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07:06 KST - method linked here has been disproved here 10:54 KST - Find a full timeline of pro comments (including Spades) in the topic here. 08:47 KST - Summary: Accusations of maphacking have the potential to destroy a player's career if left unaddressed. Because of the potential consequences, we should be careful about accepting unproven accusations. The principle of 'innocent until proven guilty' should be applied here. That does not mean that there has been a conclusion about this case, however, which is why this thread remains tentatively open. Please discuss with caution and use evidence to back up your claims. (also a summary post by an unnamed pro on reddit here) | ||
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DeepElemBlues
United States5080 Posts
On June 06 2012 06:02 fAnTaCy wrote: Fair as long as you're not just blaming CatZ like everyone else is doing i should say i lost some respect not all or a lot but at a certain point it was a little too much schadenfreude for me | ||
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Geo.Rion
7377 Posts
On June 06 2012 05:57 s4life wrote: A player's career has been literally finished off over backhanded vendettas and inconclusive evidence. It was disgusting seing how things unfolded.. shame on this community. completely false, if the accusation was baseless all he had to do is come out and say "hey dumbass, i've done nothing wrong, ur evidence is wrong because [fill in the blanks], go fuck yourself" Instead he retires. I already wrote in the other thread, i had similar experience, nobody would act like he did unless he's guilty as fuck | ||
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itsjuspeter
United States668 Posts
On June 06 2012 04:52 Erasme wrote: No, the fucking burden of proof is on you. Noone here have a hard evidence, so stop the drama and the bullshit. So what he hacked back in bw ? I can totally understand why he would deny it. Maybe he was tired/trying a different strat/playstyle. This thread should be closed by now and half of the people who posted in it should be warned/banned. No, look I love how you are so blind like the many defenders here. You are telling me that it is totally normal to playone way, ie using actual map,fow peeking, etc. but then in a match with a little more importance he decides to never check fow which is downright bad playn ONLY use minimap? Open your eyes, calm down a little, n understand majority of pros already agree he is hacking, now with him never addressing fow peek,playing the victim, then leaving without afight... Its tooobvious | ||
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discomatt
113 Posts
On June 06 2012 05:58 PandaTank wrote: This thread started off alright, but now it's just pure and absolute garbage. I think it's pretty poor judgement by the the mods that it's still even open. Talk about double standards. Hack detection should be Blizzard's responsibility. If they fail to do so, and it gets to the point where players actually begin making money illegitimately by winning tournaments while hacking, then the community should start applying massive amounts of pressure on Blizzard to resolve the issue. Instead of all these petty threads and witch hunts where a bunch of extremely impressionable and ignorant people jump onto a band wagon to publically humiliate and flame someone for something they may not have necessarily even done. It's pathetic. No, it shouldn't. It's incredibly expensive, and in the end the only way you can do it is to take control of a user's computer. People have even managed to cheat in console gaming. They have offline tournaments, and that will forever be the anti-cheat. | ||
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Megakenny
Canada829 Posts
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dAPhREAk
Nauru12397 Posts
On June 06 2012 06:04 Geo.Rion wrote: completely false, if the accusation was baseless all he had to do is come out and say "hey dumbass, i've done nothing wrong, ur evidence is wrong because [fill in the blanks], go fuck yourself" Instead he retires. I already wrote in the other thread, i had similar experience, nobody would act like he did unless he's guilty as fuck or he is being professional. | ||
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NovaTheFeared
United States7232 Posts
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s4life
Peru1519 Posts
On June 06 2012 06:04 StarStrider wrote: I read those posts. I've read this whole thread, all nearly 200 pages of it. Still unsure how this phrase applies. Is there evidence of anyone having a vendetta against Spades? If so, please provide? Mirhi's posts | ||
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NeMeSiS3
Canada2972 Posts
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Scisyhp
United States200 Posts
On June 06 2012 06:05 Megakenny wrote: Did the identity of the OP get revieled at all? Or is that still a secret? TL said they'd probably do a writeup on the whole situation, which may include that. | ||
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fAnTaCy
United States893 Posts
On June 06 2012 06:04 DeepElemBlues wrote: i should say i lost some respect not all or a lot but at a certain point it was a little too much schadenfreude for me I understand where you're coming from, it was a little over the line at some points yes, and it is fair that you lose some respect for those that took part in the bashing of Spades, but I'm getting sick and tired of the morons just blaming CatZ when there were 3 other people watching the replays and saying things about it as well yet CatZ is the only one reciving any hate at all when there were some points that he never pointed out that other people did | ||
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SCII-ALI
28 Posts
I want people to realize that he is not the only what who analyzed the games on stream. He was not alone doing it offline either, not only with drewbie, there were a bunch others, and ofc. there are also other pros that side with catz. People wanted LIVE evidence. So he gave them it. Don't put it on catz, put it on the community, and the OP for even making such a post. and now, spades. why do fail to answer my question. why is it that you do not look into fog of war in bo7? but do it all the time on stream / ladder games you provided | ||
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Defacer
Canada5052 Posts
You're trying to explain the concept of professionalism to TL. Good luck. | ||
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BoZiffer
United States1841 Posts
I think it was the wise move, true or untrue. By leaving, WW now doesn't have to answer any more questions and can just focus on being a team, not a sideshow. Completely agree. | ||
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StarStrider
United States689 Posts
I just told you I read those. I know who he is. What about his posts specifically shows that he has a 'vendetta' against Spades? | ||
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Scisyhp
United States200 Posts
On June 06 2012 06:06 NeMeSiS3 wrote: Spades was just removed from his team... Good job community, be proud that with circumstancial evidence you can get a professional player dismissed from his career... That because of frustration on ladder matches, you can message sponsors and damage a team's income and ability to play in tournaments... This is Starcraft 2, and as a community we thrive at being fucking imbeciles, I've been curious as to why pro players shun us collectively, and now I know why. There's a reason why it's called circumstantial EVIDENCE. That would be the whole part where it is EVIDENCE. So many internet lawyers have the idea that circumstantial evidence can't be used to prove something. In fact, it's the only way to prove something when you don't directly witness it. If you see 2 people go into a room, and a moment later see one of them pointing a smoking gun at the other's head with a bullet hole in it, that's circumstantial evidence but can actually be used against them. Learn a bit about evidence before throwing words around that you don't know the meaning of. | ||
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Fyrewolf
United States1533 Posts
Although the last 2-3 have been tolerable, the last thing anyone should call spades' posts in this thread is "professional". | ||
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oZii
United States1198 Posts
On June 06 2012 06:01 DeepElemBlues wrote: yes i did lose respect for all of them they could have done it without making a big joke out of everything Which shows they have no experience as being the judge the jury or the executioner if they joked about it then they didn't show any compassion to the accused at all. That is not their job though. So you can't really blame them if they did joke about it. It is possible they where just laughing at the people that kept writing crazy stuff on catz screen like maybe he scrolled with his keyboard or reading chat and seeing some of the people's ridiculous counter-arguments because thats what I took them laughing at. Catz stated he like Spades as a person cool guy nothing against him. I never really got a feel they where laughing at him directly except some of his weird play choices which are those same play choices called into question. | ||
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las91
United States5080 Posts
On June 06 2012 06:06 NeMeSiS3 wrote: Spades was just removed from his team... Good job community, be proud that with circumstancial evidence you can get a professional player dismissed from his career... That because of frustration on ladder matches, you can message sponsors and damage a team's income and ability to play in tournaments... This is Starcraft 2, and as a community we thrive at being fucking imbeciles, I've been curious as to why pro players shun us collectively, and now I know why. Circumstantial evidence has done a lot worse to far more innocent human beings than Spades. | ||
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crxer
United States16 Posts
HIs descision making and gamelay scream hack though, he plays exactly like i did with terran when i hacked thats why i conclujde he hacked and had production tab open at least and full view of the minimap. So i do think he hacks i really do or he is retarded and is really bad and makes stupid descisoins that are somehow perfect? Thats hacking 101 he is hacking its obvious when i watched his movements the way he moved the fake scan etc i played like this when i was rank 1 masters once i stopped hacking alot of seasons ago and moved down to low master. After reviewing it over and over again i think he hacks i am not 100% sure he could just be stupid and make stupid ass descisions but in my opinon he hacks, take it for what it is when i hacked i was never accused once because i did the best to cover it up i think i am kinda an expert on this as i played terran at the time as well, its the best race to hack with because of the scans and the meta game bs you could do etc. I do not know more then the progamers about what he is thiniking in the game btu i do know alot more then them about hacking in general. I stopped because it became lame and boring and once a hacker always a hacker is not true people do stop when they learn the game much more. Final opinion I think he hacks based on his gameplay not on the stupid camera lock and minimap vision crap you guuys are stations he is hacking he plaeyd almost exactly like i did but of course alot better, and covers it up really well grats to the OP for finding it out i posted before that he doesent hack but after watchign every replay i now think he does. | ||
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