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On September 25 2012 13:17 goswser wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 13:15 sathin wrote:
i love how now shes trying to bring DA down with her i feel bad for him in this predicament if he really was just trying to see if he could compete against top names then again skimming code A you would think he knew... idk i feel bad for him no sympathy for her i feel she cheated a lot of people and is now throwing DA as far under the bus as she can just out of spite of being caught Veralynn's responses sound pretty honest compared to DA. Read the last few pages.
I don't know man. I want to believe that she's not scamming people again with her latest posts, but I'm having a very difficult time only 3 people ever bought her coaching, and only 5 hours total. Last year I ran AceLessons with a friend, and the sales volume for poorly marketed coaches who were not female and not GM even surpassed that volume... not to mention she was a featured coach on z33k as well if I recalled correctly, and there's only 6 of those ( http://www.z33k.com/games/starcraft2/coach ) so it's not like there's a deluge of coaches over there.
Add that to the part where someone claimed to have purchased $100 of coaching just yesterday (which would be $5 less than the sum total of all coaching she claims was ever purchased), and I start to get suspicious...
edit - Personally I'm finding DeathAngel more believable than Vera at the moment...
edit2 - Ok apparently that $100 guy was trolling....
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first of all suing probably wouldn't be worth it considering court costs, the difficulty of people being in multiple countries (probably). what you could do is contact the police and say you want to press charges but once again considering the difficulties unless someone is actually in ireland or romania who got scammed its deifnately not worth it and still its almost guaranteed not worth it time wise.
edit: i think. I'm not a lawyer.
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On September 25 2012 13:16 MMDollar wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 13:13 veralynn wrote:There are 2 things that I did wrong - One financial and one moral/ethical. I can rectify the financial situation by issuing refunds ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/zhCve.png) Those who received refunds can confirm the above should they wish. I cannot fully rectify or answer the moral/ethical questions - I have done what I see is all I can do retrospectively by giving the entire truth of the situation. Again, I do not intend on responding unless it is necessary. Yea refund now, when the whole SC2 community saw how shit this situation is.
it's still better than just doing nothing at all, shows she's willing to "fix" things or somewhat regret it
she could have just disappeared...
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On September 25 2012 13:21 Tewks44 wrote:
As much as I love a good public humiliation, I think the attention should be focused on DeathAngel. While what Vera did was certainly wrong and damaging, particularly to the female gamer community, she's posted proof that she's reimbursed the organizations that gave out prizes to DeathAngel, playing under her identity. We can boo and hiss at her all we want, but it's done, and to be honest she probably handled the (undeniably shitty) situation as best she could given the circumstances she put herself in.
DeathAngel has been acting very childish about this, and seems to deflect any kind of blame to females and the general SC2 community. I'm not going to bother quote mining, but I'm sure people who have been keeping up with this thread have seen his oft repeated line "never trust females." However, this isn't what bothers me the most about how he's responded. He seems to completely neglect the fact he won this money under a false pretence. I don't think he owes Vera any money, because she apparently willingly gave him money for a clearly defined service, that he performed for her. However, should he reimburse Vera for the money she paid to the organizations he helped defraud? Should they split the costs 50/50? Does he actually owe anything? In my opinion, these are the questions we should be asking.
I for one am not all that interested in giving either of them a pass on this.
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Weekly drama is so nice and makes my heart happy :D
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On September 25 2012 13:16 EtherealDeath wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 13:13 veralynn wrote:There are 2 things that I did wrong - One financial and one moral/ethical. I can rectify the financial situation by issuing refunds Those who received refunds can confirm the above should they wish. I cannot fully rectify or answer the moral/ethical questions - I have done what I see is all I can do retrospectively by giving the entire truth of the situation. Again, I do not intend on responding unless it is necessary. And this guy? Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 07:16 Shantastic wrote:
I guess it was a mistake buying her GM Zerg 12-lesson $100 value pack yesterday, then :S Is he lying about paying $100, because I don't see a $100 refund in that list.
Shan was trolling. Ignore that post.
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On September 25 2012 13:22 ROOTFayth wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 13:16 MMDollar wrote:On September 25 2012 13:13 veralynn wrote:There are 2 things that I did wrong - One financial and one moral/ethical. I can rectify the financial situation by issuing refunds Those who received refunds can confirm the above should they wish. I cannot fully rectify or answer the moral/ethical questions - I have done what I see is all I can do retrospectively by giving the entire truth of the situation. Again, I do not intend on responding unless it is necessary. Yea refund now, when the whole SC2 community saw how shit this situation is. it's still better than just doing nothing at all, shows she's willing to "fix" things or somewhat regret it she could have just disappeared...
nvm
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On September 25 2012 13:22 ROOTFayth wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 13:16 MMDollar wrote:On September 25 2012 13:13 veralynn wrote:There are 2 things that I did wrong - One financial and one moral/ethical. I can rectify the financial situation by issuing refunds Those who received refunds can confirm the above should they wish. I cannot fully rectify or answer the moral/ethical questions - I have done what I see is all I can do retrospectively by giving the entire truth of the situation. Again, I do not intend on responding unless it is necessary. Yea refund now, when the whole SC2 community saw how shit this situation is. it's still better than just doing nothing at all, shows she's willing to "fix" things or somewhat regret it she could have just disappeared...
The damage that this situation does to eSports is more than a 300 $ coaching lessons so forgive me for not giving a crap about that.
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Blazinghand
United States25560 Posts
On September 25 2012 13:22 MstrJinbo wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 13:21 Tewks44 wrote:
As much as I love a good public humiliation, I think the attention should be focused on DeathAngel. While what Vera did was certainly wrong and damaging, particularly to the female gamer community, she's posted proof that she's reimbursed the organizations that gave out prizes to DeathAngel, playing under her identity. We can boo and hiss at her all we want, but it's done, and to be honest she probably handled the (undeniably shitty) situation as best she could given the circumstances she put herself in.
DeathAngel has been acting very childish about this, and seems to deflect any kind of blame to females and the general SC2 community. I'm not going to bother quote mining, but I'm sure people who have been keeping up with this thread have seen his oft repeated line "never trust females." However, this isn't what bothers me the most about how he's responded. He seems to completely neglect the fact he won this money under a false pretence. I don't think he owes Vera any money, because she apparently willingly gave him money for a clearly defined service, that he performed for her. However, should he reimburse Vera for the money she paid to the organizations he helped defraud? Should they split the costs 50/50? Does he actually owe anything? In my opinion, these are the questions we should be asking. I for one am not all that interested in giving either of them a pass on this.
I concur that there should be no passes given out.
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United States23455 Posts
Guys, stop being mean to DeathAngel. He never said he was an Angel. He's a bad guy. A rebel. A DEATH Angel. He's sorry, guys. Leave him alone, man.
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On September 25 2012 13:22 ROOTFayth wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 13:16 MMDollar wrote:On September 25 2012 13:13 veralynn wrote:There are 2 things that I did wrong - One financial and one moral/ethical. I can rectify the financial situation by issuing refunds Those who received refunds can confirm the above should they wish. I cannot fully rectify or answer the moral/ethical questions - I have done what I see is all I can do retrospectively by giving the entire truth of the situation. Again, I do not intend on responding unless it is necessary. Yea refund now, when the whole SC2 community saw how shit this situation is. it's still better than just doing nothing at all, shows she's willing to "fix" things or somewhat regret it she could have just disappeared...
Or she's smart enough to see there's still a way to salvage the situation.
Just like the pathological liar she is she'll always try and continue the charade because to her it's a zero sum game.
We all know that one guy who piles on the lies and even when he's found out he tries to pile on more to try and salvage the situation.
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On September 25 2012 12:54 veralynn wrote:
First of all, I'm glad I got caught and I can finally end this - My intentions were to help grow e-sports which I achieved through running Z33K.TV, but this has obviously turned out horribly wrong and has accomplished the complete opposite to what my intentions were:
I'm a masters Zerg player and needed coaching to help me to get to Grandmasters. I contacted a website for a coach and was put in touch with Deathangel. However, instead of coaching, we discussed that he'd boost my account to Grandmasters to give me that initial boost to help me.
Once it got to grandmasters, he continued to play the account for me regularly to keep bonus pool down/keep it active. While this happened, I put up a coaching profile to coach people. As I had never coached people, I did numerous hours of free coaching on my stream. This was known to Deathangel.
While this happened, Deathangel continued to play the account and I tried to do some coaching etc. In total, I had 3 paid coaching students. Any feedback on coaching I received was from free coaching and NOT paid coaching. I have since refunded those students and apologise if it was not helpful.
As people requested to see me stream, I asked Deathangel to stream on the account for me. He streamed regularly but charged $20-$30 an hour for each stream he did. Outside of streaming, each game that Deathangel played, he charged $3 per game, and as he regularly played for me, he did mini-discounts.
When I was invited to play any event - Millenium Girl Tournament & AGL Invitational - that he played, he took the entire prize, which I have also refunded to the organisers - I am sorry for this being under false pretenses. I have refunded the money that I never received as I gave it to DeathAngel.
We subsequently agreed to play Showmatches and he was very happy to do them - I gave him 100% of the prizes. I did not invoice SixPoolGaming for the showmatch against Sjow or Cytoplasm and so never received any money from them - However, I sent the relevant prize to DeathAngel immediately. I never received the MilleniumTV Tarson Showmatch money (yet), but I have already sent him the prize for that.
The entire thing was a terrible idea, and I apologise to all people who were hurt by this.
I am especially sorry to Z33K.TV and Z33K.Com as I grew the casting organisation with the casters and am sorry to leave it. Rifkin, Badfatpanda, Pengwin, and the rest - You guys were so close to me and this spiralled out of control. Z33K.TV grew to cast Dreamhack Valencia, TSL Qualifiers, Pokerstrategy.com League and run its own $1,000 Team league and If I had stopped it earlier, perhaps we could've continued on to grow it more - I apologise for misleading you like this.
I am happy to step away from my position as head of Z33K.TV and will happily assist in any handover procedures necessary.
I am also sorry to sixpoolgaming.com for any damage caused to their reputation - they are a great site and helped me so much and I apologise to them.
What I have said here is 100% the truth from my perspective, and thus I do not intend to make any follow up posts regarding this - I am happy to step away from the Starcraft 2 Community in a professional capacity and bid you all farewell.
Well shit just hit the fan... Now I don't even know what to think.. black list both?? I don't know, I am starting to loose my patience and my caring for this subject.
However I do want to point out on thing which I was curious about. You mentioned you refunded the 3 people you coached personally. However you made no mention of refunding money to anyone that paid (sixpoolgaming I think?) for your video packs, someone around page 30 mentioned that just yesterday he spent $100 on a replay/coaching pack of yours that had something like 12 videos. Anyway not sure about the details, but I am sure you can look it up. Are you going to refund that money? I am assuming it is sixpoolgaming that has it.. I dunno.
Actually here is the quote:
On September 25 2012 11:41 iHirO wrote:At least one person is out of pocket: Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 07:16 Shantastic wrote:
I guess it was a mistake buying her GM Zerg 12-lesson $100 value pack yesterday, then :S
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I still want to know, if they have had sex with each other.
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On September 25 2012 13:21 Angry.Zerg wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 13:17 goswser wrote:On September 25 2012 13:15 sathin wrote:
i love how now shes trying to bring DA down with her i feel bad for him in this predicament if he really was just trying to see if he could compete against top names then again skimming code A you would think he knew... idk i feel bad for him no sympathy for her i feel she cheated a lot of people and is now throwing DA as far under the bus as she can just out of spite of being caught Veralynn's responses sound pretty honest compared to DA. Read the last few pages. And you are going to forgive her?
Forgiveness isn't the issue. Considering she paid everyone back, resigned from everything, and deleted all her information, along with saying she isn't going to be involved in the professional starcraft scene anymore, I don't see the point of focusing the attention on her is. She can't be punished more if she paid everyone back and left the scene can she?
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On September 25 2012 13:24 MMDollar wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 13:22 ROOTFayth wrote:On September 25 2012 13:16 MMDollar wrote:On September 25 2012 13:13 veralynn wrote:There are 2 things that I did wrong - One financial and one moral/ethical. I can rectify the financial situation by issuing refunds Those who received refunds can confirm the above should they wish. I cannot fully rectify or answer the moral/ethical questions - I have done what I see is all I can do retrospectively by giving the entire truth of the situation. Again, I do not intend on responding unless it is necessary. Yea refund now, when the whole SC2 community saw how shit this situation is. it's still better than just doing nothing at all, shows she's willing to "fix" things or somewhat regret it she could have just disappeared... The damage that this situation does to eSports is more than a 300 $ coaching lessons so forgive me for not giving a crap about that.
Agree, online tournaments and qualifications credibility may be damaged by this people. It's a lot bigger than most people think.
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On September 25 2012 13:20 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 13:17 DecisionTheory wrote:On September 25 2012 13:15 GreyKnight wrote:On September 25 2012 13:12 DecisionTheory wrote:
Legally speaking both of them could be indited for crimes including fraud.
I would sue them if I was actually a part of this situation meh, i wouldn't sue them unless you plan on the judge judy sort of thing. not worth the effort. No. Depending on the details (didn't look at how much money they scammed) it could actually be worth while. Not much effort really, they have alr. ady both confessed almost as funny as this drama. you have no idea what you are talking about, do you?
No, I actually dont :D
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On September 25 2012 13:21 Angry.Zerg wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2012 13:17 goswser wrote:On September 25 2012 13:15 sathin wrote:
i love how now shes trying to bring DA down with her i feel bad for him in this predicament if he really was just trying to see if he could compete against top names then again skimming code A you would think he knew... idk i feel bad for him no sympathy for her i feel she cheated a lot of people and is now throwing DA as far under the bus as she can just out of spite of being caught Veralynn's responses sound pretty honest compared to DA. Read the last few pages. And you are going to forgive her?
What does forgiveness have to do with anything? At least she's tried to rectify the situation by reimbursing people. Meanwhile DA is just whining. They're both at fault, but when one party tries to fix the situation while the other does nothing at all but make excuses, then hell yes, the former is going to sound invariably more honest than the latter. She honestly could've just sauntered off and disappeared into the black hole that's the internet, and nobody could've done anything about it.
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On September 25 2012 13:25 Fionn wrote:
Guys, stop being mean to DeathAngel. He never said he was an Angel. He's a bad guy. A rebel. A DEATH Angel. He's sorry, guys. Leave him alone, man.
HE WAS SEDUCED BY AN EVIL SUCCUBUS
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On September 25 2012 13:26 Perscienter wrote:
I still want to know, if they have had sex with each other.
are they within reasonable geographical distance?
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EPT
