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Before you post, read the title of this thread slowly and out loud. |
+ Show Spoiler +I'll respond to this in depth. This league's success is highly dependent on us being able to adhere to a broadcast schedule. We need to have stuff playing every night. What happens when we let a random guy who's not in a team into the league: what if he does poorly and drops out? What if he's late every week and delays our broadcast? This ruins the league.
Having players on teams adds accountability and responsibility. If a team contracts a player to uphold some degree of professionalism, there is a much higher chance that they'll do their job. We can't just "trust" that a player not on a team will do all these things. A team can fund the player's trip to the LAN final, and pay the entry fee.
You have to realize, avilo, that this is much more than about simply playing the game well. There are many other factors to consider; we are looking at all of them, and you're only looking at the game. Requiring teams is a way to make sure that we will be able to run smoothly and professionally for the duration of the event. If you're good enough to beat the players in this league, you should get picked up by a team, or qualify through the open !
I haven't read entire thread but that is quite possibly the most bullshit I have ever read. I hoped to read this Q&A and feel better about this, but after reading that I am feeling worse. It now feels even more like the "keep the rich richer" than before.
Skip the bullshit, you want the more known players (even if they aren't the best), I can respect that, but just fucking say it, stop beating around the bush.
+ Show Spoiler +Koreans: We're not GSL. Bringing in all the Koreans will just make this event the GSL. We are focusing on the growth of Western ESPORTS, by providing players and storylines that are more relatable to our audience. That being said there is no CAP on the number of Koreans who are eligible to participate in this tournament.
Lets face it, SC2 stories are "relatable to our audience" are upcoming SC2 players who aren't sponsored. I don't care about Incontrol, the guy who fell in love on that reality show, brags about how much money he makes from coaching, but hasn't done anything at all in his SC2 career but talk. I want to see Beastyqt/Avilo/Tons more the guy who has been quietly placing well in every small tournament, beating pro/sponsored/famous players all the time, and aspiring to become a pro gamer with hard work and dedication.
(Check TLPD to compare results)
Please don't invite random Koreans over to build the NA vs KR story.
On February 24 2011 04:10 ReachTheSky wrote:
Its an invitational. You shouldn't call it a league.
On February 24 2011 04:05 iNcontroL wrote:
Also santa doesn't exist.
Incontrol trolling in the thread of the "professional" league he is the face of. Professionalism at its finest.
Edit: This edit happened before his post reading, I changed to a better example (popular vs good)
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Thank you Xeris for clearing up what a team means. Some people just don't know.
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Its an invitational. You shouldn't call it a league.
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On February 24 2011 04:02 ch33psh33p wrote:
Look, if you record something and then broadcast it later, its not live.
We can stop saying its live now. A recording of anything shown later IS NOT LIVE. You can record something live all your want, but do we call movies, tv shows, or anything of that sort live? NO! They were filmed live obviously, but they were broadcast at later dates.
We can stop pointing out that it's casted live when people stop complaining that it's casted from replays. If you have a hang up with a day delay for post production, that's fine, I won't be able to change your mind on it. You can nitpick on the wording of "casted live", but letting people think it's being casted from replays is just false information.
And because you brought up TV and such, how often have you seen a show that said "Filmed in front of a live studio audience", or a news cast playing a recording that says "live from <wherever>". Television shows have used the term "live" to describe things that were filmed live and broadcasted later for decades.
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On February 24 2011 04:12 Z-R0E wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 04:02 ch33psh33p wrote:
Look, if you record something and then broadcast it later, its not live.
We can stop saying its live now. A recording of anything shown later IS NOT LIVE. You can record something live all your want, but do we call movies, tv shows, or anything of that sort live? NO! They were filmed live obviously, but they were broadcast at later dates. We can stop pointing out that it's casted live when people stop complaining that it's casted from replays. If you have a hang up with a day delay for post production, that's fine, I won't be able to change your mind on it. You can nitpick on the wording of "casted live", but letting people think it's being casted from replays is just false information. And because you brought up TV and such, how often have you seen a show that said "Filmed in front of a live studio audience", or a news cast playing a recording that says "live from <wherever>". Television shows have used the term "live" to describe things that were filmed live and broadcasted later for decades.
I said nothing about being casted from replays, was simply clarifying the live talk. Don't insert words into my post.
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On February 24 2011 04:05 iNcontroL wrote:
Also santa doesn't exist.
/worldshattered
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On February 24 2011 04:10 ReachTheSky wrote:
Its an invitational. You shouldn't call it a league.
An invitational is a singular event where all of the spots are chosen by the organizers. After the event is over everything resets and any subsequent events follow a similar pattern.
That's not what the NASL is, so it's not an invitational. In a League there are fixed players (or teams) in multiple divisions and between seasons some players leave the league, others join the league and players occasionally move from team to team.
So between "invitational" and "league" the NASL certainly more closely resembles a league.
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On February 24 2011 03:26 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +What counts as a "team" for purposes of eligibility? If I decided I wanted to start a team and I was the only member would I be eligible? What if I convinced some friends to also list themselves as members? I've already defined what a team is multiple times. A team is a recognized entity that has player(s) playing under a single banner, has a website, and is able to support their player(s) financially. So yes, if you decided you wanted to start a team and you got your friends together in that team, you'd be eligible! Is everyone who is eligible to play going to be accepted? No.
So, does someone like DuckloadRa (WhiteRa) qualify to be a part of NASL? Or will he need to "get a team" as (I think) InControl said in the last State of the Game?
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Sponsors?: We're sponsored by pennies we picked up in the various ponds and fountains around the world. The money is there and ready to be given out to some amazing players!
I can only assume that Blizzard is backing this. No company would contribute $400,000 and not want their name plastered all over it. Blizzard already has its name on this game and it knows that growing western esports will grow Blizzard.
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On February 24 2011 04:19 OCsurfeR wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 04:10 ReachTheSky wrote:
Its an invitational. You shouldn't call it a league. An invitational is a singular event where all of the spots are chosen by the organizers. After the event is over everything resets and any subsequent events follow a similar pattern. That's not what the NASL is, so it's not an invitational. In a League there are fixed players (or teams) in multiple divisions and between seasons some players leave the league, others join the league and players occasionally move from team to team. So between "invitational" and "league" the NASL certainly more closely resembles a league.
Technically it is invitational for the first season and a league after that.
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On February 24 2011 04:23 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 03:26 Xeris wrote:What counts as a "team" for purposes of eligibility? If I decided I wanted to start a team and I was the only member would I be eligible? What if I convinced some friends to also list themselves as members? I've already defined what a team is multiple times. A team is a recognized entity that has player(s) playing under a single banner, has a website, and is able to support their player(s) financially. So yes, if you decided you wanted to start a team and you got your friends together in that team, you'd be eligible! Is everyone who is eligible to play going to be accepted? No. So, does someone like DuckloadRa (WhiteRa) qualify to be a part of NASL? Or will he need to "get a team" as (I think) InControl said in the last State of the Game?
White-Ra qualifies, as I said before. DuckLoad qualifies per our definition of what a team is.
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On February 24 2011 04:12 Z-R0E wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 04:02 ch33psh33p wrote:
Look, if you record something and then broadcast it later, its not live.
We can stop saying its live now. A recording of anything shown later IS NOT LIVE. You can record something live all your want, but do we call movies, tv shows, or anything of that sort live? NO! They were filmed live obviously, but they were broadcast at later dates. We can stop pointing out that it's casted live when people stop complaining that it's casted from replays. If you have a hang up with a day delay for post production, that's fine, I won't be able to change your mind on it. You can nitpick on the wording of "casted live", but letting people think it's being casted from replays is just false information. And because you brought up TV and such, how often have you seen a show that said "Filmed in front of a live studio audience", or a news cast playing a recording that says "live from <wherever>". Television shows have used the term "live" to describe things that were filmed live and broadcasted later for decades.
I'd love to pretend we live in a perfect world where we will never see them use a replay. Sadly we do not. Technical issues will occur and scheduling conflicts will arise that won't let a live game be "CAST LIVE!" for broadcast at a later date. With a tournament of this length and this many games it will happen and they will need to go to replays to remedy it.
We've already established that the people that want an actual "LIVE BROADCAST" aren't going to be happy watching VOD's at a scheduled time on a nightly basis and the rest don't care how you serve up the games on a nightly basis. I just rather have them stop this nuanced crap about "CAST LIVE!" and just go straight and just cast from replays and save themselves the time of having to schedule players to play on day X at Y time and focus 100% on casting and producing video features. You guys are going to need all the time you can get.
Players play the games on a daily/weekly basis and send the replays to officials. The only thing the NASL will have to worry about is getting the players for pre-game and post-game interviews.
I appreciate the responses and feedback in this thread because we wouldn't be bringing up issues/concerns if we didn't care and wanted this to be successful.
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I would suggest that you guys get only one person to answer (talk about NASL) all these things as you and Incontrol are contradicting each other.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On February 24 2011 04:06 ImHuko wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I'll respond to this in depth. This league's success is highly dependent on us being able to adhere to a broadcast schedule. We need to have stuff playing every night. What happens when we let a random guy who's not in a team into the league: what if he does poorly and drops out? What if he's late every week and delays our broadcast? This ruins the league.
Having players on teams adds accountability and responsibility. If a team contracts a player to uphold some degree of professionalism, there is a much higher chance that they'll do their job. We can't just "trust" that a player not on a team will do all these things. A team can fund the player's trip to the LAN final, and pay the entry fee.
You have to realize, avilo, that this is much more than about simply playing the game well. There are many other factors to consider; we are looking at all of them, and you're only looking at the game. Requiring teams is a way to make sure that we will be able to run smoothly and professionally for the duration of the event. If you're good enough to beat the players in this league, you should get picked up by a team, or qualify through the open ! I haven't read entire thread but that is quite possibly the most bullshit I have ever read. I hoped to read this Q&A and feel better about this, but after reading that I am feeling worse. It now feels even more like the "keep the rich richer" than before. Skip the bullshit, you want the more known players (even if they aren't the best), I can respect that, but just fucking say it, stop beating around the bush. Show nested quote ++ Show Spoiler +Koreans: We're not GSL. Bringing in all the Koreans will just make this event the GSL. We are focusing on the growth of Western ESPORTS, by providing players and storylines that are more relatable to our audience. That being said there is no CAP on the number of Koreans who are eligible to participate in this tournament. Lets face it, SC2 stories are "relatable to our audience" are upcoming SC2 players who aren't sponsored. I don't care about (just example from old thread) LzGamer, the guy whos been sponsored since SC:BW but hasn't done much in his SC2 career (maybe 1 win). I want to see Avilo (example) the guy who has been quitely placing well in every small tournament, beating pro/sponsored/famous players all the time, and aspiring to become a pro gamer with hard work and dedication. Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 04:10 ReachTheSky wrote:
Its an invitational. You shouldn't call it a league. Incontrol trolling in the thread of the "professional" league he is the face of. Professionalism at its finest.
On February 24 2011 04:06 ImHuko wrote:Show nested quote +I'll respond to this in depth. This league's success is highly dependent on us being able to adhere to a broadcast schedule. We need to have stuff playing every night. What happens when we let a random guy who's not in a team into the league: what if he does poorly and drops out? What if he's late every week and delays our broadcast? This ruins the league.
Having players on teams adds accountability and responsibility. If a team contracts a player to uphold some degree of professionalism, there is a much higher chance that they'll do their job. We can't just "trust" that a player not on a team will do all these things. A team can fund the player's trip to the LAN final, and pay the entry fee.
You have to realize, avilo, that this is much more than about simply playing the game well. There are many other factors to consider; we are looking at all of them, and you're only looking at the game. Requiring teams is a way to make sure that we will be able to run smoothly and professionally for the duration of the event. If you're good enough to beat the players in this league, you should get picked up by a team, or qualify through the open ! I haven't read entire thread but that is quite possibly the most bullshit I have ever read. I hoped to read this Q&A and feel better about this, but after reading that I am feeling worse. It now feels even more like the "keep the rich richer" than before. Skip the bullshit, you want the more known players (even if they aren't the best), I can respect that, but just fucking say it, stop beating around the bush. Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 04:10 ReachTheSky wrote:
Its an invitational. You shouldn't call it a league. Incontrol trolling in the thread of the "professional" league he is the face of. Professionalism at its finest.
Dear ImHuko (random gaming forum poster)
I just wanted to clarify,
When I said "santa doesn't exist" what I intended to convey was he is not a literal human being that exists within the confines of our understanding of santa. Is it feasible for a man to maintain a girth and old age but still fit in chimney stacks while delivering presents world wide on a specific date? Does such a labor denote extra-normal activity? I would urge you to consider that these are in fact fabrications of truth and are intended to explain a "magical" moment for children and those of dull intellect. Santa Claus may or may not be the name of a man that once existed but as far as modern science is concerned his special abilities seem far too unlikely to be considered reasonably true. This can also be said about the easter bunny.
That however does not take into account that Santa Claus can exist in our minds and hearts. Like the children, I imagine you were shocked to find I had so plainly dispelled what must have been a simple jack pleasure you indulged in. Knowing a fat bearded man delivered presents in red satin pajamas while breaking into your house was probably quite exciting. I apologize for dispelling that. I want to encourage you to consider that while he may not be a real human man he very well could be real in our hearts.
Please accept my sincerest apologies for lacking the professionalism to realize your hopes and dreams resided with the obese patron saint of contortionism.
Yours truly,
Geoff "iNcontroL" Robinson
Face of NASL
official spokesperson for all things serious and professional
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On February 24 2011 04:30 -Archangel- wrote:
I would suggest that you guys get only one person to answer (talk about NASL) all these things as you and Incontrol are contradicting each other.
I was not the person to contradict that point actually.
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Didn't anyone listen to the reasoning behind not broadcasting the games live last night on SoTG. Tyler said it, as a player not someone running the league, that its obvious that if you broadcast the games as they're being casted then everyone is tempted to just listen to the broadcast as they play. I don't know about you guys but i'd rather not watch games when one or both players know everything thats going on because they're listening. You can't compare it to the GSL because all the GSL games are played in the studio. You hear a lot of teams and players say that they can't commit to playing in the GSL because they can't afford to move to Korea and not be able to play in as many other tournaments, by the NASL games being online it doesn't create this problem. If you want to say that then all the players should have to move to LA you're not gonna get nearly as great of a lineup as you will this way.
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
On February 24 2011 04:05 iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 03:03 motioncity wrote:
i am extremely disappointed that this will not be live. that is part of the greatness of the GSL knowing that it is live and the x-factor that we can see live new strategies that have never been seen before. also the showmatch was great and all but it was very easy to tell that is was pre-recorded and if it had been any other two players in the world i probably would have not watched as the production value was not that great. i would much rather seen the loading screen with two players than know that im watching a replay. and i was planning on paying for the premium stream but knowing that it will not be live there is no way that i will pay to watch a stream of replays. kthxbye
edit: no high level quality of production will be worth the fact of it not being live. TSL Open's = not live TSL1-2 = Not live (not sure about 3 but, probably!) With stream cheating and us wanting to do production for the shows and cut the idle shit between matches you should know everything live SAVE FOR the actual broadcast = great Also santa doesn't exist.
TSL was a live cast of replays as are the TL Opens
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On February 24 2011 04:29 Hrrrrm wrote:
I'd love to pretend we live in a perfect world where we will never see them use a replay. Sadly we do not. Technical issues will occur and scheduling conflicts will arise that won't let a live game be "CAST LIVE!" for broadcast at a later date. With a tournament of this length and this many games it will happen and they will need to go to replays to remedy it.
We've already established that the people that want an actual "LIVE BROADCAST" aren't going to be happy watching VOD's at a scheduled time on a nightly basis and the rest don't care how you serve up the games on a nightly basis. I just rather have them stop this nuanced crap about "CAST LIVE!" and just go straight and just cast from replays and save themselves the time of having to schedule players to play on day X at Y time and focus 100% on casting and producing video features. You guys are going to need all the time you can get.
Players play the games on a daily/weekly basis and send the replays to officials. The only thing the NASL will have to worry about is getting the players for pre-game and post-game interviews.
I appreciate the responses and feedback in this thread because we wouldn't be bringing up issues/concerns if we didn't care and wanted this to be successful.
I don't know how you make the leap from NASL specifically saying they are not going to use replays to "there will be schedule conflicts, so just use replays and get over it." They're already established that players will be monetarily penalized for being late, so that should clear up most all scheduling conflicts. If a player is still unable to make it, I expect they would sooner postpone that game than to cast it off of replays. Suggesting that they're going to use replays if things get difficult is a direct contradiction to what they've said.
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I don't understand how any sane, logical thinking person would prefer a (possible) game between a european and a korean player with a north american caster over a perfectly running replay, regarding lags etc...
Thats just insane.
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On February 24 2011 04:41 Plexa wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 04:05 iNcontroL wrote:On February 24 2011 03:03 motioncity wrote:
i am extremely disappointed that this will not be live. that is part of the greatness of the GSL knowing that it is live and the x-factor that we can see live new strategies that have never been seen before. also the showmatch was great and all but it was very easy to tell that is was pre-recorded and if it had been any other two players in the world i probably would have not watched as the production value was not that great. i would much rather seen the loading screen with two players than know that im watching a replay. and i was planning on paying for the premium stream but knowing that it will not be live there is no way that i will pay to watch a stream of replays. kthxbye
edit: no high level quality of production will be worth the fact of it not being live. TSL Open's = not live TSL1-2 = Not live (not sure about 3 but, probably!) With stream cheating and us wanting to do production for the shows and cut the idle shit between matches you should know everything live SAVE FOR the actual broadcast = great Also santa doesn't exist. TSL was a live cast of replays as are the TL Opens
Also Justin.TV has a built in delay server, and the idle bullshit between the matches is the same as every sport. In baseball you have to wait for conferences at the mound, batters warming up, pitchers switching, etc. Same for every sport.
On February 24 2011 04:40 winnningwpie wrote:
Didn't anyone listen to the reasoning behind not broadcasting the games live last night on SoTG. Tyler said it, as a player not someone running the league, that its obvious that if you broadcast the games as they're being casted then everyone is tempted to just listen to the broadcast as they play. I don't know about you guys but i'd rather not watch games when one or both players know everything thats going on because they're listening. You can't compare it to the GSL because all the GSL games are played in the studio. You hear a lot of teams and players say that they can't commit to playing in the GSL because they can't afford to move to Korea and not be able to play in as many other tournaments, by the NASL games being online it doesn't create this problem. If you want to say that then all the players should have to move to LA you're not gonna get nearly as great of a lineup as you will this way.
Justin TV has a delay server so yea....
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EPT
