EPTWe need less whiners, and more constructive thoughts. Our understanding of Brood War is far more advanced than SC2. And watching professional games, I think that the criticism of rush availability is both exaggerated and ignorant of the age of the game.
Blizzard: Out of touch? - Page 11
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justdweezil
United States186 Posts
We need less whiners, and more constructive thoughts. Our understanding of Brood War is far more advanced than SC2. And watching professional games, I think that the criticism of rush availability is both exaggerated and ignorant of the age of the game. | ||
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ETisME
12386 Posts
Blizzard said Zerg does not have any issue on early game scouting, rather, he said all races have bad early game scouting. I don't disagree with it completely but zerg requires to play much more reactively, which is why early scout for zerg is more crucial than other races. But it seems he failed to take a note of this side of the story | ||
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Newbistic
China2912 Posts
Have you seen the Blizzard anniversary video? During part of the interview, I think it was for World of Warcraft, one of the guys mentioned that they crunched for two years to get the game out on time. These guys at the company crunched for two fucking years to get a game out while under the "it's done when it's done" philosophy. That's probably something like 15 hour days for 2 years straight to make the best games on the market today. That doesn't leave a lot of room for "being in touch". The programmers and designers can get info from their market research teams and balance teams (David Kim etc.), but there's only so much they can get out of it without actually spending so many hours "following the scene". Think about it: you're taking 1-2 hours every day to "be in touch" when you feel like it with a game that they're working on pretty much during all waking hours. It's a bit silly to ask for more from people who are already giving it their all. | ||
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Caphe
Vietnam10817 Posts
Screw Blizzard! | ||
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Switchy
343 Posts
On June 12 2011 18:47 Caphe wrote: I want my precious reaver and lurker back!!! and I play Terran T_T. Screw Blizzard! go play brood war then | ||
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Kyuki
Sweden1867 Posts
Regarding the most uninteresting unit, it has to go to the colossus. I play protoss and I pretty much never make it. I just refuse. T_T Fucking hate it. | ||
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ALPINA
3791 Posts
On June 12 2011 18:38 Huludite wrote: Why isn't the Colossus interesting? Mobile, fragile aoe is very interesting in high dps fights in my opinion Because you a-move it and kill everything? Compare this unit with reaver from BW. Reaver 10x more fun, interesting and micro intensive. | ||
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Denzil
United Kingdom4193 Posts
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Dyon
Germany12 Posts
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WickedBit
United States343 Posts
Unit Pathing - I know there is a general sentiment that unit pathing in starcraft 2 is much better than SC1. In general it is true for most cases except one. Have any of you seen in real life soldiers bumping into each other ? or tanks colliding ? This is what I see in SC2 and it bothers me a lot. Soldiers IRL walk in a nice orderly manner, in a formation with gaps between them. SC1 had this part correct. I have no idea why the so called "advanced" pathing in SC2 cannot get this right. If this is fixed then we will have more spread out armies and more epic battlers. High Ground Advantage I think the earlier system of not doing full damage was pretty good. Now there is no defenders advantage and this contributes to why all the early rushes are so powerful. If there was high ground advantage a small army sitting on high ground could hold off a much larger army. Now all that is needed is for someone to float a unit over and suddenly everyone is on the same footing. Marauders - I am not sure what blizzards vision is for new units. So units are far too powerful for their roles that they influence balance in a big way while not being too exciting. Case in points are marauders which are beefy, have slow and do massive DPS. In past abilities like slow (which is a warcraft ability) were given to units that had certain disadvantages, like low dps. But Marauders have none of those. Collosus I don't even know where to start on this. A seige unit with mobility ? Can travel up/down cliffs ? What was blizzard thinking ? Also probably the most boring unit to watch in battles. They replaced a perfectly fine unit in the reaver with this ? Colossi being overpowered is probably why gateway units are so weak. SC2 has potential but I think that is being robbed because of Blizzard trying too hard to differentiate it from SC1. This makes them change and remove stuff that was not broken to begin with. | ||
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seansye
United States1722 Posts
On June 12 2011 18:56 Dyon wrote: the voters propably were angry zergs, not getting the poll question, because the colossus has an unique design with its cliffwalking and height. the poll does not say : which unit is used too much ? Did you even play BroodWar? | ||
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Rococo
United States331 Posts
On June 12 2011 18:25 SEANSYE wrote: SC2 in general is less interesting than brood war. So many of the new units are simply attack move units. Just look at the units that they replaced and compare their abilities. For example, what's more interesting? Stim and attack move marauders or constant siegeing/unsiege and mine spread around the map. Or Colossus attack move lol, or reaver harass that had high risk/reward. SO MANY of the new units in sc2 are either attack move or "meatshield" units that just stand there and take hits and attack(Roaches, Thors, Immortals). Also, some of the spells/abilities in sc2 are lacking a bit more diversity and spark(for lack of a better term). Take the 250 mm strike cannon, corruption, auto-turret, pdd, and spawning infested terran. What would you rather see? Sc2 spells or Dark Epic Swarm, plagooo, irradiate, sexy disruption build by bisu, defensive matrix, etc.. Well go back to BW then! Just kidding. If you're like me you're still playing BW regularly alongside SC2. I agree that in general SC2 is less interesting, but it still has its charms, and is probably the best RTS released since WC3. Someone said a moment ago that banelings are just a-move lurkers. That claim makes zero sense to me. I'll never get tired of seeing well-placed baneling landmines, baneling overlord drops, or tense ling/baneling micro battles in ZvZ. And as a terran player I'm in love with roasting workers with hellions, even if I miss spider mines. So at the best of times, SC2 is not only as exciting as BW but exciting in its own way. It just has a lot of room for improvement. Luckily, two expansions are on the way. I only hope that Blizzard listens to the constructive criticism of real fans rather than the idiot chorus of fanboys. | ||
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Krehlmar
Sweden1149 Posts
I for one think it is overcredited and alot of the whine comes from Pro's who just don't spend enough time with SC2. IdrA is one of the few people who can rival koreans when it comes to practice but even they have a better practice regime aswell as an envoirment where all the players are good and they can funnel ideas inbetween eachother and become stronger through it... the only thing IdrA can learn from InControl/EG is that he should stop quitting every fucking game even if it makes him angry because he'll never be the best if he does. Point is: Westerners are just not very good at Starcraft BW or Starcraft 2, there ARE alot of great people who CAN rival Koreans, but they're very few. Now I do hate Blizzard in that sense of discussion but they have a hard position no doupt. But I heard something interesting on Steve Bonell(Or was it Destiny's stream I forgot) about how depressed they got viewing the zerg forums and all the balance and how they just really didn't want to play the game, until they stopt viewing the forums and just kept trying to win the game and explore new ways of doing it. I think SC2 has had a rough time in balance because people mix in way to much whine than actual pure balance in the discussion, and way to few people actually try to figure out how they can circumvent these problems. Do agree with that every unit doesn't feel like it has a good place/role nor that Mauraders/Roaches/Stalkers make for amazing games but sometimes they do when players know how to play it right. | ||
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HolydaKing
21254 Posts
honestly though, lurkers are many times more interesting fun to watch than banelings. sure, people getting rolled with banelings is fun, but it's also a very short fun. on the other hand, lurkers were so good at defending places and let the games be more strategical. i wish they come back in sc2:hots, but i doubt it. as for reavers, i don't think they'll appear again. if they do, they would need to be nerfed severely because blizzard won't put them back in the game being as "bugged" as they were in BW. | ||
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decaf
Austria1797 Posts
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ALPINA
3791 Posts
On June 12 2011 18:56 Dyon wrote: the voters propably were angry zergs, not getting the poll question, because the colossus has an unique design with its cliffwalking and height. the poll does not say : which unit is used too much ? Yeah I play zerg and I want protoss to have reaver and arbiter instead of collossus and mothership. And it has nothing to do with balance, I just want interesting units in the game. Collossus may have an unique design but it's really bad unit for and esports game. | ||
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Wesso
Netherlands1245 Posts
On June 12 2011 18:54 Alpina wrote: Because you a-move it and kill everything? Compare this unit with reaver from BW. Reaver 10x more fun, interesting and micro intensive. If that's the only problem there can be other solutions than just completely removing it (maybe decreasing it's range or giving it a special ability) But I think the collossus stalker sentry vs bio viking micro is pretty interesting, could be better of course, but not horrible enough to completely remove the unit (then we have to start balancing from square one again) | ||
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seansye
United States1722 Posts
On June 12 2011 19:02 decaf wrote: If they'd stream IdrA talking to Dustin Browder I'm sure 50k people would tune it to watch it. If they took IdrA's advice I would have to go shoot Dustin Browder. | ||
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decaf
Austria1797 Posts
On June 12 2011 19:04 SEANSYE wrote: If they took IdrA's advice I would have to go shoot Dustin Browder. Can you elaborate on that a bit more? IdrA's advice isn't in favor of Zerg, he seeks for overall balance - it was him suggesting nerfing the roach during the beta so I'd like to see you backing that statement up. | ||
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DerNebel
Denmark648 Posts
This is the thing. Dustin Browder said something like: "Dont like to watch SC2? Go watch BW.". That is, in my opinion, a poisonous statement. It shows that the dev team doesn't WANT to change the game for the better. I'm not saying it should be like BW, I'm saying that they like the game as it is now, when people have a lot of legitimate complaints, and are unwilling to listen. That statement, the "go back to bw", is clearly showing Blizzard to be at least somewhat out of touch with it's community. I really really really want a great expansion pack, but Blizzard doesn't really want to show anything that makes me want to buy it. | ||
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