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On March 31 2012 11:48 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:44 McFeser wrote:On March 31 2012 11:33 Forikorder wrote:On March 31 2012 11:32 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:26 Odal wrote:On March 31 2012 11:20 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:19 Gheed wrote:On March 31 2012 11:17 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:15 Roe wrote:On March 31 2012 11:07 Goldfish wrote:[quote] Agreed. Similar lawsuits against people trolling on the internet has happened countless times in SK before. Heck, even KT almost sued someone for flaming Flash.These things are serious business in South Korea, and these people should have known better. That doesn't mean the law is right. I mean come on, would you argue against someone who is fighting a racist or misogynistic government who enforces the law in kind? "But that black person should've known better than to sit at the front of the bus...the country has laws for segregation and she should obey them." I think we should all be able to agree these status quo kinds of statements are void in this argument and serve no purpose. It is right, if the law makes people be less dickery and have higher class it helps the image of the community as a whole, I can't believe all the people defending this crap. Have you not learned your lesson on what happened to the fighting game community? If we've reached the point as a society where we need the law to stop people from hurting other people's feelings, I'd say something has gone awry. If we've reached the point as a society when people are allowed to be dicks as much as they want, I'd say something has gone awry. I disagree. You should be able to act the way you'd like. Punishments shouldn't be serious for offending people with harmless words. I disagree. People should be expect to act with a minimum level of class, and be punished if they act with lack of it. People should strive to be higher and higher class. These acts of lack of class shouldn't be tolerated and should be punished and made an example of. why? why do the people of "higher class" have the right to force there views and beliefs on us "lower class" people? He's not using the right word but he is right. Everyone should act with a minimum amount of decency if only because that is what the majority of people expect/want from others. I don't think anyone would argue that this man's acts were beneficial to anyone. Also, I generally assume the best in people but for those saying we don't need laws to tell people not to be dicks - we do. I would rather have laws then some culturally pressured restriction on what is right and what is wrong concerning public behavior. As for this man's actions, they are unacceptable within what is culturally acceptable and within legal boundaries (just the Korean laws though I'm sure if someone was shouting obscenities at me at the grocery store everyday, and waiting there to do so, I could get them in some sort of trouble). Now I don't think he should be put in prison for seven years. That's just stupid. But how anyone could defend him I don't know. whos to say what a minimum level of decency is? why do words have to be bad? there words, they have as much power as you give them im pretty sure people have died in wars fighting to make sure there kids would be able to say what they want to say and do what they want to do, why shouldnt i be able to choose whatever vocabulary i choose to use? there are profanity filters for a reason, Jessica had multiple options to ignore the trolls she chose not to ignore them, to specifically pay attention to them, then whine that her feelings got hurt
Society sets the standards. But the bar should be constantly raised to make people just better human beings in general. Nobody like dicks. Nobody like people that have no class. A minimum of human decency is required in society before the entire society just turns into a society of dicks. Much like the internet today.
On March 31 2012 11:50 Skwid1g wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:46 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:43 lorkac wrote:On March 31 2012 11:36 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:32 Skwid1g wrote:On March 31 2012 11:22 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:20 Gheed wrote:On March 31 2012 11:20 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:19 Gheed wrote:On March 31 2012 11:17 Blasterion wrote:
[quote]
It is right, if the law makes people be less dickery and have higher class it helps the image of the community as a whole, I can't believe all the people defending this crap. Have you not learned your lesson on what happened to the fighting game community? If we've reached the point as a society where we need the law to stop people from hurting other people's feelings, I'd say something has gone awry. If we've reached the point as a society when people are allowed to be dicks as much as they want, I'd say something has gone awry. You can ban people from chat rooms. Yes, and you can sue them so they learn their lesson and stop being dicks rather than have them make new accounts and continue being dicks to you or to other people. People need to learn to have some class, hopefully this will make an example of those who lack it. The fact that you honestly think people should go to prison over meaningless words typed over something as impersonal as the internet baffles me. Should everyone that says "fuck you" to someone get arrested too? Just throw 90% of the world's population in prison if so, because they don't have "class." Then they should strive to have better class. Let's throw jessica's action aside for now. Now let's see, it seems like many of you are supporting cyber defamation and think it's the norm, it's ok, it's the right thing to do. but now is it really? Maybe it's the immaturity of the community, and tolerance for a lack of class that gives gamers stigmas and make scenes struggle to take off? Have you considered all the good things that can happen if some of you acted that you are actually against having no class rather than supporting it? Do you all consider the consequences of supporting cyber dickery as a community when you open your mouth at all? ( or typing shit on a forum in this case) Best save your breath, asking the TL community to respect women only works if it's still okay to treat them less than human. This is nothing new, try to take a peek at almost all the threads that attempt to be supportive of women here on TL, more than half the posts does nothing but attack them. No difference here. It's just a general trend here on TL when it comes to women. What about having basic manners and be respectful to other human beings? Before women they are humans. You still haven't answered any of the questions I set forth, where do you draw the line for being "classy" on the internet? Personally I'd say no cussing should be allowed, but I think many would disagree. What about racial slurs? Should I be able to call someone an idiot? Should I be able to criticize a celebrity harshly? Just saying "people should be classy" doesn't make any sense, since that is entirely arbitrary. I could find your posts entirely without class, and 99% of TL may disagree. Where do you draw the line?
How about basic social manners. Yes you should be able to criticize, but you should choose your words wisely and make sure they are proper. People should act with a minimum of decency demanded by their society.
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i dont understand why some people are defending the offender as an excuse of "Freedom of Speech". are you guys serious? is this what you expect out of freedom of speech? all i see is a faceless coward behind the computer who wants to troll the shit out of someone for their OWN amusement, did you guys actually read what he typed?
adding on, korean culture takes politness, respect ( unless your a foreigner, they might point at you in korea) pretty fucking seriously, ESPECIALLY to older people. and seeing how the offender is korean, he should know that better than most of the people in this forums.
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Just ban the guy Sally Glass 
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On March 31 2012 11:47 stevarius wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:44 McFeser wrote:On March 31 2012 11:33 Forikorder wrote:On March 31 2012 11:32 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:26 Odal wrote:On March 31 2012 11:20 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:19 Gheed wrote:On March 31 2012 11:17 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:15 Roe wrote:On March 31 2012 11:07 Goldfish wrote:[quote] Agreed. Similar lawsuits against people trolling on the internet has happened countless times in SK before. Heck, even KT almost sued someone for flaming Flash.These things are serious business in South Korea, and these people should have known better. That doesn't mean the law is right. I mean come on, would you argue against someone who is fighting a racist or misogynistic government who enforces the law in kind? "But that black person should've known better than to sit at the front of the bus...the country has laws for segregation and she should obey them." I think we should all be able to agree these status quo kinds of statements are void in this argument and serve no purpose. It is right, if the law makes people be less dickery and have higher class it helps the image of the community as a whole, I can't believe all the people defending this crap. Have you not learned your lesson on what happened to the fighting game community? If we've reached the point as a society where we need the law to stop people from hurting other people's feelings, I'd say something has gone awry. If we've reached the point as a society when people are allowed to be dicks as much as they want, I'd say something has gone awry. I disagree. You should be able to act the way you'd like. Punishments shouldn't be serious for offending people with harmless words. I disagree. People should be expect to act with a minimum level of class, and be punished if they act with lack of it. People should strive to be higher and higher class. These acts of lack of class shouldn't be tolerated and should be punished and made an example of. why? why do the people of "higher class" have the right to force there views and beliefs on us "lower class" people? He's not using the right word but he is right. Everyone should act with a minimum amount of decency if only because that is was the majority of people expect/want from others. I don't think anyone would argue that this man's acts were beneficial to anyone. Also, I generally assume the best in people but for those saying we don't need laws to tell people not to be dicks - we do. I would rather have laws then some culturally pressured restriction on what is right and what is wrong concerning public behavior. As for this man's actions, they are unacceptable within what is culturally acceptable and within legal boundaries (just the Korean laws though I'm sure if someone was shouting obscenities at me at the grocery store everyday, and waiting there to do so, I could get them in some sort of trouble). Now I don't think he should be put in prison for seven years. That's just stupid. But how anyone could defend him I don't know. Any American understands that this guy getting taken to civil court for being a dick is just retarded, but this is a different country we're talking about. You can't legislate good behavior. Good fucking luck trying. I don't defend his actions, but I will forever defend his right to be an asshole.... on American soil or at least a country that has sane laws involving some internet BM.
If you'd take some time to look at your own laws, I doubt you'd actually make that statement.
There are many more laws that serves to theoretically constrict and control your life so that stupid things aren't done rather than to defend your right to be an ass.
EDIT: For the record, I don't agree with this. Jessica needs to grow some thick skin if she wants to stay in the e-sports industry.
Learn from Fantasy
"If you put your attention to each kind of those posts, you can’t be a progamer (laugh). Noona must know as well. If you try responding to those absurd posts every day, you become more damaged. So I pay no attention to them at all."
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On March 31 2012 11:47 Skwid1g wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:40 Wombat_NI wrote:On March 31 2012 11:33 snailz wrote:On March 31 2012 11:23 jinorazi wrote:On March 31 2012 11:21 Zennith wrote:
I'm just baffled by how many people support this. Freedom of speech is so important, I don't understand how anyone can believe otherwise? freedom of speech is important. so should trolls doing everything they can to harm someone's reputation, finance and emotion be allowed with no consequences? intentional trolling with means to do damage, isn't freedom of speech. sometimes i get the feeling some of the Americans are so brainwashed with the whole freedom of speech, that every excrement that comes out in form of toughts from their brains is considered valid, and you don't actually have to think before you speak, because even if you are so bloody wrong, you have the right to be wrong. which is false. there was a discussion on TL similiar to this one, where guy from Scandinavia that lived on both continents analyzed the situation and said it fascinated him how in Europe kids are thought to be critical in thinking, while in the States everything is so emphasized on the individual, kids just grow up thinking every aspect of their individuality is so precious that they are actually rewarded for having a stance on something, no matter true or false. Exactly, just because you can say something doesn't necessarily mean it's worth saying. It's a cliché for sure, but one with validity. Youtube comments are worthless, streamchats are worthless, hell even half of TL threads are worthless because of attention whores who think every utterance that they release is somehow incredibly profound. I'm not an elitist by any means, people are entitled to their views but should just take a little more discretion in putting them out there. It can get extremely frustrating when you see experts in a field slaughtered by complete morons. I recall Thorzain getting bashed by a succession of platinum players in some thread, I mean the pros are noticeably less active in here of late and I think this is part of the reason why. Potentially cool platforms of interaction between the public/laymen and the professionals was one of the things I loved about this community, but they're becoming closed off precisely because of the kind of asinine behaviour this thread was created to discuss. Hope you 'trolls' enjoy it when the pros just lay low and don't communicate with the fans bar occasionally giving formulaic interviews like we see in the vast majority of professional sports. Incidentally, when did trolling move from a witty, often humourous but harmless activity into the realms of 'herp derp I'll abuse him, you mad bro?' fucking idiocy? And that's why we have all sorts of ways to keep people who abuse their privileges out of communities like this one. The fact of the matter is that there are probably tons of people that also think your posts are "worthless" but you're still allowed to post, and for good reason. I just don't think you should be able to be punished for the words you speak, obviously what is "right" and "wrong" is entirely subjective, but that's just how I feel about it. Perhaps the ability to sue someone for ban evading and repeatedly insulting/trolling/whatever (which would accomplish the same goal at the end of the day, just much more cleanly) which would be akin to taking someone to court over stalking.
Its a good thing the guy isn't being sued for speaking but is instead being sued for harassing. Saying your mind is one thing, he isn't being punished for speaking his mind, he's being punished for attacking another human being. Yes, it was verbally, but it's not the words that are being punished.
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I think under the guise of free speech, some people are condoning the act of acting like dicks and assholes.
Even if you were to justify it under saying what one really thinks, do you guys honestly believe that guy does not know how disruptive his actions are? Or that he actually believes in the ridiculous things hes saying in? Its not free speech imo, its just terrible and disgusting behavior and people want to defend that?
Now, i think what jessica is doing is counter-productive and more people will probably go to resent her over this. Taking a more relaxed attitude towards trolls is usually the best result. However, how anyone can fault her instead of the random guy, or even defend that random insulter is beyond me.
Don't let your dislike of jessica or your belief in free spech cloud your views over this issue.
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On March 31 2012 11:50 Skwid1g wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:46 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:43 lorkac wrote:On March 31 2012 11:36 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:32 Skwid1g wrote:On March 31 2012 11:22 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:20 Gheed wrote:On March 31 2012 11:20 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:19 Gheed wrote:On March 31 2012 11:17 Blasterion wrote:
[quote]
It is right, if the law makes people be less dickery and have higher class it helps the image of the community as a whole, I can't believe all the people defending this crap. Have you not learned your lesson on what happened to the fighting game community? If we've reached the point as a society where we need the law to stop people from hurting other people's feelings, I'd say something has gone awry. If we've reached the point as a society when people are allowed to be dicks as much as they want, I'd say something has gone awry. You can ban people from chat rooms. Yes, and you can sue them so they learn their lesson and stop being dicks rather than have them make new accounts and continue being dicks to you or to other people. People need to learn to have some class, hopefully this will make an example of those who lack it. The fact that you honestly think people should go to prison over meaningless words typed over something as impersonal as the internet baffles me. Should everyone that says "fuck you" to someone get arrested too? Just throw 90% of the world's population in prison if so, because they don't have "class." Then they should strive to have better class. Let's throw jessica's action aside for now. Now let's see, it seems like many of you are supporting cyber defamation and think it's the norm, it's ok, it's the right thing to do. but now is it really? Maybe it's the immaturity of the community, and tolerance for a lack of class that gives gamers stigmas and make scenes struggle to take off? Have you considered all the good things that can happen if some of you acted that you are actually against having no class rather than supporting it? Do you all consider the consequences of supporting cyber dickery as a community when you open your mouth at all? ( or typing shit on a forum in this case) Best save your breath, asking the TL community to respect women only works if it's still okay to treat them less than human. This is nothing new, try to take a peek at almost all the threads that attempt to be supportive of women here on TL, more than half the posts does nothing but attack them. No difference here. It's just a general trend here on TL when it comes to women. What about having basic manners and be respectful to other human beings? Before women they are humans. You still haven't answered any of the questions I set forth, where do you draw the line for being "classy" on the internet? Personally I'd say no cussing should be allowed, but I think many would disagree. What about racial slurs? Should I be able to call someone an idiot? Just saying "people should be classy" doesn't make any sense, since that is entirely arbitrary. I could find your posts entirely without class, but you shouldn't get sent to prison over it.
i think its self explanatory...his saying people shouldn't troll or bm, or else the gaming community could have progressed much faster without the negative stigma. like dota, cod = bad experience when chatting.
i'm for burning a flag if theres a meaning for doing so, but doing it mindlessly without thinking of the consequences, doing just because "i'm free to do so" (same for shit talking, harassing) should be looked down upon.
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People do/say that stuff because they think nothing will happen. So what if she sues him. I wouldn't, but maybe he'll think twice before he does it again.
And, maybe other people will think about it too.
Don't want to get sued? Don't harass a woman on the internet with vulgarities you wouldn't dare say in person. It's sick in real life; it's sick on the internet.
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On March 31 2012 11:49 stevarius wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:48 snailz wrote:On March 31 2012 11:47 stevarius wrote:On March 31 2012 11:44 McFeser wrote:On March 31 2012 11:33 Forikorder wrote:On March 31 2012 11:32 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:26 Odal wrote:On March 31 2012 11:20 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:19 Gheed wrote:On March 31 2012 11:17 Blasterion wrote:
[quote]
It is right, if the law makes people be less dickery and have higher class it helps the image of the community as a whole, I can't believe all the people defending this crap. Have you not learned your lesson on what happened to the fighting game community? If we've reached the point as a society where we need the law to stop people from hurting other people's feelings, I'd say something has gone awry. If we've reached the point as a society when people are allowed to be dicks as much as they want, I'd say something has gone awry. I disagree. You should be able to act the way you'd like. Punishments shouldn't be serious for offending people with harmless words. I disagree. People should be expect to act with a minimum level of class, and be punished if they act with lack of it. People should strive to be higher and higher class. These acts of lack of class shouldn't be tolerated and should be punished and made an example of. why? why do the people of "higher class" have the right to force there views and beliefs on us "lower class" people? He's not using the right word but he is right. Everyone should act with a minimum amount of decency if only because that is was the majority of people expect/want from others. I don't think anyone would argue that this man's acts were beneficial to anyone. Also, I generally assume the best in people but for those saying we don't need laws to tell people not to be dicks - we do. I would rather have laws then some culturally pressured restriction on what is right and what is wrong concerning public behavior. As for this man's actions, they are unacceptable within what is culturally acceptable and within legal boundaries (just the Korean laws though I'm sure if someone was shouting obscenities at me at the grocery store everyday, and waiting there to do so, I could get them in some sort of trouble). Now I don't think he should be put in prison for seven years. That's just stupid. But how anyone could defend him I don't know. Any American understands that this guy getting taken to civil court for being a dick is just retarded, but this is a different country we're talking about. You can't legislate good behavior. Good fucking luck trying. I don't defend his actions, but I will forever defend his right to be an asshole.... on American soil or at least a country that has sane laws involving some internet BM. so condescending... Condescending? No, American ideal of liberty. Be an asshole, but I have every right to be an asshole back within legal boundaries. You can't legislate morality. Jessica is a spaz. To the guy above: You won't find yourself in a courtroom for insulting your co-workers, but you will find yourself without a job.
So if you have money you can influence social norms but the democratically elected government is explicitly forbidden.
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What if the guy wasn't completely aware he could be held accountable.. what if, on top of that, he was intoxicated/not in his right mind at the time.. the guy doesn't deserve to lose 7 years of his life or w/e for a few bad comments..
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On March 31 2012 11:43 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:40 Flonomenalz wrote:
You know what, I'm actually perfectly fine with this.
Knowing how critical Korean culture is, and how negatively people can react from seemingly harmless insults, I'm okay with this. If this was a thread about how cyber insults forced a random teen to commit suicide or something, everyone would be up in arms against cyber bullying and the like. But since it's Jessica, she's overreacting.
Yes, she's prone to overreacting. Yes, in our eyes, she's overreacting. Different culture, different person. We can't know how the insults in chat affect her mindset, or affect SlayerS players.
if someone is so mentally fragile that a few insults can shatter there state of mind then what are they even doing on the internet to being with? 13 year old kids know that the internet is full of smack, considering Jessicas position she should know exactly what the internet is like and shes in the position to completely ignore it as well, its not like her job is the moderate chat she doesnt ahve to be reading it if she doesnt like what they say imagine if iNcontrol sued everyone who called him bad Show nested quote +Exactly. If she killed herself because of those exact words everyone would be saying completely different things. This stuff shouldnt be cool no matter what. they might say it, but jsut as many wouldnt mean it, the people here arguing about how jessica is overreacting would also say the teen way overreacted but would too worried about the obvious community backlash to actually say it
To expand upon your point a bit. I think that the best way to deal with shit like this is to just ignore it and deal with the fact that some people are going to insult you. Look at Incontrol. I personally don't really like him, and tons of people insult him all the time, but he doesn't give a shit. At all. I can assure you that the best course of action against shit like this is to just ignore it and eventually it will go away.
The only time I think something serious like jail time or fines should occur is if personal information is released or there are threats being made. People need to stop overreacting and giving trolls exactly what they want.
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On March 31 2012 11:53 RavenLoud wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:47 stevarius wrote:On March 31 2012 11:44 McFeser wrote:On March 31 2012 11:33 Forikorder wrote:On March 31 2012 11:32 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:26 Odal wrote:On March 31 2012 11:20 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:19 Gheed wrote:On March 31 2012 11:17 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:15 Roe wrote:
[quote]
That doesn't mean the law is right. I mean come on, would you argue against someone who is fighting a racist or misogynistic government who enforces the law in kind? "But that black person should've known better than to sit at the front of the bus...the country has laws for segregation and she should obey them." I think we should all be able to agree these status quo kinds of statements are void in this argument and serve no purpose. It is right, if the law makes people be less dickery and have higher class it helps the image of the community as a whole, I can't believe all the people defending this crap. Have you not learned your lesson on what happened to the fighting game community? If we've reached the point as a society where we need the law to stop people from hurting other people's feelings, I'd say something has gone awry. If we've reached the point as a society when people are allowed to be dicks as much as they want, I'd say something has gone awry. I disagree. You should be able to act the way you'd like. Punishments shouldn't be serious for offending people with harmless words. I disagree. People should be expect to act with a minimum level of class, and be punished if they act with lack of it. People should strive to be higher and higher class. These acts of lack of class shouldn't be tolerated and should be punished and made an example of. why? why do the people of "higher class" have the right to force there views and beliefs on us "lower class" people? He's not using the right word but he is right. Everyone should act with a minimum amount of decency if only because that is was the majority of people expect/want from others. I don't think anyone would argue that this man's acts were beneficial to anyone. Also, I generally assume the best in people but for those saying we don't need laws to tell people not to be dicks - we do. I would rather have laws then some culturally pressured restriction on what is right and what is wrong concerning public behavior. As for this man's actions, they are unacceptable within what is culturally acceptable and within legal boundaries (just the Korean laws though I'm sure if someone was shouting obscenities at me at the grocery store everyday, and waiting there to do so, I could get them in some sort of trouble). Now I don't think he should be put in prison for seven years. That's just stupid. But how anyone could defend him I don't know. Any American understands that this guy getting taken to civil court for being a dick is just retarded, but this is a different country we're talking about. You can't legislate good behavior. Good fucking luck trying. I don't defend his actions, but I will forever defend his right to be an asshole.... on American soil or at least a country that has sane laws involving some internet BM. If you'd take some time to look at your own laws, I doubt you'd actually make that statement. There are many more laws that serves to theoretically constrict and control your life so that stupid things aren't done than to defend your right to be an ass.
Assuming these laws even exist, you won't see me in court for insulting someone online as in this case.
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On March 31 2012 11:51 Wombat_NI wrote:
The reason people are invoking the sexism angle is because it's probably a motivating factor in the initial chat. I grow more and more uneasy with the increase in outright, horrendous misogyny. Hey I'm all for a risque sexist joke, if there's some wit involved, but the spewing of such bile makes me worry that societal attitudes towards women will change for the worse. Bear in mind this from personal recollection rather than anything backed empirically
Of course I'm a 'white knight' for believing that somebody having different reproductive organs to me doesn't give me carte blanche to abuse them.
the dude who was trolling probably doesnt give 2 cents what gender she is and was just having fun trolling if a male was doing Jessicas job and acted jsut like jessica has the dude would still have been on that chout shouting obsenities, possibly even the same ones insults are pretty universal now
the real problem with the world is people like YOU not him, he doesnt care about the gender, you do becuase Jessica is a women you consider it our job to protect her, if it was a dude you probably wouldnt care at all and jsut say he needed thicker skin, but becuase its a women allofasudden this is a big huge deal that everyone should stop and halp console Jessica after her terrible ordeal
sexism is pretty much dead, the only people keeping it alive is people who make such a huge deal over stuff like this and keep it at the top of peoples minds
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On March 31 2012 11:54 hypercube wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:49 stevarius wrote:On March 31 2012 11:48 snailz wrote:On March 31 2012 11:47 stevarius wrote:On March 31 2012 11:44 McFeser wrote:On March 31 2012 11:33 Forikorder wrote:On March 31 2012 11:32 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:26 Odal wrote:On March 31 2012 11:20 Blasterion wrote:On March 31 2012 11:19 Gheed wrote:
[quote]
If we've reached the point as a society where we need the law to stop people from hurting other people's feelings, I'd say something has gone awry.
If we've reached the point as a society when people are allowed to be dicks as much as they want, I'd say something has gone awry. I disagree. You should be able to act the way you'd like. Punishments shouldn't be serious for offending people with harmless words. I disagree. People should be expect to act with a minimum level of class, and be punished if they act with lack of it. People should strive to be higher and higher class. These acts of lack of class shouldn't be tolerated and should be punished and made an example of. why? why do the people of "higher class" have the right to force there views and beliefs on us "lower class" people? He's not using the right word but he is right. Everyone should act with a minimum amount of decency if only because that is was the majority of people expect/want from others. I don't think anyone would argue that this man's acts were beneficial to anyone. Also, I generally assume the best in people but for those saying we don't need laws to tell people not to be dicks - we do. I would rather have laws then some culturally pressured restriction on what is right and what is wrong concerning public behavior. As for this man's actions, they are unacceptable within what is culturally acceptable and within legal boundaries (just the Korean laws though I'm sure if someone was shouting obscenities at me at the grocery store everyday, and waiting there to do so, I could get them in some sort of trouble). Now I don't think he should be put in prison for seven years. That's just stupid. But how anyone could defend him I don't know. Any American understands that this guy getting taken to civil court for being a dick is just retarded, but this is a different country we're talking about. You can't legislate good behavior. Good fucking luck trying. I don't defend his actions, but I will forever defend his right to be an asshole.... on American soil or at least a country that has sane laws involving some internet BM. so condescending... Condescending? No, American ideal of liberty. Be an asshole, but I have every right to be an asshole back within legal boundaries. You can't legislate morality. Jessica is a spaz. To the guy above: You won't find yourself in a courtroom for insulting your co-workers, but you will find yourself without a job. So if you have money you can influence social norms but the democratically elected government is explicitly forbidden.
If that isn't a fallacious statement, I don't know what is. Laws can't enforce morality. Try all you must, but people will continue to be dicks on the internet.
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Imagine the windfall you can get for all the idiots out there who think that saying random insults over the internet doesn't come with consequences. She did the right thing to document everything the guy said (in writing for that matter; libel cases are almost always easier to win than slander) and waited for the moment that he couldn't dig himself out of a hole. Judging by just the mere fact that she is willing to pursue damages, it looks like a slam dunk case. If this was allowed here in the States, I would have became a personal injury lawyer a long time ago.
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On March 31 2012 11:47 mrtomjones wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:43 Forikorder wrote:On March 31 2012 11:40 Flonomenalz wrote:
You know what, I'm actually perfectly fine with this.
Knowing how critical Korean culture is, and how negatively people can react from seemingly harmless insults, I'm okay with this. If this was a thread about how cyber insults forced a random teen to commit suicide or something, everyone would be up in arms against cyber bullying and the like. But since it's Jessica, she's overreacting.
Yes, she's prone to overreacting. Yes, in our eyes, she's overreacting. Different culture, different person. We can't know how the insults in chat affect her mindset, or affect SlayerS players.
if someone is so mentally fragile that a few insults can shatter there state of mind then what are they even doing on the internet to being with? 13 year old kids know that the internet is full of smack, considering Jessicas position she should know exactly what the internet is like and shes in the position to completely ignore it as well, its not like her job is the moderate chat she doesnt ahve to be reading it if she doesnt like what they say imagine if iNcontrol sued everyone who called him bad Exactly. If she killed herself because of those exact words everyone would be saying completely different things. This stuff shouldnt be cool no matter what. they might say it, but jsut as many wouldnt mean it, the people here arguing about how jessica is overreacting would also say the teen way overreacted but would too worried about the obvious community backlash to actually say it So someone who is easily hurt should not go online? Are you kidding me? Why not just say that those who feel the need to act like kids and insult people shouldn't go online.
It's actually the same thing that american society says to rape victims.
Girl gets raped.
Public gets mad at her for wearing short skirt... instead of getting mad at rapist for raping her.
Same difference here, it's an american thing as far as I know. Unless europeans blame rapes on victims as well--that I don't know.
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On March 31 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:51 Wombat_NI wrote:
The reason people are invoking the sexism angle is because it's probably a motivating factor in the initial chat. I grow more and more uneasy with the increase in outright, horrendous misogyny. Hey I'm all for a risque sexist joke, if there's some wit involved, but the spewing of such bile makes me worry that societal attitudes towards women will change for the worse. Bear in mind this from personal recollection rather than anything backed empirically
Of course I'm a 'white knight' for believing that somebody having different reproductive organs to me doesn't give me carte blanche to abuse them. the dude who was trolling probably doesnt give 2 cents what gender she is and was just having fun trolling if a male was doing Jessicas job and acted jsut like jessica has the dude would still have been on that chout shouting obsenities, possibly even the same ones insults are pretty universal now the real problem with the world is people like YOU not him, he doesnt care about the gender, you do becuase Jessica is a women you consider it our job to protect her, if it was a dude you probably wouldnt care at all and jsut say he needed thicker skin, but becuase its a women allofasudden this is a big huge deal that everyone should stop and halp console Jessica after her terrible ordeal sexism is pretty much dead, the only people keeping it alive is people who make such a huge deal over stuff like this and keep it at the top of peoples minds
chivalry...isn't dead. i sure hope not
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On March 31 2012 09:03 GloPikkle wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 08:58 BearStorm wrote:
For Slayers sake will she please stop?! I don't want to support someone (Slayers Jessica) who is defacing an organization by demonstrating such irrational behavior. Say that it is Korean culture or something of that sort, but she is a representative of an organization that wants outside financial support and has a lot of fans overseas. Stop with the ridiculous overreactions you are harming the Slayers fanbase for personal reasons. Every antislayers trollfan that is born from this is on her head. Why would Slayers lose fans over this? Because Jessica speaks her frustrations publicly a lot, you're telling me that people are going to stop watching Slayers in GSL and GSTL? Why are you so distraught over an internet troll getting what he/she probably deserves? Give me a break, you're the one who's being the drama llama. Let her do what she wants and stop acting like the troll is getting punished for free speech. He was being a douchebag and he's being treated like a douchebag.
I don't need to explain how Slayers will experience negative PR, that is already evident by the general reaction. I'm am not saying the guy didn't get what she deserved. It's terrible that assholes are being dicks to her, but the fact is people do not like how she is reacting regardless of how terrible some troll is being. You are just being naive if you cannot see that people are upset about it. I have no problems when someone practices free speech, but someone who represents and organization should act more professionally. Please don't reply to a thread if you aren't willing to try to comprehend the meaning of the post you respond to.
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Do they have freedom of speech over there?
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On March 31 2012 11:57 jinorazi wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2012 11:55 Forikorder wrote:On March 31 2012 11:51 Wombat_NI wrote:
The reason people are invoking the sexism angle is because it's probably a motivating factor in the initial chat. I grow more and more uneasy with the increase in outright, horrendous misogyny. Hey I'm all for a risque sexist joke, if there's some wit involved, but the spewing of such bile makes me worry that societal attitudes towards women will change for the worse. Bear in mind this from personal recollection rather than anything backed empirically
Of course I'm a 'white knight' for believing that somebody having different reproductive organs to me doesn't give me carte blanche to abuse them. the dude who was trolling probably doesnt give 2 cents what gender she is and was just having fun trolling if a male was doing Jessicas job and acted jsut like jessica has the dude would still have been on that chout shouting obsenities, possibly even the same ones insults are pretty universal now the real problem with the world is people like YOU not him, he doesnt care about the gender, you do becuase Jessica is a women you consider it our job to protect her, if it was a dude you probably wouldnt care at all and jsut say he needed thicker skin, but becuase its a women allofasudden this is a big huge deal that everyone should stop and halp console Jessica after her terrible ordeal sexism is pretty much dead, the only people keeping it alive is people who make such a huge deal over stuff like this and keep it at the top of peoples minds chivalry...isn't dead.
it should be, the world wont change for the better until people stop seeing women as some fragile little bird they need to protect, there strong enough to open doors on there own and can learn to put the toilet seat down
want true equality? start by treating everyone equal
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EPT
