@HeadCoachPark As you know EG-TL team is faced with a difficult situation in Proleague. We need miracle. We will make the miracle. Expect us and love us.
I like this guy, already! As many of you BW veterans already know, Coach Park is apparently a living legend. I'm excited to see what he's going to do with EG-TL (I hope he isn't too hard and grueling on the players, though, but that's my own personal bent).
I think EG-TL faces a hard battle, though. If they were playing up to their potential, I think you could argue that they wouldn't be doing THAT much better than a 50/50 record, since the current KeSPA competition is so stiff.
But I'm just glad to see the era of questionable (or infuriating) player lineup selections and strange, risky builds coming out of our top players come to an end. Or, so I hope
UPDATED [Saturday (Mar 16th), 12:17PM PDT]:
@HeadCoachPark In order to gain training time per day,I must manage my player's streaming time efficiently the first. The time is KST am 10~12.(regularly)
@HeadCoachPark If someone want to help our team for winning in Proleague, Plz watch my player's streaming at that time. Plz help us and cheer for EG-TL.
This sounds pretty cool. They'll still be having regular streaming hours, but I guess this means there will be a lot more guaranteed team training times when they are NOT streaming. This might mean the whole team will be synced up, too, so the teamwork training can be a lot more coordinated.
UPDATED [Tuesday (Mar 19th), 3:49PM PDT]:
Coach Park gave an interview with a Korean site and Tweeted about it. I tried using Google Translate but it was kind of confusing
BUT, it seems that todobiennn on Reddit translated it for us, which was reposted by larse and opterown. Thanks guys!
Q: Coach Park! It’s been a while. I would first like to hear exactly when you entered EG-TL. A: Hello, it has been a while hasn’t it? It’s a pleasure. I am the new head coach of EG-TL, Park Yong Woon. Actually, it’s only been about 10 days since the decision was made. Serious negotiations only started about 3 weeks ago. I spoke with the head and CEO Alex quite often and after the decision was made, much preparation was had. I thought it would be detrimental if I were to just go headlong into it, so I took the time to think about where I could bring about the most change. I especially thought about whether or not I could bring results. You could say I took the time to calculate everything? I received help in many ways from many people and made my decision. Alex really seems to believe in me, so I’m already eager to go to work.
Q: You were an advisor for SK Telecom T1 until you became head coach for EG-TL. What kind of processes did you have to go through? A: SK actually helped me a lot. To be exact, President Oh Kyung Shik helped me quite a bit. Recently I felt I needed to learn English, so I went to Philippines to do so. After that I was supposed to focus on the SK Telecom T1 League of Legends team. But because the field I was about to enter was so different from the field I have been working in, it bothered me. You know how people have their ambition, so I had thoughts that my past experiences would be somewhat wasted. So when I voiced these sentiments, he helped me and in turn, I think the results turned out wonderfully.
Q: You probably had a world of opportunity in front of you, but why did you choose EG-TL? A: I’ve always wanted to coach a foreign team, even when I was at SK Telecom T1. So in preparation, I even hired tutors to verse myself in English. You know how I became an advisor, correct? To be honest, I wasn’t too happy with it. Only for an instant of course (laughs). So when this path opened up for me I thought, “This must be a heaven-sent opportunity.” Immediately after, I went to the Philippines to improve my English and even started working out to prepare. I took a little time off and it was very rewarding. During the process, I also came up with a lot of ideas. So when I was looking around for a foreign team and found EG-TL, I decided to take this opportunity to use my experiences.
Q: Even on the SK Planet Proleague Media Day (don’t ask, I have no idea) people thought EG-TL as a strong contender. But to be straight, they did not live up to the hype. Why do you think this is so? A: I would first like to say that their record seems appropriate. You don’t think so? I researched/investigated the team for 10 days or so and I concluded that this was the only possible outcome. The problem has nothing to do with the players themselves, but the infrastructure of the team itself. They have a poor environment compared to those of other teams. They cannot focus solely on Proleague, they have to travel to foreign tournaments, they have mandatory streaming obligations, as well as a lacking coaching staff, making it difficult to organize the team well. There are foreign players, and there are too many players to make practice smoothly (not 100% on this translation). Coach Kim Sung Hwan (Hwanni) must have been very frustrated. Although the players have much value to their names, because of these factors the current results were inevitable.
Q: Now that you know the problem, how will you go about fixing it? What changes will you bring? A: Hmm…I’m still giving a lot of thought to it. Truthfully, I am not sure yet. But one thing is sure: it is impossible to completely fix the problem. I am approaching with the goal of minimizing all harmful factors. For example, I’ve been thinking about how to solve the streaming problem for 2 days. There is the danger of showing their full strength to the public, but if they do not their salaries are cut and must give up a portion of their winnings so…I’m still thinking about it. I’ve actually changed the streaming schedule a bit. Before it seemed as though the players were streaming whenever they had free time, but now I have them all stream at the same time. I also changed it so that they stream in the morning. This way the streams will be more accessible to the foreign fans. The response has been great. The players used to stream into the night, resulting in insufficient rest and poor condition the next morning. This was a big problem. Having them stream in the morning is beneficial in many ways. First, it is a way to warm up their fingers. Second, it’s a good way to fill their stream requirements. Third, their full strength will not be shown. Though there probably will be fans who will wake up early to watch as well (laughs). Fans would have to wait for stream announcements to watch the players, essentially being in the dark. But now that they all have a fixed schedule, viewers can simply wait for the streams to start at a certain time. This will increase viewership, increase player income, and provide a little fun for the players streaming together. One by one, I am approaching this problem step by step.
Q: Since this is a foreign team, there are occasions where you are unable to use key players due to foreign tournaments. It’s something that you’re not used to, what do you think of it? A: You’re right, there will be times where we won’t be at full strength and forced to change up our rotation. It seems a bit unfair seeing how no other team has this problem (laughs), but I think there is some charm to this. The same way I am trying to improve the streaming schedule, I feel I can turn this into something great as well. This attracts me very much. It kind of feels like solving a homework problem? It’s definitely a challenge.
Q: What do think is most important when running a team? A: Coming to EG-TL the thing that worried me the most was how to schedule their days, especially since there would be Koreans and foreigners under the same roof. It worried me a lot. But as I met and talked with the players, I found I could apply my past experiences here as well. There was nothing different. I had no need to worry because they were all still gamers with the pro mentality. What I think is most important is their daily life. One’s individual rhythm is incredibly important. No matter how hard you practice, if you practice until 4 or 5 in the morning and feel dead tired the next morning or sleep in, I think that is a sign of a bad gamer. If you are a pro, you should know how to control yourself. You must learn to stop and recover when needed. I will not allow any action that destroys one’s rhythm. Currently, I am making the players go to bed and wake up early. They are chastised if they are caught up after 2am (laughs). I am also teaching them the habit to self-check their daily life. How long they slept, how much they practice is all being checked. This is all pro mentality in my opinion. You do not just sleep to sleep or practice to practice. You must know just how much sleep you need to be 100%. To know oneself, that is what a pro is. (I love this quote btw.) I am working to teach them this mentality.
Q: What do you think is the reason for the lack of results? A: It is as many have already guessed. They don’t hold Proleague preparation as their top priority. Their potential is enormous. You can’t blame them for this either as their environment is different. A pro’s worth is measured by their earnings and whatnot, so teams have geared their players towards focusing on Proleague. Starting with incentives to raises for Proleague standards. But our team gains more from winning outside tournaments. It’s hard to raise a team camaraderie. To make this a team a true team is my role.
Q: What do you think is EG-TL’s biggest problem right now? A: We need Terrans (laughs). We really don’t have any Terrans. Other than Yoon Young Suh (Taeja) we don’t have anyone. Terran looks very strong in Heart of the Swarm, so the problem is even bigger. I am still thinking of how to solve this.
Q: Do you think you’ll have a hard time leading such a nationally diverse team? A: I won’t be able to communicate effectively with them. The language barrier is obvious. Other than that I don’t think we will have any major problems. I get along with foreigners pretty well. I look forward to befriending ‘ThorZaIN’ Marcus Eklof and ‘Stephano’ Ilyes Satouri and many others.
Q: The most important question! I would like to ask of your English skills? How was your time in the Philippines? A: You can’t be perfect, you know? (laughs) What I learned in the Philippines was to speak with confidence. Every word with confidence. It helped a lot. But my grammar is still a bit shaky, so I’ve already gone through four grammar textbooks. I think I’ve improved a bit (laughs). I’m still much better than when I used to be. There won’t be any big translation issues, but I’m still worried (laughs). But I will have Coach Kim Sung Hwan (Hwanni) close by so I will try to learn much from him.
Q: When you were officially taken in, what did the team head say? A: The first thing I remember was, “Great!” Then it was, “Impressed!” It was a great response (laughs). What I am most grateful to Alex is his trust in me. Jokingly I said to him, “Even if you can’t trust your family, you can trust me. You have to gamble your trust in me.” He continued to give me his full trust. No matter what I would suggest, he would take it. He makes my work worthwhile. When I first spoke to Alex, I sent him my entire analysis of EG and improvement plans. He was very surprised about that. Outside of Korea, Head coach is regarded similar to a team manager. He said that he did not expect me to think about the team this much, and since then, whatever I say, he gives me his full trust. Of course, I will repay his trust with results.
Q: How have you divided the coaching staff’s roles? A: Coach Park Sung Jin and I will take care of the team, as usual. He will essentially be my assistant. Coach Kim Sung Hwan will be general coach, dealing with foreign players or working with me in communications to discuss the growth of this team in the right direction. This way I can direct my full attention to coaching the team.
Q: The 4th round of Proleague isn’t far off, what are your thoughts on Heart of the Swarm? A: I haven’t been able to play a lot. It’s my first time after the closed beta. I have discussed with the players and Terran seems to be very strong. That is why I am worried, as there are too few Terrans on the team. But I do have an issue with the Ignite Thrusters (laughs). I used to think it would be fun to put boosters on Brood War Dropships but this is real. But the boosters in HotS are a little different than what I imagined. They should use energy, or become more vulnerable when using them, something like that. There has to be a risk, but there are none, so it’s no fun when players can infinitely use them. To make the game more enjoyable, there has to be some escape to that, but there are none, which is disappointing. Maybe if there was something like Scourge, but as of now it’s a bit lacking. They can definitely make it more exciting. Other than that, it’s a very fun game. It’s better than ‘Wings of Liberty.” But looking at player’s responses, I think they are correct in calling it “Terrancraft.” (laughs)
Q: What is EG-TL’s goal for the second half of the season? A: Well, we have to recover. We have a big goal. Looking at the numbers though, it may be impossible (laughs). EG-TL’s goal is to enter the playoffs. Though through calculations, it is a very impossible number. To enter the playoffs, EG-TL must win 14 of their next 21 games. We have to play like the 1st place Woongjin Stars to have a place in the playoffs. To be honest, it is a very hard goal. But after talking with the players, and with Alex as well, the consensus I hear is, “We can still do it.” Though it will be a difficult path, I believe it will be the time of my life. But I do hope that luck and miracles help us (laughs).
Q: You have been labeled as a legend due to your ability. What do you think your chances are in reaching the post-season as you did last year? A: I am here because I believe it is possible. If EG-TL doesn’t make the playoffs, it will be disappointing to break my streak (laughs), but to continue my ambition, I accept this challenge. I’ve always loved challenges. If everything was laid out for me, where’s the fun in that? I will give it my all.
Q: Before we go, say something to the fans! A: Firstly, to both the Korean and foreign fans. To the Korean fans I ask you to embrace our players. They are having a hard time. Embrace them, cheer for them, and we will work towards the playoffs. We need momentum. If not, I don’t think we will be able to, so cheer for us! To the foreign fans I would like to voice my thinks. When the announcement was made on EG’s front page, I read many of the comments. I never imagined the amount of support you gave me. Thank you so much. It was very moving. I will return the favor, I will not forget your support. I will do my best. Lastly, I would like to address the two geniuses of EG. Alex! I want to tell you that your voice is really great. Thanks you so much. I believe we will be very good partners. I heard the team coordinator Cody is getting married soon. Congratulations! I hope to continue to inform you of what is going on. Please cheer for us!
Despite watching for a long time I don't understand how proleague finals/playoffs work. Is each round a point or is the sum of all rounds that matters... What does EGTL need to do to qualify?
Interesting, but I guess the statement is quite valid. I wonder what he's gonna do, but no matter what I see all of this as something that'll improve EGTL.
On March 16 2013 11:00 ClairvoyanceSC2 wrote: I hope they really do well in SPL. My fanboy-ism keeps choosing them for FPL but they never do that well D:
Me, too. My FPL team last round was called "KT-EG-TL or Bust!" and that was the worst round so far for BOTH KT and EG-TL. It was a painful month or so, lol
On March 16 2013 11:07 Testuser wrote: Interesting, but I guess the statement is quite valid. I wonder what he's gonna do, but no matter what I see all of this as something that'll improve EGTL.
You have to know where you are at, and where you want to be, before you can get anything done. He knows what task he's taking on. I'm hopeful, not so much for that they'll make a miracle come back this season, but they'll start the turn around that gives them success next season.
Wouldn't be surprised for HotS to flip the Proleague tables around again. It will be interesting, that's for sure. I can see EG-TL getting like 4th or 5th, but not much better than that.
On March 16 2013 11:22 bduddy wrote: You guys know that IM didn't invent the world "miracle", right? I can't believe how many of you seem to seriously think "OMG EG will buy IM!!!1"
On March 16 2013 11:22 bduddy wrote: You guys know that IM didn't invent the world "miracle", right? I can't believe how many of you seem to seriously think "OMG EG will buy IM!!!1"
I don't think a few weeks of practice under a new coach will do that much. It is probably going to take a few months, EG-TL also needs a larger roster, and the players on the PL team should not being streaming their games several hours a day for all the kespa players to study.
It's going to be hilarious when EG(TL too?) realizes they just wasted a ton of money on this guy, only to still fail in Proleague. They will need a miracle, and that shit ain't happening. If they are planning on staying in Proleague next year, this would be a reasonable investment. Perhaps they are just trying to get out of the "Last Place" so that they are ABLE to do another season of Proleague. Who knows! Maybe Taeja will come in there and ezmode people!
On March 16 2013 11:15 Faranth wrote: LGIMEGTLSKMCRC incoming.
You beat me to it ahhaah.
Personally, if the players of both teams dedicate themselves they can for sure be competing with the kespa teams in the near future. Coaching is absolutely huge in any sport, even e-sports so getting a world renowned coach will help players strive. (Hopefully we can see results from those who havn't shown in a while foreigner power!
They really aren't that far behind in the standings. If they go 13-8 in the last 21 games they could make the playoffs because of the way the middle teams are all around .500
They will never do well as long as they keep streaming every day. I dont understand why you keep forcing your players to stream and reveal their playstyle when at the same time you are investing so heavily into doing well in proleague.
On March 16 2013 13:17 mrRoflpwn wrote: They will never do well as long as they keep streaming every day. I dont understand why you keep forcing your players to stream and reveal their playstyle when at the same time you are investing so heavily into doing well in proleague.
I think the coach is probably the best place to start for recovering this team, because all of these guys clearly have massive talent, but they just never win in proleague. I legitimately believe Park can turn this team around.
On March 16 2013 13:17 mrRoflpwn wrote: They will never do well as long as they keep streaming every day. I dont understand why you keep forcing your players to stream and reveal their playstyle when at the same time you are investing so heavily into doing well in proleague.
Advertising dollars.
All players are free to keep the revenues they get from streaming.
This sounds pretty cool. They'll still be having regular streaming hours, but I guess this means there will be a lot more guaranteed team training times when they are NOT streaming. This might mean the whole team will be synced up, too, so the teamwork training can be a lot more coordinated.
That streaming time is at like around 3am for me, I guess that means I won't be able to watch those players anymore. No LiquidHero, my fav player ( But if it helps them, they should definitely try it out.
On March 16 2013 13:17 mrRoflpwn wrote: They will never do well as long as they keep streaming every day. I dont understand why you keep forcing your players to stream and reveal their playstyle when at the same time you are investing so heavily into doing well in proleague.
Advertising dollars.
All players are free to keep the revenues they get from streaming.
Streaming revenue and sponsor exposure are two different things, someone else in here beat me to that point.
Since Coach Park was acquired by EG. will the players from TL in the EG TL house also be benefiting from his coaching? It may seem like the answer is obviously yes, but you never really know when it's not explicitly stated.
On March 18 2013 06:05 HornyHydra wrote: I believe in EG-TL!
Since Coach Park was acquired by EG. will the players from TL in the EG TL house also be benefiting from his coaching? It may seem like the answer is obviously yes, but you never really know when it's not explicitly stated.
I was wondering whether TL and EG were both paying for Coach Park's salary, and/or whether it was a 50/50 split.
On March 16 2013 11:11 Larkin wrote: Wouldn't be surprised for HotS to flip the Proleague tables around again. It will be interesting, that's for sure. I can see EG-TL getting like 4th or 5th, but not much better than that.
seeing that the guy who wrote that is banned from TL. That's the spirit. Ban all the nonbelievers
This sounds pretty cool. They'll still be having regular streaming hours, but I guess this means there will be a lot more guaranteed team training times when they are NOT streaming. This might mean the whole team will be synced up, too, so the teamwork training can be a lot more coordinated.
I think this is a very important step - Coach Park is coming forward and saying HE must manage his player's streams. Jaedong already was fairly regular in that streamed on a certain day(s) at certain times, and that would be about it. Thorzain would stream for days straight. All of the arguments ignored (by me), streaming is not the same as good focused practice, and I think this is a good move. For team purposes, limit streaming and make it regular. For fan purposes, let them know and give them a time to watch.
Streaming is a good thing for sponsors and for players in terms of exposure and revenue, but it's never going to beat having a real coach directing practice and helping players to overcome weak areas they might not see on the ladder while streaming. (Side note - don't notice a lot of Kespa players streaming, do you? Of course, financially there's less of an incentive for them.)
I don't think they can make the miracle happen at this point, might climb a spot at best but playoffs ain't happening. At least Coach Park is trying I guess.
Can somebody get hold of the training schedule coach Park is suggesting? It would be interesting to see how long their breaks are, exercise etc. I assume they have to eat too XD?
I think getting a coach will be a great benefit if players can keep up with his plans and have enough practise partners. Well planned training and analysis is more efficient than trying to do everything on your own.
On March 19 2013 03:53 Vaelone wrote: I don't think they can make the miracle happen at this point, might climb a spot at best but playoffs ain't happening. At least Coach Park is trying I guess.
3 more rounds in a new game. Stranger things have happened (Hi Samsung!)
I like this guy, already! As many of you BW veterans already know, Coach Park is apparently a living legend. I'm excited to see what he's going to do with EG-TL (I hope he isn't too hard and grueling on the players, though, but that's my own personal bent).
I think EG-TL faces a hard battle, though. If they were playing up to their potential, I think you could argue that they wouldn't be doing THAT much better than a 50/50 record, since the current KeSPA competition is so stiff.
But I'm just glad to see the era of questionable (or infuriating) player lineup selections and strange, risky builds coming out of our top players come to an end. Or, so I hope
This sounds pretty cool. They'll still be having regular streaming hours, but I guess this means there will be a lot more guaranteed team training times when they are NOT streaming. This might mean the whole team will be synced up, too, so the teamwork training can be a lot more coordinated.
His twitter messages are already plastered in the release thread. ._.
for those of you not from BW. This guy will make EG-TL do well. he is amazing at his job, he has a lot to do with why SKT1 are the top 2 kespa team alongside KT Rolster
just wait and see how much they improve in every way after he starts working his magic
On March 19 2013 04:44 Champi wrote: for those of you not from BW. This guy will make EG-TL do well. he is amazing at his job, he has a lot to do with why SKT1 are the top 2 kespa team alongside KT Rolster
just wait and see how much they improve in every way after he starts working his magic
EG-TL would do better regardless. They couldn't do any worse and their stats do show it. Just getting a few more wins in the win column. This is getting blown out of proportion.
On March 19 2013 04:10 GunSec wrote: Can somebody get hold of the training schedule coach Park is suggesting? It would be interesting to see how long their breaks are, exercise etc. I assume they have to eat too XD?
No team that is giving the opposition hours of games to watch every day will succeed in PL.
I don't even know how EG-TL can be OK with their players streaming, let alone EG forcing them to do it. Anybody can see that streaming is going to give your opposition a huge edge.
Edit: Well, I guess I can see why they do it. They care about sponsorship exposure more than winning. Which is a shame, but there you go.
Someone on Reddit translated one of the questions.
Q: All the teams at the start of the Proleague picked EG-TL as the team to watch out for. But now the general consensus is that they have failed to meet the expectations- why do you think this has been the case?
A: Firstly, the position EG find themselves is about right. Does it surprise you to hear this? I studied them closely for about ten days and from what I can see, bad results are inevitable.
I'd say the problem is the infrastructure rather than the players. The environment was severely lacking compared to the other teams. No real focus on the Proleague, commitments to tournaments abroad, streaming schedules and the lack of coaching staff to look after the players. There are foreign players and despite the size of the group it is difficult to practice properly. Hwanni had a real tough job.
The players are very reputable and capable but if you put all these factors together the results can only be disappointing.
Summary of some points: -it's only been 10 days since Coach Park made the decision to join EG and he had been negotiating for 3 weeks prior to making the decision -Coach Park was supposed to focus on SKT1's LoL team once the team was set up, but he wanted to stick with Starcraft and started looking for a foreign SC2 team to join, which was apparently something he always wanted to do -He isn't surprised at all by the fact that EGTL's not doing well and attributes it to the infrastructure (no incentive for players to focus on Proleague, scheduling conflicts from foreign tournaments, required streaming sessions, not enough coaching staff, they don't have that many practice partners within the team) -The players have the talent, but the infrastructure really hinders their performance in PL -He's not entirely sure how to tackle the said problems, but he's trying to come up with solutions -One of his biggest areas of focus is the players' daily schedules - he wants to make sure that the players manage their time well and follow a good schedule, get sufficient sleep, practice, etc -Says EGTL's biggest problem is its lack of Terrans, especially because he thinks Terrans are good in HOTS -Says foreign teams' perception of what a coach does is very different from the role of a coach in the Korean teams - foreign teams see the coach as a team manager, while Korean coaches play a more analytical role, analyzing the team and coming up with improvements. He says Alex Garfield was very impressed by his analysis of EGTL and his suggestions for improvement and has been really supporting coach Park after that. -Also has some random comments about HOTS, mostly about the fact that he likes the Medivac boost, but thinks it'd be more interesting if there was some constraint to using it like using up energy, or making it take more damage while boosting -EGTL's current goal is to make the playoffs, and they'll need to win 14 out of the 21 remaining games -Thinks its difficult but doable with some luck and miracle
I don't think any race is UP or OP. The community is just used to balance whining. And I also don't think streaming generic builds for 2 hours is really going to give the other teams a huge advantage.. Gl Coach Park!
On March 19 2013 15:48 jhlee820 wrote: Summary of some points: -it's only been 10 days since Coach Park made the decision to join EG and he had been negotiating for 3 weeks prior to making the decision -Coach Park was supposed to focus on SKT1's LoL team once the team was set up, but he wanted to stick with Starcraft and started looking for a foreign SC2 team to join, which was apparently something he always wanted to do -He isn't surprised at all by the fact that EGTL's not doing well and attributes it to the infrastructure (no incentive for players to focus on Proleague, scheduling conflicts from foreign tournaments, required streaming sessions, not enough coaching staff, they don't have that many practice partners within the team) -The players have the talent, but the infrastructure really hinders their performance in PL -He's not entirely sure how to tackle the said problems, but he's trying to come up with solutions -One of his biggest areas of focus is the players' daily schedules - he wants to make sure that the players manage their time well and follow a good schedule, get sufficient sleep, practice, etc -Says EGTL's biggest problem is its lack of Terrans, especially because he thinks Terrans are good in HOTS -Says foreign teams' perception of what a coach does is very different from the role of a coach in the Korean teams - foreign teams see the coach as a team manager, while Korean coaches play a more analytical role, analyzing the team and coming up with improvements. He says Alex Garfield was very impressed by his analysis of EGTL and his suggestions for improvement and has been really supporting coach Park after that. -Also has some random comments about HOTS, mostly about the fact that he likes the Medivac boost, but thinks it'd be more interesting if there was some constraint to using it like using up energy, or making it take more damage while boosting -EGTL's current goal is to make the playoffs, and they'll need to win 14 out of the 21 remaining games -Thinks its difficult but doable with some luck and miracle
Thanks a lot for that! That was so awesome to read. Coach Park proves why he is so damn amazing and is one of the greatest coaches ever. Gets right into it and points out everything that needs to be improved
it pretty much comes down to whether egtl is willing to completly commit to proleague or not. meaning cut out streaming sessions, get more players in korea (practice partners and main terrans) and cutting international tournaments.
On March 19 2013 17:12 teddyoojo wrote: it pretty much comes down to whether egtl is willing to completly commit to proleague or not. meaning cut out streaming sessions, get more players in korea (practice partners and main terrans) and cutting international tournaments.
just my feeling ~~
I feel somewhat the same. Understandably, Korea isn't exactly TL and EG's prime market. I doubt they're willing to invest (and not just monetarily) what is needed to be successful.
On March 16 2013 11:22 bduddy wrote: You guys know that IM didn't invent the world "miracle", right? I can't believe how many of you seem to seriously think "OMG EG will buy IM!!!1"
Noone said that? You know bduddy didnt invent the term "jump the gun" right? I can't believe he just thinks he can jump the gun.
On March 19 2013 17:12 teddyoojo wrote: it pretty much comes down to whether egtl is willing to completly commit to proleague or not. meaning cut out streaming sessions, get more players in korea (practice partners and main terrans) and cutting international tournaments.
just my feeling ~~
I feel somewhat the same. Understandably, Korea isn't exactly TL and EG's prime market. I doubt they're willing to invest (and not just monetarily) what is needed to be successful.
I'd agree, were it not for the fact that they just invested in a great manager, which I personally would suppose was for the sake of being more successful! ;D I would guess that they're fine financially even with larger financial and time investments, otherwise they wouldn't bother paying for a dedicated, serious and probably seriously expensive coach, surely!
On March 19 2013 17:12 teddyoojo wrote: it pretty much comes down to whether egtl is willing to completly commit to proleague or not. meaning cut out streaming sessions, get more players in korea (practice partners and main terrans) and cutting international tournaments.
just my feeling ~~
I feel somewhat the same. Understandably, Korea isn't exactly TL and EG's prime market. I doubt they're willing to invest (and not just monetarily) what is needed to be successful.
I'd agree, were it not for the fact that they just invested in a great manager, which I personally would suppose was for the sake of being more successful! ;D I would guess that they're fine financially even with larger financial and time investments, otherwise they wouldn't bother paying for a dedicated, serious and probably seriously expensive coach, surely!
Yeah artosis said that head coaches (and especially one like coach park) are not cheap at all. He said their very expensive and for EG to make the investment shows they are trying to do good in proleague. I wish Artosis had thrown out a number for how much a head coach makes but he said they weren't cheap at all and I don't see EG investing into one, especially one of parks caliber (who I imagine would request a lot more then others due to how successful he is) just because they can.
Sounds like EG does want to do well and I hope they do
On March 19 2013 17:12 teddyoojo wrote: it pretty much comes down to whether egtl is willing to completly commit to proleague or not. meaning cut out streaming sessions, get more players in korea (practice partners and main terrans) and cutting international tournaments.
just my feeling ~~
I feel somewhat the same. Understandably, Korea isn't exactly TL and EG's prime market. I doubt they're willing to invest (and not just monetarily) what is needed to be successful.
But then why join in the first place tough. This whole EG-TL in Proleague just feels like a marketing stunt tbh.
On March 19 2013 15:48 jhlee820 wrote: Summary of some points: -it's only been 10 days since Coach Park made the decision to join EG and he had been negotiating for 3 weeks prior to making the decision -Coach Park was supposed to focus on SKT1's LoL team once the team was set up, but he wanted to stick with Starcraft and started looking for a foreign SC2 team to join, which was apparently something he always wanted to do -He isn't surprised at all by the fact that EGTL's not doing well and attributes it to the infrastructure (no incentive for players to focus on Proleague, scheduling conflicts from foreign tournaments, required streaming sessions, not enough coaching staff, they don't have that many practice partners within the team) -The players have the talent, but the infrastructure really hinders their performance in PL -He's not entirely sure how to tackle the said problems, but he's trying to come up with solutions -One of his biggest areas of focus is the players' daily schedules - he wants to make sure that the players manage their time well and follow a good schedule, get sufficient sleep, practice, etc -Says EGTL's biggest problem is its lack of Terrans, especially because he thinks Terrans are good in HOTS -Says foreign teams' perception of what a coach does is very different from the role of a coach in the Korean teams - foreign teams see the coach as a team manager, while Korean coaches play a more analytical role, analyzing the team and coming up with improvements. He says Alex Garfield was very impressed by his analysis of EGTL and his suggestions for improvement and has been really supporting coach Park after that. -Also has some random comments about HOTS, mostly about the fact that he likes the Medivac boost, but thinks it'd be more interesting if there was some constraint to using it like using up energy, or making it take more damage while boosting -EGTL's current goal is to make the playoffs, and they'll need to win 14 out of the 21 remaining games -Thinks its difficult but doable with some luck and miracle
Thanks a lot, respect! Coach Park is spot on with the concerns and problems, in my opinion. If anyone, he is the one who can turn things around!
Says EGTL's biggest problem is its lack of Terrans, especially because he thinks Terrans are good in HOTS
He have got a big point through. With Puma releashed it is just Taeja, Thorzain and Demuslim, with the latter not playing in PL.
Wonder which solution they go for? Convince Alex Garfield to do Terran talent hunting or put Taeja and Thorzain on a Brutal training course.
Taeja's performance is caused by his wrists, increasing the intensity of his training will most likely exacerbate his already terrible condition. Thorzain on the otherhand, will definitely need the bump in training. He's been performing poorly since his acquisition from EG. His pro-league performance is no better, with around 20-30% win rate.
I only want Coach Park to do well because he has worked through so much troubles with his wife in order to achieve his goals and dreams. Maybe they can get 3rd place, I could tolerate that.
kst 10-12 streaming time only ? thats 2 - 4 am europe time they will lose alot viewers if they only stream at that time but at the moment i see JYP streaming so ^^
On March 19 2013 20:24 CoR wrote: kst 10-12 streaming time only ? thats 2 - 4 am europe time they will lose alot viewers if they only stream at that time but at the moment i see JYP streaming so ^^
Well time for some real training instead of tons of hours of streaming i am all for it. They don't just need a miracle but also a strict schedule, something that has been lacking it seems.
If any one can do it it's coach Park. I to hope he can turn JD back in in the Beast he used to be aswell.
On March 19 2013 15:14 feanor1 wrote: 박용운 @HeadCoachPark @DeMusliM Hello, Nice to meet to you. I look forward to you. I hope that you would come in Korean fast.
Demuslim to Korea soon?
nah, he's obviously saying he wants Demuslim to have a child with a Korean chick so it becomes the sickest progamer ever ;D
on the real though, this sounds really good. this guy might be able to make stuff better. and on the topic of that twitter message, park made a very sensible point in his interview in saying the team is severly lacking in terrans. that might be why he wants Demuslim to get out there so badly. if you think about it they're down to Taeja, who should be the best player on the team, but has been having wrist issues, and Thorzain who's pretty good for a foreigner, but is still a foreigner. so is Demuslim of course but he would at least add another terran practice partner and perhaps Park can mold him into a sick badass.
On March 19 2013 15:48 jhlee820 wrote: Summary of some points: -it's only been 10 days since Coach Park made the decision to join EG and he had been negotiating for 3 weeks prior to making the decision -Coach Park was supposed to focus on SKT1's LoL team once the team was set up, but he wanted to stick with Starcraft and started looking for a foreign SC2 team to join, which was apparently something he always wanted to do -He isn't surprised at all by the fact that EGTL's not doing well and attributes it to the infrastructure (no incentive for players to focus on Proleague, scheduling conflicts from foreign tournaments, required streaming sessions, not enough coaching staff, they don't have that many practice partners within the team) -The players have the talent, but the infrastructure really hinders their performance in PL -He's not entirely sure how to tackle the said problems, but he's trying to come up with solutions -One of his biggest areas of focus is the players' daily schedules - he wants to make sure that the players manage their time well and follow a good schedule, get sufficient sleep, practice, etc -Says EGTL's biggest problem is its lack of Terrans, especially because he thinks Terrans are good in HOTS -Says foreign teams' perception of what a coach does is very different from the role of a coach in the Korean teams - foreign teams see the coach as a team manager, while Korean coaches play a more analytical role, analyzing the team and coming up with improvements. He says Alex Garfield was very impressed by his analysis of EGTL and his suggestions for improvement and has been really supporting coach Park after that. -Also has some random comments about HOTS, mostly about the fact that he likes the Medivac boost, but thinks it'd be more interesting if there was some constraint to using it like using up energy, or making it take more damage while boosting -EGTL's current goal is to make the playoffs, and they'll need to win 14 out of the 21 remaining games -Thinks its difficult but doable with some luck and miracle
As I'm looking over all these points I see nothing new that a lot of people assumed to begin with. Park is well connected. What he will do is help bring in new talent and practice partners from his long Rolodex. They won't make the playoffs but they certainly will perform better and it's not just going to be because of Park. The ship would right itself as I said earlier. The real fun will begin next season.
On March 19 2013 15:14 feanor1 wrote: 박용운 @HeadCoachPark @DeMusliM Hello, Nice to meet to you. I look forward to you. I hope that you would come in Korean fast.
Demuslim to Korea soon?
so is Demuslim of course but he would at least add another terran practice partner and perhaps Park can mold him into a sick badass.
He's already a sick badass Seriously, if he could replicate how well he plays on stream in major tournies I think people would start to realise just how good he really is!
The good thing about this, if they start producing great results, maybe other teams (that lack one) will start considering hiring a coach and getting a bigger group of practise partners. Generally this would increase the level of play in non-korean events that have very heavy local lineup and make it more even in bigger events.
On March 19 2013 21:37 Daswollvieh wrote: Yeah, Demuslin really is a hidden gem. If that guy ever breaks out, he´ll be the best foreigner terran and could really help the team in proleague.
What makes you say that? he hasn't performed well in any tournament for a very long time and doesn't have the speed or mechanics like a player like Major or Lucifron.
Plus, I don't think there is any way to improve playing on NA server. Would be awesome to see him in Korea though.
So I'm super excited about Coach Park, but I don't know if its possible. I'm keeping my expectations low so that i'm not horribly disappointed. But regardless EG-TL FIGHTING!
On March 19 2013 20:24 CoR wrote: kst 10-12 streaming time only ? thats 2 - 4 am europe time they will lose alot viewers if they only stream at that time but at the moment i see JYP streaming so ^^
You always have VOD's of the stream. Seriously, I'd rather watch a stream of a better player who streams less than a stream of a less-skilled player who streams more. I want EGTL to do well, and if minimizing streaming is a part of the solution, then I'm all for it!
Remember, it's also a liability streaming how you play to the open public - wonder why so many players have barcode names?
Did anyone notice that he says that they are going to stream from 10am to 12am, when players currently tend to stream around 3am to 6am? I get unfocused for a few days when there is a switch to and from day light saving time, I can't image suddenly having to get up at 9am everyday if I would wake up at 2pm before.
I think if EG-TL really want results they shouldnt let their kespa team stream.
Leave the streaming to idra, incontrol and such. Inc had almost twice the viewers than jaedong for a while yesterday.. and when u let the other kespa teams see how jaedong and such are playing HOTS then its just a recipe for more bad results.
That summary of Coach Park's interview is not enough. I just read the whole thing in Chinese, and I have to say, you have to read the whole thing. The problem is more than what the summary indicates.
Also, an interesting quote from him: "The game design is disappointed, though it's better than WoL".
If they were serious, they wouldn't be streaming at all. Park needs to put in some pretty strict structure to make this work, not sure I see it happening, and not because he won't try.
On March 20 2013 02:17 vesicular wrote: If they were serious, they wouldn't be streaming at all. Park needs to put in some pretty strict structure to make this work, not sure I see it happening, and not because he won't try.
You need to read the whole thing. He talks this in detail. It's just the summary doesn't show them.
On March 20 2013 02:00 larse wrote: That summary of Coach Park's interview is not enough. I just read the whole thing in Chinese, and I have to say, you have to read the whole thing. The problem is more than what the summary indicates.
Also, an interesting quote from him: "The game design is disappointed, though it's better than WoL".
Hmm so for us who can't read chinese, would you mind translating it? ;P
On March 19 2013 21:37 Daswollvieh wrote: Yeah, Demuslin really is a hidden gem. If that guy ever breaks out, he´ll be the best foreigner terran and could really help the team in proleague.
What makes you say that? he hasn't performed well in any tournament for a very long time and doesn't have the speed or mechanics like a player like Major or Lucifron.
Plus, I don't think there is any way to improve playing on NA server. Would be awesome to see him in Korea though.
No, he hasn't yet had his major breakout tournament but when the guy is playing well and feeling comfortable both inside and outside of the game he's truly brilliant! I don't know.. I think his mechanics are pretty fucking good, definitely improved over the past year or so, simply watching his stream shows you that. I also think that whilst he has a tendency to be inconsistent, his repeated NASL show that when he's feeling confident and comfortable in his surroundings he truly is a beast I also think that the NASL runs are clear evidence that he works extremely well in an environment where you prepare for an opponent over tournies such as MLG, IPL which are one opponent after another? In short... im not entirely sure how well he'd do in Korea, but, in the right atmosphere, with the right mind set, I think demu could really excel and prove that he really is one of the best foreign players right now!
On March 20 2013 01:55 Grumbels wrote: Did anyone notice that he says that they are going to stream from 10am to 12am, when players currently tend to stream around 3am to 6am? I get unfocused for a few days when there is a switch to and from day light saving time, I can't image suddenly having to get up at 9am everyday if I would wake up at 2pm before.
well, i would hope coach Park is looking to introduce a better sleep schedule. yeah, they might feel tired and dizzy for a few days, but it is soooo much healthier and better for your system if you get up early in the morning rather than in the afternoon.
On March 19 2013 21:37 Daswollvieh wrote: Yeah, Demuslin really is a hidden gem. If that guy ever breaks out, he´ll be the best foreigner terran and could really help the team in proleague.
What makes you say that? he hasn't performed well in any tournament for a very long time and doesn't have the speed or mechanics like a player like Major or Lucifron.
Plus, I don't think there is any way to improve playing on NA server. Would be awesome to see him in Korea though.
No, he hasn't yet had his major breakout tournament but when the guy is playing well and feeling comfortable both inside and outside of the game he's truly brilliant! I don't know.. I think his mechanics are pretty fucking good, definitely improved over the past year or so, simply watching his stream shows you that. I also think that whilst he has a tendency to be inconsistent, his repeated NASL show that when he's feeling confident and comfortable in his surroundings he truly is a beast I also think that the NASL runs are clear evidence that he works extremely well in an environment where you prepare for an opponent over tournies such as MLG, IPL which are one opponent after another? In short... im not entirely sure how well he'd do in Korea, but, in the right atmosphere, with the right mind set, I think demu could really excel and prove that he really is one of the best foreign players right now!
I love Demuslim to death, but Proleague isn't the kind of place I'd expect him to thrive, especially in this position. He has a lot of trouble dealing with pressure at LANs, and being in the booth at Proleague will only intensify this. Like you said, he does best when comfortable and confident, and this seems like a recipe for the opposite - sending him to a foreign country to play in the toughest league in the world in extremely high pressure matches as one of three terrans on a team that's facing intense scrutiny from the foreign scene.
I really want Demu to succeed and I think going to Korea could really help him get to the level he is capable of, but EGTL's current situation sounds like a nightmare for a player who hasn't spent much time (if any) in Korea, and who's biggest obstacle to success has been nerves/confidence.
On March 19 2013 21:37 Daswollvieh wrote: Yeah, Demuslin really is a hidden gem. If that guy ever breaks out, he´ll be the best foreigner terran and could really help the team in proleague.
What makes you say that? he hasn't performed well in any tournament for a very long time and doesn't have the speed or mechanics like a player like Major or Lucifron.
Plus, I don't think there is any way to improve playing on NA server. Would be awesome to see him in Korea though.
No, he hasn't yet had his major breakout tournament but when the guy is playing well and feeling comfortable both inside and outside of the game he's truly brilliant! I don't know.. I think his mechanics are pretty fucking good, definitely improved over the past year or so, simply watching his stream shows you that. I also think that whilst he has a tendency to be inconsistent, his repeated NASL show that when he's feeling confident and comfortable in his surroundings he truly is a beast I also think that the NASL runs are clear evidence that he works extremely well in an environment where you prepare for an opponent over tournies such as MLG, IPL which are one opponent after another? In short... im not entirely sure how well he'd do in Korea, but, in the right atmosphere, with the right mind set, I think demu could really excel and prove that he really is one of the best foreign players right now!
I love Demuslim to death, but Proleague isn't the kind of place I'd expect him to thrive, especially in this position. He has a lot of trouble dealing with pressure at LANs, and being in the booth at Proleague will only intensify this. Like you said, he does best when comfortable and confident, and this seems like a recipe for the opposite - sending him to a foreign country to play in the toughest league in the world in extremely high pressure matches as one of three terrans on a team that's facing intense scrutiny from the foreign scene.
I really want Demu to succeed and I think going to Korea could really help him get to the level he is capable of, but EGTL's current situation sounds like a nightmare for a player who hasn't spent much time (if any) in Korea, and who's biggest obstacle to success has been nerves/confidence.
Yeah I totally agree, his nerves have gotten the better of him in the past. I can only imagine the pressure on each and every EGTL player at the current moment! However, I can still see demu doing incredibly well IF he doesn't let his nerves get the better of him again. He seems to be managing his nerves quite a bit better in a LAN environment as of late... for example, the live finals of NASL where he took violet to an ace match. He outplayed violet majorly at times during the match and if memory serves, won most of the long macro games (a reference to his nerves holding up, not the significance of macro games > short, sharp ones!) Plus, I don't think they've got much to lose with trying demu in proleague tbh. The pressure of proleague might actually do him the world of good, after all, nothing can even come close afterwards... might manage the lesser events slightly better as a result? Also, being in a team environment, the pressure isn't purely focused on him as an individual... obviously it's still present, but I think mentally that is quite a big thing for demu?
On March 20 2013 01:55 Grumbels wrote: Did anyone notice that he says that they are going to stream from 10am to 12am, when players currently tend to stream around 3am to 6am? I get unfocused for a few days when there is a switch to and from day light saving time, I can't image suddenly having to get up at 9am everyday if I would wake up at 2pm before.
well, i would hope coach Park is looking to introduce a better sleep schedule. yeah, they might feel tired and dizzy for a few days, but it is soooo much healthier and better for your system if you get up early in the morning rather than in the afternoon.
And I think that if you sleep earlier in Korea, then events in the USA become more manageable since you can get a few more hours of sleep in usually and so it will take less time to adjust. As far as I know it's common to stay up late in Korea though. I see people from various teams streaming until 7am KST sometimes. This might be because they want to stream in a good time zone for viewers from other continents, but I doubt that's the reason, since there would be more people up at those times in the background of the streams.
On March 20 2013 01:55 Grumbels wrote: Did anyone notice that he says that they are going to stream from 10am to 12am, when players currently tend to stream around 3am to 6am? I get unfocused for a few days when there is a switch to and from day light saving time, I can't image suddenly having to get up at 9am everyday if I would wake up at 2pm before.
well, i would hope coach Park is looking to introduce a better sleep schedule. yeah, they might feel tired and dizzy for a few days, but it is soooo much healthier and better for your system if you get up early in the morning rather than in the afternoon.
And I think that if you sleep earlier in Korea, then events in the USA become more manageable since you can get a few more hours of sleep in usually and so it will take less time to adjust. As far as I know it's common to stay up late in Korea though. I see people from various teams streaming until 7am KST sometimes. This might be because they want to stream in a good time zone for viewers from other continents, but I doubt that's the reason, since there would be more people up at those times.
Dragons the big example of that. He seems to start streaming about 1AM KST and then carries on until the morning I think.
On March 19 2013 21:37 Daswollvieh wrote: Yeah, Demuslin really is a hidden gem. If that guy ever breaks out, he´ll be the best foreigner terran and could really help the team in proleague.
What makes you say that? he hasn't performed well in any tournament for a very long time and doesn't have the speed or mechanics like a player like Major or Lucifron.
Plus, I don't think there is any way to improve playing on NA server. Would be awesome to see him in Korea though.
No, he hasn't yet had his major breakout tournament but when the guy is playing well and feeling comfortable both inside and outside of the game he's truly brilliant! I don't know.. I think his mechanics are pretty fucking good, definitely improved over the past year or so, simply watching his stream shows you that. I also think that whilst he has a tendency to be inconsistent, his repeated NASL show that when he's feeling confident and comfortable in his surroundings he truly is a beast I also think that the NASL runs are clear evidence that he works extremely well in an environment where you prepare for an opponent over tournies such as MLG, IPL which are one opponent after another? In short... im not entirely sure how well he'd do in Korea, but, in the right atmosphere, with the right mind set, I think demu could really excel and prove that he really is one of the best foreign players right now!
I love Demuslim to death, but Proleague isn't the kind of place I'd expect him to thrive, especially in this position. He has a lot of trouble dealing with pressure at LANs, and being in the booth at Proleague will only intensify this. Like you said, he does best when comfortable and confident, and this seems like a recipe for the opposite - sending him to a foreign country to play in the toughest league in the world in extremely high pressure matches as one of three terrans on a team that's facing intense scrutiny from the foreign scene.
I really want Demu to succeed and I think going to Korea could really help him get to the level he is capable of, but EGTL's current situation sounds like a nightmare for a player who hasn't spent much time (if any) in Korea, and who's biggest obstacle to success has been nerves/confidence.
Yeah I totally agree, his nerves have gotten the better of him in the past. I can only imagine the pressure on each and every EGTL player at the current moment! However, I can still see demu doing incredibly well IF he doesn't let his nerves get the better of him again. He seems to be managing his nerves quite a bit better in a LAN environment as of late... for example, the live finals of NASL where he took violet to an ace match. He outplayed violet majorly at times during the match and if memory serves, won most of the long macro games (a reference to his nerves holding up, not the significance of macro games > short, sharp ones!) Plus, I don't think they've got much to lose with trying demu in proleague tbh. The pressure of proleague might actually do him the world of good, after all, nothing can even come close afterwards... might manage the lesser events slightly better as a result? Also, being in a team environment, the pressure isn't purely focused on him as an individual... obviously it's still present, but I think mentally that is quite a big thing for demu?
Yeah, I definitely agree with a lot of this, especially that they have little to lose. I do hope Demu doesn't have a hard time adjusting to Korea like Stephano seemed to though. Otherwise I definitely this is a good opportunity for him to potentially break out. And if he doesn't do well in Proleague I can definitely see him doing better at MLG, NASL, etc. after his trip.
Q: Coach Park! It’s been a while. I would first like to hear exactly when you entered EG-TL. A: Hello, it has been a while hasn’t it? It’s a pleasure. I am the new head coach of EG-TL, Park Yong Woon. Actually, it’s only been about 10 days since the decision was made. Serious negotiations only started about 3 weeks ago. I spoke with the head and CEO Alex quite often and after the decision was made, much preparation was had. I thought it would be detrimental if I were to just go headlong into it, so I took the time to think about where I could bring about the most change. I especially thought about whether or not I could bring results. You could say I took the time to calculate everything? I received help in many ways from many people and made my decision. Alex really seems to believe in me, so I’m already eager to go to work.
Q: You were an advisor for SK Telecom T1 until you became head coach for EG-TL. What kind of processes did you have to go through? A: SK actually helped me a lot. To be exact, President Oh Kyung Shik helped me quite a bit. Recently I felt I needed to learn English, so I went to Philippines to do so. After that I was supposed to focus on the SK Telecom T1 League of Legends team. But because the field I was about to enter was so different from the field I have been working in, it bothered me. You know how people have their ambition, so I had thoughts that my past experiences would be somewhat wasted. So when I voiced these sentiments, he helped me and in turn, I think the results turned out wonderfully.
Q: You probably had a world of opportunity in front of you, but why did you choose EG-TL? A: I’ve always wanted to coach a foreign team, even when I was at SK Telecom T1. So in preparation, I even hired tutors to verse myself in English. You know how I became an advisor, correct? To be honest, I wasn’t too happy with it. Only for an instant of course (laughs). So when this path opened up for me I thought, “This must be a heaven-sent opportunity.” Immediately after, I went to the Philippines to improve my English and even started working out to prepare. I took a little time off and it was very rewarding. During the process, I also came up with a lot of ideas. So when I was looking around for a foreign team and found EG-TL, I decided to take this opportunity to use my experiences.
Q: Even on the SK Planet Proleague Media Day (don’t ask, I have no idea) people thought EG-TL as a strong contender. But to be straight, they did not live up to the hype. Why do you think this is so? A: I would first like to say that their record seems appropriate. You don’t think so? I researched/investigated the team for 10 days or so and I concluded that this was the only possible outcome. The problem has nothing to do with the players themselves, but the infrastructure of the team itself. They have a poor environment compared to those of other teams. They cannot focus solely on Proleague, they have to travel to foreign tournaments, they have mandatory streaming obligations, as well as a lacking coaching staff, making it difficult to organize the team well. There are foreign players, and there are too many players to make practice smoothly (not 100% on this translation). Coach Kim Sung Hwan (Hwanni) must have been very frustrated. Although the players have much value to their names, because of these factors the current results were inevitable.
Q: Now that you know the problem, how will you go about fixing it? What changes will you bring? A: Hmm…I’m still giving a lot of thought to it. Truthfully, I am not sure yet. But one thing is sure: it is impossible to completely fix the problem. I am approaching with the goal of minimizing all harmful factors. For example, I’ve been thinking about how to solve the streaming problem for 2 days. There is the danger of showing their full strength to the public, but if they do not their salaries are cut and must give up a portion of their winnings so…I’m still thinking about it. I’ve actually changed the streaming schedule a bit. Before it seemed as though the players were streaming whenever they had free time, but now I have them all stream at the same time. I also changed it so that they stream in the morning. This way the streams will be more accessible to the foreign fans. The response has been great. The players used to stream into the night, resulting in insufficient rest and poor condition the next morning. This was a big problem. Having them stream in the morning is beneficial in many ways. First, it is a way to warm up their fingers. Second, it’s a good way to fill their stream requirements. Third, their full strength will not be shown. Though there probably will be fans who will wake up early to watch as well (laughs). Fans would have to wait for stream announcements to watch the players, essentially being in the dark. But now that they all have a fixed schedule, viewers can simply wait for the streams to start at a certain time. This will increase viewership, increase player income, and provide a little fun for the players streaming together. One by one, I am approaching this problem step by step.
Q: Since this is a foreign team, there are occasions where you are unable to use key players due to foreign tournaments. It’s something that you’re not used to, what do you think of it? A: You’re right, there will be times where we won’t be at full strength and forced to change up our rotation. It seems a bit unfair seeing how no other team has this problem (laughs), but I think there is some charm to this. The same way I am trying to improve the streaming schedule, I feel I can turn this into something great as well. This attracts me very much. It kind of feels like solving a homework problem? It’s definitely a challenge.
Q: What do think is most important when running a team? A: Coming to EG-TL the thing that worried me the most was how to schedule their days, especially since there would be Koreans and foreigners under the same roof. It worried me a lot. But as I met and talked with the players, I found I could apply my past experiences here as well. There was nothing different. I had no need to worry because they were all still gamers with the pro mentality. What I think is most important is their daily life. One’s individual rhythm is incredibly important. No matter how hard you practice, if you practice until 4 or 5 in the morning and feel dead tired the next morning or sleep in, I think that is a sign of a bad gamer. If you are a pro, you should know how to control yourself. You must learn to stop and recover when needed. I will not allow any action that destroys one’s rhythm. Currently, I am making the players go to bed and wake up early. They are chastised if they are caught up after 2am (laughs). I am also teaching them the habit to self-check their daily life. How long they slept, how much they practice is all being checked. This is all pro mentality in my opinion. You do not just sleep to sleep or practice to practice. You must know just how much sleep you need to be 100%. To know oneself, that is what a pro is. (I love this quote btw.) I am working to teach them this mentality.
Q: What do you think is the reason for the lack of results? A: It is as many have already guessed. They don’t hold Proleague preparation as their top priority. Their potential is enormous. You can’t blame them for this either as their environment is different. A pro’s worth is measured by their earnings and whatnot, so teams have geared their players towards focusing on Proleague. Starting with incentives to raises for Proleague standards. But our team gains more from winning outside tournaments. It’s hard to raise a team camaraderie. To make this a team a true team is my role.
Q: What do you think is EG-TL’s biggest problem right now? A: We need Terrans (laughs). We really don’t have any Terrans. Other than Yoon Young Suh (Taeja) we don’t have anyone. Terran looks very strong in Heart of the Swarm, so the problem is even bigger. I am still thinking of how to solve this.
Q: Do you think you’ll have a hard time leading such a nationally diverse team? A: I won’t be able to communicate effectively with them. The language barrier is obvious. Other than that I don’t think we will have any major problems. I get along with foreigners pretty well. I look forward to befriending ‘ThorZaIN’ Marcus Eklof and ‘Stephano’ Ilyes Satouri and many others.
Q: The most important question! I would like to ask of your English skills? How was your time in the Philippines? A: You can’t be perfect, you know? (laughs) What I learned in the Philippines was to speak with confidence. Every word with confidence. It helped a lot. But my grammar is still a bit shaky, so I’ve already gone through four grammar textbooks. I think I’ve improved a bit (laughs). I’m still much better than when I used to be. There won’t be any big translation issues, but I’m still worried (laughs). But I will have Coach Kim Sung Hwan (Hwanni) close by so I will try to learn much from him.
Q: When you were officially taken in, what did the team head say? A: The first thing I remember was, “Great!” Then it was, “Impressed!” It was a great response (laughs). What I am most grateful to Alex is his trust in me. Jokingly I said to him, “Even if you can’t trust your family, you can trust me. You have to gamble your trust in me.” He continued to give me his full trust. No matter what I would suggest, he would take it. He makes my work worthwhile. When I first spoke to Alex, I sent him my entire analysis of EG and improvement plans. He was very surprised about that. Outside of Korea, Head coach is regarded similar to a team manager. He said that he did not expect me to think about the team this much, and since then, whatever I say, he gives me his full trust. Of course, I will repay his trust with results.
Q: How have you divided the coaching staff’s roles? A: Coach Park Sung Jin and I will take care of the team, as usual. He will essentially be my assistant. Coach Kim Sung Hwan will be general coach, dealing with foreign players or working with me in communications to discuss the growth of this team in the right direction. This way I can direct my full attention to coaching the team.
Q: The 4th round of Proleague isn’t far off, what are your thoughts on Heart of the Swarm? A: I haven’t been able to play a lot. It’s my first time after the closed beta. I have discussed with the players and Terran seems to be very strong. That is why I am worried, as there are too few Terrans on the team. But I do have an issue with the Ignite Thrusters (laughs). I used to think it would be fun to put boosters on Brood War Dropships but this is real. But the boosters in HotS are a little different than what I imagined. They should use energy, or become more vulnerable when using them, something like that. There has to be a risk, but there are none, so it’s no fun when players can infinitely use them. To make the game more enjoyable, there has to be some escape to that, but there are none, which is disappointing. Maybe if there was something like Scourge, but as of now it’s a bit lacking. They can definitely make it more exciting. Other than that, it’s a very fun game. It’s better than ‘Wings of Liberty.” But looking at player’s responses, I think they are correct in calling it “Terrancraft.” (laughs)
Q: What is EG-TL’s goal for the second half of the season? A: Well, we have to recover. We have a big goal. Looking at the numbers though, it may be impossible (laughs). EG-TL’s goal is to enter the playoffs. Though through calculations, it is a very impossible number. To enter the playoffs, EG-TL must win 14 of their next 21 games. We have to play like the 1st place Woongjin Stars to have a place in the playoffs. To be honest, it is a very hard goal. But after talking with the players, and with Alex as well, the consensus I hear is, “We can still do it.” Though it will be a difficult path, I believe it will be the time of my life. But I do hope that luck and miracles help us (laughs).
Q: You have been labeled as a legend due to your ability. What do you think your chances are in reaching the post-season as you did last year? A: I am here because I believe it is possible. If EG-TL doesn’t make the playoffs, it will be disappointing to break my streak (laughs), but to continue my ambition, I accept this challenge. I’ve always loved challenges. If everything was laid out for me, where’s the fun in that? I will give it my all.
Q: Before we go, say something to the fans! A: Firstly, to both the Korean and foreign fans. To the Korean fans I ask you to embrace our players. They are having a hard time. Embrace them, cheer for them, and we will work towards the playoffs. We need momentum. If not, I don’t think we will be able to, so cheer for us! To the foreign fans I would like to voice my thinks. When the announcement was made on EG’s front page, I read many of the comments. I never imagined the amount of support you gave me. Thank you so much. It was very moving. I will return the favor, I will not forget your support. I will do my best. Lastly, I would like to address the two geniuses of EG. Alex! I want to tell you that your voice is really great. Thanks you so much. I believe we will be very good partners. I heard the team coordinator Cody is getting married soon. Congratulations! I hope to continue to inform you of what is going on. Please cheer for us!
Am I wrong or isn't this the interview that was posted on eg's website when they made the announcement? Seems too familiar for something I supposedly haven't read (not being able to read korean/chinese)
On March 20 2013 04:58 Zenbrez wrote: Am I wrong or isn't this the interview that was posted on eg's website when they made the announcement? Seems too familiar for something I supposedly haven't read (not being able to read korean/chinese)
Q: Coach Park! It’s been a while. I would first like to hear exactly when you entered EG-TL. A: Hello, it has been a while hasn’t it? It’s a pleasure. I am the new head coach of EG-TL, Park Yong Woon. Actually, it’s only been about 10 days since the decision was made. Serious negotiations only started about 3 weeks ago. I spoke with the head and CEO Alex quite often and after the decision was made, much preparation was had. I thought it would be detrimental if I were to just go headlong into it, so I took the time to think about where I could bring about the most change. I especially thought about whether or not I could bring results. You could say I took the time to calculate everything? I received help in many ways from many people and made my decision. Alex really seems to believe in me, so I’m already eager to go to work.
Q: You were an advisor for SK Telecom T1 until you became head coach for EG-TL. What kind of processes did you have to go through? A: SK actually helped me a lot. To be exact, President Oh Kyung Shik helped me quite a bit. Recently I felt I needed to learn English, so I went to Philippines to do so. After that I was supposed to focus on the SK Telecom T1 League of Legends team. But because the field I was about to enter was so different from the field I have been working in, it bothered me. You know how people have their ambition, so I had thoughts that my past experiences would be somewhat wasted. So when I voiced these sentiments, he helped me and in turn, I think the results turned out wonderfully.
Q: You probably had a world of opportunity in front of you, but why did you choose EG-TL? A: I’ve always wanted to coach a foreign team, even when I was at SK Telecom T1. So in preparation, I even hired tutors to verse myself in English. You know how I became an advisor, correct? To be honest, I wasn’t too happy with it. Only for an instant of course (laughs). So when this path opened up for me I thought, “This must be a heaven-sent opportunity.” Immediately after, I went to the Philippines to improve my English and even started working out to prepare. I took a little time off and it was very rewarding. During the process, I also came up with a lot of ideas. So when I was looking around for a foreign team and found EG-TL, I decided to take this opportunity to use my experiences.
Q: Even on the SK Planet Proleague Media Day (don’t ask, I have no idea) people thought EG-TL as a strong contender. But to be straight, they did not live up to the hype. Why do you think this is so? A: I would first like to say that their record seems appropriate. You don’t think so? I researched/investigated the team for 10 days or so and I concluded that this was the only possible outcome. The problem has nothing to do with the players themselves, but the infrastructure of the team itself. They have a poor environment compared to those of other teams. They cannot focus solely on Proleague, they have to travel to foreign tournaments, they have mandatory streaming obligations, as well as a lacking coaching staff, making it difficult to organize the team well. There are foreign players, and there are too many players to make practice smoothly (not 100% on this translation). Coach Kim Sung Hwan (Hwanni) must have been very frustrated. Although the players have much value to their names, because of these factors the current results were inevitable.
Q: Now that you know the problem, how will you go about fixing it? What changes will you bring? A: Hmm…I’m still giving a lot of thought to it. Truthfully, I am not sure yet. But one thing is sure: it is impossible to completely fix the problem. I am approaching with the goal of minimizing all harmful factors. For example, I’ve been thinking about how to solve the streaming problem for 2 days. There is the danger of showing their full strength to the public, but if they do not their salaries are cut and must give up a portion of their winnings so…I’m still thinking about it. I’ve actually changed the streaming schedule a bit. Before it seemed as though the players were streaming whenever they had free time, but now I have them all stream at the same time. I also changed it so that they stream in the morning. This way the streams will be more accessible to the foreign fans. The response has been great. The players used to stream into the night, resulting in insufficient rest and poor condition the next morning. This was a big problem. Having them stream in the morning is beneficial in many ways. First, it is a way to warm up their fingers. Second, it’s a good way to fill their stream requirements. Third, their full strength will not be shown. Though there probably will be fans who will wake up early to watch as well (laughs). Fans would have to wait for stream announcements to watch the players, essentially being in the dark. But now that they all have a fixed schedule, viewers can simply wait for the streams to start at a certain time. This will increase viewership, increase player income, and provide a little fun for the players streaming together. One by one, I am approaching this problem step by step.
Q: Since this is a foreign team, there are occasions where you are unable to use key players due to foreign tournaments. It’s something that you’re not used to, what do you think of it? A: You’re right, there will be times where we won’t be at full strength and forced to change up our rotation. It seems a bit unfair seeing how no other team has this problem (laughs), but I think there is some charm to this. The same way I am trying to improve the streaming schedule, I feel I can turn this into something great as well. This attracts me very much. It kind of feels like solving a homework problem? It’s definitely a challenge.
Q: What do think is most important when running a team? A: Coming to EG-TL the thing that worried me the most was how to schedule their days, especially since there would be Koreans and foreigners under the same roof. It worried me a lot. But as I met and talked with the players, I found I could apply my past experiences here as well. There was nothing different. I had no need to worry because they were all still gamers with the pro mentality. What I think is most important is their daily life. One’s individual rhythm is incredibly important. No matter how hard you practice, if you practice until 4 or 5 in the morning and feel dead tired the next morning or sleep in, I think that is a sign of a bad gamer. If you are a pro, you should know how to control yourself. You must learn to stop and recover when needed. I will not allow any action that destroys one’s rhythm. Currently, I am making the players go to bed and wake up early. They are chastised if they are caught up after 2am (laughs). I am also teaching them the habit to self-check their daily life. How long they slept, how much they practice is all being checked. This is all pro mentality in my opinion. You do not just sleep to sleep or practice to practice. You must know just how much sleep you need to be 100%. To know oneself, that is what a pro is. (I love this quote btw.) I am working to teach them this mentality.
Q: What do you think is the reason for the lack of results? A: It is as many have already guessed. They don’t hold Proleague preparation as their top priority. Their potential is enormous. You can’t blame them for this either as their environment is different. A pro’s worth is measured by their earnings and whatnot, so teams have geared their players towards focusing on Proleague. Starting with incentives to raises for Proleague standards. But our team gains more from winning outside tournaments. It’s hard to raise a team camaraderie. To make this a team a true team is my role.
Q: What do you think is EG-TL’s biggest problem right now? A: We need Terrans (laughs). We really don’t have any Terrans. Other than Yoon Young Suh (Taeja) we don’t have anyone. Terran looks very strong in Heart of the Swarm, so the problem is even bigger. I am still thinking of how to solve this.
Q: Do you think you’ll have a hard time leading such a nationally diverse team? A: I won’t be able to communicate effectively with them. The language barrier is obvious. Other than that I don’t think we will have any major problems. I get along with foreigners pretty well. I look forward to befriending ‘ThorZaIN’ Marcus Eklof and ‘Stephano’ Ilyes Satouri and many others.
Q: The most important question! I would like to ask of your English skills? How was your time in the Philippines? A: You can’t be perfect, you know? (laughs) What I learned in the Philippines was to speak with confidence. Every word with confidence. It helped a lot. But my grammar is still a bit shaky, so I’ve already gone through four grammar textbooks. I think I’ve improved a bit (laughs). I’m still much better than when I used to be. There won’t be any big translation issues, but I’m still worried (laughs). But I will have Coach Kim Sung Hwan (Hwanni) close by so I will try to learn much from him.
Q: When you were officially taken in, what did the team head say? A: The first thing I remember was, “Great!” Then it was, “Impressed!” It was a great response (laughs). What I am most grateful to Alex is his trust in me. Jokingly I said to him, “Even if you can’t trust your family, you can trust me. You have to gamble your trust in me.” He continued to give me his full trust. No matter what I would suggest, he would take it. He makes my work worthwhile. When I first spoke with Alex, he sent me everything he could on EG-TL. I was very surprised. He felt like a manager as much as the president. To worry about his team to this extent, he would trust and take my every word. And I will repay his trust with results.
Q: How have you divided the coaching staff’s roles? A: Coach Park Sung Jin and I will take care of the team, as usual. He will essentially be my assistant. Coach Kim Sung Hwan will be general coach, dealing with foreign players or working with me in communications to discuss the growth of this team in the right direction. This way I can direct my full attention to coaching the team.
Q: The 4th round of Proleague isn’t far off, what are your thoughts on Heart of the Swarm? A: I haven’t been able to play a lot. It’s my first time after the closed beta. I have discussed with the players and Terran seems to be very strong. That is why I am worried, as there are too few Terrans on the team. But I do have an issue with the Ignite Thrusters (laughs). I used to think it would be fun to put boosters on Brood War Dropships but this is real. But the boosters in HotS are a little different than what I imagined. They should use energy, or become more vulnerable when using them, something like that. There has to be a risk, but there are none, so it’s no fun when players can infinitely use them. To make the game more enjoyable, there has to be some escape to that, but there are none, which is disappointing. Maybe if there was something like Scourge, but as of now it’s a bit lacking. They can definitely make it more exciting. Other than that, it’s a very fun game. It’s better than ‘Wings of Liberty.” But looking at player’s responses, I think they are correct in calling it “Terrancraft.” (laughs)
Q: What is EG-TL’s goal for the second half of the season? A: Well, we have to recover. We have a big goal. Looking at the numbers though, it may be impossible (laughs). EG-TL’s goal is to enter the playoffs. Though through calculations, it is a very impossible number. To enter the playoffs, EG-TL must win 14 of their next 21 games. We have to play like the 1st place Woongjin Stars to have a place in the playoffs. To be honest, it is a very hard goal. But after talking with the players, and with Alex as well, the consensus I hear is, “We can still do it.” Though it will be a difficult path, I believe it will be the time of my life. But I do hope that luck and miracles help us (laughs).
Q: You have been labeled as a legend due to your ability. What do you think your chances are in reaching the post-season as you did last year? A: I am here because I believe it is possible. If EG-TL doesn’t make the playoffs, it will be disappointing to break my streak (laughs), but to continue my ambition, I accept this challenge. I’ve always loved challenges. If everything was laid out for me, where’s the fun in that? I will give it my all.
Q: Before we go, say something to the fans! A: Firstly, to both the Korean and foreign fans. To the Korean fans I ask you to embrace our players. They are having a hard time. Embrace them, cheer for them, and we will work towards the playoffs. We need momentum. If not, I don’t think we will be able to, so cheer for us! To the foreign fans I would like to voice my thinks. When the announcement was made on EG’s front page, I read many of the comments. I never imagined the amount of support you gave me. Thank you so much. It was very moving. I will return the favor, I will not forget your support. I will do my best. Lastly, I would like to address the Genius of EG. Alex! I want to tell you your voice is appreciated. (I think that’s what he means…) Thanks you so much. I believe we will be very good partners. I heard the team coordinator Cody is getting married soon. Congratulations! I hope to continue to inform you of what is going on. Please cheer for us!
Translation is always appreciated, but there's a major error in his translation.
"When I first spoke with Alex, he sent me everything he could on EG-TL. I was very surprised. He felt like a manager as much as the president. To worry about his team to this extent, he would trust and take my every word. And I will repay his trust with results."
Should actually be:
"When I first spoke to Alex, I sent him my entire analysis of EG and improvement plans. He was very surprised about that. Outside of Korea, Head coach is regarded similar to a team manager. He said that he did not expect me to think about the team this much, and since then, whatever I say, he gives me his full trust. Of course, I will repay his trust with results."
Also, a minor correction:
"Lastly, I would like to address the Genius of EG. Alex! I want to tell you your voice is appreciated. (I think that’s what he means…)"
should be:
"Lastly, I would like to address the two geniuses of EG. Alex! I want to tell you that your voice is really great"
Please make these changes if someone intends to include the interview in the OP.
So excited, sounds like he's up to the task, and is looking forward to the challenge. I can't wait to see the results foreign players can put out under proper Korean team house style training.
Wow, this man already knows the issue and is planning to do stuff about it. He sounds really serious about this, maybe there is hope after all and lol at him complaining about afterburners as well
Coach park has also already reached out\requested demuslim which i think is absolutely a great decision, demu`s mechanics and multitasking capabilities indicate a high skill ceiling that park can translate into the strong, standard-playtype terran that EGTL really needs right now. Smart moves like this (in addition to whats been mentioned) combined with getting EGTL's studly roster on a real practice regimen gives me alot of hope for the rest of the season and a ton of optimism for the next.
Q: Coach Park! It’s been a while. I would first like to hear exactly when you entered EG-TL. A: Hello, it has been a while hasn’t it? It’s a pleasure. I am the new head coach of EG-TL, Park Yong Woon. Actually, it’s only been about 10 days since the decision was made. Serious negotiations only started about 3 weeks ago. I spoke with the head and CEO Alex quite often and after the decision was made, much preparation was had. I thought it would be detrimental if I were to just go headlong into it, so I took the time to think about where I could bring about the most change. I especially thought about whether or not I could bring results. You could say I took the time to calculate everything? I received help in many ways from many people and made my decision. Alex really seems to believe in me, so I’m already eager to go to work.
Q: You were an advisor for SK Telecom T1 until you became head coach for EG-TL. What kind of processes did you have to go through? A: SK actually helped me a lot. To be exact, President Oh Kyung Shik helped me quite a bit. Recently I felt I needed to learn English, so I went to Philippines to do so. After that I was supposed to focus on the SK Telecom T1 League of Legends team. But because the field I was about to enter was so different from the field I have been working in, it bothered me. You know how people have their ambition, so I had thoughts that my past experiences would be somewhat wasted. So when I voiced these sentiments, he helped me and in turn, I think the results turned out wonderfully.
Q: You probably had a world of opportunity in front of you, but why did you choose EG-TL? A: I’ve always wanted to coach a foreign team, even when I was at SK Telecom T1. So in preparation, I even hired tutors to verse myself in English. You know how I became an advisor, correct? To be honest, I wasn’t too happy with it. Only for an instant of course (laughs). So when this path opened up for me I thought, “This must be a heaven-sent opportunity.” Immediately after, I went to the Philippines to improve my English and even started working out to prepare. I took a little time off and it was very rewarding. During the process, I also came up with a lot of ideas. So when I was looking around for a foreign team and found EG-TL, I decided to take this opportunity to use my experiences.
Q: Even on the SK Planet Proleague Media Day (don’t ask, I have no idea) people thought EG-TL as a strong contender. But to be straight, they did not live up to the hype. Why do you think this is so? A: I would first like to say that their record seems appropriate. You don’t think so? I researched/investigated the team for 10 days or so and I concluded that this was the only possible outcome. The problem has nothing to do with the players themselves, but the infrastructure of the team itself. They have a poor environment compared to those of other teams. They cannot focus solely on Proleague, they have to travel to foreign tournaments, they have mandatory streaming obligations, as well as a lacking coaching staff, making it difficult to organize the team well. There are foreign players, and there are too many players to make practice smoothly (not 100% on this translation). Coach Kim Sung Hwan (Hwanni) must have been very frustrated. Although the players have much value to their names, because of these factors the current results were inevitable.
Q: Now that you know the problem, how will you go about fixing it? What changes will you bring? A: Hmm…I’m still giving a lot of thought to it. Truthfully, I am not sure yet. But one thing is sure: it is impossible to completely fix the problem. I am approaching with the goal of minimizing all harmful factors. For example, I’ve been thinking about how to solve the streaming problem for 2 days. There is the danger of showing their full strength to the public, but if they do not their salaries are cut and must give up a portion of their winnings so…I’m still thinking about it. I’ve actually changed the streaming schedule a bit. Before it seemed as though the players were streaming whenever they had free time, but now I have them all stream at the same time. I also changed it so that they stream in the morning. This way the streams will be more accessible to the foreign fans. The response has been great. The players used to stream into the night, resulting in insufficient rest and poor condition the next morning. This was a big problem. Having them stream in the morning is beneficial in many ways. First, it is a way to warm up their fingers. Second, it’s a good way to fill their stream requirements. Third, their full strength will not be shown. Though there probably will be fans who will wake up early to watch as well (laughs). Fans would have to wait for stream announcements to watch the players, essentially being in the dark. But now that they all have a fixed schedule, viewers can simply wait for the streams to start at a certain time. This will increase viewership, increase player income, and provide a little fun for the players streaming together. One by one, I am approaching this problem step by step.
Q: Since this is a foreign team, there are occasions where you are unable to use key players due to foreign tournaments. It’s something that you’re not used to, what do you think of it? A: You’re right, there will be times where we won’t be at full strength and forced to change up our rotation. It seems a bit unfair seeing how no other team has this problem (laughs), but I think there is some charm to this. The same way I am trying to improve the streaming schedule, I feel I can turn this into something great as well. This attracts me very much. It kind of feels like solving a homework problem? It’s definitely a challenge.
Q: What do think is most important when running a team? A: Coming to EG-TL the thing that worried me the most was how to schedule their days, especially since there would be Koreans and foreigners under the same roof. It worried me a lot. But as I met and talked with the players, I found I could apply my past experiences here as well. There was nothing different. I had no need to worry because they were all still gamers with the pro mentality. What I think is most important is their daily life. One’s individual rhythm is incredibly important. No matter how hard you practice, if you practice until 4 or 5 in the morning and feel dead tired the next morning or sleep in, I think that is a sign of a bad gamer. If you are a pro, you should know how to control yourself. You must learn to stop and recover when needed. I will not allow any action that destroys one’s rhythm. Currently, I am making the players go to bed and wake up early. They are chastised if they are caught up after 2am (laughs). I am also teaching them the habit to self-check their daily life. How long they slept, how much they practice is all being checked. This is all pro mentality in my opinion. You do not just sleep to sleep or practice to practice. You must know just how much sleep you need to be 100%. To know oneself, that is what a pro is. (I love this quote btw.) I am working to teach them this mentality.
Q: What do you think is the reason for the lack of results? A: It is as many have already guessed. They don’t hold Proleague preparation as their top priority. Their potential is enormous. You can’t blame them for this either as their environment is different. A pro’s worth is measured by their earnings and whatnot, so teams have geared their players towards focusing on Proleague. Starting with incentives to raises for Proleague standards. But our team gains more from winning outside tournaments. It’s hard to raise a team camaraderie. To make this a team a true team is my role.
Q: What do you think is EG-TL’s biggest problem right now? A: We need Terrans (laughs). We really don’t have any Terrans. Other than Yoon Young Suh (Taeja) we don’t have anyone. Terran looks very strong in Heart of the Swarm, so the problem is even bigger. I am still thinking of how to solve this.
Q: Do you think you’ll have a hard time leading such a nationally diverse team? A: I won’t be able to communicate effectively with them. The language barrier is obvious. Other than that I don’t think we will have any major problems. I get along with foreigners pretty well. I look forward to befriending ‘ThorZaIN’ Marcus Eklof and ‘Stephano’ Ilyes Satouri and many others.
Q: The most important question! I would like to ask of your English skills? How was your time in the Philippines? A: You can’t be perfect, you know? (laughs) What I learned in the Philippines was to speak with confidence. Every word with confidence. It helped a lot. But my grammar is still a bit shaky, so I’ve already gone through four grammar textbooks. I think I’ve improved a bit (laughs). I’m still much better than when I used to be. There won’t be any big translation issues, but I’m still worried (laughs). But I will have Coach Kim Sung Hwan (Hwanni) close by so I will try to learn much from him.
Q: When you were officially taken in, what did the team head say? A: The first thing I remember was, “Great!” Then it was, “Impressed!” It was a great response (laughs). What I am most grateful to Alex is his trust in me. Jokingly I said to him, “Even if you can’t trust your family, you can trust me. You have to gamble your trust in me.” He continued to give me his full trust. No matter what I would suggest, he would take it. He makes my work worthwhile. When I first spoke to Alex, I sent him my entire analysis of EG and improvement plans. He was very surprised about that. Outside of Korea, Head coach is regarded similar to a team manager. He said that he did not expect me to think about the team this much, and since then, whatever I say, he gives me his full trust. Of course, I will repay his trust with results.
Q: How have you divided the coaching staff’s roles? A: Coach Park Sung Jin and I will take care of the team, as usual. He will essentially be my assistant. Coach Kim Sung Hwan will be general coach, dealing with foreign players or working with me in communications to discuss the growth of this team in the right direction. This way I can direct my full attention to coaching the team.
Q: The 4th round of Proleague isn’t far off, what are your thoughts on Heart of the Swarm? A: I haven’t been able to play a lot. It’s my first time after the closed beta. I have discussed with the players and Terran seems to be very strong. That is why I am worried, as there are too few Terrans on the team. But I do have an issue with the Ignite Thrusters (laughs). I used to think it would be fun to put boosters on Brood War Dropships but this is real. But the boosters in HotS are a little different than what I imagined. They should use energy, or become more vulnerable when using them, something like that. There has to be a risk, but there are none, so it’s no fun when players can infinitely use them. To make the game more enjoyable, there has to be some escape to that, but there are none, which is disappointing. Maybe if there was something like Scourge, but as of now it’s a bit lacking. They can definitely make it more exciting. Other than that, it’s a very fun game. It’s better than ‘Wings of Liberty.” But looking at player’s responses, I think they are correct in calling it “Terrancraft.” (laughs)
Q: What is EG-TL’s goal for the second half of the season? A: Well, we have to recover. We have a big goal. Looking at the numbers though, it may be impossible (laughs). EG-TL’s goal is to enter the playoffs. Though through calculations, it is a very impossible number. To enter the playoffs, EG-TL must win 14 of their next 21 games. We have to play like the 1st place Woongjin Stars to have a place in the playoffs. To be honest, it is a very hard goal. But after talking with the players, and with Alex as well, the consensus I hear is, “We can still do it.” Though it will be a difficult path, I believe it will be the time of my life. But I do hope that luck and miracles help us (laughs).
Q: You have been labeled as a legend due to your ability. What do you think your chances are in reaching the post-season as you did last year? A: I am here because I believe it is possible. If EG-TL doesn’t make the playoffs, it will be disappointing to break my streak (laughs), but to continue my ambition, I accept this challenge. I’ve always loved challenges. If everything was laid out for me, where’s the fun in that? I will give it my all.
Q: Before we go, say something to the fans! A: Firstly, to both the Korean and foreign fans. To the Korean fans I ask you to embrace our players. They are having a hard time. Embrace them, cheer for them, and we will work towards the playoffs. We need momentum. If not, I don’t think we will be able to, so cheer for us! To the foreign fans I would like to voice my thinks. When the announcement was made on EG’s front page, I read many of the comments. I never imagined the amount of support you gave me. Thank you so much. It was very moving. I will return the favor, I will not forget your support. I will do my best. Lastly, I would like to address the two geniuses of EG. Alex! I want to tell you that your voice is really great. Thanks you so much. I believe we will be very good partners. I heard the team coordinator Cody is getting married soon. Congratulations! I hope to continue to inform you of what is going on. Please cheer for us!
I watched HerO stream past those hours yesterday, too. He went past 12PM KST and kept going for a few hours, I think. I wonder if they've started / if Liquid players will follow as closely.
Wow, the interview greatly impressed me. He (nearly obviously, seeing his past results) really seems to know what he's talking about. especially the part on what's important when running a team was great!
On March 20 2013 07:53 Bibbit wrote: Really like Coach Park, sounds like he'll do wonders for the team. I also liked this (probably inadvertent) shot at Thorzain:
On March 20 2013 07:55 Jacmert wrote: I watched HerO stream past those hours yesterday, too. He went past 12PM KST and kept going for a few hours, I think. I wonder if they've started / if Liquid players will follow as closely.
Isn't HerO in another house that he rented with some other players? Also Stephano is in the states at the moment so he doesn't have to follow coach Park streaming obligations
On March 20 2013 08:15 Qwyn wrote: Is Thorzain switching races? Why? Confused about his quote that EGTL has no Terran players besides Taeja. I'm trying not to go bonkers here.
I figured Park forgot about Thorzain or doesnt really consider him a viable option in proleague. Hope it's not the latter >_>
On March 20 2013 08:15 Qwyn wrote: Is Thorzain switching races? Why? Confused about his quote that EGTL has no Terran players besides Taeja. I'm trying not to go bonkers here.
I figured Park forgot about Thorzain or doesnt really consider him a viable option in proleague. Hope it's not the latter >_>
Well that would be insulting. TZ has awesome potential. Considering how he talked about everyone having potential and that he was looking forward to meeting Stephano and Thorzain I hope it's not the case.
On March 20 2013 08:15 Qwyn wrote: Is Thorzain switching races? Why? Confused about his quote that EGTL has no Terran players besides Taeja. I'm trying not to go bonkers here.
I figured Park forgot about Thorzain or doesnt really consider him a viable option in proleague. Hope it's not the latter >_>
Well that would be insulting. TZ has awesome potential. Considering how he talked about everyone having potential and that he was looking forward to meeting Stephano and Thorzain I hope it's not the case.
Also possible he was saying Taeja is the only stable Terran as TZ doesn't actually live in Korea permanently
On March 20 2013 08:15 Qwyn wrote: Is Thorzain switching races? Why? Confused about his quote that EGTL has no Terran players besides Taeja. I'm trying not to go bonkers here.
I figured Park forgot about Thorzain or doesnt really consider him a viable option in proleague. Hope it's not the latter >_>
Well that would be insulting. TZ has awesome potential. Considering how he talked about everyone having potential and that he was looking forward to meeting Stephano and Thorzain I hope it's not the case.
i think tz may have been overseas when he was interviewed, so only terran = taeja at that time
On March 20 2013 08:48 blade55555 wrote: Optertown thanks for translating that was really interesting to read and the guy seems to know what he's doing (obviously) :D
On March 20 2013 08:15 Qwyn wrote: Is Thorzain switching races? Why? Confused about his quote that EGTL has no Terran players besides Taeja. I'm trying not to go bonkers here.
I figured Park forgot about Thorzain or doesnt really consider him a viable option in proleague. Hope it's not the latter >_>
Well that would be insulting. TZ has awesome potential. Considering how he talked about everyone having potential and that he was looking forward to meeting Stephano and Thorzain I hope it's not the case.
"But the boosters in HotS are a little different than what I imagined. They should use energy, or become more vulnerable when using them, something like that. There has to be a risk, but there are none, so it’s no fun when players can infinitely use them."
I thought of the energy requirement and extra vulnerability, too. Personally, I like the latter more. Maybe they can take extra damage while boosting or something.
Also, +1 to scourge (or something similar). This man knows what he is talking about!
I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
On March 20 2013 18:05 Canucklehead wrote: I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
Streaming makes the player more visible, brings in more fans for him and thus also increases the sponsor visibility. It makes sense.
On March 20 2013 18:05 Canucklehead wrote: I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
It's not that surprising, IdrA just said yesterday on Inside the Game that his contract is heavily based on streaming, if he went to Korea and could only stream for as long as Coach Park allows, he'd make maybe 2/3 of the salary he does now.
They're pretty open about it, and I guess everyone pretty much knew or guessed that anyway.
"To address this issue, we will be doing several things. First, we’ll be increasing our infrastructure budget operation-wide, which includes everything from our team house itself, to our ground transportation, to our player support – we’re going to allocate more resources and improve the entire operation, in every way we can, so that our players can minimize their distractions and put additional focus on their play in a more organized, structured environment. And secondly (and just as, if not more importantly), we’re going to make a big addition to our coaching staff by hiring a new Head Coach whom you’re all probably quite familiar with."
This makes me think that in addition to improving the physical situation in the team house in Korea (which was horrible by all accounts that I've actually heard or read) they are also going to be lightening up on the streaming obligations for their players in Korea, Park probably sat EG down and told them that it was unrealistic to expect large amounts of streaming AND good proleague results (or any other major tournament for that matter).
On March 21 2013 01:29 HSAN wrote: Too bad core members of EG don't always seem to approve of Park's ways. At least that's the impression I got from watching ITG.
Well they don't need to approve as long as they still follow it.
On March 20 2013 18:05 Canucklehead wrote: I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
It's not that surprising, IdrA just said yesterday on Inside the Game that his contract is heavily based on streaming, if he went to Korea and could only stream for as long as Coach Park allows, he'd make maybe 2/3 of the salary he does now.
They're pretty open about it, and I guess everyone pretty much knew or guessed that anyway.
This is the main problem with them (and many foreign teams), salary over results.
On March 20 2013 18:05 Canucklehead wrote: I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
It's not that surprising, IdrA just said yesterday on Inside the Game that his contract is heavily based on streaming, if he went to Korea and could only stream for as long as Coach Park allows, he'd make maybe 2/3 of the salary he does now.
They're pretty open about it, and I guess everyone pretty much knew or guessed that anyway.
This is the main problem with them (and many foreign teams), salary over results.
It is the problem of supporting a team in NA or EU. Kespa teams are heavly sponsored, they can take public transportation to the studio for Proleague and other Korean leagues, and so on. They can focus more on practicing because they have less overhead and no start up costs. If all Esports in NA took place in one city, things would be a lot cheaper for the teams.
On March 21 2013 02:05 xwoGworwaTsx wrote: stream time sucks. but this is great for EGTL
Yeah, and since being a professional player is pretty much a job, I can see why someone wouldn't want to take a pay cut. I mean, if someone told me "If you go to Korea and train for 12 hours a day to become the most badass paralegal ever, but your pay will be cut to 2/3 and you still need to do the work you did previously to get that, plus pratice. By the way, the enviorment is there is also pretty crappy to practice in," I would tell them to come back with a better deal that made sense for me in any way.
It is up to the team to make practicing in Korean attractive to players. You can't expect people to take pay cuts and worker harder just for the potential of getting better.
Sad thing is that Coach Park is making a huge effort to try to motivate these players to get on the same level as the Kespa pros, but people like idra don't want to move to Korea and make an effort to compete professionally. They are pretty much telling coach park to "fuck himself."
God, EG seriously needs to reconsider their line-up, so far only Jaedong is making an effort to improve himself for competitive play.
Q: Coach Park! It’s been a while. I would first like to hear exactly when you entered EG-TL. A: Hello, it has been a while hasn’t it? It’s a pleasure. I am the new head coach of EG-TL, Park Yong Woon. Actually, it’s only been about 10 days since the decision was made. Serious negotiations only started about 3 weeks ago. I spoke with the head and CEO Alex quite often and after the decision was made, much preparation was had. I thought it would be detrimental if I were to just go headlong into it, so I took the time to think about where I could bring about the most change. I especially thought about whether or not I could bring results. You could say I took the time to calculate everything? I received help in many ways from many people and made my decision. Alex really seems to believe in me, so I’m already eager to go to work.
Q: You were an advisor for SK Telecom T1 until you became head coach for EG-TL. What kind of processes did you have to go through? A: SK actually helped me a lot. To be exact, President Oh Kyung Shik helped me quite a bit. Recently I felt I needed to learn English, so I went to Philippines to do so. After that I was supposed to focus on the SK Telecom T1 League of Legends team. But because the field I was about to enter was so different from the field I have been working in, it bothered me. You know how people have their ambition, so I had thoughts that my past experiences would be somewhat wasted. So when I voiced these sentiments, he helped me and in turn, I think the results turned out wonderfully.
Q: You probably had a world of opportunity in front of you, but why did you choose EG-TL? A: I’ve always wanted to coach a foreign team, even when I was at SK Telecom T1. So in preparation, I even hired tutors to verse myself in English. You know how I became an advisor, correct? To be honest, I wasn’t too happy with it. Only for an instant of course (laughs). So when this path opened up for me I thought, “This must be a heaven-sent opportunity.” Immediately after, I went to the Philippines to improve my English and even started working out to prepare. I took a little time off and it was very rewarding. During the process, I also came up with a lot of ideas. So when I was looking around for a foreign team and found EG-TL, I decided to take this opportunity to use my experiences.
Q: Even on the SK Planet Proleague Media Day (don’t ask, I have no idea) people thought EG-TL as a strong contender. But to be straight, they did not live up to the hype. Why do you think this is so? A: I would first like to say that their record seems appropriate. You don’t think so? I researched/investigated the team for 10 days or so and I concluded that this was the only possible outcome. The problem has nothing to do with the players themselves, but the infrastructure of the team itself. They have a poor environment compared to those of other teams. They cannot focus solely on Proleague, they have to travel to foreign tournaments, they have mandatory streaming obligations, as well as a lacking coaching staff, making it difficult to organize the team well. There are foreign players, and there are too many players to make practice smoothly (not 100% on this translation). Coach Kim Sung Hwan (Hwanni) must have been very frustrated. Although the players have much value to their names, because of these factors the current results were inevitable.
Q: Now that you know the problem, how will you go about fixing it? What changes will you bring? A: Hmm…I’m still giving a lot of thought to it. Truthfully, I am not sure yet. But one thing is sure: it is impossible to completely fix the problem. I am approaching with the goal of minimizing all harmful factors. For example, I’ve been thinking about how to solve the streaming problem for 2 days. There is the danger of showing their full strength to the public, but if they do not their salaries are cut and must give up a portion of their winnings so…I’m still thinking about it. I’ve actually changed the streaming schedule a bit. Before it seemed as though the players were streaming whenever they had free time, but now I have them all stream at the same time. I also changed it so that they stream in the morning. This way the streams will be more accessible to the foreign fans. The response has been great. The players used to stream into the night, resulting in insufficient rest and poor condition the next morning. This was a big problem. Having them stream in the morning is beneficial in many ways. First, it is a way to warm up their fingers. Second, it’s a good way to fill their stream requirements. Third, their full strength will not be shown. Though there probably will be fans who will wake up early to watch as well (laughs). Fans would have to wait for stream announcements to watch the players, essentially being in the dark. But now that they all have a fixed schedule, viewers can simply wait for the streams to start at a certain time. This will increase viewership, increase player income, and provide a little fun for the players streaming together. One by one, I am approaching this problem step by step.
Q: Since this is a foreign team, there are occasions where you are unable to use key players due to foreign tournaments. It’s something that you’re not used to, what do you think of it? A: You’re right, there will be times where we won’t be at full strength and forced to change up our rotation. It seems a bit unfair seeing how no other team has this problem (laughs), but I think there is some charm to this. The same way I am trying to improve the streaming schedule, I feel I can turn this into something great as well. This attracts me very much. It kind of feels like solving a homework problem? It’s definitely a challenge.
Q: What do think is most important when running a team? A: Coming to EG-TL the thing that worried me the most was how to schedule their days, especially since there would be Koreans and foreigners under the same roof. It worried me a lot. But as I met and talked with the players, I found I could apply my past experiences here as well. There was nothing different. I had no need to worry because they were all still gamers with the pro mentality. What I think is most important is their daily life. One’s individual rhythm is incredibly important. No matter how hard you practice, if you practice until 4 or 5 in the morning and feel dead tired the next morning or sleep in, I think that is a sign of a bad gamer. If you are a pro, you should know how to control yourself. You must learn to stop and recover when needed. I will not allow any action that destroys one’s rhythm. Currently, I am making the players go to bed and wake up early. They are chastised if they are caught up after 2am (laughs). I am also teaching them the habit to self-check their daily life. How long they slept, how much they practice is all being checked. This is all pro mentality in my opinion. You do not just sleep to sleep or practice to practice. You must know just how much sleep you need to be 100%. To know oneself, that is what a pro is. (I love this quote btw.) I am working to teach them this mentality.
Q: What do you think is the reason for the lack of results? A: It is as many have already guessed. They don’t hold Proleague preparation as their top priority. Their potential is enormous. You can’t blame them for this either as their environment is different. A pro’s worth is measured by their earnings and whatnot, so teams have geared their players towards focusing on Proleague. Starting with incentives to raises for Proleague standards. But our team gains more from winning outside tournaments. It’s hard to raise a team camaraderie. To make this a team a true team is my role.
Q: What do you think is EG-TL’s biggest problem right now? A: We need Terrans (laughs). We really don’t have any Terrans. Other than Yoon Young Suh (Taeja) we don’t have anyone. Terran looks very strong in Heart of the Swarm, so the problem is even bigger. I am still thinking of how to solve this.
Q: Do you think you’ll have a hard time leading such a nationally diverse team? A: I won’t be able to communicate effectively with them. The language barrier is obvious. Other than that I don’t think we will have any major problems. I get along with foreigners pretty well. I look forward to befriending ‘ThorZaIN’ Marcus Eklof and ‘Stephano’ Ilyes Satouri and many others.
Q: The most important question! I would like to ask of your English skills? How was your time in the Philippines? A: You can’t be perfect, you know? (laughs) What I learned in the Philippines was to speak with confidence. Every word with confidence. It helped a lot. But my grammar is still a bit shaky, so I’ve already gone through four grammar textbooks. I think I’ve improved a bit (laughs). I’m still much better than when I used to be. There won’t be any big translation issues, but I’m still worried (laughs). But I will have Coach Kim Sung Hwan (Hwanni) close by so I will try to learn much from him.
Q: When you were officially taken in, what did the team head say? A: The first thing I remember was, “Great!” Then it was, “Impressed!” It was a great response (laughs). What I am most grateful to Alex is his trust in me. Jokingly I said to him, “Even if you can’t trust your family, you can trust me. You have to gamble your trust in me.” He continued to give me his full trust. No matter what I would suggest, he would take it. He makes my work worthwhile. When I first spoke to Alex, I sent him my entire analysis of EG and improvement plans. He was very surprised about that. Outside of Korea, Head coach is regarded similar to a team manager. He said that he did not expect me to think about the team this much, and since then, whatever I say, he gives me his full trust. Of course, I will repay his trust with results.
Q: How have you divided the coaching staff’s roles? A: Coach Park Sung Jin and I will take care of the team, as usual. He will essentially be my assistant. Coach Kim Sung Hwan will be general coach, dealing with foreign players or working with me in communications to discuss the growth of this team in the right direction. This way I can direct my full attention to coaching the team.
Q: The 4th round of Proleague isn’t far off, what are your thoughts on Heart of the Swarm? A: I haven’t been able to play a lot. It’s my first time after the closed beta. I have discussed with the players and Terran seems to be very strong. That is why I am worried, as there are too few Terrans on the team. But I do have an issue with the Ignite Thrusters (laughs). I used to think it would be fun to put boosters on Brood War Dropships but this is real. But the boosters in HotS are a little different than what I imagined. They should use energy, or become more vulnerable when using them, something like that. There has to be a risk, but there are none, so it’s no fun when players can infinitely use them. To make the game more enjoyable, there has to be some escape to that, but there are none, which is disappointing. Maybe if there was something like Scourge, but as of now it’s a bit lacking. They can definitely make it more exciting. Other than that, it’s a very fun game. It’s better than ‘Wings of Liberty.” But looking at player’s responses, I think they are correct in calling it “Terrancraft.” (laughs)
Q: What is EG-TL’s goal for the second half of the season? A: Well, we have to recover. We have a big goal. Looking at the numbers though, it may be impossible (laughs). EG-TL’s goal is to enter the playoffs. Though through calculations, it is a very impossible number. To enter the playoffs, EG-TL must win 14 of their next 21 games. We have to play like the 1st place Woongjin Stars to have a place in the playoffs. To be honest, it is a very hard goal. But after talking with the players, and with Alex as well, the consensus I hear is, “We can still do it.” Though it will be a difficult path, I believe it will be the time of my life. But I do hope that luck and miracles help us (laughs).
Q: You have been labeled as a legend due to your ability. What do you think your chances are in reaching the post-season as you did last year? A: I am here because I believe it is possible. If EG-TL doesn’t make the playoffs, it will be disappointing to break my streak (laughs), but to continue my ambition, I accept this challenge. I’ve always loved challenges. If everything was laid out for me, where’s the fun in that? I will give it my all.
Q: Before we go, say something to the fans! A: Firstly, to both the Korean and foreign fans. To the Korean fans I ask you to embrace our players. They are having a hard time. Embrace them, cheer for them, and we will work towards the playoffs. We need momentum. If not, I don’t think we will be able to, so cheer for us! To the foreign fans I would like to voice my thinks. When the announcement was made on EG’s front page, I read many of the comments. I never imagined the amount of support you gave me. Thank you so much. It was very moving. I will return the favor, I will not forget your support. I will do my best. Lastly, I would like to address the two geniuses of EG. Alex! I want to tell you that your voice is really great. Thanks you so much. I believe we will be very good partners. I heard the team coordinator Cody is getting married soon. Congratulations! I hope to continue to inform you of what is going on. Please cheer for us!
Based on the interview, it seems Coach Park is really very interested taking on the challenge of improving EG-TL. I am surprised that he have already noted key points of the team like it is a mixed nationality team, the stream/contract obligations, improving the team's practice structure plus he already have a set goal which is high but realistic. I am truly impressed and I hope that EG-TL improve not only in ranking but also the players themselves.
On March 21 2013 02:16 Nightsz wrote: Sad thing is that Coach Park is making a huge effort to try to motivate these players to get on the same level as the Kespa pros, but people like idra don't want to move to Korea and make an effort to compete professionally. They are pretty much telling coach park to "fuck himself."
God, EG seriously needs to reconsider their line-up, so far only Jaedong is making an effort to improve himself for competitive play.
Why would anyone take a pay cut to live to move across the world and live in a forgien country where they don't speak the language only to pratice 12 hours a day for the potential of getting better? Since these players are trying to make a living, why would they make less money?
Its not greed causing the problem. Pay cuts are serious issues and I would never take one, no matter how much better the job I was going to was. It is up to the teams and coaches to make it worth the player's time to go to Korea. You can't force them unless you want lack luster results(no one works well when they are forced to do so). It is good for the players, but only if they don't give up to much by moving to Korea.
I think Coach Park understands the issues at hand and is working hard to address them. If anything, I think he likes the challenge of making an amazing team while also making sure the team's stay viable to run.
On March 21 2013 02:16 Nightsz wrote: Sad thing is that Coach Park is making a huge effort to try to motivate these players to get on the same level as the Kespa pros, but people like idra don't want to move to Korea and make an effort to compete professionally. They are pretty much telling coach park to "fuck himself."
God, EG seriously needs to reconsider their line-up, so far only Jaedong is making an effort to improve himself for competitive play.
Why would anyone take a pay cut to live to move across the world and live in a forgien country where they don't speak the language only to pratice 12 hours a day for the potential of getting better? Since these players are trying to make a living, why would they make less money?
Its not greed causing the problem. Pay cuts are serious issues and I would never take one, no matter how much better the job I was going to was. It is up to the teams and coaches to make it worth the player's time to go to Korea. You can't force them unless you want lack luster results(no one works well when they are forced to do so). It is good for the players, but only if they don't give up to much by moving to Korea.
i maybe would take a pay cut, dependent of the situation..
But otherwise agree, it's a very serious issue when a company's goals are different from personal goals of employees as written in their contracts. I really hope it's solved without too much trouble.
On March 20 2013 18:05 Canucklehead wrote: I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
It's not that surprising, IdrA just said yesterday on Inside the Game that his contract is heavily based on streaming, if he went to Korea and could only stream for as long as Coach Park allows, he'd make maybe 2/3 of the salary he does now.
They're pretty open about it, and I guess everyone pretty much knew or guessed that anyway.
This is the main problem with them (and many foreign teams), salary over results.
It is the problem of supporting a team in NA or EU. Kespa teams are heavly sponsored, they can take public transportation to the studio for Proleague and other Korean leagues, and so on. They can focus more on practicing because they have less overhead and no start up costs. If all Esports in NA took place in one city, things would be a lot cheaper for the teams.
Kespa players will also make far less money. Negotiating a salary with a 14,15,16 year old kid who doesn't know anything about the international e-sports scene will be far different from negotiating a salary with Idra, Stephano, Huk, or Thorzain.
"To address this issue, we will be doing several things. First, we’ll be increasing our infrastructure budget operation-wide, which includes everything from our team house itself, to our ground transportation, to our player support – we’re going to allocate more resources and improve the entire operation, in every way we can, so that our players can minimize their distractions and put additional focus on their play in a more organized, structured environment. And secondly (and just as, if not more importantly), we’re going to make a big addition to our coaching staff by hiring a new Head Coach whom you’re all probably quite familiar with."
EG realizes that heavy streaming and high end results don't mix, this quote would strongly indicate that they are going to lighten the streaming burdens for their players in Korea in addition to the many things they are doing to commit heavily to proleague and korea in general (coach park, improving team house etc)
On March 20 2013 18:05 Canucklehead wrote: I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
It's not that surprising, IdrA just said yesterday on Inside the Game that his contract is heavily based on streaming, if he went to Korea and could only stream for as long as Coach Park allows, he'd make maybe 2/3 of the salary he does now.
They're pretty open about it, and I guess everyone pretty much knew or guessed that anyway.
Hmm, I'm not really talking about the same thing. What Idra is talking about is if he can only stream for 2 hours compared to say 5 hours or more, then he loses out on lost ad revenue from those missing hours. Idra wants to stream and lots for the ad revenue.
I'm talking about player x has a quota of X hours of streaming for the month he has to hit. If he doesn't hit that quota mark he's fined/salary is withheld until he does. Therefore, this is not the case of a person worried about missing out on lost ad revenue from streaming, but the case of them losing out on their actual salary for missing their stream quota. Now for someone who loves streaming anyways, hitting their quota will never be an issue for them, but will be for players who don't like streaming as much.
The fact that players need to stream on EG is public knowledge and common sense, but penalties being levied against players for missing stream quotas seemed more on the down low to me. Maybe I'm wrong and everyone knew that too and could be since I think I read someone say that on reddit a while ago.
The Taeja/Stephano/HerO trio used to be the strongest core in Proleague by far, with a solid support cast of JYP, Revival, Jaedong and Thorzain. EG-TL should have won the first rounds in convinving fashion, but didn't due to various factors, some of which Coach Park might have solved. Now that Kespa teams have caught up skillwise and still have superior infrastructure and undivided attention, it's probably too late for EG-TL to be successful.
On March 20 2013 18:05 Canucklehead wrote: I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
It's not that surprising, IdrA just said yesterday on Inside the Game that his contract is heavily based on streaming, if he went to Korea and could only stream for as long as Coach Park allows, he'd make maybe 2/3 of the salary he does now.
They're pretty open about it, and I guess everyone pretty much knew or guessed that anyway.
This is the main problem with them (and many foreign teams), salary over results.
while it's unfortunate for fans, can you really blame them? they get to play a video game they like for a living, might as well make as much money as possible while it lasts. if i ever wanted to become a progamer, that's what i would be thinking. it's not a career.
On March 20 2013 18:05 Canucklehead wrote: I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
It's not that surprising, IdrA just said yesterday on Inside the Game that his contract is heavily based on streaming, if he went to Korea and could only stream for as long as Coach Park allows, he'd make maybe 2/3 of the salary he does now.
They're pretty open about it, and I guess everyone pretty much knew or guessed that anyway.
This is the main problem with them (and many foreign teams), salary over results.
while it's unfortunate for fans, can you really blame them? they get to play a video game they like for a living, might as well make as much money as possible while it lasts. if i ever wanted to become a progamer, that's what i would be thinking. it's not a career.
That is great but why join something as big as Proleague then to get utterly destroyed? I mean they should at least have discussed something with the players right?
On March 20 2013 18:05 Canucklehead wrote: I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
It's not that surprising, IdrA just said yesterday on Inside the Game that his contract is heavily based on streaming, if he went to Korea and could only stream for as long as Coach Park allows, he'd make maybe 2/3 of the salary he does now.
They're pretty open about it, and I guess everyone pretty much knew or guessed that anyway.
This is the main problem with them (and many foreign teams), salary over results.
while it's unfortunate for fans, can you really blame them? they get to play a video game they like for a living, might as well make as much money as possible while it lasts. if i ever wanted to become a progamer, that's what i would be thinking. it's not a career.
Yeah, it's hard to blame them. In korea, you need to win to make money. In the west you need to be popular to make money. Winning is very hard and not guaranteed, so any money earned from winning for foreigners is just bonus money on top of their salary/stream income.
On March 20 2013 18:05 Canucklehead wrote: I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
It's not that surprising, IdrA just said yesterday on Inside the Game that his contract is heavily based on streaming, if he went to Korea and could only stream for as long as Coach Park allows, he'd make maybe 2/3 of the salary he does now.
They're pretty open about it, and I guess everyone pretty much knew or guessed that anyway.
This is the main problem with them (and many foreign teams), salary over results.
while it's unfortunate for fans, can you really blame them? they get to play a video game they like for a living, might as well make as much money as possible while it lasts. if i ever wanted to become a progamer, that's what i would be thinking. it's not a career.
That is great but why join something as big as Proleague then to get utterly destroyed? I mean they should at least have discussed something with the players right?
That is the teams problem, not the players. If they want to do well in Pro-league, they need to make it worth the players time and effort. My boss can’t make me work overtime without pay or travel without giving me money for gas, doesn’t matter how good I would get at my job. If the player is going to lose money by going to Korean, the team needs to make up for the difference to make it worth the players time.
On March 20 2013 18:05 Canucklehead wrote: I'm surprised he was so candid about their streaming obligations going so far as to say players get fined/salary withheld if they don't meet their streaming quota.
It's not that surprising, IdrA just said yesterday on Inside the Game that his contract is heavily based on streaming, if he went to Korea and could only stream for as long as Coach Park allows, he'd make maybe 2/3 of the salary he does now.
They're pretty open about it, and I guess everyone pretty much knew or guessed that anyway.
This is the main problem with them (and many foreign teams), salary over results.
while it's unfortunate for fans, can you really blame them? they get to play a video game they like for a living, might as well make as much money as possible while it lasts. if i ever wanted to become a progamer, that's what i would be thinking. it's not a career.
That is great but why join something as big as Proleague then to get utterly destroyed? I mean they should at least have discussed something with the players right?
That is the teams problem, not the players. If they want to do well in Pro-league, they need to make it worth the players time and effort. My boss can’t make me work overtime without pay or travel without giving me money for gas, doesn’t matter how good I would get at my job. If the player is going to lose money by going to Korean, the team needs to make up for the difference to make it worth the players time.
yeah, this pretty much. i doubt the foreign EG-TL players told their management it is their biggest dream to play in Proleague, maybe not even some of the Koreans. it's more likely the team(s) said you're gonna play in this now or we'll cut your salary/not renew your contract or something like that and the players complied. i guess they don't even have to say anything like that, it's implicit anyways.
i always thought progaming is still like amateur musicians. you love what you do, you do it even if means little pay, you do it because you dream of going big, and to go big you sacrifice a lot for the opportunities.
then people are saying "give me good environment then i'll think about it", "paycut? no thanks". to train in korea means you want to be the best, if you want your easy money gtfo and stay an amateur.
double standards i think, some people think the market is like an actual sport. everyone has to sacrifice a little to make this esports happen, people have no idea how small this market is. its bigger than before, but its no mainstream (korea is the closest thing)
the term "pro" was mostly related with Kespa players for me because of how hard it was to get in, how much work and sacrifice it required. now everyone thinks whoever can win a tournament or stream with big numbers are pros.
On March 21 2013 03:03 jinorazi wrote: i always thought progaming is still like amateur musicians. you love what you do, you do it even if means little pay, you do it because you dream of going big, and to go big you sacrifice a lot for the opportunities.
then people are saying "give me good environment then i'll think about it", "paycut? no thanks". to train in korea means you want to be the best, if you want your easy money gtfo and stay an amateur.
double standards i think, some people think the market is like an actual sport. everyone has to sacrifice a little to make this esports happen, people have no idea how small this market is. its bigger than before, but its no mainstream (korea is the closest thing)
the term "pro" was mostly related with Kespa players for me because of how hard it was to get in, how much work and sacrifice it required. now everyone thinks whoever can win a tournament or stream with big numbers are pros.
the scene has become so fucking spoiled.
I think it's a really bad comparison with amateur musicians. If a musician works all of his or her life and doesn't make it, there are numerous fall-back opportunities. They can teach music at a primary school level. They can give individual lessons. They can also find small playing gigs throughout their lifetime.
If you don't make it as a programer, then you're pretty much washed up. Instead of going to school (and this includes secondary for 15 year old Kespa players who play for 12 hours a day) to gain marketable skills, you spent your youth playing video games. There is no market for retired programers outside of casting, and there are fewer slots for casters than there are for active progamers.
So what we're seeing right now is incredibly interesting-- we're slowly seeing the definition of what is a Western progamer. This will be completely different from what Koreans see as progamers because Western progamers are almost uniformly older than their Korean counterparts. Success will ultimately be based on a balance of marketability and skill. Sponsors pay the bills and salaries, and they don't care how good a player is, they just care about how those players represent their brand and increase brand recognition. Look at all of the Western teams which just cut a whole bunch of Koreans while maintaining their Western core. After all, the most important thing is finding a sustainable business model which can support a healthy international scene.
On March 21 2013 03:03 jinorazi wrote: i always thought progaming is still like amateur musicians. you love what you do, you do it even if means little pay, you do it because you dream of going big, and to go big you sacrifice a lot for the opportunities.
then people are saying "give me good environment then i'll think about it", "paycut? no thanks". to train in korea means you want to be the best, if you want your easy money gtfo and stay an amateur.
double standards i think, some people think the market is like an actual sport. everyone has to sacrifice a little to make this esports happen, people have no idea how small this market is. its bigger than before, but its no mainstream (korea is the closest thing)
the term "pro" was mostly related with Kespa players for me because of how hard it was to get in, how much work and sacrifice it required. now everyone thinks whoever can win a tournament or stream with big numbers are pros.
the scene has become so fucking spoiled.
I think it's a really bad comparison with amateur musicians. If a musician works all of his or her life and doesn't make it, there are numerous fall-back opportunities. They can teach music at a primary school level. They can give individual lessons. They can also find small playing gigs throughout their lifetime.
If you don't make it as a programer, then you're pretty much washed up. Instead of going to school (and this includes secondary for 15 year old Kespa players who play for 12 hours a day) to gain marketable skills, you spent your youth playing video games. There is no market for retired programers outside of casting, and there are fewer slots for casters than there are for active progamers.
So what we're seeing right now is incredibly interesting-- we're slowly seeing the definition of what is a Western progamer. This will be completely different from what Koreans see as progamers because Western progamers are almost uniformly older than their Korean counterparts. Success will ultimately be based on a balance of marketability and skill. Sponsors pay the bills and salaries, and they don't care how good a player is, they just care about how those players represent their brand and increase brand recognition. Look at all of the Western teams which just cut a whole bunch of Koreans while maintaining their Western core. After all, the most important thing is finding a sustainable business model which can support a healthy international scene.
isn't that how it is with athletes? they still go to college, get a degree so they can fall back on. some prefer to skip it and go pro after highschool (like in NBA). its their choice as it should be with progamers too. some progamers are students also and the progaming team should set up a program to insure their player's future if they already have not. the esports scene has created plenty of jobs for retired progamers.
On March 21 2013 03:03 jinorazi wrote: i always thought progaming is still like amateur musicians. you love what you do, you do it even if means little pay, you do it because you dream of going big, and to go big you sacrifice a lot for the opportunities.
then people are saying "give me good environment then i'll think about it", "paycut? no thanks". to train in korea means you want to be the best, if you want your easy money gtfo and stay an amateur.
double standards i think, some people think the market is like an actual sport. everyone has to sacrifice a little to make this esports happen, people have no idea how small this market is. its bigger than before, but its no mainstream (korea is the closest thing)
the term "pro" was mostly related with Kespa players for me because of how hard it was to get in, how much work and sacrifice it required. now everyone thinks whoever can win a tournament or stream with big numbers are pros.
the scene has become so fucking spoiled.
Yeah, well guess what, being a pro gamer is not like being an amateur musicians. My girl friend is a drummer in an amateur band and they don’t do gigs they don’t paid for. Why? Because it costs money for them to travel to the venue, set up, eat and they don’t do that for free. They used to do gigs for free, but stopped because it wasn’t worth their time and they all have full times jobs. They love music and play because they love it, but they don’t spend time and money to do it totally for free. You can accuse her(and her band) of not loving the music enough, but I think you should try doing it to her face and see what response you get. I am sure it will be awesome.
The argument that players should just take pay cuts, travel across the world to work 12 hours a day just to have a chance of getting better is naïve and slightly childish. And the fact that those players are on professional teams makes it even more so. Why would you work hard for your employer to make less money? People need good reasons to pay cuts and right now the teams aren’t offering them for Korea. Over time they might and that is likely what Coach Park is going address.
And anyone who thinks the Korean player’s aren’t playing for money, don’t care about how much their get paid and are only playing because of passion are being naïve.
On March 21 2013 03:03 jinorazi wrote: i always thought progaming is still like amateur musicians. you love what you do, you do it even if means little pay, you do it because you dream of going big, and to go big you sacrifice a lot for the opportunities.
then people are saying "give me good environment then i'll think about it", "paycut? no thanks". to train in korea means you want to be the best, if you want your easy money gtfo and stay an amateur.
double standards i think, some people think the market is like an actual sport. everyone has to sacrifice a little to make this esports happen, people have no idea how small this market is. its bigger than before, but its no mainstream (korea is the closest thing)
the term "pro" was mostly related with Kespa players for me because of how hard it was to get in, how much work and sacrifice it required. now everyone thinks whoever can win a tournament or stream with big numbers are pros.
the scene has become so fucking spoiled.
Yeah, well guess what, being a pro gamer is not like being an amateur musicians. My girl friend is a drummer in an amateur band and they don’t do gigs they don’t paid for. Why? Because it costs money for them to travel to the venue, set up, eat and they don’t do that for free. They used to do gigs for free, but stopped because it wasn’t worth their time and they all have full times jobs. They love music and play because they love it, but they don’t spend time and money to do it totally for free. You can accuse her(and her band) of not loving the music enough, but I think you should try doing it to her face and see what response you get. I am sure it will be awesome.
The argument that players should just take pay cuts, travel across the world to work 12 hours a day just to have a chance of getting better is naïve and slightly childish. And the fact that those players are on professional teams makes it even more so. Why would you work hard for your employer to make less money? People need good reasons to pay cuts and right now the teams aren’t offering them for Korea. Over time they might and that is likely what Coach Park is going address.
And anyone who thinks the Korean player’s aren’t playing for money, don’t care about how much their get paid and are only playing because of passion are being naïve.
i'm not saying they should play for free, what i'm saying is consider how much you're asking (as a player) in return of the work in this field.
korean progamers ge tpaid big, those who made it. for those who havnt made it, you think its ok for them to ask 200k salaries without posting results? and how do you post results; practice hard. what i'm saying is if you want to "make it big" as in make money, you must sacrifice your way to get there. there are those who see it as not worth it and thats totally fine but i'm saying they're not entitled to some payout for their efforts to "go big".
I agree with him about Medivac Boosters, exactly the philosophy that is missing in SC2. There has to be a drawback to using the boost, it would make the game so much more interesting.
pick one: - make medivacs unable to unload/load troops when boosted. - make medivacs unable to heal while boosted (or healing is 50% slower (or some other percentage)) - make them lose some HP for every boosted second (some sort of overheating explanation)
On March 21 2013 03:03 jinorazi wrote: i always thought progaming is still like amateur musicians. you love what you do, you do it even if means little pay, you do it because you dream of going big, and to go big you sacrifice a lot for the opportunities.
then people are saying "give me good environment then i'll think about it", "paycut? no thanks". to train in korea means you want to be the best, if you want your easy money gtfo and stay an amateur.
double standards i think, some people think the market is like an actual sport. everyone has to sacrifice a little to make this esports happen, people have no idea how small this market is. its bigger than before, but its no mainstream (korea is the closest thing)
the term "pro" was mostly related with Kespa players for me because of how hard it was to get in, how much work and sacrifice it required. now everyone thinks whoever can win a tournament or stream with big numbers are pros.
the scene has become so fucking spoiled.
I think it's a really bad comparison with amateur musicians. If a musician works all of his or her life and doesn't make it, there are numerous fall-back opportunities. They can teach music at a primary school level. They can give individual lessons. They can also find small playing gigs throughout their lifetime.
If you don't make it as a programer, then you're pretty much washed up. Instead of going to school (and this includes secondary for 15 year old Kespa players who play for 12 hours a day) to gain marketable skills, you spent your youth playing video games. There is no market for retired programers outside of casting, and there are fewer slots for casters than there are for active progamers.
So what we're seeing right now is incredibly interesting-- we're slowly seeing the definition of what is a Western progamer. This will be completely different from what Koreans see as progamers because Western progamers are almost uniformly older than their Korean counterparts. Success will ultimately be based on a balance of marketability and skill. Sponsors pay the bills and salaries, and they don't care how good a player is, they just care about how those players represent their brand and increase brand recognition. Look at all of the Western teams which just cut a whole bunch of Koreans while maintaining their Western core. After all, the most important thing is finding a sustainable business model which can support a healthy international scene.
isn't that how it is with athletes? they still go to college, get a degree so they can fall back on. some prefer to skip it and go pro after highschool. its their choice as it should be with progamers too. some progamers are students also and the progaming team should set up a program to insure their player's future if they already have not. the esports scene has created plenty of jobs for retired progamers.
Most athletes don't get a degree, and those that do get a degree because college sports is an accepted path to professional sports; the CSL definitely isn't there yet. Also, athletes in the major sports make tons of money - the "Big 4" sports in the US all have minimum contracts above $500k per year, and there are tons of well-paying jobs available afterwards in scouting, TV commentary, etc. Progamers don't make nearly as much, and unless they're lucky enough to land one of the few coach or commentator positions once they retire, they end up with almost no money and no marketable skills once they retire. I agree that in theory it would be great for teams to in some way support their retired players, but the money to do that just isn't there. I have no problem with any pro-gamer trying to make as much money as they can in their short careers, and I do have a problem with people that try to blame them for doing so.
On March 21 2013 03:03 jinorazi wrote: i always thought progaming is still like amateur musicians. you love what you do, you do it even if means little pay, you do it because you dream of going big, and to go big you sacrifice a lot for the opportunities.
then people are saying "give me good environment then i'll think about it", "paycut? no thanks". to train in korea means you want to be the best, if you want your easy money gtfo and stay an amateur.
double standards i think, some people think the market is like an actual sport. everyone has to sacrifice a little to make this esports happen, people have no idea how small this market is. its bigger than before, but its no mainstream (korea is the closest thing)
the term "pro" was mostly related with Kespa players for me because of how hard it was to get in, how much work and sacrifice it required. now everyone thinks whoever can win a tournament or stream with big numbers are pros.
the scene has become so fucking spoiled.
I think it's a really bad comparison with amateur musicians. If a musician works all of his or her life and doesn't make it, there are numerous fall-back opportunities. They can teach music at a primary school level. They can give individual lessons. They can also find small playing gigs throughout their lifetime.
If you don't make it as a programer, then you're pretty much washed up. Instead of going to school (and this includes secondary for 15 year old Kespa players who play for 12 hours a day) to gain marketable skills, you spent your youth playing video games. There is no market for retired programers outside of casting, and there are fewer slots for casters than there are for active progamers.
So what we're seeing right now is incredibly interesting-- we're slowly seeing the definition of what is a Western progamer. This will be completely different from what Koreans see as progamers because Western progamers are almost uniformly older than their Korean counterparts. Success will ultimately be based on a balance of marketability and skill. Sponsors pay the bills and salaries, and they don't care how good a player is, they just care about how those players represent their brand and increase brand recognition. Look at all of the Western teams which just cut a whole bunch of Koreans while maintaining their Western core. After all, the most important thing is finding a sustainable business model which can support a healthy international scene.
isn't that how it is with athletes? they still go to college, get a degree so they can fall back on. some prefer to skip it and go pro after highschool. its their choice as it should be with progamers too. some progamers are students also and the progaming team should set up a program to insure their player's future if they already have not. the esports scene has created plenty of jobs for retired progamers.
It depends on what you mean by 'pro.' Earlier you said that it used to be reserved for Kespa players who sacrifice everything to hope to one day join a team. Based on what Western players who have trained in Korea have said in interviews, those teamhouses basically have 15 year old kids living there on no salary living as practice slaves who hope to one day get their break and make it onto the proleague team. That's going to be flat-out unacceptable in the West as these players have nothing to fall back on.
I also wouldn't say anything about their choice or not. Adults who don't have much of an interest in this player's future are pressuring a teenage kid into making long-term sacrifices for the opportunity to potentially get better and make it. It's really hard to say that it's their free choice when it's very binary. Everyone in this community seems to praise sacrifice and hard work, but I think many who say this are too young to realize the long-term consequences of these sacrifices. However, the more I hear about kespa gaming houses, the more it sounds like Eastern-bloc Olympic training facilities where winning is placed on a pedestal far above an athlete's future.
On March 21 2013 03:03 jinorazi wrote: i always thought progaming is still like amateur musicians. you love what you do, you do it even if means little pay, you do it because you dream of going big, and to go big you sacrifice a lot for the opportunities.
then people are saying "give me good environment then i'll think about it", "paycut? no thanks". to train in korea means you want to be the best, if you want your easy money gtfo and stay an amateur.
double standards i think, some people think the market is like an actual sport. everyone has to sacrifice a little to make this esports happen, people have no idea how small this market is. its bigger than before, but its no mainstream (korea is the closest thing)
the term "pro" was mostly related with Kespa players for me because of how hard it was to get in, how much work and sacrifice it required. now everyone thinks whoever can win a tournament or stream with big numbers are pros.
the scene has become so fucking spoiled.
I think it's a really bad comparison with amateur musicians. If a musician works all of his or her life and doesn't make it, there are numerous fall-back opportunities. They can teach music at a primary school level. They can give individual lessons. They can also find small playing gigs throughout their lifetime.
If you don't make it as a programer, then you're pretty much washed up. Instead of going to school (and this includes secondary for 15 year old Kespa players who play for 12 hours a day) to gain marketable skills, you spent your youth playing video games. There is no market for retired programers outside of casting, and there are fewer slots for casters than there are for active progamers.
So what we're seeing right now is incredibly interesting-- we're slowly seeing the definition of what is a Western progamer. This will be completely different from what Koreans see as progamers because Western progamers are almost uniformly older than their Korean counterparts. Success will ultimately be based on a balance of marketability and skill. Sponsors pay the bills and salaries, and they don't care how good a player is, they just care about how those players represent their brand and increase brand recognition. Look at all of the Western teams which just cut a whole bunch of Koreans while maintaining their Western core. After all, the most important thing is finding a sustainable business model which can support a healthy international scene.
isn't that how it is with athletes? they still go to college, get a degree so they can fall back on. some prefer to skip it and go pro after highschool. its their choice as it should be with progamers too. some progamers are students also and the progaming team should set up a program to insure their player's future if they already have not. the esports scene has created plenty of jobs for retired progamers.
It depends on what you mean by 'pro.' Earlier you said that it used to be reserved for Kespa players who sacrifice everything to hope to one day join a team. Based on what Western players who have trained in Korea have said in interviews, those teamhouses basically have 15 year old kids living there on no salary living as practice slaves who hope to one day get their break and make it onto the proleague team. That's going to be flat-out unacceptable in the West as these players have nothing to fall back on.
I also wouldn't say anything about their choice or not. Adults who don't have much of an interest in this player's future are pressuring a teenage kid into making long-term sacrifices for the opportunity to potentially get better and make it. It's really hard to say that it's their free choice when it's very binary. Everyone in this community seems to praise sacrifice and hard work, but I think many who say this are too young to realize the long-term consequences of these sacrifices. However, the more I hear about kespa gaming houses, the more it sounds like Eastern-bloc Olympic training facilities where winning is placed on a pedestal far above an athlete's future.
That is a really good analogy to the Korean gaming houses and I hadn’t thought about it that way before. Its not really brought up a lot in the forums, but no one could ever set up a Korean style team house in NA. The number of contract-less, under aged players would be a problem for most child labor laws in most states. The lack of pay for a number of players would also be an issue and it is legally questionable to have someone work for you with the potential of pay at a later date. I know a couple of firms in my state that were called out for “internships” that were just unpaid work, which is highly illegal in this state.
It is an issue that can be overcome, but not with the “practice harder” argument. The issue is more complex than that, though some seem to think it isn’t.
On March 21 2013 03:03 jinorazi wrote: i always thought progaming is still like amateur musicians. you love what you do, you do it even if means little pay, you do it because you dream of going big, and to go big you sacrifice a lot for the opportunities.
then people are saying "give me good environment then i'll think about it", "paycut? no thanks". to train in korea means you want to be the best, if you want your easy money gtfo and stay an amateur.
double standards i think, some people think the market is like an actual sport. everyone has to sacrifice a little to make this esports happen, people have no idea how small this market is. its bigger than before, but its no mainstream (korea is the closest thing)
the term "pro" was mostly related with Kespa players for me because of how hard it was to get in, how much work and sacrifice it required. now everyone thinks whoever can win a tournament or stream with big numbers are pros.
the scene has become so fucking spoiled.
I think it's a really bad comparison with amateur musicians. If a musician works all of his or her life and doesn't make it, there are numerous fall-back opportunities. They can teach music at a primary school level. They can give individual lessons. They can also find small playing gigs throughout their lifetime.
If you don't make it as a programer, then you're pretty much washed up. Instead of going to school (and this includes secondary for 15 year old Kespa players who play for 12 hours a day) to gain marketable skills, you spent your youth playing video games. There is no market for retired programers outside of casting, and there are fewer slots for casters than there are for active progamers.
So what we're seeing right now is incredibly interesting-- we're slowly seeing the definition of what is a Western progamer. This will be completely different from what Koreans see as progamers because Western progamers are almost uniformly older than their Korean counterparts. Success will ultimately be based on a balance of marketability and skill. Sponsors pay the bills and salaries, and they don't care how good a player is, they just care about how those players represent their brand and increase brand recognition. Look at all of the Western teams which just cut a whole bunch of Koreans while maintaining their Western core. After all, the most important thing is finding a sustainable business model which can support a healthy international scene.
isn't that how it is with athletes? they still go to college, get a degree so they can fall back on. some prefer to skip it and go pro after highschool. its their choice as it should be with progamers too. some progamers are students also and the progaming team should set up a program to insure their player's future if they already have not. the esports scene has created plenty of jobs for retired progamers.
It depends on what you mean by 'pro.' Earlier you said that it used to be reserved for Kespa players who sacrifice everything to hope to one day join a team. Based on what Western players who have trained in Korea have said in interviews, those teamhouses basically have 15 year old kids living there on no salary living as practice slaves who hope to one day get their break and make it onto the proleague team. That's going to be flat-out unacceptable in the West as these players have nothing to fall back on.
I also wouldn't say anything about their choice or not. Adults who don't have much of an interest in this player's future are pressuring a teenage kid into making long-term sacrifices for the opportunity to potentially get better and make it. It's really hard to say that it's their free choice when it's very binary. Everyone in this community seems to praise sacrifice and hard work, but I think many who say this are too young to realize the long-term consequences of these sacrifices. However, the more I hear about kespa gaming houses, the more it sounds like Eastern-bloc Olympic training facilities where winning is placed on a pedestal far above an athlete's future.
That is a really good analogy to the Korean gaming houses and I hadn’t thought about it that way before. Its not really brought up a lot in the forums, but no one could ever set up a Korean style team house in NA. The number of contract-less, under aged players would be a problem for most child labor laws in most states. The lack of pay for a number of players would also be an issue and it is legally questionable to have someone work for you with the potential of pay at a later date. I know a couple of firms in my state that were called out for “internships” that were just unpaid work, which is highly illegal in this state.
It is an issue that can be overcome, but not with the “practice harder” argument. The issue is more complex than that, though some seem to think it isn’t.
if that is the case (slaves), the scene has been around for a decade and its hard to believe some people are just realizing such issues. rather, isnt it because some foreigners aren't willing to go to korea for such harsh work environment with less pay? then say the money isn't worth the efforts. (if they dont think its worth it, thats fine but it feels like they want the cake and eat it too)
child labor laws, unpaid work, etc is a separate topic worth its own thread. kespa practice regime is known for their long hours days, i'm 100% sure these topics have come up. (i'd hope kespa put in standards on how these kids are treated)
i see nothing wrong with kids playing, training for hours on end as prodigy musicians do, kid athletes in all fields, kids training as singer/entertainer, as long as they're treated right. i dont know if esports scene in general is treating their kids right or not, we can speculate i guess.
On March 21 2013 03:03 jinorazi wrote: i always thought progaming is still like amateur musicians. you love what you do, you do it even if means little pay, you do it because you dream of going big, and to go big you sacrifice a lot for the opportunities.
then people are saying "give me good environment then i'll think about it", "paycut? no thanks". to train in korea means you want to be the best, if you want your easy money gtfo and stay an amateur.
double standards i think, some people think the market is like an actual sport. everyone has to sacrifice a little to make this esports happen, people have no idea how small this market is. its bigger than before, but its no mainstream (korea is the closest thing)
the term "pro" was mostly related with Kespa players for me because of how hard it was to get in, how much work and sacrifice it required. now everyone thinks whoever can win a tournament or stream with big numbers are pros.
the scene has become so fucking spoiled.
I think it's a really bad comparison with amateur musicians. If a musician works all of his or her life and doesn't make it, there are numerous fall-back opportunities. They can teach music at a primary school level. They can give individual lessons. They can also find small playing gigs throughout their lifetime.
If you don't make it as a programer, then you're pretty much washed up. Instead of going to school (and this includes secondary for 15 year old Kespa players who play for 12 hours a day) to gain marketable skills, you spent your youth playing video games. There is no market for retired programers outside of casting, and there are fewer slots for casters than there are for active progamers.
So what we're seeing right now is incredibly interesting-- we're slowly seeing the definition of what is a Western progamer. This will be completely different from what Koreans see as progamers because Western progamers are almost uniformly older than their Korean counterparts. Success will ultimately be based on a balance of marketability and skill. Sponsors pay the bills and salaries, and they don't care how good a player is, they just care about how those players represent their brand and increase brand recognition. Look at all of the Western teams which just cut a whole bunch of Koreans while maintaining their Western core. After all, the most important thing is finding a sustainable business model which can support a healthy international scene.
isn't that how it is with athletes? they still go to college, get a degree so they can fall back on. some prefer to skip it and go pro after highschool. its their choice as it should be with progamers too. some progamers are students also and the progaming team should set up a program to insure their player's future if they already have not. the esports scene has created plenty of jobs for retired progamers.
It depends on what you mean by 'pro.' Earlier you said that it used to be reserved for Kespa players who sacrifice everything to hope to one day join a team. Based on what Western players who have trained in Korea have said in interviews, those teamhouses basically have 15 year old kids living there on no salary living as practice slaves who hope to one day get their break and make it onto the proleague team. That's going to be flat-out unacceptable in the West as these players have nothing to fall back on.
I also wouldn't say anything about their choice or not. Adults who don't have much of an interest in this player's future are pressuring a teenage kid into making long-term sacrifices for the opportunity to potentially get better and make it. It's really hard to say that it's their free choice when it's very binary. Everyone in this community seems to praise sacrifice and hard work, but I think many who say this are too young to realize the long-term consequences of these sacrifices. However, the more I hear about kespa gaming houses, the more it sounds like Eastern-bloc Olympic training facilities where winning is placed on a pedestal far above an athlete's future.
That is a really good analogy to the Korean gaming houses and I hadn’t thought about it that way before. Its not really brought up a lot in the forums, but no one could ever set up a Korean style team house in NA. The number of contract-less, under aged players would be a problem for most child labor laws in most states. The lack of pay for a number of players would also be an issue and it is legally questionable to have someone work for you with the potential of pay at a later date. I know a couple of firms in my state that were called out for “internships” that were just unpaid work, which is highly illegal in this state.
It is an issue that can be overcome, but not with the “practice harder” argument. The issue is more complex than that, though some seem to think it isn’t.
if that is the case (slaves), the scene has been around for a decade and its hard to believe some people are just realizing such issues. rather, isnt it because some foreigners aren't willing to go to korea for such harsh work environment with little pay? then say the money isn't worth the efforts.
child labor laws, unpaid work, etc is a separate topic worth its own thread and its something that has been discussed here and there. kespa is known for their 15+ hours days, i'm 100% sure these topics have come up.
i see nothing wrong with kids playing, "training" for hours on end as prodigy musicians do, kid athletes in all fields, as long as they're treated right. i dont know if sc2 scene is treating their kids right or not, we can speculate i guess.
The issue of children practicing to much for music and sports is always a topic for discussion in the US and is the subject of some pretty tense debates. Child prodigy musicians do practice for numerous hours, but they don’t “work” for anyone while they do it. They are sent to schools to be educated while they focus on their craft, but the school does not make a profit off of the student’s efforts. Most of the high end music schools are non profits. The Korean team houses are different, because they are a for profit industry that uses the younger, newer players an practice partners for their star players. So the star player and team are gaining be benefits from the unpaid efforts of the younger, newer players that are not paid or paid very little.
Culturally, in North America, the concept of a sponsored, competitive, professional team using poorly paid minors to train their star players would not be acceptable.
Also, the idea that foreign players won’t take a large pay cut to work more hours and live in another country where they speak the language should not be shocking to anyone. If the teams can make it so they don’t lose anything from doing it, then I would say the players should go. But not if they are going to lose 1/3 of their income(in idra’s case)
On March 21 2013 03:03 jinorazi wrote: i always thought progaming is still like amateur musicians. you love what you do, you do it even if means little pay, you do it because you dream of going big, and to go big you sacrifice a lot for the opportunities.
then people are saying "give me good environment then i'll think about it", "paycut? no thanks". to train in korea means you want to be the best, if you want your easy money gtfo and stay an amateur.
double standards i think, some people think the market is like an actual sport. everyone has to sacrifice a little to make this esports happen, people have no idea how small this market is. its bigger than before, but its no mainstream (korea is the closest thing)
the term "pro" was mostly related with Kespa players for me because of how hard it was to get in, how much work and sacrifice it required. now everyone thinks whoever can win a tournament or stream with big numbers are pros.
the scene has become so fucking spoiled.
I think it's a really bad comparison with amateur musicians. If a musician works all of his or her life and doesn't make it, there are numerous fall-back opportunities. They can teach music at a primary school level. They can give individual lessons. They can also find small playing gigs throughout their lifetime.
If you don't make it as a programer, then you're pretty much washed up. Instead of going to school (and this includes secondary for 15 year old Kespa players who play for 12 hours a day) to gain marketable skills, you spent your youth playing video games. There is no market for retired programers outside of casting, and there are fewer slots for casters than there are for active progamers.
So what we're seeing right now is incredibly interesting-- we're slowly seeing the definition of what is a Western progamer. This will be completely different from what Koreans see as progamers because Western progamers are almost uniformly older than their Korean counterparts. Success will ultimately be based on a balance of marketability and skill. Sponsors pay the bills and salaries, and they don't care how good a player is, they just care about how those players represent their brand and increase brand recognition. Look at all of the Western teams which just cut a whole bunch of Koreans while maintaining their Western core. After all, the most important thing is finding a sustainable business model which can support a healthy international scene.
isn't that how it is with athletes? they still go to college, get a degree so they can fall back on. some prefer to skip it and go pro after highschool. its their choice as it should be with progamers too. some progamers are students also and the progaming team should set up a program to insure their player's future if they already have not. the esports scene has created plenty of jobs for retired progamers.
It depends on what you mean by 'pro.' Earlier you said that it used to be reserved for Kespa players who sacrifice everything to hope to one day join a team. Based on what Western players who have trained in Korea have said in interviews, those teamhouses basically have 15 year old kids living there on no salary living as practice slaves who hope to one day get their break and make it onto the proleague team. That's going to be flat-out unacceptable in the West as these players have nothing to fall back on.
I also wouldn't say anything about their choice or not. Adults who don't have much of an interest in this player's future are pressuring a teenage kid into making long-term sacrifices for the opportunity to potentially get better and make it. It's really hard to say that it's their free choice when it's very binary. Everyone in this community seems to praise sacrifice and hard work, but I think many who say this are too young to realize the long-term consequences of these sacrifices. However, the more I hear about kespa gaming houses, the more it sounds like Eastern-bloc Olympic training facilities where winning is placed on a pedestal far above an athlete's future.
That is a really good analogy to the Korean gaming houses and I hadn’t thought about it that way before. Its not really brought up a lot in the forums, but no one could ever set up a Korean style team house in NA. The number of contract-less, under aged players would be a problem for most child labor laws in most states. The lack of pay for a number of players would also be an issue and it is legally questionable to have someone work for you with the potential of pay at a later date. I know a couple of firms in my state that were called out for “internships” that were just unpaid work, which is highly illegal in this state.
It is an issue that can be overcome, but not with the “practice harder” argument. The issue is more complex than that, though some seem to think it isn’t.
if that is the case (slaves), the scene has been around for a decade and its hard to believe some people are just realizing such issues. rather, isnt it because some foreigners aren't willing to go to korea for such harsh work environment with less pay? then say the money isn't worth the efforts. (if they dont think its worth it, thats fine but it feels like they want the cake and eat it too)
child labor laws, unpaid work, etc is a separate topic worth its own thread. kespa practice regime is known for their long hours days, i'm 100% sure these topics have come up. (i'd hope kespa put in standards on how these kids are treated)
i see nothing wrong with kids playing, training for hours on end as prodigy musicians do, kid athletes in all fields, kids training as singer/entertainer, as long as they're treated right. i dont know if esports scene in general is treating their kids right or not, we can speculate i guess.
While it has been around for a decade, it's really hard to find out about these things as a more mainstream Westerner. The language barrier is a very big deal, and Kespa hasn't actually cared about a foreign audience before SC2. Even now, they only started producing English content a few months ago. Our only glimpse into this world is through interviews with Western gamers who have lived it first hand-- most recently I'm referring to Huk's interview from MLG.
I have to agree that I wouldn't have problems with kids playing for hours and hours on end with one caveat: if they were independent of a team. If an independent gamer wanted to ladder for 10 hours a day, more power to him or her. Go show up to code A qualifiers and make it in. However, there is a big difference between independent play and guided at the hands of a coach. In actual sports, state-level high school athletic associations and the NCAA have strict rules which govern how long people are allowed to train because these associations have an explicit goal of furthering the advancement of the individual athlete. Kespa is different because their main goal is to make money and generate brand exposure for their sponsors.
On March 22 2013 11:58 ShiroKaisen wrote: Got a chance to interview him for EG's website - he talks his history in Brood War, his impressions of Star2, EG-TL's problems, and going forward.
Park sounds super organized. No doubt he knows how to win. The question is whether the team members will buy into what is required to win at the highest levels. One wonders about a clash of cultures, on the one hand a culture of training to be truly great and on the other the western culture. Hopefully it goes really well. Great experiment anyway.
On March 22 2013 15:00 jmbthirteen wrote: you guys ever think, that since proleague is on a break right now, the schedule might not have been implemented yet?
Doesn't make sense to me for Park to waste weeks of potential time on an improved schedule.
On March 21 2013 03:46 niteReloaded wrote: I agree with him about Medivac Boosters, exactly the philosophy that is missing in SC2. There has to be a drawback to using the boost, it would make the game so much more interesting.
pick one: - make medivacs unable to unload/load troops when boosted. - make medivacs unable to heal while boosted (or healing is 50% slower (or some other percentage)) - make them lose some HP for every boosted second (some sort of overheating explanation)
You see how great situations it would cause?
I would much rather see a design change in medivac to a point which they cannot load up the ground crew so fast. The unloading is fine in the way that troops are deployed from the medivac one by one, but the problem seems to be that Terran can use the Medivac boost to pick up all of their ground crew instantly and get away with it. Make it so that medivacs can't load up everything instantly.
On March 21 2013 03:46 niteReloaded wrote: I agree with him about Medivac Boosters, exactly the philosophy that is missing in SC2. There has to be a drawback to using the boost, it would make the game so much more interesting.
pick one: - make medivacs unable to unload/load troops when boosted. - make medivacs unable to heal while boosted (or healing is 50% slower (or some other percentage)) - make them lose some HP for every boosted second (some sort of overheating explanation)
You see how great situations it would cause?
I would much rather see a design change in medivac to a point which they cannot load up the ground crew so fast. The unloading is fine in the way that troops are deployed from the medivac one by one, but the problem seems to be that Terran can use the Medivac boost to pick up all of their ground crew instantly and get away with it. Make it so that medivacs can't load up everything instantly.
People will simply target the medivac. Pros will target your medivac till it's near death and wait for you to pick a move: Load n' Die or Just Die.
EPT
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