EPTHere's a question though. Would widowmine be ok if it didn't affect air(both trigger and splash)? Between turrets, marines, thors and vikings, it's not as if Terran lacks anti-air. It would definitely help carriers TvP. It might be both negative and positive in ZvT, easier to deal with stray mines, more shots against ground as you can't soak up mine shots with mutalisks and air units. Avoids silly situations where 4-5 mines take out 30 mutalisks.
Designated Balance Discussion Thread - Page 1177
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TokO
Norway577 Posts
Here's a question though. Would widowmine be ok if it didn't affect air(both trigger and splash)? Between turrets, marines, thors and vikings, it's not as if Terran lacks anti-air. It would definitely help carriers TvP. It might be both negative and positive in ZvT, easier to deal with stray mines, more shots against ground as you can't soak up mine shots with mutalisks and air units. Avoids silly situations where 4-5 mines take out 30 mutalisks. | ||
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Decendos
Germany1338 Posts
On October 29 2014 01:31 DinoMight wrote: Well then I don't really care what you have to say, but go on... Yes. For the second time I've given you a well reasoned argument as to why Tempests are "fragile" and several people agree. I already discussed how HP is not the focus but rather relative DPS, but that doesn't seem to matter to you so fine.. agree to disagree then. Though I would add that by your logic, a Hatchery would win a fight vs a bunch of MMM because it has higher HP. I gave you the DPS of Marines, Hydras, Vikings (things that would typically shoot at Tempests that wander too far away from their escorting army) to make the point that Tempests cannot wander away from the army that protects them or they die very quickly. This seems very reasonable to me... much more so than your counter argument: With debating skills like that I'm not sure why you're not in law school already. Yeah if you're just going to reply "LOL DINOMIGHT IS WRONG HE IS SO WRONG" then you're not really adding anything here. User was warned for this post | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
I believe I've been warned before for using that exact video as a response to someone, FYI. | ||
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Decendos
Germany1338 Posts
oh and in no way i said protoss OP before you start reading whatever you want again... | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
On October 29 2014 04:41 Decendos wrote: cant debate with you. you read whatever you want and post senseless stuff like the DPS of tempests vs marines or hydras then i said 5 times that colossus and HT rape both so its really stupid to compare those units Maybe I'm not explaining it clearly? What part of this is hard to understand: I gave you the DPS of Marines, Hydras, Vikings (things that would typically shoot at Tempests that wander too far away from their escorting army) to make the point that Tempests cannot wander away from the army that protects them or they die very quickly. Note how I'm talking about Tempests when they're by themselves, away from the Colossus and HT. One of my points was that they're hard to use in a composition because they tend to drift off by themselves if you're not careful and you have to actively make sure they stay with your army. This is really basic stuff here, man. On October 29 2014 04:41 Decendos wrote:oh and in no way i said protoss OP before you start reading whatever you want again... ???????? Where did I say that you called Protoss OP? You're the one making stuff up here, not me. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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parkufarku
882 Posts
Build time decreased by 20 seconds Widow Mine No longer can hit air units. Cost increased to 100 minerals / 150 gas Hellbats Life reduced by 20 Medivacs Gas cost increased to 125 Terran buildings Requires a research for lift, which costs 150/150. Can be researched at Orbital Corrupters Attack speed increased by 20% Hydras New ability: Toxin Spine (Will now decrease all regeneration or healing done by 50% for units hit by Hydras. Mostly intended to decrease bio healing effectiveness) Damage increased by 3 Marine Stim'd marines now attack 20% slower Storm Storm duration reduced by 2 seconds, but deals the same amount of damage as before over its duration. Game is now balanced. | ||
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Meavis
Netherlands1300 Posts
On October 29 2014 23:54 parkufarku wrote: Carriers Build time decreased by 20 seconds Widow Mine No longer can hit air units. Cost increased to 100 minerals / 150 gas Hellbats Life reduced by 20 Medivacs Gas cost increased to 125 Terran buildings Requires a research for lift, which costs 150/150. Can be researched at Orbital Corrupters Attack speed increased by 20% Hydras New ability: Toxin Spine (Will now decrease all regeneration or healing done by 50% for units hit by Hydras. Mostly intended to decrease bio healing effectiveness) Damage increased by 3 Marine Stim'd marines now attack 20% slower Storm Storm duration reduced by 2 seconds, but deals the same amount of damage as before over its duration. Game is now biased. fixed | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On October 29 2014 23:54 parkufarku wrote: Game is now balanced. Yep. Around 2 races. | ||
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JCoto
Spain574 Posts
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parkufarku
882 Posts
At least I made changes that made remotely some sense and addressed some issues that people on this thread were talking about. If the game balance was in your hands, you would have Terran start the game with 10 SCVs, Banshees perma-stealth mode, all Terran units are now free, and you would still deny that the race is broken. | ||
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parkufarku
882 Posts
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
It's a strategy game. Much like not building the wrong units, you shouldn't pick the wrong races. I like it when people nerf | ||
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Meavis
Netherlands1300 Posts
On October 30 2014 00:04 parkufarku wrote: At least I made changes that made remotely some sense and addressed some issues that people on this thread were talking about. If the game balance was in your hands, you would have Terran start the game with 10 SCVs, Banshees perma-stealth mode, all Terran units are now free, and you would still deny that the race is broken. how fucking delusional are you, your changes make the terran race completely unplayable, with super cost inefficient mines, no building swapping and even more expensive medivacs is inable of holding the slightest of aggresion. these changes do not adress anything at all minus maybe the carrier build time thing, and I'm 100% sure you're trolling. also thedwf has never made any suggestions even near that as far I can recall. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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parkufarku
882 Posts
On October 30 2014 00:09 Meavis wrote: how fucking delusional are you, your changes make the terran race completely unplayable, with super cost inefficient mines, no building swapping and even more expensive medivacs is inable of holding the slightest of aggresion. also thedwf has never made any suggestions even near that as far I can recall. completely unplayable? no. a large nerf? yes. mines would still be incredibly powerful; the cost increase is justified for how strong they are, and not hitting air units would be something that would help PvT and they are mostly used as Zerg ground units anyway. The tiny 25 gas increase for medivac is huge? How many medivacs do you see mid-game, about 5 or 6? 6 times 25 = not even 200 gas and it addresses the too cost efficient bio army | ||
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Deleted User 137586
7859 Posts
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JCoto
Spain574 Posts
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SC2Toastie
Netherlands5725 Posts
On October 30 2014 00:09 Meavis wrote: how fucking delusional are you, your changes make the terran race completely unplayable, with super cost inefficient mines, no building swapping and even more expensive medivacs is inable of holding the slightest of aggresion. these changes do not adress anything at all minus maybe the carrier build time thing, and I'm 100% sure you're trolling. also thedwf has never made any suggestions even near that as far I can recall. Is this the real life, or is this /r/Starcraft? Seriously, the game is as balanced as it has ever been and you come up with 2 buffs to Protoss (of which one MASSIVE), 7 Nerfs to Terran and 2 buffs to Zerg. Parkufarku, hand me some of that stuff you are using, please. And before you draw the epic Biased card, I play random. And your changes are bullshit. | ||
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Meavis
Netherlands1300 Posts
On October 30 2014 00:12 parkufarku wrote: completely unplayable? no. a large nerf? yes. mines would still be incredibly powerful; the cost increase is justified for how strong they are, and not hitting air units would be something that would help PvT and they are mostly used as Zerg ground units anyway. The tiny 25 gas increase for medivac is huge? How many medivacs do you see mid-game, about 5 or 6? 6 times 25 = not even 200 gas and it addresses the too cost efficient bio army yes completely unplayable, a shit ton, if not all all-ins require swapping add-ons to some extend for clutch holds, the mines cost would only be justified if it would get it's maximum potential value every single time, and you would be retarded to think this is the case, with costs like these there is no reason to ever build mines as anything else can outperform it. but alternatives are no option as mines are absolutely needed to hold zealot archon busts. or hey, even suiciding banelings into mines is allready cost efficient, GL fighting mutaling. mines not hitting air would make the allready problematic muta balls be unstopable. "tiny" 25gas may not be much when you have 3bases rolling, but the cost is extreme for your first 2 medivacs, you just spent 350/350 even teching to them, you don't have that luxury of gas yet and the first 2 medivacs are absolutey super fucking important for any timing ever, and you should know that terran is on a deathclock in both their non mirror MU's. | ||
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