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We previously announced that we intended to “loosen” the range of opponents chosen in matchmaking, causing the game to occasionally match opponents that were a bit more disparate from one another in skill than before. This change was carried out, we have carefully evaluated the results we’re seeing, and we have decided to roll back the change for now.
What we saw with this experiment were undesirable consequences for players at the far ends of the range of skill, and we have now returned to the previous matchmaker tuning -- settings that were in use for a long time before this trial. Nonetheless, we may make further adjustments to the matchmaker in the future.
Thank you very much for your participation and feedback on this!
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/4427703901
Anyway; i didnt mind the new changes. Being masters, it was about the same, really. Got to play some GM, and some diamond.
But, i guess id feel bad if i was diamond having to play a lot of masters, or a GM playing low masters......
Did the new matchmaking make anxiety worse for some? Where theyd lose and be upset?
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Well that didn't take long at all
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This is awesome. NO MORE PLAYING WITH RANK 1 GM(on sea) 8 times in a row~~~
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See that i wouldnt mind. Good practice 
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I enjoyed it while it lasted... I supposed it would be pretty annoying if you were at the top of GM and all of a sudden you're playing a low masters player and only getting +1 point for winning every time you play a lower skilled player, while getting -10 or whatever when you lose to an opponent at your level. I imagine that was the majority of the problem, high level players were playing too many scrubs while bronzies were playing too many silvers and golds to get any enjoyment.
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All I found out from that is top masters players are cheesy as hell. Was a good idea though and got some good experience out of it.
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I think the only thing that SUCKED for me that was that I would gain like 9 points a game and I would lose 10-15 points per game... wtf... T_T
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All masters is, is more refined cheese :p
You defend it; then the macro begins.
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tbh i liked the changes oh well =\
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I didn't notice at all. Everyone I played against was in my league...
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I bet a lot of low bronze noobs got huge loss streaks. I started 12-6 but later it was back to 50/50
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well, for GM and bronze, you cant really "have more variance" except for higher up/lower down.
Prob good for silver->diamond, though, really.
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On April 13 2012 15:27 Malpractice.248 wrote:
well, for GM and bronze, you cant really "have more variance" except for higher up/lower down.
Prob good for silver->diamond, though, really.
Was thinking myself. Actually they could make the variance a function of MMR (hope you get what I mean).
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On April 13 2012 15:25 Cheerio wrote:
I bet a lot of low bronze noobs got huge loss streaks. I started 12-6 but later it was back to 50/50
I started out 17-6 the first day, didnt play yesteday, and then spent all day today getting my ass kicked. Maybe something to do with this? But I was playing mostly masters people the first day even though I was fresh off my promotion to diamond, so it doesnt look like I was just getting people below me before. Confusing !
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thank god, so i take my rant back from the other thread
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Lol that was real quick. I kinda liked the change but could definitely see how it could be annoying to people who would either easily win or get stomped.
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awww and i was hoping to get to play some gm players 
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Hey guys, I heard it'd be hard to use a different algorithm based on what your rating range is.
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I'm disapointed. Since we can not reset our accounts, I think this was the best solution to have some variance. Just playing against players your skill level is not the best way to improve. Day9 did an old podcast where he talks about this. http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/intrigue/Day90006PlayAgainstWorsePlay.mp3
You need to play against worse players to be comforatable enough to try some new stuff without the fear of instantly losing, and you need to test those ideas against better players to make sure you're not doing anything that can be punished. The only way to do this before the ladder reformat was buying multiple accounts, which a lot of people who play starcraft can't really afford (ie high school, and college students). I wish they'd just let you reset your account when you wanted to.
Also for people in really low skill levels (gold-plat and below), it's a great way to see cleaner build orders and practice versus refined play and thus be forced to play better.
I can see how for really, really good players (pro players), how it could be really annoying, though.
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This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
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Awesome decision. I really hated the new match-making system for team games.
What about EU though?
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On April 13 2012 15:42 darkness wrote:
Awesome decision. I really hated the new match-making system for team games.
What about EU though?
dont see any posts on any EU forum about this so i think its not reverted back on EU servers :x
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On April 13 2012 15:42 darkness wrote:
Awesome decision. I really hated the new match-making system for team games.
What about EU though?
Lol good point, I had a funny game earlier where I played players who I swear couldn't have been higher than low diamond (they tried to 1 base for 20 minutes). Was pretty ridiculous rickrolling win where we took the entire map and sat on our ass waiting for them lol. We were high masters so.... was pretty unfair mathmaking to say the least.
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On April 13 2012 15:31 Bibbit wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 15:25 Cheerio wrote:
I bet a lot of low bronze noobs got huge loss streaks. I started 12-6 but later it was back to 50/50 I started out 17-6 the first day, didnt play yesteday, and then spent all day today getting my ass kicked. Maybe something to do with this? But I was playing mostly masters people the first day even though I was fresh off my promotion to diamond, so it doesnt look like I was just getting people below me before. Confusing !
I was thinking about this. Any increase in the matchmaking range will result in increased winrates for those at the top end mainly because the higher u get the more diverse and rare MMR gets, so its is much easier for the engine to find you a partner within more populated lower part of your range. On the other hand it might be the case that those immidiately below the top range will not get compensated enough because.they will be in much more demand from the upper MMR players than from the lower end ones. This is pure speculation of course.
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I am starting to like the new Match making but Blizzard reverted it again zzzzz
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It was quite strange to get silver>gold>plat>silver as a silver level player, instead of the silver>silver>silver>silver I got last season, and only losing 5 points to the plat and gaining 13 points from one of the silvers.
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Not sure how I felt about the new matchmaking system to be honest. I am in gold league and I played a streak of platinums that I got soundly beaten by and it wasn't a lot of fun and I didn't learn a lot. Shortly thereafter I played a bunch of lesser players who all lost immediately to a simple 3rax push. It felt really streaky. In a way I'd like to play against superior players to improve but a lot of the time the skill gap seemed rather large and I lost so comprehensively to make it difficult to pinpoint areas where I could improve, outside of 'everything'.
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Kind of actually disappointed that they rolled this back, but I understand why.
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All I figured out during this mmr change is that the skillgap between mid-plat and mid diamond is close to nonexistant.
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Yeah it was weird to play high golds and in the next match mid diamonds(i'm somewhat highish platinum). Games varied so much it was hard to get in the right tempo for me :/
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Aw man now I can't tell myself after every loss "it's ok, he's probably just one of those higher mmr players"
Making me own up to my fuck ups, I don't appreciate it Blizzard.
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On April 13 2012 16:19 Ogww wrote:
Yeah it was weird to play high golds and in the next match mid diamonds(i'm somewhat highish platinum). Games varied so much it was hard to get in the right tempo for me :/
Exactly. Changes should be gradual instead of from one league to another in a super short period.
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I liked the system while it lasted, but I got several weird opponents as well (beginner-bronze and high golds, I'm silver). Maybe it would be better if you could check or uncheck the system, to turn it on or off? That way the "pro's" and the people who weren't enjoying the system, could play like they usually did.
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I liked it
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I agree, I enjoyed the old system a lot more, I was playing low platinums quite often as mid diamond, and what's worse is that since most of them were Protoss, I would lose most of the time to cannon rushes and proxy gates, since not a lot of Protosses want to play PvP. Especially if they see that I'm favored on the score screen and know they can't match me micro wise, and are just looking for a promotion. But I would crush any terran or zerg opponents. Now I'm scared for my MMR, hopefully I don't get demoted. :/ Though at least I just played a few matches versus some mid diamond zergs and won them all so hopefully my MMR is back to where I started this season.
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So did I get this right? EU is still the same? Because I was really happy to get more mid and high master players, decreasing the time to promotion, as I won against a lot of them. (I am diamond.)
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On April 13 2012 15:14 Malpractice.248 wrote:......
Did the new matchmaking make anxiety worse for some? Where theyd lose and be upset?
I think that what they meant the problem was is:
1. Top X (insert arbitrary number) GM, at least those in there that play competitively, would consider those matches a loss of time: arguably not much gain in rating and 10-15 minutes of practice lost playing someone that can not help them get better by playing against them.
2. Low Bronze (like, the 50 lowest ones), which already struggle with any opponent and now will only experience an increase in difficulty, since there is no one they are favored against (beeing them at the very bottom of the ladder).
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
The technology just isnt there yet.
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
Good suggestion actually.
If (for example) one person has "I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [X] (and lets say the person is Diamond) and the other has "I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X] (and lets say this player is Platinum), then the game could match those two up due to the options.
If the person has neither checked, they'll get matched up with the same people (within their MMR).
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On April 13 2012 15:50 EtherealDeath wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 15:42 darkness wrote:
Awesome decision. I really hated the new match-making system for team games.
What about EU though? Lol good point, I had a funny game earlier where I played players who I swear couldn't have been higher than low diamond (they tried to 1 base for 20 minutes). Was pretty ridiculous rickrolling win where we took the entire map and sat on our ass waiting for them lol. We were high masters so.... was pretty unfair mathmaking to say the least.
I had 1 team where it was 2 diamond, 1 masters, 1 plat vs 4 legit silvers... it was quite sad. I honestly didnt enjoy my win and felt bad :/ lol
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As gold I played diamonds a couple of times and got my ass handed to me. T_T
But then other times I'd play bronze and win easily. So you still average out as around 50%.. its just the games where you get steamrolled aren't fun :p
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I liked it, it felt more like how a tournament is, good maps with random players of varying skill. Also mentally it helped me get over the ladder fear I've been having but it's ok because I feel like I'm over it now thanks to these past couple days.
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They should have atleast gave it a week not 2 days -_-
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On April 13 2012 16:24 Yndigo wrote:
So did I get this right? EU is still the same? Because I was really happy to get more mid and high master players, decreasing the time to promotion, as I won against a lot of them. (I am diamond.)
I have heard several times that a wider MMR range of your opponents would promote you faster. I don't think this is true. A matchmaking system normally increases or decreases your MMR in proportion to your chances of winnig against that opponent, and I don't think it can be implemented in any other way. It wouldn't work.
So, if you are playing against an even opponent your MMR would increase or decrease eg 5 points. If you play against someone you have 10% chance of winning against you would win 9 points or lose 1 point. Thus, if you play 10 games against this opponent you would win 1 time and lose 9 times on average, and your MMR would stay where it is, which it should.
If you are underrated, would your MMR incease faster with more diverse opponents? No. With even opponents you would gain +5, +5 etc. In the other case you would gain +1, +9 etc. Same speed.
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On April 13 2012 15:19 warcralft wrote:
This is awesome. NO MORE PLAYING WITH RANK 1 GM(on sea) 8 times in a row~~~
this made me laugh. this is really what SEA is like sometimes though.
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Now I can finally play a game without getting cheesed !
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Well I liked it as diamond.
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I hadn't even started playing yet. Was looking forward to it T.T
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On April 13 2012 15:50 EtherealDeath wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 15:42 darkness wrote:
Awesome decision. I really hated the new match-making system for team games.
What about EU though? Lol good point, I had a funny game earlier where I played players who I swear couldn't have been higher than low diamond (they tried to 1 base for 20 minutes). Was pretty ridiculous rickrolling win where we took the entire map and sat on our ass waiting for them lol. We were high masters so.... was pretty unfair mathmaking to say the least.
Well actually I had some funny moments too! In one game my partner misplaced his nexus by 3 matrix!!! In the other game I got a pearl from my tp:
2v2 game starts on a map where 1 natural is basicly inside our main, me zerg, saying
me: i fe
partner: fe against zerg? (we were against zp or zt team)
partner: lets hope the zerg has no braines and doesnt macro hatch lings
... needless to say I was a bit confused
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On April 13 2012 16:42 Mendelfist wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 16:24 Yndigo wrote:
So did I get this right? EU is still the same? Because I was really happy to get more mid and high master players, decreasing the time to promotion, as I won against a lot of them. (I am diamond.) I have heard several times that a wider MMR range of your opponents would promote you faster. I don't think this is true. A matchmaking system normally increases or decreases your MMR in proportion to your chances of winnig against that opponent, and I don't think it can be implemented in any other way. It wouldn't work. So, if you are playing against an even opponent your MMR would increase or decrease eg 5 points. If you play against someone you have 10% chance of winning against you would win 9 points or lose 1 point. Thus, if you play 10 games against this opponent you would win 1 time and lose 9 times on average, and your MMR would stay where it is, which it should. If you are underrated, would your MMR incease faster with more diverse opponents? No. With even opponents you would gain +5, +5 etc. In the other case you would gain +1, +9 etc. Same speed.
Ofc. If you win against a player with a higher MMR, you get more points (or more MMR points) and if you win against a player with a lower MMR you get less points (or less MMR points).
Same with losses, I dont think I have to explain that.
Example:
Depending on your MMR the system "thinks" your chance of winning against your opponent is like 10%, as you said.
If you win, you get more points than you would get in a even match.
Conclusion: you get more points in less time if you play opponents with a higher MMR (and win).
Saying that you win often, you get promoted faster if you play more people with higher MMR.
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
They cant, honestly.
Not because technology isnt there, but because you need people to play on one system.
Most would check "I dont mind playing weaker opponents" but not many would want to play higher.
Why? Because MOST the population wants promotions, and wants to feel good about winning. That would happen more often if you have a higher % to play only lower.
For a system to work, everyone needs to adhere to the same standards.
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On April 13 2012 17:25 Malpractice.248 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better. They cant, honestly. Not because technology isnt there, but because you need people to play on one system. Most would check "I dont mind playing weaker opponents" but not many would want to play higher. Why? Because MOST the population wants promotions, and wants to feel good about winning. That would happen more often if you have a higher % to play only lower. For a system to work, everyone needs to adhere to the same standards.
My thoughts exactly. If they implement something like that you might as well throw the entire ladder system out of the window because ranks and leagues will have even less meaning then they already did.
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i was facing mostly masters players (as a diamond player), and i enjoyed every game way more than i would have previously, knowing it meant more every time i faced a 'favored' opponent than it did previously
i'm a sad panda, but i understand why some people wouldnt want to face low ranked players 'all the time' as they so put it
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On April 13 2012 17:21 Yndigo wrote:Saying that you win often, you get promoted faster if you play more people with higher MMR.
Yes, but you shouldn't get matched against people with high MMR more often than low MMR, unless you are in low bronze. It can happen by chance of course, but not on average.
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^
This post makes no sense.
Even if you checked "I don't mind playing weaker opponents", the system WOULDN'T match you against weaker opponents who didn't check "Match me vs. stronger", so all is good.
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On April 13 2012 17:25 Malpractice.248 wrote:
Why? Because MOST the population wants promotions, and wants to feel good about winning. That would happen more often if you have a higher % to play only lower.
No. Playing against lower league players will not get you promoted easier.
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I can't see why this cannot be implemented in the leagues where it matters (silver - low master range?). Include all the people who have just started to understand whats happening to the ones that are becoming good. I also don't see why you can't prioritize certain matchups on ladder so I don't have to play ZvZ ten times in a row when I want to playing the game (I don't play too often). I guess it's Blizzard who doesn't want the ladder players to have any direct input in the matchmaking system at all. I can understand why it would be bad for the top 2-3 % but why not for the rest of us? According to most forums we in the 98% are terrible anyway so why not?
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Playing GMs as a low masters is really nice... However, playing low masters as a GM probably sucks a lot.
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hmm well im low masters and for me i felt like i got a lot of easy low dia opponents. got a few really good masters too where i almost lost all couse i still need to learn so much so i think its better if i get the same skill lvl again
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Does the same apply to the European ladder? I actually quite liked the change, it was fun to play against high masters for the challenge and then get to play against some high diamonds, thus making me feel better about myself. 
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On April 13 2012 16:20 darkness wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 16:19 Ogww wrote:
Yeah it was weird to play high golds and in the next match mid diamonds(i'm somewhat highish platinum). Games varied so much it was hard to get in the right tempo for me :/ Exactly. Changes should be gradual instead of from one league to another in a super short period.
I dunno, I felt like not knowing the skill of my opponent was helping me improve faster. I felt like I had to be on my A game in case I played someone a league up. Now, if I never improve, I'll still be in every game. If you sometimes play better people, though, you have to be on your toes, because you never know when you could be roflstomped.
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Wonder why they didn't just tweak the parameters a little instead of completely reverting the change.
Outside of the fact that I encountered even more cheese than usual, I can't say I noticed the change too much, (although I probably wasn't paying enough attention).
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was starting to play diamonds and winning but listening to the people on forums who complain about everything is totally more important than being able to get promotions faster.
if blizzard had a better way of teaching everyone exactly how mmr and ladder points work, like having a video that you're forced to watch before playing your first ladder games or something, this change would have been a good idea because people would have realized that the only bad thing that comes from this is pouting when you lose to someone ranked higher than you insted of watching the replay and learning from your mistakes.
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
The problem is that everyone wants to play stronger and not weaker. (well vast majority)
I was really enjoying the change. Played a few games where i was like WTF MAP HAX - how could he know i was going to do that?. Watched the replay and see that nope i just got completley pwnt.
Result I learnt more in that one game about zvt than i did through the most of last season of owning 1 basing nubs.
EDIT:
THere i s a big problem for the scoring mechanism though as you can end up in a situation where loses take off more than wins. There was a big tweak to the ladder early on to kind of avoid it. I think by opening up the matching range it resurfaced.
When i first started playing i couldnt get off 0 points until i could win 2/3 games - ie it was only bonus pool that enabled you to be +ve score if you won 50% of games
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My mmr was suddenly changed into high masters whereas my skill wasn't. I was losing 70-80% of my games but still I kept playing the better master players. Happy that they reverted it this fast.
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This is good for pro players !
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I think every like 10-20 games should be either still randomly weaker/stronger opponents kinda deal honestly (or a random number bigger than 10 games in a row) at least imo.
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I didn't play much on EU an NA recently but matchmaking on KR was ridiculous. I am in Gold and I was playing only either vs Silver or Platinum. So my history was like: win, lose, win, lose, win, lose... :D Maybe it suppose to be like that, but I rather prefer playing Gold and sometimes Platinum while being in Gold
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I didn't notice much of a difference personally, being in silver playing mostly against silver-high gold.
My friend in Bronze however got faced up against a Platinum player and got crushed, he wasn't too impressed.
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Edit: Wrong Thread - Apologies.
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On April 13 2012 17:31 Mendelfist wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 17:21 Yndigo wrote:Saying that you win often, you get promoted faster if you play more people with higher MMR. Yes, but you shouldn't get matched against people with high MMR more often than low MMR, unless you are in low bronze. It can happen by chance of course, but not on average.
Why not? If I am as good as a high master player, why shouldnt it let me play against high master players?
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It was a really good change. Seeing how you can match up against much better players is good experience. Also it gives you a reason to try harder against everyone cause you know they might be way better than you.
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On April 13 2012 19:32 SigmaoctanusIV wrote:
It was a really good change. Seeing how you can match up against much better players is good experience. Also it gives you a reason to try harder against everyone cause you know they might be way better than you.
Exactly! Thats my point.
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couldn't they just turn it off for bronze and masters? Why cancel it? stupid.
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On April 13 2012 17:30 Fragile51 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 17:25 Malpractice.248 wrote:On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better. They cant, honestly. Not because technology isnt there, but because you need people to play on one system. Most would check "I dont mind playing weaker opponents" but not many would want to play higher. Why? Because MOST the population wants promotions, and wants to feel good about winning. That would happen more often if you have a higher % to play only lower. For a system to work, everyone needs to adhere to the same standards. My thoughts exactly. If they implement something like that you might as well throw the entire ladder system out of the window because ranks and leagues will have even less meaning then they already did.
Well it works on chess... Maybe it's time they switch to a superior rating system...
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I would like that option to play higher/lower skilled players for reasons mentioned already in this thread. Only way to get to play much higher skilled players is to sign up for a tournament. I've found those games particularly interesting because similar skilled players tend to give me more room for mistakes.
Getting steamrolled all the time isn't fun though. :p
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On April 13 2012 19:45 Natespank wrote:
couldn't they just turn it off for bronze and masters? Why cancel it? stupid.
That's a good point. A distributed variance would be better, one that is very low for the end of the curve (so bronze and masters) and higher for the guys in the middle.
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thank god, maybe I finally can beat someone
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Was it just me or did the matchmaking for team games completely suck ?
From what I noticed it seemed like they applied new rules regarding the whole teams, but the makeup of the teams was still done the old-fashioned way. So you had teams of bronz-silver against teams of diamond players. If they mixed also the teams themselves it might have worked, but as it was it was a slaughter
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On April 13 2012 19:28 Yndigo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 17:31 Mendelfist wrote:On April 13 2012 17:21 Yndigo wrote:Saying that you win often, you get promoted faster if you play more people with higher MMR. Yes, but you shouldn't get matched against people with high MMR more often than low MMR, unless you are in low bronze. It can happen by chance of course, but not on average. Why not? If I am as good as a high master player, why shouldnt it let me play against high master players?
Because the system doesn't know you are as good as a high master player. Your MMR is what the system thinks your skill level is at. Why should the system give you more opponents above your MMR than below?
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Well I didnt noticed it cause I only play 1 game a month. And I am only platinum.
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changed that fast, why not enable lan settings while their at it.
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I guess everyone was quite unhappy about it. Many rants about fighting people ranked higher and losing.
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On April 13 2012 19:32 SigmaoctanusIV wrote:
It was a really good change. Seeing how you can match up against much better players is good experience. Also it gives you a reason to try harder against everyone cause you know they might be way better than you.
This was the reason that this was an awesome change!
I am not saying it wasnt bad for forever Bronze players and IdrA's, because it was.
But for everyone else this was the best thing to happen, you'll get a better sense of the game if that Terran 10min tank push comes at 8 when you have better players playing you and you get steam rolled. You'll be like "Woah I normally own that, better accommodate this new timing" and BOOM your working at a much faster pace than if another player came with a 9:30 and you barely survive.
I still think they should just work around the top/ bottom end of MMR not the rest of us
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I liked it :/ The main complaints i could find about it were from bronzies and team gamers. Making it optional and only for 1v1 would be perfect but that might be hard to have the matchmaking system working with everyone preferring something different.
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anyone on EU played already?
did they change it for EU already?
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Damn it, I liked the changes
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boppel its the same on EU. Ive been playing 1100 point master from previous season alot now. Personally, i dont like it.
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I didn`t mind Blizzard trying it and I give them props for taking it back fast, after realising this isn`t helpful at all.
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i dont know how i feel about the changes yet, but nice reaction time if rly it didnt work :/
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
This would require an interface change, which simply cannot be done.
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They tried something, gathered data, and found it didn't work so they stopped doing it.
Sounds perfectly logical and worth a shot
Good work ^^
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I am glad about this. I was getting 6 points for a win and 16 for a loss TT.
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I actually thought it was brilliant and i was happy that it was implemented.
I've been playing way better then against my mmr opponents, just because i know i can do better but slack alot when i play my mmr opponents. From all the favored people i still have a 58% winrate over them, and against only my own mmr opponents it's only 59% :S
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Lol it was fun playing really weak players one moment, and then playing that one random masters player. I just wish it would have told me when i was playing someone in a lower league.
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Are you sure they changed it back yet? Yesterday (when it was announced) I did play several players that were VERY noticeably better than what I had played before.
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This doesn't have anything to do with the match making system; but has anyone noticed the increase in zerg players? It looks like there are more this season... anyways, back on topic. It was a good idea tho, maybe if the players went against people in their own league but at higher levels? Like it would be possible for a low silver to go against a high silver, just not often.
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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/ZlOeZ.jpg)
Thanks Blizzard back to square one. Lol. Search time is too good.
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On April 13 2012 22:42 covetousrat wrote:Thanks Blizzard back to square one. Lol. Search time is too good.
4vs4.. serious shit
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Thank god, so many games were a total waste of practice time T_T
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Thank god. Being in Platinum I'm no god but I was being matched up with players so bad I felt like I was back in Silver league. Some dude went Mass Marine/Viking against me and would fly around, land his vikings and try to harass me. I built high templar and won. The next guy tried to marine tank all in me and move commanded his entire fucking army including scvs past me and didn't even correct this until he had like 3 marines and an SCV left.
Shit like this was happening constantly. Thank god I can play an even game of SC2 again.
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But, i guess id feel bad if i was diamond having to play a lot of masters, or a GM playing low masters......
i was enjoying playing more masters than i did before this...
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Thank god. As diamond I was just getting used to beating low-mid masters. With this change I played 10 top 8 masters in a row and lost every game. Awful change, thankfully they changed back.
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aww im 16-3 this season =\ oh well it guess it was prolly too much for low/high level players
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im sad.was able to play alot of gms that way
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maybe its just me but aside 1-2 games i played games from within diamond and i am diamond....I don't know how blizzard decides that something doesn't work within 2-3 days..
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Ladder anxiety is for kids
But really though, I hadn't noticed a change. My friend ended up going 10-22 in master though. Not the most fun. He had to play some pros, which he got mopped.
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Wow, that was a rather quick switch! I did not have time to play one game during the matchmaking test, so I guess I really can't say anything, but I still think that facing players that are considerably better than you is a good way to assess your own skill.
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At first I didn’t like the change because I was being paired with a lot of Gold players (im plat). Later on I was paired with Diamond players which helped improve my game. I like being able to compare myself to higher skilled players. I think it is good to be paired up with someone much better to help improve. Then when you on a losing slump, some low ones help boost your confidence. I liked it over all.
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Sweet i wonderd why i was playing Dimond peoples when im in silver, learning terran. Im a gold random/toss/zerg but TERRIBAD at terran, its just strange. But yeah good stuff
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On April 13 2012 23:01 Ripebananaa wrote:
Ladder anxiety is for kids
But really though, I hadn't noticed a change. My friend ended up going 10-22 in master though. Not the most fun. He had to play some pros, which he got mopped.
ye it happened to me too i got like 1-7 and stopped playing i was matched with only top players >.>
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fuck i had won all my matches hopefully trying to get out of bronze, dismantled all the golds and silvers i played.
oh well another season of bronze.
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I really liked the change :| Got to play a couple GM players that I normally wouldn't be able to and won a couple of them.
Oh well, hope they tweak it a bit and bring it back!
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This explains why some of my friends who were gold got matched against high Diamond players lol.
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for a moment I read matchfixing charges reverted! Savior was gonna come back!!!... and then I read again
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damn I liked the change lol...got to whoop up on some low diamond and plats :D
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On April 13 2012 16:32 Sisko wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better. The technology just isnt there yet.
Just... No. Remember Iccup and all those players asking only for higher ranked players ?... Resulting in no games for the rank below.
Just plain retarded.
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Not sure how the matchmaking affected my laddering. I have a pretty good positive record in Season 7 so far and I've been playing a good number of high-mid Gold players (I'm #1 in my Silver division), as well as a couple of Plat players. I'm not sure if playing these players was either because of the new matchmaking or because I was doing better. Guess I get to find out now.
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On April 13 2012 23:16 SyntechiTV wrote:fuck i had won all my matches hopefully trying to get out of bronze, dismantled all the golds and silvers i played. oh well another season of bronze.
So if you're winning against silver and gold players... why aren't you winning against bronze players who are far worse? And if you do, what makes you think you will stay in bronze for a whole season? Just win and you will be promoted.
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aw man for the first time i was playing a lot of masters kids! came out with a winning record too. disappointing :/
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I actually liked playing against stronger/higher ranked opponents...
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Wow they pulled this change so fast but when it came to the snipe nerf... No changes at all. When it comes to making the Hydra a useful unit no rush no rush. Carrier? is that even in the game? wtf?
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i liked playing harder opponents ... learnt alot more from it than i have playing the even matches i normally have ... id rather be 40:60 W:L than 60:40 ¬_¬ atleast i know then when im improving
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A lot of people were losing every single game, while many others were only winning. Closer opponents almost always equal closer better games.
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
Perfectly said.
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Didn't like the new matchmaking thing. Being a bronze player I definitely did not enjoy losing 10 straight games cause they put me up against silver/golds. Prefer that it be evenly matched
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Pretty much the moral of the story is just that people who are a bit weaker WANT to play people a bit stronger, but on the flip side the people who are a bit stronger don't want to beat players who might possibly not have refined play / challenge them. For example, pre-patch I was still slightly favoured vs. other GM players, but after patch I play people who were 200-230 and low masters.
That being said, I'm not against the idea at all, but it'll very well inflate the record of those at the top and matchmaking will have a tough time getting everyone to a 50% win rate if this system stays.
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Damn, I kinda liked this change, tbh
It was the first time I played master opponents (3 guys) since I started playing SC2, and I won 2 games out of 3.
Funny thing, one of the master guy I beat said something along the lines of + Show Spoiler +"DAMN FUCK YOU DIAMONDS GUY SERIOUSLY YOU CAN'T PLAY FOR SHIT AND NOW WE LOSE CAUSE WE PLAY AGAINST NOOBS LIKE YOU".
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finally, was pretty frustrating to loss gainst gm´s but i think i got better in this experiment after playin all these pro´s but my ladderstats got worse^^
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Was blown away at some of the people I was playing on my account, thank youu for the revert!
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On April 13 2012 15:19 warcralft wrote:
This is awesome. NO MORE PLAYING WITH RANK 1 GM(on sea) 8 times in a row~~~
Wouldn't that mean you are at least masters? I would assume that if anyone was half decent and competitive, would love the opportunity to play against someone better than them. Perhaps I'm wrong though, not quite sure.
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Have to say although I didn't complain about the changes I'm happy they're gone. Not played too many but got absolutely crushed vs someone significantly better than I am (and then BM'd for losing?) but also crushed two people who weren't bad but just seemed less experienced than I was and I felt bad in all 3 cases. Happy for the revert!
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
This is a good idea...very easy solution
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On April 14 2012 00:02 Chronald wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better. Perfectly said.
And perfectly wrong.
To keep the overall fairness, the system still should try maintain a win ratio of about 50%. If you want to play versus lower or higher league players, you have to get it the other way around sooner or later.
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I see, 2 years after sc2 release most people still don't know how the matchmaking system works
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As a non masters player I enjoyed the changes.. Too bad they couldnt impliment the change for lower tier players and leave the masters match making alone
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I’m a little disappointed I think from a percentage standpoint all they had to do was cut off the top and bottom 5%. I think it’s a great idea for anyone that is NOT in Bonze or Grand Masters. I was actually looking forward to it. I get to help people under me and play people significantly higher than me, which means I can get promoted faster . Boohoo…. Hopefully, they’ll figure it out.
It also allows you to try new strategies that you might not otherwise try when the matching system is so tight. If you play someone that is significantly lower than you, people are apt to try wonky builds.
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Aw, i thought it was kind of nice playing something outside of my league =/ The irony of it all was that in the five games i played, I lost my three games to other plat players and my diamond and gold opponents i beat
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I hope they try again with a slightly different system that narrows the band of possible opponents for players who have really high or low MMRs.
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As a casual player I liked the change. It was fun getting to play players a bit more above and below my own skill level. However, I totally understand that this really screwed up matchmaking at the top of GM and the lowest levels of bronze, so they had to revert it. I hope they look at another way to make this kind of looser matchmaking possible, maybe it could even be a setting you can turn on or off, I don't see how that would be impossible to implement.
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I only played two games before the switch.
Both were against diamond players and both felt pretty competitive for the duration of the match. Now I'm sad I didn't ladder more
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Well this is unfortunate. I wanted to play around with the new system for a bit.
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On April 13 2012 15:23 Malpractice.248 wrote:
All masters is, is more refined cheese :p
You defend it; then the macro begins.
You mean good players have well-timed openings that can easily transition into macro games? Who'da thunk it.
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i guess it makes streams alot less exciting aswell, ive watched some idra and some of his opponents werent nearly able to compete with him, and there were alot of these.
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Oh thank god that they changed it back... I absolutely hate beating someone who was rated higher and then being matched up against someone who is hardly masters... Pretty annoying, especially when you get cheesed or all-ind and lose.
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Yesterday I played 3v3 with a couple of friends. It was absolutely ridicules. The matchmaking system is never good in the beginning of a new season, but we were placed against silver, gold, diamond and master teams while we are a diamond team ourselves. Getting steamrolled and then steamroll yourself is a lot less fun than playing equal opponents.
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What if they just applied the change to silver->masters and not bronze/GM, leaving them on the standard ranking system?
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
This is a fantastic idea, and I think they should implement this into the system. That way Masters players could play GM, but those in let's say, gold, who seem to be struggling can work on basic mechanics against silver and bronze level players, if they choose to do so.
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On April 14 2012 01:50 Beast Mode wrote:
What if they just applied the change to silver->masters and not bronze/GM, leaving them on the standard ranking system?
Then you just move the "always playing against people significantly better/worse (depending on which end) than me" problem to silver and masters.
Basically, someone is always going to have the lopsided matchmaking system. Hell, bottom of bronze, and gm always will. It's just a matter of finding how lopsided is too lopsided. They decided this was too lopsided.
Having a compressed MMR system due to caps at both ends won't be helping matters in this regard, either.
(I'm willing to bet 0 - 1 and (cap - 1) to (cap) are the 2 highest skill ranges for a single point MMR difference)
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Props to Blizzard. I'm very surprised at the speed they reversed it. I really thought they would keep it for the remainder of the season. Hopefully, they can try it again later. I think, with some tweaking, it could be a really cool feature. I really liked playing against masters players (I'm diamond), and seeing how much improving I still have to do. It can be really easy to fool myself into thinking I've hit my mechanical peak when I'm playing people at my own relatively shitty skill level.
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sigh. high masters 2v2 queue times are going to be long....
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Glad to see it removed. Hopefully nobody quit playing forever!
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On April 14 2012 01:26 chadissilent wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 15:23 Malpractice.248 wrote:
All masters is, is more refined cheese :p
You defend it; then the macro begins.
You mean good players have well-timed openings that can easily transition into macro games? Who'da thunk it.
Honestly, A lot don't... They have been told macro macro macro and get angry when they get punished early.
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I ididn't even get the chance to utilize it T_T, i guess feed back was REALLY REALLY bad for Blizzard to revert something that quickly
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I wish they would have kept the change, I was loving it.
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I enjoyed losing to much better high masters players than my mid masters self. I'll miss this change -- fun to analyze and check BOs and such.
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I didn't notice anything different really...
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Thank goodness they changed it back. I am in bronze and I noticed that I had to lose like 70-ish % of my games to get bronze opponents. Practicing wasn't all that fun when you got steamrolled by top 8 golds all the time. I know that doesn't sound like much but for a noob like me the difference in skill was huge.
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I never really noticed any changes while I was laddering. The opponents I was facing where around the same skill that I would expect to face any other season.
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Personally I didn't like it. After the initial change I wont 10 out of 14 games because It pitted me against lower teir players, sure I got two play two masters out of the 14 games which was cool (and I won those games btw) but the majority of the games were against low teir diamond. Now with the change I'm back to about a 50%~60% win ratio rather than that ridiculous 71% which means I am getting more consistent practice which will help me more in the long run.
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
True and im sure some people would mark up Weaker opponents as well.
Still think blizzard needs a reconnect option.
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I didnt think the noobs played at all, so it shouldnt have been an issue
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On April 14 2012 01:27 ChriseC wrote:
i guess it makes streams alot less exciting aswell, ive watched some idra and some of his opponents werent nearly able to compete with him, and there were alot of these.
So you´re sayin that his opponents which were not as good as him making the game more exciting. To be honest that does not make any sense at all.
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seems really dumb to change it in the first place
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can't they just make GM players have the old MM and everyone else the new way?
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and i wonder why i not get 1,4k master anymore xD kind of sad cause this guys was the only one i could beat (good players are way easier to beat... dont know why but they play absolute unsafe)
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On April 13 2012 15:24 JiYan wrote:
tbh i liked the changes oh well =\
Yeah. Back to more cheesy bastards in diamond
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My prayers to the heavens have been answered.
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I had fun when they matched me with a crappy player to stomp!
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I found it kind of annoying because I'd win against a masters player (play is relatively predictable and makes sense) and then lose to a platinum player that did an all in I haven't seen in months and forgot even existed.
BTW....platinum players seem like the most BM of all players...many think they're really good and call people newbs a lot. And not even after the game but at the start, during, and after regardless if they win or not.
Just found it annoying.
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Brunei Darussalam566 Posts
On April 14 2012 06:58 Innovation wrote:
I found it kind of annoying because I'd win against a masters player (play is relatively predictable and makes sense) and then lose to a platinum player that did an all in I haven't seen in months and forgot even existed.
BTW....platinum players seem like the most BM of all players...many think they're really good and call people newbs a lot. And not even after the game but at the start, during, and after regardless if they win or not.
Just found it annoying.
You got matched with Masters and Platinum players? I find this highly unlikely.
I played around 10-15 games since the start of the season and, being mid diamond, I faced: 2 or 3 high diamond players and ONE #1 ranked platinum player who was like on a 10 game winning streak. The rest were all around my level.
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Wow the OP was playing GM players before the GM ladder was even unlocked! I wish i was half as good
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Wow a random survey taken of the people in this thread would indicate that everyone here smashes people above them, loses to people below them because they're not playing correctly, but likes the revert to the old MM system.
Even though they experimented with some changes, it's good to see a steady stream of delusion to anchor it all down
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i liked the changed. got my first season6-gm sculp.
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On April 14 2012 05:53 MooLen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 14 2012 01:27 ChriseC wrote:
i guess it makes streams alot less exciting aswell, ive watched some idra and some of his opponents werent nearly able to compete with him, and there were alot of these. So you´re sayin that his opponents which were not as good as him making the game more exciting. To be honest that does not make any sense at all.
Pretty sure you said that wrong. He said it makes it a lot less exciting, since his opponents weren't able to keep up?
On April 14 2012 07:06 Romitelli wrote:Show nested quote +On April 14 2012 06:58 Innovation wrote:
I found it kind of annoying because I'd win against a masters player (play is relatively predictable and makes sense) and then lose to a platinum player that did an all in I haven't seen in months and forgot even existed.
BTW....platinum players seem like the most BM of all players...many think they're really good and call people newbs a lot. And not even after the game but at the start, during, and after regardless if they win or not.
Just found it annoying. You got matched with Masters and Platinum players? I find this highly unlikely. I played around 10-15 games since the start of the season and, being mid diamond, I faced: 2 or 3 high diamond players and ONE #1 ranked platinum player who was like on a 10 game winning streak. The rest were all around my level.
How in the world are you calling him out? You said yourself you've experienced a plat, and some high diamonds (virtually interchangeable with masters) and you've played a measly 10-15 games? If anything, your evidence is in support of his claims.
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I thought the system was pretty stupid. On my plat account I was playing kids in top bronze. The games were laughably bad. I thought the guy was trolling me then I remembered what blizz did to match making and all the foolishness made sense.
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I thought it was great, I didn't play against anyone easier, only "Favored" and "Slightly Favored" opponents. I thought it was really upping the difficulty level for me which I enjoyed.
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It's especially interesting when you're bronze and you see that the person you've lost to is, well, MASTERS. T.T Although I did have some fun.
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Hard to believe you played a masters when you re in bronze. Sorry bub.
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On April 14 2012 07:51 UpooPoo wrote:
I thought it was great, I didn't play against anyone easier, only "Favored" and "Slightly Favored" opponents. I thought it was really upping the difficulty level for me which I enjoyed.
thats like that for everyone at the start of a new season because your points are compared to your opponents MMR and his points to your MMR. everyone has 0 points at start of a season and now guess why everyone was favored vs you. yes 1+1=2
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I feel like the previously mentioned "I don't want to play worse/better players" issue often only applies to the far extremes of the ranking (Bronze & Grandmaster). Blizzard could implement some function within the ladder where the extremes of the ladder are not included (Silver--Masters can still have high variance, while the ultra casuals at Bronze and the gosu players at Grandmasters are not included). I feel that if you are anywhere from Silver to Master league, any high variance is simply good practice. If you are in Bronze, you can very easily ladder with other Bronze players and become better, as even playing Silvers can be an excessive test of your (most likely) very low skill. If you are in Grandmasters, you more than likely have many practice partners/do not find it necessary to play worse players simply for the added "security" in terms of testing builds, and you don't have to deal with gaining 1 point after winning against a low Masters and losing 20 when you do poorly versus people around your skill level. I did not like the change as it was, however I feel they could have changed some of what it applies to instead of removing it.
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
Yeah, in HoN I know there's an option when you queue up for "shorter queues or fair matches" or something like that.
I think it's pretty good. In SC2 the queue times are generally pretty short imo though, so not much of an issue.
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Well that didn't take long.
Lower level players had a tough time for the duration of this so called new matchmaking system though :/
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Weirdly enough, from the start of season 7, I, a low bronze nublet, ended up on a 17 game winning streak.
I'm not sure if I got some freaky, freaky draw there or something, but it doesn't seem right that I ended up absolutely roflstomping the ladder during a time when I should have been given stronger opponents.
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I didn't enjoy the match making change.
I basically had a 80% winrate in diamond, and got top 3 before the ladder lock came and ended up in diamond again :/
Essentially, I was winning all my low tier games, barely squeaking out games or just getting squashed against mid-high masters, my combined record during the ladder change was 8-14
Which I think dropped my MMR by quite a bit.
These games weren't really helping me better because I felt like I was just getting outplayed and squashed, or the game was just ridiculously easy for me to win (aka 1a terran pushes = gg)
Since the change I'm back to 12-3, meeting just diamond-low masters, game feels a bit more competitive but still one-sided due to my MMR plummetting facing nothing but masters players for a 6-7 games in a row. Hopefully blizzard keeps this method
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On April 14 2012 06:58 Innovation wrote:
I found it kind of annoying because I'd win against a masters player (play is relatively predictable and makes sense) and then lose to a platinum player that did an all in I haven't seen in months and forgot even existed.
BTW....platinum players seem like the most BM of all players...many think they're really good and call people newbs a lot. And not even after the game but at the start, during, and after regardless if they win or not.
Just found it annoying.
I disagree. my time in platinum, it was fairly good manners. Nothing bad, nothing good.
The worst is high-diamond-low masters level.Every single game they seem to lose, its some random excuse, some race imbal or they choose to hurl unnecessary insults at me which is sort of humourous and annoying at the same time.
But yes, platinum players are a lot less predictable because they'll just do somthing unexpected and throw you off.
On April 14 2012 07:06 Romitelli wrote:Show nested quote +On April 14 2012 06:58 Innovation wrote:
I found it kind of annoying because I'd win against a masters player (play is relatively predictable and makes sense) and then lose to a platinum player that did an all in I haven't seen in months and forgot even existed.
BTW....platinum players seem like the most BM of all players...many think they're really good and call people newbs a lot. And not even after the game but at the start, during, and after regardless if they win or not.
Just found it annoying. You got matched with Masters and Platinum players? I find this highly unlikely. I played around 10-15 games since the start of the season and, being mid diamond, I faced: 2 or 3 high diamond players and ONE #1 ranked platinum player who was like on a 10 game winning streak. The rest were all around my level.
It's likely. I can attest to it. I got put up with during my 8-14 run witih the ladder match making..3 high plats, 3 low masters, 5 mid masters and 2 high masters :/..and 11 diamonds...
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
I like you and this suggestion. I would probably ladder more if I could always have the chance to play people considered stronger than me. I haven't laddered for almost 2 seasons =/ I just don't like facing people who are considered my skill level, or in my MMR. I came from AoK days where you could face people who are top of the line and you learn so much faster getting your face smashed in over and over eventually beating those people.
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thnaks for this no more cheeses
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sad... i was playing so many Plats and had an okay winning record... (4-5 i think... i am gold on SEA) now back to playing golds... less chance of promotion IMO.
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edit: woops wrong thread.
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:S Didn't have time to test the changes. But by the looks of everything it didn't seem so good
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In the two days, only few games were played. Over the long run, no-one would be able to sustain 80% win rate or getting crushed endlessly. The small sample of game played is no good indicator of the quality of the tested new search range. It would be possbile to ensure almost anyone nearly perfect 50% winrate without too large win or loss streaks, but that wouldn't feel very natural. (If you above 50%, you get too hard guys, otherwise you get too weak opponents.)
On April 14 2012 06:02 striderxxx wrote:
can't they just make GM players have the old MM and everyone else the new way?
Match making works both ways. If you have master players with loosened search range, they still get (too many?) GM players. While it should be possible, to widen the search range only for the leagues in the middle, it is not that easy.
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
I agree with this. I would prefer to mostly play against weaker opponents since I would like to win about 75% of my matches. At the same time some players may want harder opponents so this would benefits everyone.
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So I wasn't going to comment on it at first but since it keeps being brought up the "I don't mind playing weaker/stronger opponents" checkbox selection is a really bad way to do the system. A much better way would just be to allow you to play with the more relaxed method but only either higher or lower depending on your current wins or losses to more quickly allow people to end up where they're meant to be on ladder, so that the system can more easily get people in to fun games.
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On April 13 2012 15:41 dronefarm wrote:I'm disapointed. Since we can not reset our accounts, I think this was the best solution to have some variance. Just playing against players your skill level is not the best way to improve. Day9 did an old podcast where he talks about this. http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/intrigue/Day90006PlayAgainstWorsePlay.mp3You need to play against worse players to be comforatable enough to try some new stuff without the fear of instantly losing, and you need to test those ideas against better players to make sure you're not doing anything that can be punished. The only way to do this before the ladder reformat was buying multiple accounts, which a lot of people who play starcraft can't really afford (ie high school, and college students). I wish they'd just let you reset your account when you wanted to.
Been busy and I didn't even get a chance to try it out yet... I was kind of interested in seeing what it would be like. I am at Mid-Low masters now so I was playing a mix of Masters and Diamond. I was hoping to have a more varied experience, because right now, every game is kind of frustrating. "Too even" means I have no chances to test my skill or try stuff out dronefarm said.
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It kinda felt more relaxing to play =P oh well, still love sc2 no matter who i face.
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On April 14 2012 11:13 GuitarBizarre wrote:
Weirdly enough, from the start of season 7, I, a low bronze nublet, ended up on a 17 game winning streak.
I'm not sure if I got some freaky, freaky draw there or something, but it doesn't seem right that I ended up absolutely roflstomping the ladder during a time when I should have been given stronger opponents.
I had a pretty much opposite experience. Won 5 matches at first but then faced only golds and silvers and I am not either so I ended up on huge losing streaks and winning only 2 out of 10 matches for a long time.
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oh sad i used to bash bronze newbs ( im rank 2 master last s ) in 4v4 whole night, it was fun :D
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They should keep the matchmaking system, but use it in a more clever way like:
80% of the matches of the same level or league
10% against higher levels
10% against lower leagues
That way you could at least test if you are on par with higher levels considering you are in the top 8 of your division.
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Good thing they changed it back, for me atleast.
I had a day i only played alot less skilled people which led to huge mmr gain, next day i was only matches with people way better so i dropped right back.... to wide selection of people you could be matched with which made it kinda random if u meet to good players all day or to bad players all day.
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I want = - + system
1.match even
2.me favored
3. unfavored
and even favored ufavored again again and all will be happy and me tooo please ......
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The problem was that you didn't know when you were playing someone significantly better/weaker than you.
It's not the same thing as playing against a friend you know is a lower league than you, if I go into a game and have to spend 10 minutes determining how much worse a player is than me, I'm going to continue using my regular play incase he isn't worse. And in the case of 'better' players, it's often hard to determine whether he's just a high member of your league or much higher than you until it's too late. And better players are often much better at abusing openings (holes) in weaker players strategies, so it can be challenging to know whether or not your build is bad, your macro was bad, or your strategy is bad, because those are all exploitable.
If there was a big icon on the loading screen saying like, "this player is majorly favoured" and it did the same thing in the replay or something, then I would think it's a great change. I also think you should have lost no points to playing better players, as many people in this thread, myself included, went on big losing streaks to players ahead of us.
(I lost 7 games in a row to low masters players, but I ended up feeling really shitty because I wasn't entirely sure whether it was them outplaying me or me underperforming.)
All in all, happy to see it go, but I wish they had executed it better because I feel like it could be a beneficial to laddering, except to the top top pros, it just sucks for them. Maybe top 8 masters + GM shouldn't have it if the reimplement in the future?
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I dont know why but suddenly i have lost for 2 days even after they removed it and i dropped down a league, a league which i had no problem getting into before.. good job blizz, fucking with something that was fine to begin with imo.....
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wow, that sucks.. sort of preferred the new system
playing opponents better than you = better practice, though being on the contrary side it's kind of nerve-wrecking
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On April 16 2012 06:48 RiPPy wrote:
I dont know why but suddenly i have lost for 2 days even after they removed it and i dropped down a league, a league which i had no problem getting into before.. good job blizz, fucking with something that was fine to begin with imo.....
That literally has NOTHING to do with Blizzard. It's your fault you got demoted.
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On April 16 2012 07:02 XenocideFTW wrote:Show nested quote +On April 16 2012 06:48 RiPPy wrote:
I dont know why but suddenly i have lost for 2 days even after they removed it and i dropped down a league, a league which i had no problem getting into before.. good job blizz, fucking with something that was fine to begin with imo..... That literally has NOTHING to do with Blizzard. It's your fault you got demoted.
Ofcourse it does DOH!... The system change got me stuck in some imba twilight zone where i dont belong HENSE matchmaking system fails....for days i was matched with 10x better people, didnt matter if my mmr dropped, still was stuck there.
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
This fellow is on to something here!
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On April 16 2012 12:09 tReaper wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better. This fellow is on to something here!
This would skew the win rate depending on which options the player chooses.
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On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
great suggestion for something that should be added but will never be added cus its....well blizzard
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Glad about the change. Played my first game in 3 months a few days ago, and got horribly dominated even though I had a surprisingly good game. It was only afterwards that I found out I played a gm player on a huge win streak. Was wondering how after 3 months of being absent, my MMR managed to pair me against someone of this caliber.
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i got some diamond players constanty cheesing me so gay
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I really wish the game would show what league your opponent was in rather than just the vague "opponent is slightly favored" and etc we currently have.
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Hmm I didn't even get to experience this trial.
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Is this why I've got utterly crushed since the start of season 7, with the exception of a couple of people so bad I thought they were in placement?
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Damn no wonder lol. I didn't ladder until after it was reverted >.< I wanted to see what it was like playing vs some GMs lol.
On April 13 2012 15:41 niteReloaded wrote:
This would be a perfectly good adition to the personal options....
"I don't mind playing weaker opponents" [ ]
"I don't mind playing stronger opponents" [X]
Sure, it would only work in cases where the weak and strong are looking for each other, but things like that make the service better.
Wow nice idea, I wonder why they don't do it? (well maybe that's obvious, they're busy and still have a lot of other things to implement xD)
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I didn't mind the changes....
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So, I'm not sure I believe that the changes have really been reverted. In my last four games - you can check my match history if you want (zennith.872) I have played a rank 4 masters who finished last season top 8 (he was favored), followed by a rank 1 diamond this season (I was favored), followed by a rank 1 masters who was in GM last season (he was favored), followed by a rank 11 diamond player (I was favored).
This makes no sense if they've really reverted the changes - and I have 2000+ wins on the account, so my mmr should be pretty stable...
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They did not revert the changes. It's pretty obvious that it's not back to the way it was. Or they just said they reverted them but actually put it somewhere in between the new and old settings.
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I’m also a bit suspicious about the ‘reverted’ ladder matching.
I’m a low Diamond… my 4 games last night:
Low plat
Low plat
Mid diamond
High gold
I just came off a winning streak… how does that make any sense? Why would I be playing a high gold who was on a 5 game losing streak.. and was pretty mediocre record prior to that?
I hadn’t faced a gold prior to last night in MONTHS and that includes when I was in platinum and went on 10 or 12 game losing streaks… Now I’m diamond on a winning streak and I face a gold? Seriously?
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All this was good for is showing me that the skill gap between the top of bronze and the middle of platinum is almost nonexistent.
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i also get the feeling change hasn't been reverted, and if in fact they have tampered with it, they only changed it back slightly
my opponents league/skill range is just too funky...
EU server
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Lol. Matchmaking changes were reverted and now i go from beating a rank 11 master zerg to beating a rank 50ish diamond terran? Uh? Is that how it was before???
edit: they both had 30+ games so its not like they have yet to re-rank this season.
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I just went from playing a mid masters guy to then facing aTnCloud
good times
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Yeah, it seems to me too that it has not been reverted (Europe, high diamond playing people from mid plat to low master).
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Europe Master, the changes have almost certainly NOT been reverted!
In my last few matches, I got matched against two opponents that had huge variance in their match history. One of them had a game where he lost 2 points (so his opponent had much higher mmr than his adjusted points) and followed a game where he lost 16 points (so his opponent was pretty lower mmr than his adjusted points.
Another opponent had -3 and -15.
Myself I had +5 and +22 (adjusted points. no bonus pool involved).
These were all during evening times on EU, not crazy hours where few people are online. 7-10 pm.
Either Blizzard is secretly playing around with the parameters, or they haven't reverted them back on EU at all.
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Definitely not reverted. Playing anywhere from t8 Masters to t100 Diamond, have played maybe three or four even matches in the last two days. I'm t50 Masters, NA.
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Yeah, not reverted. I'm top master, usually play high master/GM but then i play low master... wtf? I even got a diamond i got 1 point for beating 2 days ago...
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My games these days have been (I'm mid-masters)
High masters
High Diamond
High masters
High Diamond
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whether it is reverted or not, i am all for it. shorter search times for mildly better or lesser opponents is good.
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I wouldnt mind being crushed by some GM players, would learn a lot from watching the replays Didn't run into anyone except in my league unfortunately
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Good change, pro players were probably getting some unsatisfactory practice, and it wasn't much difference for me. Got stomped some, which could be helpful, by looking at opponent's play.
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i like crushing people worse than me
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hrmm.. tough to tell. I have been matching vs masters players (I am high diamond). Not sure if it is because of funky MM or if I am actually improving.
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I got the best so far.
Every game I have vs'd someone who is favored/slightly favored. When i win I get like 2-3 points only because they say that I am the one who was favored or w/e.
Same thing if neither side is favored, I win and I get told I was favored or I lose -20 because I was favored.
I've fought masters/diamonds/platinums(What the fuck...) in my last 30 or so matches. Up and down and all over the place.
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i really liked the diverse 1v1 skills on ladder, now its back to being work, and i just want to have fun.
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Why don't we have an option to choose if we want this diverse rage on or not. Some people may like it.
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Sigh.. lol ok last 5 win streak: First to last
Mid Master
Mid Master
Mid Diamond
Mid Diamond
Low Diamond
Am i the only one that sees something wrong here?!
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On April 21 2012 06:41 Sajaki wrote:
Sigh.. lol ok last 5 win streak: First to last
Mid Master
Mid Master
Mid Diamond
Mid Diamond
Low Diamond
Am i the only one that sees something wrong here?!
I am also getting a broader range of opponents, but I like it, so...
shhh
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On April 21 2012 06:41 Sajaki wrote:
Sigh.. lol ok last 5 win streak: First to last
Mid Master
Mid Master
Mid Diamond
Mid Diamond
Low Diamond
Am i the only one that sees something wrong here?!
It's okay,
My last ten wins
Mid Masters
Low Masters
High Diamond
High PLatinum
Low Masters
Mid Platinum
High Masters
High Diamond
Mid Masters.
Four Losses in between:
Mid masters
Low Masters
Mid Masters
Mid Masters
I'm high diamond.
Something's clearly wrong with the picture.
Yep.
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I'm in diamond league. Out of my last 10 games i got 2 other diamond, 3 platinum and 5 master players. Even after 2 wins against master players (they had slightly over 50%-winrate) i got a platinum opponent (who wasn't even ranked very high).
Seems really strange and random to me...
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I am curious as how do you guys know if people is low/mid/high, you can't trust points only, you need to see that suddenly you won 17 points (+ bonus pool) or won only 3 points or lost only 2-7 points.
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Still feels broken...
Playing against people I am much better than over and over... It's honestly not even fun /shrug, it just feels like a huge waste of time.
I really hope they fix this asap.
If only Korea didn't have delay =(
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Its really nerve-wracking to be honest. Being near the bottom of masters, I constantly feel like I'm about to be demoted when I'm favored or slightly favored, especially given my losing streaks. Having a lot of even matches makes me feel much more comfortable playing than the schizophrenic ladder system in place now.
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Got matched up with TLO. <.<
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My matches have been flipping between low diamond to high masters, with a single high plat.
This feels different than before, maybe they're tweaking it without making a post about it?
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United Kingdom20284 Posts
I met a silver league last night on ladder, he had about 60% win ratio (no higher) and got destroyed by me, loosing only 2 points while i gained 16 (no bonus pool).
Im hitting masters on ladder and met up with him, and keep getting random matches with gold league guys In the middle of my diamond winstreaks o.o
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If it is that extreme then there is no doubt about the league being re reverted.
They might just be testing things temporarily and might write a blog with the conclusions in the future.
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Went from losing to IdrA to playing a diamond. How fun.
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I thought Blizzard said they reverted the changes already? Or are they going to do it sometime in the future? I've won the last 7 or so games, lost the first game to a diamond, then played a low gold and I've won there.
The second to the last game I won was against a diamond, not sure how high, then the last game was to a high gold...?
This just feels wrong.
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This is seriously annoying..playing nothing but people im atleast slightly favored against...
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wtf is this shit ? they sneaked the changes back in
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I was wondering, why I was playing against a HighBronze after a HighPlat :o
I'm in Plat and I would like if my opponents would range from Mid Gold to HighDia and maybe 1/50 a low masters.
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im about 25-30th in diamond. Im constantly playing top8 plats or top8diamonds, nothing really inbetween. Got a gold too, which probably wasnt that fun for him.
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The matchmaking changes are most definitely back. It's visible in the match history of anyone who played a lot the last few days. If you look at the losses they are usually close to -12, but after the change it swings a lot more due to the wider MMR range. It seems to have happened around yesterday.
And no, I don't like it.
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As a mid-diamond I went from playing mid/high diamonds and then suddenly got a high gold. ... Wut? What's the point?
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Lol I'm high plat, managed to kill 2 bases with surprisingly effective cannon rushes against zerg but still lost. Turns out the dude is mid masters -_-
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Im mid/high masters i dont get this I get favored/slightly favored who are my lvl or above and get +2 - +4 for beating them and in case i loose i get like -25 its retarded.. i can get 10 win streak for 20 and loose once to get -20
EDIT: these whole point gains/losses seem way off .. i see some people on ladder with records like 25-1 having 300 points and guy above him is 320 points and record 27-24 this is just silly.
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I don't think they reverted it, I'm around mid master and I faced diamonds and high masters when normally I'd almost exclusively face people around my level. I lost -1 for a game, and got +21 for another game, so it really seems like the range of opponents is still quite broad. Also, it's really annoying being favored in a zvz because I seem to constantly encounter all-ins and it makes ladder really frustrating sometimes...
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Probably have to wait for tuesday maintenance to roll around to have this fixed. Kind of funny, I am in diamond and I play a masters player one game, then a platinum, then a diamond player the next; it makes so much sense.
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It's not reverted on Europe at least and I hate that new system sooooooo much.
I don't see the point of having 1/3 of my games against awful players and 1/3 against players that definitely find me awful.
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I don't htink they reverted it either. I am facing so many diamonds. and then I get roflstomped by higher masters lol.
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I can't believe that it's been changed back, in plat myself and my past 30 games or so have been against players ranging from silver to diamond. Including silvers who have been playing silvers, diamonds who have been playing diamonds, and just about everything in between.
In previous seasons the majority of games have felt very close, but a lot of these games are very one sided, just wish I could be playing people at my level for most games.
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yeah i played a masters and a plat in consecutive matches yesterday.
I actually REALLY like the broad range of opponents as I like seeing what I do wrong when I get CRUSHED by people.
playing people right around your skill level is going to cause you to plateau significantly faster than playing people further away from your skill level
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playing a 650+ point masters (pretty damn high 2 weeks into the season) and then a platinum player back to back. yeah, nothing suspicious about the match maker at all.
i wonder if blizzard made a legitimate mistake in failing to revert the changes, or if they actually just thought we wouldn't notice?
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Canada13389 Posts
On April 22 2012 05:59 Zeetee wrote:
playing a 650+ point masters (pretty damn high 2 weeks into the season) and then a platinum player back to back. yeah, nothing suspicious about the match maker at all.
i wonder if blizzard made a legitimate mistake in failing to revert the changes, or if they actually just thought we wouldn't notice?
You are lucky, my spread is even match vs other diamond and on the top end a 600+ master leaguer :/
I wish I could play platinum from time to time 
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i am a silver and gold player and i really enjoyed playing against some good plat and diamond players. got some good replays and i think it was worthwile for blizzard to try it.
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Ive been playing against people who recently got promoted to masters, I haven't played people in low masters for like 10 months, so yeah they've fucked up the matchmaking. It's definitely not reverted.
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On April 21 2012 22:03 Veriol wrote:
Im mid/high masters i dont get this I get favored/slightly favored who are my lvl or above and get +2 - +4 for beating them and in case i loose i get like -25 its retarded.. i can get 10 win streak for 20 and loose once to get -20
EDIT: these whole point gains/losses seem way off .. i see some people on ladder with records like 25-1 having 300 points and guy above him is 320 points and record 27-24 this is just silly.
Dear lord this is annoying. I'm having such a hard time gaining any points because a single loss brings me back 10 games.
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Do we have any official word about the matchmaking system being reverted on EU?
It sure doesn't feel like it from the range of players I've been playing. I personally really like it though but I do understand the frustration of the poster above.
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On April 21 2012 22:03 Veriol wrote:
Im mid/high masters i dont get this I get favored/slightly favored who are my lvl or above and get +2 - +4 for beating them and in case i loose i get like -25 its retarded.. i can get 10 win streak for 20 and loose once to get -20
EDIT: these whole point gains/losses seem way off .. i see some people on ladder with records like 25-1 having 300 points and guy above him is 320 points and record 27-24 this is just silly.
Completely agree. This is yet another point where it would have been better to just implement the system of warcraft 3.
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On April 22 2012 23:04 sleepingdog wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 22:03 Veriol wrote:
Im mid/high masters i dont get this I get favored/slightly favored who are my lvl or above and get +2 - +4 for beating them and in case i loose i get like -25 its retarded.. i can get 10 win streak for 20 and loose once to get -20
EDIT: these whole point gains/losses seem way off .. i see some people on ladder with records like 25-1 having 300 points and guy above him is 320 points and record 27-24 this is just silly. Completely agree. This is yet another point where it would have been better to just implement the system of warcraft 3.
what is that system?
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On April 22 2012 05:23 ultimfier wrote:
yeah i played a masters and a plat in consecutive matches yesterday.
I actually REALLY like the broad range of opponents as I like seeing what I do wrong when I get CRUSHED by people.
playing people right around your skill level is going to cause you to plateau significantly faster than playing people further away from your skill level
You will plateau as well the difference is you won't notice it as much because you will play against worse opponents more often. If your aim is to get better it's way more beneficial to have a constant stream of even opponents than having a fluctuation of skilled and unskilled opponents.
On April 22 2012 23:04 sleepingdog wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 22:03 Veriol wrote:
Im mid/high masters i dont get this I get favored/slightly favored who are my lvl or above and get +2 - +4 for beating them and in case i loose i get like -25 its retarded.. i can get 10 win streak for 20 and loose once to get -20
EDIT: these whole point gains/losses seem way off .. i see some people on ladder with records like 25-1 having 300 points and guy above him is 320 points and record 27-24 this is just silly. Completely agree. This is yet another point where it would have been better to just implement the system of warcraft 3.
Why? The matchmaking before the changes was so much better than Warcraft 3 matchmaking. In fact the changes make the matchmaking more like the Warcraft 3 matchmaking where it was very common to play against a lot of different skill levels and ladder turned into a emotional rollercoaster because you either got stomped or stomped on someone while having an even skilled opponent wasn't the norm at all.
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also getting weird weird opponents... thought i was approaching masters because i was playing a few. but then it turns out it's just the messed up ladder system. honestly blizzard, WTF were u thinking?? hate the new range. give me equally skilled opponents or give me death.
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well, i´m plat, and i´m getting silver, gold, plat and diamond players...a littel bit stupid^^
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Half the games are much too easy, half are much too hard.
No idea how anyone could think it makes laddering more interesting.
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Im just curious as to what difference it makes to your MMR? If you drop 4 or 5 games in a row to favored opponents does your MMR just get tanked? If so, that would be stupid...
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Not that this is significant given that so many other people have posted similar stories, but I found it funny that today I matched a grandmaster and platinum player back to back.
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I matched all kind of people today from silver to diamond... really strange..
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United Kingdom20284 Posts
I am still matching vs both gold and masters, without either having any kind of significant win/loss streaks.
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I've had dozens of platinums (and I only just got to Gold T.T), then got a bronze... if this is reverted I'd hate to have seen what it was like before :|
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well i started fresh (bronze) at monday. In 6 days with 5 games each i made it up to top platinum
so yeah, i really enjoyed it. Oh, and i only played one single game where my opponent was not favoured to win XD
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I've still had pretty erratic matches too. It doesn't really feel like they've changed it back yet to me. But I think that's good, I enjoy the variety.
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I dunno on american ladder I've been siver since season 3. Start of season 7 it started matching me against gold. Ended when they "reverted". Had seen nothing but silver until this week. This week I played a gold and platinum along with silver. Won both - both were real games (got lucky and scouted aggressive expand in both cases so I all-in'd.
However, I wonder if match ups are result of player drop off. - I've noticed serious drop off in # of players this season based on sc2ranks statistics.
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Sweden448 Posts
either my mmr is really wacky or they have reverted again because im going against bort silver and diamond players (im gold), without any real streak
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I knew it! I could've sworn the matchmaking was not actually reverted at all...
I was matched vs top 12 diamond one game and the next top 10 gold lol
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I don't know what exactly Blizzard expected to happen with this. I guess some people got to experience the actual disparity between them and their opponents for once. It probably didn't feel very nice. I'm not against it, or anything, since the point potential for playing higher ranked opponents was actually pretty good. I think I won a game that netted 38 points. That's pretty badass. Too bad they're turning it back, but I guess they feel for the nubs. Getting trampled constantly must really affect the overall staying power a player has.
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My platinum win netted me 42. Felt good after going 0-5 against last 5 silver opponents.
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im mid diamond right now and im getting matched up with high diamond and masters.. no platinum players o.O
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People need to realise that you lose less points for a loss against a higher ranked player, and also that the system wants a 50/50 ratio anyway, so playing a wider range of players doesn't affect them at all in the long run.
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On April 23 2012 07:47 dUTtrOACh wrote:
I don't know what exactly Blizzard expected to happen with this. I guess some people got to experience the actual disparity between them and their opponents for once. It probably didn't feel very nice. I'm not against it, or anything, since the point potential for playing higher ranked opponents was actually pretty good. I think I won a game that netted 38 points. That's pretty badass. Too bad they're turning it back, but I guess they feel for the nubs. Getting trampled constantly must really affect the overall staying power a player has.
They probably wanted people to experience more high stakes matches against super favoured opponents and then have some more fun silly games against worse opponents.Which was fine as IMO having to always play at the sameish level gets kinda boring and starts feeling more like grinding.
Dunno I liked it
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I am facing diamonds and getting 2-6 points per win. This change does not feel reverted at all. Maybe its just because I am terrible, but I feel as if I either get rolled or am rolling my opponents this season. This is my 7th season as Masters.
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I also don't think this is reverted, last week I played players ranging from mid plat to mid master as a diamond player. Had a losing streak today and just faced a regular high silver. Not a smurf, just some guy who faced silvers and golds before me....
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On April 23 2012 14:00 StreetWise wrote:
I am facing diamonds and getting 2-6 points per win. This change does not feel reverted at all. Maybe its just because I am terrible, but I feel as if I either get rolled or am rolling my opponents this season. This is my 7th season as Masters.
this
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Ugh. I've lost all interest in playing because pretty much every game is a stomp. It's not fun for either side.
I'm still trying to figure out why they intentionally broke pretty much the best thing about B.Net 2.0 (IMO).
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yeah I'm having issues too
This pattern has repeated itself for the last 5 days:
I play 1-3 games vs people that are favoured or slightly favoured vs me
then suddenly all the next games I am the one that is slightly favoured
never an even match, and always in that order.
kinda sux
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I remember in the last season evenly matched games were the norm and "slightly favored" was uncommon ; now it's reversed and there are quite a lot of "favored" games. Something definitely changed in the matchmaking, it's not back to normal in my experience.
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This season I have faced top 8 bronze, top 8 silver, top 8 plat and top 8 diamond. This week I have faced mostly top 8 plat and diamond. I am a top 8 gold right now. It is really frustrating to face these top 8 diamond and plat (i mostly beat the plat, occasionally the diamond) and still be in gold league. It is even more frustrating to be favored and lose to someone who is top 8 plat.
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I'm high diamond (actually got promoted like 2 weeks ago but have 80% win rate over 50 games since then) and have also noticed that I have been playing a lot of plats and masters but, its kinda cool, I took out my first masters the other day and was so happy, when I lost to my first masters PVP i creeped his build after and at least learned something. I think this change is good, but I do agree that the +/- points system should be more normalized, losing a PvP to sum plat nub cannoner would seriously enrage me. Truthfully if you want to get better at high levels the ONLY way is to play against people who are better than you and lose so you can find out what went wrong!!! DONT BE SCARED OF THE LADDER!
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On April 22 2012 23:40 Baum wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 23:04 sleepingdog wrote:On April 21 2012 22:03 Veriol wrote:
Im mid/high masters i dont get this I get favored/slightly favored who are my lvl or above and get +2 - +4 for beating them and in case i loose i get like -25 its retarded.. i can get 10 win streak for 20 and loose once to get -20
EDIT: these whole point gains/losses seem way off .. i see some people on ladder with records like 25-1 having 300 points and guy above him is 320 points and record 27-24 this is just silly. Completely agree. This is yet another point where it would have been better to just implement the system of warcraft 3. Why? The matchmaking before the changes was so much better than Warcraft 3 matchmaking. In fact the changes make the matchmaking more like the Warcraft 3 matchmaking where it was very common to play against a lot of different skill levels and ladder turned into a emotional rollercoaster because you either got stomped or stomped on someone while having an even skilled opponent wasn't the norm at all.
What I meant is, that in warcraft 3 it was much more transparent - you saw not only your level, but you saw EXACTLY how your points translated into how close you are to a promotion or demotion. Furthermore, the points you gained or lost were always calculated based on the difference of your level compared to your opponent's level. This "favored"-crap might or might not be true, I have no way of knowing why bnet now decides that my opponent is "favoured". It's all in the dark, calculated by some unknown highly complicated matrix that is apparently too complex to explain...ever.
I want to know why my opponent is favoured based on his ranking. His points mean nothing at all, since everything is based on MMR. Divisions mean less than nothing. And leagues mean nothing since every skilled player is in Masters. In warcraft 3 you had 50 levels, in sc2 you have 6/7 leagues - that's just not good enough to differentiate.
The bottom line is, that there's no way to ever tell how good your opponent is - hell, there's no way to tell how good you are, since the division-system is so incredibly useless.
Finally - even though that might just be me - I think it's GOOD to play against far better or far worse players time and time again. Admittedly, it sometimes was over the edge in warcraft 3, but bnet "overdoes" it in my opinion. Why is that the case? Because only against someone who is a superior player than you are you get the possibility to really test how stable your builds are. Maybe you lose in lategame, but if your build "holds" then you have something to rely on. And if you had played with an unsafe opening before, getting crushed by a superior player really makes you think about your playstyle. Concerning playing against far worse players: well, that's just the other side of things - to enable others to test theird builds, it is necessary for you to be the "better player" once in a while.
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I liked it only if the increased range let me stomp on lowbie masters now and again
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EPT
