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Patch 1.4.3 - Preview Blog - Page 86

Forum Index > SC2 General
4449 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 84 85 86 87 88 223 Next
Please DISCUSS the changes and the impact they will have on gameplay.

Straight up whining and bitching will get you a ban, no exceptions.
Garmer
Profile Joined October 2010
1286 Posts
February 10 2012 22:32 GMT
#1701
so now the snipe... do not snipe anymore....even ling survive lol
ejozl
Profile Joined October 2010
Denmark3364 Posts
February 10 2012 22:33 GMT
#1702
now TvZ will be exactly like TvP. we'll have to scan every 30 seconds to see if a tech switch is up to be able to react in time. wooooooooo!

Luckily u won't be needing that energy for muling golds anymore, so u can easily mass scan xD JK.

Feel like everyone of these changes are in the right direction concerning the balancing of things, but i'm not totally satisfied with the way they're doing it.
Terran as the race which takes the least advantage of gold bases seem kinda strange, (atleast in the way that gold bases are used nowaday, placed at center strong points.)
It's adding more underline rules (special rules for special circumstances,) which i feel is a bad thing.

Ghost's special early game tactics are now taken completely out of the game and in lategame situations Ghost's will from now on be more of a added counter to BLords, Ultras combined with either vikings or marauders. Instead of now just making Ghost's to counter anything zerg lategame, which i think is an awesome thing.

Snipe now actually does 5 more dmg to bio spellcasters, which means that they now 2 shot, infestors and other ghosts, instead of 3 shotting. This is a very interesting stat change and am looking forward to ingame scenarios where this stat will take effect.

Phoenix Range Upg: I always felt like phoenix needed a fleet beacon upg, though i imagined some kind of researchable spell.
It's interesting buffing the range, it does help tearing down the much larger muta ball slowly and is an investment into air, which is making toss air more viable, which is definately something the race is in need off.

Yah overall excellent patch.
SC2 Archon needs "Terrible, terrible damage" as one of it's quotes.
architecture
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States643 Posts
February 10 2012 22:33 GMT
#1703
On February 11 2012 07:29 TheDougler wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 11 2012 07:13 architecture wrote:
Someone answer how mass ghosts counter ling/bane late game.



I don't understand the question, are you saying that should happen or shouldn't happen? It just... doesn't make sense any way I look at it, but I don't think you'll have to worry about that now... I also don't think you had to worry about that before.


People are complaining that ghosts countered everything. The only thing they trade evenly against is Hive units.

Ghosts don't counter ling bane. Ghost don't counter everything. They have very significant weaknesses and opportunity cost.
tpfkan
Aratan
Profile Joined October 2010
United States90 Posts
February 10 2012 22:34 GMT
#1704
No actually Terran has been nerfed since the Beta in mostly quite major ways.

And have kept well above 50% winrate in matchups since beta, so....
architecture
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States643 Posts
February 10 2012 22:34 GMT
#1705
I don't think people even remember how hard late game Z was shitting on T before people started using ghosts.
tpfkan
TrueSyzygy
Profile Joined August 2010
60 Posts
February 10 2012 22:35 GMT
#1706
On February 11 2012 07:31 architecture wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 11 2012 07:28 TrueSyzygy wrote:
I think the purpose of the Ghost to Blizzard needs to be looked upon. I honestly don't know exactly what Blizzard intended them for. However, from this patch I can take a guess. I believe they intended the ghost to be complimentary unit for use of dealing with casters. This patch actually BUFFS the Ghost in that aspect. They now do 50 damage instead of 45 to casters with snipe. Blizzard is simply rewiring a unit back into what it was intended for, rather than what it was being used for.

You know what hard counters Broodlords and Ultralisks? Yamato Cannon.


BC takes 90s to make. With 75 energy, it would take another 1:30m to get to 125. So in total, it takes 180s to make a unit that shoots once against 60s hive units.


Yes, because Battle Cruisers without energy do as much damage as Ravens without energy. Also, Broodlords take 74 seconds.
Tall, dark, and... Well, two out of three ain't bad.
Dephy
Profile Joined January 2011
Lithuania163 Posts
February 10 2012 22:35 GMT
#1707
On February 11 2012 07:31 architecture wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 11 2012 07:28 TrueSyzygy wrote:
I think the purpose of the Ghost to Blizzard needs to be looked upon. I honestly don't know exactly what Blizzard intended them for. However, from this patch I can take a guess. I believe they intended the ghost to be complimentary unit for use of dealing with casters. This patch actually BUFFS the Ghost in that aspect. They now do 50 damage instead of 45 to casters with snipe. Blizzard is simply rewiring a unit back into what it was intended for, rather than what it was being used for.

You know what hard counters Broodlords and Ultralisks? Yamato Cannon.


BC takes 90s to make. With 75 energy, it would take another 1:30m to get to 125. So in total, it takes 180s to make a unit that shoots once against 60s hive units.

You know what counter Bc? Corruptors.
moregamethanSEGA
Profile Joined May 2011
United States76 Posts
February 10 2012 22:35 GMT
#1708
[QUOTE]On February 11 2012 07:28 TrueSyzygy wrote:
I think the purpose of the Ghost to Blizzard needs to be looked upon. I honestly don't know exactly what Blizzard intended them for. However, from this patch I can take a guess. I believe they intended the ghost to be complimentary unit for use of dealing with casters. This patch actually BUFFS the Ghost in that aspect. They now do 50 damage instead of 45 to casters with snipe. Blizzard is simply rewiring a unit back into what it was intended for, rather than what it was being used for.

You know what hard counters Broodlords and Ultralisks? Yamato Cannon.[QUOTE]

BY far the most amusing quote so far. Good luck making those 10 BCs with an upgrade, if you aren't dead in 15 mins after the broods hit maybe you'll be fine... maybe.

btw, in order to make broods, you have to already have corrupters... which counter bcs. Your arguement makes about as much sense as blizzards nerf. Here's an idea, increase broodlord accelleration so that you can just fly out of range of snipes easier. I doubt that would break the other matchups. Those lategame battles should have the players microing back and forth, not just A-move broods, fungle everything, send in lings, gg.
Heroes live forever... but legends never die.
-orb-
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
United States5770 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-10 22:36:00
February 10 2012 22:35 GMT
#1709
Interesting patch.

MULE change - obvious change, the only thing surprising here is that it took them such an absurd amount of time to figure this one out.

Snipe change - Intelligent way to change the ability, but I am definitely worried and will be watching for cascading effects of this change, such as lategame TvP with snipes not helping as much against zealots, and whether or not this will all but eliminate ghost usage TvZ.

Phoenix change - Hmm this one sure is interesting. On the one hand it's nice for protoss to get a better way to deal with muta, but with the absurdly idiotic way phoenixes attack on move command, this could make lategame muta zvp completely worthless against good phoenix counts. What really worries me about this though is how it will affect colossi/phoenix deathballs. In all 3 matchups this unit composition has proven to be quite powerful already, and with 2 extra range on the phoenixes I am worried it will become overpowered. Only time will tell I suppose. I'm anticipating some really cool double stargate after FFE openers vs zerg into quick fleet beacon with quick phoenix range and later a mothership...

APM - thanks, but I feel weird saying thanks when the change originally shouldn't've happened in the first place. Still glad they are listening enough to give us back the legitimate apm along with their cpm.
'life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery'
how sad that sc2 has no shield battery :(
Sabin010
Profile Joined September 2010
United States1892 Posts
February 10 2012 22:36 GMT
#1710
On February 11 2012 07:32 Theovide wrote:
I like the patchnotes overall, though I'm unsure how terrans will be able to fight endgame zergs. If I'm not wrong before people started massing ghosts the terran simply lost if the zerg got a good corruptor broodlord infestor army going, and I kind of feel that will be the case again now.


It's going to pressure the terran players to set the tempo in the M/U instead of trying to turtle up on a few bases, max out, and move out. Should be very interesting to see. That or Terran's are going to need to start using something like Battlecruisers with thor ground support to splash on the corrupters in the late game.
CortoMontez
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia608 Posts
February 10 2012 22:37 GMT
#1711
I would have preferred to see a ghost damage bonus vs light, or a damage penalty vs massive. Otherwise it removes too many worker snipe strategies, and closes up the TvT openings.
"Creator was doing a really good job trying to win without storm but it was like eating spaghetti with a screwdriver." -Severian
Vague
Profile Joined April 2011
170 Posts
February 10 2012 22:37 GMT
#1712
The three terran players left in diamond league are switching to zerg today. This is a sad day.
jabberjaw
Profile Joined October 2010
225 Posts
February 10 2012 22:37 GMT
#1713
i like the changes, but the snipe damage reduction may be a bit too much. maybe start at a -10 dmg reduction and if it's still OP, then move to -20. but -20 to begin with is quite a lot. other than that, the rest of changes are good.
Lesrah
Profile Joined November 2010
Portugal110 Posts
February 10 2012 22:37 GMT
#1714
Phoenix buff is too much 5 range max..
Ghost nerf is too much.. We cant deal with the imba tech switches from zerg anymore.
21 snipes for a ultra? really? 525 energy for 1 unit? Comon, im switching for toss. Clearly toss will roll everyone now.
I dont care about tvp, it stays about the same, but tvz will be unbearable. Nerf terrans to the ground even more and not even a single buff. Fuck at least make fucking seeker missile 100 energy
jgelling
Profile Joined February 2011
55 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-10 22:41:38
February 10 2012 22:38 GMT
#1715
On February 11 2012 07:34 architecture wrote:
I don't think people even remember how hard late game Z was shitting on T before people started using ghosts.

People do, but it's also true Blizz subsequently reduced ghost cost by 50 gas and nerfed infestors since then. Now they're buffing snipe vs infestors, but making it relatively weak against brood lord/ultras.

Blizz's reasoning is obvious: BL/infestor or ultra/infestor may have been crazy strong, but if infestors are well-countered ultras or broods by themselves are counterable, and the same unit shouldn't counter BOTH BLs/ultras and infestors. They want the ghost to be primarily anti-caster, not anti-all tier 3 plus anti-caster plus DT-like ninja.
HunterK
Profile Joined April 2011
Argentina68 Posts
February 10 2012 22:40 GMT
#1716
Snipe damage penalty vs massive woujld been much better IMO.
Meridian.
Profile Joined February 2012
United States7 Posts
February 10 2012 22:41 GMT
#1717
With all the tournaments that are running maps sans gold bases nerfing mules seems like a good attempt to bring the rich mineral patch back into the game. The nerf to the ghost snipe seems huge. I guess they wanted it to be more of an anti-caster rather than an all encompassing anti-zerg.Yeh viking and marauder spreads..... Late game vs zerg is not going to be very fun. Oh and they're bringing back the old APM counter? Blizzard Community Brownie points 1.4.3
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
February 10 2012 22:41 GMT
#1718
On February 11 2012 07:38 jgelling wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 11 2012 07:34 architecture wrote:
I don't think people even remember how hard late game Z was shitting on T before people started using ghosts.

People do, but it's also true Blizz subsequently reduced ghost cost by 50 gas and nerfed infestors since then. Now they're buffing snipe vs infestors, but making it relatively weak against brood lord/ultras.

Blizz's reasoning is obvious: BL/infestor or ultra/infestor may have been crazy strong, but if infestors are well-countered ultras or broods by themselves are weak, and the same unit shouldn't counter BOTH BLs/ultras and infestors. They want the ghost to be primarily anti-caster, not anti-all tier 3 plus anti-caster plus DT-like ninja.


Not to mention that some terrans still don't use Ghosts and still do fine in lategame vs Z.
Lesrah
Profile Joined November 2010
Portugal110 Posts
February 10 2012 22:41 GMT
#1719
[QUOTE]On February 11 2012 07:35 moregamethanSEGA wrote:
[QUOTE]On February 11 2012 07:28 TrueSyzygy wrote:
I think the purpose of the Ghost to Blizzard needs to be looked upon. I honestly don't know exactly what Blizzard intended them for. However, from this patch I can take a guess. I believe they intended the ghost to be complimentary unit for use of dealing with casters. This patch actually BUFFS the Ghost in that aspect. They now do 50 damage instead of 45 to casters with snipe. Blizzard is simply rewiring a unit back into what it was intended for, rather than what it was being used for.

You know what hard counters Broodlords and Ultralisks? Yamato Cannon.[QUOTE]

BY far the most amusing quote so far. Good luck making those 10 BCs with an upgrade, if you aren't dead in 15 mins after the broods hit maybe you'll be fine... maybe.

btw, in order to make broods, you have to already have corrupters... which counter bcs. Your arguement makes about as much sense as blizzards nerf. Here's an idea, increase broodlord accelleration so that you can just fly out of range of snipes easier. I doubt that would break the other matchups. Those lategame battles should have the players microing back and forth, not just A-move broods, fungle everything, send in lings, gg.[/QUOTE]


U know what counters that? neural parasite.. U cant have much tanks lategame when u techswitch to BC's

I can see mass banes infestor a great tech switch vs yamato
NomadicG
Profile Joined January 2011
United States1 Post
February 10 2012 22:41 GMT
#1720
with the huge emp nerf last patch and big snipe nerf this patch, i'm guessing next patch nukes will minimap ping for all players and cloak will only last for 5 seconds at a time :/
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