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On October 29 2016 05:29 [PkF] Wire wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2016 05:28 Probe1 wrote:On October 29 2016 05:25 KingofdaHipHop wrote:
why are theese brfeaks so long It's pretty bad. I had a friend over yesterday that has no interest in Starcraft or competitive esport srs bsns stuff. I got him to watch after spinning the tale of Drogo and getting him interested. He enjoyed watching the first game. And then there was a 20 minute setup. By minute 5 he already had his laptop out and was working. is it better in other competitive games ? I tried to watch a LoL tourney once and I got bored just because they spent like half an hour choosing their heroes
It certainly isn't better in LoL. The analyst desk in SC2 already seems useless to me, it's even longer in LoL 
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On October 29 2016 05:29 Kerence wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2016 05:25 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:24 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:17 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:15 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:14 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:10 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:09 Fango wrote:
[quote]
No one predicted them to not take a single map. Just to not get out of any group Some TL guys did on various threads some months ago it wasn't known yet that the korean scene is collapsing And? This is still 200K for the winner and you're supposedly playing against weaker players this year :p pretty sure this affects the mentality of the players. I don't think it's a coincidence that foreigners are now catching up after 18 years of complete korean dominance at the exact same time all the teams are disbanding. right they instantly got way worse after leaving the practice house I think they've been aware of the situatio since long before the teams actually disbanded, and yeah that was bound to affect their training regimen Most likely. I mentioned this earlier in the thread, but TotalBiscuit commented on this when Proleague was cancelled. Cynicalbrit_official wrote:
Keeping GSL running shouldn't be a problem as long as Blizzard keeps their wallet open. The problem is filling it with top talent when you have no semi-pro scene, no up-and-comers and no teamhouse infrastructure.
More than all of that however, is keeping the morale of the Korean pros up. There were already some pretty reliable reports that a bunch of KeSPA Koreans did not practice hard for KeSPA cup because they knew this was coming. Motivation and morale over there is at an all time low and has been steadily declining since the region lock announcement.
What I think a lot of people don't realize is that Korean pros really valued playing in foreign countries. Not for prize money, but to actually get out and see the world and play in front of enthusiastic crowds. It was the #1 priority of every Korean player I've ever negotiated a contract with or tried to sign, way above salary.
Imagine after all that, you get told "we don't want you anymore". Heartbreaking. Now even if there was a reversal of the region lock, most of the Korean scene is teamless and would be reliant on precious few qualifier spots to be able to afford to come to a foreign event in the first place. Foreign teams don't wanna sign them because they can't use their players in events outside of Korea and Korean events are on at horrible times for the majority of the west and get poor viewership.
Source: + Show Spoiler +https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/583t7w/want_to_do_something_for_korean_sc2_help/d8y5loq/ I really understand why Blizzard chose to revive the foreign scene instead of the korean one but we'll only be able to tell if that was the good choice in 2 years or so I mean, what else could they have done for the korean scene anyway? They pretty much already fund GSL. Sure I dislike the WCS rules, but it didn't effect what happened that much. The korean scene might have lived a little longer if they didn't region lock WCS, but I doubt much would have changed.
I might have prevented a bunch of retirements. PartinG, HerO, Fantasy, Rain, Jaedong, Soulkey all retired or lost motivation because of wcs changes.
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On October 29 2016 05:31 Durnuu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2016 05:29 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:28 Probe1 wrote:On October 29 2016 05:25 KingofdaHipHop wrote:
why are theese brfeaks so long It's pretty bad. I had a friend over yesterday that has no interest in Starcraft or competitive esport srs bsns stuff. I got him to watch after spinning the tale of Drogo and getting him interested. He enjoyed watching the first game. And then there was a 20 minute setup. By minute 5 he already had his laptop out and was working. is it better in other competitive games ? I tried to watch a LoL tourney once and I got bored just because they spent like half an hour choosing their heroes It certainly isn't better in LoL. The analyst desk in SC2 already seems useless to me, it's even longer in LoL
Hearthstone has it the easiest, you can barely tell the difference between gameplay, ad breaks and technical difficulties. It's all the same speed anyway.
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On October 29 2016 05:31 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2016 05:29 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:25 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:24 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:17 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:15 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:14 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:10 ArtyK wrote:
[quote]
Some TL guys did on various threads some months ago it wasn't known yet that the korean scene is collapsing And? This is still 200K for the winner and you're supposedly playing against weaker players this year :p pretty sure this affects the mentality of the players. I don't think it's a coincidence that foreigners are now catching up after 18 years of complete korean dominance at the exact same time all the teams are disbanding. right they instantly got way worse after leaving the practice house I think they've been aware of the situatio since long before the teams actually disbanded, and yeah that was bound to affect their training regimen Most likely. I mentioned this earlier in the thread, but TotalBiscuit commented on this when Proleague was cancelled. Cynicalbrit_official wrote:
Keeping GSL running shouldn't be a problem as long as Blizzard keeps their wallet open. The problem is filling it with top talent when you have no semi-pro scene, no up-and-comers and no teamhouse infrastructure.
More than all of that however, is keeping the morale of the Korean pros up. There were already some pretty reliable reports that a bunch of KeSPA Koreans did not practice hard for KeSPA cup because they knew this was coming. Motivation and morale over there is at an all time low and has been steadily declining since the region lock announcement.
What I think a lot of people don't realize is that Korean pros really valued playing in foreign countries. Not for prize money, but to actually get out and see the world and play in front of enthusiastic crowds. It was the #1 priority of every Korean player I've ever negotiated a contract with or tried to sign, way above salary.
Imagine after all that, you get told "we don't want you anymore". Heartbreaking. Now even if there was a reversal of the region lock, most of the Korean scene is teamless and would be reliant on precious few qualifier spots to be able to afford to come to a foreign event in the first place. Foreign teams don't wanna sign them because they can't use their players in events outside of Korea and Korean events are on at horrible times for the majority of the west and get poor viewership.
Source: + Show Spoiler +https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/583t7w/want_to_do_something_for_korean_sc2_help/d8y5loq/ I really understand why Blizzard chose to revive the foreign scene instead of the korean one but we'll only be able to tell if that was the good choice in 2 years or so I mean, what else could they have done for the korean scene anyway? They pretty much already fund GSL. Sure I dislike the WCS rules, but it didn't effect what happened that much. The korean scene might have lived a little longer if they didn't region lock WCS, but I doubt much would have changed. I might have prevented a bunch of retirements. PartinG, HerO, Fantasy, Rain, Jaedong, Soulkey all retired or lost motivation because of wcs changes.
Hey! HerO isn't retired! Yet.
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On October 29 2016 05:30 [PkF] Wire wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2016 05:29 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:25 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:24 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:17 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:15 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:14 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:10 ArtyK wrote:
[quote]
Some TL guys did on various threads some months ago it wasn't known yet that the korean scene is collapsing And? This is still 200K for the winner and you're supposedly playing against weaker players this year :p pretty sure this affects the mentality of the players. I don't think it's a coincidence that foreigners are now catching up after 18 years of complete korean dominance at the exact same time all the teams are disbanding. right they instantly got way worse after leaving the practice house I think they've been aware of the situatio since long before the teams actually disbanded, and yeah that was bound to affect their training regimen Most likely. I mentioned this earlier in the thread, but TotalBiscuit commented on this when Proleague was cancelled. Cynicalbrit_official wrote:
Keeping GSL running shouldn't be a problem as long as Blizzard keeps their wallet open. The problem is filling it with top talent when you have no semi-pro scene, no up-and-comers and no teamhouse infrastructure.
More than all of that however, is keeping the morale of the Korean pros up. There were already some pretty reliable reports that a bunch of KeSPA Koreans did not practice hard for KeSPA cup because they knew this was coming. Motivation and morale over there is at an all time low and has been steadily declining since the region lock announcement.
What I think a lot of people don't realize is that Korean pros really valued playing in foreign countries. Not for prize money, but to actually get out and see the world and play in front of enthusiastic crowds. It was the #1 priority of every Korean player I've ever negotiated a contract with or tried to sign, way above salary.
Imagine after all that, you get told "we don't want you anymore". Heartbreaking. Now even if there was a reversal of the region lock, most of the Korean scene is teamless and would be reliant on precious few qualifier spots to be able to afford to come to a foreign event in the first place. Foreign teams don't wanna sign them because they can't use their players in events outside of Korea and Korean events are on at horrible times for the majority of the west and get poor viewership.
Source: + Show Spoiler +https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/583t7w/want_to_do_something_for_korean_sc2_help/d8y5loq/ I really understand why Blizzard chose to revive the foreign scene instead of the korean one but we'll only be able to tell if that was the good choice in 2 years or so I mean, what else could they have done for the korean scene anyway? They pretty much already fund GSL. Sure I dislike the WCS rules, but it didn't effect what happened that much. The korean scene might have lived a little longer if they didn't region lock WCS, but I doubt much would have changed. that's why I think they did the smart choice. GSL had no business being the mecca of sc2 since the game isn't truly loved here.
Might have been the smart choice. Still sucks though. IMO that is. Oh well, back to the games.
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On October 29 2016 05:32 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2016 05:31 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:29 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:25 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:24 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:17 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:15 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:14 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 Charoisaur wrote:
[quote]
it wasn't known yet that the korean scene is collapsing And? This is still 200K for the winner and you're supposedly playing against weaker players this year :p pretty sure this affects the mentality of the players. I don't think it's a coincidence that foreigners are now catching up after 18 years of complete korean dominance at the exact same time all the teams are disbanding. right they instantly got way worse after leaving the practice house I think they've been aware of the situatio since long before the teams actually disbanded, and yeah that was bound to affect their training regimen Most likely. I mentioned this earlier in the thread, but TotalBiscuit commented on this when Proleague was cancelled. Cynicalbrit_official wrote:
Keeping GSL running shouldn't be a problem as long as Blizzard keeps their wallet open. The problem is filling it with top talent when you have no semi-pro scene, no up-and-comers and no teamhouse infrastructure.
More than all of that however, is keeping the morale of the Korean pros up. There were already some pretty reliable reports that a bunch of KeSPA Koreans did not practice hard for KeSPA cup because they knew this was coming. Motivation and morale over there is at an all time low and has been steadily declining since the region lock announcement.
What I think a lot of people don't realize is that Korean pros really valued playing in foreign countries. Not for prize money, but to actually get out and see the world and play in front of enthusiastic crowds. It was the #1 priority of every Korean player I've ever negotiated a contract with or tried to sign, way above salary.
Imagine after all that, you get told "we don't want you anymore". Heartbreaking. Now even if there was a reversal of the region lock, most of the Korean scene is teamless and would be reliant on precious few qualifier spots to be able to afford to come to a foreign event in the first place. Foreign teams don't wanna sign them because they can't use their players in events outside of Korea and Korean events are on at horrible times for the majority of the west and get poor viewership.
Source: + Show Spoiler +https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/583t7w/want_to_do_something_for_korean_sc2_help/d8y5loq/ I really understand why Blizzard chose to revive the foreign scene instead of the korean one but we'll only be able to tell if that was the good choice in 2 years or so I mean, what else could they have done for the korean scene anyway? They pretty much already fund GSL. Sure I dislike the WCS rules, but it didn't effect what happened that much. The korean scene might have lived a little longer if they didn't region lock WCS, but I doubt much would have changed. I might have prevented a bunch of retirements. PartinG, HerO, Fantasy, Rain, Jaedong, Soulkey all retired or lost motivation because of wcs changes. Hey! HerO isn't retired! Yet.
i said retired or lost motivation
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On October 29 2016 05:30 Makro wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2016 05:28 Probe1 wrote:On October 29 2016 05:25 KingofdaHipHop wrote:
why are theese brfeaks so long It's pretty bad. I had a friend over yesterday that has no interest in Starcraft or competitive esport srs bsns stuff. I got him to watch after spinning the tale of Drogo and getting him interested. He enjoyed watching the first game. And then there was a 20 minute setup. By minute 5 he already had his laptop out and was working. i'm interested about that drogo's tale
Just telling him the way he got into the tournament by chance and how he was playing the very best in the first match, and maybe there's a chance a guy who wasn't even the first replacement choice has found himself in the champions tournament. Which is interesting. And it lets me talk about the double elimination system and brackets and how these points are awarded and now he's hooked.
But yeah the breaks killed him. Mild interest turned into doing something else.
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On October 29 2016 05:31 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2016 05:29 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:25 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:24 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:17 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:15 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:14 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:10 ArtyK wrote:
[quote]
Some TL guys did on various threads some months ago it wasn't known yet that the korean scene is collapsing And? This is still 200K for the winner and you're supposedly playing against weaker players this year :p pretty sure this affects the mentality of the players. I don't think it's a coincidence that foreigners are now catching up after 18 years of complete korean dominance at the exact same time all the teams are disbanding. right they instantly got way worse after leaving the practice house I think they've been aware of the situatio since long before the teams actually disbanded, and yeah that was bound to affect their training regimen Most likely. I mentioned this earlier in the thread, but TotalBiscuit commented on this when Proleague was cancelled. Cynicalbrit_official wrote:
Keeping GSL running shouldn't be a problem as long as Blizzard keeps their wallet open. The problem is filling it with top talent when you have no semi-pro scene, no up-and-comers and no teamhouse infrastructure.
More than all of that however, is keeping the morale of the Korean pros up. There were already some pretty reliable reports that a bunch of KeSPA Koreans did not practice hard for KeSPA cup because they knew this was coming. Motivation and morale over there is at an all time low and has been steadily declining since the region lock announcement.
What I think a lot of people don't realize is that Korean pros really valued playing in foreign countries. Not for prize money, but to actually get out and see the world and play in front of enthusiastic crowds. It was the #1 priority of every Korean player I've ever negotiated a contract with or tried to sign, way above salary.
Imagine after all that, you get told "we don't want you anymore". Heartbreaking. Now even if there was a reversal of the region lock, most of the Korean scene is teamless and would be reliant on precious few qualifier spots to be able to afford to come to a foreign event in the first place. Foreign teams don't wanna sign them because they can't use their players in events outside of Korea and Korean events are on at horrible times for the majority of the west and get poor viewership.
Source: + Show Spoiler +https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/583t7w/want_to_do_something_for_korean_sc2_help/d8y5loq/ I really understand why Blizzard chose to revive the foreign scene instead of the korean one but we'll only be able to tell if that was the good choice in 2 years or so I mean, what else could they have done for the korean scene anyway? They pretty much already fund GSL. Sure I dislike the WCS rules, but it didn't effect what happened that much. The korean scene might have lived a little longer if they didn't region lock WCS, but I doubt much would have changed. I might have prevented a bunch of retirements. PartinG, HerO, Fantasy, Rain, Jaedong, Soulkey all retired or lost motivation because of wcs changes.
if kespa never took over sc2 in korea all the guys who committed to sc2 initially would still be here, and the bw scene would be even healthier. I think this was the hugest mistake, believing you could force such a big switch. It ended up killing everything, because yeah gsl will probably be held next year, but with no new blood or competitivity no one will watch and it will end up there.
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On October 29 2016 05:33 Kerence wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2016 05:30 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:29 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:25 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:24 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:17 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:15 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:14 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 Charoisaur wrote:
[quote]
it wasn't known yet that the korean scene is collapsing And? This is still 200K for the winner and you're supposedly playing against weaker players this year :p pretty sure this affects the mentality of the players. I don't think it's a coincidence that foreigners are now catching up after 18 years of complete korean dominance at the exact same time all the teams are disbanding. right they instantly got way worse after leaving the practice house I think they've been aware of the situatio since long before the teams actually disbanded, and yeah that was bound to affect their training regimen Most likely. I mentioned this earlier in the thread, but TotalBiscuit commented on this when Proleague was cancelled. Cynicalbrit_official wrote:
Keeping GSL running shouldn't be a problem as long as Blizzard keeps their wallet open. The problem is filling it with top talent when you have no semi-pro scene, no up-and-comers and no teamhouse infrastructure.
More than all of that however, is keeping the morale of the Korean pros up. There were already some pretty reliable reports that a bunch of KeSPA Koreans did not practice hard for KeSPA cup because they knew this was coming. Motivation and morale over there is at an all time low and has been steadily declining since the region lock announcement.
What I think a lot of people don't realize is that Korean pros really valued playing in foreign countries. Not for prize money, but to actually get out and see the world and play in front of enthusiastic crowds. It was the #1 priority of every Korean player I've ever negotiated a contract with or tried to sign, way above salary.
Imagine after all that, you get told "we don't want you anymore". Heartbreaking. Now even if there was a reversal of the region lock, most of the Korean scene is teamless and would be reliant on precious few qualifier spots to be able to afford to come to a foreign event in the first place. Foreign teams don't wanna sign them because they can't use their players in events outside of Korea and Korean events are on at horrible times for the majority of the west and get poor viewership.
Source: + Show Spoiler +https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/583t7w/want_to_do_something_for_korean_sc2_help/d8y5loq/ I really understand why Blizzard chose to revive the foreign scene instead of the korean one but we'll only be able to tell if that was the good choice in 2 years or so I mean, what else could they have done for the korean scene anyway? They pretty much already fund GSL. Sure I dislike the WCS rules, but it didn't effect what happened that much. The korean scene might have lived a little longer if they didn't region lock WCS, but I doubt much would have changed. that's why I think they did the smart choice. GSL had no business being the mecca of sc2 since the game isn't truly loved here. Might have been the smart choice. Still sucks though. IMO that is. Oh well, back to the games.
back to the games indeed. And cheese is happening.
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Violet is already looking better 
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your Country52798 Posts
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On October 29 2016 05:34 BaneRiders wrote:Violet is already looking better
more like Dear is looking even worse
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Stats went nexus first against a 12-pool against soO in Shoutcraft and lost 0 probes. Dear's micro man.
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On October 29 2016 05:35 Elentos wrote:
Stats went nexus first against a 12-pool against soO in Shoutcraft and lost 0 probes. Dear's micro man.
this was dreadful
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now IF viOLet manages to lose that it'll be even worse than his series vs ByuN
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On October 29 2016 05:35 [PkF] Wire wrote:more like Dear is looking even worse
True enough, but it still works to save violet somehow.
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On October 29 2016 05:35 [PkF] Wire wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2016 05:35 Elentos wrote:
Stats went nexus first against a 12-pool against soO in Shoutcraft and lost 0 probes. Dear's micro man. this was dreadful
And yet I'm not sure it'll be enough for viOlet.
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This series is over. Dear 100% tilted he will throw this series and then Showtime will get ro8
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On October 29 2016 05:31 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On October 29 2016 05:29 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:25 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:24 Kerence wrote:On October 29 2016 05:17 [PkF] Wire wrote:On October 29 2016 05:15 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:14 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 ArtyK wrote:On October 29 2016 05:12 Charoisaur wrote:On October 29 2016 05:10 ArtyK wrote:
[quote]
Some TL guys did on various threads some months ago it wasn't known yet that the korean scene is collapsing And? This is still 200K for the winner and you're supposedly playing against weaker players this year :p pretty sure this affects the mentality of the players. I don't think it's a coincidence that foreigners are now catching up after 18 years of complete korean dominance at the exact same time all the teams are disbanding. right they instantly got way worse after leaving the practice house I think they've been aware of the situatio since long before the teams actually disbanded, and yeah that was bound to affect their training regimen Most likely. I mentioned this earlier in the thread, but TotalBiscuit commented on this when Proleague was cancelled. Cynicalbrit_official wrote:
Keeping GSL running shouldn't be a problem as long as Blizzard keeps their wallet open. The problem is filling it with top talent when you have no semi-pro scene, no up-and-comers and no teamhouse infrastructure.
More than all of that however, is keeping the morale of the Korean pros up. There were already some pretty reliable reports that a bunch of KeSPA Koreans did not practice hard for KeSPA cup because they knew this was coming. Motivation and morale over there is at an all time low and has been steadily declining since the region lock announcement.
What I think a lot of people don't realize is that Korean pros really valued playing in foreign countries. Not for prize money, but to actually get out and see the world and play in front of enthusiastic crowds. It was the #1 priority of every Korean player I've ever negotiated a contract with or tried to sign, way above salary.
Imagine after all that, you get told "we don't want you anymore". Heartbreaking. Now even if there was a reversal of the region lock, most of the Korean scene is teamless and would be reliant on precious few qualifier spots to be able to afford to come to a foreign event in the first place. Foreign teams don't wanna sign them because they can't use their players in events outside of Korea and Korean events are on at horrible times for the majority of the west and get poor viewership.
Source: + Show Spoiler +https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/583t7w/want_to_do_something_for_korean_sc2_help/d8y5loq/ I really understand why Blizzard chose to revive the foreign scene instead of the korean one but we'll only be able to tell if that was the good choice in 2 years or so I mean, what else could they have done for the korean scene anyway? They pretty much already fund GSL. Sure I dislike the WCS rules, but it didn't effect what happened that much. The korean scene might have lived a little longer if they didn't region lock WCS, but I doubt much would have changed. I might have prevented a bunch of retirements. PartinG, HerO, Fantasy, Rain, Jaedong, Soulkey all retired or lost motivation because of wcs changes.
Sure. TB also commented on how region lock cut of any other chance of funding for proleague teams:
https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/581cnr/5_kespa_teams_have_disbanded/d8woogp/
And as you say some players might have stuck around longer.
I'm not agreeing about the region lock anyway, I think it's stupid. But outside of that there's not much Blizzard could have done to prevent the situation in Korea.
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