|
|
On October 29 2013 22:48 Steveling wrote:Messi is the best and no one comes close to his quality so it's normal he should get his 5th consecutive ballon. Show nested quote +On October 29 2013 20:50 Pandemona wrote:
Plus this record of 43 appearances and 42 goals in the champions league for Ronaldo is fkn stupid xD.
You really think cristiano who's 28 years old has only played in 43 cl games? xD You may wanna check your stats. Messi leads in every possible stat category by far.
That stat is of Ronaldo's time at Madrid.
|
Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Yeah i was just using Real Madrid stat which i find more incredible. The one record he has over Messi is his champions league scoring record xD
|
On October 29 2013 18:01 WillyWanker wrote:Ribery is maybe the 5th or 6th best player in Bayern that's why. And of course I'm biased, but probably less than you 
How can the best player in the Bundesliga be the 5th or 6th best player on Bayern?
|
|
|
I think it's good that the player who's won the most trophies usually gets the award.
Btw don't get Alex Ferguson's autobiography unless you're a diehard Man Utd fan. The writing is as bad as you would expect from a sports autobiography, and all of the "shocking revelations" are in the news already. I was surprised how limited he thought Van Nistelrooy was, I remembered him as bit more than just a pure poacher. Besides that everything is as expected, Ferguson makes it a point to leave everyone's reputation in tact except the ones he has already publicly criticized. One thing though is the way he thought Mancini didn't understand how to prepare his players to defend a title and thought that his job was finished after the first one.
|
I lol'd at Gerd Müller's ratio. Exactly what I expected. That man...
|
On October 29 2013 23:10 zulu_nation8 wrote:
I think it's good that the player who's won the most trophies usually gets the award.
Btw don't get Alex Ferguson's autobiography unless you're a diehard Man Utd fan. The writing is as bad as you would expect from a sports autobiography, and all of the "shocking revelations" are in the news already. I was surprised how limited he thought Van Nistelrooy was, I remembered him as bit more than just a pure poacher. Besides that everything is as expected, Ferguson makes it a point to leave everyone's reputation in tact except the ones he has already publicly criticized. One thing though is the way he thought Mancini didn't understand how to prepare his players to defend a title and thought that his job was finished after the first one.
Van Nisterooij never scored a goal outside of the penalty box during his united time, but his goals inside the box came from every angle imaginable. So while he was definitely a poacher, I personally feel he was a special one. Give him an inch and he scored.
On October 29 2013 23:15 Holgerius wrote:
I lol'd at Gerd Müller's ratio. Exactly what I expected. That man...
Hahaha indeed, couldn't have been more perfect.
|
Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Yeah but the record for Ronaldo is he has so many goals in a row. Hasn't failed to not score in champions league game in a while xD
On October 29 2013 23:15 Ysellian wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2013 23:10 zulu_nation8 wrote:
I think it's good that the player who's won the most trophies usually gets the award.
Btw don't get Alex Ferguson's autobiography unless you're a diehard Man Utd fan. The writing is as bad as you would expect from a sports autobiography, and all of the "shocking revelations" are in the news already. I was surprised how limited he thought Van Nistelrooy was, I remembered him as bit more than just a pure poacher. Besides that everything is as expected, Ferguson makes it a point to leave everyone's reputation in tact except the ones he has already publicly criticized. One thing though is the way he thought Mancini didn't understand how to prepare his players to defend a title and thought that his job was finished after the first one. Van Nisterooij never scored a goal outside of the penalty box during his united time, but his goals inside the box came from every angle imaginable. So while he was definitely a poacher, I personally feel he was a special one. Give him an inch and he scored. Show nested quote +On October 29 2013 23:15 Holgerius wrote:
I lol'd at Gerd Müller's ratio. Exactly what I expected. That man... Hahaha indeed, couldn't have been more perfect.
DEM PENALTIES!!!
First guy to my knowledge who would put a penalty into the SIDE NETTING every time. Fucking amazing penalties xD
|
Ferguson said something like Van Nistelrooy only cared about his scoring record and nothing else, and he couldn't do anything but score scrappy goals, although consistently, and also he could only play up front alone because of his ego and lack of desire to work with a partner. The latter part is not surprising I guess but I thought RVN was a team player, he never struck me as overly selfish.
|
I think comparing Messi/CR/Ribery by numbers will not work. It´s kinda like the NBA superstar conspiracy theory with them (for those not familiar with basketball, it basically says that the "stars" like Lebron or Kobe Bryant are stars because they look good at TV and are marketable, that every average NBA player can make 30 points a game if the system is working mainly for him).
I personally prefer Messi over Ronaldo because i think he is better at the "i make my team mates better" department. Its the same with Ribery he was really good 4 or 5 years ago but what was bringing him to the highest level last season was that he stoped looking for 1v1 and was more of a team player. He defended, received the first passes of an attack and moved more without the ball to create space for his team mates.
Just look at the way Dani Alves was defended in the classico and the CL semi finals. Ribery played second left CB 180 minutes were CR or Bale were just not interested (or not able to?).
So Ronaldo may be the "completest" player he is also the most "limited" in my opinion.
|
What if C.Ronaldo had stayed at Manchester United? He'd probably have been producing stats at the same rate as he has been at RM, MU would probably have won the last 4 championships (making it 7 in a row), the Premier League would probably be considered the most entertaining league by far (less of a debate between La Liga and PL since a lot of the fun in La Liga is the fact you have the two best players in the world head-to-head). It would be harder to compare stats between Messi and Ronaldo - Barcelona would rape La Liga while Premier League would be perceived as more competitive, even despite MU's total annihilation of the league in the last 7 years. He'd be the king of the most popular league in the world, with legendary status at the most popular club in the world. This would be his 11th season at MU. He'd have broken Alan Shearer's record as top goalscorer in the PL by now.
IMO he'd have a greater chance at winning more PoY awards than he does now.
|
Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
He won't leave Real Madrid now which is the problem, i would much preferred him to have left with Mourinho and gone to Yanited or Chelsea <3 lalalal XD
But he wont now, he wants to get all the Real Madrid records which is fair enough, it is the biggest club in the world so you can't blame him.
I wish they would win their 10th champions league though just to cement the club as the best. This year might be their year too ^_^
Won't have to worry about the league soon as Barca running away with it already, will be able to concentrate on it. Ronaldo in stupid form 7 goals in 3 games!!! Then if Bale turns good over the next few months (getting fit mainly) then they will be such a force if they could learn to defend.
To put it bluntly id much rather face Barca over 2 legs than Real ^_^
|
I actually feel that if Madrid doesn't win La Liga or CL this year, shitstorm will hit and Ronaldo will go back to the Premier.
Although Florentino López changed the Madrid laws so only a very few can become president, so if he continues I can see him throwing enough money at CR to make him stay I guess.
|
Something that these simple stats don't show is how "bad" of a shooter cristiano really is.
Well, comparing to messi.
Last year iirc he had like 100 more shots than messi but he scored less.
Messi needs typically 3-4 shots to get one in, while cristiano needs to waste 6-7.
|
On October 29 2013 23:01 city42 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2013 18:01 WillyWanker wrote:Ribery is maybe the 5th or 6th best player in Bayern that's why. And of course I'm biased, but probably less than you How can the best player in the Bundesliga be the 5th or 6th best player on Bayern?
Well maybe people saying that Ribery is the best Bundesliga player are stupid 
Standards nowadays say that an offensive player is better than a defensive one just because scoring goals is fancier than stopping one.
Schweinsteiger, Lahm, Müller, Alaba, Neuer, Kroos (and even Robben if he was more regular) are all better than Ribery but he's the one that will shine in this team because he's the one finishing the attempts... I never liked him but I have to say that he has been very impressive last season (and this one too)... just not more impressive than his teammates that I listed.
|
On October 30 2013 00:24 WillyWanker wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2013 23:01 city42 wrote:On October 29 2013 18:01 WillyWanker wrote:Ribery is maybe the 5th or 6th best player in Bayern that's why. And of course I'm biased, but probably less than you How can the best player in the Bundesliga be the 5th or 6th best player on Bayern? Well maybe people saying that Ribery is the best Bundesliga player are stupid Standards nowadays say that an offensive player is better than a defensive one just because scoring goals is fancier than stopping one. Schweinsteiger, Lahm, Müller, Alaba, Neuer, Kroos (and even Robben if he was more regular) are all better than Ribery but he's the one that will shine in this team because he's the one finishing the attempts... I never liked him but I have to say that he has been very impressive last season (and this one too)... just not more impressive than his teammates that I listed.
He is the best Bundesliga player because he is DEFENDING like crazy. Ribery always had these offensive capabilities, but since Heynkes he's learned to give everything to his team by defending.
Please watch more Bayern matches before you make statements like these (Neuer better than Ribery hahahaha)
|
Netherlands13554 Posts
Ribery is horribly overrated in my opinion. He isn't top 10 in the world, let alone top 3 or best.
Trophies count a lot in these things, but I agree with WillyWanker that there's a bunch of players on Bayern alone that are better than Ribery. I definitely agree on Schweinsteiger, Lahm, Robben, Müller being better than Ribery.
Off the top of my head players not from Bayern who impress me way more than Ribery does (IMO!!): Messi, Ronaldo, Özil, Ibrahimovic, Busquets, Reus, van Persie, Aguero, Falcao, Yaya Touré, Suarez, Bale (@Tottenham). If I'd think a bit harder I could probably name a few more.
Being a huge Messi fan I'd like seeing him win again but I'll be fine with anyone but Ribery.
|
On October 30 2013 00:35 sharkie wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On October 30 2013 00:24 WillyWanker wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2013 23:01 city42 wrote:On October 29 2013 18:01 WillyWanker wrote:Ribery is maybe the 5th or 6th best player in Bayern that's why. And of course I'm biased, but probably less than you How can the best player in the Bundesliga be the 5th or 6th best player on Bayern? Well maybe people saying that Ribery is the best Bundesliga player are stupid Standards nowadays say that an offensive player is better than a defensive one just because scoring goals is fancier than stopping one. Schweinsteiger, Lahm, Müller, Alaba, Neuer, Kroos (and even Robben if he was more regular) are all better than Ribery but he's the one that will shine in this team because he's the one finishing the attempts... I never liked him but I have to say that he has been very impressive last season (and this one too)... just not more impressive than his teammates that I listed. He is the best Bundesliga player because he is DEFENDING like crazy. Ribery always had these offensive capabilities, but since Heynkes he's learned to give everything to his team by defending. Please watch more Bayern matches before you make statements like these + Show Spoiler +(Neuer better than Ribery hahahaha)
Basically, this. Neuer/Kroos/Alaba/Müller ALL better than Ribery?!
|
On October 30 2013 00:24 WillyWanker wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2013 23:01 city42 wrote:On October 29 2013 18:01 WillyWanker wrote:Ribery is maybe the 5th or 6th best player in Bayern that's why. And of course I'm biased, but probably less than you How can the best player in the Bundesliga be the 5th or 6th best player on Bayern? Well maybe people saying that Ribery is the best Bundesliga player are stupid Standards nowadays say that an offensive player is better than a defensive one just because scoring goals is fancier than stopping one. Schweinsteiger, Lahm, Müller, Alaba, Neuer, Kroos (and even Robben if he was more regular) are all better than Ribery but he's the one that will shine in this team because he's the one finishing the attempts... I never liked him but I have to say that he has been very impressive last season (and this one too)... just not more impressive than his teammates that I listed.
I'm not sure what you mean by "he's the one finishing the attempts" considering he was their 4th highest scorer last season. What separated Ribery was his incredible work rate. The word "defend" was never in his vocabulary, but Heynckes somehow convinced him to give it a try and the results were stunning. Now Ribery never stops running over the course of 90 minutes and his defensive work has contributed greatly to the rise of Alaba.
Putting Robben over Ribery is particularly crazy. Robben wouldn't have seen the pitch last season if not for Kroos getting hurt against Juve. When he wasn't playing, he was his typical petulant self, complaining about being on the bench. Even now his pathetic behavior is continuing with the penalty nonsense in recent weeks.
p.s. you can only trust statistics so much, but Ribery's work rate is reflected in his incredible whoscored rating last season.
|
On October 30 2013 00:35 sharkie wrote:Show nested quote +On October 30 2013 00:24 WillyWanker wrote:On October 29 2013 23:01 city42 wrote:On October 29 2013 18:01 WillyWanker wrote:Ribery is maybe the 5th or 6th best player in Bayern that's why. And of course I'm biased, but probably less than you How can the best player in the Bundesliga be the 5th or 6th best player on Bayern? Well maybe people saying that Ribery is the best Bundesliga player are stupid Standards nowadays say that an offensive player is better than a defensive one just because scoring goals is fancier than stopping one. Schweinsteiger, Lahm, Müller, Alaba, Neuer, Kroos (and even Robben if he was more regular) are all better than Ribery but he's the one that will shine in this team because he's the one finishing the attempts... I never liked him but I have to say that he has been very impressive last season (and this one too)... just not more impressive than his teammates that I listed. He is the best Bundesliga player because he is DEFENDING like crazy. Ribery always had these offensive capabilities, but since Heynkes he's learned to give everything to his team by defending. Please watch more Bayern matches before you make statements like these (Neuer better than Ribery hahahaha)
Somehow I think the ridiculous amount of goals and assists by Ronaldo and Messi warrant defending less. Having said that a Dutch analyst yesterday said Ronaldo is one of the hardest working players on the planet and I completly agree with him. He defends a lot as well you do realise he got tricked by Dani Alves at his own 16. Messi is an incredible team player as well with the amount of assits he produces.
Seriously defensive capabilities by offensive players are overrated sure you need some of it but it's hardly a deciding factor in who is better except maybe when 2 players are very very close to each other in all other aspects.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
