EPTTSL's Coach Lee speaks out on PuMa - Page 12
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hjkim1304
Korea (South)105 Posts
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Fighter
Korea (South)1531 Posts
Will Korea just be a breeding ground for good players before they get siphoned off to the west? That would be a hell of an interesting scenario if it became common place... | ||
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Dantat
170 Posts
I hope they lead their team to a GSTL championship victory. | ||
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Sworn
Canada920 Posts
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las91
United States5080 Posts
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WolfintheSheep
Canada14127 Posts
On July 22 2011 14:57 Ownos wrote: Because EG did not contact Coach Lee first. "That he shouldn’t leave like this and that this was not an agreement made through the right channels, nor an official trade between two teams." Please do try to read the OP of BOTH threads carefully. We already have too many people not fully understanding why, of all Korean-foreigner partnerships/acquisitions, this one happens to be a big deal (bigger in Korea). Ditto to you. EG gave Puma a business card at NASL, when Puma was in the Ro4. I find it highly unlikely that they went into some big aggressive push when a player was still set to play the Semi-finals (and possibly finals) of a big tournament. By all accounts, it was Puma that took the signing discussions further. While that doesn't change the fact that proper channels were ignored, you can't expect a team to shut the door in a player's face when he was the one that actually approached them seriously. And while no one knows how the discussion between Lee and Puma actually went, I can at least imagine that Garfield thought Lee would be contacting him so they could have a mutual announcement. | ||
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Midgetman101
United States825 Posts
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IslandLife
21 Posts
On July 22 2011 14:41 Daniel C wrote: Yes, every human being and every culture is the same. Don't be silly. If you don't have a contract, you don't have any claim. It's a bit offensive to have someone claim "honor" is more important in Asian culture than Western culture. My point is I think that's an invalid argument in this case. I think it's a great move by Puma and I look forward to seeing him play more in America. | ||
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kdmx
United States23 Posts
On July 22 2011 15:03 Sworn wrote: Ya I agree for the most part that what EG did was absolutely HORRIBLE! Imagine if when Idra was staying in korea if one of the teams just came out of nowhere asked him to play for them and didn't even talk to EG. EG would have been furious losing their star player and it's the same for TSL. I really wish EG would issue an apology at least. Yeah, it's absolutely horrible that EG pays their players. They are killing E-Sports! Stop with the overly dramatic BS already. | ||
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h0peless
United States5 Posts
But in the end Puma would have probably still made this decision and TSL would be in the exact same shape they're in now. edit: also, suppose Puma's skill starts dropping because TSLs practice regiment was just so much better. Everyone will see that, and then anytime a korean will get an offer from the west they'll say "no thanks you guys don't practice well enough" - anything can happen. | ||
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TheButtonmen
Canada1401 Posts
On July 22 2011 15:03 Sworn wrote: Ya I agree for the most part that what EG did was absolutely HORRIBLE! Imagine if when Idra was staying in korea if one of the teams just came out of nowhere asked him to play for them and didn't even talk to EG. EG would have been furious losing their star player and it's the same for TSL. I really wish EG would issue an apology at least. 1. EG wants a top level Korean player. 2. Top level Koreans come over to NASL finals. 3. EG hands out cards seeing if anyone is interested. 4. Puma is interested and talks to EG staff, when they find out he is open to the idea of working for them, has no contract and no salary they need to compete with they lay out what they are prepared to offer, Puma is interested but he wants to be the one to talk to his coach rather then EG, EG agrees. 5. Puma talks to his coach, coach isn't impressed and thinks that Puma and EG have gone and signed behind his back. (Please note that EG and Puma haven't signed or agreed to anything yet.) 6. Coach feels disrespected and starts this whole thing with his posts. 7. The standard drama fueled shitfest occurs. 8. EG finds out about all of this. 9. Coach clarifies what he meant / what happened as mis-communications start to get cleared up (hell he even throws Puma a goodbye party) 10. EG speaks out on Lo3, saying they didn't do anything wrong and they followed their potential new players wishs. (Again note that EG and Puma still haven't signed anything still.) 11. Dramallamas continue to frolic. 12. EG opens mouth and inserts foot re: what team liquid is for (while I agree partially with them this sure as hell wasn't the time). 13. Even more shit hits the fan as TL defends one of their own. 14. I eat an orange. 15. I write this post. So where exactly in this chain of events do you think EG crossed the line and needs to apologize? This was all basically EG doing their best to recruit some new blood, Puma doing his best to find the best option offered to him, TSL not being able to compete due to their lack of cash flow and a tragic misunderstanding between Puma and Coach Lee which started an epic drawn out shitfest. | ||
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Dakk
Sweden572 Posts
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Applecakes
Australia319 Posts
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SlipperySnake
248 Posts
All this faux outrage is just ridiculous. | ||
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Grampz
United States2147 Posts
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TrickyGilligan
United States641 Posts
Not only did TSL not contract their players, they were in so much financial trouble that no was was getting paid. Players were even giving money back to the team to help it survive. How are they surprised that players would want to seek out other opportunities? Gotta pay people to keep them around, if you can't get sponsors or pay a salary,I don't see how you should expect your players to remain faithful. I see this as a good thing for ESPORTS. The best players are following the money. If they do well and people show enthusiasm for this kind of thing, sponsors will start providing even more money. All this does is strengthen the competition and the scene as a whole, I'm all for it. Oh, and put your players under contract, for god's sake. No contract = free agent = up for grabs. | ||
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TheGiftedApe
United States1243 Posts
I hope Coach Lee can summon some words of wisdom and motivation that will help to make this team into a top SC2 team once again. | ||
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Amui
Canada10567 Posts
On July 22 2011 15:09 IslandLife wrote: Don't be silly. If you don't have a contract, you don't have any claim. It's a bit offensive to have someone claim "honor" is more important in Asian culture than Western culture. My point is I think that's an invalid argument in this case. I think it's a great move by Puma and I look forward to seeing him play more in America. By no means is it offensive, it is in fact true. If you put everything on a whiteboard then it's completely fair and legal. I agree on this point. By no means did AG do anything illegal. However the means he took to aquire a player, while in the western world, is perfectly fine and acceptable, but in Korea is extremely disrespectful. The coach treats his players as his own children, he feeds them, gives them a place to stay, and tries to do his utmost to assist them. When Clide and Sangho both feel indebted enough to give back their stipends/salary to help the team, you know how strong the bond is. I can guarantee you AG does not share the same bond with his players, he may meet them several times a month, review salaries and performance, maybe drop by once in a while to watch practice, but the western system doesn't allow for such loyalties to form. | ||
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WolfintheSheep
Canada14127 Posts
On July 22 2011 15:19 SlipperySnake wrote: I am so tired of reading "proper channels" over and over again. There are no proper channels between teams because the teams don't have agreements between themselves. The only thing that is of any substance is the contract between a player and his team. If this contract has backout clauses that need to be negotiated then the teams can talk but if there is nothing other than feelings and honor then it is all on the player. All this faux outrage is just ridiculous. I know what you mean. All I'm really getting from this is that Korean teams are somehow "family", and Coach Lee thinks there should be a system in place to stop "family members" from leaving if they want to. If the cultural bond was really as strong as all these posters say it is, Puma wouldn't have talked with EG at all. | ||
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LuckyMacro
United States1482 Posts
Any final words? First of all, I would like to apologize to FruitDealer and Tester for not fulfilling what I’ve promised to do. Coach Lee T.T | ||
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