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On July 01 2012 14:35 Duravi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 14:34 iky43210 wrote:
employee gave you a hard time, you ask for the manager. if manager gave you a hard time, you ask for their company representatives. If nothing work, don't support them.
I thought this was a fairly basic concept and that's what made services great for so many companies. Its better to let the higher up knows their bottom is screwing up than to ignore them completely. Apparently in esports you have to have a grievance that the higher powers deem legitimate before you are allowed to follow the natural hierarchy.
and what made you say that? I think most have tried to talk to the teams or the player themselves.
Though tbh I don't think those teams have any powers at all. Most of them are so close and niche that they might as well be a single entity with the employee.
Do you think complaining to root will affect destiny at all given that he practically started the team? or sirscoots? In cases where they have tried (like the above posters), I think its legitimate allowed to contact the next higher representatives
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Without Day9 or Artosis on the show this show is falling apart! ;( Sad to see actually..been watching State of the Game for so long now 
I did like the TvZ discussion with QXC and Idra though! Keep that shit up! 
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On July 01 2012 14:36 brinker wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 14:23 IdrA wrote:On July 01 2012 14:11 Duravi wrote:On July 01 2012 14:09 Ireniicus wrote:
I contacted SirScoots to the affect I would not watch the latest EG mastercup because of the last SOTG antics. As you can imagine he was unrepentant advised I should just unfollow all EG, which is a shame as I quite like listening to the guy on Lo3 .
So I think the message is clear. If it didn't bother you carry on and enjoy the shows if it did best let EG know that you will not be supporting them at this time as its clear their management team see nothing wrong whatsoever with EGIdra or EGIncontrols actions of late.
SirScoots @ "Underreaction, you should unfollow all things EG, myself included if they upset you so much." If you are really unhappy, contact the sponsors. That appears to be the only thing that actually gets things done. As long as you contact sponsors when you see some good things too I don't believe there is anything wrong with it. the thing that gets things done is having a legitimate complaint Agreed. You gave Avilo his chance that he didn't deserve, and he repeatedly yelled over you and restated the exact same thing over and over again. If you only read the conversation instead of actually listening to it, please go listen to it. Nothing to do or see here anymore. Would be awesome to see an Avilo vs. IdrA series in the NA WCS.. I wonder how that would go.
we did listen, but avilo is not the only offender here. If you think Avilo was the only one interrupting, you may have your fan goggle too tight
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On July 01 2012 14:37 iky43210 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 14:35 Duravi wrote:On July 01 2012 14:34 iky43210 wrote:
employee gave you a hard time, you ask for the manager. if manager gave you a hard time, you ask for their company representatives. If nothing work, don't support them.
I thought this was a fairly basic concept and that's what made services great for so many companies. Its better to let the higher up knows their bottom is screwing up than to ignore them completely. Apparently in esports you have to have a grievance that the higher powers deem legitimate before you are allowed to follow the natural hierarchy. and what made you say that? I think most have tried to talk to the teams or the player themselves. Though tbh I don't think those teams have any powers at all. Most of them are so close and niche that they might as well be a single entity with the employee. Do you think complaining to root will affect destiny at all given that he practically started the team? or sirscoots? In cases where they have tried (like the above posters), I think its legitimate allowed to contact the next higher representatives
I'm not sure what you are trying to say because my point was basically agreeing with your statement. As far as Idra goes, he is right that people gripe about a lot of stupid shit, but its not up to him, or EG, to decide what is a legitimate complaint and what is not, that is everyone's personal decision.
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On July 01 2012 14:37 Cloud9157 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 14:32 walklightwhat wrote:On July 01 2012 14:29 Cloud9157 wrote:On July 01 2012 14:23 IdrA wrote:On July 01 2012 14:11 Duravi wrote:On July 01 2012 14:09 Ireniicus wrote:
I contacted SirScoots to the affect I would not watch the latest EG mastercup because of the last SOTG antics. As you can imagine he was unrepentant advised I should just unfollow all EG, which is a shame as I quite like listening to the guy on Lo3 .
So I think the message is clear. If it didn't bother you carry on and enjoy the shows if it did best let EG know that you will not be supporting them at this time as its clear their management team see nothing wrong whatsoever with EGIdra or EGIncontrols actions of late.
SirScoots @ "Underreaction, you should unfollow all things EG, myself included if they upset you so much." If you are really unhappy, contact the sponsors. That appears to be the only thing that actually gets things done. As long as you contact sponsors when you see some good things too I don't believe there is anything wrong with it. the thing that gets things done is having a legitimate complaint Your ignorance/arrogance at its prime. Demanding action because, at worst, two people acted like assholes is ignorance and arrogance actually. At best a professional athlete would be spoken to behind closed doors and made to understand they screwed up. The ridiculous overreaction and hypersensitivity of this community doesn't apply to the rest of the world. So if EG management talks to him in private about this as a result of them demanding action, its still ignorance/arrogance? Don't know if I would use words like hypersensitivity when he is infamously known for having such a high-horse mentality.
I don't consider a private talk to be what most people seem to want. So, yeah.
I have no idea what you are trying to say with second sentence.
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On July 01 2012 14:40 Duravi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 14:37 iky43210 wrote:On July 01 2012 14:35 Duravi wrote:On July 01 2012 14:34 iky43210 wrote:
employee gave you a hard time, you ask for the manager. if manager gave you a hard time, you ask for their company representatives. If nothing work, don't support them.
I thought this was a fairly basic concept and that's what made services great for so many companies. Its better to let the higher up knows their bottom is screwing up than to ignore them completely. Apparently in esports you have to have a grievance that the higher powers deem legitimate before you are allowed to follow the natural hierarchy. and what made you say that? I think most have tried to talk to the teams or the player themselves. Though tbh I don't think those teams have any powers at all. Most of them are so close and niche that they might as well be a single entity with the employee. Do you think complaining to root will affect destiny at all given that he practically started the team? or sirscoots? In cases where they have tried (like the above posters), I think its legitimate allowed to contact the next higher representatives I'm not sure what you are trying to say because my point was basically agreeing with your statement. As far as Idra goes, he is right that people gripe about a lot of stupid shit, but its not up to him, or EG, to decide what is a legitimate complaint and what is not, that is everyone's personal decision.
sorry, I got the wrong impression from your post.
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On July 01 2012 14:32 walklightwhat wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 14:29 Cloud9157 wrote:On July 01 2012 14:23 IdrA wrote:On July 01 2012 14:11 Duravi wrote:On July 01 2012 14:09 Ireniicus wrote:
I contacted SirScoots to the affect I would not watch the latest EG mastercup because of the last SOTG antics. As you can imagine he was unrepentant advised I should just unfollow all EG, which is a shame as I quite like listening to the guy on Lo3 .
So I think the message is clear. If it didn't bother you carry on and enjoy the shows if it did best let EG know that you will not be supporting them at this time as its clear their management team see nothing wrong whatsoever with EGIdra or EGIncontrols actions of late.
SirScoots @ "Underreaction, you should unfollow all things EG, myself included if they upset you so much." If you are really unhappy, contact the sponsors. That appears to be the only thing that actually gets things done. As long as you contact sponsors when you see some good things too I don't believe there is anything wrong with it. the thing that gets things done is having a legitimate complaint Your ignorance/arrogance at its prime. Demanding action because, at worst, two people acted like assholes is ignorance and arrogance actually. At best a professional athlete would be spoken to behind closed doors and made to understand they screwed up. The ridiculous overreaction and hypersensitivity of this community doesn't apply to the rest of the world.
You obviously don't keep up with sports, because it does apply to the rest of the sports world. I enjoy reading the posts about the "hypersensitivity" or "overreactions" of the Starcraft community when in reality it happens in EVERY sport. Drama sells, and whatever sells gets a lot of exposure. A lot of the fastest growing and largest threads on this site are about these types of stories. I doubt you'll find a sports website without some personal story that has nothing to do with sports, especially ESPN.
SirScoots obviously needs to learn to either ignore people or have a company line. Telling fans to no longer support the team because they differ in opinion during one scenario is pretty stupid.
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Alright,
Can we put this shit in perspective please?
Following a great debate with QXC, InControl joked that the debate lacked the drama and the conflict that a debate with Avilo would have. Everyone in the broadcast knew that this would be a bad idea.
JP and InControl, in a lapse of judgement, invited him on as a larf.
After 5 minutes of Avilo rehashing the same points that QXC did, but worse, IdrA became frustrated. Avilo then started putting words in IdrA's mouth, and IdrA decided to disengage from the discussion, realizing he was way too pissed off to continue.
This 'controversial' segment of SOTG lasted little more than five to ten minutes in an otherwise standard episode.
The only real fault here is JP and InControl inviting a guest on for a stupid reason (let's see if we can get IdrA to rage!) than a good reason (Avilo actually having something original to contribute).
Does anyone else remember the dark ages when they replaced InControl with ... ugggghhhh ... Leah Jackson?
Or when a drunk Kennigit berated InControl for complaining about post formatting on the forums?
Or when InControl tortured a stunned ex-pornstar with bad double-entendres and shitty questions while his 'co-hosts' sat there half-conscious for what felt like HOURS?
Seriously, I just rewatched the entire episode for the QXC/IdrA debate, and the Avilo segment was just a tiny blip of anti-entertainment -- which, if you've been following SOTG since the beginning, isn't exactly extraordinary.
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On July 01 2012 14:43 LeaD wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 14:32 walklightwhat wrote:On July 01 2012 14:29 Cloud9157 wrote:On July 01 2012 14:23 IdrA wrote:On July 01 2012 14:11 Duravi wrote:On July 01 2012 14:09 Ireniicus wrote:
I contacted SirScoots to the affect I would not watch the latest EG mastercup because of the last SOTG antics. As you can imagine he was unrepentant advised I should just unfollow all EG, which is a shame as I quite like listening to the guy on Lo3 .
So I think the message is clear. If it didn't bother you carry on and enjoy the shows if it did best let EG know that you will not be supporting them at this time as its clear their management team see nothing wrong whatsoever with EGIdra or EGIncontrols actions of late.
SirScoots @ "Underreaction, you should unfollow all things EG, myself included if they upset you so much." If you are really unhappy, contact the sponsors. That appears to be the only thing that actually gets things done. As long as you contact sponsors when you see some good things too I don't believe there is anything wrong with it. the thing that gets things done is having a legitimate complaint Your ignorance/arrogance at its prime. Demanding action because, at worst, two people acted like assholes is ignorance and arrogance actually. At best a professional athlete would be spoken to behind closed doors and made to understand they screwed up. The ridiculous overreaction and hypersensitivity of this community doesn't apply to the rest of the world. You obviously don't keep up with sports, because it does apply to the rest of the sports world. I enjoy reading the posts about the "hypersensitivity" or "overreactions" of the Starcraft community when in reality it happens in EVERY sport. Drama sells, and whatever sells gets a lot of exposure. A lot of the fastest growing and largest threads on this site are about these types of stories. I doubt you'll find a sports website without some personal story that has nothing to do with sports, especially ESPN. SirScoots obviously needs to learn to either ignore people or have a company line. Telling fans to no longer support the team because they differ in opinion during one scenario is pretty stupid.
I do keep up with other sports. The most recent example that comes to mind was Amare Stoudamire getting a slap on the wirst (in a relative sense) for using a homophobic slur. I didn't see any fans refusing to support the Knicks or demanding he be removed because of it. So, no, overreaction and hyper sensitivity are the perfect words.
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On July 01 2012 14:35 Duravi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 14:34 iky43210 wrote:
employee gave you a hard time, you ask for the manager. if manager gave you a hard time, you ask for their company representatives. If nothing work, don't support them.
I thought this was a fairly basic concept and that's what made services great for so many companies. Its better to let the higher up knows their bottom is screwing up than to ignore them completely. Apparently in esports you have to have a grievance that the higher powers deem legitimate before you are allowed to follow the natural hierarchy.
You can follow that hierarchy; you just have to know that those people will likely give even less of a shit about something like "some dude said something mean to some other lesser known dude on some show at one point in a way that had no influence on me personally or financially and when I told his boss he treated my complaint with the level of seriousness something of this nature would typically get."
As you've seen, people aren't mocking that hierarchy but rather the idea that something so trivial could be seen as worth a second of someone's time.
"moooooom! Brother called me a poopyhead!"
Yes dear. I'll deal with it.
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Day9 takes vacation and the entire Starcraft community falls apart!
We need you Sean Plott!!
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On July 01 2012 14:46 walklightwhat wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 14:43 LeaD wrote:On July 01 2012 14:32 walklightwhat wrote:On July 01 2012 14:29 Cloud9157 wrote:On July 01 2012 14:23 IdrA wrote:On July 01 2012 14:11 Duravi wrote:On July 01 2012 14:09 Ireniicus wrote:
I contacted SirScoots to the affect I would not watch the latest EG mastercup because of the last SOTG antics. As you can imagine he was unrepentant advised I should just unfollow all EG, which is a shame as I quite like listening to the guy on Lo3 .
So I think the message is clear. If it didn't bother you carry on and enjoy the shows if it did best let EG know that you will not be supporting them at this time as its clear their management team see nothing wrong whatsoever with EGIdra or EGIncontrols actions of late.
SirScoots @ "Underreaction, you should unfollow all things EG, myself included if they upset you so much." If you are really unhappy, contact the sponsors. That appears to be the only thing that actually gets things done. As long as you contact sponsors when you see some good things too I don't believe there is anything wrong with it. the thing that gets things done is having a legitimate complaint Your ignorance/arrogance at its prime. Demanding action because, at worst, two people acted like assholes is ignorance and arrogance actually. At best a professional athlete would be spoken to behind closed doors and made to understand they screwed up. The ridiculous overreaction and hypersensitivity of this community doesn't apply to the rest of the world. You obviously don't keep up with sports, because it does apply to the rest of the sports world. I enjoy reading the posts about the "hypersensitivity" or "overreactions" of the Starcraft community when in reality it happens in EVERY sport. Drama sells, and whatever sells gets a lot of exposure. A lot of the fastest growing and largest threads on this site are about these types of stories. I doubt you'll find a sports website without some personal story that has nothing to do with sports, especially ESPN. SirScoots obviously needs to learn to either ignore people or have a company line. Telling fans to no longer support the team because they differ in opinion during one scenario is pretty stupid. I do keep up with other sports. The most recent example that comes to mind was Amare Stoudamire getting a slap on the wirst (in a relative sense) for using a homophobic slur. I didn't see any fans refusing to support the Knicks or demanding he be removed because of it. So, no, overreaction and hyper sensitivity are the perfect words.
You`re kidding me right? There's plenty of people that want Amare out because he's an idiot. Just because that story is larger and not centered in one location does not mean there weren't people raging out what he did or thinking like you do, that that it was an overreaction. Have you ever heard any New York radio shows? Yeah, I'm sure you keep up with sports.
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On July 01 2012 14:47 Aakoz wrote:
Day9 takes vacation and the entire Starcraft community falls apart!
We need you Sean Plott!!
To be honest other then the day 9 dailies I haven't seen much of him. He hasn't been at the last 2 mlg's iirc, he hasn't been on state of the game all year (I might be wrong of course). Kind of sucks I miss when day9 was on state of the game alot and I hope he starts going to mlg's again as I love his commentary :p
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On July 01 2012 14:47 Prophanity wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 14:35 Duravi wrote:On July 01 2012 14:34 iky43210 wrote:
employee gave you a hard time, you ask for the manager. if manager gave you a hard time, you ask for their company representatives. If nothing work, don't support them.
I thought this was a fairly basic concept and that's what made services great for so many companies. Its better to let the higher up knows their bottom is screwing up than to ignore them completely. Apparently in esports you have to have a grievance that the higher powers deem legitimate before you are allowed to follow the natural hierarchy. You can follow that hierarchy; you just have to know that those people will likely give even less of a shit about something like "some dude said something mean to some other lesser known dude on some show at one point in a way that had no influence on me personally or financially and when I told his boss he treated my complaint with the level of seriousness something of this nature would typically get." As you've seen, people aren't mocking that hierarchy but rather the idea that something so trivial could be seen as worth a second of someone's time. "moooooom! Brother called me a poopyhead!" Yes dear. I'll deal with it.
I highly doubt any competent organization will "give even less shit" about bullying in any of their department. Whether someone is "lesser known dudes" has nothing to do with it. I have recieved complaints about my support teams, even if they seem trivial or irrelevant, in my company but I always treat them seriously and personally reply to them.
And your family analogy is inapplicable in this scenario. It would actually be more akin to a complete stranger telling your mom instead of your brother.
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On July 01 2012 14:50 LeaD wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 14:46 walklightwhat wrote:On July 01 2012 14:43 LeaD wrote:On July 01 2012 14:32 walklightwhat wrote:On July 01 2012 14:29 Cloud9157 wrote:On July 01 2012 14:23 IdrA wrote:On July 01 2012 14:11 Duravi wrote:On July 01 2012 14:09 Ireniicus wrote:
I contacted SirScoots to the affect I would not watch the latest EG mastercup because of the last SOTG antics. As you can imagine he was unrepentant advised I should just unfollow all EG, which is a shame as I quite like listening to the guy on Lo3 .
So I think the message is clear. If it didn't bother you carry on and enjoy the shows if it did best let EG know that you will not be supporting them at this time as its clear their management team see nothing wrong whatsoever with EGIdra or EGIncontrols actions of late.
SirScoots @ "Underreaction, you should unfollow all things EG, myself included if they upset you so much." If you are really unhappy, contact the sponsors. That appears to be the only thing that actually gets things done. As long as you contact sponsors when you see some good things too I don't believe there is anything wrong with it. the thing that gets things done is having a legitimate complaint Your ignorance/arrogance at its prime. Demanding action because, at worst, two people acted like assholes is ignorance and arrogance actually. At best a professional athlete would be spoken to behind closed doors and made to understand they screwed up. The ridiculous overreaction and hypersensitivity of this community doesn't apply to the rest of the world. You obviously don't keep up with sports, because it does apply to the rest of the sports world. I enjoy reading the posts about the "hypersensitivity" or "overreactions" of the Starcraft community when in reality it happens in EVERY sport. Drama sells, and whatever sells gets a lot of exposure. A lot of the fastest growing and largest threads on this site are about these types of stories. I doubt you'll find a sports website without some personal story that has nothing to do with sports, especially ESPN. SirScoots obviously needs to learn to either ignore people or have a company line. Telling fans to no longer support the team because they differ in opinion during one scenario is pretty stupid. I do keep up with other sports. The most recent example that comes to mind was Amare Stoudamire getting a slap on the wirst (in a relative sense) for using a homophobic slur. I didn't see any fans refusing to support the Knicks or demanding he be removed because of it. So, no, overreaction and hyper sensitivity are the perfect words. You`re kidding me right? There's plenty of people that want Amare out because he's an idiot. Just because that story is larger and not centered in one location does not mean there weren't people raging out what he did or thinking like you do, that that it was an overreaction. Have you ever heard any New York radio shows? Yeah, I'm sure you keep up with sports.
I don't waste my time with radio shows. They are filled with morons.
If that's the standard people are willing to hold themselves to, then I know how much attention I need to pay to the community from here out.
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On July 01 2012 07:54 monkybone wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 07:51 Talack wrote:On July 01 2012 07:48 monkybone wrote:On July 01 2012 07:37 Shiori wrote:On July 01 2012 07:33 monkybone wrote:On July 01 2012 06:30 Neelia wrote:On July 01 2012 05:04 SMD wrote:On July 01 2012 04:07 kafkaesque wrote:On July 01 2012 03:58 Mellowman wrote:
I still find it pretty hilarious that Idra is better than MKP That underlines my point perfectly. There is no way any one could be so delusional to call MKP a "terrible player who doesn't know shit about Starcraft" and be serious about it. IdrA has to maintain recognition to support himself and since tournament results have ceased to be an option for him, he at least has to keep up his image. idra calling MKP bad, could be see as silly, but its same as forum poster x calling incontrol bad. edit: just using an example, I <3 me some incontrol, he just gets way too much hate No it's not, one of the two has decent results over the past 2 years and one has none since MLG Dallas. Should not be hard to figure out who is who. It's one thing to dislike the play style of someone for whatever reasons but calling someone who has put up consistent results bad is cringeworthy. I think Idra quite literally thinks that MKP is a bad player and wins because of luck due to his random builds, and not because of skill. It's really weird to listen to, and even if this is the true opinion of Idra, he should tone his criticism down because such a nonsensical stance puts him in a bad light. If this is actually what Idra thinks, he needs to look up the definition of random luck. I think MKP wins because of his mechanics, and that his decisions are actually pretty questionable in a lot of cases. If that's what Idra means, I agree. The difference is that idra labels him a bad player that gets undeserved wins, something which I doubt you would agree with. MKP wins because he's unpredictable and is capable of pulling wins out of situations that he shouldn't have due to his macro/micro and multitasking and sheer aggression. Idra has a gameplan for every game and if anything out of the ordinary happens then he falls apart. It's tragic to watch. Did the exact same thing in BW, complained about people "not playing the game the way they're supposed to" Arguably he's right when it comes to Zerg. Players like DRG really shows that standard play can be sufficient for anything. But terran and protoss don't have these liberties, playing standard (predictable) puts them way behind, especially vs Zerg.
Agreed 100%, terran/protoss can't play standard vs zerg. Zerg can play standard vs anything and still win very convincingly.
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As a long time fan of SotG and all the cast of the show, I can say that I am a little disappointed at how the most recent show was handled. I think that bringing a person onto the show when you know full well that there is animosity between him and one of the cast members is not only inappropriate, but also a little bit stupid. It may be funny at the time, but to people who are inherently passive and don't particularly like confrontation it could seem cruel.
That being said...
There is really no reason to go to management and/or sponsors to solve this "issue". While it was wrong to incite the debate between IdrA and Avilo, no real harm was done to either person's reputation, in my humble opinion.
Anywho, I hope that those who are not searching for drama can forgive and forget as long as this does not become a common occurrence on the show. As always, I am eagerly awaiting the next episode!
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On July 01 2012 14:09 Ireniicus wrote:
I contacted SirScoots to the affect I would not watch the latest EG mastercup because of the last SOTG antics. As you can imagine he was unrepentant advised I should just unfollow all EG, which is a shame as I quite like listening to the guy on Lo3 .
So I think the message is clear. If it didn't bother you carry on and enjoy the shows if it did best let EG know that you will not be supporting them at this time as its clear their management team see nothing wrong whatsoever with EGIdra or EGIncontrols actions of late.
SirScoots @ "Underreaction, you should unfollow all things EG, myself included if they upset you so much."
AHAHAHAH if this is real, SirScoots is a fucking BOSS, and has earned my respect for life.
Edit: I love you <3
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The EG guys are right that people are grasping at straws and complaining about a pretty insignificant event in an otherwise good epsiode of the show. However, geoff and greg, there is a sense among a lot of regular listeners that sotg is becoming more of a drama-filled elitist boys club. Challenging the hosts with legitimate opinions on tl or reddit results in a series of insults and e-bullying on the next episode that turns some people off. I don't mind it because I listen to the show to hear your personalities and be entertained and definitely not for in-depth balance or strategy discussion.
That said, you all are bright and I'm sure you are self aware, but you shouldn't treat guests like shit and be dismissive of resulting opinions about your behavior and then feign incredulity when people drum up a shitstorm over it. Many of us feel that you do a fine job with the show, but some of this stuff really isn't going to help grow your business.
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JP admitted it was a bad idea to bring Avilo on and won't make the same mistake again. Asking for more than that is kind of weird, imo.
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EPT
