• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 14:20
CET 19:20
KST 03:20
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy5ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT30Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book19Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289
Community News
Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool37Weekly Cups (March 9-15): herO, Clem, ByuN win42026 KungFu Cup Announcement6BGE Stara Zagora 2026 cancelled12Blizzard Classic Cup - Tastosis announced as captains18
StarCraft 2
General
Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool Potential Updates Coming to the SC2 CN Server Weekly Cups (March 2-8): ByuN overcomes PvT block Weekly Cups (August 25-31): Clem's Last Straw? Weekly Cups (March 9-15): herO, Clem, ByuN win
Tourneys
World University TeamLeague (500$+) | Signups Open RSL Season 4 announced for March-April Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV Team League Season 10 KSL Week 87
Strategy
Custom Maps
Publishing has been re-enabled! [Feb 24th 2026]
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 517 Distant Threat Mutation # 516 Specter of Death Mutation # 515 Together Forever
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ JaeDong's form before ASL [ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos ASL21 General Discussion Gypsy to Korea
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL22] Open Qualifiers & Ladder Tours Small VOD Thread 2.0 IPSL Spring 2026 is here!
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Five o'clock TL Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Cricket [SPORT] Formula 1 Discussion Tokyo Olympics 2021 Thread General nutrition recommendations
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Laptop capable of using Photoshop Lightroom?
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Money Laundering In Video Ga…
TrAiDoS
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
FS++
Kraekkling
Shocked by a laser…
Spydermine0240
Unintentional protectionism…
Uldridge
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2361 users

Designated Balance Discussion Thread - Page 1260

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 1258 1259 1260 1261 1262 1266 Next
FrkFrJss
Profile Joined April 2015
Canada1205 Posts
January 22 2016 05:14 GMT
#25181
I mean...I guess we'll have to see after Code S begins, but there are currently 6 Protoss, 8 Terran, and 6 Zerg in Code S. PvT is 1-1, and there are 3 TvPs left. So far, herO, Myungsik, seed, and Trap have advanced. None of those are particularly no name.

I'm not denying the imbalance, but so far, the results PURELY in the GSL (which is what you point towards) really don't point to Terran and Zerg performing worse than Protoss.

Also, Seed just made an interview that said how broken adepts were versus Terran, and many Protoss players in this thread have acknowledged the imbalance with the wp + adept matchup.
"Keep Moving Forward" - Walt Disney
Merkmerk
Profile Joined August 2010
United States96 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-22 15:15:50
January 22 2016 15:10 GMT
#25182
^

Sometimes balance isn't exclusively for 400 apm pros though. PvT is most assuredly broken at lower skill levels where the classic skill to execute vs skill to survive is vastly out of sync

Besides, sooner they nerf adept/wp for PvT, the sooner they can get around to nerfing Lolberators. They're next on the chopping block you can take that to the bank
Yodeleihelaihee
Thieving Magpie
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States6752 Posts
January 23 2016 08:40 GMT
#25183
On January 21 2016 02:41 DinoMight wrote:
For any Magic the Gathering players out there (Thieving Magpie)...

People just don't like losing to Protoss. No one ever thinks they were out played by Protoss.. they always just go "Protoss bullshit."

Protoss is the Blue of StarCraft.

When someone plays a big trample creature and kills you with it, you go "oh, I was out played."

When someone mind controls your giant trample creature and kills you with it, you go "fuck blue."

There are a lot of frustrating Protoss strategies but I do think it makes the game a lot more diverse strategically and more entertaining.

Without sneaky Protoss bullshit HotS would have been just a bunch of people splitting marines against banelings.


We'd never have gotten Idra's ragequit to Huk's hallucinations (still the funniest shit ever).

We'd have no Parting or MC or any of the hilarity and swagger they brought to the game.



Learn to love the Protoss bullshit and deal with it. The Protoss player is using the tools he has at his disposal. Don't hate the game. Hate the player :p


This is golden

Don't listen to the haters, this is gold right here <3
Hark, what baseball through yonder window breaks?
CheddarToss
Profile Joined September 2015
534 Posts
January 23 2016 20:00 GMT
#25184
Watching the uThermal vs PtitDrogo series I can't help but feeling the urge to throw up. Liberators are such an imbalanced unit, it's not even funny. Adepts are the definition of balance in comparison.
Nebuchad
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
Switzerland12417 Posts
January 23 2016 20:06 GMT
#25185
On January 24 2016 05:00 CheddarToss wrote:
Watching the uThermal vs PtitDrogo series I can't help but feeling the urge to throw up. Liberators are such an imbalanced unit, it's not even funny. Adepts are the definition of balance in comparison.


As a general rule, when a series is 2-2 and close with nobody looking like he has a clear advantage, you shouldn't be throwing up.
No will to live, no wish to die
Deleted User 3420
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
24492 Posts
January 23 2016 20:51 GMT
#25186
it's not balance discussion but can someone explain how the ladder works to me

how is it that i am playing game after game at the top of diamond, and for some reason the ladder put me up against the same guy, who isn't even ranked, twice in a row. he doesnt even have ranked games played, so why am i playing him on the ladder. and if he is in placement then I still don't understand why 1.) he is playing someone who is basically low master mmr, and 2.) why is he playing the same guy twice(even after losing) in his placements?
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
January 23 2016 20:58 GMT
#25187
On January 24 2016 05:51 travis wrote:
it's not balance discussion but can someone explain how the ladder works to me

how is it that i am playing game after game at the top of diamond, and for some reason the ladder put me up against the same guy, who isn't even ranked, twice in a row. he doesnt even have ranked games played, so why am i playing him on the ladder. and if he is in placement then I still don't understand why 1.) he is playing someone who is basically low master mmr, and 2.) why is he playing the same guy twice(even after losing) in his placements?


You play games and by winning your MMR (match making rating) increases, by losing it falls. Dependent on your MMR suitable opponent's are chosen and you get placed into leagues if you are playing ranked.
So if your opponent is playing unranked he/she is not placed in a league, but might have a similar MMR to yours which won't change too much from just one loss, hence he/she might play you mutlitple times in a row.

Oh, and before I forget it, there is also a pretty useless point system with no meaning whatsoever in place to visualize your skill in comparison to others in your league.
Empirimancer
Profile Joined July 2011
Canada1024 Posts
January 23 2016 20:59 GMT
#25188
On January 22 2016 14:14 FrkFrJss wrote:
I mean...I guess we'll have to see after Code S begins, but there are currently 6 Protoss, 8 Terran, and 6 Zerg in Code S. PvT is 1-1, and there are 3 TvPs left. So far, herO, Myungsik, seed, and Trap have advanced. None of those are particularly no name.

I'm not denying the imbalance, but so far, the results PURELY in the GSL (which is what you point towards) really don't point to Terran and Zerg performing worse than Protoss.


But the Protoss have only lost to Zerg and other Protoss. The only exception is TY vs Patience, the best Terran in the world vs someone who probably shouldn't even be in Code A.


Deleted User 3420
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
24492 Posts
January 23 2016 21:02 GMT
#25189
On January 24 2016 05:58 Big J wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2016 05:51 travis wrote:
it's not balance discussion but can someone explain how the ladder works to me

how is it that i am playing game after game at the top of diamond, and for some reason the ladder put me up against the same guy, who isn't even ranked, twice in a row. he doesnt even have ranked games played, so why am i playing him on the ladder. and if he is in placement then I still don't understand why 1.) he is playing someone who is basically low master mmr, and 2.) why is he playing the same guy twice(even after losing) in his placements?


You play games and by winning your MMR (match making rating) increases, by losing it falls. Dependent on your MMR suitable opponent's are chosen and you get placed into leagues if you are playing ranked.
So if your opponent is playing unranked he/she is not placed in a league, but might have a similar MMR to yours which won't change too much from just one loss, hence he/she might play you mutlitple times in a row.

Oh, and before I forget it, there is also a pretty useless point system with no meaning whatsoever in place to visualize your skill in comparison to others in your league.


so then people playing unranked can be put up vs ranked players?
seems... stupid
lol
Shapelog
Profile Joined November 2015
United States5188 Posts
January 23 2016 21:14 GMT
#25190
On January 24 2016 06:02 travis wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2016 05:58 Big J wrote:
On January 24 2016 05:51 travis wrote:
it's not balance discussion but can someone explain how the ladder works to me

how is it that i am playing game after game at the top of diamond, and for some reason the ladder put me up against the same guy, who isn't even ranked, twice in a row. he doesnt even have ranked games played, so why am i playing him on the ladder. and if he is in placement then I still don't understand why 1.) he is playing someone who is basically low master mmr, and 2.) why is he playing the same guy twice(even after losing) in his placements?


You play games and by winning your MMR (match making rating) increases, by losing it falls. Dependent on your MMR suitable opponent's are chosen and you get placed into leagues if you are playing ranked.
So if your opponent is playing unranked he/she is not placed in a league, but might have a similar MMR to yours which won't change too much from just one loss, hence he/she might play you mutlitple times in a row.

Oh, and before I forget it, there is also a pretty useless point system with no meaning whatsoever in place to visualize your skill in comparison to others in your league.


so then people playing unranked can be put up vs ranked players?
seems... stupid
lol


I cry every time i play ladder because I get pared against a Diamond player (I am Bronze!) who is playing unranked.
Good Practice thou.
"Subsequently clicking post is like launching a doomsday's worth of nukes' equivalent in dopamine." -RB
keglu
Profile Joined June 2011
Poland485 Posts
January 23 2016 21:46 GMT
#25191
On January 23 2016 00:10 Merkmerk wrote:
^

Sometimes balance isn't exclusively for 400 apm pros though. PvT is most assuredly broken at lower skill levels where the classic skill to execute vs skill to survive is vastly out of sync

Besides, sooner they nerf adept/wp for PvT, the sooner they can get around to nerfing Lolberators. They're next on the chopping block you can take that to the bank



Ladder race distribution do not support this argument. Protoss is currently heavily underrepresnted in higher leagues (platinium-master) and overpresented in brozne-silver.
aksfjh
Profile Joined November 2010
United States4853 Posts
January 23 2016 23:00 GMT
#25192
On January 24 2016 05:00 CheddarToss wrote:
Watching the uThermal vs PtitDrogo series I can't help but feeling the urge to throw up. Liberators are such an imbalanced unit, it's not even funny. Adepts are the definition of balance in comparison.

A unit/build that can be hard countered by going stargate is imbalanced? The build even requires Terran to sacrifice the economy (to an extent) to perform. This is in contrast to the "quick 3rd expansion behind adept-warp prism harass that usually kills the Terran."

It's actually quite hilarious, if you seen casts of the adept harass. "[Terran] really shut that harass down! Was all over his base and just seemed impenetrable! [Protoss] wasn't able to do any meaningful damage and lost his adepts! Meanwhile, [Protoss] took his 3rd and Terran finally feels confident enough to move out and take his."

There's no mention of "He really needed to do damage with that attack..." or "BUT AT WHAT COST?!" It basically boils down to "Protoss attack failed, now we can continue the game on equal footing."
CheddarToss
Profile Joined September 2015
534 Posts
January 23 2016 23:47 GMT
#25193
On January 24 2016 08:00 aksfjh wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2016 05:00 CheddarToss wrote:
Watching the uThermal vs PtitDrogo series I can't help but feeling the urge to throw up. Liberators are such an imbalanced unit, it's not even funny. Adepts are the definition of balance in comparison.

A unit/build that can be hard countered by going stargate is imbalanced? The build even requires Terran to sacrifice the economy (to an extent) to perform. This is in contrast to the "quick 3rd expansion behind adept-warp prism harass that usually kills the Terran."

It's actually quite hilarious, if you seen casts of the adept harass. "[Terran] really shut that harass down! Was all over his base and just seemed impenetrable! [Protoss] wasn't able to do any meaningful damage and lost his adepts! Meanwhile, [Protoss] took his 3rd and Terran finally feels confident enough to move out and take his."

There's no mention of "He really needed to do damage with that attack..." or "BUT AT WHAT COST?!" It basically boils down to "Protoss attack failed, now we can continue the game on equal footing."

And how is that different from Liberator harass? It does a lot of damage every single time. Have you seen the two games, where uThermal did just that vs PtitDrogo? Only two Liberators did soooooo much damage (a lot of lost mining time and dead probes), that when uThermal came knocking at Drogo's door, he had 4x the army supply of the latter. And the disgusting thing is, uThermal did nothing special, because Liberator harass doesn't require micro or anything. It's super safe and easy to perform, because of the amazing range Liberators have.
PinheadXXXXXX
Profile Joined February 2012
United States897 Posts
January 24 2016 00:29 GMT
#25194
On January 24 2016 08:00 aksfjh wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2016 05:00 CheddarToss wrote:
Watching the uThermal vs PtitDrogo series I can't help but feeling the urge to throw up. Liberators are such an imbalanced unit, it's not even funny. Adepts are the definition of balance in comparison.

A unit/build that can be hard countered by going stargate is imbalanced? The build even requires Terran to sacrifice the economy (to an extent) to perform. This is in contrast to the "quick 3rd expansion behind adept-warp prism harass that usually kills the Terran."

It's actually quite hilarious, if you seen casts of the adept harass. "[Terran] really shut that harass down! Was all over his base and just seemed impenetrable! [Protoss] wasn't able to do any meaningful damage and lost his adepts! Meanwhile, [Protoss] took his 3rd and Terran finally feels confident enough to move out and take his."

There's no mention of "He really needed to do damage with that attack..." or "BUT AT WHAT COST?!" It basically boils down to "Protoss attack failed, now we can continue the game on equal footing."

I don't think that's necessarily bad design. Compare this to marine-mine-medivac builds off of a reaper expand in HotS TvP. Terran would generally come out even as long as they didn't lose all of their units for nothing. Generally, trading evenly would be good for terran, except in certain cases (such as an imminent blink allin), and it was totally acceptable to lose 10 marines and 2 mines for 12 probes.

The thing about these builds, though, was that Protoss could defend them perfectly well from a wide range of reasonable macro openings, and there was always the option for some kind of blink attack or quick colossus push, but adept-prism and the pylon cannon forces Terran to play a certain specific build and only that build. Terrans are also constricted through the midgame; currently, every TvP seems to end with a marine-tank push that hits Protoss a little before their fourth base is fully functional. It's possible that the adept nerf will lead to more build diversity for Terrans and thus more diverse play in the midgame, but it's also possible that may not even get close to fixing the problem. It might be balanced, but if the midgame doesn't change then DK needs to work a little harder.
Taeja the one true Byunjwa~
ProtossMasterRace
Profile Joined January 2016
57 Posts
January 24 2016 00:36 GMT
#25195
On January 24 2016 05:59 Empirimancer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 22 2016 14:14 FrkFrJss wrote:
I mean...I guess we'll have to see after Code S begins, but there are currently 6 Protoss, 8 Terran, and 6 Zerg in Code S. PvT is 1-1, and there are 3 TvPs left. So far, herO, Myungsik, seed, and Trap have advanced. None of those are particularly no name.

I'm not denying the imbalance, but so far, the results PURELY in the GSL (which is what you point towards) really don't point to Terran and Zerg performing worse than Protoss.


But the Protoss have only lost to Zerg and other Protoss. The only exception is TY vs Patience, the best Terran in the world vs someone who probably shouldn't even be in Code A.




There has been literally only 1 other TvP match where toss won 3 - 1 against a terran that played absolutely atrociously. Any good terran can easily counter adepts by now. It is not a balance issue it is a learn to play issue. The overall winrate of TvP in code A is exactly 50%
CheddarToss
Profile Joined September 2015
534 Posts
January 24 2016 00:38 GMT
#25196
On January 24 2016 09:36 ProtossMasterRace wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2016 05:59 Empirimancer wrote:
On January 22 2016 14:14 FrkFrJss wrote:
I mean...I guess we'll have to see after Code S begins, but there are currently 6 Protoss, 8 Terran, and 6 Zerg in Code S. PvT is 1-1, and there are 3 TvPs left. So far, herO, Myungsik, seed, and Trap have advanced. None of those are particularly no name.

I'm not denying the imbalance, but so far, the results PURELY in the GSL (which is what you point towards) really don't point to Terran and Zerg performing worse than Protoss.


But the Protoss have only lost to Zerg and other Protoss. The only exception is TY vs Patience, the best Terran in the world vs someone who probably shouldn't even be in Code A.




There has been literally only 1 other TvP match where toss won 3 - 1 against a terran that played absolutely atrociously. Any good terran can easily counter adepts by now. It is not a balance issue it is a learn to play issue. The overall winrate of TvP in code A is exactly 50%

Well, to be fair, it is also a design issue. PvT is a badly designed matchup.
ProtossMasterRace
Profile Joined January 2016
57 Posts
January 24 2016 00:39 GMT
#25197
On January 24 2016 08:00 aksfjh wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2016 05:00 CheddarToss wrote:
Watching the uThermal vs PtitDrogo series I can't help but feeling the urge to throw up. Liberators are such an imbalanced unit, it's not even funny. Adepts are the definition of balance in comparison.

A unit/build that can be hard countered by going stargate is imbalanced? The build even requires Terran to sacrifice the economy (to an extent) to perform. This is in contrast to the "quick 3rd expansion behind adept-warp prism harass that usually kills the Terran."

It's actually quite hilarious, if you seen casts of the adept harass. "[Terran] really shut that harass down! Was all over his base and just seemed impenetrable! [Protoss] wasn't able to do any meaningful damage and lost his adepts! Meanwhile, [Protoss] took his 3rd and Terran finally feels confident enough to move out and take his."

There's no mention of "He really needed to do damage with that attack..." or "BUT AT WHAT COST?!" It basically boils down to "Protoss attack failed, now we can continue the game on equal footing."


Adepts get hard countered by anything that is not light, tanks marauders etc. So your point is?
ProtossMasterRace
Profile Joined January 2016
57 Posts
January 24 2016 00:42 GMT
#25198
On January 24 2016 09:38 CheddarToss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2016 09:36 ProtossMasterRace wrote:
On January 24 2016 05:59 Empirimancer wrote:
On January 22 2016 14:14 FrkFrJss wrote:
I mean...I guess we'll have to see after Code S begins, but there are currently 6 Protoss, 8 Terran, and 6 Zerg in Code S. PvT is 1-1, and there are 3 TvPs left. So far, herO, Myungsik, seed, and Trap have advanced. None of those are particularly no name.

I'm not denying the imbalance, but so far, the results PURELY in the GSL (which is what you point towards) really don't point to Terran and Zerg performing worse than Protoss.


But the Protoss have only lost to Zerg and other Protoss. The only exception is TY vs Patience, the best Terran in the world vs someone who probably shouldn't even be in Code A.




There has been literally only 1 other TvP match where toss won 3 - 1 against a terran that played absolutely atrociously. Any good terran can easily counter adepts by now. It is not a balance issue it is a learn to play issue. The overall winrate of TvP in code A is exactly 50%

Well, to be fair, it is also a design issue. PvT is a badly designed matchup.


That is absolutely true, I don't like the fact that the only way to win against terran is stupid adept all ins but mid and late game is so heavily terran favored because of liberators that there is no point of even trying to get there unless adepts already did insane amount of damage. The whole matchup is just retarded, if toss wins with 1A adepts or terran wins with shift clicking liberators. The same is true for PvZ with the exception that only zerg has easy ways of winning with ravagers mutas lurkers or just doing whatever they want while taking bases without risks.
Matte
Profile Joined January 2016
Sweden6 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-24 01:09:42
January 24 2016 01:08 GMT
#25199
On January 24 2016 08:47 CheddarToss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2016 08:00 aksfjh wrote:
On January 24 2016 05:00 CheddarToss wrote:
Watching the uThermal vs PtitDrogo series I can't help but feeling the urge to throw up. Liberators are such an imbalanced unit, it's not even funny. Adepts are the definition of balance in comparison.

A unit/build that can be hard countered by going stargate is imbalanced? The build even requires Terran to sacrifice the economy (to an extent) to perform. This is in contrast to the "quick 3rd expansion behind adept-warp prism harass that usually kills the Terran."

It's actually quite hilarious, if you seen casts of the adept harass. "[Terran] really shut that harass down! Was all over his base and just seemed impenetrable! [Protoss] wasn't able to do any meaningful damage and lost his adepts! Meanwhile, [Protoss] took his 3rd and Terran finally feels confident enough to move out and take his."

There's no mention of "He really needed to do damage with that attack..." or "BUT AT WHAT COST?!" It basically boils down to "Protoss attack failed, now we can continue the game on equal footing."

And how is that different from Liberator harass? It does a lot of damage every single time.


I feel like he lost more due to his pylon placement rather than liberator harass being OP. Having well placed pylons would never allow a liberator to kill more than 2 probes while adept harass will almost always get 2 scvs per adept at a minimum. You can also counter it by getting a single phenoix as well.

Now this is not to say that the liberator is not problematic. It is a no splash flying siege tank with AOE air attack and it will need to be adjusted for TvP to end in a good place.
aksfjh
Profile Joined November 2010
United States4853 Posts
January 24 2016 01:46 GMT
#25200
On January 24 2016 10:08 Matte wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2016 08:47 CheddarToss wrote:
On January 24 2016 08:00 aksfjh wrote:
On January 24 2016 05:00 CheddarToss wrote:
Watching the uThermal vs PtitDrogo series I can't help but feeling the urge to throw up. Liberators are such an imbalanced unit, it's not even funny. Adepts are the definition of balance in comparison.

A unit/build that can be hard countered by going stargate is imbalanced? The build even requires Terran to sacrifice the economy (to an extent) to perform. This is in contrast to the "quick 3rd expansion behind adept-warp prism harass that usually kills the Terran."

It's actually quite hilarious, if you seen casts of the adept harass. "[Terran] really shut that harass down! Was all over his base and just seemed impenetrable! [Protoss] wasn't able to do any meaningful damage and lost his adepts! Meanwhile, [Protoss] took his 3rd and Terran finally feels confident enough to move out and take his."

There's no mention of "He really needed to do damage with that attack..." or "BUT AT WHAT COST?!" It basically boils down to "Protoss attack failed, now we can continue the game on equal footing."

And how is that different from Liberator harass? It does a lot of damage every single time.


I feel like he lost more due to his pylon placement rather than liberator harass being OP. Having well placed pylons would never allow a liberator to kill more than 2 probes while adept harass will almost always get 2 scvs per adept at a minimum. You can also counter it by getting a single phenoix as well.

Now this is not to say that the liberator is not problematic. It is a no splash flying siege tank with AOE air attack and it will need to be adjusted for TvP to end in a good place.

I disagree. I have yet to see a game where it is abused in such a way that thoughtful simcity/build orders wouldn't negate their usefulness in the early game. For the mid and late game, I've seen too many games where Protoss either refused to branch tech trees ("robo is good enough to end this game now") or didn't capitalize on an advantage early enough (usually taking expansions too slowly).

Theoretically, I can see how it can be powerful. Maybe we'll see it one day where a Terran will "showcase to DK" how broken it is, but I haven't seen anything ridiculous from it so far. Only comments like "Liberator harass doesn't require micro or anything" from the people that play the race that was notorious for a-moving death balls 4 months ago.
Prev 1 1258 1259 1260 1261 1262 1266 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
LAN Event
16:00
StarCraft Madness Day 2
Airneanach162
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Liquid`TLO 226
SpeCial 179
EmSc Tv 33
MindelVK 30
Codebar 24
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 21634
Calm 3092
Mini 301
Zeus 224
EffOrt 153
firebathero 142
Dewaltoss 137
actioN 85
ggaemo 66
Shine 54
[ Show more ]
Nal_rA 26
IntoTheRainbow 17
NaDa 6
Dota 2
Gorgc6432
LuMiX1
Counter-Strike
fl0m5475
Fnx 2973
pashabiceps1373
byalli577
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox692
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor540
Liquid`Hasu505
Other Games
Grubby2657
FrodaN2632
Liquid`RaSZi1529
B2W.Neo592
Beastyqt494
Mlord423
Hui .104
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick903
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream81
StarCraft 2
EmSc Tv 33
EmSc2Tv 33
angryscii 18
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 13
• Reevou 7
• Kozan
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Migwel
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 7
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota276
League of Legends
• Nemesis4187
• Shiphtur437
Other Games
• imaqtpie1027
Upcoming Events
PSISTORM Gaming Misc
41m
BSL
1h 41m
Replay Cast
14h 41m
Afreeca Starleague
15h 41m
Sharp vs Scan
Rain vs Mong
Wardi Open
17h 41m
Monday Night Weeklies
22h 41m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 15h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 15h
Soulkey vs Ample
JyJ vs sSak
Replay Cast
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
hero vs YSC
Larva vs Shine
[ Show More ]
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
KCM Race Survival
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
WardiTV Team League
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
WardiTV Team League
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
Cure vs Zoun
herO vs Rogue
WardiTV Team League
5 days
Platinum Heroes Events
5 days
BSL
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
ByuN vs Maru
MaxPax vs TriGGeR
WardiTV Team League
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Jeongseon Sooper Cup
WardiTV Winter 2026
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
BSL Season 22
CSL Elite League 2026
CSL Season 20: Qualifier 1
RSL Revival: Season 4
Nations Cup 2026
NationLESS Cup
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual

Upcoming

ASL Season 21
Acropolis #4 - TS6
2026 Changsha Offline CUP
CSL Season 20: Qualifier 2
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.