EPTPatch 1.4.3 - Preview Blog - Page 84
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Please DISCUSS the changes and the impact they will have on gameplay. Straight up whining and bitching will get you a ban, no exceptions. | ||
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ampson
United States2355 Posts
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Applesqt
United States206 Posts
On February 11 2012 07:18 ticklishmusic wrote: The solution to nerfing ghosts? Make more of them, duh.  I mean, the scroll wheel trick can still gib-ify a hole Hive army in seconds. 21 snipes to kill 1 ultralisk, 10 for 1 broodlord | ||
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Zane
Romania3916 Posts
On February 11 2012 07:12 Cloud9157 wrote: Hmm, I just realized that Blizzard just gave Terran an answer to Chargelot/Archon... Ghosts beat Archons even harder now i guess. I know right? Maybe if Blizzard added "+25 against Lazerz" ghosts would counter colossi too. | ||
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Ripps
Canada97 Posts
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architecture
United States643 Posts
On February 11 2012 07:19 Mistakes wrote: The thing with that is that late game, the upgrades are good enough, and the Terran has tanks, that mass ling/bling just melts to Terran armies. Zerg needs Broodslords/Ultras/Infestors to push back the Terran, but Snipe was just destroying that also. Now there is a way for Zerg to fight back. (Assuming the change helps Z) We enter 20m: T has primarily high tank count + marines. First max: BL infestor, trade against marine tank T masses up ghosts Second max: Swap to ling/bane bombs, overrun low tank count T has balanced army Outposition, be where elements of his army are not. | ||
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Rhedsa
Costa Rica594 Posts
1) the snipe change is kind of going into the "we like to change things more drastic and maybe scale it later.." way of Blizzard, although a cooldown or higher energycost would not really make snipe kind of useless... i mean not effectiv sniping (bane)lings, zealots and workers? 2) mules on gold is kind of a half hearted confession that gold bases are just a bad design 3) as for the phoenix range, it will come for a high cost (fleet beacon+upgrade) and won't be as effectiv at the high level (storms!!, phoenix & blinkers), but for the casual player it should help a lot. All in all, nice direction! Next issues should be the 200remax protoss ball in PvT, but it's kind of hard with the warp gate mechanic.... as well as forcefields with immortal-pushes ^^ | ||
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Sackings
Canada457 Posts
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TheRavensName
United States911 Posts
On February 11 2012 07:19 Mistakes wrote: The thing with that is that late game, the upgrades are good enough, and the Terran has tanks, that mass ling/bling just melts to Terran armies. Zerg needs Broodslords/Ultras/Infestors to push back the Terran, but Snipe was just destroying that also. Now there is a way for Zerg to fight back. (Assuming the change helps Z) Terran can't re-macro nearly as well as zerg, your suppose to melt xD. | ||
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architecture
United States643 Posts
On February 11 2012 07:21 Ripps wrote: Snipe change is stupid. Make snipe do less damage vs massive. That takes care of problems with Ultra and Broodlord countering while still allowing Ghosts to kill casters. People have no brains, Ghosts will still kill casters in 2 shots, in fact it will be buffed against infestors. But no one cares, because you are sniping casters, that's pointless when only 1 fungal/storm needs to go off for your investment to be useless. | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On February 11 2012 07:21 Zane wrote: I know right? Maybe if Blizzard added "+25 against Lazerz" ghosts would counter colossi too. snipe targets bio only. Ghosts still can't target archons | ||
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snakeeyez
United States1231 Posts
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
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Mjolnir
912 Posts
Clearly as Terran we should see that the take home message here is: "MAKE MOAR MARINES!" As a Zerg and Terran player at master level, that's pretty much the best bet late game, me thinks. Snipe can't even take out a ling now (lawl), and it seems like it was a bit too much of a nerf vs. BL and Ultras. However, it was a little bit too strong prior. I think this change to snipe was excessive - which seems typical of Blizzard SC2 patching. Phoenix change is nice. Gives Zerg a chance to harass but doesn't guarantee impunity as time goes on. MULE change was definitely needed. No idea why it took so long. | ||
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Vehemus
United States586 Posts
They can't snipe marines. They can't snipe banelings. They can't snipe zealots. They can't effectively snipe broodlords. It takes 600/300 plus waiting until the ghosts have full energy to snipe down one ultralisk. So sure, you can try to EMP huge clumps of the Protoss army or hope they're stupid and clump all their spellcasters and let you EMP those, but that's it. Snipe isn't worth getting ghosts for if it only counters spellcasters. I'd rather invest that money into a medivac and two more marines and simply bait and split against fungals and storms. | ||
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moregamethanSEGA
United States76 Posts
On February 11 2012 06:34 moregamethanSEGA wrote: hmmm... two more nerfs to terran... surprise, surpise. Everytime I watch GSL terran is getting owned by toss and zerg (Nada, MKP, JJakji). This is such a joke... what do you expect when you can't spend your gas late game cause Blizzard makes worthless lategame terran units (thor, BC, banshee). you could argue that, terrans have no choice but to mass ghosts because there isn't another opportunity cost available to them. "we were seeing a lot of games where terrans were playing very defensive games while massing ghosts" aka "we were seeing terrans use an unconventional, yet effective strategy late game vs zerg on extremely large macro maps when the zerg couldn't stop terran from getting on 4 base because they were too concerned with making 100 drones and 25 mutas instead of just strategically attacking before the terran was able to make ghosts to begin with." So niche, so unnecessary - this is not terran's problem. Zerg can adapt with spines/spores/fungals to prevent ghost from moving up while the broods rain the pain down. I see it all the time. Or perhaps they could just make units that arent countered strongly by ghosts (lings roaches). OR (and this will blow ur mind) bane/roach drop on ghosts with brood corrupter support or (gasp) a nydus worm. Unless I am mistaken the idea here is: punish terran for being TOO turtley by making them be even MORE turtley in order to get the insane amount of energy they will need to be effective against both zerg tier 2.5 and 3 units. I mean... 19 snipes to kill ultra... and now i can't snipe workers/zealots... fml btw, question: does your data show you that terran is 'forced' to go bio in every matchup now? I saw MKP yesterday do a hellion tank marine build and it BARELY won against Genius. That was the most variation I have seen in TvP since Jinro was in GSL... and MKP still lost to Genius in the end. My point is maybe this wouldn't be a problem if terran wasnt always going bio to begin with. Mech just isn't viable because hellions dont even counter zealots in TvP and anything except lings in TvZ so there is no 'meatsheld' for your army. On top of that terrans currently have no air-to-ground transitions to open with (or go late game with) vs zerg and toss - BC/banshees seem completely worthless in standard tvp and tvz. Unless I am mistaken, now ghosts don't counter anything except infestors and hts. Man, what a veristile unit just like the thor and BC. JOY. Ain't this the truth? User was warned for this post | ||
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SeaSwift
Scotland4486 Posts
On February 11 2012 07:14 Aco1064 wrote: Wondering what race I should switch to, don't really think playing a macro game as terran is viable anymore as we have no late game vs z or p now. I really like zerg's macro mechanic, and protoss units have nice splash. Protoss seems a bit boring tho, what with collosus vs everything, anyone got any tips on which race is more fun? Just go Random. That way, because you know that Terran can't play a macro game, if you roll Terran you will cheese about 1/3 of your games anyway. It's good to mix in cheese from time to time anyway. As for me, I'm just going to watch Terran win games in GSL. 3/8 Ro8 ain't half bad. Better than 1/8, anyway. | ||
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Zane
Romania3916 Posts
On February 11 2012 07:23 Big J wrote: snipe targets bio only. Ghosts still can't target archons I was being sarcastic. | ||
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babybell
776 Posts
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SeaSwift
Scotland4486 Posts
MoregamethanSEGA or moreaccountthanSEGA? | ||
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Cloud9157
United States2968 Posts
On February 11 2012 07:26 Abrafred wrote: To the protoss cheering I'd like to say that imo the +5 damage on ht's being sniped is bigger than an upgradable range for phoenix. Can't really see myself using that in whatever scenario. HTs died in 2 snipes anyway. It turned into 100 damage from 90... Guess how much health+shield a HT had? You can't see a 6 range Phoenix being more viable vs the ever annoying Muta/ling playstyle? You can now KITE Mutas effectively. | ||
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