A friend of mine was playing around the editor and here's what he came up with regarding the Stalker range bug. It's kind of impracticalsometimes useful for a real game (edit: TL proves me wrong), and it's kind of funny.
While playing in the map editor, I ran into this blink range issue so set up a custom map to test it out. There are gaps of widths varying from 6 to 16 units. Neutral pylons show the gap widths (They're 2x2).
Stalker blink is supposed to have a range of 8, which just clears a gap of 6, as the stalkers have some width between their fronts and backs. This can be seen by blinking down the 6 unit road strip at the far left. The largest gap that stalkers successfully blink is 14 units across, an effective range of nearly 16 (double what it should be).
Stalkers only seem to exceed their normal range if there is a gap of invalid terrain between the start and end points, such as the pits in the test map or the gap to island expansions. If it's just two high ground regions separated by low ground, they seem to just end up on the low ground. They still require vision to jump these distances; observers are in place for the larger gaps.
For testing purposes, the research requirement was removed for blink. No other part of the ability was changed.
Wow. You're right about it being impractical now, yet I can see this being abused a lot in custom maps (assuming it goes un-fixed/was intended to be this way).
is this the same bug that nony used to blink over the rocks when he didnt have vision past them? i assume he blinked "onto" the rocks and the bug placed the stalkers past them because they couldnt land there.
nony dident use a bug, if you walk a unit up close to the rocks you get vision on the other side. its probably because rocks dont block vision or something
On May 03 2010 15:32 skuj wrote: is this the same bug that nony used to blink over the rocks when he didnt have vision past them? i assume he blinked "onto" the rocks and the bug placed the stalkers past them because they couldnt land there.
im pretty sure thats an issue of either A) seeing a bit of the terrain past the rocks, or B) if you bunch up like 8 stalkers and blink them against a breakable item, it will push one thru.
What this OP is about seems to be that if you have vision, you can leap a gap. So in theory, yes, island on Desert Oasis could be jumped if you had an obs there.. someone should try it.
I'm sure this isn't a bug but a design implement. It just makes stalkers become a threat to island expansions. Not letting them blink as far on normal ground is probably designed so they don't become too mobile in large land battles.
I knew something was wrong when people discovered the blinking across bases on LT.
I think this is the same problem as the mass recall on the mothership back then, where you could recall units to the closest land if your mothership was over unaccessible terrain.
I've assumed this is intentional but I have been unhappy in the inconsistency in the maps. All positions should be equal with respect to blinkability but they are not
On May 03 2010 15:21 Bill Murray wrote: keep it imo stalkers already suck dont they?
I think they are pretty amazing and I rarely use blink.
I dont`t really like the fact that you can blink from base to base or to island expos even though I play Protoss. I would assume it`s a bug but it would probably be long fixed if it was.
Isn't this expected behaviour? When you blink a stalker onto invalid terrain, it will find the nearest valid spot from there. That effectively almost doubles the distance over invalid terrain. You could of course make the blink not happen, but...
I'm wondering how it will react with gaps of various shape. Will it also move to the side is that's closer? Someone is going to make some 'stepping stones' island map that will allow stalkers to reach the other side in 2 mins.
The same bug as with the mothership recall. If you recall while not above ground units get teleported to the nearest possible location. Both of these are definitely bugs, I don't want stalkers blinking through bases on LT either.
I'm just taking a wild guess here; this might be because the stalker blinks to 8 range (which is over halfway) then it doesn't know where to be, so it finds the nearest available spot which is on the other side of that gap. What happens if you for instance have it like this: + Show Spoiler +
Where x is the stalker, and the gap is 14 range with available terrain on both side.
Yeah, maybe it should say "Invalid location" instead of warping you on the other edge. However, the other is that the blink is used anyway, this should not happen if you select an invalid location.
I don't know if this was fixed at one point, but the mothership recall had the same bug/feature. If you recalled to some illegitimate terrain, the units would end up in a nearby place, like in an enemy base right between the turrets that should hold the mothership at bay. ^^
i think it has smthing to do with the range of the blink, like antimage's blink in DotA, the range might be 1200 but if you click more than 1200(like 1500) it will only blink 1000 range
ow right its true!! in lost temple there is a scene in the clip BananaCraft where they made stalkers blink from one base to another! in the 2:45 mark!!!
On May 03 2010 15:28 Randominity wrote: Places in current maps this applies:
Lost Temple: Blink to the 2 island expos, and also blinking from base to base (when the 2 bases are close via air)
It should be clarified that the gold expos can bling to the islands, and from there you can also blink to the tankable ridge above the nats. Main base blinking can be largely prevented by building depots/pylons in your base.
Also, it should be noted that blink can be queue'd, so a cool trick is to bunch up a group of stalkers, tell them to move to the corner, shift-click blink to the opposite corner, and then shift-move away from that corner. That way, all hte stalkers will blink through one at a time and then get out of the way.
Pretty sure this is expected behavior like Aseq says. If a stalker can blink beyond halfway it will find the nearest valid spot to land. It's most likely intentional and even if it's not I would consider it a bug that improves the game.
On May 04 2010 00:23 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: Pretty sure this is expected behavior like Aseq says. If a stalker can blink beyond halfway it will find the nearest valid spot to land. It's most likely intentional and even if it's not I would consider it a bug that improves the game.
This also happens with the mothership. It will recall units across a gap, and the units will be teleported outside it's range, and outside the initial selected area size.
So blinking and recall work in two steps: 1. attempt to translocate the unit at the desired location, up to maximum range. 2. translocate the unit to the closest available free spot around the desired location.
This is why the stalker and recalled units can pass large gaps. Also, this means that a blinking stalker may be blinked further AWAY from the intended location in the opposite direction, if his current position is overcrowded and the player has vision only further back.
I definitely agree that this makes the game better, but like Nony says, it should be universal in a map, ie. if one main is blinkable, the others should be as well.
On May 03 2010 22:18 Shouryu wrote: I'm just taking a wild guess here; this might be because the stalker blinks to 8 range (which is over halfway) then it doesn't know where to be, so it finds the nearest available spot which is on the other side of that gap. What happens if you for instance have it like this: + Show Spoiler +
Where x is the stalker, and the gap is 14 range with available terrain on both side.
That's actually very plausible. It would certainly explain the almost double range of the blink. Instead of having it return to the original location, it blinks to the closest valid position from the limit of its blink range.
I'd imagine the reasoning behind this was so that you don't waste blinks and at least would end up somewhere further instead of wasting the blink in the same spot.
A quick fix would be to only allow the ability to be casted within a range that is shown, like infestors, HT, ghosts, etc.
Blinking into the back of a person's base is like using a nydus worm, except it doesn't give the defending player the opportunity to kill the worm before the stalkers appear. Maybe a little balancing, but I think that it is a great extension of the stalker's utility.
On May 04 2010 04:05 Homicide13 wrote: Blinking into the back of a person's base is like using a nydus worm, except it doesn't give the defending player the opportunity to kill the worm before the stalkers appear. Maybe a little balancing, but I think that it is a great extension of the stalker's utility.
The enemy needs vision, which for protoss means they have either an air unit, collosus on the ledge, or observer or a unit already present in your base to offer vision. They can't just make a stalker and have it pop up in your base.
At around that time in the game, zerg can overlord drop and the terran has medivacs.
PS: exceptions for blistering sands and other maps with destructable rocks
What is it with toss and having ridiculous teleporting glitches. The mothership could recall from the middle of nowhere onto the nearest land. And stalkers can blink INTO your base and there is basically nothing that can be done to stop it. Kinda gay IMO
On May 04 2010 03:26 CowGoMoo wrote: Old news! Cool find though, but I doubt this is intentional.
awwww. don't tell Blizzard tho 'kay? ;]
I think this probably works the same way recall works though. I personally think it will improve the game rather than hurt it. It makes for turtling island expos to be easier to break, while it wouldn't really allow for abuse by blinking into mains.
On May 04 2010 00:23 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: Pretty sure this is expected behavior like Aseq says. If a stalker can blink beyond halfway it will find the nearest valid spot to land. It's most likely intentional and even if it's not I would consider it a bug that improves the game.
you only say that because you are a protoss user T_T as a t user this is stupidly imba ! ! ! ! dear blizzard: pls fix blink
On May 04 2010 08:36 guitarizt wrote: OT but how else would toss destroy a T island expo guarded by turrets and vikings without blink on a map like lt?
This, this is a bug but one they should keep imo, you can block the blink points by building at the likely places too, anything that stops the lead stalker moving out of the way will also stop stalkers coming in behind it. (think reaper defence)
Other than carriers, protoss doesn't really have many anti-island possibilities, wtb +1 void ray range upgrade...
Blinking a huge army with this probably won't work very well, even with smartblinking. In those cases, the distance should be pretty tight, "walling off" the blinkable area (i.e. adding a layer of supply depots) might work. Also, if you deny vision, you'll be fine too.
If this is a bug, it is one of those that they should keep (much unlike the mothership recall thing).
Old news technically, but intended I believe. Tis fair, works the same as a drop would, but you need sight instead, so you can't just get out of there and back in instantly. Balanced imo.
Another way for mappers to stop this might be making some walkable low ground, but 2 cliffs high (cliff jumpers can't traverse two at once iirc) So the blink would end up on the low ground and the cliffjumpers would be unable to get there at all. True island
Now someone just needs to clean up the distances on the official maps and we're golden.
EPT
![[image loading]](http://img526.yfrog.com/img526/622/51757283.png)
