With that logic the game would get rid of alot of the micro that people have to do nowadays. Just hit the scatter button and marines split themselves against banelings, MMM gets out of the aoe range of collosus, lings can avoid the aoe of tanks, storms hit only a few units at once, etc. Adding a scatter button would be basically the same thing as adding a micro bot like this.
And to those who argued earlier that terran was fine at the highest skill level and used Taeja as their example, I tell you, terran is imba at the highest skill level. Just look at the micro of that bot, way over 3000 apm! I say nerf terran to hell! /endsarcasm
Do you see the flaw in your rguments? If you force every terran to have micro like this bot or the comparatively "easy" micro that taeja does, you can just more or less remove terran from the game because nobody will ever reach that skill level. So a buff to terran or nerf to other races has to either affect ALL skill levels or all skill levels up to taeja's for the changes to have any significance to the matchup. But what changes can be made to prevent the matchup from being imbalanced at any level and to stop all of these people from whining when the matchup is being fixed?
I'd rather just make other races harder with a higher skill cap. Terran micro can be mindlessly easy sometimes but it's always necessary. I just don't see why other races can't have similar mechanics.
I think Protoss have a lot of good micro potential that are not being used. Mostly because they might be way too intensive.
For example, unlike Terran armies which are very homogeneous in this respect, Protoss balls are a mix of different range and speed units. When attacking or defending Protoss probably has the biggest burden of correct positioning, something which always messes up whenever you move. Always keeping zealots in front sentries slightly behind (also positioning sentries more efficiently so as you cover more of your army with GS) and flanking with them stalkers. Making sure your HT are split and not too far behind.
Most games you will never see that constant level of attention because it can become way too taxing. But as time goes on I think Protoss players will eventually start making these micro changes to be even more effective. Also a lot of people underestimate the skill and accuracy needed to place efficient FFs, since, unlike fungals, FFs can work against a Protoss if you're not careful.
Dunno, it just feels like people only consider the marine splitting for banelings and nothing else when it comes to intensive micro. I know at Diamond level marine splitting is really important for terrans bcs banelings/fungal/storm are stupidly powerful when you can't micro well, but when you consider play at the highest level I think Protoss positioning and micro are severely underrated (especially in terms of potential micro).
Protoss doesn't need to do any of that and they can win 90% of the time. The only time control comes into play as protoss is when the other player is either a) coming at you with ~equal forces or b) coming at you with stronger forces. Terran CONSTANTLY has to micro due to the fragility of their units compared to the other races, even in situations where they're ahead. As Terran, there is rare a "macro" win where, regardless of the units being thrown away, theA+move and macro of the Terran is overwhelming. It's always using those few units with good macro and micro that wins games, ALWAYS.
Yes and if Terrans, like TaeJa, switch to Protoss they will never lose a game ever again. People need to get a grip on reality. Terran micro can be intense, especially vs. Z on creep, but it's not magnitudes of order better.
I agree that Terrans have a problem with Zergs in certain situations based on balance, but it's not this crazy imbalance which all these plat/dia Terrans think it is.
Actually, if Taeja did play Protoss or Zerg for that matter, he might just break the balance of this game ^_^
Not really, Taeja is just mechanically solid, with great fundamentals and control. He wouldn't be able to use these natural attributes to his advantage with the other non-Terran races
Actually, regardless of which race Taeja plays, he will be a very solid player. He will be good completely regardless of race. He will be able to use those same fundamentals to elevate any race to appear broken, just like he is doing with terran.
He'd be solid regardless of his, but you can't take his attributes that make him great (especially his control) and say they're going to benefit him as much with the other races.
MC has sick fundamentals but you don't see these in evidence as much because of how Protoss functions and people label him a timing attack one-trick pony
Look at PartinG, who has the best army control of all protoss players (at least against terran). He wins games entirely because of his army control. HerO should also be considered in that category as well (I can't remember the exact game, but it was on antiga shipyard, where he had a 55 kill immortal and 30 kill immortal against zerg).
Yes, but Taeja, MMA, MKP, and MVP all play Zerg and Protoss at their MMR on their main accounts. Meaning they beat top 16 GM players on the Korean server consistently when off-racing. (Name any other Zerg or Protoss pro that has streamed off-racing with these types of wins.)
I don't care what level their Terran is, to be able to do this with all 3 races demonstrates their extreme skill. Given the fact that nearly all Koreans in GM play at least 6 hours a day (most likely a lot more, especially as we broach the top 20) with their one race, it's truly amazing that these Terrans can waltz in and off-race and beat players of this caliber and this work ethic.
This certainly strengthens the argument that the best Terrans, if they spent even more time on Zerg or Protoss, Would Indeed break the balance of the game. Imagine if any of them switched completely to Zerg or Protoss.
On August 19 2012 04:15 plogamer wrote: Broodlings are too good against tanks. Watching Vortix vs Supernova and other Terrans, today, I saw a tech switch of broods cause tanks to friendlyfire their own units to death. This allowed him to turn the game around from some really big deficits.
It's not a new, unknown fact, but I think it goes unnoticed and underrated. If we could have tanks that didn't do splash damage (or maybe less of it), then broodlings would be less of a threat and infestors would be zoned out with targetfire, allowing vikings to push back broodlords. It would still require skill, ie, not a-move.
It would be a buff for mech in all matchups (which we sorely need) and it would be a nerf to infestors in TvZ.
I wish Blizzard would try it out on their balance maps one day. Maybe as an upgrade?
you make me giggle
Can your biased zerg brain even consider the possibility of not making broodlords an automatic mind-control on seige tanks?
Wait Tanks that don't do splash or less splash? Then what's the point of having siege tank as a unit....
He wants no FRIENDLY splash. So, for example, Zerglings run into Marines, which usually works out fairly well because Tank Splash. But without the Marines taking damge from the splash.
Also making any kind of drop on top of tanks worthless.(in ALL matchups.)
It always eluded me why Tanks have such a huge Friendly Fire splash whereas the Collosus has none.
Tanks should do less friendly splash because it makes free units like broodlings much stronger than they should be. It forces the un-seige, which grants a run in of lings and then it's game.
I'd rather just make other races harder with a higher skill cap. Terran micro can be mindlessly easy sometimes but it's always necessary. I just don't see why other races can't have similar mechanics.
I think Protoss have a lot of good micro potential that are not being used. Mostly because they might be way too intensive.
For example, unlike Terran armies which are very homogeneous in this respect, Protoss balls are a mix of different range and speed units. When attacking or defending Protoss probably has the biggest burden of correct positioning, something which always messes up whenever you move. Always keeping zealots in front sentries slightly behind (also positioning sentries more efficiently so as you cover more of your army with GS) and flanking with them stalkers. Making sure your HT are split and not too far behind.
Most games you will never see that constant level of attention because it can become way too taxing. But as time goes on I think Protoss players will eventually start making these micro changes to be even more effective. Also a lot of people underestimate the skill and accuracy needed to place efficient FFs, since, unlike fungals, FFs can work against a Protoss if you're not careful.
Dunno, it just feels like people only consider the marine splitting for banelings and nothing else when it comes to intensive micro. I know at Diamond level marine splitting is really important for terrans bcs banelings/fungal/storm are stupidly powerful when you can't micro well, but when you consider play at the highest level I think Protoss positioning and micro are severely underrated (especially in terms of potential micro).
Protoss doesn't need to do any of that and they can win 90% of the time. The only time control comes into play as protoss is when the other player is either a) coming at you with ~equal forces or b) coming at you with stronger forces. Terran CONSTANTLY has to micro due to the fragility of their units compared to the other races, even in situations where they're ahead. As Terran, there is rare a "macro" win where, regardless of the units being thrown away, theA+move and macro of the Terran is overwhelming. It's always using those few units with good macro and micro that wins games, ALWAYS.
Yes and if Terrans, like TaeJa, switch to Protoss they will never lose a game ever again. People need to get a grip on reality. Terran micro can be intense, especially vs. Z on creep, but it's not magnitudes of order better.
I agree that Terrans have a problem with Zergs in certain situations based on balance, but it's not this crazy imbalance which all these plat/dia Terrans think it is.
Actually, if Taeja did play Protoss or Zerg for that matter, he might just break the balance of this game ^_^
Not really, Taeja is just mechanically solid, with great fundamentals and control. He wouldn't be able to use these natural attributes to his advantage with the other non-Terran races
Actually, regardless of which race Taeja plays, he will be a very solid player. He will be good completely regardless of race. He will be able to use those same fundamentals to elevate any race to appear broken, just like he is doing with terran.
He'd be solid regardless of his, but you can't take his attributes that make him great (especially his control) and say they're going to benefit him as much with the other races.
MC has sick fundamentals but you don't see these in evidence as much because of how Protoss functions and people label him a timing attack one-trick pony
Look at PartinG, who has the best army control of all protoss players (at least against terran). He wins games entirely because of his army control. HerO should also be considered in that category as well (I can't remember the exact game, but it was on antiga shipyard, where he had a 55 kill immortal and 30 kill immortal against zerg).
Yes, but Taeja, MMA, MKP, and MVP all play Zerg and Protoss at their MMR on their main accounts. Meaning they beat top 16 GM players on the Korean server consistently when off-racing. (Name any other Zerg or Protoss pro that has streamed off-racing with these types of wins.)
I don't care what level their Terran is, to be able to do this with all 3 races demonstrates their extreme skill. Given the fact that nearly all Koreans in GM play at least 6 hours a day (most likely a lot more, especially as we broach the top 20) with their one race, it's truly amazing that these Terrans can waltz in and off-race and beat players of this caliber and this work ethic.
This certainly strengthens the argument that the best Terrans, if they spent even more time on Zerg or Protoss, Would Indeed break the balance of the game. Imagine if any of them switched completely to Zerg or Protoss.
Blizzard would have to make some balance changes.
If PRO players could so easily get better results (and therefore more money) by switching to a different race, they would do it in a heartbeat.
The fact that they haven't should tell you something.
On August 19 2012 04:15 plogamer wrote: Broodlings are too good against tanks. Watching Vortix vs Supernova and other Terrans, today, I saw a tech switch of broods cause tanks to friendlyfire their own units to death. This allowed him to turn the game around from some really big deficits.
It's not a new, unknown fact, but I think it goes unnoticed and underrated. If we could have tanks that didn't do splash damage (or maybe less of it), then broodlings would be less of a threat and infestors would be zoned out with targetfire, allowing vikings to push back broodlords. It would still require skill, ie, not a-move.
It would be a buff for mech in all matchups (which we sorely need) and it would be a nerf to infestors in TvZ.
I wish Blizzard would try it out on their balance maps one day. Maybe as an upgrade?
They just should give tanks an hold fire or target fire only command.
On August 19 2012 21:16 malaan wrote: Unless you are tip top grandmaster at the very least you should not be complaining about balance this much. If folks in here spending hours play-testing balance maps and whinging in forums that Blizzard probably laugh about instead of actually playing the game / improving....
it's not about balance, it is about making an units more useful, tank are really weak right now, don't need to be a grandmaster to say that....
I'd rather just make other races harder with a higher skill cap. Terran micro can be mindlessly easy sometimes but it's always necessary. I just don't see why other races can't have similar mechanics.
I think Protoss have a lot of good micro potential that are not being used. Mostly because they might be way too intensive.
For example, unlike Terran armies which are very homogeneous in this respect, Protoss balls are a mix of different range and speed units. When attacking or defending Protoss probably has the biggest burden of correct positioning, something which always messes up whenever you move. Always keeping zealots in front sentries slightly behind (also positioning sentries more efficiently so as you cover more of your army with GS) and flanking with them stalkers. Making sure your HT are split and not too far behind.
Most games you will never see that constant level of attention because it can become way too taxing. But as time goes on I think Protoss players will eventually start making these micro changes to be even more effective. Also a lot of people underestimate the skill and accuracy needed to place efficient FFs, since, unlike fungals, FFs can work against a Protoss if you're not careful.
Dunno, it just feels like people only consider the marine splitting for banelings and nothing else when it comes to intensive micro. I know at Diamond level marine splitting is really important for terrans bcs banelings/fungal/storm are stupidly powerful when you can't micro well, but when you consider play at the highest level I think Protoss positioning and micro are severely underrated (especially in terms of potential micro).
Protoss doesn't need to do any of that and they can win 90% of the time. The only time control comes into play as protoss is when the other player is either a) coming at you with ~equal forces or b) coming at you with stronger forces. Terran CONSTANTLY has to micro due to the fragility of their units compared to the other races, even in situations where they're ahead. As Terran, there is rare a "macro" win where, regardless of the units being thrown away, theA+move and macro of the Terran is overwhelming. It's always using those few units with good macro and micro that wins games, ALWAYS.
Yes and if Terrans, like TaeJa, switch to Protoss they will never lose a game ever again. People need to get a grip on reality. Terran micro can be intense, especially vs. Z on creep, but it's not magnitudes of order better.
I agree that Terrans have a problem with Zergs in certain situations based on balance, but it's not this crazy imbalance which all these plat/dia Terrans think it is.
Actually, if Taeja did play Protoss or Zerg for that matter, he might just break the balance of this game ^_^
Not really, Taeja is just mechanically solid, with great fundamentals and control. He wouldn't be able to use these natural attributes to his advantage with the other non-Terran races
Actually, regardless of which race Taeja plays, he will be a very solid player. He will be good completely regardless of race. He will be able to use those same fundamentals to elevate any race to appear broken, just like he is doing with terran.
He'd be solid regardless of his, but you can't take his attributes that make him great (especially his control) and say they're going to benefit him as much with the other races.
MC has sick fundamentals but you don't see these in evidence as much because of how Protoss functions and people label him a timing attack one-trick pony
Look at PartinG, who has the best army control of all protoss players (at least against terran). He wins games entirely because of his army control. HerO should also be considered in that category as well (I can't remember the exact game, but it was on antiga shipyard, where he had a 55 kill immortal and 30 kill immortal against zerg).
Yes, but Taeja, MMA, MKP, and MVP all play Zerg and Protoss at their MMR on their main accounts. Meaning they beat top 16 GM players on the Korean server consistently when off-racing. (Name any other Zerg or Protoss pro that has streamed off-racing with these types of wins.)
I don't care what level their Terran is, to be able to do this with all 3 races demonstrates their extreme skill. Given the fact that nearly all Koreans in GM play at least 6 hours a day (most likely a lot more, especially as we broach the top 20) with their one race, it's truly amazing that these Terrans can waltz in and off-race and beat players of this caliber and this work ethic.
This certainly strengthens the argument that the best Terrans, if they spent even more time on Zerg or Protoss, Would Indeed break the balance of the game. Imagine if any of them switched completely to Zerg or Protoss.
Blizzard would have to make some balance changes.
MC for example offraces all of the time. He is cited in some interviews as having some really impressive zerg play. I wonder if that has anything to with the fact he is one of the best PvZ players? Did you know almost every top player offraces all of the time? Yep, it's true, really good players are just straight up good at the game and can play any race. Just because you only know that the top terrans do it does not mean that the other top players of the other races do not do it, it means you haven't looked to see if the others do it (hint: they do).
On August 19 2012 04:15 plogamer wrote: Broodlings are too good against tanks. Watching Vortix vs Supernova and other Terrans, today, I saw a tech switch of broods cause tanks to friendlyfire their own units to death. This allowed him to turn the game around from some really big deficits.
It's not a new, unknown fact, but I think it goes unnoticed and underrated. If we could have tanks that didn't do splash damage (or maybe less of it), then broodlings would be less of a threat and infestors would be zoned out with targetfire, allowing vikings to push back broodlords. It would still require skill, ie, not a-move.
It would be a buff for mech in all matchups (which we sorely need) and it would be a nerf to infestors in TvZ.
I wish Blizzard would try it out on their balance maps one day. Maybe as an upgrade?
you make me giggle
Can your biased zerg brain even consider the possibility of not making broodlords an automatic mind-control on seige tanks?
Wait Tanks that don't do splash or less splash? Then what's the point of having siege tank as a unit....
He wants no FRIENDLY splash. So, for example, Zerglings run into Marines, which usually works out fairly well because Tank Splash. But without the Marines taking damge from the splash.
Also making any kind of drop on top of tanks worthless.(in ALL matchups.)
It always eluded me why Tanks have such a huge Friendly Fire splash whereas the Collosus has none.
Tanks should do less friendly splash because it makes free units like broodlings much stronger than they should be. It forces the un-seige, which grants a run in of lings and then it's game.
This is so wrong.
I would argue that colossus should do friendly splash; along with PFs and probably fungal. The only splash attack that shouldn't do friendly fire would be melee attacks (blings and ultras) because that would be functionally stupid.
Colossus and PF splash makes me sad. It feels like they put the game on easymode with those two attacks, and they are both horrible for the game IMO.
On August 19 2012 04:15 plogamer wrote: Broodlings are too good against tanks. Watching Vortix vs Supernova and other Terrans, today, I saw a tech switch of broods cause tanks to friendlyfire their own units to death. This allowed him to turn the game around from some really big deficits.
It's not a new, unknown fact, but I think it goes unnoticed and underrated. If we could have tanks that didn't do splash damage (or maybe less of it), then broodlings would be less of a threat and infestors would be zoned out with targetfire, allowing vikings to push back broodlords. It would still require skill, ie, not a-move.
It would be a buff for mech in all matchups (which we sorely need) and it would be a nerf to infestors in TvZ.
I wish Blizzard would try it out on their balance maps one day. Maybe as an upgrade?
you make me giggle
Can your biased zerg brain even consider the possibility of not making broodlords an automatic mind-control on seige tanks?
Wait Tanks that don't do splash or less splash? Then what's the point of having siege tank as a unit....
He wants no FRIENDLY splash. So, for example, Zerglings run into Marines, which usually works out fairly well because Tank Splash. But without the Marines taking damge from the splash.
Also making any kind of drop on top of tanks worthless.(in ALL matchups.)
It always eluded me why Tanks have such a huge Friendly Fire splash whereas the Collosus has none.
Tanks should do less friendly splash because it makes free units like broodlings much stronger than they should be. It forces the un-seige, which grants a run in of lings and then it's game.
This is so wrong.
I would argue that colossus should do friendly splash; along with PFs and probably fungal. The only splash attack that shouldn't do friendly fire would be melee attacks (blings and ultras) because that would be functionally stupid.
Colossus and PF splash makes me sad. It feels like they put the game on easymode with those two attacks, and they are both horrible for the game IMO.
Well. While i am not very inclined to discuss balance for darker reasons...
The collosous non-friendly fire stuff is understandable because it would uselessify meele units for protoss. Because every zealot would be destroyed by the laser stuffs. Tanks are fine with friendly splash, because all terran units are ranged, and it forces you to make some tactical choices when faced with meele units.
I think its a great thing to consider how other units will complement the splasher, and when one unit makes another one useless, it is really not that great for creating unit use diversity.
And if planetarys had friendly splash, then running 2 lings into an scv line would destroy that line in two or three shots. could be discussed if this is bad or good.
I think Protoss have a lot of good micro potential that are not being used. Mostly because they might be way too intensive.
For example, unlike Terran armies which are very homogeneous in this respect, Protoss balls are a mix of different range and speed units. When attacking or defending Protoss probably has the biggest burden of correct positioning, something which always messes up whenever you move. Always keeping zealots in front sentries slightly behind (also positioning sentries more efficiently so as you cover more of your army with GS) and flanking with them stalkers. Making sure your HT are split and not too far behind.
Most games you will never see that constant level of attention because it can become way too taxing. But as time goes on I think Protoss players will eventually start making these micro changes to be even more effective. Also a lot of people underestimate the skill and accuracy needed to place efficient FFs, since, unlike fungals, FFs can work against a Protoss if you're not careful.
Dunno, it just feels like people only consider the marine splitting for banelings and nothing else when it comes to intensive micro. I know at Diamond level marine splitting is really important for terrans bcs banelings/fungal/storm are stupidly powerful when you can't micro well, but when you consider play at the highest level I think Protoss positioning and micro are severely underrated (especially in terms of potential micro).
Protoss doesn't need to do any of that and they can win 90% of the time. The only time control comes into play as protoss is when the other player is either a) coming at you with ~equal forces or b) coming at you with stronger forces. Terran CONSTANTLY has to micro due to the fragility of their units compared to the other races, even in situations where they're ahead. As Terran, there is rare a "macro" win where, regardless of the units being thrown away, theA+move and macro of the Terran is overwhelming. It's always using those few units with good macro and micro that wins games, ALWAYS.
Yes and if Terrans, like TaeJa, switch to Protoss they will never lose a game ever again. People need to get a grip on reality. Terran micro can be intense, especially vs. Z on creep, but it's not magnitudes of order better.
I agree that Terrans have a problem with Zergs in certain situations based on balance, but it's not this crazy imbalance which all these plat/dia Terrans think it is.
Actually, if Taeja did play Protoss or Zerg for that matter, he might just break the balance of this game ^_^
Not really, Taeja is just mechanically solid, with great fundamentals and control. He wouldn't be able to use these natural attributes to his advantage with the other non-Terran races
Actually, regardless of which race Taeja plays, he will be a very solid player. He will be good completely regardless of race. He will be able to use those same fundamentals to elevate any race to appear broken, just like he is doing with terran.
He'd be solid regardless of his, but you can't take his attributes that make him great (especially his control) and say they're going to benefit him as much with the other races.
MC has sick fundamentals but you don't see these in evidence as much because of how Protoss functions and people label him a timing attack one-trick pony
Look at PartinG, who has the best army control of all protoss players (at least against terran). He wins games entirely because of his army control. HerO should also be considered in that category as well (I can't remember the exact game, but it was on antiga shipyard, where he had a 55 kill immortal and 30 kill immortal against zerg).
Yes, but Taeja, MMA, MKP, and MVP all play Zerg and Protoss at their MMR on their main accounts. Meaning they beat top 16 GM players on the Korean server consistently when off-racing. (Name any other Zerg or Protoss pro that has streamed off-racing with these types of wins.)
I don't care what level their Terran is, to be able to do this with all 3 races demonstrates their extreme skill. Given the fact that nearly all Koreans in GM play at least 6 hours a day (most likely a lot more, especially as we broach the top 20) with their one race, it's truly amazing that these Terrans can waltz in and off-race and beat players of this caliber and this work ethic.
This certainly strengthens the argument that the best Terrans, if they spent even more time on Zerg or Protoss, Would Indeed break the balance of the game. Imagine if any of them switched completely to Zerg or Protoss.
Blizzard would have to make some balance changes.
If PRO players could so easily get better results (and therefore more money) by switching to a different race, they would do it in a heartbeat.
The fact that they haven't should tell you something.
Just not true, pros are usually not free to change at whim. You have to consider the line-up of the team (coaches will not like it when they suddenly change races, because they invested time in refining their build order, they might be needed as practice partners for certain matchups etc), you have to consider that they spent time learning the in-and-outs of the race and a balance patch might throw everything around again, so it's not worth it to reinvest that much time (sure, the top of the top like MVP, MKP is excellent with their off race as well, but they will not be as familiar with unconventional strats that they would encounter in tournament situations, so there would definitely be time lost) and last but not least, they'd offend their fans. If MVP, the Terran King, or MC, Bosstoss, would switch, they'd lose fans, which is of very much value for pros, it is their brand they are trying to build.
On August 21 2012 02:54 ChristianS wrote: By the way, guys, this balance patch was put on hold. Blizzard feels like just as they announced it Zergs started struggling.
On August 21 2012 02:54 ChristianS wrote: By the way, guys, this balance patch was put on hold. Blizzard feels like just as they announced it Zergs started struggling.
so they take those kind of decision based on the result of those few tournies from patch announce up to now ? this argument feel a bit weird for me considering their 'we collect a tons of data to make our decisions' stance before.
On August 21 2012 02:54 ChristianS wrote: By the way, guys, this balance patch was put on hold. Blizzard feels like just as they announced it Zergs started struggling.
so they take those kind of decision based on the result of those few tournies from patch announce up to now ? this argument feel a bit weird for me considering their 'we collect a tons of data to make our decisions' stance before.
It's the same old thing as always. Thorzain makes a Thor build and it gets nerfed instantly. Zergs don't win every tournament and suddenly a nerf is reverted. There's no point in ever trusting their data when they buffed zerg when the matchup was 50.1 - 49.9. Even if they don't nerf creep it would be ridiculous not to buff the raven speed.
On August 21 2012 02:54 ChristianS wrote: By the way, guys, this balance patch was put on hold. Blizzard feels like just as they announced it Zergs started struggling.
On August 21 2012 02:54 ChristianS wrote: By the way, guys, this balance patch was put on hold. Blizzard feels like just as they announced it Zergs started struggling.
so they take those kind of decision based on the result of those few tournies from patch announce up to now ? this argument feel a bit weird for me considering their 'we collect a tons of data to make our decisions' stance before.
It's the same old thing as always. Thorzain makes a Thor build and it gets nerfed instantly. Zergs don't win every tournament and suddenly a nerf is reverted. There's no point in ever trusting their data when they buffed zerg when the matchup was 50.1 - 49.9. Even if they don't nerf creep it would be ridiculous not to buff the raven speed.
yeah i'm aware of that, what strange is them so openly saying it when they where denying this kind of thing before.
On August 19 2012 04:15 plogamer wrote: Broodlings are too good against tanks. Watching Vortix vs Supernova and other Terrans, today, I saw a tech switch of broods cause tanks to friendlyfire their own units to death. This allowed him to turn the game around from some really big deficits.
It's not a new, unknown fact, but I think it goes unnoticed and underrated. If we could have tanks that didn't do splash damage (or maybe less of it), then broodlings would be less of a threat and infestors would be zoned out with targetfire, allowing vikings to push back broodlords. It would still require skill, ie, not a-move.
It would be a buff for mech in all matchups (which we sorely need) and it would be a nerf to infestors in TvZ.
I wish Blizzard would try it out on their balance maps one day. Maybe as an upgrade?
you make me giggle
Can your biased zerg brain even consider the possibility of not making broodlords an automatic mind-control on seige tanks?
Wait Tanks that don't do splash or less splash? Then what's the point of having siege tank as a unit....
He wants no FRIENDLY splash. So, for example, Zerglings run into Marines, which usually works out fairly well because Tank Splash. But without the Marines taking damge from the splash.
Also making any kind of drop on top of tanks worthless.(in ALL matchups.)
It always eluded me why Tanks have such a huge Friendly Fire splash whereas the Collosus has none.
Tanks should do less friendly splash because it makes free units like broodlings much stronger than they should be. It forces the un-seige, which grants a run in of lings and then it's game.
This is so wrong.
I would argue that colossus should do friendly splash; along with PFs and probably fungal. The only splash attack that shouldn't do friendly fire would be melee attacks (blings and ultras) because that would be functionally stupid.
Colossus and PF splash makes me sad. It feels like they put the game on easymode with those two attacks, and they are both horrible for the game IMO.
Well. While i am not very inclined to discuss balance for darker reasons...
The collosous non-friendly fire stuff is understandable because it would uselessify meele units for protoss. Because every zealot would be destroyed by the laser stuffs. Tanks are fine with friendly splash, because all terran units are ranged, and it forces you to make some tactical choices when faced with meele units.
I think its a great thing to consider how other units will complement the splasher, and when one unit makes another one useless, it is really not that great for creating unit use diversity.
And if planetarys had friendly splash, then running 2 lings into an scv line would destroy that line in two or three shots. could be discussed if this is bad or good.
No one would make planeteries then. Right now their main purpose is deterring ling/zealot harassment because 6 ultralisks tear down a planetery in two seconds flat. As would any protoss army.
them saying they were going to buff ravens was enough of a buff without actually releasing the patch. People are making ravens more often now and should be realizing that they are a very good unit.
Ha, this is complete bullshit by Blizzard. This literally makes no fucking sense. I'm normally on their side, since they have tools and data that we simply can't obtain, but this is ridiculous. Everything we have points to a slump in Terran performance, well outside the margins of error. Maybe a buff to TvZ isn't the answer, nor a buff to TvP, but there's definitely a problem there.
Amazing, how the infestor can be a sick good unit, a counter to basicly everything terran has. Meanwhile there is the raven, a slow building unit that is only good when the opponent clumps up his broodlords. Oh, and you have to upgrade the spell. Imagine infestors need fungal upgrade, and fungal requires 125 energy...
EPT
