• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 07:27
CEST 13:27
KST 20:27
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview4[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview2herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026)6Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO4 & Finals Preview5
Community News
Weekly Cups (May 18-25): MaxPax wins doubles0Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League4Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double0Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO8 Results2Weekly Cups (May 4-10): Clem, MaxPax, herO win1
StarCraft 2
General
herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview Weekly Cups (May 18-25): MaxPax wins doubles Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double
Tourneys
GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Welcome to the External Content forum Mutation # 527 Hell Train The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 526 Rubber and Glue
Brood War
General
Every Matchup's Top 5 Winrates (all ASLs & KSLs) Pros React To: ASL S21 Finals BW General Discussion Very long shot - StarCraft x A7X video Pros React to: TvT Masterclass in FlaSh vs Light
Tourneys
Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [BSL22] WB Final & LB Semis - Saturday 21:00 CEST [ASL21] Grand Finals [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Trading/Investing Thread Dating: How's your luck? European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development streaming software
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Customization Drives Loyalty…
TrAiDoS
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2925 users

PvZ mothership and carrier replay pack - Page 4

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 All
rsvp
Profile Blog Joined January 2006
United States2266 Posts
October 04 2011 06:00 GMT
#61
On October 04 2011 09:30 Belha wrote:
Hey rsvp, what about a 1.4 replay update?? I'm sure the protoss will love the update in this mothership times


Heh sorry I don't have any new 1.4 replays since I've actually been working on other PvZ strats. But of course, this is much much stronger now than pre-1.4.
kcdc
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2311 Posts
October 04 2011 16:53 GMT
#62
On October 04 2011 14:58 Anihc wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 27 2011 23:12 kcdc wrote:
Anihc, great replay pack. Thanks for the upload. I'm totally gonna copy your PvZ. Couple questions.

Your general build seems to go something like:

FE (usually FFE), scout for Z's 3rd at 5-6 min, if he's expanded, tech straight to colossi (or 6 gate), take quick third around the time that the first colossus pops, add second robo, then transition to carrier+archon while trying to cannon+nexus the map.

I couldn't get all of the replays to load, but that seemed to be the outline from what I saw.

What are your thoughts on the order for twilight council/templar archives/stargate/fleet beacon? Twilight council is needed for +2 weapons, but the archons seem to be the last addition to your deathball when you've finally got the 10 gas geysers to make the perfect all-gas composition. In the games I watched, those 4 tech structures along with +2 weapons seemed to be kind of jumbled in all at the same time. Do you worry about spending too much of your income on tech at this window?

Why 2 robo's? They came in handy when you got caught in bad positions and lost your core, but for the most part, you rarely used both at the same time, and often, they both sat idle as you tended to stop at ~6 colossi anyway. Do you feel like you need 2 robo's to boost your colossus count fast enough to defend your aggressive expansions? Or do you want the extra production capacity should you need to rebuild your colossus core quickly?

Do you think about applying pressure beyond the occasional zealot or DT drop, or is your plan more about grabbing bases and crafting the perfect 200/200 composition? Do you see any timings where you could apply direct pressure?

Blink and storm--are they worth it? Assuming you're going with the expand+defend strategy, when would you research them? I assume you'd only want at most 2 HT kept for storm, and the rest made into archons before engaging.

How thrilled are you about the infestor nerfs? NP seemed to be the only thing that gave you problems in the mid-game.


Order for twilight/archives/stargate/fleet beacon - yea I see that you could tell I was just randomly throwing up tech buildings in a lot of my games :p I'm glad that you mentioned worrying about spending too much of my income on tech at the same time, since actually this has become an issue for me recently - I've lost to several zergs who just quickly max on roach/infestor and then attack. For some reason in the past most zergs just wait for hive tech, which gives me enough time to get out carrier/mothership/etc. So now I think an important thing is to keep an eye on when they start their hive (i.e. obs in their main), because if they don't get hive there's no need to tech to fleet beacon. Stargate is still good though, since mixing in voids is always great. I guess order should be twilight (for +2), stargate, and then fleet beacon when you see hive, and finally templar archives when you're about to complete your death ball.

I originally went double robo because one of my other favorite openings is a fast +1 6 gate, and I'd follow that up with double robo colo since your robo comes late and I feel the need to catch up on colo count. But I guess if you go fast robo/colo, there's really no need for the double robo. I'd recommend a faster stargate instead and adding in voids earlier rather than a 2nd robo. Once you get to 4+ bases though a 2nd robo is always good.

There's really no way to apply pressure other than zealot/dt/drops. I've tried just maxing on gateway/colo and attacking, but if you tech/expand at the same time then your attack is too slow, and if you don't tech at all then you'll lose to hive tech.

Blink is always great to have. That's actually a weakness of my play, I know I often don't really utilize blink well. The question of storm vs archon - I've actually been leaning more towards storm recently. When I face good zergs who spread out their units and don't throw everything into vortex, then archons actually get killed by broodlords who are outside the vortex. Thus storm becomes much better for you to defend your carriers against corruptors.

Yea infestor nerfs + mothership buff makes this deathball style extremely strong now. Now really the only thing I'm scared of is mass corruptor/BL + fast remax.


I initially tried your double robo style and had a lot of trouble defending my 3rd or 4th bases. I think sticking to 1 robo would help, but I also think that in the replays I watched, you got away with some exploitable expos. Sticking on just 1 robo and cutting out the fleet beacon tech would help with having enough mid-game units to defend, but p00n's style where you go straight for mothership+archon seems so much easier to execute than colossus->third->archon->mothership/carrier. Colossi come out faster, but the mothership seems better for defending the third.
Velvet_Llama
Profile Joined September 2011
United States25 Posts
October 04 2011 18:23 GMT
#63
So glad to see this recent explosion (well maybe explosion is a bit too strong of a word) of mothership and carrier play. While I don't think Protoss was imbalanced or at an unfair disadvantage in comparison to the other races, it did feel like you were always pushed into a fairly narrow set of strategic options as a 'Toss player because they were so much more effective than other strategies. Doing anything else felt like putting yourself behind the proverbial eight ball. Beyond Protoss players, the emergence of new strategies is good for everyone. It just makes each matchup more interesting when you have to take into consideration new strategic options.

Plus the mothership is just freaking awesome so I'm glad people are finding ways to use it more effectively :p
Prev 1 2 3 4 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
GSL
09:30
2026 Season 2: Ro8 Group B
Zoun vs RogueLIVE!
Maru vs TBD
SHIN vs TBD
Ryung 465
IntoTheiNu 311
CranKy Ducklings SOOP36
Rex24
GSL EN (SOOP)0
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Ryung 465
Lowko232
TKL 50
Rex 24
ProTech0
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 20098
Calm 5508
Hyuk 842
Jaedong 426
Horang2 399
BeSt 340
EffOrt 326
Mini 242
Leta 230
Pusan 173
[ Show more ]
Light 142
Soulkey 131
ZerO 129
Last 119
ggaemo 89
hero 81
ToSsGirL 76
Aegong 54
Rush 50
Shinee 46
Mind 41
scan(afreeca) 39
Sharp 37
JYJ 33
soO 33
Sea.KH 30
sorry 26
Terrorterran 20
Free 19
JulyZerg 17
Barracks 17
zelot 13
Sacsri 12
910 11
GoRush 10
Noble 9
Movie 7
ajuk12(nOOB) 7
Icarus 6
Dota 2
Dendi456
XcaliburYe153
canceldota59
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1417
x6flipin226
allub172
markeloff99
kRYSTAL_62
Other Games
B2W.Neo770
Mew2King165
Pyrionflax134
DeMusliM0
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 1026
Other Games
gamesdonequick577
Counter-Strike
PGL288
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 13
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 16
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis1466
• Jankos1426
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Spring Champion…
34m
SKillous vs Strange
Lambo vs Strange
Ryung vs Strange
Lambo vs Ryung
Ryung vs SKillous
Lambo vs SKillous
OSC
7h 34m
Cham vs Percival
ShoWTimE vs Lambo
Krystianer vs sebesdes
Cure vs Babymarine
SKillous vs Arrogfire
Gerald vs MindelVK
goblin vs TBD
Jumy vs HonMonO
Replay Cast
12h 34m
Maestros of the Game
1d 1h
Replay Cast
1d 12h
RSL Revival
1d 19h
Lambo vs SHIN
Solar vs Rogue
herO vs Clem
Maestros of the Game
1d 23h
IPSL
2 days
ZZZero vs WorsT
Julia vs eOnzErG
BSL
2 days
TerrOr vs Dewalt
Bonyth vs eOnzErG
Replay Cast
2 days
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
2 days
Maestros of the Game
3 days
OSC
3 days
IPSL
3 days
Dragon vs Artosis
dxtr13 vs Hawk
BSL
3 days
Wardi Open
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
WardiTV Spring Champion…
4 days
Maestros of the Game
5 days
The PondCast
5 days
Maestros of the Game
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
WardiTV Spring Champion…
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 21
2026 GSL S1
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

2026 KK StarCraft Pro League
BSL Season 22
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
KK 2v2 League Season 1
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: King of Kings
YSL S3
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
Bounty Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.