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Massive units are not affected by concussive shells. If you think they are, you are wrong.
It's SPORE crawlers that are being changed, not SPINE. Please read carefully. |
On April 26 2011 11:55 PGriff wrote:
The ghost change is good for TvZ. The new infestor is seeing a LOT more use (cause its awesome) so making ghosts viable among tank/medvac production is pretty good imo.
For TvP though I feel liek this could be tough. I play zerg, so idk but I feel like a slightly delayed stim push with a money emp could be pretty sick against slower gates.
I agree with the Ghost change for TvZ. Definitely more doable to get a Ghost now with the M&T composition.
On April 26 2011 12:03 Mastermind wrote:
The ghost buff is so fucking random. What made them think ghosts needed to be cheaper?
The slavage nerf is about fucking time. Free return was just retarded.
I am not a fan of how they are trying to "fix" pvp. These changes are not worth it at all. I would prefer them to leave that mu alone if this is their idea of a fix. 4gate isnt so bad because both players do it, then the game can go into the mid game, where it gets interesting.
Seriously, in TvP, if you're going tier 1-1.5 units, minerals will limit the number of units you can produce early game, therefore I see this as a nerf early game, but definitely a buff late game (although MMM builds are still very mineral intensive).
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On April 26 2011 12:06 KhAlleB wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2011 12:04 GiantEnemyCrab wrote:
y do people cry about 2 gate, if you scout it early with ur worker scout, you practically win the game ok you didnt played the beta you did you ?
if you look at the tsl matches ALL the players scout for stuff like this b4 scout their enemy base, so i really wanna see how the pros deal with this before jumping to conclusions
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On April 26 2011 12:09 GiantEnemyCrab wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2011 12:06 KhAlleB wrote:On April 26 2011 12:04 GiantEnemyCrab wrote:
y do people cry about 2 gate, if you scout it early with ur worker scout, you practically win the game ok you didnt played the beta you did you ? if you look at the tsl matches ALL the players scout for stuff like this b4 scout their enemy base, so i really wanna see how the pros deal with this before jumping to conclusions
It's not a proxy 2 gate, it's just 2 gate, similar to 2 rax.
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uh when we last had 2 gate, we still had steppes.
now the map distance are much longer especially in competitive scene. don't see that being much more of a problem tbh. Although skipping gas might not be an option for zergs anymore otherwise more stalkers will abuse them to death.
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On April 26 2011 12:03 Mastermind wrote:
The ghost buff is so fucking random. What made them think ghosts needed to be cheaper?
The slavage nerf is about fucking time. Free return was just retarded.
I am not a fan of how they are trying to "fix" pvp. These changes are not worth it at all. I would prefer them to leave that mu alone if this is their idea of a fix. 4gate isnt so bad because both players do it, then the game can go into the mid game, where it gets interesting.
Well, the fact that ghost usage is so scarce that when someone is actually going for a ghost build everyone is like "WHOA what the hell is going on". Of all the major, awesome tournaments ive followed the last month i think i have seen 1 (one) set where ghost usage actually tipped the scale in favor of a terran.
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Why the bitching?
They are nerfing 4 gate (but not nerfing early game Protoss) and giving them a nice buff.
Terran is getting a decent buff and a small nerf.
Zerg is getting an okay change. It will be good against all ins I guess
This balances the infestor-ghost in TvZ, well finally removing stupid bunker rushing.
PvT it may hurt, but Protoss is doing pretty well right now, and archon buff could be interesting
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On April 26 2011 11:52 Golgotha wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2011 11:47 Eleaven wrote:On April 26 2011 11:39 TurtlePerson2 wrote:
It's good to see 4-gate come a little later. I think that will adjust Protoss in a good way. 4-gate is weakened, but all other strategies are more or less untouched.
The ghost change is kind of interesting. Terrans usually have a mineral abundance due to MULEs, so I think it will help Terran.
. wut? Show me a good terran with spare minerals? Pretty much every terran is floating a ton of gas mid game, since their core units are very gas light, and mineral heavy. Mule doesn't give them spare minerals, it lets them keep up in production with races that use mins/gas in a more balanced manner sir i hope you are not kidding. it is pretty much common knowledge that the mules allow terran to easily stockpile minerals more so than gas. show me a good terran with spare gas...tanks and marauders are gas heavy and are core terran units.
Common knowledge amongst people who don't know anything about the game...
2-gate will be harder to hold, but it was never really overpowered in high level play anyways. Zealot build time got nerfed because it was too easy for lower level players to do and too hard relatively to stop since no-one walls or scouts in Bronze. Glad they're focusing on higher level play now, 'bout time.
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On April 26 2011 12:03 Mastermind wrote:
The ghost buff is so fucking random. What made them think ghosts needed to be cheaper?
The slavage nerf is about fucking time. Free return was just retarded.
I am not a fan of how they are trying to "fix" pvp. These changes are not worth it at all. I would prefer them to leave that mu alone if this is their idea of a fix. 4gate isnt so bad because both players do it, then the game can go into the mid game, where it gets interesting.
It actually buffs mech play in TvP. Late 4 gate means siege expands might be viable and lower gas cost means ghost+mech late game is viable (mech without ghost is lame). It might even translate into a classic BW style matchup where terran siege expands gets mech, then adds ghosts while toss keeps up in expos and makes that transition to stargate while terran needs to push and kill toss before carrirers/voids come out. Wouldn't that make for a good matchup?
We are in agreement on the salvage nerf.
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Great change. love that the bunkers will actually cost somthing now
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On April 26 2011 12:10 Maetl wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2011 12:09 GiantEnemyCrab wrote:On April 26 2011 12:06 KhAlleB wrote:On April 26 2011 12:04 GiantEnemyCrab wrote:
y do people cry about 2 gate, if you scout it early with ur worker scout, you practically win the game ok you didnt played the beta you did you ? if you look at the tsl matches ALL the players scout for stuff like this b4 scout their enemy base, so i really wanna see how the pros deal with this before jumping to conclusions It's not a proxy 2 gate, it's just 2 gate, similar to 2 rax.
Exactly. It's the sheer number of units produced, not the actual strategy.
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On April 26 2011 12:11 1Eris1 wrote:
Why the bitching?
They are nerfing 4 gate (but not nerfing early game Protoss) and giving them a nice buff.
Terran is getting a decent buff and a small nerf.
Zerg is getting an okay change. It will be good against all ins I guess
Spore crawlers won't do much against any kind of all in unless it's like..banshees? idk
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There is a new map between. Let me find the way to get the map in full screen then ill make a picture
Edit : All I can say, this is the distructible rocks paradise
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I like that the bunkers aren't free anymore. On the brighter side, archons being massive is a change i've been waiting for forever. Not sure how decreasing build times are gonna work out, but hopefully it turns out to be alright.
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Diggin these changes thus far.
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On April 26 2011 12:09 Two_DoWn wrote:
At least I can see a 2 gate coming...
Are you implying you couldnt see 4gate coming? 4gate is one of the easiest builds to scout.
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ghost is not gas intensive? wtf whos idea was this? terran = all minerals all the time...
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Im pretty much shocked they reverted all the timings back to beta for protoss. LOL. Also im pretty shocked that the protoss deathball (ie. colossus) wasnt nerfed.
Seems kind of a random patch. Spore crawler dig in i guess is good for zergs, but i think the more pressing thing was spine crawlers because if someone gets banshees in your base and you have to build and move spore crawlers, you are pretty far behind anyway.
Ghost buff is the dark horse, and i think its because they are trying to encourage more ghosts, particularily now that infestors are soooo potent.
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Wait... Close spawn on metal and temple are still allowed, and stalker and zealot build time is decreased. I'm completely dumbfounded by this change. Did Blizzard even account for how OP this will be for P in PvZ close spawns? Sure, that change will be nice on large maps, but close spawn is where most zergs have problems.
Sigh...
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THE GLORIOUS RETURN OF 2 GATE CORE IS COMING. 
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On April 26 2011 11:24 Xapti wrote:
ROFL WAFL
Patch 16: Zealot build time increased from 33 to 38.
Patch 17: Zealot build time decreased from 38 to 33.
Patch 1.1.0: Zealot build time increased from 33 to 38.
Patch 1.3.3: Zealot train time decreased from 38 to 33.
WTF M8?
LOL Look at this.
Patch 6: Build time decreased from 40 seconds to 30 seconds.
Patch 16: Bunker build time increased from 30 to 40.
Patch 17: Bunker build time decreased from 40 seconds to 30 seconds.
Patch 1.1.0: Build time increased from 30 to 35.
Patch 1.3.0: Build time increased from 35 to 40.
At least they aren't changing the build time again 
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EPT
