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On January 31 2012 08:44 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:43 dsousa wrote:On January 31 2012 08:41 Hot_Bid wrote:On January 31 2012 08:37 Quakie wrote:
I got ya, Hot_Bid. Doesn't seem like it is bias at place here. Over to the case, Stephano seems to be a very blunt guy, and I think this also got to him here a bit. Its frustrating because even if someone makes a really shitty OP like "Liquid sucks now man" we'd have to consider leaving it open even if we'd instantly close an "EG sucks now man" or "Mouz sucks now man" thread, because people get all wound up about perceived bias. 1. If any other non-Liquid player forfeited first round, we'd not make a thread 2. If Tyler or Ret or Zenio or Hero forfeited in the finals for a similar reason as Stephano did, we'd make a thread You can believe us or not about the truth of these two statements, but that is what we'd do, and if that's the case then there is no hypocrisy here. As for the newsworthiness of this, of course it's news, it's one of the best if not the best non Korean forfeiting in the finals of a semi-major community organized tournament with a 3k prize pool. It's about as concrete news and notable as it gets. Did you make a thread about Polt? nobody gives a shit about the go4sc2 cup. they dont even have LR threads.
Well its unprofessional behaviour so lets raise the topic, We can shit on Stephano, why cant we shit on Polt. Unprofessional is Unprofessional
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Braavos36402 Posts
On January 31 2012 08:43 dsousa wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:41 Hot_Bid wrote:On January 31 2012 08:37 Quakie wrote:
I got ya, Hot_Bid. Doesn't seem like it is bias at place here. Over to the case, Stephano seems to be a very blunt guy, and I think this also got to him here a bit. Its frustrating because even if someone makes a really shitty OP like "Liquid sucks now man" we'd have to consider leaving it open even if we'd instantly close an "EG sucks now man" or "Mouz sucks now man" thread, because people get all wound up about perceived bias. 1. If any other non-Liquid player forfeited first round, we'd not make a thread 2. If Tyler or Ret or Zenio or Hero forfeited in the finals for a similar reason as Stephano did, we'd make a thread You can believe us or not about the truth of these two statements, but that is what we'd do, and if that's the case then there is no hypocrisy here. As for the newsworthiness of this, of course it's news, it's one of the best if not the best non Korean forfeiting in the finals of a semi-major community organized tournament with a 3k prize pool. It's about as concrete news and notable as it gets. Did you make a thread about Polt?
We did not make a thread about Polt.
Are you saying we should have? Or that us not making a thread about Polt is somehow unfair? Please clarify. Because I am pretty sure we were right not to make a thread about Polt.
However, if you feel that there is an epidemic of forfeits and it is discussion worthy, you can make a thread about all of them in SC2 General with a nice OP. Did you make a thread about Polt? You can.
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On January 31 2012 08:40 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:37 Swiv wrote:On January 31 2012 08:33 Vei wrote:On January 31 2012 08:30 Swiv wrote:
Nulla poena sine lege stricta. Taking away the 2nd place money is just NOT justified. what the fuck did you just say anyway, yeah i kind of agree. like, he coulda just 6pooled 4x. that would've been more "disrespectful" It is a very common latin quotation, it says 'no fine without a bill'. very fundamental juristiction. think about it. ONOG did an arbitrary punishment to stephano. if you are saying arbitrary because there was no precedent or written rules, i agree with you. if you are saying arbitrary because it was not thought out and logical, then i would have to disagree with you. the tournament was for the barcrafts and fans. him dropping out at the last minute because he was tired was not acceptable to them and they handled it the best way they could think of. the fact that he got any prize money shows that they were considering the best result for all people.
first point. how can you justify a punishment otherwise? it's always like 'we just felt like it at the moment'
anyway, ONOG won't change it, and i kind of agree with the judgement. but tournament organizers just should take 30min and and put together some rules of action for the players.
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Yeah, even though the games would've been "bad," I'd say there's still a professional courtesy/obligation. There are expectations when you enter tournaments, and it seems disrespectful to forfeit on a really petty basis like being tired.
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On January 31 2012 08:26 Corsica wrote:
3 AM ... It was 3 Fucking AM in Europe, Stephano was playing whole day, showed some amazing games on Scan Invitational and ONOG. Imagine if you worked whole day, trying to get a raise, and so you work for 12 hours, and then your boss tells you , no fuck you, you worked till 3 AM, and I cant even give you small raise, and now whole office will know and we will hate you...Golden rule people...
There are real people behind pro-gamer IDs.
E: Would you rather see stephano 6 pool in 4 games and go 0-4. No
Playing the analogy game...no...this incident would be more equivalent to Stephano being a contractor and taking on multiple conflicting contracts and then backing out of one of them at the very last minute, after calling in and saying he'd be late.
Stephano took on more than he could chew, he was not GIVEN more than he could handle...he CHOSE to accept those invites.
I'd rather see a player who will accept the invite and stick out the tournament like all the other playerrs did. Stephano forfeiting potentially robbed another player of a spot in the tournament.
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On January 31 2012 08:45 Corsica wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:44 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 31 2012 08:43 dsousa wrote:On January 31 2012 08:41 Hot_Bid wrote:On January 31 2012 08:37 Quakie wrote:
I got ya, Hot_Bid. Doesn't seem like it is bias at place here. Over to the case, Stephano seems to be a very blunt guy, and I think this also got to him here a bit. Its frustrating because even if someone makes a really shitty OP like "Liquid sucks now man" we'd have to consider leaving it open even if we'd instantly close an "EG sucks now man" or "Mouz sucks now man" thread, because people get all wound up about perceived bias. 1. If any other non-Liquid player forfeited first round, we'd not make a thread 2. If Tyler or Ret or Zenio or Hero forfeited in the finals for a similar reason as Stephano did, we'd make a thread You can believe us or not about the truth of these two statements, but that is what we'd do, and if that's the case then there is no hypocrisy here. As for the newsworthiness of this, of course it's news, it's one of the best if not the best non Korean forfeiting in the finals of a semi-major community organized tournament with a 3k prize pool. It's about as concrete news and notable as it gets. Did you make a thread about Polt? nobody gives a shit about the go4sc2 cup. they dont even have LR threads. Well its unprofessional behaviour so lets raise the topic, We can shit on Stephano, why cant we shit on Polt. Unprofessional is Unprofessional
its a news site, not a gossip site. ONOG was a fairly large tournament and a controversy arose. that is news. polt being unprofessional in a tournament nobody cares about is (albeit unprofessional) not newsworthy because nobody cares.
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On January 31 2012 08:41 Velocirapture wrote:
The logic to this whole thing seems very straightforward to me.
1) Is Stephano leaving without playing the finals a bad outcome? Yes
2) Is it reasonable for a live program to delay its finals to the next day? No
3) Did Stephano knowingly double book himself? Yes
The fault is clear as day. I guess tournaments need to start advertising common sense rules like "during these hours you may only participate in our event".
Actually, this is a good point - if this become normal and acceptable, then tournament organizers are going to stop trusting teams/players to manage their time reasonably, and prohibit participation in other tournaments for specific dates as a precondition to participating in theirs. I am coming dangerously close to proclaiming that this is "hurting e-sports", but if we want more tournaments, bigger prize pools, and more pro games to watch, we can't accept this kind of behavior as okay. Its one or the other.
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hes a grown adult, he can make his own decisions.... people will always complain and make racist french comments, grow up get over it plz
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On January 31 2012 08:32 aTnClouD wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:30 Corsica wrote:On January 31 2012 08:29 aTnClouD wrote:On January 31 2012 08:26 Corsica wrote:
3 AM ... It was 3 Fucking AM in Europe, Stephano was playing whole day, showed some amazing games on Scan Invitational and ONOG. Imagine if you worked whole day, trying to get a raise, and so you work for 12 hours, and then your boss tells you , no fuck you, you worked till 3 AM, and I cant even give you small raise, and now whole office will know and we will hate you...Golden rule people...
There are real people behind pro-gamer IDs. And there are real people raising money and going to a barcraft to have a forfeited final match cause one of the players couldn't take responsibility for finishing what he started, without giving a shit on everybody else. This is a major act of disrespect imo. Should he die near his computer? He played two tournaments and delayed one of the two to forfeit the finals, the mess is his fault in the first place so he better take responsibility and finish what he started. No need for more spoiled arrogant kids in esports, thanks.
Where did you see him say it's not his fault and that he is not taking responsibility ?
What is arrogant about forfeiting because you're exhausted ? You think if he was as successful as you are (not much) he wouldn't forfeit the tournament, how would you know.
you absolutely make no sense, you're the little kid expressing his pointless opinion
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On January 31 2012 08:46 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:45 Corsica wrote:On January 31 2012 08:44 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 31 2012 08:43 dsousa wrote:On January 31 2012 08:41 Hot_Bid wrote:On January 31 2012 08:37 Quakie wrote:
I got ya, Hot_Bid. Doesn't seem like it is bias at place here. Over to the case, Stephano seems to be a very blunt guy, and I think this also got to him here a bit. Its frustrating because even if someone makes a really shitty OP like "Liquid sucks now man" we'd have to consider leaving it open even if we'd instantly close an "EG sucks now man" or "Mouz sucks now man" thread, because people get all wound up about perceived bias. 1. If any other non-Liquid player forfeited first round, we'd not make a thread 2. If Tyler or Ret or Zenio or Hero forfeited in the finals for a similar reason as Stephano did, we'd make a thread You can believe us or not about the truth of these two statements, but that is what we'd do, and if that's the case then there is no hypocrisy here. As for the newsworthiness of this, of course it's news, it's one of the best if not the best non Korean forfeiting in the finals of a semi-major community organized tournament with a 3k prize pool. It's about as concrete news and notable as it gets. Did you make a thread about Polt? nobody gives a shit about the go4sc2 cup. they dont even have LR threads. You quote me , yet you dont understand me. Well its unprofessional behaviour so lets raise the topic, We can shit on Stephano, why cant we shit on Polt. Unprofessional is Unprofessional its a news site, not a gossip site. ONOG was a fairly large tournament and a controversy arose. that is news. polt being unprofessional in a tournament nobody cares about is (albeit unprofessional) not newsworthy because nobody cares.
You quote me , yet you dont understand me.
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On January 31 2012 07:20 tekos44 wrote:
Why isnt the ONOG caster sentence about french people in the OP ?
"stephano the french pride - french doing what the french do best and surrender, keeping the record in surrendering"
I mean, if you want drama, this is pretty good too
this is probably worst than stephano did
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On January 31 2012 08:45 Swiv wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:40 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 31 2012 08:37 Swiv wrote:On January 31 2012 08:33 Vei wrote:On January 31 2012 08:30 Swiv wrote:
Nulla poena sine lege stricta. Taking away the 2nd place money is just NOT justified. what the fuck did you just say anyway, yeah i kind of agree. like, he coulda just 6pooled 4x. that would've been more "disrespectful" It is a very common latin quotation, it says 'no fine without a bill'. very fundamental juristiction. think about it. ONOG did an arbitrary punishment to stephano. if you are saying arbitrary because there was no precedent or written rules, i agree with you. if you are saying arbitrary because it was not thought out and logical, then i would have to disagree with you. the tournament was for the barcrafts and fans. him dropping out at the last minute because he was tired was not acceptable to them and they handled it the best way they could think of. the fact that he got any prize money shows that they were considering the best result for all people. first point. how can you justify a punishment otherwise? it's always like 'we just felt like it at the moment' anyway, ONOG won't change it, and i kind of agree with the judgement. but tournament organizers just should take 30min and and put together some rules of action for the players.
doing a logical, reasonable thing justifies a punishment. you dont necessarily have to have written rules or precedent. it is better if you do have them, but its not necessary. bear in mind that judges create new precedents all the time because of new facts that require that they do so. tournament admins have to do the same thing.
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On January 31 2012 08:45 Hot_Bid wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:43 dsousa wrote:On January 31 2012 08:41 Hot_Bid wrote:On January 31 2012 08:37 Quakie wrote:
I got ya, Hot_Bid. Doesn't seem like it is bias at place here. Over to the case, Stephano seems to be a very blunt guy, and I think this also got to him here a bit. Its frustrating because even if someone makes a really shitty OP like "Liquid sucks now man" we'd have to consider leaving it open even if we'd instantly close an "EG sucks now man" or "Mouz sucks now man" thread, because people get all wound up about perceived bias. 1. If any other non-Liquid player forfeited first round, we'd not make a thread 2. If Tyler or Ret or Zenio or Hero forfeited in the finals for a similar reason as Stephano did, we'd make a thread You can believe us or not about the truth of these two statements, but that is what we'd do, and if that's the case then there is no hypocrisy here. As for the newsworthiness of this, of course it's news, it's one of the best if not the best non Korean forfeiting in the finals of a semi-major community organized tournament with a 3k prize pool. It's about as concrete news and notable as it gets. Did you make a thread about Polt? We did not make a thread about Polt. Are you saying we should have? Or that us not making a thread about Polt is somehow unfair? Please clarify. Because I am pretty sure we were right not to make a thread about Polt. However, if you feel that there is an epidemic of forfeits and it is discussion worthy, you can make a thread about all of them in SC2 General with a nice OP. Did you make a thread about Polt? You can.
I'm just pointing out the fact that this happened to Stephano because he's the "IT" guy right now and this post is feeding the mob.
What Stephano did is not different, the only difference is he's better and/or more popular.
Lucky him.
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On January 31 2012 08:45 Corsica wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:44 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 31 2012 08:43 dsousa wrote:On January 31 2012 08:41 Hot_Bid wrote:On January 31 2012 08:37 Quakie wrote:
I got ya, Hot_Bid. Doesn't seem like it is bias at place here. Over to the case, Stephano seems to be a very blunt guy, and I think this also got to him here a bit. Its frustrating because even if someone makes a really shitty OP like "Liquid sucks now man" we'd have to consider leaving it open even if we'd instantly close an "EG sucks now man" or "Mouz sucks now man" thread, because people get all wound up about perceived bias. 1. If any other non-Liquid player forfeited first round, we'd not make a thread 2. If Tyler or Ret or Zenio or Hero forfeited in the finals for a similar reason as Stephano did, we'd make a thread You can believe us or not about the truth of these two statements, but that is what we'd do, and if that's the case then there is no hypocrisy here. As for the newsworthiness of this, of course it's news, it's one of the best if not the best non Korean forfeiting in the finals of a semi-major community organized tournament with a 3k prize pool. It's about as concrete news and notable as it gets. Did you make a thread about Polt? nobody gives a shit about the go4sc2 cup. they dont even have LR threads. Well its unprofessional behaviour so lets raise the topic, We can shit on Stephano, why cant we shit on Polt. Unprofessional is Unprofessional
Unprofessional is unprofessional, but magnitude and significance does matter as well.
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On January 31 2012 08:47 FaRess wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:32 aTnClouD wrote:On January 31 2012 08:30 Corsica wrote:On January 31 2012 08:29 aTnClouD wrote:On January 31 2012 08:26 Corsica wrote:
3 AM ... It was 3 Fucking AM in Europe, Stephano was playing whole day, showed some amazing games on Scan Invitational and ONOG. Imagine if you worked whole day, trying to get a raise, and so you work for 12 hours, and then your boss tells you , no fuck you, you worked till 3 AM, and I cant even give you small raise, and now whole office will know and we will hate you...Golden rule people...
There are real people behind pro-gamer IDs. And there are real people raising money and going to a barcraft to have a forfeited final match cause one of the players couldn't take responsibility for finishing what he started, without giving a shit on everybody else. This is a major act of disrespect imo. Should he die near his computer? He played two tournaments and delayed one of the two to forfeit the finals, the mess is his fault in the first place so he better take responsibility and finish what he started. No need for more spoiled arrogant kids in esports, thanks. Where did you see him say it's not his fault and that he is not taking responsibility ? What is arrogant about forfeiting because you're exhausted ? You think if he was as successful as you are (not much) he wouldn't forfeit the tournament, how would you know. you absolutely make no sense, you're the little kid expressing his pointless opinion
Cloud said few month ago that stephano and nerchio cheated.. cuz they didnt win offline.
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i agree with the decision that they made. I might even go further to say that something like a no show like that should be grounds for just straight removal from a tournament.. just move everyone up places and put his ass last.
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On January 31 2012 08:47 Corsica wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:46 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 31 2012 08:45 Corsica wrote:On January 31 2012 08:44 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 31 2012 08:43 dsousa wrote:On January 31 2012 08:41 Hot_Bid wrote:On January 31 2012 08:37 Quakie wrote:
I got ya, Hot_Bid. Doesn't seem like it is bias at place here. Over to the case, Stephano seems to be a very blunt guy, and I think this also got to him here a bit. Its frustrating because even if someone makes a really shitty OP like "Liquid sucks now man" we'd have to consider leaving it open even if we'd instantly close an "EG sucks now man" or "Mouz sucks now man" thread, because people get all wound up about perceived bias. 1. If any other non-Liquid player forfeited first round, we'd not make a thread 2. If Tyler or Ret or Zenio or Hero forfeited in the finals for a similar reason as Stephano did, we'd make a thread You can believe us or not about the truth of these two statements, but that is what we'd do, and if that's the case then there is no hypocrisy here. As for the newsworthiness of this, of course it's news, it's one of the best if not the best non Korean forfeiting in the finals of a semi-major community organized tournament with a 3k prize pool. It's about as concrete news and notable as it gets. Did you make a thread about Polt? nobody gives a shit about the go4sc2 cup. they dont even have LR threads. You quote me , yet you dont understand me. Well its unprofessional behaviour so lets raise the topic, We can shit on Stephano, why cant we shit on Polt. Unprofessional is Unprofessional its a news site, not a gossip site. ONOG was a fairly large tournament and a controversy arose. that is news. polt being unprofessional in a tournament nobody cares about is (albeit unprofessional) not newsworthy because nobody cares. You quote me , yet you dont understand me.
your insert words into my quotes because you think you are sly, you are caught. you asked a question, i answered it. you dont like the answer, you try to insult me. i read, i lol.
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On January 31 2012 08:50 Bagration wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 08:45 Corsica wrote:On January 31 2012 08:44 dAPhREAk wrote:On January 31 2012 08:43 dsousa wrote:On January 31 2012 08:41 Hot_Bid wrote:On January 31 2012 08:37 Quakie wrote:
I got ya, Hot_Bid. Doesn't seem like it is bias at place here. Over to the case, Stephano seems to be a very blunt guy, and I think this also got to him here a bit. Its frustrating because even if someone makes a really shitty OP like "Liquid sucks now man" we'd have to consider leaving it open even if we'd instantly close an "EG sucks now man" or "Mouz sucks now man" thread, because people get all wound up about perceived bias. 1. If any other non-Liquid player forfeited first round, we'd not make a thread 2. If Tyler or Ret or Zenio or Hero forfeited in the finals for a similar reason as Stephano did, we'd make a thread You can believe us or not about the truth of these two statements, but that is what we'd do, and if that's the case then there is no hypocrisy here. As for the newsworthiness of this, of course it's news, it's one of the best if not the best non Korean forfeiting in the finals of a semi-major community organized tournament with a 3k prize pool. It's about as concrete news and notable as it gets. Did you make a thread about Polt? nobody gives a shit about the go4sc2 cup. they dont even have LR threads. Well its unprofessional behaviour so lets raise the topic, We can shit on Stephano, why cant we shit on Polt. Unprofessional is Unprofessional Unprofessional is unprofessional, but magnitude and significance does matter as well.
Newswise, not ethicswise
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One thing I do not understand.
34 pages of talks on this incident... why... how... I don't even...
This is such a trivial thing about such a bad player (standard is Code S ofc) at such a non-prestigious tournament that even ended with only minor penalties. Why so serious?
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EPT
