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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/946ce.jpg)
Based on some feedback, I've decided to revamp my post.
Where can I find the book? + Show Spoiler +PWNED is available for purchase from Amazon (TL Referral Link!) and Barnes & Noble as an e-book, with additional e-book outlets like iTunes coming soon.
What's the story about? + Show Spoiler +PWNED is a classic thriller set against an eSports background. The main character is a young Sc2 pro who has qualified for Code S for the first time and is preparing to head to the GSL.
Things go wrong when the FBI inform him he is a person of interest in an ongoing investigation, and must not leave the country, therefore keeping him from flying to Korea to compete.
What was your goal in writing this novel? + Show Spoiler +I'm not a hardcore gamer, but my husband is, and the idea for an eSports themed thriller came after watching a few Day[9] dailies, and seeing how GRAND the GSL is as a production.
I really came to know and love the eSports community after a few weeks of casual interaction, and wanted to tell a story in a Tom-Clancy-esque Thriller, with an eSports background. I wanted to show how tight the community is, while making the novel readable for the general public.
Who is the novel written for? + Show Spoiler +My primary audience is the general public who lean towards geekdom. I try to use the book as a tool to introduce eSports the same way it was introduced to me.
The main character doesn't seem realistic to me. + Show Spoiler +They say to write what you know. As a coffee shop lovin writer, my main character reflects this.
I know that this doesn't reflect your average eSports pro. For example, I watch HuK's stream a lot and see him getting messages on email and Facebook from his family telling him how much they miss him.
He's given up a lot to be where he is, and I just can't write from that perspective. I feel like it would be disingenuous to try and create a character I can't relate to
Isn't your book terrible and amateurish? + Show Spoiler +It might be.
This is only my second novel, and I have a long way to go as an author.
I did have a lot of fun writing the book, though, and while it may not be terribly polished, I think it's a fun story that will help introduce eSports to a larger community.
Why should I buy this book? + Show Spoiler +Three things come to mind: - It's a good way to help promote eSports
- I set up the Amazon link with TeamLiquid's account so they get a piece of every sale
- Not every eSports release will be perfect, but helping out upstarts like me will encourage more people to engage in eSports themed expression.
Based on the current feedback, how would you feel about writing for the eSports crowd??
I thought Starcraft fanfic was supposed to be about Jim Raynor and Zeratul expressing their undying love for one another + Show Spoiler +TROLOLOLOLOL![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/oL891.gif)
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Magic Woods9326 Posts
Sounds very interesting ^______^;;
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OMG AWESOME.
I am so buying this.
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Wow this is awesome they wrote the Story of Tasteless on his brief stint taking down the korean ladder.
wow i thought my post was low content and probably not even worth posting then i get to see the 3 posters above me. It was like they all wanted to say first but knew they couldn't.
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How strange. I'm not a big reader (dyslexia) but that book sounds very funky. I wonder if its any good, especially the writing when games are on. I bet its not easy to write a game of SC2 so people can understand it without the visuals of actually seeing the game being played.
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I love you you put Bawls in there, and starcraft im getting this book.
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United States4796 Posts
Whoaaaa. This sounds really fun.
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This sounds awesome, looking forward to the paperback edition coming out.
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I can't wait to publish my ESPORT - Mecha themed story. Good fortune Erika Mitchell!
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Thanks for the positive comments My wife wrote the book, and I helped with the game research. Diamond Terran, and big fan of Day[9] and Tastosis.
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Haha this seems funny (but a bad novel)
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@Sazchu: Should be 5-7 weeks for the print run.
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I think this is probably the first published SC story that isn't Fanfic set in the Starcraft Universe. If it does well with general audiences, and the hardcore crowd embraces it, it could be good for eSports in general.
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@Steel: Give it a chance, it's a fun read
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PWNED tells the story of Sean Boxer
Read that and got chills, the bad ones. Like you could have chosen a better name, thats just TOO cheesy imho.
Anyways good luck with your book
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@Scouter: I embrace the challenge of e-publishing but would accept any help, thank you.
Parts of my story still don't fit well both as text and be spoken aloud, so major editing is making an e-publishing date indeterminate.
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United States24600 Posts
I'll wait. Maybe I'll get a paperback; I'll get The Starcraft Bible also and put it next to The Epic Blog. Any others I'm missing? I want the best bookshelf in esports.
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I don't know if any of you have actually read the chapters but.. Practicing for gsl in team games? It's horribly written and it makes me embarrassed to be a member of the starcraft community
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I read the sample, seems quite interesting. Erika's writing style feels really colorful to me. I've read over a lot of Battle reports and when they describe a battle it feels very mechanical. It's written in a way so that you could really envision how the players are feeling, and what the battle really looks like on screen so that the hardcore gamer won't complain about it being too vague in description.
The way Erika wrote it (in the sample) seems to appeal to a broader variety of readers. I felt like I was watching a battle scene from Lord of the Rings but in space across three continents. So it was really cool, and I can see other people who don't know what Starcraft is enjoying the read.
Overall I think I think it's awesome that a book like this is written. Now if I have a friend who I want to introduce Starcraft to, I can show them this book. Looking forward to buying a copy of it.
EDIT: @Odal yeah sure the GSL Team games thing was silly, but let's not hammer down the book just for that. You'll basically be mocking people who aren't as dedicated to E-Sports as we are and as a result comments like that will stagnate our growth.
Not being a big reader myself, we should leave the opinions of the authors writing to serious readers =P. Otherwise this is going to look like the Strategy forums.
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Sean Boxer... o.o If he's forced to kill someone in the book his name better be changed to Slayers. In any case, very interesting. I wonder what you could get a progamer set up for.
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@ErikaMitchell, Scouter: Just from one artist to another, I was taught not to have disclaimers when reading in public or presenting the material to anyone. It cheapens the experience for the reader, as the summary of text will provide the answers to a readers questions.
Good fortune!
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On June 22 2011 05:04 Odal wrote: I don't know if any of you have actually read the chapters but.. Practicing for gsl in team games? It's horribly written and it makes me embarrassed to be a member of the starcraft community
I didn't want to be the first guy to say this, but... it's true There's a reason people don't write sports fiction any more: it doesn't work. You simply can't recreate the excitement of a real game, and the only sports fiction that really works is the type where the in-game action is barely mentioned. Try The Damned United (there's a decent film version if you can't get hold of the book in America).
The fact that there were errors in the sample chapter isn't helpful (the plural of colossus is colossi) and the writing style is incredibly wooden and lifeless. The content was genuinely cringe-worthy (sorry, but i can't lie) and it felt like the author was just trying to cram in as many insider references as possible. I mean, Sean Boxer? Really? I haven't read much fan fiction in my life, but i imagine that this is what it reads like. Sorry to be harsh, but hopefully you can take some helpful criticism from this.
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Hyrule18992 Posts
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How long is that book? I'm very interested to read it but I'd like to hear some reviews first :D. Available in the UK? (Paperback)
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Interesting idea to bring into a novel format, I might just have to pick this one up!
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I'm surprised this got published
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Haha, this sounds like such a troll. Cool anyhow, anything that promotes E-sport ^^
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On June 22 2011 04:26 ErikaMitchell wrote: PWNED tells the story of Sean Boxer
Oh come on now, that was just too obvious.
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On June 22 2011 05:04 Odal wrote: I don't know if any of you have actually read the chapters but.. Practicing for gsl in team games? It's horribly written and it makes me embarrassed to be a member of the starcraft community Yeah. I don't want to shit in someone's sponsored thread but I am torn between this just being bad but an honest person's effort at writing a story or if it's the result of someone who noticed how popular SC2 is lately and having the clever idea to type out a short story one afternoon and sell it because they knew at least a handful of people will support anything if you throw out the magic word (esports).
It's not very good
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On June 22 2011 05:33 Brotatolol wrote:I'm surprised this got published  Self-publishing is very easy. There are also many books which are basically an interesting title/premise and really horrible content that sell well because... people just look at the title. It's like a book called Zombie Ninja Monsters! Isn't that so outrageous??
I don't know if that is the case with this book, but I'd be weary and hope to find a sample of the writing before spending money on it, just because it is likely it was written because StarCraft is popular, not because the author wanted to write about StarCraft.
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i read the chapters. this book is terrible! the author is obviously a silver level noob, not even in touch with the community.
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On June 22 2011 06:34 Chef wrote:Self-publishing is very easy. There are also many books which are basically an interesting title/premise and really horrible content that sell well because... people just look at the title. It's like a book called Zombie Ninja Monsters! Isn't that so outrageous?? I don't know if that is the case with this book, but I'd be weary and hope to find a sample of the writing before spending money on it, just because it is likely it was written because StarCraft is popular, not because the author wanted to write about StarCraft.
Sample chapters here http://www.erika-mitchell.com/books/pwned/pwned-chapters-1-2/
Consider yourself warned...
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On June 22 2011 06:31 floor exercise wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 05:04 Odal wrote: I don't know if any of you have actually read the chapters but.. Practicing for gsl in team games? It's horribly written and it makes me embarrassed to be a member of the starcraft community Yeah. I don't want to shit in someone's sponsored thread but I am torn between this just being bad but an honest person's effort at writing a story or if it's the result of someone who noticed how popular SC2 is lately and having the clever idea to type out a short story one afternoon and sell it because they knew at least a handful of people will support anything if you throw out the magic word (esports). It's not very good Yeah. Ripping off midnight gladeus my reaction to this book is Mreow? (sc1 probe sound >.>)
I'm torn on this one.
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Nice book but what I want is a movie about Savior.
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On June 22 2011 04:30 fearlessparagon wrote: Sounds like Enders game
Have you read Ender's Game? I haven't read anything about this book except for the description in the OP and I can promise you that this is NOTHING like Ender's Game.
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I was interested, then read the sample chapters. I was very disappointed, reads like a medicore online fanfic, sc2 seems references seems to forced, going to pass,
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I know every thread is supposed to be very positive these days on tlnet... but that summary and those outtakes were horrible and convinced me i'd never want to read this book.
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On June 22 2011 06:49 Phil Phoenix wrote:Have you read Ender's Game? I haven't read anything about this book except for the description in the OP and I can promise you that this is NOTHING like Ender's Game.
They are very different. This proves objective writing isn't easy. It's take massive subjective involvement. I'm still very happy for Erika Mitchell, she did something. As an intelligent animal I feel the ordinary is overlooked as obvious.
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On June 22 2011 05:04 Odal wrote: I don't know if any of you have actually read the chapters but.. Practicing for gsl in team games? It's horribly written and it makes me embarrassed to be a member of the starcraft community
You can not bash a fictional book for not being exactly like the real world. Its fiction for a reason. You can find many books writing about real things where its not completly like the real world (Dan Brown - to name a known one). You can however dislike the writing style, theme, wording, language and/or tons of other stuff that are more technical. I read a lot, mostly english fantasy, and after reading the sample chapters i was not impressed. But neither was a going "Oh god stop". It seems like a decent try to write a story involving SC2, but from the chapters it seems to have a wrong angle (for me). It didn't catch me in the ways that other books do after 1-2 chapters. It might get better, it might not - some of my best books had horrible first chapters - but i won't pay to find out.
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Hey, don't worry about the haters. You wrote a fucking book about Starcraft! That's awesome! Honestly, even if it was the worst written, stupidest book of all time (which I'm sure it's not), it would STILL be uberpro.
I expect a HoTS sequel.
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Ugh. Why, when you see the rich wealth of competition, community and personalities, would you write about FBI agents and international fugitive status? Its sounds to me like cookie cutter teen fiction with a Starcraft twist to draw in buyers. When I think of a novel about gamers I want to hear the author discuss what it is life trying to improve at the game while balancing life, school and perceptions of friends/family. The game itself is somewhat unimportant in my eyes; what we want to know about is the E-SPORTS spirit, that which does us to spend hours a day at computers diligently practicing, all the while seeing the beauty and science of the game unfold countless times before our eyes.
When you watch this, this and of course #100 do you think to yourself, "Man, how cool would it be if NaDa was kidnapped by terrorists"?
GL with your book.
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I hope she continues to pursue her hobby & publish again. This feedback is very important for an artist.
Thanks Dali., This helped me conceptualize more of my idea emotionally. Hotbid says it best in his Youtube channel "Showing the spectacle of will, pain, triumph, and emotion that so aptly defines the Korean Pro-Gaming scene." + Show Spoiler +
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Edited out vaguely trolly first paragraph.
When it comes down to it, there are certain things that will make me read a novel: a character I can relate to, a plot I care about, or a world I'd like to explore. I'll read a book that has one of these things, I'll really enjoy a book with two, and I'll love and reread and recommend a book with all three. I think some people get the wrong idea when a critic or reader asks for "a character they can relate to." We don't want someone we share the boring aspects of our life with. Its like with your friends - you don't care that you both eat at Chipotle, wear the same brand of socks... the important things you relate to each other about are how you think and your passions. Sean Boxer, as far as the first two chapters go, does not think and is not passionate about anything. He's not passionate about writing; he's approached by an individual who expresses a modicum of interest, and shuts her down. If someone expresses interest to me about say, photography (which I am passionate about), I wouldn't be able to stop myself from talking! Doesn't matter if that person is underaged, male, female, deaf, mute, blind, whatever! Our hero doesn't even blink, which leads me to believe he doesn't care about his writing or want to share it particularly much. He's not even passionate about Starcraft, like the target audience is! He plays a game, reads TL a little, and heads out to go get some coffee. There's nothing there, it just feels like a hobby in the story.
Still, he may have other things he is passionate about that haven't been revealed yet. But how does he think about the world? Can I relate to him in that way?
Routine took over and his mind wandered while he walked the three blocks to The Beanerie, a coffee shop where he was more or less a regular. A light wind tossed his curly blond hair off his forehead as scattered raindrops smeared their way down his glasses. He kept his head tucked to his chest, letting the fresh air clear his mind the way it always did.
Quite plainly, he doesn't think. He's filled with the routine, taking out the trash, getting takeout, drinking coffee... and then he even feels the need to clear his mind out of the boring stuff! To what end? Even if it's something little, like "He ducked his head and walked a little faster in the rain, wondering if, in fact, he was getting his glasses wetter by jogging..." And then the audience thinks, "Oh, I totally know someone like that!" Or if you're me, you go, "Oh, I totally do that! If I go faster, I add a relative horizontal component to the velocity of the raindrop which makes it hit the plane of my glasses more! Surely there must be an optimal speed to walk at the minimizes time out but ...." and so forth. Instead, we're left with nothing to latch on to, just a dry, empty guy walking down the street thinking about absolutely nothing.
And then he sits down to write his novel! Hopefully we can get something from him that we can relate to! How does he write? How does his imagination work? Do I know someone like him? Am I like him? Instead of a description of his personality or his imagination, a very rich well of information which can be drawn upon, the author instead gives us a picture of fish flopping around in his empty ocean of a brain.
The thread of the story recovered, it was easy for him to spill the contents of his mind across the keyboard. Ideas unspooled from his mind, chasing one another like carp until afternoon turned into dusk...
That tells me nothing about Sean, his goals, his thoughts, his personality, his passion. What a wasted opportunity!
And then there's the plot. From the synopsis it sounds mildly interesting, but hardly consider me sold. While we don't get a glimpse of it in the sample chapters, I can forgive that for the development that should have been happening. My only comment is that I hope the author did her research. Throwing things like the FBI in cheapen it and make it feel "Hollywood-fake" unless you add a thick veneer of well researched polish.
While I was writing this wall of text, someone else mentioned how many storylines already exist in the communty, and that's true to some extent. Imagine a mystery novelization of the betting scandal in Korea! Using the infamous "based on a true story" you can even add in a foreign player character, some heightened drama, and bam! instant mystery novel. If you want a more character driven sports novel plot (think movies like The Fighter, Million Dollar Baby, Remember the Titans, etc.) find / create someone who goes through that struggle to succeed, the underdog who we cheer for. If the community is already cheering for them in real life, imagine how easily you can hook a reader by adding drama to the situation of something like Tasteless vs Day9, or Grrrr trying to make it in Korea.
And then there's the setting. The real world, which is, to be fair, quite interesting. But there's no focus on it! You're exploring Korean culture, from a westerner's perspective... make sure to play up the differences, the similarities, the shocks, and all the little details that make culture so intriguing. Again, none of this comes across in the samples, but I hope it is well developed when the time comes.
While I'd love to support endeavors of the Starcraft community, the sample chapters do not give me much faith that my expectations for a good plot or setting will be met. Hopefully the author can work on her writing and come back with something more well crafted.
Good luck!
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Sounds like a lulzy funfic ESPORTS
glhf, but I don't think I'll be picking it up anytime soon.
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I think if you were to write a book about SC2 you would be far better off writing about the lore, although that is definitely the intellectual property of blizzard so it would be hard.
I just don't think that anyone but a pro-gamer can understand what they put themselves through and their training regiments ect so for anyone to write about it is doing it ignorantly.
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I dunno, 1 post for that account kind of ruins it for me. This isn't an advertisement site to reach a hard-to-get demographic, but ppl seem to forget that from time to time
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On June 22 2011 08:08 tehemperorer wrote: I dunno, 1 post for that account kind of ruins it for me. This isn't an advertisement site to reach a hard-to-get demographic, but ppl seem to forget that from time to time
Its under sponsored threads, meaning that person paid money to have it show up here.
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On June 22 2011 08:06 Richis wrote: I think if you were to write a book about SC2 you would be far better off writing about the lore, although that is definitely the intellectual property of blizzard so it would be hard.
I just don't think that anyone but a pro-gamer can understand what they put themselves through and their training regiments ect so for anyone to write about it is doing it ignorantly.
That's why writers do interviews and research. Do you really think pro players, when asked about their path to becoming a pro (especially for a published book), would do anything less than spill their guts?
Funny that you'd mention realism and writing with first hand knowledge, yet the book is about FBI agents and "bureaucratic red tape".
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Wow, thanks for all the feedback!
Some positive, some less so. I would just say for perspective, this isn't a book about Starcraft, but a thriller set against an eSports background, and I would take it as such.
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The chapters didn't really sell it to me, the cover is awesome tho.
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The summary sounds so ridiculously cheesy rofl, don't think I'll be reading.
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On June 22 2011 05:04 Odal wrote: I don't know if any of you have actually read the chapters but.. Practicing for gsl in team games? It's horribly written and it makes me embarrassed to be a member of the starcraft community
Hi! I'm the author, and a few people have commented on this so I just thought I'd weigh in. Obviously as a pro gamer, the majority of his games are 1v1. But, what I wanted to convey in his interactions with his teammates was a sense of camaraderie. Gamers get a lot of crap for being loners, but what I'm trying to show in this book is a vibrant community.
As for the poorly written part? Well, all I can do is shrug to that. I do, however, appreciate that you took the time to read the sample chapters.
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Lol, this is why self-publishing by amateur writers is a terrible idea.
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On June 22 2011 05:30 Benjef wrote: How long is that book? I'm very interested to read it but I'd like to hear some reviews first :D. Available in the UK? (Paperback)
The book is a little over 76,000 words, or about 300 pages as a paperback. Thanks for your interest!
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On June 22 2011 06:31 floor exercise wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 05:04 Odal wrote: I don't know if any of you have actually read the chapters but.. Practicing for gsl in team games? It's horribly written and it makes me embarrassed to be a member of the starcraft community Yeah. I don't want to shit in someone's sponsored thread but I am torn between this just being bad but an honest person's effort at writing a story or if it's the result of someone who noticed how popular SC2 is lately and having the clever idea to type out a short story one afternoon and sell it because they knew at least a handful of people will support anything if you throw out the magic word (esports). It's not very good
I think it's understandable to wonder where I was coming from when I wrote this. After all, I'm not a gamer!
My husband is, however, and I came up with the story idea while he was telling me about the GSL last year. Pro gaming was an entirely new world to me, and I thought it would be fun and cool to introduce people to it.
And it was.
I learned how to play Starcraft 2, I watched so many Day9 replays I sometimes hear Sean Plott's voice in my head, and I took enough notes to choke a goat. Starcraft 2 is cool, and my goal in writing this book was to share a fun story and maybe introduce new people to pro gaming.
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On June 22 2011 07:28 Dali. wrote:Ugh. Why, when you see the rich wealth of competition, community and personalities, would you write about FBI agents and international fugitive status? Its sounds to me like cookie cutter teen fiction with a Starcraft twist to draw in buyers. When I think of a novel about gamers I want to hear the author discuss what it is life trying to improve at the game while balancing life, school and perceptions of friends/family. The game itself is somewhat unimportant in my eyes; what we want to know about is the E-SPORTS spirit, that which does us to spend hours a day at computers diligently practicing, all the while seeing the beauty and science of the game unfold countless times before our eyes. When you watch this, this and of course #100 do you think to yourself, "Man, how cool would it be if NaDa was kidnapped by terrorists"? GL with your book.
Thanks for commenting! I can't do anything about my idea seeming cookie-cutter. It is, admittedly, not the most original idea in the world.
However, if you read on you will see that I did my best to do justice to the very issues you've brought up. I won't give away any spoilers, but I am acutely aware of the perils of pursuing a passion that many people may not understand or give credence to.
It's tough to convey the emotional scope of a novel in the first two chapters, but should you ever find occasion to read on I think you'll be mollified by what you find.
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On June 22 2011 08:40 ErikaMitchell wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 22 2011 05:04 Odal wrote: I don't know if any of you have actually read the chapters but.. Practicing for gsl in team games? It's horribly written and it makes me embarrassed to be a member of the starcraft community Hi! I'm the author, and a few people have commented on this so I just thought I'd weigh in. Obviously as a pro gamer, the majority of his games are 1v1. But, what I wanted to convey in his interactions with his teammates was a sense of camaraderie. Gamers get a lot of crap for being loners, but what I'm trying to show in this book is a vibrant community. As for the poorly written part? Well, all I can do is shrug to that. I do, however, appreciate that you took the time to read the sample chapters.
Erika,
I know there are a lot of negative feedback in this thread. Some constructive, but most of it is not. I want to say that your book, although dose not appeal to me personally, has a lot of great potential.
Not a lot of people really understand the effort you put into writing this book, and I want to applaud you for your great feat of patience and determination that you went through to put this together. I know not how many books you have written, but I can guarantee that you will defiantly get better as you grow in writing.
People can critique a book and its words for ages, but in the end it is you who makes the edit in your style that you feel is best to suit not only you, but the community of fans that you may earn.
Good luck in your future endeavors, and I hope any future publications yield great success.
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As a writer I can say the you are the subject your audience what's to hear about. Animals are very curious about each other.
And about SCII as your topic, I can say it goes both ways, either you'll never want to publish because you're endlessly revising or you can't wait to get the product finalized.
"A book is never finished; it's abandoned." — Gene Fowler
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ahhahah "Sean Boxer". could it get more cheesy
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Are you an Arrested Development fan and a Firefly fan?!?
You're the coolest person ever. Good luck with your book!
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On June 22 2011 08:48 ErikaMitchell wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 06:31 floor exercise wrote:On June 22 2011 05:04 Odal wrote: I don't know if any of you have actually read the chapters but.. Practicing for gsl in team games? It's horribly written and it makes me embarrassed to be a member of the starcraft community Yeah. I don't want to shit in someone's sponsored thread but I am torn between this just being bad but an honest person's effort at writing a story or if it's the result of someone who noticed how popular SC2 is lately and having the clever idea to type out a short story one afternoon and sell it because they knew at least a handful of people will support anything if you throw out the magic word (esports). It's not very good I think it's understandable to wonder where I was coming from when I wrote this. After all, I'm not a gamer! My husband is, however, and I came up with the story idea while he was telling me about the GSL last year. Pro gaming was an entirely new world to me, and I thought it would be fun and cool to introduce people to it. And it was. I learned how to play Starcraft 2, I watched so many Day9 replays I sometimes hear Sean Plott's voice in my head, and I took enough notes to choke a goat. Starcraft 2 is cool, and my goal in writing this book was to share a fun story and maybe introduce new people to pro gaming.
Its great to see that kind of interest from someone who used to be an outsider. What I don't understand is why you chose the approach you did! Your hero starts off as an insider, a Starcrafter already familiar with the community. You had a huge opportunity to start him off as an outsider like yourself, and bring the reader along for the ride, to share your experience of discovering a new culture, coming to love icons like Day9, and eventually becoming passionate about esports.
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On June 22 2011 08:06 Richis wrote: I think if you were to write a book about SC2 you would be far better off writing about the lore, although that is definitely the intellectual property of blizzard so it would be hard.
I just don't think that anyone but a pro-gamer can understand what they put themselves through and their training regiments ect so for anyone to write about it is doing it ignorantly.
Thanks for commenting! I agree, it would be extremely difficult to write a completely accurate account of the trials and difficulties inherent in being a pro gamer.
That wasn't the intention of my book, however. What I wanted to accomplish was tell what I think is a fun story and maybe introduce a whole new audience of people to the world of Starcraft 2 gaming. It's a fine line to tread, trying to portray SC2 accurately while still keeping the materials accessible to non-SC2 gamers, but I'd like to think I accomplished my goal.
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On June 22 2011 08:12 Dali. wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 08:06 Richis wrote: I think if you were to write a book about SC2 you would be far better off writing about the lore, although that is definitely the intellectual property of blizzard so it would be hard.
I just don't think that anyone but a pro-gamer can understand what they put themselves through and their training regiments ect so for anyone to write about it is doing it ignorantly. That's why writers do interviews and research. Do you really think pro players, when asked about their path to becoming a pro (especially for a published book), would do anything less than spill their guts? Funny that you'd mention realism and writing with first hand knowledge, yet the book is about FBI agents and "bureaucratic red tape".
Ha! I actually laughed when I read this because I did try to contact a few pro gamers in an effort to do my due diligence and was met with a lot of silence. Not everyone is excited about talking about themselves.
As for first-hand knowledge, you would be shocked to know how much I learned about extradition laws, the NSA, and the U.S. government's right to seize computers and intellectual property. I also learned a fair amount about ciphers, but that was mostly just for fun
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On June 22 2011 08:59 Alabasern wrote: As a writer I can say the you are the subject your audience what's to hear about. Animals are very curious about each other.
And about SCII as your topic, I can say it goes both ways, either you'll never want to publish because you're endlessly revising or you can't wait to get the product finalized.
"A book is never finished; it's abandoned." — Gene Fowler
So true. And that is an excellent quote!
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On June 22 2011 09:09 ErikaMitchell wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 08:12 Dali. wrote:On June 22 2011 08:06 Richis wrote: I think if you were to write a book about SC2 you would be far better off writing about the lore, although that is definitely the intellectual property of blizzard so it would be hard.
I just don't think that anyone but a pro-gamer can understand what they put themselves through and their training regiments ect so for anyone to write about it is doing it ignorantly. That's why writers do interviews and research. Do you really think pro players, when asked about their path to becoming a pro (especially for a published book), would do anything less than spill their guts? Funny that you'd mention realism and writing with first hand knowledge, yet the book is about FBI agents and "bureaucratic red tape". Ha! I actually laughed when I read this because I did try to contact a few pro gamers in an effort to do my due diligence and was met with a lot of silence. Not everyone is excited about talking about themselves. As for first-hand knowledge, you would be shocked to know how much I learned about extradition laws, the NSA, and the U.S. government's right to seize computers and intellectual property. I also learned a fair amount about ciphers, but that was mostly just for fun 
Sounds like someone's been reading Cryptonomicon 
EDIT: and if not, go read it already! The plot involves: The origins of the NSA, the seizure of a server, electronic money and intellectual property lawsuits, as well as a lot about WWII codes and codebreaking. Reading the last sentence of your post, there is literally EVERYTHING to do with Stephensons book lol
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On June 22 2011 09:05 Enervate wrote: Are you an Arrested Development fan and a Firefly fan?!?
You're the coolest person ever. Good luck with your book!
I am a HUGE Arrested Development and Firefly fan! You'll also find references to 30 Rock and Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas in there too
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If you're going to get a family member to leave you the first review on Amazon you should probably get them to change their name or something.
Good luck with the book though.
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On June 22 2011 09:05 susySquark wrote: [ Its great to see that kind of interest from someone who used to be an outsider. What I don't understand is why you chose the approach you did! Your hero starts off as an insider, a Starcrafter already familiar with the community. You had a huge opportunity to start him off as an outsider like yourself, and bring the reader along for the ride, to share your experience of discovering a new culture, coming to love icons like Day9, and eventually becoming passionate about esports.
Ah, that would have been a great angle except how likely would it be for an outsider to eventually rise to the ranks of the GSL?! I'm a total outsider (I never even played Super Mario Bros as a kid) and I'd say there's exactly no chance at all that I'd ever be good enough at SC2 to make it to the GSL.
But yes, that would have been a fun angle!
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i read the first chapter, and it seemed kinda interesting... coming from someone who NEVER reads it kept me reading
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On June 22 2011 09:16 baneling wrote: If you're going to get a family member to leave you the first review on Amazon you should probably get them to change their name or something.
Good luck with the book though.
My husband may be the most supportive person ever born. YOU try keeping him away from saying nice things about my book! 
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Looks interesting, I might aquire this after I get a hold of a copy of Starcraft Bible
i look forward to reading it
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Sean Boxer?
I really should set aside some space on my bookshelf for all this ESPORTS literature.
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On June 22 2011 08:56 ErikaMitchell wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 07:28 Dali. wrote:Ugh. Why, when you see the rich wealth of competition, community and personalities, would you write about FBI agents and international fugitive status? Its sounds to me like cookie cutter teen fiction with a Starcraft twist to draw in buyers. When I think of a novel about gamers I want to hear the author discuss what it is life trying to improve at the game while balancing life, school and perceptions of friends/family. The game itself is somewhat unimportant in my eyes; what we want to know about is the E-SPORTS spirit, that which does us to spend hours a day at computers diligently practicing, all the while seeing the beauty and science of the game unfold countless times before our eyes. When you watch this, this and of course #100 do you think to yourself, "Man, how cool would it be if NaDa was kidnapped by terrorists"? GL with your book. Thanks for commenting! I can't do anything about my idea seeming cookie-cutter. It is, admittedly, not the most original idea in the world. However, if you read on you will see that I did my best to do justice to the very issues you've brought up. I won't give away any spoilers, but I am acutely aware of the perils of pursuing a passion that many people may not understand or give credence to. It's tough to convey the emotional scope of a novel in the first two chapters, but should you ever find occasion to read on I think you'll be mollified by what you find.
Cheers for the reply. It's good to see you and your husband responding so well to a pretty tough crowd.
Chances are I probably will not read the book but I appreciate you standing by it as well as finding new mediums to promote E-SPORTS.
On June 22 2011 09:09 ErikaMitchell wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 08:12 Dali. wrote:On June 22 2011 08:06 Richis wrote: I think if you were to write a book about SC2 you would be far better off writing about the lore, although that is definitely the intellectual property of blizzard so it would be hard.
I just don't think that anyone but a pro-gamer can understand what they put themselves through and their training regiments ect so for anyone to write about it is doing it ignorantly. That's why writers do interviews and research. Do you really think pro players, when asked about their path to becoming a pro (especially for a published book), would do anything less than spill their guts? Funny that you'd mention realism and writing with first hand knowledge, yet the book is about FBI agents and "bureaucratic red tape". Ha! I actually laughed when I read this because I did try to contact a few pro gamers in an effort to do my due diligence and was met with a lot of silence. Not everyone is excited about talking about themselves. As for first-hand knowledge, you would be shocked to know how much I learned about extradition laws, the NSA, and the U.S. government's right to seize computers and intellectual property. I also learned a fair amount about ciphers, but that was mostly just for fun 
I thought many pros would have been more open but I guess people can be less charitable when there is little personal exposure to be gained.
Glad to hear you have maintained a decent level of authenticity. It always pains me to hear something along the lines of, "I've dropped a trojan into the city mainframe, that should bypass the intra-firewall bitcode and give me access to all the cameras in New York."
Sorry if I was initially harsh,
ErikaMitchell fighting!
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If my library gets a copy (I'll nag them) I'll give it a read and allow myself to be surprised but I'm worried this will just be a pulp thriller book using a common format and starcraft as the unique theme.
I've been hurt before by starcraft "books". I hope this surprises me.
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On June 22 2011 04:32 Pughy wrote: How strange. I'm not a big reader (dyslexia) but that book sounds very funky. I wonder if its any good, especially the writing when games are on. I bet its not easy to write a game of SC2 so people can understand it without the visuals of actually seeing the game being played.
I did my best to transcribe actual games. It's pretty tough to try to communicate SC2 battlegrounds and weapons in terms non-gamers will be able to visualize, but I think I did a decent job. The outsiders who edited for me seemed to think I did a decent job
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I wish exerts were taken from an interesting part of the book so we could get intrigued by some mid plot action and want to know how it got there and where it will go. I can't remember the last time I started reading a book and had my breath taken away by the first 10 pages.
I doubt a library would ever pick up a book like this though, but if they do I'll give it a chance.
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I think the writing is very good but I don't have much of a desire to read such a story. Biography/Autobiography of some of the most famous and beloved programers, maybe (say, Nada, Boxer, July, etc.) -- I'd be glad to read. In fact, I already read Boxer's auto. Alot of us at TL did. Maybe wait until a gamer reaches legendary status in SC2 -- wait for a "bonjwa". Something like that.
I love the Arrested Dev/Firefly refs.
edit: One little thing that's bothering me (I'm a writer, too), was that you seem to try so hard to find unique verbs/adverbs. Sometimes the best way to say "say" is... "say". I remember some famous writer saying something like that and it stuck in the back of my mind, really influencing every line I've written since then. Hemingway? I don't remember. Too much flair in every paragraph tires the reader out.
Keep writing, please!
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Might have a look when the paperback.
Congrats on releasing a novel anyway!
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Day9 did it better
http://day9fan.com/~/boy-and-his-game-day9
Just write that down, and it is a way better sc2 book, the first 2 chapters make this look like someone who knows a little about starcraft and a little about writing tried to combine the two; much like mixing a strong acid with a strong base, they did not react well. Reads like a fanfic written by a casual fan.
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People hate on others way too easily IMO. Congratulations on writing a book, Erika, which is more than most of the people in this thread have done.
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Since the main character is named Sean, this book better have a good plott.
This sounds pretty interesting, I'll have to give it a read.
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Started reading this.
I couldn't stop giggling while I read about Starcraft. Not because it's silly or embarrassing, but because it's so strange to read about this.
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On June 22 2011 10:47 OreoBoi wrote: Since the main character is named Sean, this book better have a good plott.
This sounds pretty interesting, I'll have to give it a read.
Ladies and Gentlemen, we have our winner.
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This looks really cool. It's great to see a novel with some SC inspiration.
I'm going to check this out. =)
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Ehh... as much as I hate to be negative I gotta say its poorly written IMO. Its awesome to see all the cool references in there but there is so much fluff and excess detail it makes it really hard to read. Its a good try but if I buy it its only because its starcraft.... sowwy
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This story seems pretty fun! Like a good summer read full of nerdiness :3
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I dont know if anyone here actually read the sample chapters but they are AWFUL.
The main characters' name is Sean Boxer....apparently because she is a fan of day 9 and slayers boxer..Get some imagination and originality..
Also, why does the story assume that only 1 of 2 americans can win the GSL? Thats not realistic at all...
It feels like its been written by a 14yo for an english assignment.
I love how she stereotypes our community into bachelors living as slobs with takeway and energy drink rubbish all around...
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On June 22 2011 10:47 OreoBoi wrote: Since the main character is named Sean, this book better have a good plott. .
comedy gold
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On June 22 2011 10:47 OreoBoi wrote: Since the main character is named Sean, this book better have a good plott.
That wasn't a tasteless joke for sure.
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On June 22 2011 12:19 endy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 10:47 OreoBoi wrote: Since the main character is named Sean, this book better have a good plott.
That wasn't a tasteless joke for sure.
My brain hurts P:
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I'm going to tell you something that upsets every writer the first time they hear it:
Cracking his knuckles, he set his fingers to the keyboard and got to work.
Don't start sentences this way. It is always more effective to write directly. "He cracked his knuckles and set his fingers to work on the keyboard." Maybe that sounds like the same thing, but trust me if you replace every sentence you wrote this way your book will read about 100 times better. If you're genuinely interested in becoming better at writing, please consider rewriting some of the paragraphs this way, and rereading them for yourself to see if it helps. I can't help you have better ideas, but I can tell you that this is one of the first things regular readers groan at when reading amateur fiction. Once you start noticing it it's horrible.
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On June 22 2011 12:19 endy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 10:47 OreoBoi wrote: Since the main character is named Sean, this book better have a good plott.
That wasn't a tasteless joke for sure.
you're really good at making puns very useful talent toi have
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Nice! Hopefully it will be released on paperback before the summer is over.
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Can't wait to buy a paperback! :D
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I read the sample chapters; it's not the worst writing I've ever seen but it's definitely not for adult readers.
It also reads like a bit of a cash grab by someone who doesn't actually know a lot about starcraft or the e-sports pro scene, but is just hoping that it will sell to some nerds who will buy anything starcraft related.
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Read the sample chapters, god damn that was cheesy. Also, that Sean Boxer character is a total douche. Try not to contradict yourself when your own character is talking, has an argument with "Serenity" over using proper words in chat, then ends with "kk"? Team games as a vehicle for practice in competitive Starcraft? Tank/Viking against Protoss?
My head hurts...
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+ Show Spoiler +On June 22 2011 12:39 Chef wrote:I'm going to tell you something that upsets every writer the first time they hear it: Don't start sentences this way. It is always more effective to write directly. "He cracked his knuckles and set his fingers to work on the keyboard." Maybe that sounds like the same thing, but trust me if you replace every sentence you wrote this way your book will read about 100 times better. If you're genuinely interested in becoming better at writing, please consider rewriting some of the paragraphs this way, and rereading them for yourself to see if it helps. I can't help you have better ideas, but I can tell you that this is one of the first things regular readers groan at when reading amateur fiction. Once you start noticing it it's horrible.
This completely sums up why I find the writing itself to be so hard to stomach. A ridiculously disproportionate amount of the text is written this way. This makes everything so disjointed for me, it's not a pleasant read at all. I love that the writer found an interest in Starcraft 2 and wanted to write a story based around it, but even the best plot (which isn't present in this book) wouldn't be able to do it for me if it's being hampered by such viscous writing.
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Props to the author for your positive responses to criticism in this thread, despite the SC-fanboyish criticism of the minutiae of gaming details or the utter dismissals of your work by literary prodigies.
There are, of course, good posts like Chef's.
With a healthy, improvement-oriented mindset I can imagine that this feedback may prove helpful for future projects. It's always good to be able to shrug off the vitriol of criticism in order to pick out useful information.
Btw, $5 ~= movie theater matinee.
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This one time in college one of my creative writing professors gave us an assignment: think of a sentence/paragraph that would cause you to put the book back on the shelf/in the trash immediately....
Seriously let me give my interpretation of this book.
Cheesy cliche'ed government story that you have seen/read 5000 times. Oh and some esports to try to get some sort of fan-base because straight up this is nothing interesting, and needs a last minute gimmick. Written by: amateur writer who knows nothing about esports....but needed a gimmick to make it somewhat appealing to anyone possible. Hype hype hype
And whoever said "its fiction it doesn't have to be realistic". It does if its set in a real setting. And at least has to be accurate/coherent in its own setting. Fictional crime stories set in the early 1900'! Will never have "and then ronald reagan killed the terminator with a heat seeking missile shot out of his ball point pen". So there is still an argument for realism/coherency in fictional pieces.
But naybe I'm the only one reading it as "loads of bad but it has an esports gimmick"...
Next piece: fbi loses control of double agent at the professional bowling world championships... will the terrorist succeed in his goal of killing america's best bowler?!?!
I hope my criticism is somewhat helpful. I just don't like the idea of "pay for this me cause its for the benefit of esports". Seriously bandwagoner how about you sell your ideas for their content instead of trying to piggyback off of esports and say "its for the scene! You should buy it to promote esports!"
Idk in my honest opinion this is like selling a plain white shirt with "esports rules" written in permanent marker. "But its for the benefit of esports. If you don't buy it you hate esports and want them to fail by not promoting esports with ur money."
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Sounds stupid.
Sean "Boxer"? Could you have made that anymore obvious?
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I'd copy and paste the Negative review of it from Amazon here, but you guys can go check it out for yourselves. It is very poignant and almost antagonistic, because it's obviously made to both criticize the writing style and be better written that the book.
I'm a slow, uneducated reader myself, which might help me not notice some of the problems- but with everything that has been said about this, I really can't spend any time with it. It takes me 10X the time to read anything it takes a normal person.
While I suppose the effort is appreciated, I hate to think of the warped picture a book like this might give someone who doesn't know anything about Starcraft to begin with. They might think we all live in this mundane, thoughtless world. (See the review I mentioned.)
Lots of comments in the thread, while quite blunt and crass (always characteristic of the internet) seem to be nearly 100% true in this case.
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As with other people I feel like this is hard to read because it has some serious problems with the writing style attempting to be overly flashy, and overall feels like a cheap attempt to cash in on the rise in popularity of e-sports. The sample chapters provided are also incredibly cheesy and silly and I definitely couldn't stomach reading an entire book where there are so many cheesy references crammed into each chapter. There is also nothing that makes me relate at all to the main character so far, and I'm sorry to say but it really does end up coming out like very average fanfiction.
Some people could say I shouldn't judge a book by the first 2 chapters, but realistically when I read a book if the first 2 chapters are this bad there is no way I'm going to continue reading it, and having been provided with this sample I wont be buying the book.
If your interest in e sports is genuine and you are determined to become a published author then I hope one day you will find a way to write a story based on e sports that doesn't come out as silly as this one, the idea of somebody training for GSL by playing team games really is absurd and it would have taken very little research for you to know that and leave it out of the book. Those things can seem like small details but in fact they are not small and they really can be off putting to people that realize how silly it is, on top of everything else.
Sorry to be so harsh but when you post something like this on a website dedicated to Starcraft then you really are going to get some very harsh criticism.
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Read the samples, liked it very much. I'll probably ending up buying it
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On June 22 2011 16:07 cursor wrote: I'd copy and paste the Negative review of it from Amazon here, but you guys can go check it out for yourselves. It is very poignant and almost antagonistic, because it's obviously made to both criticize the writing style and be better written that the book.
Interestingly, I checked out the Amazon reviews for the book, and found one positive 5-star review. I quote: "Read this book when it came out based on a facebook recommendation. I really liked it! Was lots of fun ". This review was submitted by one Wesley Mitchell. Hmmmmmmmmmm......
I dunno, I just find it a bit disingenuous to market your book this way, especially on the most hardcore Starcraft forum in the western world, where people are going to nitpick at absolutely every detail within. It's kind of like how every chess forum makes fun of the movies where the actors move some pieces around and go "Aha! Checkmate!". Stuff like that just doesn't happen, and yes, you need to be addicted to Starcraft to notice it.
From what I read of the writing itself, I'm going to give you some very constructive criticism, from one writer to another: use less adjectives. Adjectives and adverbs are powerful descriptive tools, but reliance on them often shows insecurity in your writing ability, and it seems that you use them in a rather overabundance. Once you describe the character as having curly hair, or whatever, you don't really need to address him later in the book by saying that "His curly locks swayed majestically in the breeze as his feet carried him with unyielding swiftness to the coffee shop". There are more elegant ways of getting your point across. Try getting inside the head of your main character rather than reiterating what a random passerby might see if they were looking at him for the first time. You're creating a distance from your character with phrases like these.
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On June 22 2011 09:17 ErikaMitchell wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 09:05 susySquark wrote: [ Its great to see that kind of interest from someone who used to be an outsider. What I don't understand is why you chose the approach you did! Your hero starts off as an insider, a Starcrafter already familiar with the community. You had a huge opportunity to start him off as an outsider like yourself, and bring the reader along for the ride, to share your experience of discovering a new culture, coming to love icons like Day9, and eventually becoming passionate about esports. Ah, that would have been a great angle except how likely would it be for an outsider to eventually rise to the ranks of the GSL?! I'm a total outsider (I never even played Super Mario Bros as a kid) and I'd say there's exactly no chance at all that I'd ever be good enough at SC2 to make it to the GSL. But yes, that would have been a fun angle!
This is an interesting point. Although your argument is reasonable, we (the community) have lived several moment that have taught us not to judge outsiders as forever noobs. Thorzain was fairly unknown before he amazed us all in his TSL3 victory.
I praise you very much for your courage and effort put into this book. I know there must be a love for the game if you're going yo write 76,000 words about it. However, I would have recommended more personal interaction of you with the community before finishing the novel. We already had a discussion of whether it was "colossuses" or "colossi" or etc. It was pretty big, and most casters began referring to them as "Collosi". The fact that you referred to them as colosusses is a deal-breaker for me. Good luck with this book and future endeavors!
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On June 22 2011 04:30 fearlessparagon wrote: Sounds like Enders game
...Not at all. Ender's game was about a kid being played by the system. This seems to be about a 20-something year old guy fighting against the bull shit of bureaucratic procedure, and corruption in the pro gaming scene.... as the description says. Will definitely read this.
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When I first announced that PWNED was coming out, a friend of mine, in the interest of being a good friend, asked me if it was ready. If it was the best it could possibly be. At the time I answered yes, because I thought (and still think) that it’s a great story. Now, though, I’m inclined to think it’s not the best it could possibly be. The reason being that I’m not as good at writing as I will ever be. I could keep every book I write cloistered on my computer for decades, and just work through them with a fine-toothed comb every time I learn a new technique. I could spend my entire life re-writing and revising them, convinced they’re not ready because of my fear of what I don’t know. I’m not interested in doing that. This is me fully admitting that I’m a writing noob. PWNED is not the Great American Novel, and I fully admit to having room to learn and grow. What I also fully admit to is loving the story, the characters, and the plot. I had so much fun writing this book, and it shows. I’m steeling myself for the inevitable bad reviews on the horizon (because trolls are everywhere and I’d be foolish to think they’ll ignore me) but I’m also just really excited to share the story with whoever is interested in reading it.
Doesn't sound too promising + money leaving esports scene and going to book companies and authors isn't what I like.
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Colourful writing is no substitute for an interesting story, this is what the sample chapters clearly showed. Also, I find the description rather patronizing and cheesy. We're gamers, not children. Clearly, there is lots of potential for writing the story of a gamer who goes to Korea and struggles to balance everything out. However, if you're not a gamer, you're going to write this mediocre book instead of a good one.
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Hmmm, seems like one of those books just trying to cash in on a growing scene. I´ll wait and see some reviews.
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On June 22 2011 17:24 HoMM wrote: Doesn't sound too promising + money leaving esports scene and going to book companies and authors isn't what I like.
At least they payed for a sponsored thread on TL..at least thats some money going back to the scene. I wouldnt worry about any money leaving the esports scene because noones going to be giving up their GSL subscription and buying this instead
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"Sean sent his tall, leggy Colossuses"
DURRR DURRRR DURRRRR.
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Made a purchase! Gotta support amazing ideas like this =)
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On June 22 2011 18:49 Lesser wrote: "Sean sent his tall, leggy Colossuses"
DURRR DURRRR DURRRRR.
I'm gonna get turned on every time I see a collosus now.
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On June 22 2011 17:03 Cel.erity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 16:07 cursor wrote: I'd copy and paste the Negative review of it from Amazon here, but you guys can go check it out for yourselves. It is very poignant and almost antagonistic, because it's obviously made to both criticize the writing style and be better written that the book. Interestingly, I checked out the Amazon reviews for the book, and found one positive 5-star review. I quote: "Read this book when it came out based on a facebook recommendation. I really liked it! Was lots of fun  ". This review was submitted by one Wesley Mitchell. Hmmmmmmmmmm..... Oh, for crying out loud, that's silly. The husband has been very supportive, and assured us time and time again that the book "actually is very good! (...) classic 300-paged thriller set in a Starcraft environment! (...) really realistic battle reports!", but I've seen nothing of the sort in the sample chapters.
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the Dagon Knight4002 Posts
As another writerly person on TL, I don't mean to be down on this, but:
The rest of his teammates were scattered throughout the map, embroiled in their own battles, and no help would be forthcoming in time enough to be useful.
He was on his own.
Serenity: gg newbs wp
BOBLOBLAW: TYVM
ProfPlum: I thought you were a goner, Captain. That was pretty gosu
This sounds like a monument to self-parody...
I'm not sure if that's sufficient to stop me picking it up.
+ Show Spoiler +The coolest part of the sample chapters was that I know a guy who plays using the id BOBLOBLAW
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On June 22 2011 14:07 suspiciousbear wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 22 2011 12:39 Chef wrote:I'm going to tell you something that upsets every writer the first time they hear it: Don't start sentences this way. It is always more effective to write directly. "He cracked his knuckles and set his fingers to work on the keyboard." Maybe that sounds like the same thing, but trust me if you replace every sentence you wrote this way your book will read about 100 times better. If you're genuinely interested in becoming better at writing, please consider rewriting some of the paragraphs this way, and rereading them for yourself to see if it helps. I can't help you have better ideas, but I can tell you that this is one of the first things regular readers groan at when reading amateur fiction. Once you start noticing it it's horrible. This completely sums up why I find the writing itself to be so hard to stomach. A ridiculously disproportionate amount of the text is written this way. This makes everything so disjointed for me, it's not a pleasant read at all. I love that the writer found an interest in Starcraft 2 and wanted to write a story based around it, but even the best plot (which isn't present in this book) wouldn't be able to do it for me if it's being hampered by such viscous writing.
I really agree with these posts. There's something about the writing that put me off, and these posts helped sum it up. The real problem is that the writing tries to be "ornate" rather than just tell things simple and straight.
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Plain and simple english is almost always better.
Couldnt get past the first few paragraphs, was instantly turned off by the writing style.
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I read the sample chapters.
Since it is a novel, I accept that it is no documentary. The events don't need to be 100% realistic. I also accept that the novel looks somewhat like an SC community exploitation novel, but this is a good thing in the sense that Starcraft goes into mainstream.
But I cannot stand the writing. The writing is strange, not very streamlined. I would buy it even though the story don't look very original if the hero would not be named Sean Boxer and if the writing would be more standard English.
If I would write a book about a Starcraft player, I would establish the hero as a solid player who however has a particular weakness in his play, preventing him to come out at top. Of course he also struggles with his real life. Then he needs to make a choice: Either practice more, to get rid of the aforementioned weakness, or sort out the biggest RL issue. He picks the first. As he finally overcomes his big playing weakness, the other players also have improved their skill. So the hero still don't win the ultimate championship. But he gets recognized, gets a good clan offer which he accepts and he is able to both follow his gaming career as well as take care about his RL.
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the Dagon Knight4002 Posts
On June 22 2011 22:36 [F_]aths wrote: If I would write a book about a Starcraft player, I would establish the hero as a solid player who however has a particular weakness in his play, preventing him to come out at top. Of course he also struggles with his real life. Then he needs to make a choice: Either practice more, to get rid of the aforementioned weakness, or sort out the biggest RL issue. He picks the first. As he finally overcomes his big playing weakness, the other players also have improved their skill. So the hero still don't win the ultimate championship. But he gets recognized, gets a good clan offer which he accepts and is able to both follow his gaming career as well as take care about his RL.
No way, man! Play the tragedy card; at the very end of the book, he stands on stage, accepts the GSL trophy and looks out into the crowd, looking for the girlfriend he neglected so that he could finally add that tiny little bit of polish to his game, and realises that she didn't come to see him in his finest hour. She wasn't there to see what all the hardship and the waiting was for.
Tears run down his face and in all the celebration, there's nobody there who can understand how much it's cost him to get where he is.
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Lol at the "battle reports" cant appease everybody. the hardcore fans wont like it. the non-fans wont like the idea of reading a book about a video game. hopefully the swarms of newbs will like it?
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On June 22 2011 22:52 ComaDose wrote: Lol at the "battle reports" cant appease everybody. the hardcore fans wont like it. the non-fans wont like the idea of reading a book about a video game. hopefully the swarms of newbs will like it? Someone has to make the first step.
I really can imagine a TV show about a fictional SC2 training house. The protagonists struggle with both tournament success as well with RL issues and every show features a Starcraft match which is somehow important to the story. That TV show features real pros from time to time, who are special guest stars for one episode.
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I'd like to also point out (since it has been brought up more than once) 75k words is not really 300 pages for most books... The pages would have to be pretty small (yeah, some books are like that) and the writing kinda spacey (lots of cheap books are like that to try to look longer, but also some are like that just so people with bad eyes can read them). My 95k word book is only 226 pages, or about 20 pages shorter than what Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency was, if you have that (which has by no means large pages, they're actually a little smaller than what is standard these days). It very much depends on typeset size etc, but don't think you are in for an epic here... This is a novel which got ended early on what would be page 160 of most books (which given the topic, is not the most reassuring thing). It's kind of like writing a 10 page essay... When you get to page 6 or 7 you start thinking 'if I just decreased the margins a little I would have a lot less work' hahaha... Of course you'd fail, so you don't do it. The light novel is actually a format I kind of like tho, so I don't mind books of that length... But it's clear this person set out to write a full novel, and 75k words might be the very minimum with a lot of type setting for that. Stretching that to 300 pages tho would look silly... A lot of good novels aren't much longer than 200 or so pages, there's no reason to make it 300 unless you want people to feel like speed readers (I read that page in less than a minute!).
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On June 22 2011 23:14 Chef wrote: I'd like to also point out (since it has been brought up more than once) 75k words is not really 300 pages for most books... The pages would have to be pretty small (yeah, some books are like that) and the writing kinda spacey (lots of cheap books are like that to try to look longer, but also some are like that just so people with bad eyes can read them). My 95k word book is only 226 pages, or about 20 pages shorter than what Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency was, if you have that (which has by no means large pages, they're actually a little smaller than what is standard these days). It very much depends on typeset size etc, but don't think you are in for an epic here... This is a novel which got ended early on what would be page 160 of most books (which given the topic, is not the most reassuring thing). It's kind of like writing a 10 page essay... When you get to page 6 or 7 you start thinking 'if I just decreased the margins a little I would have a lot less work' hahaha... Of course you'd fail, so you don't do it. The light novel is actually a format I kind of like tho, so I don't mind books of that length... But it's clear this person set out to write a full novel, and 75k words might be the very minimum with a lot of type setting for that. Stretching that to 300 pages tho would look silly... A lot of good novels aren't much longer than 200 or so pages, there's no reason to make it 300 unless you want people to feel like speed readers (I read that page in less than a minute!).
What in the hell are you talking about? Page counts can vary widely. A dialogue heavy novel can easily be 300 pages at 75k words. Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone was 76k words and 300+ pages. Oh but I guess in Chef world JK Rowling was just silly stretching and clearly set out to write a full novel then stopped at the bare minimum.
P.S. Is your 95k word book even published?
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On June 22 2011 23:48 StorkHwaiting wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 23:14 Chef wrote: I'd like to also point out (since it has been brought up more than once) 75k words is not really 300 pages for most books... The pages would have to be pretty small (yeah, some books are like that) and the writing kinda spacey (lots of cheap books are like that to try to look longer, but also some are like that just so people with bad eyes can read them). My 95k word book is only 226 pages, or about 20 pages shorter than what Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency was, if you have that (which has by no means large pages, they're actually a little smaller than what is standard these days). It very much depends on typeset size etc, but don't think you are in for an epic here... This is a novel which got ended early on what would be page 160 of most books (which given the topic, is not the most reassuring thing). It's kind of like writing a 10 page essay... When you get to page 6 or 7 you start thinking 'if I just decreased the margins a little I would have a lot less work' hahaha... Of course you'd fail, so you don't do it. The light novel is actually a format I kind of like tho, so I don't mind books of that length... But it's clear this person set out to write a full novel, and 75k words might be the very minimum with a lot of type setting for that. Stretching that to 300 pages tho would look silly... A lot of good novels aren't much longer than 200 or so pages, there's no reason to make it 300 unless you want people to feel like speed readers (I read that page in less than a minute!). What in the hell are you talking about? Page counts can vary widely. A dialogue heavy novel can easily be 300 pages at 75k words. Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone was 76k words and 300+ pages. Oh but I guess in Chef world JK Rowling was just silly stretching and clearly set out to write a full novel then stopped at the bare minimum. P.S. Is your 95k word book even published?
Hey, this thread is about making fun of someone else's book, not his.
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On June 22 2011 07:43 susySquark wrote: Even if it's something little, like "He ducked his head and walked a little faster in the rain, wondering if, in fact, he was getting his glasses wetter by jogging..." And then the audience thinks, "Oh, I totally know someone like that!" Or if you're me, you go, "Oh, I totally do that! If I go faster, I add a relative horizontal component to the velocity of the raindrop which makes it hit the plane of my glasses more! Surely there must be an optimal speed to walk at the minimizes time out but ...." and so forth.
No way me too! ^^
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I can appreciate the effort, but those sample pages made me cringe...
May be bearable for the age 10-14 demographic though (still a stretch).
On June 22 2011 06:49 Phil Phoenix wrote:Have you read Ender's Game? I haven't read anything about this book except for the description in the OP and I can promise you that this is NOTHING like Ender's Game.
LoL, that is exactly what I was thinking when I read that post :-)
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On June 22 2011 07:08 Alabasern wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 06:49 Phil Phoenix wrote:On June 22 2011 04:30 fearlessparagon wrote: Sounds like Enders game Have you read Ender's Game? I haven't read anything about this book except for the description in the OP and I can promise you that this is NOTHING like Ender's Game. They are very different. This proves objective writing isn't easy. It's take massive subjective involvement. I'm still very happy for Erika Mitchell, she did something. As an intelligent animal I feel the ordinary is overlooked as obvious.
I didn't mean to imply anything about the quality. I just meant the stories of the two books are clearly very different.
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lol holy shit this sounds like an amazing read, gonna go get me a paperback when it's released :D
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On June 22 2011 22:46 SirJolt wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 22:36 [F_]aths wrote: If I would write a book about a Starcraft player, I would establish the hero as a solid player who however has a particular weakness in his play, preventing him to come out at top. Of course he also struggles with his real life. Then he needs to make a choice: Either practice more, to get rid of the aforementioned weakness, or sort out the biggest RL issue. He picks the first. As he finally overcomes his big playing weakness, the other players also have improved their skill. So the hero still don't win the ultimate championship. But he gets recognized, gets a good clan offer which he accepts and is able to both follow his gaming career as well as take care about his RL.
No way, man! Play the tragedy card; at the very end of the book, he stands on stage, accepts the GSL trophy and looks out into the crowd, looking for the girlfriend he neglected so that he could finally add that tiny little bit of polish to his game, and realises that she didn't come to see him in his finest hour. She wasn't there to see what all the hardship and the waiting was for. Tears run down his face and in all the celebration, there's nobody there who can understand how much it's cost him to get where he is.
Oh man, we should write a new book in this thread and get it e-published.
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is this fiction or non fiction?
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On June 23 2011 00:34 LarJarsE wrote: is this fiction or non fiction? ...fiction. It's about a guy who practices for the GSL playing 3v3 games.
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On June 22 2011 17:24 HoMM wrote:Show nested quote +When I first announced that PWNED was coming out, a friend of mine, in the interest of being a good friend, asked me if it was ready. If it was the best it could possibly be. At the time I answered yes, because I thought (and still think) that it’s a great story. Now, though, I’m inclined to think it’s not the best it could possibly be. The reason being that I’m not as good at writing as I will ever be. I could keep every book I write cloistered on my computer for decades, and just work through them with a fine-toothed comb every time I learn a new technique. I could spend my entire life re-writing and revising them, convinced they’re not ready because of my fear of what I don’t know. I’m not interested in doing that. This is me fully admitting that I’m a writing noob. PWNED is not the Great American Novel, and I fully admit to having room to learn and grow. What I also fully admit to is loving the story, the characters, and the plot. I had so much fun writing this book, and it shows. I’m steeling myself for the inevitable bad reviews on the horizon (because trolls are everywhere and I’d be foolish to think they’ll ignore me) but I’m also just really excited to share the story with whoever is interested in reading it. Doesn't sound too promising + money leaving esports scene and going to book companies and authors isn't what I like.
We actually set up the Amazon link with Team Liquid so they get money for each purchase
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*ogles at the leggy Collosi*
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
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Also, the T in GSTL stands for Team, as in Team games, as in 3v3's.
Of course.
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On June 23 2011 02:18 TheRealPaciFist wrote: *ogles at the leggy Collosi*
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
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Also, the T in GSTL stands for Team, as in Team games, as in 3v3's.
Of course. The work is obviously fiction, not a documentary. In a fictional world, a GSL (or GSTL) can conduct team games.
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sounds interesting may get it
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How many people have purchased this book so far?
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On June 23 2011 02:14 Scouter wrote:We actually set up the Amazon link with Team Liquid so they get money for each purchase 
... amazing.
"Buy this book, cause it says Starcraft 2 and esports."
Which it looks like some people are willing to buy simply because of your gimmicks, but honestly it is kind of amazing that people are willing to exploit something they love.
Some people say this is promoting esports, I would love to hear how a terribly written, horrendously false, and incredibly misleading book about esports is "good for the scene."
(Honestly I don't see this doing anything to actually affect the scene as the only people who are going to buy it are the 4-5 people who just see "esports!!!!" and buy it simply for that. Anyone without those blinders on will not even make it past the preview pages.)
But at least you are smart enough to say now "Buy it for esports and buy it for team liquid!" increasing your gimmick level in hopes to trick people into buying this.
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On June 23 2011 02:21 [F_]aths wrote: The work is obviously fiction, not a documentary. In a fictional world, a GSL (or GSTL) can conduct team games.
Why not make it more interesting and just have the player use his super mind powers to speak through the computer to his units without the use of a keyboard/mouse and he can get actual information/data directly from his units, as well as give orders from inside of his Command Center, while playing chess with Jim Raynor and Sarah Kerrigan?
Cause even fictional pieces have to maintain a certain amount of coherency/credibility. Fiction does not mean "anything goes." Don't set your piece in a real world setting, revolving around a real world event, and then be horribly inaccurate with the writing.
You cant set a story during the World Cup of Soccer/Football and talk about how it was 35 v 35 on the field.
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I'll support anything with my dollars that helps broaden the SC2 / eSports community! Just picked up your eBook and looking forward to giving it a read. Whether it turns out to be a great read or not - thanks for taking the time and effort to contribute something unique!
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On June 23 2011 03:44 MaestroSC wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 02:14 Scouter wrote:We actually set up the Amazon link with Team Liquid so they get money for each purchase  But at least you are smart enough to say now "Buy it for esports and buy it for team liquid!" increasing your gimmick level in hopes to trick people into buying this.
I have no intentions of being gimmicky! I really love the eSports scene, and my husband has 4 seasons of the GSL.
It's cool if you don't like it, I'm sure if I spent a lot more time on it I could have made it perfect in every way. It's pretty scary sending your book out into the wild, try not to make a girl cry mmmkay?
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reading isent my thing. but i hope it does weell
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On June 23 2011 03:50 MaestroSC wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 02:21 [F_]aths wrote: The work is obviously fiction, not a documentary. In a fictional world, a GSL (or GSTL) can conduct team games. Why not make it more interesting and just have the player use his super mind powers to speak through the computer to his units without the use of a keyboard/mouse and he can get actual information/data directly from his units, as well as give orders from inside of his Command Center, while playing chess with Jim Raynor and Sarah Kerrigan? Cause even fictional pieces have to maintain a certain amount of coherency/credibility. Fiction does not mean "anything goes." Don't set your piece in a real world setting, revolving around a real world event, and then be horribly inaccurate with the writing. You cant set a story during the World Cup of Soccer/Football and talk about how it was 35 v 35 on the field. This is the 2nd time you made outrageous ideas on how you can not write about something real and then twist it. I agree that not everything goes. But most does given the right setting and atmosphere. There is however nothing wrong with twisting reality so the story flows better or what not. Like changing GSL/GSTL into a 2v2/3v3/4v4 format. A movie that spring to mind is "Transformers" where a big frozen robot is under hoover dam... "But thats not how it is in the real world." (edit: Well i dont know for sure... =) No but it makes a damn good story. (afterthought: Indiana Jones movies?)
Most books take something real and twist it to be something else. Most FBI/CIA books does that. Most social-status book does that and even most fantasy books does that - look at newage fantasy. The amount of changes that people like are subjective. Personally I like it when things are vastly different from the real world (Fantasy) but most things are still ideas or even real historical things from "our" world.
To sum up: How different a _fictional_ book can be from the real world, even in a real world setting, is subjective - and often theme based. (e.g. Would you feel this strongly if the book was about curling and they used 10 stones per round instead of 8?).
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I am interested in it. I am going to wait until I hear some reviews before purchasing though.
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Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone was 76k words and 300+ pages. My copy of that particular book is 223 pages long... Like I said it's no problem to stretch 75k words into a 200 page novel, but 300 is going to look really silly. Plus it's a children's book, they always make the font a little bigger so that kids don't lose interest reading a single page forever.
edit: I looked it up... most of the editions I found were about 220 pages give or take a few, and one that was 320 pages which was marketed toward elementary school children (you can guess who spacey the font for that would be). So yeah, it's not exactly honest to call Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone a 300 page novel lol. We are talking about a font which is designed to give children confidence in their reading speed, not a realistic page count for an adult. Also, if you're thinking the baby's version might be longer because it has smaller pages, it doesn't. The pages are actually a few cm bigger lol. So basically the 220 page version which already has larger than normal font because it is marketed to young teens got an extra 100 pages, while still increasing the page size... What I'm saying is: your example was terrible.
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Interesting concept for a book, but like many have echoed before me, a lot of things can definitely be refined. I understand that ESPORTS is just the setting of the novel, and it's mainly a thriller involving the FBI/CIA? I think most people are put off by the fact that it isn't centralized around ESPORTS.
I appreciate the effort, research, and time you put into attempting to make the ESPORTS aspect of the novel as authentic as possible. However, I think you could learn a few things by taking a couple hours to browse forums and interacting with the community, while keeping up with the latest tournaments and watching VoD's/documentaries etc.
Here's a really interesting read that encompasses a player's first experience in Korea as well: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=22425
As you can see, the ESPORTS experience in Korea isn't all glamour and ESPORTS bitches constantly (at least it wasn't in the BW days). Having a pro player enter a foreign land or being slightly apathetic to his wins and losses does not make for a compelling story. Progamers are people - they learn to grow up, they suffer with losses, they are ecstatic about wins, they are disillusioned about the glamour of ESPORTS, they worry about their future prospects, and they push themselves to continue.
In the end, my main concern after reading your sample chapters is that your protagonist doesn't wreak the same passion as many community members do. It seems he knows he's good, he takes his losses, and moves on like nobody's business. It just seems...arrogant? Bland? What is he learning? How is he growing?
I hope your book does well, but I hope the next time you choose to explore the ESPORTS setting you implement what you've learned from the feedback in the thread and from your book reviews. Best of luck.
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I commend your motivation for writing a book about Starcraft, which is much more than most people have done. However, after reading your sample chapters, maybe it's better that this book isn't the vanguard which represents TeamLiquid or eSports in the world of print novels...
The writing is objectively second rate, and the parts regarding the actual playing of the game have many factual errors in them. If you are writing a book about something that has norms and customs, it would be very beneficial for you to research them in much more depth. In this case, the actual Starcraft content is correct on the surface, meaning that the units and races are named correctly, but they are written about in the wrong way. This has the effect of irritating readers who are informed about the respective content, because instead of focusing on the story and characters, they will be distracted by the errors. I once watched a movie set in ancient Greece that was pretty well directed and authentic, but during one scene set in a marketplace (or agora) I saw one of the extras wearing a watch. That actually ruined the whole movie for me, since it was so out of place that I kept subconsciously checking the wrists of every character for watches, and missed a few important plot details.
In the case of this book, I was reading the first few paragraphs and I kept thinking "Why doesn't this Protoss player just make three Immortals and kill the entire tank line? Why is this Terran going mech in TvP? Why is this amazing American gamer practicing for the GSL in team games?" All of these things are similar to the wristwatch in the movie I mentioned - out of place and distracting to people who possess Starcraft knowledge.
The picture you paint of Sean in the sample chapters is also quite stereotypical - he's the gamer who hasn't showered in two days and whose apartment is filled with empty pizza boxes and cans of cola. The section concerning the girl who approaches him in the coffee shop also pushes this stereotype. If you look at some of the successful American progamers who have competed in Korea, such as Nony (Tyler), you'd find almost the exact opposite traits. The fact that your main character represents the stereotype that most gamers are trying to rid themselves of would alienate most informed readers of your book.
In addition, all of this criticism leaves out the spelling errors and grammatical mistakes that are present throughout the two sample chapters. I could go on, but I think I've made my point.
Finally, I'm not attempting to berate the author herself, as I think it's pretty cool that eSports is spreading to other realms than just TeamLiquid. All of my criticism pertains to the actual book and what it contains/represents.
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On June 23 2011 05:19 Chef wrote:My copy of that particular book is 223 pages long... Like I said it's no problem to stretch 75k words into a 200 page novel, but 300 is going to look really silly. Plus it's a children's book, they always make the font a little bigger so that kids don't lose interest reading a single page forever. edit: I looked it up... most of the editions I found were about 220 pages give or take a few, and one that was 320 pages which was marketed toward elementary school children (you can guess who spacey the font for that would be). So yeah, it's not exactly honest to call Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone a 300 page novel lol. We are talking about a font which is designed to give children confidence in their reading speed, not a realistic page count for an adult. Also, if you're thinking the baby's version might be longer because it has smaller pages, it doesn't. The pages are actually a few cm bigger lol. So basically the 220 page version which already has larger than normal font because it is marketed to young teens got an extra 100 pages, while still increasing the page size... What I'm saying is: your example was terrible.
lol kk. Thanks for the research.
220 pages paperback estimated
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Why is this amazing American gamer practicing for the GSL in team games on a laptop?
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On June 23 2011 05:23 shindigs wrote:Interesting concept for a book, but like many have echoed before me, a lot of things can definitely be refined. I understand that ESPORTS is just the setting of the novel, and it's mainly a thriller involving the FBI/CIA? I think most people are put off by the fact that it isn't centralized around ESPORTS. I appreciate the effort, research, and time you put into attempting to make the ESPORTS aspect of the novel as authentic as possible. However, I think you could learn a few things by taking a couple hours to browse forums and interacting with the community, while keeping up with the latest tournaments and watching VoD's/documentaries etc. Here's a really interesting read that encompasses a player's first experience in Korea as well: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=22425As you can see, the ESPORTS experience in Korea isn't all glamour and ESPORTS bitches constantly (at least it wasn't in the BW days). Having a pro player enter a foreign land or being slightly apathetic to his wins and losses does not make for a compelling story. Progamers are people - they learn to grow up, they suffer with losses, they are ecstatic about wins, they are disillusioned about the glamour of ESPORTS, they worry about their future prospects, and they push themselves to continue. In the end, my main concern after reading your sample chapters is that your protagonist doesn't wreak the same passion as many community members do. It seems he knows he's good, he takes his losses, and moves on like nobody's business. It just seems...arrogant? Bland? What is he learning? How is he growing? I hope your book does well, but I hope the next time you choose to explore the ESPORTS setting you implement what you've learned from the feedback in the thread and from your book reviews. Best of luck.
Thanks for the insight! My husband emphasized that a bit as well, and I think the angle of camaraderie in the Liquid/oGs house would make for a fun backdrop as well, but based on my ability to research and write a novel, I decided against it for this reason:
The more specific I get in regards the community, the easier it is going to be to miss details here and there and irritate the community.
I'm an author who spends a lot of time writing in a coffee shop.
While the protagonist may not be an accurate description of someone like HuK, who is super dedicated, (I see him get emails and facebook messages from his family back home a lot on his stream) I just think it would almost be disrespectful to try and put myself in his shoes and write his story.
So my book comes across as more of a Rocky style rags to riches bootstrapping character, which probably isn't 100% analogous to some of our eSports heroes, but I like his arc nonetheless.
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On June 23 2011 06:42 redFF wrote: Why is this amazing American gamer practicing for the GSL in team games on a laptop?
Lots of players play on a laptop. I know Drewbie does, and IdrA does as well I believe.
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On June 23 2011 06:07 HyperionDreamer wrote: I commend your motivation for writing a book about Starcraft, which is much more than most people have done. However, after reading your sample chapters, maybe it's better that this book isn't the vanguard which represents TeamLiquid or eSports in the world of print novels...
The writing is objectively second rate, and the parts regarding the actual playing of the game have many factual errors in them. If you are writing a book about something that has norms and customs, it would be very beneficial for you to research them in much more depth. In this case, the actual Starcraft content is correct on the surface, meaning that the units and races are named correctly, but they are written about in the wrong way. This has the effect of irritating readers who are informed about the respective content, because instead of focusing on the story and characters, they will be distracted by the errors. I once watched a movie set in ancient Greece that was pretty well directed and authentic, but during one scene set in a marketplace (or agora) I saw one of the extras wearing a watch. That actually ruined the whole movie for me, since it was so out of place that I kept subconsciously checking the wrists of every character for watches, and missed a few important plot details.
In the case of this book, I was reading the first few paragraphs and I kept thinking "Why doesn't this Protoss player just make three Immortals and kill the entire tank line? Why is this Terran going mech in TvP? Why is this amazing American gamer practicing for the GSL in team games?" All of these things are similar to the wristwatch in the movie I mentioned - out of place and distracting to people who possess Starcraft knowledge.
The picture you paint of Sean in the sample chapters is also quite stereotypical - he's the gamer who hasn't showered in two days and whose apartment is filled with empty pizza boxes and cans of cola. The section concerning the girl who approaches him in the coffee shop also pushes this stereotype. If you look at some of the successful American progamers who have competed in Korea, such as Nony (Tyler), you'd find almost the exact opposite traits. The fact that your main character represents the stereotype that most gamers are trying to rid themselves of would alienate most informed readers of your book.
In addition, all of this criticism leaves out the spelling errors and grammatical mistakes that are present throughout the two sample chapters. I could go on, but I think I've made my point.
Finally, I'm not attempting to berate the author herself, as I think it's pretty cool that eSports is spreading to other realms than just TeamLiquid. All of my criticism pertains to the actual book and what it contains/represents.
I think you could use a nicer word than second rate. Maybe, clearly this is my first book? 
I'll echo what I explained in an above reply. I don't think I could genuinely convey the lifestyle of an actual progamer. I've watched a lot of streams, spent a lot of time on Reddit. I know a lot about the community, but in the end I had to write a character I could relate to, or it would be pretty disingenuous.
As far as the games go, my husband did the fight choreography. A lot of the games were taken straight out of the GSL, and I know especially with Polt.Prime's Bio performance at GSL, no one is doing much of a mech style TvP these days, but it is used on occasion.
The picture of Sean comes a lot from Day[9] who usually has crazy hair going, and often times a few pizza boxes in the background on the daily. This may be more of a college student thing than a gamer thing, but the imagery worked for me 
As far as errors go, I still find errors in third editions of Dresden Files books, and I love me some Jim Butcher. I think they happen, but I can't afford the kind of editor who keeps them to a minimum.
And finally, thank you for taking the time to read the samples and communicate. Sales so far look like they are better outside the eSports community, which is good because it accomplishes my goal of helping to spread eSports, but it'd make me happy if the community embraced it more.
Hopefully once a few people have read it we'll get some good feedback on the thread and see how it goes 
Cheers!
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Reading the preview chapters makes me wish someone would actually make a book about SC2 and do it right.
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$5? That's like 1/3 of a lunch for me. I'll probably buy this. Especially with all the hate and dislike coming from this thread. Who cares if it's entirely fact based? It's fictional. That's kind of the definition.
I read fast(2~ pages / minute when I concentrate) so this should be a matter of hours of what I am pretty sure will be enjoyed time. Even if it's not, I haven't wasted a lot of money and I'll gladly show my support to e-sport fiction any day.
As people mentioned, describing the actual SC2 battles is not easy but from what I read in the sample chapters, you do a good job. Keep up the good work!
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On June 23 2011 07:21 Siretu wrote: $5? That's like 1/3 of a lunch for me. I'll probably buy this. Especially with all the hate and dislike coming from this thread. Who cares if it's entirely fact based? It's fictional. That's kind of the definition.
I read fast(2~ pages / minute when I concentrate) so this should be a matter of hours of what I am pretty sure will be enjoyed time. Even if it's not, I haven't wasted a lot of money and I'll gladly show my support to e-sport fiction any day.
As people mentioned, describing the actual SC2 battles is not easy but from what I read in the sample chapters, you do a good job. Keep up the good work!
Thanks! I don't mind the criticism, I expected as much. Much like writing a Star Wars novel, someone is going to take issue with the way you write about [Topic x]
Hope you enjoy it!
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and there will be a swedish version , pöwned, aswell?
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On June 23 2011 06:50 ErikaMitchell wrote:I think you could use a nicer word than second rate. Maybe, clearly this is my first book?  Sure, I guess there are nicer words, but that is what I do feel. I don't read much pulp fiction, but the few authors that I do read have much more effective writing styles. Obviously I don't expect Shakespeare from anyone, but there is a level of competency that I feel is achieved in all respected published material and not in the samples that I read.
I'll echo what I explained in an above reply. I don't think I could genuinely convey the lifestyle of an actual progamer. I've watched a lot of streams, spent a lot of time on Reddit. I know a lot about the community, but in the end I had to write a character I could relate to, or it would be pretty disingenuous
That's a fair statement. If you feel that you couldn't have portrayed this character as anything else without sounding false, then you made the right decision. I was more commenting on the stereotype that I previously described. Most people in society see it negatively, and I think it's more than fair to say that most (if not all) of the professional players that both you and I watch are not like that. If eSports is to grow in legitimacy, then this image has to either be re-cast in a favourable light in the eyes of society, or eliminated altogether; otherwise, the players will be seen as basement-dwellers rather than "athletes" in the traditional sense.
As far as the games go, my husband did the fight choreography. A lot of the games were taken straight out of the GSL, and I know especially with Polt.Prime's Bio performance at GSL, no one is doing much of a mech style TvP these days, but it is used on occasion.
My criticism of the actual Starcraft is mainly based on the established trends in the game - other than LiquidJinro using it once, I've never either seen or heard of a professional player using a mech style in TvP. Whether the fights are bio or mech, however, is not really important to the market outside of eSports followers. Being an eSports fan, it does somewhat bother me, but not enough that I discard your work altogether.
The picture of Sean comes a lot from Day[9] who usually has crazy hair going, and often times a few pizza boxes in the background on the daily. This may be more of a college student thing than a gamer thing, but the imagery worked for me  Nothing wrong with either crazy hair or pizza, but it's the gamer stereotype which comes in here as well. I kind of touched on that above.
As far as errors go, I still find errors in third editions of Dresden Files books, and I love me some Jim Butcher. I think they happen, but I can't afford the kind of editor who keeps them to a minimum. And finally, thank you for taking the time to read the samples and communicate. Sales so far look like they are better outside the eSports community, which is good because it accomplishes my goal of helping to spread eSports, but it'd make me happy if the community embraced it more. Hopefully once a few people have read it we'll get some good feedback on the thread and see how it goes 
I agree, errors do happen. In fact, I discovered that I had mis-spelled the word "water" as "watrr" two separate times when I was walking to hand in my graduate thesis a few years ago. 
However, the errors in your samples were frequent and obvious, which significantly degrades the overall quality of your writing. I think most of them could have been discovered in a cursory read-through, and I was surprised to find that many errors in the final draft of actual published work.
I completely understand sales being better outside of the established eSports community, because many of the things that I've mentioned wouldn't irritate them. As you've said, I think it would be really cool to have a work that was well received by both eSports fans and the public, and I think the things I've mentioned would go a long way towards satisfying the people inside the current community.
Good luck in the rest of your writing career.
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On June 23 2011 06:07 HyperionDreamer wrote:
In the case of this book, I was reading the first few paragraphs and I kept thinking "Why doesn't this Protoss player just make three Immortals and kill the entire tank line? Why is this Terran going mech in TvP? Why is this amazing American gamer practicing for the GSL in team games?"
First of all, a protoss player can't make three immortals and simply march them into a choke to kill a bunch of sieged tanks. I agree that it's odd that a terran is going mech in TvP, but it's not like we haven't seen it before. Perhaps because it's a team game, and his mech can help deal with the other races as well? I also think it's strange that someone is practicing for the GSL in team games. But remember, this is in the first chapter of the book. This scene, despite the fact that it might not be entirely realistic, establishes certain facts about Sean's personality and introduces characters in a way that an account of a ladder game couldn't do.
I agree that the scene isn't completely realistic. The point of my response is simply to point out that the situation might not be as simple as it seems at first glance, and that the team game aspect does play an important role in setting up the novel.
Edit:
[QUOTE]On June 23 2011 07:44 HyperionDreamer wrote: [QUOTE]On June 23 2011 06:50 ErikaMitchell wrote: [quote] As far as the games go, my husband did the fight choreography. A lot of the games were taken straight out of the GSL, and I know especially with Polt.Prime's Bio performance at GSL, no one is doing much of a mech style TvP these days, but it is used on occasion. [/quote]
My criticism of the actual Starcraft is mainly based on the established trends in the game - other than LiquidJinro using it once, I've never either seen or heard of a professional player using a mech style in TvP. Whether the fights are bio or mech, however, is not really important to the market outside of eSports followers. Being an eSports fan, it does somewhat bother me, but not enough that I discard your work altogether. .[/QUOTE]
There have actually been a few other instances of Terrans meching against Protoss. Before Thors were nerfed (the patch came after the book was written), a lot of Terrans were experimenting with mass Thor builds. Famously, ThorZain did it to defeat MC in the TSL3 semi-finals. Once again, I agree with you that it's a bit odd, but it's not unheard of.
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On June 23 2011 06:50 ErikaMitchell wrote: As far as errors go, I still find errors in third editions of Dresden Files books, and I love me some Jim Butcher. I think they happen, but I can't afford the kind of editor who keeps them to a minimum.
Isn't your publisher supposed to take care of getting your book edited before actually publishing it ?
Are you getting a vanity publication ? Because it sounds like it.
I think the whole thing reads like you tried too hard to put in references and geeky stuff that would cater to your target audience. I find it cheesy and not well written. But you know what ? I'd probably enjoy reading it, like some guilty pleasure movie I'd watch because it connects to something I love (The Wizard comes to mind).
Keep on writing and congratulations on actually finishing a manuscript ! Good or bad, it's more than most of the "wannabe writers" will ever achieve.
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Papua New Guinea1058 Posts
On June 22 2011 04:26 ErikaMitchell wrote: PWNED: The best book about Starcraft 2 gamers you haven't read yet. Ego trippin much?
Would surely check it out if there were a translation or at least a native sale, since I'm a big enemy of e-books.
On a second thought tho, after reading the sample it seems pretty forced and fake. Seems like a story written by someone that has no clue about the world he/she's trying to describe. Just my personal thoughts, no hating. It's still pretty cool that someone actually makes an attempt like that.
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On June 23 2011 07:56 Silfurstar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 06:50 ErikaMitchell wrote: As far as errors go, I still find errors in third editions of Dresden Files books, and I love me some Jim Butcher. I think they happen, but I can't afford the kind of editor who keeps them to a minimum.
Isn't your publisher supposed to take care of getting your book edited before actually publishing it ? Are you getting a vanity publication ? Because it sounds like it. I think the whole thing reads like you tried too hard to put in references and geeky stuff that would cater to your target audience. I find it cheesy and not well written. But you know what ? I'd probably enjoy reading it, like some guilty pleasure movie I'd watch because it connects to something I love (The Wizard comes to mind). Keep on writing and congratulations on actually finishing a manuscript ! Good or bad, it's more than most of the "wannabe writers" will ever achieve.
Yes, but that doesn't mean it was a GOOD editor. First time authors don't get a lot of attention
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It's just too forced. And the writing leaves a lot to be desired. However, it is an interesting idea. The biggest problem that I see is that it won't really appeal to the 'hardcore' fans of sc2, nor the masses. So who is the intended audience?
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I wish you luck with your book and any future publications, but I feel your writing style, and especially your content (FBI story? :/ ) could use improving.
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On June 23 2011 08:08 ErikaMitchell wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 07:56 Silfurstar wrote:On June 23 2011 06:50 ErikaMitchell wrote: As far as errors go, I still find errors in third editions of Dresden Files books, and I love me some Jim Butcher. I think they happen, but I can't afford the kind of editor who keeps them to a minimum.
Isn't your publisher supposed to take care of getting your book edited before actually publishing it ? Are you getting a vanity publication ? Because it sounds like it. I think the whole thing reads like you tried too hard to put in references and geeky stuff that would cater to your target audience. I find it cheesy and not well written. But you know what ? I'd probably enjoy reading it, like some guilty pleasure movie I'd watch because it connects to something I love (The Wizard comes to mind). Keep on writing and congratulations on actually finishing a manuscript ! Good or bad, it's more than most of the "wannabe writers" will ever achieve. Yes, but that doesn't mean it was a GOOD editor. First time authors don't get a lot of attention 
If a publisher cares about your book and wants to push it, he'll do good work on it. At least in french publishing, that's how it goes.
The only times I've seen obvious poor editing work was in the case of vanity press (the author actually pays to get his book published, gets a percentage on every sale and hopes that it sells enough for him to break even).
Are you in this situation ?
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the Dagon Knight4002 Posts
I am tempted to purchase a copy, that I might stream myself reading it.
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On June 23 2011 08:37 SirJolt wrote: I am tempted to purchase a copy, that I might stream myself reading it.
Lol. That's very Andy Kaufman of you.
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On June 23 2011 08:08 ErikaMitchell wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 07:56 Silfurstar wrote:On June 23 2011 06:50 ErikaMitchell wrote: As far as errors go, I still find errors in third editions of Dresden Files books, and I love me some Jim Butcher. I think they happen, but I can't afford the kind of editor who keeps them to a minimum.
Isn't your publisher supposed to take care of getting your book edited before actually publishing it ? Are you getting a vanity publication ? Because it sounds like it. I think the whole thing reads like you tried too hard to put in references and geeky stuff that would cater to your target audience. I find it cheesy and not well written. But you know what ? I'd probably enjoy reading it, like some guilty pleasure movie I'd watch because it connects to something I love (The Wizard comes to mind). Keep on writing and congratulations on actually finishing a manuscript ! Good or bad, it's more than most of the "wannabe writers" will ever achieve. Yes, but that doesn't mean it was a GOOD editor. First time authors don't get a lot of attention 
Erika, I don't mean to be insulting but stop calling yourself a first-time author. You're not. You're an aspiring writer. You can call yourself an author after you get a book deal from a legit publishing house. Your claim of being an author is a slap in the face to the many, many writers who strive for years honing their craft and imagination to achieve actual success. There's a reason self-publishing and vanity publishing are considered faux pas in the writing world. And pretty much any editor would consider it a giant red flag if you mentioned such a publication in a query letter.
Trying to market yourself on a site where it's obvious the vast majority of people have no idea how to distinguish the difference between a vanity pub and a legit pub is somewhat facetious, which is probably why Chef is so critical of you.
To Chef: 250 words constitutes the standard "page" in the publishing world. Any house can distort the actual page count to whatever the hell they want using font changes, spacing, etc just like you mentioned. My point is that it's kind of retarded to try to guesstimate what her paperback page count should be. That's why nobody does it. They just go by word count. And as such, a 75K book is not far off the mark. Average range for a novel runs from 80k to 100k.
P.S. You never answered whether your book was published or not. Why would you use your own book as an example if it wasn't in print somewhere? That seems like a much more terrible example than mine, considering Harry Potter is in print at 300+ pages on the bookshelves. Can I find your 96k word book somewhere on a shelf at 200+ pages?
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the Dagon Knight4002 Posts
On June 23 2011 08:43 ErikaMitchell wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 08:37 SirJolt wrote: I am tempted to purchase a copy, that I might stream myself reading it. Lol. That's very Andy Kaufman of you.
I'm going to need you to be direct with me here Erika, is this permission?
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That is the most absolute retarded story synopsis I've ever heard.
It just sounds like you've tried to throw in as many catch phrases as you could to appeal to a nerdier audience instead of actually writing an interesting book.
User was temp banned for this post.
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On June 23 2011 07:28 ErikaMitchell wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 07:21 Siretu wrote: $5? That's like 1/3 of a lunch for me. I'll probably buy this. Especially with all the hate and dislike coming from this thread. Who cares if it's entirely fact based? It's fictional. That's kind of the definition.
I read fast(2~ pages / minute when I concentrate) so this should be a matter of hours of what I am pretty sure will be enjoyed time. Even if it's not, I haven't wasted a lot of money and I'll gladly show my support to e-sport fiction any day.
As people mentioned, describing the actual SC2 battles is not easy but from what I read in the sample chapters, you do a good job. Keep up the good work! Thanks! I don't mind the criticism, I expected as much. Much like writing a Star Wars novel, someone is going to take issue with the way you write about [Topic x] Hope you enjoy it!
teamliquid is the most elitist and ego driven community in the world. we have very high standards compared to even the toughest critics. check out the survey threads and you'll see the type of people you are really dealing with.
cheer up and take it with a grain of salt. from the sample chapters, your book is actually well written and the general idea that it is actually a thriller goes way over the heads of the fact-driven starcraft evangelists around here that only care that jinro meched twice in GSL january.
i will definitely purchase for the read, but also to support first time authors that show an interest in such a niche genre.
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On June 22 2011 17:03 Cel.erity wrote: From what I read of the writing itself, I'm going to give you some very constructive criticism, from one writer to another: use less adjectives. Adjectives and adverbs are powerful descriptive tools, but reliance on them often shows insecurity in your writing ability, and it seems that you use them in a rather overabundance. Once you describe the character as having curly hair, or whatever, you don't really need to address him later in the book by saying that "His curly locks swayed majestically in the breeze as his feet carried him with unyielding swiftness to the coffee shop". There are more elegant ways of getting your point across. Try getting inside the head of your main character rather than reiterating what a random passerby might see if they were looking at him for the first time. You're creating a distance from your character with phrases like these.
This is what I'm talking about right here. The fact that the whole thing (that I've seen) reads like an itinerary of the guys day to day life... with no interesting thoughts or characteristics for us to attach us to it him. Couple these two things together. There is scarcely a noun that is not preceded by 3 or 4 fluffy adjectives. Its just too much.
It's like those birthday cakes, when you go to your 3yo nephew's birthday party, that are made of like 80% that fluffy, overly sweet icing in huge globs and in bright colors, with only a few crumbs of the chocolate cake itself to eat... that's exactly what it's like. It's just too much fluff.
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I see a lot of male readers here (to be expected, really). The book reads like it's written for a predominantly female audiences (if you ever accidently picked up one of those paperbags with scantily dressed ladies clutching on the shoulder of a muscular guy, mistaking it for a porn, you know what I mean),
I suppose the author been a woman is one of the reasons why the book is written this way, but kudo to you for actually sat down and write it all up.
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On June 23 2011 11:21 cursor wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 17:03 Cel.erity wrote: From what I read of the writing itself, I'm going to give you some very constructive criticism, from one writer to another: use less adjectives. Adjectives and adverbs are powerful descriptive tools, but reliance on them often shows insecurity in your writing ability, and it seems that you use them in a rather overabundance. Once you describe the character as having curly hair, or whatever, you don't really need to address him later in the book by saying that "His curly locks swayed majestically in the breeze as his feet carried him with unyielding swiftness to the coffee shop". There are more elegant ways of getting your point across. Try getting inside the head of your main character rather than reiterating what a random passerby might see if they were looking at him for the first time. You're creating a distance from your character with phrases like these. This is what I'm talking about right here. The fact that the whole thing (that I've seen) reads like an itinerary of the guys day to day life... with no interesting thoughts or characteristics for us to attach us to it him. Couple these two things together. There is scarcely a noun that is not preceded by 3 or 4 fluffy adjectives. Its just too much. It's like those birthday cakes, when you go to your 3yo nephew's birthday party, that are made of like 80% that fluffy, overly sweet icing in huge globs and in bright colors, with only a few crumbs of the chocolate cake itself to eat... that's exactly what it's like. It's just too much fluff.
Or you could just call it amateur writing.
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Read the sample chapters. Definitely amateur writing, not worth $5, IMO.
Sorry, I'm generally positive about starcraft fan art, but this book is bad (based on the available samples). Further, self-publishing is not the same thing as having a real publishing house with a professional editor work on your book. You seem to not grasp this, which is obnoxious to literary nerds like myself. Don't give up on writing though -- try getting a story published in one of the many amateur literary 'zines (a greater accomplishment for an aspiring author than self-publishing) or do some writing workshops. And definitely don't give up on writing about SC2 -- I think it's a great concept.
You might get a better response if you were to more honestly present your material as amateur writing (eg, on a fanfic site), instead of trying to charge money for it.
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On June 23 2011 09:07 iko wrote: That is the most absolute retarded story synopsis I've ever heard.
It just sounds like you've tried to throw in as many catch phrases as you could to appeal to a nerdier audience instead of actually writing an interesting book.
User was temp banned for this post.
temp banned for truth
User was temp banned for this post.
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What happened to susySquark's book review on Amazon? lol.
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On June 23 2011 17:01 lutarez wrote: What happened to susySquark's book review on Amazon? lol. Ya, the one I referenced in my comments is most definitely gone. Too bad because it was a really well written, and obviously well thought out critique of the book. I would encourage whoever wrote it to post it again, and post it here, and also complain to Amazon that they are taking down negative comments. My complaint has already been sent to the site. Some suspicious stuff there, unless the user was talked into voluntarily removing it on their own, which I guess would be okay.
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the Dagon Knight4002 Posts
The review may have been pulled down because it went up too early to possibly have been based on the finished book (if it only went on sale in the last two days)
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I am cautiously pessimistic. A year seems far too short a time to develop this, and the blurb in the OP seems to contain far more draws to pop factor than genuinely interesting plotting or character development.
It feels very X generic modern battler deals with Y shady organisation based on Z (insert talent relevant to getting relevant niche group interested here) skill.
That said, it could just be a little lack of skill in blurbing, which is in itself not the easiest thing to do. I await the judgement of my peers...
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Am i the only one who liked this? :D
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On June 22 2011 05:04 Odal wrote: I don't know if any of you have actually read the chapters but.. Practicing for gsl in team games? It's horribly written and it makes me embarrassed to be a member of the starcraft community
Couldn't agree more.
Is this seriously what passes for literature these days?
Utter rubbish.
On June 22 2011 05:04 micronesia wrote:I'll wait. Maybe I'll get a paperback; I'll get The Starcraft Bible also and put it next to The Epic Blog. Any others I'm missing? I want the best bookshelf in esports.
Thanks Micronesia, at least something descent came of this thread.
EDIT: OK, I feel I better qualify my reaction - the plot is woefully generic (come on an FBI plot) - what's wrong with a realist fictional interpretation of SC2 progamership? I mean, from reading TL the lifestyle is incredible, full of passion and drama. The writing style is cliche ridden as well and lacks attention to language. Also, what's with the major inaccuracies in depicting its subject matter and lack of plausibility, where was your research?
I won't apologies for my opinion, I really can't cliche driven narrative at the best of times.
Haters, gonna hate I guess.
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Usually I dislike the hating by the TL Community but I have to agree that this book doesn't seem to offer the "passionate, creative starcraft 2 story" that we all would love to read. Dont get me wrong, I really appreciate such effort. But when I read this thread I almost feel betrayed, like somebody just said "Hey, you like starcraft 2. I've written a book that has a starcraft 2 story on it. Now buy it, k?"
The story doesn't even sound interesting(at the first look!), it sounds more like a fantasy GSL and suddenly a player is to be arrested and ... well, thats all(I don't want to spoiler myself anything if it turns out to be a good book so I didn't read through all the example paragraphs) I mean, whats the point? Even the advertising is fully based upon the fact that SC2 is in this book - and now we all should buy it? No. I don't buy keyboards just because they have "starcraft 2" written on them neither do I buy books that have "starcraft 2" in them.
I want quality stories & decent writing / telling styles...but it seems that the author / advertiser doesn't even care about that (at least this is what I get from the OP). All I read is "starcraft 2!", "starcraft 2" and "day9".
Can someone explain this? I would love to read a good book featuring such kind of story but I don't want to read just "random blabla" about starcraft 2.
I hope I don't get banned for this as I'm not trolling here or anything, this is my honest view on it and I hope that someone can proof me wrong, I would love to have a good book here.
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aw cool
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On June 23 2011 22:02 KeksX wrote:I want quality stories & decent writing / telling styles...but it seems that the author / advertiser doesn't even care about that (at least this is what I get from the OP). All I read is "starcraft 2!", "starcraft 2" and "day9".
Yes, I'm somewhat curious to read the book just so I can get to the description and dialogue of Day9.
Before him stood Sean "Day[9]" Plott, 9 being a number which is higher than 8. Sean towered above him in all his leggy glory, his glasses poised atop the bridge of his nose as is typical of glasses, his voice soothing like a Halls throat lozenge.
"You can do this, Sean," said Sean. "You can be the very best. Like no one ever was."
"But Sean," said Sean, "I have traveled across the land, searching far and wide..."
Sean cut him off. "You're my best friend, Sean. Our courage will pull us through. Now go pwn some noobs, gosu star captain."
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On June 23 2011 22:39 Cel.erity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 22:02 KeksX wrote:I want quality stories & decent writing / telling styles...but it seems that the author / advertiser doesn't even care about that (at least this is what I get from the OP). All I read is "starcraft 2!", "starcraft 2" and "day9". Yes, I'm somewhat curious to read the book just so I can get to the description and dialogue of Day9. Before him stood Sean "Day[9]" Plott, 9 being a number which is higher than 8. Sean towered above him in all his leggy glory, his glasses poised atop the bridge of his nose as is typical of glasses, his voice soothing like a Halls throat lozenge. "You can do this, Sean," said Sean. "You can be the very best. Like no one ever was." "But Sean," said Sean, "I have traveled across the land, searching far and wide..." Sean cut him off. "You're my best friend, Sean. Our courage will pull us through. Now go pwn some noobs, gosu star captain."
Now this is the kind of novel I'd read.
God speed you black emperor.
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On June 23 2011 17:01 lutarez wrote: What happened to susySquark's book review on Amazon? lol.
I'm guessing it that it might be because susySquark effectively gave his/her impressions of the preview chapters rather than presenting a full review. At least that is a non-shady reason that comes to mind (though I am somewhat surprised that the ratings are all 5 stars now, though they could be well-meaning family members...) . See the following excerpts from the review:
Sean Boxer, as far as the first two chapters go, does not think and is not passionate about anything.
While we don't get a glimpse of it in the sample chapters, I can forgive that for the development that should have been happening.
While I'd love to support endeavors of the Starcraft community, the sample chapters do not give me much faith that my expectations for a good plot or setting will be met.
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On June 23 2011 03:50 MaestroSC wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 02:21 [F_]aths wrote: The work is obviously fiction, not a documentary. In a fictional world, a GSL (or GSTL) can conduct team games. Why not make it more interesting and just have the player use his super mind powers to speak through the computer to his units without the use of a keyboard/mouse and he can get actual information/data directly from his units, as well as give orders from inside of his Command Center, while playing chess with Jim Raynor and Sarah Kerrigan? Cause even fictional pieces have to maintain a certain amount of coherency/credibility. Fiction does not mean "anything goes." Don't set your piece in a real world setting, revolving around a real world event, and then be horribly inaccurate with the writing. You cant set a story during the World Cup of Soccer/Football and talk about how it was 35 v 35 on the field. That won't work because Soccer is too widely known.
Star Trek works as science fiction even though warp drive and transporter technology is completely un-scientific.
Starcraft itself works even though mutas flap their wings in space.
One could imagine that a future GSTL league actually conducts 3v3 games. It is very unlikely but not impossible. That is easier for me to swallow than the language of the book (the way many sentences are constructed.)
Lets imagine one would like to try to write a story evolving around the SC scene. When you have the main plot worked out, you probably need to bend some RL facts. As long as the book don't claims to be a documentary-like real description of the actual scene I consider it (while still sub-optimal) okay.
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I hated on this book because sean boxer turned down a co-ed to eat thai food in his bachelor pad.
Sean Plott would have turned down a co-ed to cast a daily.
Boxer would have turned down a co-ed because he has a super hot korean girlfriend.
Sean Boxer does/has neither.
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the Dagon Knight4002 Posts
On June 24 2011 00:53 MaboTofu wrote: I hated on this book because sean boxer turned down a co-ed to eat thai food in his bachelor pad.
Sean Plott would have turned down a co-ed to cast a daily.
Boxer would have turned down a co-ed because he has a super hot korean girlfriend.
Sean Boxer does/has neither.
Incorrect, sir. The Sean Boxer I envision would not have turned her down...
He would have invited her back to his bachelor pad so that he could stream him getting it on with both his hot korean girlfriend and the nice young lady who met him in the restaurant.
+ Show Spoiler +I should write fanfics professionally.
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I'm having trouble giving an honest response to this without coming off as a dick. Its not that the writing is terrible - there are published works with a similar level of prose. Its not that the concept is too pulpish or seems intended to capitalize on a particular sub-culture, as you can have a good book without great depth or breadth.
Its just that it comes across as... masturbatory. From the first chapter, the main character is a world class Starcraft II player (at least according to the plot summary), a famous novelist and turns down beautiful women as they throw themselves at him. All he needs is a huge dick, a degree from Harvard and MIT and billions of dollars from the inventions he designed while recovering from the wounds that earned him the Medal of Honor.
And "The professionally apathetic barista who slouched behind the register took his money before shuffling over to begin her alchemy on the beans and milk that were her ply and trade" or "People emerged from the void that existed behind his closed eyelids, their conflicts and characteristics wrapped around each of them like cauls" or "Her smooth face, faux-vintage clothes, and haphazardly knitted scarf broadcasted her age well enough that Sean felt confident it would be illegal to serve her alcohol".... that's not good writing, that's what people imagine good writing to be when they are not the ones being subjected to it.
Its like a singer who believes herself to be a diva doing runs and variations demonstrating her great vocal gifts when simply singing the song correctly would create a much better work. You don't have to show off.
Take: "He took atavistic pleasure in imagining her pouting toward his turned back as he left the coffee shop..." You better have a damn good reason for using a word like "atavistic" if you're going to do it. There's few worse habits a writer can fall into than trying to show of vocabulary and not using the word quite right. Perhaps the use was appropriate here... maybe you wanted to emphasize the protagonists sophistication by framing the appeal of the co-ed as primitive and beneath him. But there are enough other examples - "modulated", "defunct", "forthcoming" - of questionably used words that it becomes very distracting.
One more critique is the repetitive sentence construction. "Xing ----, he y'ed" was overused. Its especially questionable in a thriller - past is OK but you're getting into real passive territory here even when your verbs are actually pretty active.
"Turning around, he yanked on the cord that dangled from his window blinds, sending them shooting up to the top of the window in a screaming hurry. ...Grabbing a trashcan from the kitchen, he hefted its bulging bag out of it and replacing it with an empty one. Carrying the can over to his desk, he shot out his arm and swept everything but his laptop into the trash.... After shaking his head like a dog to rid his floppy hair of the rain, he shuffled to the counter and ordered....Sipping the hot coffee, he closed his eyes and slipped backward into the parallel universe he’d begun creating a week ago....She sat backward in her chair, facing him with her arms folded across the top of the backrest. ...She modulated the remainder of her response, striving for the happy medium....He glanced at his watch and leaned down to pack up his laptop, replying as he did,....Tipping her a wink, he said...caught up to him, looking ....lay back and closed his eyes he couldn’t stop his mind from racing through the night’s matches, replaying the mistakes..."
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On June 24 2011 03:04 PantsB wrote: I'm having trouble giving an honest response to this without coming off as a dick...
You don't come off as a dick. Clearly you spent a lot of time on this.
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im using my first post on this! sounds really cool i will look forward to reading it ty for taking my post virginity!
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Even though it's now smaller, the OP is way better now. Great reaction! That alone will make the decision easier 
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On June 24 2011 04:43 KeksX wrote:Even though it's now smaller, the OP is way better now. Great reaction! That alone will make the decision easier 
Thanks! I tried to take my cue from the posts here
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On June 24 2011 05:02 ErikaMitchell wrote:Show nested quote +On June 24 2011 04:43 KeksX wrote:Even though it's now smaller, the OP is way better now. Great reaction! That alone will make the decision easier  Thanks! I tried to take my cue from the posts here 
Now where are the links to Amazon etc.?
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Now where are the links to Amazon etc.?
FTFY.
PWNED is available for purchase from Amazon (TL Referral Link!) and Barnes & Noble as an e-book, with additional e-book outlets like iTunes coming soon.
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You seriously edited the OP to basically say "Buy my book, ESPORTTSS"? People should buy a book if it is good, not because it supports a cause.
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the Dagon Knight4002 Posts
On June 22 2011 04:26 ErikaMitchell wrote:Why should I buy this book?Three things come to mind: - It's a good way to help promote eSports
Excuse me if this seems like I'm heckling, but can you please explain how this works?
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Excuse me if this seems like I'm heckling, but can you please explain how this works?
No problem.
I'm not gonna promote eSports with the Team Liquid crowd, y'all are obviously fans of eSports.
However, so far %75 of sales have come from sites outside of the eSports community (Good Reads, etc...)
Most of these people have no idea that there is such a thing as a professional gamer. This is my target audience, people (who like myself 8 months ago) had no idea that eSports was a thing, that some dude in Korea just picked up 100k for winning a video game tournament.
The feedback from that end has been great so far. I won't reveal sales info, but I can tell you we've exposed a lot of people in 2.5 days to eSports and I feel good about that.
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female + bad writing + appealing badly to a nerdy niche dominated by men = female with the cluster b narcissistic disorder; characterized by low self esteem but conflicting excessive egocentrism and little empathy, which motivates bursts of intensive study on a male's priority interest, in order to gain an esteem boost from being seen as better or equal than men in that field and as such perceives herself to be far ahead of other women on the desirable-o-meter. if you need more proof than this book, you can confirm this with just a few seconds of research on her person.
I wouldn't care so much about an author's motivations, but this distinct personality disorder often enrages me with their ego-blinded unperceptive attempts at things that their heart isn't in to begin with.
a paste about the disorder:
This personality disorder is characterized by feelings of envy, fragile self-esteem, and behavior that is often seeking approval or admiration. The person usually has little empathy (identification with and understanding of another's situation, feelings or motives) [etc]
Symptoms: Grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements) Preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love. Believes that they are "special" and unique and can only be understoody by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions). Requires excessive admiration. Has a sense of entitlement i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with their expectations. Is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve their own needs. Lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others. [such as how this book is percieved by veterans of starcraft]
awaiting ban because no mod on tl.net likes an informative post. even when everyone here clearly needs to l2psychology.
User was banned for this post.
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On June 24 2011 08:49 bulldyke wrote: female + bad writing + appealing badly to a nerdy niche dominated by men = female with the cluster b narcissistic disorder; characterized by low self esteem but conflicting excessive egocentrism and little empathy, which motivates bursts of intensive study on a male's priority interest, in order to gain an esteem boost from being seen as better or equal than men in that field and as such perceives herself to be far ahead of other women on the desirable-o-meter. if you need more proof than this book, you can confirm this with just a few seconds of research on her person.
I wouldn't care so much about an author's motivations, but this distinct personality disorder often enrages me with their ego-blinded unperceptive attempts at things that their heart isn't in to begin with.
a paste about the disorder:
This personality disorder is characterized by feelings of envy, fragile self-esteem, and behavior that is often seeking approval or admiration. The person usually has little empathy (identification with and understanding of another's situation, feelings or motives) [etc]
Symptoms: Grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements) Preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love. Believes that they are "special" and unique and can only be understoody by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions). Requires excessive admiration. Has a sense of entitlement i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with their expectations. Is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve their own needs. Lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others. [such as how this book is percieved by veterans of starcraft]
awaiting ban because no mod on tl.net likes an informative post. even when everyone here clearly needs to l2psychology.
You're clearly new here + it looks like you have heard the term for this disorder before (perhaps a psychology 101 or bro-ology 101 class) and copypasted it so you could trollrage.
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Anything helping spread esports is a good thing. No idea why people are being so harah x.x The OP looks much better now and really makes buying the book much more attractive.
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Ender's Game will be untouched in terms of gaming perspective. But writing for ESPORTS is relatively untouched, yes.
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The sample chapters kind of read like a thesaurus, and I'm not really interested in the story itself, but since TL gets "a piece" of the sale and that's a nice gesture by you, I may throw $5 at it.
How much does TL get out of the sale, how much do you get, how much does Amazon take? In short, where would my money go?
Nothing personal, I'm sure you had a lot of fun writing the story and I'm not going to submit some long winded diatribe of a critical review, just wondering where my Lincoln will end up going.
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A vanity pub does not make you an author. And Sean Boxer, really?
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Too big of a closet nerd not to buy this.
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On June 24 2011 03:04 PantsB wrote: I'm having trouble giving an honest response to this without coming off as a dick. Its not that the writing is terrible - there are published works with a similar level of prose. Its not that the concept is too pulpish or seems intended to capitalize on a particular sub-culture, as you can have a good book without great depth or breadth.
Its just that it comes across as... masturbatory. From the first chapter, the main character is a world class Starcraft II player (at least according to the plot summary), a famous novelist and turns down beautiful women as they throw themselves at him. All he needs is a huge dick, a degree from Harvard and MIT and billions of dollars from the inventions he designed while recovering from the wounds that earned him the Medal of Honor.
And "The professionally apathetic barista who slouched behind the register took his money before shuffling over to begin her alchemy on the beans and milk that were her ply and trade" or "People emerged from the void that existed behind his closed eyelids, their conflicts and characteristics wrapped around each of them like cauls" or "Her smooth face, faux-vintage clothes, and haphazardly knitted scarf broadcasted her age well enough that Sean felt confident it would be illegal to serve her alcohol".... that's not good writing, that's what people imagine good writing to be when they are not the ones being subjected to it.
Its like a singer who believes herself to be a diva doing runs and variations demonstrating her great vocal gifts when simply singing the song correctly would create a much better work. You don't have to show off.
Take: "He took atavistic pleasure in imagining her pouting toward his turned back as he left the coffee shop..." You better have a damn good reason for using a word like "atavistic" if you're going to do it. There's few worse habits a writer can fall into than trying to show of vocabulary and not using the word quite right. Perhaps the use was appropriate here... maybe you wanted to emphasize the protagonists sophistication by framing the appeal of the co-ed as primitive and beneath him. But there are enough other examples - "modulated", "defunct", "forthcoming" - of questionably used words that it becomes very distracting.
One more critique is the repetitive sentence construction. "Xing ----, he y'ed" was overused. Its especially questionable in a thriller - past is OK but you're getting into real passive territory here even when your verbs are actually pretty active.
"Turning around, he yanked on the cord that dangled from his window blinds, sending them shooting up to the top of the window in a screaming hurry. ...Grabbing a trashcan from the kitchen, he hefted its bulging bag out of it and replacing it with an empty one. Carrying the can over to his desk, he shot out his arm and swept everything but his laptop into the trash.... After shaking his head like a dog to rid his floppy hair of the rain, he shuffled to the counter and ordered....Sipping the hot coffee, he closed his eyes and slipped backward into the parallel universe he’d begun creating a week ago....She sat backward in her chair, facing him with her arms folded across the top of the backrest. ...She modulated the remainder of her response, striving for the happy medium....He glanced at his watch and leaned down to pack up his laptop, replying as he did,....Tipping her a wink, he said...caught up to him, looking ....lay back and closed his eyes he couldn’t stop his mind from racing through the night’s matches, replaying the mistakes..."
Agree wholeheartedly with all of this. Exactly the same feeling I got when I read this. You can't just put an overemphasis on descriptive words and not actually structure the sentences to run smoothly. Doing so even detracts from the already barely existent voice of the novel. There has to be a greater meaning behind these words. They have to speak to the mental state of the protagonist, his status in life. We want to feel like we are seeing the world through the eyes of the main character and puking out a diverse vocabulary just doesn't cut it.
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On June 24 2011 08:49 bulldyke wrote:+ Show Spoiler +female + bad writing + appealing badly to a nerdy niche dominated by men = female with the cluster b narcissistic disorder; characterized by low self esteem but conflicting excessive egocentrism and little empathy, which motivates bursts of intensive study on a male's priority interest, in order to gain an esteem boost from being seen as better or equal than men in that field and as such perceives herself to be far ahead of other women on the desirable-o-meter. if you need more proof than this book, you can confirm this with just a few seconds of research on her person.
I wouldn't care so much about an author's motivations, but this distinct personality disorder often enrages me with their ego-blinded unperceptive attempts at things that their heart isn't in to begin with.
a paste about the disorder:
This personality disorder is characterized by feelings of envy, fragile self-esteem, and behavior that is often seeking approval or admiration. The person usually has little empathy (identification with and understanding of another's situation, feelings or motives) [etc]
Symptoms: Grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements) Preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love. Believes that they are "special" and unique and can only be understoody by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions). Requires excessive admiration. Has a sense of entitlement i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with their expectations. Is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve their own needs. Lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others. [such as how this book is percieved by veterans of starcraft]
awaiting ban because no mod on tl.net likes an informative post. even when everyone here clearly needs to l2psychology. User was banned for this post. Psych? How are you going to come assuming that people here need to l2psychology? Really? How do you know that there aren't posts made well before yours by people that know much more than you in the field? I've seen some pretty good critique here, and yours doesn't rank very highly. I imagine the poster probably thought the ban would make his post seem weighty and consequential, but everyone here knows that martyring yourself is a ban 100% of the time.
You don't have nearly enough information to make any kind of real diagnosis; you're guessing about a lot of stuff, and really making an overcomplicated diagnosis of a very simple situation. This book is obviously the bi-product of a relationship where one person is a "writer" and one is a fan of Starcraft. Write a book, has an audience, unique subject matter, even if poor in the details. You yourself are obviously looking to make up from some sort of feelings on inadequacy by trying to look smart, lashing out at admins and every other poster before you, for no reason. But no psychologist worth his weight in salt would try to make a real diagnosis based on your actions here. Such an obvious attempt to get attention and mix things up. The irony is hilarious.
This is a thread about a book. No need to come around martyring yourself, making little sense, and not even for a good cause. If you're gonna martyr yourself, do it somewhere useful like the Strategy sections with some serious balance whining.
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How are you going to make his name Boxer.... Anyhow, I'm sure he has a friend named Nick Garimto who casts with Dan SilentControl.
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On June 23 2011 03:44 MaestroSC wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 02:14 Scouter wrote:We actually set up the Amazon link with Team Liquid so they get money for each purchase  ... amazing. "Buy this book, cause it says Starcraft 2 and esports." Which it looks like some people are willing to buy simply because of your gimmicks, but honestly it is kind of amazing that people are willing to exploit something they love. Some people say this is promoting esports, I would love to hear how a terribly written, horrendously false, and incredibly misleading book about esports is "good for the scene." (Honestly I don't see this doing anything to actually affect the scene as the only people who are going to buy it are the 4-5 people who just see "esports!!!!" and buy it simply for that. Anyone without those blinders on will not even make it past the preview pages.) But at least you are smart enough to say now "Buy it for esports and buy it for team liquid!" increasing your gimmick level in hopes to trick people into buying this.
There's nothing like the internet to bring out the negativity that some people harbor inside them.
On another note, it's obvious that the majority of TLers criticizing the book are doing so because it doesn't appeal to them specifically even though it's about Starcraft 2. It's similar to the reason a lot of the more hardcore players don't like casters such as Total Biscuit - he doesn't know very much about the game and can get some things wrong. This author clearly doesn't know a whole lot about Starcraft and hasn't made her description of the players and competitive scene extremely accurate, which is not what a lot of TLers would be interested in. What you guys need to realize is that your bias against the book in this aspect doesn't automically mean that it is terrible in all respects.
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Really tempted to buy this book, but for the wrong reasons just like rebecca black's friday gained massive popularity for the wrong reasons. Pretty cringeworthy sample of the first two chapters, but cringeworthy can be strangely enjoyable sometimes, like watching The Office (uk version)
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I really wish that I had a credit card or paypal or something to buy this.
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Is there by any chance I could read a small excerpt that could give me an idea if I would like this or not?
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After reading the posts on this thread and reading the excerpt, I am inclined to agree with a lot of the more critical TLers.
Please don't get me wrong Erika, any attempt at promoting Esports is good and you undoubtedly put a lot of work into this project.
I just think the book lacks passion. I don't want to read about an invincible and emotionless dimensionless protagonist. I want to read about an emotive trainwreck who overcomes obstacles and develops in character. Or failing that someone who at least ends up changing and growing as a result of his experiences in a realistic and extensive manner. Please excuse me if I have this wrong but, that's the impression the excerpt gives me.
Also I think taking the perspective of an outsider who is broguht into the sc2 gaming scene is a good one to take. You previously mentioned that this would be unrealistic. I disagree. All it takes to be good at starcraft is practice imho, but if you set the story in the protagonist's teens then the concept of an outsider learning to become pro stops being ludicrous and becomes an inevitability.
At that age, if you practice ANYTHING 6 hours a day every day, you become very good, very fast. Now why would a young teenager spend so much time playing 1v1's at starcraft every single day? Maybe he just got rejected by a girl at school and playing starcraft takes him away from that harsh reality into a fantasy world where he is the uber sexy terran commander, pwning noobs left, right and centre. Maybe he gets bullied. Maybe he has OCD. pick a crisis, any crisis.
I'm not a writer, but I am a reader and I know what I like. Add some character development and another dimension onto the protagonist (and a better name) and I'm sure your work will become the opus dei of the starcraft 2 literary community.
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So, I read Pwned this weekend and figured I'd take a minute to share my thoughts on the book for those who are sitting on the fence. Generally speaking, if you just want a very distilled reccomendation: I think that many of the criticisms posted by folks who took the time to give it a fair shake are accurate. This is clearly a first novel and, not to discredit the author's effort, not up to the quality you could expect from a major publishing house.
That being said, if you're just looking for a fun read, it's totally worth five bucks. The book moves along at a decent pace and is interesting enough to be a light summer read. If you're willing to approach the book with a healthy suspension of disbelief, just looking for a quick read that involves SC2, you'll enjoy it. If you're looking for something polished and perfectly faithful in its attention to SC2 detail, you will be disappointed by Pwned.
One other thing to point out: I was really wary of the whole "NSA trying to take down a pro-gamer" thing when I read the description of the novel, but in the actual plot it never comes across as a giant government conspiracy. I felt it was actually handled fairly well and ended up fitting in decently as a plot device.
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Erika, I just want to give some major props to you. You were brave in coming here with what could at best be called a dubious product, which quite a few people were very quick to point out in excruciating detail. Once all of this came out, you immediately put an extremely clever spin on it with the update to the original post. I'm sure that it would have been much easier for you to bow out with your tail between your legs, or start lashing out at people You handled this uncomfortable situation extremely well; I'm sure that your next book will be amazing.
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Canada13379 Posts
good luck with the first book :D
to all the haters and complainers, its a first book not everything you do for the first time is pure gold lets be honest here. And its not like she's charging 40 dollars for a hardcover either.
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Thanks guys! I think this goes down after today.
Thanks for all the constructive criticism and thank you to everyone who bought a copy! I hope you enjoy it
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Read the preview, sorry to say it but kind of lame lol. I still think the concept of a narrative about eSports is really cool though ^_^
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