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On July 21 2011 16:44 udgnim wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 16:40 Aetherial wrote:On July 21 2011 15:00 Milkis wrote:
"There needs to be a system to stop foreign teams from stealing Korean players like this"
Player contracts? there isn't enough sponsorship money in Korean SC2 where teams can start signing players to iron clad contracts making players sign contracts with little monetary incentive behind it makes little sense for the player
Lol I'm pretty sure the companies sponsoring SC2 teams are bigger than the companies sponsering Western SC2 teams. Who do you think is bigger, a company like Razer that caters to a very specific (hardcore gaming) market, or the fast food companies that sponser teams like IM and are very well known for handing out prestigious contracts in Korea? Don't state your retarded assumptions as facts.
User was temp banned for this post.
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On July 21 2011 16:44 HolyArrow wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 16:41 taLbuk wrote:On July 21 2011 16:40 IceSlipper wrote:On July 21 2011 16:39 HolyArrow wrote:On July 21 2011 16:35 BFCrimson wrote:On July 21 2011 16:34 IceSlipper wrote:On July 21 2011 16:32 taLbuk wrote:On July 21 2011 16:30 IceSlipper wrote:On July 21 2011 16:28 Mycl wrote:
From SirScoots via twitter
"I see esports journalism continues its fine tradition of no fact checking! Bravo! Bravo! /me rolls eyes" Such a stupid response from scoots.. Really? We are only going off what we have, what more facts can we check? lmfao.. how about you give us some instead of sitting on your high-horse and thinking of anyway you can justify this horrible display of ethics and lack of respect.. No response at all would be much more professional than this trash.. you can wait to make an irrational emotion fueled post until we have more facts. or you can spew your nonsense like you just did. How long are we suppose to wait? We have plenty of facts right here (Puma on TSL -> Puma NASL -> Puma released -> Puma EG), and you want us to just sit here while scoots/EG make up a nice little fairytale? He just took a jab at the whole community, without clarifying anything at all.. God forbid we wait more than an hour and a half (with the story breaking at 11:00PM PDT) for the other half of the story, WE HAVE FACTS!!!! The problem is that time is actually of the essence in a situation like this. If EG takes too long to come out with the announcement, people are going to infer that they spent that extra time trying to tailor a nicer story than perhaps what the actual truth might be. EG management should know EXACTLY what happened, and, seriously, it doesn't take long to type up a couple paragraphs that would clarify everything. Certainly, it wouldn't take an hour. Half an hour, tops, if they really wanted to just clarify everything cleanly. This. The fact that scoots is willing to tweet about us not having the facts without giving us the facts just points more towards this being the truth.. Oh god, drop the theatrics and conspiracy bullshit. You should also lose the tinfoil hat while your at it. Theatrics and conspiracy bullshit? Spinning a situation to make yourself look good is a common practice. Coach Lee's reaction is enough evidence in my eyes to show that something went quite wrong with EG's acquiring of Puma.
So saying sensationalist things like Sirscoots is taking long beause he is trying to tailor a perfect story to make them like the victims and tsl like the evil doers while he opens his closet and sucks the blood of his latest victim all while Puma is sitting in a cage on the bottom of an airplane tied with shackles. Because thats basically what you and the person you quoted look like.
when in reality it could just be the fact that it is midnight and because the tweet caught everybody offguard he now has to right a proper press release?
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*puts on tin hat*
TSL tells the team they need to downsize, and ask who will stay. None of their best players stay. Coaches angry. EG acquires PuMa.
Unlikely. But so are a ton of the other ideas on here.
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On July 21 2011 16:45 jellyjello wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 16:37 Kamuy wrote:
Good for Puma and EG. If both sides benefit from this then there is nothing wrong. Korean culture, blah blah blah, they need to understand this is a GLOBAL game. Their culture and high moral standards are not the norm for the rest of the world and you either sign your players to legally binding contracts or expect them to get better, more lucrative offers and gladly accept them.
Anyone saying what Puma did here is wrong is delusional.
Scenario A: Puma stays with TSL, has to bank his ENTIRE sc2 tournament winnings on ONE tournament, and rarely leaves Korea for international tournaments. We'll assume hes getting paid, but obviously less than he would with EG.
Scenario B: Puma joins EG, gains a higher salary, and travels all over the world to multiple events while gaining notoriety and more opportunities for cash prizes.
Yea.... I'd like to see how many people take Scenario A.
It's very simple. Had EG contacted TSL for the said player "PuMa", it's more than likely that TSL agreed to having the player join the team EG and everyone would have been happy. But because EG went behind the player's team and his coach/manager, we now ended up with this retarded fiasco.
That makes sense.
Sirscoots:"Hey Coach Lee we want you're best player"
Coach Lee: Sure Scoots!
Now would that make any sense xD
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On July 21 2011 16:46 KeksX wrote:
Do you guys even UNDERSTAND what the Coach was saying there?
The real issue here is between PuMa and him. PuMa betrayed him and his team.
I can't understand how you can say that this is okay so easily. I want a clarification of PuMa, not Scoots. PuMa made the dickmove here.
wait what? most of what coach lee said was that he felt disrespected by EG.
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dont feel like this is a good thing for puma in the long run, he needs to be around players that are on his level or above it and imo EG has no shining terran
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On July 21 2011 16:42 dc302 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 16:34 jellyjello wrote:On July 21 2011 16:28 Soleron wrote:
Why does anyone think his practice will degrade?
It doesn't say he's leaving Korea. It's normal to have many practice partners outside your team anyway, so why would he stop practising with them? Puma wouldn't get this good by just practising against Clide, FD and Trickster up to now. So he'll likely continue to practice with who he has been, maybe even including his own team. Why would any progamer in Korea want to willingly practice "for" PuMa now that he's not even in Korea? Think about it, who's more important - people you see and talk everyday or someone who's living in completely different country? Sure, PuMa will get to ladder vs Koreans as long as he keeps his Korean ID, but laddering is completely different than practicing. I'm sure he has some close friends... Unless Korean culture is not what I expect it to be =/
You have to understand that Korean SC2 is a very cutthroat environment. PuMa sure does have some close friends, but that won't help him with practicing much.
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On July 21 2011 16:46 Kamuy wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 16:44 dc302 wrote:On July 21 2011 16:37 Kamuy wrote:
Good for Puma and EG. If both sides benefit from this then there is nothing wrong. Korean culture, blah blah blah, they need to understand this is a GLOBAL game. Their culture and high moral standards are not the norm for the rest of the world and you either sign your players to legally binding contracts or expect them to get better, more lucrative offers and gladly accept them.
Anyone saying what Puma did here is wrong is delusional.
Scenario A: Puma stays with TSL, has to bank his ENTIRE sc2 tournament winnings on ONE tournament, and rarely leaves Korea for international tournaments. We'll assume hes getting paid, but obviously less than he would with EG.
Scenario B: Puma joins EG, gains a higher salary, and travels all over the world to multiple events while gaining notoriety and more opportunities for cash prizes.
Yea.... I'd like to see how many people take Scenario A.
I think you're scenarios are a bit off. It's more like TSL is upset that EG didn't contact TSL first. If they had, they skill could have agreed to either scenario. Something tells me that if EG had sent an email to TSL saying, "Hey, were interested in your ace player. Just a heads up, were ready to offer him a deal you can't match. Good luck with this." They would still be as upset as they are right now.
Yes, because that's not how you send a respectful email. Ever heard of being polite? Tactful?
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People still seem to think that Puma will benefit from this. Please tell me how. Sure, he will travel a lot of foreigner events and get a lot of money FOR A SHORT TIME. He can live off being amazing and talented for a few months now but after that he´s gonna dissappear as long as EG doesnt get him some good practice, which they cant if they dont put him in a korean house.
The fact that he´s a good player and that you guys are all happy EG picked him up isnt cus he´s korean, it´s cus hes gotten korean training, something he´ll lose now...
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On July 21 2011 16:43 Shinta) wrote:
Really ridiculous... BTW probably was contracted by TSL with his salary and paid expenses, which is probably why he was "released" from TSL, and didn't "leave" TSL. Sure he accepted EG's offer, but he still wasn't in line to leave the team, as he was probably legally bound. Lee, knowing that Puma wanted to leave TSL, then allowed him to leave.
If I'm wrong someone correct me plz, but that's how I think it was.
Really sad for TSL... and interestingly enough, this makes me hope EG starts to fail even harder... Pay IdrA and Puma more than the rest of the team combined, still lose the majority of their clanwars, never win a clan league, and not benefit from the players as much as the players benefit from the orga.
Sorry that's mean to say right? But this move was just way out of line...
Why ? You always follow the money. If you work as a plumber and get 100 dollars a day at one place, and another place says, hey we really think you're good, we'll offer you 200 dollars to come work for us. Then its called "logic" of course you do it. But as soon as its something like sports involved people start crying about loyalty etc. He did what was logical to him. What made sens, and what everyone would have done.
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On July 21 2011 16:45 DystopiaX wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 16:43 yeint wrote:On July 21 2011 16:33 PikaXchU wrote:Your family allows you to go over to your friend's house for the weekends. On Sunday, your friend's parents offer you to stay at their house instead of your house, and in return gives you much more allowance than your parents give and some other benefits. Well, you take this offer, and you get home, pack your things and tell your parents you are not staying with them anymore. How exactly would your parents feel? Players are not children and professional teams are not parents. The fact that this drivel is being sold as a "cultural" thing leads to exploitative organizations like Kespa. It's all well and good to have loyalty and respect for "parents", but what if they treat you as slave labor and make a profit off of you? None of us know the details of Puma's relationship with TSL. We just know the management is complaining about a "lack of respect". It's in their best interests to paint this as a cultural affront. TL painted it as a cultural affront, TSL jus said they weren't contacted. It's not even a Korean thing, I'm American born and raised and I think that poaching a player without contacting his team is dumb and shady.
Seriously what the fuck is this cultural shit. Because player poaching is accepted and applauded in the West, right?
Not saying that's what's going on here (I don't have the facts so I'll withhold until it's clear,) but people talking about Korean culture in this situation are ignorant as hell.
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So will Puma be going to the EG house then? or will he be living on his own in korea like idra did?
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On July 21 2011 16:35 Thewildfish wrote:
Why does everyone get so angry so quickly about something we haven't even heard both sides of?
getting angry about things is fun, you should try it. leave your rationality at the door, please.
I'm eagerly awaiting EG's official statement about all this
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Huge!! Hoping to hear EG's response to all of this!
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On July 21 2011 16:45 jellyjello wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 16:37 Kamuy wrote:
Good for Puma and EG. If both sides benefit from this then there is nothing wrong. Korean culture, blah blah blah, they need to understand this is a GLOBAL game. Their culture and high moral standards are not the norm for the rest of the world and you either sign your players to legally binding contracts or expect them to get better, more lucrative offers and gladly accept them.
Anyone saying what Puma did here is wrong is delusional.
Scenario A: Puma stays with TSL, has to bank his ENTIRE sc2 tournament winnings on ONE tournament, and rarely leaves Korea for international tournaments. We'll assume hes getting paid, but obviously less than he would with EG.
Scenario B: Puma joins EG, gains a higher salary, and travels all over the world to multiple events while gaining notoriety and more opportunities for cash prizes.
Yea.... I'd like to see how many people take Scenario A.
It's very simple. Had EG contacted TSL for the said player "PuMa", it's more than likely that TSL agreed to having the player join the team EG and everyone would have been happy. But because EG went behind the player's team and his coach/manager, we now ended up with this retarded fiasco.
Hahaha, sure. "Here is our best player, would you like his original chair and headset too?"
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On July 21 2011 16:46 Kamuy wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 16:44 dc302 wrote:On July 21 2011 16:37 Kamuy wrote:
Good for Puma and EG. If both sides benefit from this then there is nothing wrong. Korean culture, blah blah blah, they need to understand this is a GLOBAL game. Their culture and high moral standards are not the norm for the rest of the world and you either sign your players to legally binding contracts or expect them to get better, more lucrative offers and gladly accept them.
Anyone saying what Puma did here is wrong is delusional.
Scenario A: Puma stays with TSL, has to bank his ENTIRE sc2 tournament winnings on ONE tournament, and rarely leaves Korea for international tournaments. We'll assume hes getting paid, but obviously less than he would with EG.
Scenario B: Puma joins EG, gains a higher salary, and travels all over the world to multiple events while gaining notoriety and more opportunities for cash prizes.
Yea.... I'd like to see how many people take Scenario A.
I think you're scenarios are a bit off. It's more like TSL is upset that EG didn't contact TSL first. If they had, they skill could have agreed to either scenario. Something tells me that if EG had sent an email to TSL saying, "Hey, were interested in your ace player. Just a heads up, were ready to offer him a deal you can't match. Good luck with this." They would still be as upset as they are right now.
And why shouldn't they be?
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United States23455 Posts
CLLLLLLLLLLLLIDDDDDDDDDDDDE
I don't think TSL is going to be sending anymore players to international events.
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EPT
