EPTI only hope that Blizzard can "fix" SC2 in HotS and LotV, but I'm not counting on it.
[D] What SC2 is missing? - Page 7
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Headshot
United States1656 Posts
I only hope that Blizzard can "fix" SC2 in HotS and LotV, but I'm not counting on it. | ||
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CommanderCato
United States78 Posts
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seansye
United States1722 Posts
But when I watch oGsMC use some pretty sexy forecefield or well uhhh theres pretty much nothing else that is mentionable, I can go play a ladder game and do something almost very similar. | ||
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
On April 16 2011 12:21 mahnini wrote: yes. i have bw still installed on my computer but i never touch it and play sc2 instead. i watch all the tsls and catch as many other tournaments as i can whereas i haven't followed a season of bw since savior lost to bisu. i have favorite players and i thoroughly enjoy watching and playing sc2, i just think the experience can be better. I haven't played BW in close to a decade and haven't played SC2 since February. I'm not interested in playing at all. I'm just interested in watching progames. BW's nonstop battles and frequent poking are still so much more exciting to watch. | ||
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deafhobbit
United States828 Posts
On April 16 2011 12:20 mike1290 wrote: This is so true. If SC2 commentaries were only broadcast in korean, I would have stopped watch them a very long time ago. It almost seems SC2 is riding on the backs of the awesome commentators out there. I don't think I could personally watch SC2 for years, like it did BW, but I'm crossing my fingers for these next expansions. There have been so many times watching SC2 when a fights going on, the commentators are screaming "OMG THIS IS SO AWESOME" and I'm bored out of my mind. The stuff about eco management and timings can be interesting, but i can get that watching BW, all while having actually entertaining fights to watch. If you're bored with Sc2, come back to BW. MSL starts in 30 minutes, and tonight's groups look cool. | ||
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RinconH
United States512 Posts
I do feel SC2 needs more "positional" units and, likewise, more positions on the map worth defending. Armies need to have more incentives to be split up and there needs to be more opportunity to turn the tide of a battle when you don't have a supply advantage. Positional units are the key to both of these I think. That's why, IMO, Terran vs. Terran bring the most exciting games right now. Both sides have siege tanks. Hopefully Blizzard will institute this type of thing in the expansions. | ||
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Atheros
United States84 Posts
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seansye
United States1722 Posts
On April 16 2011 12:30 Atheros wrote: This makes me sad that I didn't really get into StarCraft until SC2. I wasn't really to experience the excitement and drama that you are talking about. I think I might take a break from SC2 and try some Brood War for a while. The MSL is in 30 minutes. It's a very prestigious bw tournament, check it out! | ||
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Demonace34
United States2493 Posts
SC2 everything is so fast it seems so fragile, but at the same time that means if you mess up 1 time the other player could plow you over in the next 1 min gametime... I love watching DDE vs NaDa because of how positional it was. True skill shines when watching TvT in SC2 and I'm sure the same goes for TvT SC1. Siege units are just so different in SC2, Colossus isn't slow and can climb up and down mountains, broodlords are awesome, but without spellcasters under them they can't hold any decent position. Also it takes time for the broodlings to get out and start doing the damage unlike a colossus or tank which does direct damage along with splash damage. I just hope for more positional units, and some type of hydra that works decently off creep. Thanks for such a thought out thread though, I agree on most points. | ||
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Headshot
United States1656 Posts
On April 16 2011 12:28 deafhobbit wrote:There have been so many times watching SC2 when a fights going on, the commentators are screaming "OMG THIS IS SO AWESOME" and I'm bored out of my mind. Ugh, I completely agree. I really dislike whenever commentators get worked up over well executed Blink micro. Sure, it's fun to see, but it's nothing that's that demanding, or that takes much skill. | ||
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thehitman
1105 Posts
I'd also like to add the "bonus damage". In SC2 units do bonus damage versus armored or light, while in BW the units did less damage to an armor type, thus making the battles last longer and be more exciting. As some1 else said right now a 200/200 battle is over in 4-5 seconds, while in brood war such a fight would last like whole 5 minutes, with back and forth positioning and attacking. I would also say that the current macro mechanics make the game easier. For example chorno boost, mules and inject don't make it harder, its just a quick reflex thing, but it makes the game easier. I need more money, i just have to drop mules. I need more units, i can just chrono boost and have 5 more stalkers in no time, i need more units i can just inject no problem. I think if SC2 is going to succeed Blizzard need to remove the bonus damage and make it like it was in BW with damage types doing less damage to armor types, instead of more. I also agree that there needs to be more strategic units, I mean the roach is the worst replacement to the lurker, WTH were you blizzard thinking? "we can't find a place for the lurker" yeah right, so we can get the boring roach, 1a move. Colossus is like the reaver that has 3x its normal speed and can climb terrain, if that was the case in BW do you know how imba that would have been. And SC2 siege tanks area joke, and the Thor is a piss poor replacement for the goliath. This makes me just go and build a Starcraft: Brood War map in the editor with all the original units, stats and quirks. I really think it will be more successful if its done properly and can take off more than SC2 right now. | ||
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Mulu731
United States99 Posts
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mahnini
United States6862 Posts
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Datum
United States371 Posts
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deafhobbit
United States828 Posts
On April 16 2011 12:30 Atheros wrote: This makes me sad that I didn't really get into StarCraft until SC2. I wasn't really to experience the excitement and drama that you are talking about. I think I might take a break from SC2 and try some Brood War for a while. There are live games coming up soon, but without english commentary you might not get what's going on. Give it a try, and if it looks interesting, try watching some commentated vods to get a better idea how BW works. I didn't start following competitive BW till Jan 2010, and for the first few months ALL i did was watch commentated vods. Really helped me get what's going on. Recommended Commentators CholeraSC - He was awesome, but hasn't updated for about a year and a half Nukethestars - easily the best commentator currently active. Commentates OSL, and random Proleague games when OSL isn't on. RanshinDA - Not as good as Nuke, but was pretty decent. Commentated MSL and random PL games, but stopped a few months ago. Best channel for non-commentated games is nevake. Jon747 used to be great, but he uploaded a few too many WCG games and got taken down. Plenty of others out there, but these are my favorites. Even though i mostly watch live games nowadays, i still watch commentated games every once in awhile if i just want to watch a game without paying as much attention to it. If i miss a game and i know a commentary for it will be coming out soon, i usually wait for it instead of watching it on nevake. | ||
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zako
4 Posts
On April 16 2011 12:33 thehitman wrote: I think if SC2 is going to succeed Blizzard need to remove the bonus damage and make it like it was in BW with damage types doing less damage to armor types, instead of more.. Well, "Marauder does more damage to armored" is the same as "Marauder does less damage to light". About making battles slower, here's an odd data point: there's a Half-Life 2 mod called MINERVA. When this mod came out the author was praised for his brilliant improvements to the enemy AI; they just seemed so much smarter and more deadly than the enemies in the original game. But the thing is, he didn't change the AI at all. All he did was give them a lot more HP. Basically, since the enemies lived longer, they had more time to do cool stuff. Right now some of the coolest micro battles in SC2 are early game PvT and PvP battles with small numbers of units. Basically your units are living long enough to do cool stuff with them. | ||
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OnFire
324 Posts
Atleast that would make the game 33% more interesting. I mean, the grand choice that a Protoss has to make is: "Should I mix in Zealots with my Stalker/Sentry/Collosus ball or should I just get more Stalkers?". I think it all comes down to the Protoss deathball being way to efficient. Stalkers are anti air, good range, fast, blink. Sentry's provide forcefields to keep the deathball safe, and they have guardian shield as insult to injury, to negate even more damage. Collosus range is sick, have splash damage and they are impossible to get at without using Vikings or Corruptors (siege tanks can work aswell), and that means you need like 10+ air units which can't attack ground, making them chew up well needed supply in a ground army. Then they are pretty much useless when the Collosus are dead. | ||
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Authweight
United States304 Posts
The other matchups need some tweaking though. Protoss and Zerg need units that require positioning and control to use properly. Fortunately, the next two expansions will focus on those races. I feel like terran is a fully functional race right now, but the other two could use some work. Lets make it happen Blizzard! Until then I'll enjoy the TvTs and ZvTs though  | ||
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Gimix
United States67 Posts
On April 16 2011 12:43 zako wrote: Well, "Marauder does more damage to armored" is the same as "Marauder does less damage to light". About making battles slower, here's an odd data point: there's a Half-Life 2 mod called MINERVA. When this mod came out the author was praised for his brilliant improvements to the enemy AI; they just seemed so much smarter and more deadly than the enemies in the original game. But the thing is, he didn't change the AI at all. All he did was give them a lot more HP. Basically, since the enemies lived longer, they had more time to do cool stuff. Right now some of the coolest micro battles in SC2 are early game PvT and PvP battles with small numbers of units. Basically your units are living long enough to do cool stuff with them. This seems like a really cool idea. Slowing the game speed down to faster/normal would have an analogous effect. | ||
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mahnini
United States6862 Posts
On April 16 2011 12:44 Authweight wrote: I feel like SC2 TvT is actually at that level right now. Tanks are obviously very positional, marines are very microable, and viking positioning is pretty critical too. ZvT is there to some degree, the drama of marine vs baneling micro is very awesome to watch, as well as muta micro to pick off tanks, workers, buildings, etc. i agree with you. tvt is by far my favorite matchup, watching mkp vs mvp really resembles bw tvp. tvz is up there too. | ||
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