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Right now the only use we see of reapers in high level play is a 10 rax early 1-2 reaper opening. After that, they almost never get made again. They have a tiny niche role - early harass, and then nothing else.
They don't fill the harassment role of any-time, because hellions, banshees, and hell, even vikings do that, all while not being useless in your main army. I guess Reapers kill buildings better, but to do that effectively you need 5-8 reapers, and most players just aren't going to make that investment.
I really don't know what can be done to fix reapers, it just seems as a unit design they will always be limited. Unless you eliminate their early harass potential to turn them into a better mid-game unit. Or you give them mines they can lay so that making reapers is still useful throughout the game 
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When you attack from the front with your main force you send the reapers around and ruin their workers
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Maybe if they gave them an upgradeable health boost like marine combat shield they could be usable later as anti-light and building harasssment...
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If they're using Marines, Zealots, Lings and Hydras, Reapers can be pretty epic.
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Are you kidding? You obviously dont play very many high level gamers Im guessing. Lots of terrans will have a group or 2-4 somewhere close to your mineral line so when u or him attack and are focusing somewhere else your workers will die. They are great harassment units.
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On April 30 2010 06:48 GUN.gun wrote:
When you attack from the front with your main force you send the reapers around and ruin their workers
at that point in the game its far cheaper and more combat effective just to use a medivac filled with marauders, and you can actually use those marauders to support your main army if need be.
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They are fast, mobile and fragile. Perfect for hit and run tactics. I predict reapers will have some strategic role in the future -other than early game harrass- when the gameplay and strategy evolve.
Atleast, for the sake of innovation, they will receive some love.
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On April 30 2010 06:50 sob3k wrote:Show nested quote +On April 30 2010 06:48 GUN.gun wrote:
When you attack from the front with your main force you send the reapers around and ruin their workers at that point in the game its far cheaper and more combat effective just to use a medivac filled with marauders, and you can actually use those marauders to support your main army if need be.
I agree, personally I'd prefer stim marines vs workers and only use marauders if I'm planning on killing tech.
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I think reapers just havent been used enough in the beta. Im a zerg player, so im not really sure how expensive or viable it is to build like maybe 6-8 reapers on the side; but I could see a harass being very effective when your main army is attacking your opponents army. The damage they deal to buildings is amazing, and the ability to jump up cliffs even without vision is also very useful. Have you tried using them in this way yet? I dont think ive seen a VOD of this yet, so maybe it's not viable. Either way, 1 reaper is probably an incredibly useful scout.
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On April 30 2010 06:50 sob3k wrote:Show nested quote +On April 30 2010 06:48 GUN.gun wrote:
When you attack from the front with your main force you send the reapers around and ruin their workers at that point in the game its far cheaper and more combat effective just to use a medivac filled with marauders, and you can actually use those marauders to support your main army if need be.
True, But reapers ARE fairly cheap, and if you get reapers early and they don't die, you can always save them.. Maybe that's what he's talking about.
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Reapers are building harassers/snipers, and serve a few secondary functions.
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TossFloss
Canada606 Posts
I have been using them for early game scout. For 50minerals/50gas you get a unit that can penetrate the enemy base and poke around.
So for example PvT once the stalker warps in, you can't send a unit up his ramp. You can opt for a scanner sweep, but you the opportunity cost of not getting the MULE is 270 minerals. A lone reaper will provide valuable information: Is he going early robo? stargate? 3 gates? some DT cheese?
Additionally, once he knows you have a reaper threat, P will want to keep at least one stalker in his base. So you spend 50/50 to lock-down a 125/25 unit, thus dampening P's early aggression. Afterwards, you can plant the reaper on ledges, near watch towers, use it to destroy destructible rocks and use it to scout for secret expos.
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With the damage bonus they have, and the mobility, i really do feels that reapers can and should be used in mid-late game harass. Not as a stand alone play, but as a support play while you barrel down his front. (make him choose where to spend his APM, microing his main army, or his workers)
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maybe they should remove them and make marines have a researchable jumppack upgrade
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their role is to cheese toss cause tvp is hard 
oh and they are fun to mass in ffas.
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On April 30 2010 06:55 Pablols wrote:
maybe they should remove them and make marines have a researchable jumppack upgrade
Oh heavens no.
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Blizzard needs to remove the attack that does bonus damage to buildings, and give Reapers an actual utility spell, like the spidermine-like charges that they used to have in the Alpha version. It's the lack of actual utility that harms Reapers, and Terran units are known for having good utility spells to offset their lack of speed or power.
But I guess every game needs its Firebat.
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On April 30 2010 06:50 TheComeback wrote:
Are you kidding? You obviously dont play very many high level gamers Im guessing. Lots of terrans will have a group or 2-4 somewhere close to your mineral line so when u or him attack and are focusing somewhere else your workers will die. They are great harassment units.
Show me some high-level games where this is used as a standard?
2-4 reapers also means you didn't build 2-4 marauders, which could have an impact on that front-line battle, while 2-4 reapers are repelled by like 1 stalker.
I saw I think qxc use hellion/reaper against a Zerg who went hydras once, but I've really not seen any other reaper as a army unit play.
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On April 30 2010 06:50 Zeke50100 wrote:
If they're using Marines, Zealots, Lings and Hydras, Reapers can be pretty epic.
How are they better against those than Hellions? Which only cost minerals and can be pumped via reactors?
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I hate reapers. Not because they give me grief, but they just force you to get such an early Gateway and Cybernetics Core. I'd like fast expand to be viable and kind of risky, but not suicide to a common build.
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On April 30 2010 07:00 PanzerDragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On April 30 2010 06:50 Zeke50100 wrote:
If they're using Marines, Zealots, Lings and Hydras, Reapers can be pretty epic. How are they better against those than Hellions? Which only cost minerals and can be pumped via reactors?
because you already have the required buildings to pump out reapers en masse (assuming you are going bio build) and most factories would be better served with a tech lab for tanks or thor. Also, i think reapers are far more mobile.
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Keep in mind I'm not saying they are underpowered. I'm saying they are similar to Ultras in their role is already fulfilled by better, more versatile units.
Are reapers really that much better harassers than Hellions past the very early game? And they just have no utility past the 10 rax that other things don't already do (a medivac with 8 stimmed marines is a way better harass than the reapers, for example)
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On April 30 2010 07:05 nTooMuch wrote:Show nested quote +On April 30 2010 07:00 PanzerDragoon wrote:On April 30 2010 06:50 Zeke50100 wrote:
If they're using Marines, Zealots, Lings and Hydras, Reapers can be pretty epic. How are they better against those than Hellions? Which only cost minerals and can be pumped via reactors? because you already have the required buildings to pump out reapers en masse (assuming you are going bio build) and most factories would be better served with a tech lab for tanks or thor. Also, i think reapers are far more mobile.
If you are pumping reapers over marauders against P or T or over marines against Z you will probably lose.
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Reapers fill the cheese role for terran. That's it. They're a dumb unit and honestly should be removed from the game or redesigned (bring back old school d8 charges plz)
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I don't think that Reapers should be a unit that's built from the barracks.
Since Reapers are strictly a harass unit, Reapers should be an upgrade to the marines. You should have to upgrade the Reaper jet pack from the tech lab, so you just select some marines to upgrade to Reapers.
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
On April 30 2010 07:39 leeznon wrote:
I don't think that Reapers should be a unit that's built from the barracks.
Since Reapers are strictly a harass unit, Reapers should be an upgrade to the marines. You should have to upgrade the Reaper jet pack from the tech lab, so you just select some marines to upgrade to Reapers.
Oh, you mean like how a zerg unit morphs into something else? That's totally the style of terran.
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On April 30 2010 07:00 PanzerDragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On April 30 2010 06:50 Zeke50100 wrote:
If they're using Marines, Zealots, Lings and Hydras, Reapers can be pretty epic. How are they better against those than Hellions? Which only cost minerals and can be pumped via reactors?
Reapers outdamage Hellions by a crapload, and much more easily microed. It really depends on whether or not you have a Fac.
Also, Hydras are VERY commonly used. Marauders are always used, but only because everybody thinks the Reaper sucks. If people knew, Reapers would be used against heavy Hydra armies.
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Well, how I build for Terran, I always start with reaper attack. It's not really a rush but quick into the game i can get a small squad that either ends the game or does some huge damage.
Mediafire Upload:
http://www.mediafire.com/?1j0ydgwqj44
That's a replay of a quick game i just played. After watching the replay i DO realize that the guy wasn't very good and that he didn't even start mining until about 10 seconds into the game but i assume he went afk for a sec. Either way, I do what happens in the replay everygame and it always has an impact whether it's against experienced players or nubs. After this i transition into my main build but ill save that for another forum. This is how in my opinion reapers should be used. They can one shot workers in a small squad like that, and they're very easy to kite with when you research nitro.
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I think reapers are Terran's ability to annoy early game. Zerg have Zerglings and Protoss have chrono-boosted Zealots.
Also Reapers are good for drawing attention away from somewhere else, such as a choke.
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-> 3, 4 Reapers you store for backstabbing won't do much damage if there are just 2 Stalkers or a cannon
-> Zerg should know what's up close to his base du to overlords plus he always has a queen
-> Didn't see it in TvT either, maybe because it's so gas heavy.
Games are way to clumsy with lot of basecamping to play reapers well imo. Actually it's more useful to go for marauder drop in most cases exept für early reaper harassment ofc although players did noticed that already and play stable counter builds.
I think the Reaper is an example for an overly specialized unit. It's way cooler to do such things with less specialized units plus those don't have to worry to be useless in combat.
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In my opinion, Reapers should be able to Stim. The ability should only increase movespeed and increase pistol attack speed-stimmed D-8s would obviously be horrifically imbalanced.
I think this combined with nitro packs would make them possibly effective in stand-up fights against melee/short range units whilst also adding in some really fun micro.
That, or just increase them to 10 damage per shot base; that way they'd be capable of putting out some serious DPS while remaining glass cannons that are easily killed. Plus, it'd be another alternative to help Terrans deal with Immortals.
Thoughts? Anything that makes them more viable later on is needed. One marauder or stalker on a cliff means GG for your reaper harass.
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i think mines being researched, and cost like 100-100 could make reapers like vulture, would be awesome an army with reapers flanking an putting mines (maybe just 1 per unit), they are fragile but could be devastating researchin speed and mines in late game!
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The problem is their role crosses over with the Hellion.
A fast harass unit that kills light?!
I'd rather spend 100 minerals and have an aoe attack, than 50 minerals and 50 precious gas.
I think that the terrain jump ability should be removed BUT they should higher HP and do a lot of high base damage to light and immortals, giving them a sensible role in the Terran ground army.
Oh and as for scouting... we need non OC scan back, that's a must imo.
Information for Terran in SC2 is too hard to come by.
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On April 30 2010 08:00 No_eL wrote:
i think mines being researched, and cost like 100-100 could make reapers like vulture, would be awesome an army with reapers flanking an putting mines (maybe just 1 per unit), they are fragile but could be devastating researchin speed and mines in late game!
As much as I love spider mines, I think we need to avoid bringing them back.
If Blizzard is trying to change the SC2 meta away from the SC1 meta mines are a huge thing that really needs to go. They are quintessential SC1.
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The purpose of the reaper is to be annoying and kill workers/tech buildings.
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I actually won a few games thanks to reapers.
(Im not talking about mass reapers, im talking about 1-2-3 reapers)
I recently hat a TvT where the opponent tank pushed (scoutet - saw i had no starport and went fast siege) I went Bio.
As i saw him moving out I put the marauders I had outside of my base and sent 1 reaper I had built out of a hunch towards his base. I timed my flank with the reaper reaching his base. So his 2nd reinforcement tank and more units were on the way to his front line.
I barely killed the push but meanwhile I could pick off like 2-3 SCVs for free. (he was microing his push/reinforcements). I then switched to the reaper getting 2 more kills and he gged.
For a unit that costs 50/50 plus is in your tech anyways if you go Bio its a quite useful unit IMO.
Nobody says you have to mass them..
/edit: I use to queue the reaper with shift (move move and then attack at the right spot) then watch it on the minimap and time the attack to cause the most stress for the opponent. Works wonders - works even with drops into the mineral lines. Its a good way to multitask when you really gotta have all your attention on one spot (because it might be game-deciding)
snace
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On April 30 2010 07:49 lubu42 wrote:
he didn't even start mining until about 10 seconds into the game
I don't think using a game that has that in the description should really be used to emphasize the power of reapers.
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The problem with any Reaper buff is it makes an already controversial early game rush more powerful. Early Reapers are hard to deal with, especially for Toss. I'm not willing to say they are in need of some buff yet but I would keep them on my "watch" list.
If the only use for a Reaper is 2-4 early game harassment I think the unit needs to be redone, but I don't think we can safely say that is the only use yet.
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Reapers should be buildable in reactors so that they don't clog up valuable barracks production time.
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Reapers should come out later (require Ebay for example) but become much stronger.
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On April 30 2010 08:03 Wr3k wrote:
The purpose of the reaper is to be annoying and kill workers/tech buildings.
But they aren't really better at the worker thing than a marine drop or hellions, and the tech building snipe requires you building 4-5 reapers instead of 4-5 marauders.
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remove hellions, give reapers the flamethrower, and bring back vultures with spidermines.
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Step 1: Make reapers require some kind of early tech like Engineering Bay or something. This allows blizzard to balance them around a 4-5 minute rush and not a 3 minute rush, so they can have a faster build time, more useful abilities etc.
Step 2: Give them a real role. Right now they are a fast moving unit that kills workers well. They share this with Bio in a Dropship, Hellions and Banshees right now, and all of those are more viable late game units in an actual fight. I personally like the idea of making them semi-casters, with something like a spider mine style deployable that doesn't move or blow up but gives you a short (2-3 range) vision or maybe an activated snare (and remove the snare from marauders or something).
Step 3: Profit. Balance the unit so that it has real uses in the late game and you have something that doesn't force players to go a certain tech but is still a viable part of the terran army.
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EPT
