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Russian Federation4295 Posts
On August 01 2011 16:28 Dommk wrote:
This only works if you can see the Hellions coming before they get near the mineral line :/ Not to mention it is stupidly annoying to pull off if you are getting attacked at two places at once
What about burrowing drones? So terran will waste scan too and this rush will be more expensive.
So, 2 spines and burrowed helions will give you some time.
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This doesn't seem more effective than pulling your workers and splitting them in groups to me. The important thing is to keep away from the helions, but if you do this you'll have downtime where a majority of your workers aren't moving at all, so they'll still be able to get a lot of kills.
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United States33712 Posts
On November 27 2010 22:45 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
This is interesting, might become very useful in future games.
good call :o
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On August 01 2011 16:49 Existor wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2011 16:28 Dommk wrote:
This only works if you can see the Hellions coming before they get near the mineral line :/ Not to mention it is stupidly annoying to pull off if you are getting attacked at two places at once What about burrowing drones? So terran will waste scan too and this rush will be more expensive. So, 2 spines and burrowed helions will give you some time.
I rue the day burrowed hellions get introduced to the game.
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Russian Federation4295 Posts
This doesn't seem more effective than pulling your workers and splitting them in groups to me. The important thing is to keep away from the helions, but if you do this you'll have downtime where a majority of your workers aren't moving at all, so they'll still be able to get a lot of kills.
It is more effective, than running in a group and dying all from one splash atack (from 2 blue-helions).
Imo, need to try use burrow more.
I rue the day burrowed hellions get introduced to the game.
Underground wars!
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On August 01 2011 16:53 Waxangel wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2010 22:45 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
This is interesting, might become very useful in future games. good call :o
lol dw man this is just how people bump up their post numbers
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On August 01 2011 16:52 Itsmedudeman wrote:
This doesn't seem more effective than pulling your workers and splitting them in groups to me. The important thing is to keep away from the helions, but if you do this you'll have downtime where a majority of your workers aren't moving at all, so they'll still be able to get a lot of kills.
This takes a lot less precision and effort, so it's a superior method. Players could manually split, but what's the point when you can do this faster and use your own combat units to handle the hellions?
And regarding the idle downtime -- hellions will get almost no kills if they're only killing 1 at a time. The reason they're good is splash. In many situations, it's safe to separate all your workers and let hellions get 4 of them rather than run them in circles from the hellions and hope your opponent doesn't land a few good shots for 10 kills.
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I think manually splitting will be more effective because its faster if you're good at splitting which means you can get back to controlling units quicker
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People sure do have some stupid reasons for not liking this technique. Nobody ever said that this will save 100% of your workers. It's merely meant to limit them to 1-2 kills at a time. Given the cooldown of a Hellion's attack, that's going to buy you a TON of time to get your army in to clean them up.
Sure, if you just grab all of your workers and run away, you MIGHT get away with 0 casualties, but is it worth the risk? Especially when your opponent is just as good as you are and knows that you're gonna try to run them away? One thing I noticed a few of these Terrans do (and noted that a few of them COULD have done) was send a couple Hellions to the back to make them pull the workers and keep 2 in front to intercept them while they're lined up.
As for missing Macro time, they sacrifice more of that with Blink Micro, Marine Splitting, Baneling Micro (As easy as it is, you can't really stop at any point to do much else or you'll lose them all), and many more. This situation isn't any less important than the above. Games are lost on the worker line as often as on the battlefield.
I'm not faulting the players for not doing this every single time. Sometimes you just have too much going on (Defending a multi-pronged attack, for instance), but there were plenty of times when it was absolutely the best thing they could have done. Just imagine what Day[9] and djWheat's reactions would have been if this had occurred in even a single game that we saw.
I am of the opinion that this technique could single-handedly obsolete this mass Hellion build-of-the-week. Who would go for a Hellion-based opening when you aren't likely to get more than 2-3 worker kills with it (unless they didn't see it, but that goes back to Day[9]'s rant on "Hope based strategies").
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On August 01 2011 18:18 Sylvr wrote:
People sure do have some stupid reasons for not liking this technique. Nobody ever said that this will save 100% of your workers. It's merely meant to limit them to 1-2 kills at a time. Given the cooldown of a Hellion's attack, that's going to buy you a TON of time to get your army in to clean them up.
Sure, if you just grab all of your workers and run away, you MIGHT get away with 0 casualties, but is it worth the risk? Especially when your opponent is just as good as you are and knows that you're gonna try to run them away? One thing I noticed a few of these Terrans do (and noted that a few of them COULD have done) was send a couple Hellions to the back to make them pull the workers and keep 2 in front to intercept them while they're lined up.
As for missing Macro time, they sacrifice more of that with Blink Micro, Marine Splitting, Baneling Micro (As easy as it is, you can't really stop at any point to do much else or you'll lose them all), and many more. This situation isn't any less important than the above. Games are lost on the worker line as often as on the battlefield.
I'm not faulting the players for not doing this every single time. Sometimes you just have too much going on (Defending a multi-pronged attack, for instance), but there were plenty of times when it was absolutely the best thing they could have done. Just imagine what Day[9] and djWheat's reactions would have been if this had occurred in even a single game that we saw.
I am of the opinion that this technique could single-handedly obsolete this mass Hellion build-of-the-week. Who would go for a Hellion-based opening when you aren't likely to get more than 2-3 worker kills with it (unless they didn't see it, but that goes back to Day[9]'s rant on "Hope based strategies").
A well timed hellion harass will definitely kill more than 2-3 workers even if they split them just because of the movement speed, I think they will lose a lot of popularity at first and then suddenly make a bit of a comeback as players stop factoring hellion harass into their builds as much after it becomes less popular. Definitely don't see it becoming obsolete though.
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On August 01 2011 18:41 FeastOfThePoops wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2011 18:18 Sylvr wrote:
People sure do have some stupid reasons for not liking this technique. Nobody ever said that this will save 100% of your workers. It's merely meant to limit them to 1-2 kills at a time. Given the cooldown of a Hellion's attack, that's going to buy you a TON of time to get your army in to clean them up.
Sure, if you just grab all of your workers and run away, you MIGHT get away with 0 casualties, but is it worth the risk? Especially when your opponent is just as good as you are and knows that you're gonna try to run them away? One thing I noticed a few of these Terrans do (and noted that a few of them COULD have done) was send a couple Hellions to the back to make them pull the workers and keep 2 in front to intercept them while they're lined up.
As for missing Macro time, they sacrifice more of that with Blink Micro, Marine Splitting, Baneling Micro (As easy as it is, you can't really stop at any point to do much else or you'll lose them all), and many more. This situation isn't any less important than the above. Games are lost on the worker line as often as on the battlefield.
I'm not faulting the players for not doing this every single time. Sometimes you just have too much going on (Defending a multi-pronged attack, for instance), but there were plenty of times when it was absolutely the best thing they could have done. Just imagine what Day[9] and djWheat's reactions would have been if this had occurred in even a single game that we saw.
I am of the opinion that this technique could single-handedly obsolete this mass Hellion build-of-the-week. Who would go for a Hellion-based opening when you aren't likely to get more than 2-3 worker kills with it (unless they didn't see it, but that goes back to Day[9]'s rant on "Hope based strategies"). A well timed hellion harass will definitely kill more than 2-3 workers even if they split them just because of the movement speed, I think they will lose a lot of popularity at first and then suddenly make a bit of a comeback as players stop factoring hellion harass into their builds as much after it becomes less popular. Definitely don't see it becoming obsolete though.
Well, I may have exaggerated a little on that last part, but it definitely won't happen every single game anymore like GSL Season 3's 2-Rax all-in.
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EPT
