EPTSituation report Patch 1.3.3 - Page 22
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ridonkulous
159 Posts
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sudzy
United States58 Posts
On May 14 2011 18:07 Coeus1 wrote: It's great that blizzard gives insight for the reasons of patches.. but.. why they never buff my race? I have a mere 50% win rate on ladder and I'm vastly superior player to people I play against. This one time I lost to unit Y from the race X, there really is no answer! How to deal with that? But no, Blizzard keeps nerfing my race. My favorite pro player (who also plays my race) feels the same! So there is proof. And to bring some statistics, my race only has 49.9923456% win rate in major tournaments. While one of the other races has 51.535125990% win rate. But no, blizzard fails to fix it. Listen to SotG to get even more proof. This is an absolutely fantastic post! I feel the same way, some of these posts are bordering on the absurd. | ||
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Rabiator
Germany3948 Posts
First, we definitely don’t like seeing Thors en masse. Due to the visual size of the unit, as well as a small pathing radius, Thors can obscure the other units in your army too easily. This can be problematic because it's important to know roughly how many units an opponent has when scouting. We want the Thor to be the type of unit that you add to your main army, and we definitely don’t want them to be the core of your army to the point where you strive to build as many as possible. Dear Blizzard, Colossi obscure units since day 1 of Starcraft 2. Why is it ok for Protoss to obscure their units and not for Terrans? If anything the Colossus is the worse offender here because he moves in synchrony with the Gateway units while the Thor is much slower. Sure the ability to repair with "hidden SCVs" might be rather strong, but you dont need many High Templars hidden beneath Colossi to deal rather strong surprise damage. A curious customer who dislikes logic fails. | ||
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MajorityofOne
Canada2506 Posts
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Thezzy
Netherlands2117 Posts
First, we definitely don’t like seeing Thors en masse. So, and? Thus? Meaning? Personal preference doesn't come in to this Blizzard, AT ALL. Due to the visual size of the unit, as well as a small pathing radius, Thors can obscure the other units in your army too easily. This can be problematic because it's important to know roughly how many units an opponent has when scouting. But mass Colossi obscuring the Protoss army or Zerg bringing 10 overlords with them hiding half the army is fine? Obscuring the army is fine, nothing wrong with it. Heck, in teamgames some Zergs group their overlords over their ally's tech structure such as a Dark Shrine, I consider that to be clever thinking, not a bug or something to remove. We want the Thor to be the type of unit that you add to your main army, and we definitely don’t want them to be the core of your army to the point where you strive to build as many as possible. Again, personal preference from Blizzard. If I want to build 20 Thors, you have no right to say 'Well I don't like that, let's nerf it'. Mass Thor is very difficult and tricky to actually pull off. They are very slow, form bad concaves and especially Protoss has dozens of ways of dealing with Thors. Even staying alive to get 20 Thors is a challenge. If any Terran wants a Thor-centric army, there is no reason for Blizzard to discourage it for the stated reasons. The reasons Blizzard provided feel a lot like nothing more than personal preference, with no regard for the actual balance. P.S. Seeing a dozen collector edition Thors on the field is pure awesome. | ||
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IntotheNorth
Denmark116 Posts
seriously, david kim , u fail so hard at balance the game | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On May 14 2011 14:12 Killcycle wrote: Well, a lot of the community didn't like it either. And in the end, I'm sure Blizzard has a stronger grasp on the game on every level than most of us can hope to have, so beyond utter failure I'm more inclined to trust their judgement. Though 150 energy is a hell of a lot xP. Blizzard has demonstrated an alarming amount of failure in truly understanding BW or SC2 in terms of the reality of the game. Where the hell are you getting this confidence from? | ||
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Amber[LighT]
United States5078 Posts
On May 14 2011 21:18 shizna wrote: the weird thing is that thor can't use anti-air to shoot colossus, the 10 range weak-ass dps might be favourable to 7 range imba dps. queen uses air attack versus colossus, but thor can not. I think when Blizzard patched this they were doing it because Thors would exclusively attack with the AA and neglect anything on the ground that was closer. Queens ironically didn't function like this and I don't even know why they worked differently from the start. | ||
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Froadac
United States6733 Posts
If you can't make a creep colony to later change, then as Idra has repeatedly said you need crawlers to move and to adjust. And 6 seconds isn't going to kill somebody. And no, more people than idra have said it. (Day9 etc) Their reasoning is basically "we want people to not make drones and spinecrawlers, but to make units early game" I don't like that sort of artificial interference. Thor was a little unimpressive as well, but the rest were reasonable. | ||
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mike1290
United States88 Posts
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Wyk
314 Posts
The nature of lockdown abilities in general is that they have the potential to heavily turn the tide of battle against armies that would otherwise counter your units. Most of these abilities, especially for an ability as strong as this one, have to be fairly difficult to bring out and easier to counter. Excuse me? What about fungal growth? Damage + root is not fun? But I guess its easily counterable because it has an instant effect with 9 range. | ||
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10325 Posts
If you can't make a creep colony to later change, then as Idra has repeatedly said you need crawlers to move and to adjust. And 6 seconds isn't going to kill somebody. About your post, I haven't interpreted what blizzard said in the same way. Anyways, yes 6 seconds can definitely kill someone. And if not 6 seconds, then multiple periods of 6 seconds. That's 6 seconds of time a void or phoenix or void and phoenix or etc can pick off a couple drones or even a queen. Unless you were sarcastic here? Edit: Also, I don't think enough people consider the possible conflict between the game designers (and even the art directors) and the balancers. It seems that the preference thing with the mass Thors is definitely a game designer and art director choice, while the Archon changes were obviously a balancer choice. Of course we don't know what positions each department has in regards to this kind of stuff, but it would make sense. | ||
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cYaN
Norway3322 Posts
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nvrs
Greece481 Posts
On May 15 2011 03:51 Rabiator wrote: Dear Blizzard, Colossi obscure units since day 1 of Starcraft 2. Why is it ok for Protoss to obscure their units and not for Terrans? If anything the Colossus is the worse offender here because he moves in synchrony with the Gateway units while the Thor is much slower. Sure the ability to repair with "hidden SCVs" might be rather strong, but you dont need many High Templars hidden beneath Colossi to deal rather strong surprise damage. A curious customer who dislikes logic fails. Damn right! I can't believe that Blizzard replied like that - it sounds like trolling! I mean i am ok with most of balance changes etc. up until now but the reasoning behind this opens a can of worms... Seriously i am crap at this game (low masters) but i don't think Thors are really worth getting except as a turret at your base when the zerg goes heavy on mutas. They are slow and crap at anti-air with magic boxed units. Now this... | ||
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nalgene
Canada2153 Posts
On May 15 2011 03:51 Rabiator wrote: Dear Blizzard, Colossi obscure units since day 1 of Starcraft 2. Why is it ok for Protoss to obscure their units and not for Terrans? If anything the Colossus is the worse offender here because he moves in synchrony with the Gateway units while the Thor is much slower. Sure the ability to repair with "hidden SCVs" might be rather strong, but you dont need many High Templars hidden beneath Colossi to deal rather strong surprise damage. A curious customer who dislikes logic fails. You can see under the legs... | ||
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TyrantPotato
Australia1541 Posts
blizzard is constantly trying to "force" balance to fit their idea of how the game "should be played" . if blizzard doesnt take a step back and just let stuff develop (except in the case of some sort of magic super OP bullshit strat unbeatable stuff) then this game will start to stagnate and i hope to hell it doesnt come to that. | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
On May 15 2011 04:25 IntotheNorth wrote: why blizzard wants the game play to be just the way they wanted to seriously, david kim , u fail so hard at balance the game That's called game design | ||
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Rabiator
Germany3948 Posts
... but not behind the upper body, which is relevant when the Protoss has 4+ Colossi and walks around with his tight ball. Just watch some of the TSL3 3rd/4th matches and ask yourself: Can I see all of the Protoss units at all times? Thats where I had to answer NO. "I cant see all the units around the Thors" is something which applies only to a SNAPSHOT and not a moving continuous battle. The speed of the Thor compared to the units which might be huddling around its feet is a lot different, but if you do the same comparison for Protoss units you dont see that speed gap. So there are two more reasons why the explanation from Blizzard is kinda bogus ... | ||
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uzas
Croatia52 Posts
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WesleyLok
Canada99 Posts
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