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Terran already has it easy to stop cheese because of how easy it is to just block your choke. It really isn't tough to get your choke blocked even by the time a 6 pool shows up and then 1 marine with a few scv's repairing stop it and gg. So really the way to stop a 6 pool with terran wasn't building a fast rax yourself anyway.
However, I do think that aside from the roach change, seems like to much of the patch/changes in this game are just to address cheese play. Sure it is frustrating and probably create the most QQ, but common. For the 1 time in what, 20 games+ I might see someone try to cheese rax before supply depot the rest of the time it doesn't matter. So I guess on the one hand it is meaningless because 90% of the time you are making your depot before rax anyway, but on the other I hate to see them continue to patch the game over and over because of cheese play. They did it last patch w/ the zealot time addition and reapers, now more reapers, etc. What is next, OL before pool? I always thought there was a balance with cheese on it's own. It could mean an easy win if it works but if it doesn't you are pretty much done. It is an all or nothing.
Also, should have been an engine bay to get reaper upgrade, not a factory.
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Oh man this patch sounds like pure gold. There is really no point I can´t understand but the supply depot before rax may be kinda over the top because it just cuts alot of options.
With the building hp buff and the medivac speed nerf marauder drops should become a bit easier to handle and also the roach range increase should help against all sort of kiting .) Can´t wait to try it.
Edit: The only thing that bothers me is the reaper speed upgrade. Like Nobody ever builds a reaper after he got a factory anyways, they may have been a problem in team games but with the supply before barracks change I think the upgrade nerf may be overkill. Nobody will ever build more then 1 scouting reaper and they had such an interessting concept.
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Ah wow that's a really big nerf for voids, now they suck pretty bad unless you catch them completely off guard AND charged off rocks too. I like the nexus buff though. Maybe I'll try switching to protoss to try out the macro play.
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On October 15 2010 03:36 bigjenk wrote:
I would like to see them make a second toss air unit viable in most games now, phoenixes were the only decent ones outside cheese already and carriers have a rough time against any sort of unit that can hit them cost and time wise unless it is a really drawn out game with low supply.
Will be interested to see if any terrans can get a working thor late game going against toss with no energy to feedback now in time for gsl.
Also the roach buff will completely make the early game much stronger for z.
seriously, i already thought early roach all ins were hard to deal with lol..
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Is the patch live?
I didn't get a download patcher when I tried to start the game.
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wait after GSL i predict a "Zerg is OP"-Thread flood.
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On October 15 2010 03:35 Achilles wrote:
Reaper is already making friends with the dark templar in the house of fail
What do you mean that ranged dt that you can get out faster than normal dts is amazing and it flies. Oh wait they gave it to terran...
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On October 15 2010 03:37 Yaotzin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 03:35 Sfydjklm wrote:On October 15 2010 03:34 Yaotzin wrote:On October 15 2010 03:30 Sfydjklm wrote:On October 15 2010 03:18 Yaotzin wrote:On October 15 2010 03:14 Sfydjklm wrote:
how nice how they fix all bugs except the one that affects zerg(ultra spash one) There's not an ultra bug? the fix for the planetary fortress splash bug accidentally nerfed ultra splash against regular units. Hm dunno about the accidentally bit. They had that bizarre mechanic of doing splash based on the centre of the unit they're hitting, which was just exposed when they could use it against PFs. Now they do what looks like a normal splash for, well, a cleave. Pretty sure that's not a mistake.. if it wasnt a mistake it would've been included in the patch notes. Nah you can't say that, Blizzard regularly put stealth changes in.
when
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Mostly good.
I don't agree with the depot before barracks AT ALL
The Void Ray nerf seems a little harsh 
The damage nerf isn't so bad
But the speed upgrade nerf isn't bad
Hopefully this doesn't make VR not a viable option. It's a nice alternative to collossus to kill everything.
I agree with every zerg buff, although I would have liked a tunneling speed increase for roaches instead. And a movement speed upgrade for hydras.
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1. VRs: it's close to where they should be, maybe a slight overnerf. I do think that the VR ought to get it's 7 range back now.
2. Reaper change is dumb. Reaper plays really aren't that hard to stop. Either the depot change or the nitro pack change would be fine, but not both.
3. Everything else fucking owns.
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questionable changes we'll have to see how the game plays out
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United States7166 Posts
On October 15 2010 03:38 Sfydjklm wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 03:37 Yaotzin wrote:On October 15 2010 03:35 Sfydjklm wrote:On October 15 2010 03:34 Yaotzin wrote:On October 15 2010 03:30 Sfydjklm wrote:On October 15 2010 03:18 Yaotzin wrote:On October 15 2010 03:14 Sfydjklm wrote:
how nice how they fix all bugs except the one that affects zerg(ultra spash one) There's not an ultra bug? the fix for the planetary fortress splash bug accidentally nerfed ultra splash against regular units. Hm dunno about the accidentally bit. They had that bizarre mechanic of doing splash based on the centre of the unit they're hitting, which was just exposed when they could use it against PFs. Now they do what looks like a normal splash for, well, a cleave. Pretty sure that's not a mistake.. if it wasnt a mistake it would've been included in the patch notes. Nah you can't say that, Blizzard regularly put stealth changes in. when
neural parasite's 12 second duration?
never ever once mentioned in any patch notes, nor any post from blizz afaik.
it was in that patch where they accidentally made a bunch of changes to the game that didnt get noted. then they had a patch soon after that reverted most/all of the chagnes except for neural parasite.
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I love this patch ^^. When will this be implemented?
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On October 15 2010 03:31 AyJay wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 03:25 Liquid`Jinro wrote:
Cant they just create some kind of defensive option against retarded 7 rax reaper cheese instead of making the unit useless? Like, give drones and probes back range so you can do moving shot vs them like you did vs bunker rushes in SC1.
But then Huk race would be op
yeaaaaaa 
its good to see blizzard actually doing something instead of small little changes but like most here I don't agree with a lot of it, and the reaper changes make them useless. Especially since zergs have been getting better and better defending against reapers anyways.
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On October 15 2010 03:38 Sfydjklm wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 03:37 Yaotzin wrote:On October 15 2010 03:35 Sfydjklm wrote:On October 15 2010 03:34 Yaotzin wrote:On October 15 2010 03:30 Sfydjklm wrote:On October 15 2010 03:18 Yaotzin wrote:On October 15 2010 03:14 Sfydjklm wrote:
how nice how they fix all bugs except the one that affects zerg(ultra spash one) There's not an ultra bug? the fix for the planetary fortress splash bug accidentally nerfed ultra splash against regular units. Hm dunno about the accidentally bit. They had that bizarre mechanic of doing splash based on the centre of the unit they're hitting, which was just exposed when they could use it against PFs. Now they do what looks like a normal splash for, well, a cleave. Pretty sure that's not a mistake.. if it wasnt a mistake it would've been included in the patch notes. Nah you can't say that, Blizzard regularly put stealth changes in. when
There's a whole thread on them for 1.1. Everything from some change to worker pathing so they die easier, to all those new icons.
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On October 15 2010 03:37 trotskyist wrote:
plus where is the logic for this terran nerf? all there stats show terran is losing over 50% of games vs toss. why the hell would they go and nerf terran? i am kinda bummed about it but .. im gonna switch to toss so i will get over it
The stats only show what's happening for bad players. Balance doesn't really matter in lower leagues.
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Supply before rax is... odd
Void ray will be interesting....
You're all forgetting that T still has hellions into cloaked banshees.
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On October 15 2010 03:38 bigjenk wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2010 03:35 Achilles wrote:
Reaper is already making friends with the dark templar in the house of fail What do you mean that ranged dt that you can get out faster than normal dts is amazing and it flies. Oh wait they gave it to terran...
Meant units that became useless due to overzealous developers. DT not being able to be made at temp archives makes them about as useless as reapers now that you have to research reaper speed @ factory stage.
But I agree about the banshee. Hate the cloak + gigantic dmg they do. Pick one blizz imo.
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On October 15 2010 03:39 ToxNub wrote:
1. VRs: it's close to where they should be, maybe a slight overnerf. I do think that the VR ought to get it's 7 range back now.
2. Reaper change is dumb. Reaper plays really aren't that hard to stop. Either the depot change or the nitro pack change would be fine, but not both.
3. Everything else fucking owns.
Really when was the last time you saw vr's outside a proxy cheese or unscouted in the main actually do something. They really have almost no use in the army.
Imo at current costs they should up the hp of them or nerf the damage a bit more but make them much cheaper and not so ungodly slow.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/bqF2q.png)
