EPTProps to TT1 for not trying it yet!
[?] Spades hacking? - Page 49
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07:06 KST - method linked here has been disproved here 10:54 KST - Find a full timeline of pro comments (including Spades) in the topic here. 08:47 KST - Summary: Accusations of maphacking have the potential to destroy a player's career if left unaddressed. Because of the potential consequences, we should be careful about accepting unproven accusations. The principle of 'innocent until proven guilty' should be applied here. That does not mean that there has been a conclusion about this case, however, which is why this thread remains tentatively open. Please discuss with caution and use evidence to back up your claims. (also a summary post by an unnamed pro on reddit here) | ||
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ReaperX
Hong Kong1758 Posts
Props to TT1 for not trying it yet! | ||
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Pantythief
Denmark657 Posts
On June 05 2012 10:14 Kitchen.Sink wrote: Watch the replay at normal speed. Watch it several times. First, Spades begins moving his army at the EXACT time that Lucifron loads his hellions into the medivac. Second, there is one, single click Spades makes at the EXACT moment that the hellions begin to move after being unloaded but before they are in Spades's vision range. Oddly enough, this single click is in line to directly intercept the hellions and Spades continues to follow that same line to chase them. These two things seem far too coincidental to be just coincidences, especially in light of all the other strange coincidences spread throughout all the games. After all, if he was scared of drops, why would he not just send his viking to the periphery of his base? Why would he move his entire army around if he was afraid of drops when a group of stimmed marines could run right up his ramp? If he was afraid of drops he could have had his vikings near the back ledge and his main army near the ramp. It's quite clear from the positioning that Spades knew he could send his entire army to deal with the drop. Ultimately, however, coincidental. This does not say evidence, in a million years. | ||
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gosuRob
United States319 Posts
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MidgetHumper
United Kingdom280 Posts
![[image loading]](http://www.jaynetdesign.com/images/maphack.png) User was warned for this post | ||
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.Mthex-
United States168 Posts
The camera blocks I saw, where when he was clicking on the mini map, and then used hotkeys to select his buildings. Though strange that he does not move his camera during these hotkey macro moments.. I don't find it incriminating. I'm not sure whether he is guilty or innocent, but I do really want to caution EVERYONE before they jump on the band wagon here and start with the 'I saw, he said, she said' crap. This is someone's career, be careful. | ||
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Crazysc2
United States26 Posts
On June 05 2012 10:14 Spades wrote: My last 50 something ladder games, none left out. includes 2 warmup games i played vs SanghooLeeMD right before the showmatch. https://rapidshare.com/files/624275372/New_folder__4_.rar There you guys go, you got what you wanted | ||
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Internet_justice
20 Posts
On June 05 2012 10:14 Spades wrote: My last 50 something ladder games, none left out. includes 2 warmup games i played vs SanghooLeeMD right before the showmatch. https://rapidshare.com/files/624275372/New_folder__4_.rar Quoting this for others. | ||
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artanis2
United States732 Posts
On June 05 2012 10:14 Spades wrote: My last 50 something ladder games, none left out. includes 2 warmup games i played vs SanghooLeeMD right before the showmatch. https://rapidshare.com/files/624275372/New_folder__4_.rar Nice job, now the real work begins I guess. | ||
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Doodsmack
United States7224 Posts
A mod should do an IP check of the OP and expose his main account. This should be done because of the manner in which the OP went about accusing Spades. He exaggerated and misinterpreted NUMEROUS times, in ways that can only lead us to conclude he did so deliberately. For example, claiming that moving an SCV to a watchtower w/o looking at the watchtower is evidence of a hack is simply dishonest, and intended to capitalize on the hasty-conclusion hive mind that was sure to follow his post. Just look at the first page of this thread, numerous people start assuming the OP is correct WHILE ADMITTING that they haven't watched the replay yet, simply because of how much text and timestamps the OP offered as supposed evidence. In other words the OP created the illusion of painstaking examination when in fact his evidence was HEAVILY circumstantial. It's only fair that his identity should be outed if he's going to pretend to be the judge and jury. | ||
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quarkle
United Kingdom92 Posts
On June 05 2012 10:14 Spades wrote: My last 50 something ladder games, none left out. includes 2 warmup games i played vs SanghooLeeMD right before the showmatch. https://rapidshare.com/files/624275372/New_folder__4_.rar Well done. !!! You've taken a huge step into clearing your name. Hopefully that should take some pressure off you.  | ||
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VPCursed
1044 Posts
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andReslic
216 Posts
lol, 50 ladder games after or before? it after, its just as simple as turning off the maphack and play. Also, who says he didnt delete replays? i dont think this proves something. | ||
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-Kaiser-
Canada932 Posts
As someone who's not a big fan of second chances for cheaters, with all of this circumstantial evidence it's hard to take his side. Without trying to offend anybody, I don't think Spades is relevant enough on the scene for some bad publicity to his career to be a big deal. I doubt he's making much money. If his career is important, he'll be good enough that none of this is an issue and he'll prove it to us. I look forward to his future games. I don't have Sc2 on this computer, can somebody please try to emulate the scan evidence? I would like to know if it's possible to replicate the replay by double clicking rapidly on the minimap for a scan and pan. Also, can we get somebody to confirm the SCV-select-through-fog-of-war evidence? | ||
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Kkxtrouble
Brazil575 Posts
I'm not going to jump to conclusions, not going to defend him nor attack him. I think anyone that is not a high level-player should step away until the smoke is clear, it's better than making a fool out of yourself. Edit: Does anybody know when Catz will be streaming his response ? | ||
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andReslic
216 Posts
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whiterabbit
2675 Posts
Doesn't matter if Spades somehow proves he never used hacks in SC2, as someone with background of BW player who used hacks, his career or at least image is ruined. I can't believe this topic didn't get closed/deleted giving there is no real proof. And I love how few other pros jumped to throw cheap accusations basically saying "Hey, I think you are hacker but if you are not...well... sowwy!" Hacker should be called out and surgically removed from the scene, but ruining someone's career without real proof is beyond bad and as I said, I can't believe TeamLiquid is assisting at doing so. | ||
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Moonling
United States987 Posts
On June 05 2012 08:37 avilo wrote: I actually have accused spades b4 of hacking / called him out on it during a game I played on my stream before. He was former teammate so I gave him benefit of the doubt, but it seemed painfully obvious that he was gaining extraordinary perception in this game from ladder: http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=264521 A few things make it painfully obvious. First off, he's doing an exact mirror build off of zero scouting which is incredibly rare to happen. But that's not where the lulz come. I then end up getting contained, but I decided to purposely "bait" him a couple times and see how he reacts during this contain to verify if he's hacking or not. Every high level TvTer can verify how questionable and suspicious the decisions are from 13:00 min in this game during the contain. First, note the perfect placement of his tanks just outside of the range of my already pre-sieged tanks...could be luck, but suspicious to start. Next, I purposely make a viking flower as if I am going to leap frog tanks to gain vision over his tanks. Spades has zero vikings. 13:23, he looks where my tanks are, send a marine forward, standard to confirm, but he has no scans, and he doesn't seem to be afraid at all of my tanks moving forward at all... 13:30 he gets energy to scan now, that every high level TvT would save if they want to keep this contain up, otherwise they may just retreat without vikings for vision. 13:34 HE MULES, still not saving scans...leaving every tank sieged still, while knowing that I have the viking advantage for vision, notice my tanks have not moved an inch and he is not worrying about his tanks at all even though he knows he has no way to get vision...WTF? 13:41 This is where my detective work comes in. I make a viking flower pretending that i am about to leap frog my tanks forward. But I leave all my tanks purposely sieged in the same spot. He obviously is looking through the fog of war and sees that I have not moved them, every good player here throws up a scan, but he knows they are in the same exact position as before, so he does not move his tanks away, and he used the mule. He does walk a marine forward though. 13:50 He has a scan available now. 14:09 Another marine moves forward 14:30 Notice this is the first time that I unsiege any tanks near the contain, and what I plan next is to purposely feint a leapfrog forward and then insta-move back to see if he insta-scans. Keep in mind, every single instance before this that I have viking flowered as if leapfrogging forward, he has never reacted at all, no scan. 14:36 I make the final "bait" move here and I purposely do not viking flower to see how he reacts. The instant I move the tanks forward he insta-moves his screen to that location, insta-scans, and I did not siege because, like I said, I was already suspicious at that point and was curious how he would react. Incredibly suspicious imo...some would say incredibly obvious as well. I was streaming at the time, and even more curious was spades was immediately on my stream out of no where to immediately defend himself...-_- After analyzing this replay the entire sequence after 13 min is just so... odd. IF ANYTHING, the most damming part of this replay that suggests hacking is at 14:10. 14:10- Spadd has had his camera locked in a random part where his natural ramp is located for a solid 9 seconds while his CC is selected then makes some random movements with a scv and then moves him back, and then here is the kicker. After being still for 9 seconds right when Avilo un-sieges his tanks to bust the contain spades has, Spades immediately scans where the break is coming giving his tanks vision (Spades had NOT HAD VISION of avilo's tanks the entire engagement due to Avilo having air control with vikings and Spades tanks had been sitting there for 9 min with no air support but manages to scan right when the push is coming). I watched this replay pretty fast but that stood out very obviously Still nothing conclusive, but just suspicious activity I'm tired, I know I had bad grammar i'm sorry  | ||
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Rowrin
United States280 Posts
On June 05 2012 10:19 -Kaiser- wrote: This seems like an extraordinary coincidence of circumstantial evidence if Spades is innocent, and his explanations are awful in a lot of spots. I look forward to the SotG review. At the very least, Spades is going to be under a lot of scrutiny now. As someone who's not a big fan of second chances for cheaters, with all of this circumstantial evidence it's hard to take his side. Without trying to offend anybody, I don't think Spades is relevant enough on the scene for some bad publicity to his career to be a big deal. I doubt he's making much money. If his career is important, he'll be good enough that none of this is an issue and he'll prove it to us. I look forward to his future games. I don't have Sc2 on this computer, can somebody please try to emulate the scan evidence? I would like to know if it's possible to replicate the replay by double clicking rapidly on the minimap for a scan and pan. Also, can we get somebody to confirm the SCV-select-through-fog-of-war evidence? It's the blizzard replay camera doing the paning, it smooths out players camera movement so it isn't jumpy. | ||
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mememolly
4765 Posts
On June 05 2012 10:14 Spades wrote: My last 50 something ladder games, none left out. includes 2 warmup games i played vs SanghooLeeMD right before the showmatch. https://rapidshare.com/files/624275372/New_folder__4_.rar posting your last X competitive/online tourney games would have made more sense | ||
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legaton
France1763 Posts
edit: deleted a repeat | ||
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