EPTDesignated Balance Discussion Thread - Page 1063
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Faust852
Luxembourg4004 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27230 Posts
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Faust852
Luxembourg4004 Posts
On August 14 2014 03:14 Wombat_NI wrote: Protoss is shit to play for me, hence the switch to T, but I have close to 0 leisure time and it's kind of soul destroying dropping further and further down the ladder without a chance to really get practice in You gotta enjoy playing the elite master race, even if you are playing it in gold dude ! | ||
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BlackCompany
Germany8388 Posts
On August 14 2014 03:12 Faust852 wrote: Race switching is so hard tbh. I tried Protoss these holidays, managed to do something like 150 games and getting to midmaster with it, but damn, once you are in fond of something, you can't really betray it. I didn't enjoyed a single game I played as Protoss, because even if I won with some BS, I was sad for the opponent :3. i played every race for some time (not random, but manually picking them) and tbh i am completly trash at zerg. I used to play terran for some years, then did all 3 races and now i'm just playing vs the ai or friends and do crazy stuff. Protoss and ofc Terran has worked for me most of the time, but i just suck at the reactive unit building you do as Zerg. I drone, enemy attacks, i die. Do that 30 games in a row and you compeltly loose your motivation^^ | ||
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Faust852
Luxembourg4004 Posts
 So when I play zerg I just 2 bases allin :D | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27230 Posts
I enjoyed my brief dabblings in Starbow, I enjoy the RTS genre so hopefully one day can return in some guise. | ||
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BlackCompany
Germany8388 Posts
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
If you play green and you just make big monsters and attack people, they don't seem to mind. But if you play blue and counter all their spells and prevent them from drawing cards and that sort of thing, they get really mad. I have a friend who plays mostly green. He enjoys just making big creatures and attacking me with them. I play almost exclusively blue. I like nothing more than countering his large creatures with a 1-2 mana spell and then laughing like an evil mad scientist. If you're the kind of person who really enjoys playing Terran, you will probably hate Protoss. It just takes a certain mindset to play both those races. Personally I can't really get into Terran for too long. You mean I just build Marines and then something to counter my opponent's splash? In every matchup? Zzzzzzzzzzzz. But there are people who dig that. The nice thing about StarCraft is that we have 3 totally different races to play and ways to play each of those races beyond that (note the stylistic differences between Snute and Life, sOs and Rain, Taeja and Maru). So before you come in here claiming that XYZ race requires no skill, or is easy to play, or "you make marines every game" (lol) just realize that you play the race you do for a reason. Because it suits YOU. | ||
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Vete
Germany190 Posts
So I only play Terran and Zerg. :D | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
Zerg is hard as fuck mechanically. Terrans talk about how their race is the hardest all the time, but I don't know how many of them have actually tried Zerg. You have to spread creep on every tumor, inject larva at each hatch, and constantly spread overlords ON TOP of everything you would normally do. Just managing your queens and making sure one doesn't fuck off to a different Hatchery by accident is difficult. That said, I find that if you are good mechanically and scouting well, ZvP requires almost zero micro. People call Protoss the a-move race but man, a good max roach/hydra/viper timing is one of the simplest things to do. Press D a few times and then a-move. Terran feels like it requires the most micro because all your units are quite fragile (going bio). But as a Protoss I can tell you that the KEY**** Protoss units in the matchup (High Templar, Colossus) are also very vulnerable. One bad EMP can take out all your splash damage. Vikings firing at your Colossus over a cliff can be extremely hard to deal with in the midgame (and anywhere on Foxtrot Labs). So whereas all game Terran players feel like Protoss is bullshit, it only takes one bad EMP for a game to swing 180 degrees. Nothing is more painful than playing a game perfectly for 45 minutes only to lose because you clumped your HT a little for 3 seconds. Trust me, Terran players, we have felt that feeling as well. The one thing I think is universally accepted - TvT is awesome! It's actually really fun to play. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27230 Posts
It's not limited to SC2 mind, probably a natural thing when you're playing vs evenly skilled players who know what they're doing, doesn't stop being annoying though | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
On August 14 2014 03:40 Wombat_NI wrote: I don't really feel it's an issue with any of the races in particular, but SC2 as a whole. The feeling that you play extremely well for a long game and just melt through one mistake with no subsequent chance to recover. It's not limited to SC2 mind, probably a natural thing when you're playing vs evenly skilled players who know what they're doing, doesn't stop being annoying though Agree, but I think a lot of Terran players think that it's something just limited to them. Protoss and, to a lesser extent, Zerg experience that too. I played a game the other day where I forgot my Lair for about 10-15 seconds and Banshees showed up and killed everything immediately before my Overseers spawned. | ||
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Grumbels
Netherlands7032 Posts
Mind you it's near impossible to distinguish between two chess players just from a set of games, even though you can easily set yourself apart skillwise in chess. Maybe the latter is difficult for protoss, but they can manage to develop unique styles, so that's at least something. | ||
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Defenestrator
400 Posts
On August 14 2014 03:35 DinoMight wrote: My perspective, as a Protoss player who's spent a LOT of time playing Terran and Zerg lately: Zerg is hard as fuck mechanically. Terrans talk about how their race is the hardest all the time, but I don't know how many of them have actually tried Zerg. You have to spread creep on every tumor, inject larva at each hatch, and constantly spread overlords ON TOP of everything you would normally do. Just managing your queens and making sure one doesn't fuck off to a different Hatchery by accident is difficult. Seriously, people who play other races often ignore this =/ I suspect this is why we see less micro from pro Z players than pro P's and T's (who generally micro much better). Very nice post, it's very true that the micro required by protoss during actual engagements is hardly ever trivial vs an equally-skilled opponent. | ||
Whitewing
United States7483 Posts
On August 14 2014 03:44 DinoMight wrote: Agree, but I think a lot of Terran players think that it's something just limited to them. Protoss and, to a lesser extent, Zerg experience that too. I played a game the other day where I forgot my Lair for about 10-15 seconds and Banshees showed up and killed everything immediately before my Overseers spawned. This is a result of the "terrible terrible damage" motto blizzard used when designing the game. It happens to all races, quite frequently in fact. Protoss can lose to being half a second late on a forcefield, and has no choice but to look away to warp in more units. Look away for a moment, and bam EMP on your whole army, or a key fungal hits your phoenix. Terran looks away for half a second and banelings roll in or storms land. Zerg looks away for half a second and their army gets trapped with forcefields. The damage output and speed at which damage is dealt is extremely high. | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
On August 14 2014 03:45 Grumbels wrote: Even blizz said it's difficult for high level protoss players to truly set themselves apart. Mind you it's near impossible to distinguish between two chess players just from a set of games, even though you can easily set yourself apart skillwise in chess. Maybe the latter is difficult for protoss, but they can manage to develop unique styles, so that's at least something. I disagree. Look at Protoss players who have been consistently good for a long time now - MC, sOs, Rain, PartinG... all have really different styles yet have been at the top of the game for years. Sure, actual tournament wins may be more diversified among Protoss players than Terrans, but keep in mind the period when Terran was strong was at the beginning of the game and all the Kespa players hadn't joined/had enough time to get used to SC2 yet. What the hell is MVP doing these days? Losing to Morrow. And MarineKing is still doing Wings cheeses. Zerg also had their few random winners when Zerg was strong. Has anyone talked to Sniper lately? | ||
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Luolis
Finland7188 Posts
On August 14 2014 03:51 DinoMight wrote: What the hell is MVP doing these days? Losing to Morrow. I dont get why you even mention this part. Its like you just want to diss Mvp for no reason lol. | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
On August 14 2014 03:56 Luolis wrote: I dont get why you even mention this part. Its like you just want to diss Mvp for no reason lol. My point is that every race has had a period when it was strong (Terran early, Zerg end of Wings, Protoss HotS) and during that period, "random" winners emerged. Sure MVP was really good, but he's a nobody now. His builds are just awful every time I see him play. | ||
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Whitewing
United States7483 Posts
On August 14 2014 04:00 DinoMight wrote: My point is that every race has had a period when it was strong (Terran early, Zerg end of Wings, Protoss HotS) and during that period, "random" winners emerged. Sure MVP was really good, but he's a nobody now. His builds are just awful every time I see him play. MVP has awful wrist problems that prevent him from practicing well and really inhibit him. He's not a good choice for your argument. MKP is fine though. | ||
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johnbongham
451 Posts
On August 14 2014 04:00 DinoMight wrote: My point is that every race has had a period when it was strong (Terran early, Zerg end of Wings, Protoss HotS) and during that period, "random" winners emerged. Sure MVP was really good, but he's a nobody now. His builds are just awful every time I see him play. MVP quite obviously isnt training as hard as he once was and it is a result of his physical inability to play the game at the same level he once did. Using MVP for your argument while tons of former terran champions such as MMA, Bomber, Taeja, Polt are still competing at the top is a pretty shitty way to cherrypick examples. | ||
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