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The MLG format:
The MLG format is a standard double elimination format. This gives everyone two lives. The Winners bracket (WB) people still have two lives. The LB people only have 1 life. Big tournaments with a lot of people will generally use a double elim format. No one wants to go to MLG play one game and be done. Its just better to have double elim.
What is it?
The extended series says that anytime two players are going to face each other for the 2nd time, the results from the first meeting will be counted towards a BO7.
Red plays Blue and wins 2-1.
Red plays blue again:
BO7 where Red is up 2-1. If the series ends 4-1 or 4-2 then extended series did not affect this game. The outcome would be the same according to standard double elimination tourney. If Red loses the first 3 games 1-2 then extended series saves Red here. The game would be 3-2 Red.
Consider:
The only time extended series can affect a match is if the underdog wins 2 out of the first 3. Then there are times that you can say "well extended series saved him." It would be true. However if Red wins out of the first 3 games then Red would also win standard double elim tourney.
The Finals:
The finals of a double elim tournament work like this. The person from WB still has his two lives and the person from LB has only one. They should play a BO3. If WB wins, then its over. If LB wins, then they have to play another BO3. Extended series can come into play here but not at first.
MLG says for the finals you play a BO3. If WB wins its done. Tourney over. If LB wins, then it goes to BO7. Here is when extended series starts. It doesn't start before this. Extended series actually hurts the WB person. Its completely backwards for the finals from the rest of the tournament.
If WB is losing 1-2 in the Finals. In a normal double elim tourney, it should reset. WB should have to win 2 games and its done. However, because of extended series he has to win 3 more to win.
If the two players have already played and the finals starts 2-1 or 2-0 then the WB person does get an advantage because of ES. This then falls back to if WB wins the first 2 out of 3 games then he would've won anyway in double elim tourney.
Conclusion:
Understand when extended series actually is in play and when it is just the standard double elim tourney rules. MKP did not win because of extended series and he had to win an extra game because of it.
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Well one thing is sure. MKP well deserved that tourney win.
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Thank you for explaining this I had some idea of what it was but this definately clarifies this
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Most people understand it. It's just a bad format that shouldn't be used by big tournaments when they can just have group play into single elimination bracket instead.
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32 person you can pull off group play. MLG circuits with 256 people you cannot do group play. It has to be double elim.
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We've been lucky the last two MLGs because of comebacks by the underdog players. Leenock and DRG both fought back from the deficit, and Leenock actually won, which was amazing. Overall, however, the extended series undermines the thrill of the finals, which, at heart, should be the most important matches of the entire tournament.
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Thanks for the clarification.
Still, while it has some good sides (people get to see their favourites even if they lose) it should be changed.
I mean, the WB finalist has already the advantage of watching his opponent play about 3 more matches and study him, while the LB finalist has to jump right after in the final.
A final should be tense, nerve-wrecking and most importantly even: the WB is already in an advantage condition, I don't see why he should simply win a bo3.
It's anticlimatic.
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True. Then just play double elim till you have the top 16. Add them to the top16 from the arena event and make 8x4 players groups.
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Another one of these? People have been saying this since the beginning, but they keep using this format.
I wish MLG would get rid of the extended series because (I haven't followed MLG in a long time, so disregard if they changed this) but when someone won in the WB, then met his opponent again in the LB, the guy who won the first match had a major advantage. That's the biggest issue, followed by the fact that you can't reset the brackets, which would allow both players to "lose" more games before being able to win the match. (2-1 = max of 4 games being played - 2-0 = max of 5 games, etc...) it gives the guy from WB a major advantage, because he doesn't have to win as many games as he otherwise would if the guy from LB had reset the brackets.
They should use a regular double elim without extended series. Win a game in the finals coming from LB? Get to play another set from scratch. Get matched against someone you fought back in WB and now meet in LB? Who gives a shit, just a regular Bo3, you don't deserve to start with a lead.
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It can yes when the finals is between two people who have previously played. WB can be up 2-1 or 2-0. If the score starts like this in the finals then yes ES caused it. i should've put that in my post. i will update
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On February 28 2012 03:41 2WeaK wrote:
I wish MLG would get rid of the extended series because (I haven't followed MLG in a long time, so disregard if they changed this) but when someone won in the WB, then met his opponent again in the LB, the guy who won the first match had a major advantage. .
i think it should stay the way it is , and pro gamers should be thankful for a second chance . in many other sports you dont get a second chance .
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Its not the double elim that people are annoyed with, its the extended series rules.
It's a horrible format because the final match puts the players in a position where probability based strategies that yield roughly 50% wins purely based on luck can be used from the very first match because the winner of the previous bo3 can afford to lose more games. THis often leads to a less interesting finals.
I'd rather watch single elim than ES, because it guarantees better matches IMO.
If anything, they could always do some type of hybrid double elim --> 32 man pool play --> single elim tourney.
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my main issue with using extended series instead of having bo5 semi's and bo7 final is that unless the guy from the lower bracket wins the first 2 out of 3 games, the final can not ever be epic.
If MKP had 2-0'd the final last night it would have been even more anti-climactic than it was. You should never have a grand final that can be won in 2 games.... that simple. Either make the finals bo5 double elim (lower bracket guy has to win 2 bo5's) with no extended series bs or make it a simple bo7.... they've both made it to the finals, they have proven they are the best (the whole point of double elim) and now they should duke it out on level footing.
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Get rid of the extended series. It's a confusing and you'll have to explain it every time to people not familiar with the rules. Tournament format should be simple. Just make it Bo7 or Bo5. No need for this convoluted mess.
I don't get it. I don't get it. I don't fucking get it.
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Every single double elim tourney can be won in 2 games if the WB guy wins. It isn't ES that causes that. If MKP 2-0'd the final than ES didn't even come into play at all.
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EPT
