57
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
Weekly Cups (Dec 15-21): Classic wins big, MaxPax & Clem take weeklies3ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !10Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win4Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump1Weekly Cups (Nov 24-30): MaxPax, Clem, herO win2
StarCraft 2
General
What's the best tug of war? The Grack before Christmas Weekly Cups (Dec 15-21): Classic wins big, MaxPax & Clem take weeklies ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career ! Micro Lags When Playing SC2?
Tourneys
OSC Season 13 World Championship $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship $100 Prize Pool - Winter Warp Gate Masters Showdow Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Winter Warp Gate Amateur Showdown #1
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 505 Rise From Ashes Mutation # 504 Retribution Mutation # 503 Fowl Play Mutation # 502 Negative Reinforcement
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Recommended FPV games (post-KeSPA) BW General Discussion FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle soO on: FanTaSy's Potential Return to StarCraft
Tourneys
Small VOD Thread 2.0 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] LB QuarterFinals - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL21] WB SEMIFINALS - Saturday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Game Theory for Starcraft Current Meta Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason Path of Exile General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Russo-Ukrainian War Thread How Does UI/UX Design Influence User Trust? Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List TL+ Announced Where to ask questions and add stream?
Blogs
National Diversity: A Challe…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Thanks for the RSL
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2459 users

Balance patch this week - Hellbats nerfed, Banshees buffed…

Forum Index > SC2 General
1080 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 29 30 31 32 33 55 Next
NarutO
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
Germany18839 Posts
July 09 2013 11:32 GMT
#601
On July 09 2013 20:30 Lock0n wrote:
Once hellbats are nerfed, TvT will go from being a tense and explosive matchup with hellbat drops, to a long and drawn out turtle fest. This nerf will add 10 mins to an average TvT game, and will be much more boring if you ask me.


It only means the initial hellbat drop is weaker against economy. They are as good as before against marauders, tanks, vikings.... basically everything but marines and economy and hellions. Actually its a huge buff to forGG build lol :D
CommentatorPolt | MMA | Jjakji | BoxeR | NaDa | MVP | MKP ... truly inspiring.
Fuchsteufelswild
Profile Joined October 2009
Australia2028 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-09 11:36:18
July 09 2013 11:36 GMT
#602
On July 09 2013 20:18 Napoleon53 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 19:39 Drake wrote:
172 HARDCORE terran players who vote for "I only like the banshee" thats the best in whole poll haha

Im a terranplayer who dont like the hellbat nerf. I think it is too soft. I would rather prefer something like less HP, no medivac healing, or even slower movement speed. I dont think the damage nerf is enough. But I guess time will tell...

I know you're probably just throwing ideas around but wouldn't that make them even more useless in mech play?
You'd only be moving them via medivac and with them still being biological, they might feel even more like bio units (if you can only really use them when you have medivacs, may as well make more?).
Mineral cost bio reavers minus the range and with a smaller area of effect. :O
I'm just playing around with the theory of the idea, you understand.
ZerO - FantaSy - Calm - Nal_rA - Jaedong - NaDa - EffOrt - Bisu - by.hero - StarDust - Welmu - Nerchio - Supernova - Solar - Squirtle - LosirA - Grubby - IntoTheRainbow - Golden... ~~~ Incredible Miracle and Woongjin Stars 화이팅!
matsushi
Profile Joined December 2010
Philippines65 Posts
July 09 2013 11:39 GMT
#603
Thank God... Hellbat was ruining TvT.. It was seriously getting too boring just making hellbats and dropping them on mineral linez every single game
Driving this road down to paradise, letting the sunlight into my eyes
Napoleon53
Profile Joined January 2010
Denmark167 Posts
July 09 2013 11:46 GMT
#604
On July 09 2013 20:36 Fuchsteufelswild wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 20:18 Napoleon53 wrote:
On July 09 2013 19:39 Drake wrote:
172 HARDCORE terran players who vote for "I only like the banshee" thats the best in whole poll haha

Im a terranplayer who dont like the hellbat nerf. I think it is too soft. I would rather prefer something like less HP, no medivac healing, or even slower movement speed. I dont think the damage nerf is enough. But I guess time will tell...

I know you're probably just throwing ideas around but wouldn't that make them even more useless in mech play?
You'd only be moving them via medivac and with them still being biological, they might feel even more like bio units (if you can only really use them when you have medivacs, may as well make more?).
Mineral cost bio reavers minus the range and with a smaller area of effect. :O
I'm just playing around with the theory of the idea, you understand.

ya true - I totally get what you're saying. Lowering movement speed might not be the way to go I just feel like the mass hellbat vs mass hellbat in tvt will continue, since hellbats are soo strong against marines.
Msr
Profile Joined March 2011
Korea (South)495 Posts
July 09 2013 12:02 GMT
#605
is there a set day they are doing this? from past experience tuesday(today) would be the most common day for them to implement some form of change.
MasterDrone
Profile Joined January 2013
France50 Posts
July 09 2013 12:04 GMT
#606
Zerg: watch out for Blue flame Hellion & Hellbat interchanging! The whole mineral line can just go down in instant!
govie
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
9334 Posts
July 09 2013 12:25 GMT
#607
On July 09 2013 02:33 Entirety wrote:
Blizzard just nerfed INnoVation!


Back in code b
The two NBA teams in states with legal weed are called the Nuggets and the Blazers...
Lephex
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany153 Posts
July 09 2013 12:41 GMT
#608
pleas give me an idea how i should survive cloaked mass banshee pushes on platin (top8 ) as a protoss ??, banshees just eat my whole early game armys, and if i fast tech to templar feedback i have so less ground to defend marines + tank + banshee. Anyone can give me a hint ? my stalkers just melt to mass banshee and now cloak will be ready so much faster :/ please helllllp xD ( hellbat change +1)
There are three types of people in this world: those who make things happen, those who watch things happen and those who wonder what happened.
Chr15t
Profile Joined March 2011
Denmark1103 Posts
July 09 2013 12:53 GMT
#609
On July 09 2013 02:34 purakushi wrote:
My question is if hellbats are going to shoot blue flames after the upgrade.

:O would be cool
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
Vindicare605
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States16109 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-09 12:58:03
July 09 2013 12:55 GMT
#610
On July 09 2013 21:53 Chr15t wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 02:34 purakushi wrote:
My question is if hellbats are going to shoot blue flames after the upgrade.

:O would be cool


They did on the test map.

There's no reason for them not to put the graphic in on the live realms especially now that it serves a valuable purpose in identifying upgraded Helbats vs stock.

Also just checked, Cloaken confirmed the graphic will return when he replied to the thread on reddit. http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/1hvjej/blue_post_balance_patch_incoming_this_week/
aka: KTVindicare the Geeky Bartender
Naphal
Profile Joined December 2010
Germany2099 Posts
July 09 2013 13:16 GMT
#611
i hope blizz will adress some other issues too, like caduceus reactor... or maybe merge hellionupgrades into "infernal warfare"
Railgan
Profile Joined August 2010
Switzerland1507 Posts
July 09 2013 13:21 GMT
#612
On July 09 2013 22:16 Naphal wrote:
i hope blizz will adress some other issues too, like caduceus reactor... or maybe merge hellionupgrades into "infernal warfare"

They will call it Bluetransform!
Grandmaster Zerg from Switzerland!!! www.twitch.tv/railgan // www.twitter.com/railgansc // www.youtube.com/c/railgansc
Hider
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Denmark9408 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-09 13:25:26
July 09 2013 13:21 GMT
#613
On July 09 2013 18:48 Rabiator wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 18:02 NarutO wrote:
On July 09 2013 17:47 Rabiator wrote:
Hellbat change wont matter much, because the "problem" of the Hellbat drop is that it costs almost nothing and you can lose 3-4 double Medivac drops and only deal the decisive economic blow with the 5th drop anyways. Sooo ... people will just save up the Medivacs and Hellbats until blue flame is done researching and then go with 4-5 Medivacs at the same time.

Power Overwhelming!

The Hellbat change isnt a "fix of the issue" but rather only a delay ... and since the time doesnt really matter that much (because they are just as efficient later on and players wont have built more static defenses anyways) the effect will be just the same.


I called you out on another balance thread, and I'll do here as well. You called me an arrogant asshole for that matter for calling you out, but the reality is, you don't understand the game at the level you need to, to actually make a qualified post. While the hellbat drops were dangerous for Protoss and Zerg, they were no where near balance breaking or game deciding and eventually, defending the hellbat drops with killing the medivac/hellbats leaves Terran actually far behind, but a player like you will never understand, because they overcommit to defence.

Queens are actually a very good call as they are powerful against medivacs and hellbats, they can transfuse the static defence as well. If you go hellbat drops and commit (aka lose the medivac) you will end up way behind. IF you don't commit and save everything, you dealt minimal damage. The marauder/hellbat timing that can follow is strong, but certainly not unbeatable especially when scouted and ling/bane or roach/bane can defend it.

If you defend that timing, Terran is more than just behind. I don't even want to start on TvP .



So why did Moonglade lose that game after Sound lost FOUR DOUBLE-Medivac-Hellbat drops without achieving too much? By your definition Sound should have been MILES behind because of the HUGE investment.

Oh and I called you arrogant because you said that balance should only be done for the top half of the progamers and "tough luck for the rest of the players, sucks to be you. Have fun playing an unbalanced game." (more or less).


Moonglades macro completely fell apart during the drops actually.
Actual it wasn't really only during the drops. Kinda through the entire game it was semi-sloppy, and his drone-timing wasn't very good either.
Quateras
Profile Joined August 2012
Germany867 Posts
July 09 2013 13:25 GMT
#614
On July 09 2013 21:41 Lephex wrote:
pleas give me an idea how i should survive cloaked mass banshee pushes on platin (top8 ) as a protoss ??, banshees just eat my whole early game armys, and if i fast tech to templar feedback i have so less ground to defend marines + tank + banshee. Anyone can give me a hint ? my stalkers just melt to mass banshee and now cloak will be ready so much faster :/ please helllllp xD ( hellbat change +1)


If someone uses THIS much of his money for banshee's you can easily invest into a single stargate with 4-5 Phoenix.
Liking the change, although i foresee problems for Terrans in TvP, but maybe they'll figure out a new opening.
"If you don't know where you are going, you can never get lost."
TurboMaN
Profile Joined October 2005
Germany925 Posts
July 09 2013 13:27 GMT
#615
Are they patching now? EU Bnet is offline for me!
Yoshirou_Iba
Profile Joined January 2013
Paraguay37 Posts
July 09 2013 13:31 GMT
#616
sound distracted moonglades attention and scatterd his focus everywhere while he build his own economy and in the end moonlade could not catch up he was grinded by beter macro + harass terran
HeeroFX
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States2704 Posts
July 09 2013 13:33 GMT
#617
On July 09 2013 22:27 TurboMaN wrote:
Are they patching now? EU Bnet is offline for me!



TL bot says all of the servers are up
TurboMaN
Profile Joined October 2005
Germany925 Posts
July 09 2013 13:34 GMT
#618
Hmm I always get the "Temporary Outage of Battlenet Service" message when I try to log in
midnight999
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States257 Posts
July 09 2013 13:38 GMT
#619
On July 09 2013 17:19 Napoleon53 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 17:05 xxxKagexxx wrote:
On July 09 2013 16:35 Napoleon53 wrote:
Hm Banshees were very strong in the early WoL days. I always wondered why the totally disappeared over time. I think this buff might be too strong.

Seems like it is possible to rush to cloaked banshees while expanding.


LOL seems that u learn about fast expand is a strat powerfull ?


Not really sure what you mean. My point was that cloaked banshees can be made from 1 gas now. Thereby making it more safe to expand behind it.

Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 16:36 Qikz wrote:
On July 09 2013 16:35 Napoleon53 wrote:
Hm Banshees were very strong in the early WoL days. I always wondered why the totally disappeared over time. I think this buff might be too strong.

Seems like it is possible to rush to cloaked banshees while expanding.


Most of it is because of HoTS.

Widow mines one shot banshees and everyone opened hellbats. Protoss has easier detection (Stargate or Robo) so unless he goes 4 gate doesn't outright die like they did in WoL if they didn't get a robo and Zerg have the best early game AA in the game (queens/no evo spores).

That's mostly why I believe.

Thanks for answer! I guess this makes sense. I didnt know widow mines one shot banshees.. Are you sure about that? Widow mines do 125 dam.. and banshees have 140 hp.


That's not really an option. I tried that out.
Liquid`Jinro
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
Sweden33719 Posts
July 09 2013 13:48 GMT
#620
On July 09 2013 20:32 NarutO wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 20:30 Lock0n wrote:
Once hellbats are nerfed, TvT will go from being a tense and explosive matchup with hellbat drops, to a long and drawn out turtle fest. This nerf will add 10 mins to an average TvT game, and will be much more boring if you ask me.


It only means the initial hellbat drop is weaker against economy. They are as good as before against marauders, tanks, vikings.... basically everything but marines and economy and hellions. Actually its a huge buff to forGG build lol :D

Whats the forgg build?
Moderatortell the guy that interplanatar interaction is pivotal to terrans variety of optionitudals in the pre-midgame preperatories as well as the protosstinal deterriggation of elite zergling strikes - Stimey n | Formerly FrozenArbiter
Prev 1 29 30 31 32 33 55 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 3m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Livibee 142
SKillous 89
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 50695
Sea 4581
Rain 3498
EffOrt 1196
PianO 954
Soma 363
Shuttle 331
Mini 286
ggaemo 209
firebathero 202
[ Show more ]
Light 194
BeSt 164
Mong 163
Rush 152
Snow 133
Sharp 130
Hyun 113
Zeus 92
Barracks 87
hero 74
JYJ 64
Terrorterran 58
Mind 53
Leta 51
Sexy 22
zelot 20
scan(afreeca) 16
yabsab 13
Shine 11
Bale 10
JulyZerg 10
SilentControl 10
Dota 2
qojqva4507
XcaliburYe808
Fuzer 225
League of Legends
Reynor38
Counter-Strike
olofmeister2924
zeus1412
edward202
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor213
Other Games
singsing2258
crisheroes385
Mlord157
XaKoH 140
B2W.Neo18
Organizations
StarCraft 2
CranKy Ducklings133
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 83
• HeavenSC 29
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 7
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota294
Upcoming Events
Big Brain Bouts
2h 3m
Elazer vs Nicoract
Reynor vs Scarlett
Replay Cast
10h 3m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 19h
Krystianer vs TBD
TriGGeR vs SKillous
Percival vs TBD
ByuN vs Nicoract
OSC
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
OSC
3 days
Solar vs MaxPax
ByuN vs Krystianer
Spirit vs TBD
OSC
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
CSL Season 19: Qualifier 2
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025

Upcoming

CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Big Gabe Cup #3
OSC Championship Season 13
Nations Cup 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.