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On July 21 2011 23:33 canikizu wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 23:25 w_Ender_w wrote:On July 21 2011 23:22 canikizu wrote:
Oh well, I guess Koreans will stop sending their players to international events for a while now.
good job Eccentric Genius.
How in the world are you guys reaching the conclusion that this means no Koreans will participate in foreign events when literally all the evidence points otherwise? o_o "I guess" <<<< ? Knowing how Asians work, team players/coaches might whisper each other and be aware of the threat of losing their players when sending them to international events. I can still see Koreans participating online international events, but for offline events, I don't expect them to send kids to do big jobs now.
It's a huge leap to take. I can see it having repercussions in different ways but to say Korean teams will stop sending players abroad completely is quite unfounded and for that to happen there would have to be a lot more than this incident behind it.
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On July 21 2011 23:35 tooPrime wrote:
Okay, TL is now worse than Cleveland Cavalier fans. Shameful day.
This is just one thread, it doesn't represent the entire site.
What's wrong with people looking for loyalty/integrity...
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On July 21 2011 23:27 Sakarabu wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 23:23 ZisforZerg wrote:
"Same old EG.. things never change. Every other pro team has respect for one another and approach the players the right way.. I'm not one bit surprised EG pulled this off. They've been doing this ever since quakeworld.
I don't know why there are comparisons between this and FXO acquiring FoU. The FXO/FoU deal was handled through the team managers vs. going behind a teams back and picking up their players. Its called professionalism, and obviously EG lacks it."
--- Are you serious? When you have a job in the real world and another company wants to hire you, the company does not go and talk to your boss to see if that's "ok". SC2 does not have an all-encompassing governing body similar to the NBA, NFL, MLB, etc. so they can and will exercise their rights to pursue a possible employee. If you actually think that this was a dirty move by EG than you have unrealistic views of how business is done. Please, do not post when you are oblivious to what it is you're talking about.
--------------------Congratulations EG, I think this is awesome, only question is if he will stay in Korea w/ another team possibly or come to the AZ house. EG Hwaitiiiiinnnnnngggggg!
Umm, yeah nice try but that is completely the wrong analogy here. Why not try something which is actually related to the subject matter, Such as professional football (or soccer in the US)? If an opposing team contacts one of your players directly instead of going through official channels they can get severely fucked for it, and I presume it's the same for the majority of major team based sports.
But the SC2 scene isn't regulated the same way major sports leagues are. It's simply not that advanced, and honestly everyone involved with SC2 should be hoping it never is. You can't tamper within the confines of the league. IE another Organization in the league can't contact a player on another team in regards to something like this. But nothing is stopping these guys from talking to other avenues outside of that league. Until SC2 becomes a league, and a professional players union is created to protect the players still in that environment, you can't have that type of regulation, especially in an INTERNATIONAL scene.
If, say, all of these little leagues in NA banded together and had one expansive league, then SC2 teams joined the league, the teams could regulate that situation. Where teams couldnt swipe from one another outside of trades, or the players demanding a trade and getting traded/bought out. Then you could get on teams about tampering with players from other teams, so long as the players are contracted. But again, I'm an avid sports fan, and that type of situation is -not- what the SC2 community wants to corner itself into. Without even considering how impossible it would be to get the entire SC2 world to agree on coming together to form a super voltron league.
EDIT: Perfect analogy is Cleveland/Lebron/Miami situation. Cleveland fans all up in arms over Lebron leaving. He had the right to choose, he wasn't under contract. He could have delivered it better without question, but the fact remains there was nothing unethical about what he did. He was just a cog in a system that was already in place (free agency for players without contracts). Don't be bitter Cleveland.
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On July 21 2011 23:37 PartyBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 23:33 stormchaser wrote:On July 21 2011 23:30 pHelix Equilibria wrote:
I'm not surprised. Its EG. Evil as hell, way to go behind the team's back. I don't understand why people can't just wish Puma the best of luck for his decision. So many people have to put a negative spin on change. He was probably paid shit if he accepted this deal with EG, c'mon guys, I'm sure he's happier than ever now. I wish Puma the best of luck, people are pissed though because it obviously feels like EG just threw a huge amount of cash (that a much smaller homegrown team like TSL does not have) to make an offer a player couldn't refuse. http://i.imgur.com/FlGPh.png
So then by that logic people should be pissed at every single player acquisition in almost every single sport, and the contracts of players like Flash Jaedong Nada Stork Bisu, etc....... Cuz they just throw cash at them as well.
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On July 21 2011 23:37 PartyBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 23:33 stormchaser wrote:On July 21 2011 23:30 pHelix Equilibria wrote:
I'm not surprised. Its EG. Evil as hell, way to go behind the team's back. I don't understand why people can't just wish Puma the best of luck for his decision. So many people have to put a negative spin on change. He was probably paid shit if he accepted this deal with EG, c'mon guys, I'm sure he's happier than ever now. I wish Puma the best of luck, people are pissed though because it obviously feels like EG just threw a huge amount of cash (that a much smaller homegrown team like TSL does not have) to make an offer a player couldn't refuse. http://i.imgur.com/FlGPh.png
Im sorry but what is wrong with that? They saw Puma is an amazing player and they wanted him on their team. What else do you offer a player? People in this thread making assumptions based on incomplete information is breaking my brain. I swear most of you could be legally retarded.
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This is amazing news. Wd EG for having such great sponsors that you can provide Puma more $ than TSL can.
I for one am still a fan. Who gives a damn if TSL's feelings get hurt when you don't tell me you're buying out Puma. Puma has a mouth, he can tell TSL management himself when he's packing his bags, or when he's demanding a higher price than what EG has offered!
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On July 21 2011 23:39 arbitrageur wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 23:37 stormchaser wrote:On July 21 2011 23:35 Sandro wrote:On July 21 2011 23:33 stormchaser wrote:On July 21 2011 23:30 pHelix Equilibria wrote:
I'm not surprised. Its EG. Evil as hell, way to go behind the team's back. I don't understand why people can't just wish Puma the best of luck for his decision. So many people have to put a negative spin on change. He was probably paid shit if he accepted this deal with EG, c'mon guys, I'm sure he's happier than ever now. Nobody is shitting on Puma, just EG, and until we get their side of the story, they deserve it. No they don't. They did not break ANY RULES whatsoever, in the law, in ethics, none. They had talks with the player and Puma obviously has faith in EG, so he accepted. No one forced him and I'm sure he received many other deals as well. Stop pretending EG is some evil corporation, I don't understand the hate. Exactly.. Why should EG go and talk to TSL management. Puma can tell them he's leaving himself.. Lmao I'm open to hearing why EG should converse with TSL management.. but amongst the thousand or so posts condemning EG the only reason I've heard is that it's respectful and it saves their feelings from getting hurt.
Agreed. Why should they. Do I see a wall of rules this team must follow? Nope. Exactly. If I were a team manager, I'd be stealing as many koreans and taking them over the west as possible. They are good at the game, why would any smart manager not do this? It's good for all involved. If TSL is mad about the decision, they shold've taken care of such an AAA player better.
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I don't see how everyone is slamming EG. So what they offered puma a spot. What were they supposed to do, give TSL a bunch of compensation? Trade players? Ask TSL to give Puma away? LOL please, it's on puma to decide what he wants to do, and I don't think anyone knows the details of his TSL contract. They could have been treating him like crap for all we know.
Is it just a coincidence that like 5 other top players left TSL lately? Just because puma went straight to another team which happens to be overseas that team has horrible ethics? right
Seeing this level of drama is slightly entertaining, but more sad then anything else.
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On July 21 2011 23:40 Rinrun wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 23:35 tooPrime wrote:
Okay, TL is now worse than Cleveland Cavalier fans. Shameful day. This is just one thread, it doesn't represent the entire site. What's wrong with people looking for loyalty...
What's wrong with people leaving a crappy team that doesn't pay them what they deserve, and then bad mouths them in the media when they do?
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This is probably one of the toughest decisions we've seen made in e-sports yet. I hope all goes well for every party involved.
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It seems that the bottom line in Korea is that SC:BW is still the money scene and there is just not enough sponsors for SC2 teams at the moment. Kinda visible with fOu being merged with FXO and with foreign teams recruiting Koreans.
It seems like the players that are really good, but have not succeeded in GSL yet can get so much better deals from foreigner teams. I like the view that these teams will provide the players with better opportunies and make it possible for them to join more tournaments etc.
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TSL keep losing their good players  this is so sudden first SK gaming now this
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Holy shit, this is huge. Sad for TSL, losing such a rising star, but they still have Cliiiiiiiiide! :D
Gonna wait for the official statement before I rage out at EG/Puma, but I hope they approached the team before the player. I pretty much only know a bout football (or as some people call it, soccer D:<), but if I'm not mistaken it's not allowed to approach a player and give him an offer before talking to the team he plays for, so this would seem kind of underhanded by EG, but then again I don't know the whole story.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tapping_up
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In the west, if a player is not contracted he is basically a free agent.
In Korea one does not just walk up to a player and offer him/her a deal without speaking with his team manager first (or the one responsible for player "transfers"), it's a matter of respect. Westerner simply do not care about such things if a player is not contracted. Now if EG acquired a NA or EU player, I understand their position. BUT, if you are acquiring a player from Korea, you have to play by their "rules".
So imo it's dirty business.
I'll still be rooting for PuMa but I hope "Kespa 2.0" handles this issue so in future such things can be avoided.
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On July 21 2011 23:41 arbitrageur wrote:
This is amazing news. Wd EG for having such great sponsors that you can provide Puma more $ than TSL can.
I for one am still a fan. Who gives a damn if TSL's feelings get hurt when you don't tell me you're buying out Puma. Puma has a mouth, he can tell TSL management himself when he's packing his bags, or when he's demanding a higher price than what EG has offered!
I too think this is amazing. Unfortunately the way it was done clash with the way Koreans want to do business which is unfortunate.
It's not a good thing if this in Korea is viewed as "dirty".
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I can not wait until some of you get real jobs, with real contracts and try to leave with a head hunter. Tell me how that works out for you.
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On July 21 2011 23:42 megaBICEPS wrote:
I don't see how everyone is slamming EG. So what they offered puma a spot. What were they supposed to do, give TSL a bunch of compensation? Trade players? Ask TSL to give Puma away? .
They were supposed to ask Coach Lee to walk him to, and then give him away at the altar.
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I for one thinks this is awesome. EG gets an extremely good Terran to practice with and I like the thought to have Koreans in foreign proteams.
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On July 21 2011 23:42 tooPrime wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2011 23:40 Rinrun wrote:On July 21 2011 23:35 tooPrime wrote:
Okay, TL is now worse than Cleveland Cavalier fans. Shameful day. This is just one thread, it doesn't represent the entire site. What's wrong with people looking for loyalty... What's wrong with people leaving a crappy team that doesn't pay them what they deserve, and then bad mouths them in the media when they do?
Now how can you be sure that he was paid inadequately? I'd like to see some sources.
Also on the topic of "badmouthing" that happened after the fact, not before.
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This is great for Puma, more $, gets to be flown around and participate in foreign events (I'm assuming.) But for TSL who can't offer that to Puma, and they are already losing players left and right, I can see where they would feel betrayed and pissed. But, business can be like that sometimes. It's not like EG forced Puma to join, it was his own volition, so fair is fair.
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EPT
