EPTHowever, the game is already released and it might be too late for Blizzard to make such a drastic change, so they might just nerf individual units instead.
The Actual Issues Affecting Gameplay - Page 10
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thesauceishot
Canada333 Posts
However, the game is already released and it might be too late for Blizzard to make such a drastic change, so they might just nerf individual units instead. | ||
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Setanta
99 Posts
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Alexstrasas
302 Posts
On September 05 2010 08:52 kickinhead wrote: creep is chore to spread, but can be pushed back by the opponent in seconds... you can't base an offensive gameplan on that. creep has almost exclusively defensive usage. Really? Last time i checked if you control half of the map and that half is covered in creep your units will reach the middle of the map faster than your oponent units reinforcing pushes insanly fast | ||
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Onioncookie
Germany624 Posts
And then the enemy just kills it with a scan or an obs in seconds .... i always cry when i see that xD | ||
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
On September 05 2010 09:34 Alexstrasas wrote: Really? Last time i checked if you control half of the map and that half is covered in creep your units will reach the middle of the map faster than your oponent units reinforcing pushes insanly fast Your post didn't really disprove what he said. If you on creep you are good on creep. That isn't the problem. The problem is that you are inversely effected by creep. As in you are bad off it and need it to be good. Instead of being good off it | ||
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OHtRUe
United States283 Posts
On September 05 2010 08:41 Alexstrasas wrote: OP quotes bullshit No one said Zerg has to be agressive since the start, its a macro race, when the creep is spread out thats is when they should start thinking about doing big attacks. The rest of the post is just standard weak Zerg whine not worth adressing to as its been vastly discussed in other threads. Lol i main terran bro, i know its hard to believe but i understand the race i play is completely stupid. What the fuck is a macro race? All these new SC 2 kids dont know what they're talking about. Theres no such thing as a "macro" race. Macro is the producing of units and the maintaining of your base and economy. The whole problem was pretty much showed by your completely stupid post. Zerg cannot be aggressive unless they have a definite unit lead over the opponent with any unit that isn't a zergling and is forced to play completely defensively. Also again that is the most stupid statement ive ever seen I mean a macro race? Jesus christ......... I guess every single pro BW game the race they were playing was a macro race, these forums are getting dumber and dumber every day. Also of course its "whine" not constructive criticism. Oh everything that even says that Terran has problems is complete nonsense from a terribad player. I guess every single tourny result, all the ladder rankings, and all the pro's saying that Terran is broken is for nothing....... Also yes zerg is supposed to be the aggressive race. Theres a reason its called the swarm and that Terran ever since the release of vanilla Sc has been called a defensive race. | ||
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Smigi
United States328 Posts
It hits the EXACT problems of this game, None of this 'IMBA TERRAN OMFG THORS OWN ME". The Creep Mechanic explanation is absolutely on the target. Creep is not a bonus, but a necessity. It handicaps Zerg units. Zerg ground force, aside from the Speedling(which is so weak its sad), Is not at all the most mobile force in the game. With Stim, and Medics that are also Dropships, Terran BIO is by far the most mobile ground fource in the game. | ||
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OPSavioR
Sweden1465 Posts
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theshin2007
United States133 Posts
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mahnini
United States6862 Posts
On September 10 2010 05:06 theshin2007 wrote: Another thing that should be added is that if you accidentally click the hotkey icon on top of the unit info box, it adds that unit to the group. I wish there was a way to disable this so my production hotkeys dont end up with scvs in them throwing off my macro. god i hate that. spam right click and accidentally overwrite your hotkey and get all confused. i also used to do this with the side notifications but thankfully you can turn those off. | ||
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kiykiy
233 Posts
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0mar
United States567 Posts
On September 04 2010 06:10 ikester wrote: Who opens like that against any decent Protoss? If I had total vision of the Protoss while I was building and the ability to see into the future that might work but otherwise opening with that plan in mind is pretty unsafe unless you were rushing banshee, which also isn't a good idea against a decent protoss. Besides, tech lab does me no good in the example I was giving, which is against a void ray. wait what? Did you just ask "who the opens 1/1/1 against Protoss?" The 1/1/1 build is extremely powerful against all Protoss openings. It lets you expand fast, punish teching with either banshees or ravens, defends against fast void ray, allows for ridiculous harass options through blue flame hellion drops, or lets you macro MMM. It's one of the best openings in the game. Seriously, you need to either watch more games or play more because the 1/1/1 is a staple in TvP. | ||
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DARKHYDRA
United States303 Posts
On September 10 2010 05:32 kiykiy wrote: tl:dr, has anyone suggested a negative speed coefficient on other units on creep rather than a speed boost to zerg units. Wouldn't that solve most creep related problems? I think someone started a poll on the bnet forums about this before beta was released, basically the options were creep speeding up zerg units, slowing down non zerg units or healing zerg units on creep while not moving. I would've taken either of the two options over the current. Not that it matters now but I think a more interesting creep mechanic would be to have creep be nuetral early game and just required for building, then once you reach lair you get to pick one out of 3 upgrades that permanently alter the creep for the rest of the game. | ||
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mangina
United States230 Posts
On September 02 2010 01:02 OHtRUe wrote: The Power of the Marauder Honestly I think the marauders are an awesome unit and amazing to play with (terran main) but i can admit that they are overpowered in the early game and in certain aspects. First off marauders give free map control for the whole early game and forces protoss to go tier 2 instantly which eliminates FE play for Toss while letting Terran doing anything they want. The second problem is there upgrades which makes marauders into super heroes. Concussive shells disallows any micro from the opponent and punishes skirmishes and harassment. Stim and marauders is just ridiculous in how fast marauders can kill anything armored, how fast they become (lol synergy), and how little drawbacks are there from using it. I'm not gonna even get into marauder drops which are completely stupid (again im a terran main) To fix the marauder you have to look at the problems with bio upgrades. I'm gonna steal an idea from Gretorp (check out balance suggestions from Xeris's thread from MLG Raleigh) which is to combine Combat shield into a marine and marauder health upgrade while nerfing marauders starting hp to 100. This is to promote distinctive bio upgrades while punishing Stim timing pushes and makes marauders easier to handle in the early game. As well as this concussive shells and combat shield are now unlocked from the academy. Buildings also shouldn't be armored btw~ Something else I want to add on about the Marauders is their DPS. They do bonus +20dmg to plus armor units with 6 range. That was like a dragoon. When I first saw Marauders being introduced when they showed Starcraft 2. I said "wow... terran have dragoons now" and I was right. Their 1.5 attack speed and +20 dmg does the same DPS as zealots do, to stalkers. Stalkers only do +14, much less than the damage that dragoons used to do. Another reason why, no... two... i mean THREE reasons why you cant micro any stalkers against a group of marauders is that the marauders hit is going to hit the stalker and the concussive shell is going to slow it down. If you add in stim there, its over for the protoss army. The only way to stop this in the current game, is getting well placed force fields with sentries. | ||
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SovSov
United States755 Posts
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TRAP[yoo]
Hungary6026 Posts
but honestly i dont know how the big maps work with the new mechanics you got. | ||
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Bibdy
United States3481 Posts
Zealots + Sentries beat pure Marauder, pure Marine or Marine + Marauder and even with Stim. Terran units aren't particularly tough so their numbers dwindle rapidly when unable to kite and faced with a wall of Zealots slicing and dicing. Protoss don't have to go Tier 2 in order to beat them, but we do have to go Tier 2 in order to figure out what you're doing because of that wall. Neither side can really risk rampaging up each other's ramp without losing a bunch of stuff and putting themselves at jeopardy (Crap Station not withstanding). It can be said that the wide-open spaces in front of naturals give Terrans an advantage in expansion, because you can't really circumvent a couple of Bunkers in front of an expansion, but you can really capitalize on the Sentry+Zealot combo's difficulty in preventing them from kiting with so much open space. HOWEVER, its my belief that its EMP, followed by Psi Storm that truly breaks the whole bio vs Gateway battle. Stims + EMP is both too much upfront damage capability AND breaking the back of Protoss' ability to stop the bio ball kiting, unlocked too quickly for Terran and leads to tons and tons of quick, easy wins when Protoss is absolutely forced to gain some macro or harassment advantage in order to combat it. If Protoss can hold off long enough to get Psi Storm + Khaydarin Amulet, the pendulum completely swings the other way. EMPs get thrown out, the Protoss retreats to a nearby Pylon, summons more HTs and obliterates the bio-ball with the fastest-acting, most cost-effective damage spell ever seen in an RTS. The combined gas cost of the Terran bio ball is absurdly low allowing Ghosts to be fielded without any kind of significant investment. 100 gas for Stim? 50 for the Ghost Academy? 150 for the Ghost? That's a pittance compared to what the Protoss spends in gas just to combat pure Marine+Marauder, let alone MMG. It's no surprise to me you always see bio-balls running around with 1/1, 2/2 or even 3/3, fighting Gateway armies sitting on 0/0/0 for 20 minutes. They've got so much surplus gas they don't know what to do with it, and don't even have to bother getting double-Refineries on their first expansion for a long-ass time. So you get tons of these games where Terran just shows up with Stim + EMP and wipes the the floor with the guy. And an equal number of games where he plays more passively, gives the Protoss ample opportunity to get Psi Storm and then gets his ass kicked. If that turns out to be a 50:50 win rate for each side, is that balance? Of course this isn't counting games where Terrans try things like Banshee rushes, slow Mech-based pushes and so-on, but when the Terran opens with Ghosts I've yet to see a single game that didn't end on the flip of the 'how aggressive is the Terran?' coin. | ||
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Kal_rA
United States2925 Posts
i like it.. i think it adds an interesting dynamic IF used effectively.. especially at high levels.. | ||
mrd33ds
Djibouti30 Posts
Creep is messed up right? with ur opponent just being able to detect it and bam there goes everything. What if the creep were invulnerable to detectors except for around mineral nodes? As in every base has a circle the size of the scanner tower to where ur opponent can detect the creep tumors. Sounds like a good idea to me. What u guys think? | ||
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Ascendant13
66 Posts
For example, if the Terran makes a bunch of marauders and you don't have the right unit mix to fight them, you'll die. But the marauders can escape or do ok even if you DO have the right mix. If he gets banshess (vs toss) the toss really needs an observer and a stargate to properly fight them (stalkers aren't super against banshees actually). Which is two tech paths that you might not otherwise get. Because even if they aren't cloaked, they are still very good. I mean if a toss goes DTs and the enemy has good detection, it is a bust, since DTs die so fast. But banshees and enemy has detection? No worries, they are still awesome. Terrans access all their units far too easily, can switch production too easily, and have excellent counters. On the other hand their opponent has to go out of his way to counter one thing, and the counter unit (phoenix, colosssus) is suddenly largely useless do to instant terran tech switch. | ||
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