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Re-opening. Any derailment of this thread will be punished harshly from here on out. Watch your language folks. - p4NDemik |
On June 25 2011 15:56 Defacer wrote:
Here's the point: Let's say the NASL does tank?
WHAT THE FUCK DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH INCONTROL?
InControl was employed by the NASL. Do you seriously think that he is somehow liable....
leaning on the Caps Lock key and swearing does not help your post.
if he makes promises that go unfulfilled it lowers his credibility...
and he painted the picture of being far more than a "contract employee".
i remember in that IGN IPL interview thing he referred to the NASL by saying
"i'm starting my own league"
throughout the initial announcement its "we decided.." , "we thought ..."
if an organization goes down in the flames of unfulfilled promises then all involved look bad.
the more deeply you're involved with the organization the worse you look. the guy who does nothing but print the live event tickets probably does not take much of a hit to his credibility... he is just getting paid to print the tickets.
But the guy who says "i'm starting my own league".. i'd say he is acknowledging a big involvement in it and he is not merely printing the tickets or reciting a memorized speech prepared by others.
all of this is speculation though...let's see if the NASL can "Show me the Money".
and at this point i'd like to revisit my original conclusion and end things in a constructive manner
with the NASL only a few months old with no real ties to the SC2 community ( no Razer, no Intel , no zotac connections) it would be prudent for all involved to withhold payment of any kind of Season2 "application fee" payment until Season 1 prize money is handed out.
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On June 25 2011 15:56 Defacer wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2011 11:29 JimmyJRaynor wrote:On June 25 2011 10:51 Defacer wrote:
You and you're revisionist, half-baked history should be a bannable offense. Everything you've mentioned is imagined, fabricated or warped, and it's obvious you know absolutely nothing about how NASL is run, who runs it, or even how business works.
If the NASL fails, and there is absolutely now reason right now to think it would since they have financing for three seasons, it will almost have nothing to do with InControl, who was basically their contract employee.
Your attempt to blame InControl for a failure that a) hasn't even happened yet or b) he would deserve absolutely no fault for is so fucking despicable and low it makes me sick.
I can only assume that your a 15 year old that InControl beat you on the ladder once, and now you're making it a mission to drag his name in the mud. To which I say this: Go fuck yourself.
On June 25 2011 10:51 Defacer wrote:
You and you're revisionist half baked history
if you are going to take big shots at me like this please at least get the basic grammar correct. it should be "you and your revisionist history" unfortunately, http://www.GosuGuide.com is doing a pretty good job dragging his name through the mud. The site is still actively accepting orders with Mr. Robinson's name all over it. I'm just some random poster in the middle of a giant thread. Now, Mr. Robinson publicly acknowledged he exercised poor judgement is doing business with unscrupulous people in the formation of GosuGuide.com. As a result many innocent SC2 consumers were mislead regarding the product they were buying. Basically, a bunch of people got ripped off. Let's hope for everyone involved that Mr. Robinson did not exercise poor judgement again in dealing with the people at http://www.NASL.tvNASL was good at accepting the application fees. Let's see how good they are at paying out the prize money. I'd be cautious about giving them any money for Season 2 until the Season 1 prize money is handed out. Is the NASL asking for Season 2 "application money" before handing out Season 1 prize money? Regarding these comments about my lack of business acumen let's examine the motives of an eSports promoter or organizer than hands out 10s of thousands of dollars in prizes. With the haphazard organization of NASL these kinds of questions arise. Furthermore, lacking a sponsor like a Chip Manufacturer, Peripheral Maker, or Dr. Pepper for that matter one must wonder how the NASL is sustainable. You see Razer, Intel, AMD and ZOTAC sponsor eSports events not because they want to generously hand out money, but because they want to advertise their brand. The same reason Honda, Toyota, FOrd and Penzoil sponsor and hand out huge prizes a auto racing events. It is because of facts like these that speculation regarding the long term viability of the NASL arises. I hope I've satisfied your concerns regarding my lack of business acumen. Here's the point: Let's say the NASL does tank? WHAT THE FUCK DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH INCONTROL? InControl was employed by the NASL. Do you seriously think that he is somehow liable for how they do business, or the prize money, or the salaries of employees? Your original, ridiculous post suggests that -- somehow -- InControl should somehow be blamed IF the NASL were to fail, when all he did was his fucking job -- commentate the games and promote the enterprise as much as he could. And he did both those things quite well. Your eagerness to assign guilt-by-association is preposterous and obviously motivated by a personal bias. It's like blaming a foot soldier for wasting hundreds of billions of dollar in the war in Iraq. It's like blaming Day 9 for the clusterfuck at MLG Dallas. Your skepticism of the NASL may have merit -- however it is purely skepticism, there is absolutely nothing substantial to suggest otherwise. Still, it has nothing to do with InControl. Unless you can show me the documentation that suggests that InControl has equity in the NASL, is an owner, or was responsible for financing and finding sponsors for the NASL, it doesn't belong in this thread. And your business acumen is still unsatisfactory, due to your inability to properly parse and separate different individuals from their responsibilities and respective liabilities. 
This is pretty much just as distorted. He moved across the country and lived with the Russ guy from Gosucoaching to do NASL. Before it began he was the only one we knew who was involved with all the hype he was doing. Remember all the talk on SOTG about how it's the biggest thing in the entire esports world and he can't wait to reveal it and all that? He was so much more than just a caster before it began.
He was doing a great job at hyping it up, but when the community reaction was less than overwhelmingly positive he seemed to distance himself and now he's moving on.
I know the forum has a short memory span but to act like he was barely a part of it is just plain wrong. It was basically Incontrol's thing with these silent partners who they wouldn't even talk about if we asked, they'd give us some sarcastic response. As far as contracts, ownership etc we don't even know if they are an actual registered business. We know nothing of that so you're arguing from a position of ignorance.
You could certainly be right for all we know. Maybe Inc only lived with Russ temporarily and he was only brought in to hype it up at the beginning and then over the season limit his time spent on NASL and move on. Or maybe after it turned out it wasn't nearly as good as he thought it would be and that association with it no longer benefited him he decided to move on.
But then if he was hired explicitly to hype up the league you'd think he wouldn't stop 2 weeks in. My best guess is that he realized how much work it is, how poor NASL is, and how better his time is spent elsewhere. I don't think the quality is his fault at all, I can't say he planted the seed in everyone's head and it's all his fault that they wasted their time and money on NASL, but I can say it looks a little strange that he'd announce his departure before the finals and I am curious to hear what the NASL crew think of it all. But then their ability to interface with the community has been hilariously poor so who knows if they ever will talk about it.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
why guess when I tell you what is up?
It's a 9-5 for 3 months that doesn't allow me to travel as much as I'd like as a player. It's a 9-5 that detracts from my time to play (my actual passion). Having never casted especially on this level (Nobody has -- talking time commitment here) I didn't know how I would feel.
The league is promised to go beyond 1 season. I personally did not promise to be the head commentator for every season. My time became limited because I was traveling for EG etc... I have no idea where these theories come from stating I "noticed it wasn't doing as good so I started to distance myself." You'd have to be some kind of special dumb to try and connect those dots.. think I reached out to intel and had them run the "Love IT" event and invite me PURELY so I can cast less on NASL? wtf
NASL is doing great. Was it as big as my hype? Nope. But it is doing great and is planning on doing better season 2. Please stop spreading lies as if you have any special information (you don't) and your constant assuming/ignorance from your hideously negative perspective (jimmyraynor/floorexercise) is gross and annoying. Stop. Neither of you know anything aside from what you see on the forums and what you invent in your head (lol).
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On June 26 2011 00:39 iNcontroL wrote:
why guess when I tell you what is up?
I, personally, loved every minute of NASL, but casting it is evidently a lot of work and your decision not to do it for another season is perfectly understandable. No reason to answer the trolls with wild imaginations who come up with their own reasons for your choice.
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Hmmm, I wonder if they are going to be having auditions for casters for season 2...
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So it was too much work for little reward so you quit, isn't that one of those insane special dumb theories I stated? Of course we don't know anything, NASL doesn't even like to tell us who the sucker losing all the money on it is. That's what the internet is for, baseless and often times absurd speculation.
My other absolutely baseless speculation is that the finals are going to be so bad that you want to make it clear that you have no affiliation to NASL before it even begins. I'm not stating anything as fact, I am just typing up the ridiculous scenarios that I conjure up with my overactive imagination
Far be it for people to make assumptions based on a history of coming up with tremendously cool ideas that end in tears and ashes. GosuCamp was nearing a full on riot according to PsyonicReaver, and it was Incontrol advertising it here. GosuGuide is, despite being all but confirmed a scam full of unfulfilled promises STILL taking orders to a Paypal account using your name to advertise it but you don't even try to alert Paypal and have it shut down? And up to about a month ago was STILL advertised in your tlnet profile. But you still maintain that you're the victim of some cut and run by Louder. Which maybe you are, but come on dude. Someone is either making money on your name and putting you in situations like this to have your credibility questioned, or you are complicit in it and still making money on GosuGuide. As Marlo says, your name is your name.
+ Show Spoiler +
You do a pretty good job of putting yourself in situations for people to make these wild zany assumptions, don't you think? The track record of you advertising something and then trying to shove it under the nearest rug is growing kind of long, I honestly don't think it's that big a leap to think NASL is headed the exact same direction given that they all have one thing in common. This place may have the memory span of a goldfish but it's like clockwork with you and your esport entrepreneurial adventures.
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On June 26 2011 01:05 floor exercise wrote:
So it was too much work for little reward so you quit, isn't that one of those insane special dumb theories I stated? Of course we don't know anything, NASL doesn't even like to tell us who the sucker losing all the money on it is. That's what the internet is for, baseless and often times absurd speculation.
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It's not that it was too much work for too little reward...it's too much work to do that, AND to be a professional player at the same time...
Being able to practice, or go to lans, or participate in events are all hindered by the fact that he was casting as a FULL TIME job, not as some little side gig that some people do on sunday afternoon where they don't have anything else going on
I'm sad to see him go, but glad to see him switching back to playing full time, i can't wait to see what inc has for us in the future.
Nothing but love inC!
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
floor excercise, you've been at this for awhile now.. moving from thread to thread trying to make a case that I am some kind of villain or w/e.
I am leaving the NASL because I want to play more. YOU are the idiot continually ignoring what I (the fucking person we are talking about) say and instead interpreting that what actually happened is I didn't want to work hard any more and left... can you please put your troll hat aside for 1 second and at least address what I say? I have a passion to play. I can't do that when I work on the NASL. Why hate on me for that? Cause I hyped the NASL? Sorry I guess. If you thought I was going to stay with the NASL and give up progaming I apologize if I lead you astray.
I am going to speak 1 more time to the shit about the Gosuguide / gosucamp / gosucoaching while louder ran it. I've spoken to all these things before... there were no fucking secrets (you are lying again) but here goes:
1. Gosuguide is not a scam. You pay for a guide, you get a guide. The guide was SUPPOSED to be updated that was a huge part of it's value. The owner, the guy with all the information / ability to update has had a child and is no longer responsive/working on the site. He is not known to me in person. I have no connection to him. I made a tremendous mistake attaching my name to a project when I did not personally know the guy. I have learned and will try and not make that mistake. No I have not contacted authorities to have the site closed down or w/e. Because I have no legal standing to do that. I do not get paid from him. I have removed all links to it. I get asked about it every 3 months or so by a person (like you) and each time I tell this story.
2. Gosucamp -- let me just start off by saying you quoted psyonicreaver (you are a huge idiot). You mean the guy who had a melt down at Riot and was fired and has since then quit anything gaming related and moved back to his parent's home in oregon to work a job at a mill? The guy who literally got drunk and told a bunch of lies about his friends on his stream? Not a good call buddy. We did 1 camp. It was messy as we had never ran anything like that. We did the best we could. We talked about doing more... then SC2 exploded. I don't have time to do it and neither does anyone else. Thankfully we don't have an obligation to do another.. we would LOVE to and will hopefully get there but atm it isn't feasible. Who the FUCK are you to hate on me for that? I'm sorry I put on a SC2 camp... what have you done?
3. Gosucoaching with Louder: Wow.. so this happened during the beta of SC2 nearly 1 year ago. He changed the payment system. People weren't getting lessons because the site was getting overloaded and he flipped out and posted a msg saying "well, you guys can get your money by complaining to paypal I won't touch the issue" SO YOU BET YOUR ASS I distanced myself. The owner of the site did the dumbest thing ever.. I had no control so I publicly stated I thought it was REALLY dumb and said I don't agree and will move on. WTF would YOU do? "Well, this is tough guys but I'm going to stick it out! GL with paypal!"
Since then Gosucoaching has done amazing under the ownership of Russ. Seen any issues from me? Didn't think so.
I've always found you extremely annoying. But at least do it where you aren't lying and being really really bad. PLZ!
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On June 26 2011 01:30 iNcontroL wrote:
floor excercise, you've been at this for awhile now.. moving from thread to thread trying to make a case that I am some kind of villain or w/e.
I am leaving the NASL because I want to play more. YOU are the idiot continually ignoring what I (the fucking person we are talking about) say and instead interpreting that what actually happened is I didn't want to work hard any more and left... can you please put your troll hat aside for 1 second and at least address what I say? I have a passion to play. I can't do that when I work on the NASL. Why hate on me for that? Cause I hyped the NASL? Sorry I guess. If you thought I was going to stay with the NASL and give up progaming I apologize if I lead you astray.
I am going to speak 1 more time to the shit about the Gosuguide / gosucamp / gosucoaching while louder ran it. I've spoken to all these things before... there were no fucking secrets (you are lying again) but here goes:
1. Gosuguide is not a scam. You pay for a guide, you get a guide. The guide was SUPPOSED to be updated that was a huge part of it's value. The owner, the guy with all the information / ability to update has had a child and is no longer responsive/working on the site. He is not known to me in person. I have no connection to him. I made a tremendous mistake attaching my name to a project when I did not personally know the guy. I have learned and will try and not make that mistake. No I have no contacted authorities to have the site closed down or w/e. Because I have no legal standing to do that. I do not get paid from him. I have removed all links to it. I get asked about it every 3 months or so by a person (like you) and each time I tell this story.
2. Gosucamp -- let me just start off by saying you quoted psyonicreaver (you are a huge idiot). You mean the guy who had a melt down at Riot and was fired and has since then quit anything gaming related and moved back to his parent's home in oregon to work a job at a mill? The guy who literally got drunk and told a bunch of lies about his friends on his stream? Not a good call buddy. We did 1 camp. It was messy as we had never ran anything like that. We did the best we could. We talked about doing more... than SC2 exploded. I don't have time to do it and neither does anyone else. Thankfully we don't have an obligation to do another.. we would LOVE to and will hopefully get there but atm it isn't feasible. Who the FUCK are you to hate on me for that? I'm sorry I put on a SC2 camp... what have you done?
3. Gosucoaching with Louder: Wow.. so this happened during the beta of SC2 nearly 1 year ago. He changed the payment system. People weren't getting lessons because the site was getting overloaded and he flipped out and posted a msg saying "well, you guys can get your money by complaining to paypal I won't touch the issue" SO YOU BET YOUR ASS I distanced myself. The owner of the site did the dumbest thing ever.. I had no control so I publicly stated I thought it was REALLY dumb and said I don't agree and will move on. WTF would YOU do? "Well, this is tough guys but I'm going to stick it out! GL with paypal!"
Since then Gosucoaching has done amazing under the ownership of Russ. Seen any issues from me? Didn't think so.
I've always found you extremely annoying. But at least do it where you aren't lying and being really really bad. PLZ!
Seems like you need to stop dealing with such shady ass people z.z
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This makes me sad, i really loved the Gretorp/iNcontrol casting duo 
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Maybe he can have a winning record against combat-ex one day now...
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
@greatness: congrats you read my post where I said I need to not deal with people I haven't met.
The only other person you could be referring to is Louder.. everyone knew/met him. People do dumb stuff. I could never eliminate interacting with dumb people forever..I can only try and avoid them (which I do).
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Not sure where I'm lying when you admitted they were all failed projects in one way or another and they all involved you. We just established that it's all speculation and that random forum posters have incredibly limited information, why do you then keep claiming that I am a liar? How can I lie about facts I am not privy to?
I get that you're not happy with them, but it doesn't make me a liar or someone hellbent on the destruction of your character to point them out and to connect the dots to NASL.
I don't think you're diabolical or a bad person or that you look for ways to scam people left and right. I just think you put your name to so many bad things that I can only reasonably come to conclusion that the next thing with your name affixed to it will be tainted as well. I'm sorry it upsets you to be questioned on things and asked for clarification and to dig up that long list of disappointing projects, but I appreciate that you responded.
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On June 26 2011 01:47 iNcontroL wrote:
@greatness: congrats you read my post where I said I need to not deal with people I haven't met.
The only other person you could be referring to is Louder.. everyone knew/met him. People do dumb stuff. I could never eliminate interacting with dumb people forever..I can only try and avoid them (which I do).
Sorry your get rich quick schemes didn't work.
I guess it's all about esports and the fans huh?
User was temp banned for this post.
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On June 25 2011 22:10 JimmyJRaynor wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2011 15:56 Defacer wrote:
Here's the point: Let's say the NASL does tank?
WHAT THE FUCK DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH INCONTROL?
InControl was employed by the NASL. Do you seriously think that he is somehow liable....
leaning on the Caps Lock key and swearing does not help your post. if he makes promises that go unfulfilled it lowers his credibility... and he painted the picture of being far more than a "contract employee". i remember in that IGN IPL interview thing he referred to the NASL by saying "i'm starting my own league" throughout the initial announcement its "we decided.." , "we thought ..." if an organization goes down in the flames of unfulfilled promises then all involved look bad. the more deeply you're involved with the organization the worse you look. the guy who does nothing but print the live event tickets probably does not take much of a hit to his credibility... he is just getting paid to print the tickets. But the guy who says "i'm starting my own league".. i'd say he is acknowledging a big involvement in it and he is not merely printing the tickets or reciting a memorized speech prepared by others. all of this is speculation though... let's see if the NASL can "Show me the Money". and at this point i'd like to revisit my original conclusion and end things in a constructive manner with the NASL only a few months old with no real ties to the SC2 community ( no Razer, no Intel , no zotac connections) it would be prudent for all involved to withhold payment of any kind of Season2 "application fee" payment until Season 1 prize money is handed out.
The use of the word "we" when representing or speaking on behalf of an organization in interviews is standard in the professional world. It's call being a team player, par for course for anyone that's ever been part of a team or had a real job, and is not indicative of actual ownership and responsibility.
You're reading WAAAAAAAAAY to much into it.
You're last suggestion of withholding payment is an active attempt to sabotage someone else's businees, just so you can fulfill your own depressing, cynical prophecy.
The NASL has a sensible need to mitigate their own risk. You on the other hand are an idiot that thinks the world is made of faceless corporations which hand out lucrative opportunities for players, without the players making any sort of commitment or having any skin in the game.
Disgusting sense of entitlement. Let me guess, you're an engineering or science student?
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I can't say this is unexpected. But I still feel disappointed. INControl's humor was a part of NASL as much as anything else.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On June 26 2011 01:52 Greatness wrote:Show nested quote +On June 26 2011 01:47 iNcontroL wrote:
@greatness: congrats you read my post where I said I need to not deal with people I haven't met.
The only other person you could be referring to is Louder.. everyone knew/met him. People do dumb stuff. I could never eliminate interacting with dumb people forever..I can only try and avoid them (which I do). Sorry your get rich quick schemes didn't work. I guess it's all about esports and the fans huh?
???
Yes I coach SC2 as a get rich quick scam. I also put on SC2 camps and create content in my never ending effort to make millions of dollars.
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I am a little sad to see him go. I thought he was performing fairly well in tournaments. But, I think he sees that competition is really starting to gear up and take a step to the next level. I'm interested to see where things go, but I am excited to see iNcontrol to put out some great games.
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On June 26 2011 01:50 floor exercise wrote:
I don't think you're diabolical or a bad person or that you look for ways to scam people left and right. I just think you put your name to so many bad things that I can only reasonably come to conclusion that the next thing with your name affixed to it will be tainted as well. I'm sorry it upsets you to be questioned on things and asked for clarification and to dig up that long list of disappointing projects, but I appreciate that you responded.
I would love to meet with you floor exercise, and openly discuss your personal history. We can talk about your experience free lance coaching or playing games professionally, and discuss your attempts at carving out a living in an new and untested industry, with very little history of success in North America.
Oh wait, you have ZERO experience?
Have you ever worked for yourself or started a business?
Have you ever taught a class?
Have you ever successfully asked out a girl?
Please, bitch. Every entrepreneur has been involved in a long string of success and failures. I'm willing to be InControl's CV/resume is a lot more impressive than yours.
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EPT
