"I have a lot of followers and a business behind me, i am important, you aren't really, so i am right obviously"
Funnily enough, what i see is "even though i'm giving an offensive opinion, it is still a right and valid one that is supported by quite a lot of persons, while still keeping a quite decent level of argumentation".
Also, funny to mention things like this, considering avilo's main defense is a bunch a die-hard following fanboys who give him importance.
I don't even talk about avilo, it is just literally TB's last argument he oftentimes uses. And only cause you think TB's argumentation is solid, doesn't mean it is. He didn't have one solid argument why avilo should be unfeatured on TL, actually it won't even make any difference, TL is not important for streamers anymore at all. It just is hilarious to me that he wants a balance whiner to be "banned" , there is just no point in doing so. So yeah, i just engage in this conversation cause it amuses me in the end i guess.
no solid argument besides his constant whine / cheating accusations / other players belittling-shadowing / bragging that we can see by just tuning in for one hour on his stream ? Or other things like his fanboy hords harassing people, downvoting/arguing/etc whatever that could hurt their idol in the least subtle way possible ?
So you want to "ban" him cause he whines? Cause he accuses someone of cheating? Why? What harm does it? Why wasn't Idra banned for way worse things? Why isn't TB banned for demanding Avilo to be unfeatured? (don't you think his tweet alone will give avilo countless harassment pms?) I don't see any reason for this ridiculous demand, it just doesn't matter. I am not sure if you think i am an avilo fanboy, just want you to know that i don't care about HIM, but the principle in this conversation. I mean sure, avilo is a troll, he doesn't do the bets job at articulating his whine (i mean, we all know he has some points), but do people really think he harms the community more than any other balance whiner in LR threads? Does he harm it more than TB posting he nearly wants to cut the salary of his toss players? Any more than the big TL article a few days ago? Any more than "insert XYZ here" ? I am out now though, Bomber is too awesome to not give him full attention now!
On July 07 2014 07:43 Dakreyas wrote: TB is one of the most toxic people in this community.
Just ignore him like I do and move on. Dude does nothing but insult and belittle others-- the ultimate example of throwing stones in glass houses. Let him have his casual and clueless fans, and everyone else let's just enjoy SC2... thank God he hardly casts anymore. His gold league level game knowledge is always a drag.
Avilo fans ladies and gentlemen.
I'm not an Avilo fan. I despise the guy. But making fun of his lisp? You are a toxic clown.
On July 07 2014 07:43 Dakreyas wrote: TB is one of the most toxic people in this community.
Just ignore him like I do and move on. Dude does nothing but insult and belittle others-- the ultimate example of throwing stones in glass houses. Let him have his casual and clueless fans, and everyone else let's just enjoy SC2... thank God he hardly casts anymore. His gold league level game knowledge is always a drag.
Avilo fans ladies and gentlemen.
To Avilos defence, while I was watching for a little bit he actually told his viewers not to hate on you. Guess they didn't listen.
Guess who likes toxic whiny people?
Toxic whiny people.
Does he harm it more than TB posting he nearly wants to cut the salary of his toss players?
Lolwut. You can't distinguish the difference between an obvious joke and daily hours and hours of stream whining? Riiiight.
On July 07 2014 07:43 Dakreyas wrote: TB is one of the most toxic people in this community.
Just ignore him like I do and move on. Dude does nothing but insult and belittle others-- the ultimate example of throwing stones in glass houses. Let him have his casual and clueless fans, and everyone else let's just enjoy SC2... thank God he hardly casts anymore. His gold league level game knowledge is always a drag.
Avilo fans ladies and gentlemen.
I'm not an Avilo fan. I despise the guy. But making fun of his lisp? You are a toxic clown.
I believe you. You have 8 Posts. Why else would you be here.
On July 07 2014 07:43 Dakreyas wrote: TB is one of the most toxic people in this community.
Just ignore him like I do and move on. Dude does nothing but insult and belittle others-- the ultimate example of throwing stones in glass houses. Let him have his casual and clueless fans, and everyone else let's just enjoy SC2... thank God he hardly casts anymore. His gold league level game knowledge is always a drag.
Avilo fans ladies and gentlemen.
To Avilos defence, while I was watching for a little bit he actually told his viewers not to hate on you. Guess they didn't listen.
Does he harm it more than TB posting he nearly wants to cut the salary of his toss players?
Lolwut. You can't distinguish the difference between an obvious joke and daily hours and hours of stream whining? Riiiight.
It doesn't matter if this is a joke, your ad hominem here is no solid argument either. Truth is, if you say something like that and only 1% of your twitter followers don't understand the intention, you already did more damage than avilo probably. QED
Please TB don't group all Avilo fans into a crazy muddle of people, some of Avilo's fans are just there to enjoy his stream and his entertainment. They're not all mindless robots blindly following him and his ideas!
I respect both Avilo and you as integral parts of the Sc2 community, and promoting hatred between fanbases won't help Sc2 come out of its slump!
"I have a lot of followers and a business behind me, i am important, you aren't really, so i am right obviously"
Funnily enough, what i see is "even though i'm giving an offensive opinion, it is still a right and valid one that is supported by quite a lot of persons, while still keeping a quite decent level of argumentation".
Also, funny to mention things like this, considering avilo's main defense is a bunch a die-hard following fanboys who give him importance.
I don't even talk about avilo, it is just literally TB's last argument he oftentimes uses. And only cause you think TB's argumentation is solid, doesn't mean it is. He didn't have one solid argument why avilo should be unfeatured on TL, actually it won't even make any difference, TL is not important for streamers anymore at all. It just is hilarious to me that he wants a balance whiner to be "banned" , there is just no point in doing so. So yeah, i just engage in this conversation cause it amuses me in the end i guess.
no solid argument besides his constant whine / cheating accusations / other players belittling-shadowing / bragging that we can see by just tuning in for one hour on his stream ? Or other things like his fanboy hords harassing people, downvoting/arguing/etc whatever that could hurt their idol in the least subtle way possible ?
So you want to "ban" him cause he whines? Cause he accuses someone of cheating? Why? What harm does it? Why wasn't Idra banned for way worse things? Why isn't TB banned for demanding Avilo to be unfeatured? (don't you think his tweet alone will give avilo countless harassment pms?) I don't see any reason for this ridiculous demand, it just doesn't matter. I am not sure if you think i am an avilo fanboy, just want you to know that i don't care about HIM, but the principle in this conversation. I mean sure, avilo is a troll, he doesn't do the bets job at articulating his whine (i mean, we all know he has some points), but do people really think he harms the community more than any other balance whiner in LR threads? Does he harm it more than TB posting he nearly wants to cut the salary of his toss players? Any more than the big TL article a few days ago? I am out now though, Bomber is too awesome to not give him full attention now!
I haven't said he should be banned. Even though i think he shouldn't be featured. The message he carries - both as a mech player and as a player at all - isn't right. Idra was punished in the end - and at least, for some time, he was the best foreigner in the world. He had something to back it up, even if it doesn't really justify his terrible attitude, he was still the fucking best at what he did, and he didn't just whine.
Avilo doesn't just whine like a forum whiner. And don't compare him to the recent TL article, because it is an insult to Downfall. Dwf made a full article with statistics, reasonning, etc, even if it is also offensive. Avilo is nearly always fully offensive, accusing nearly all of his opponents of hacking / stream cheating, discrediting everyone, trying to steal everyone's credits for everything involving mech (dear god, he even keep saying Maru/flash/etc mech or raven play is inspired by HIM whenever they use it ! He says koreans are copying him ! dear god), trying to belittling every single rivale (even a kinda unknown high master who made a guide 2 year ago, ha !), heavily insults people (like against legend litterally minutes ago, he kept insulting him both on vocal and on in game chat). Avilo never loses because of his mistakes. Avilo always wins because he outplayed the "fucking maphacking noob". Avilo calls himself the "savior of esport", "god of mech", "creator of [insert some mech/sky related stuff here]" since months, and he does so seriously. Avilo sends his armies of followers whenever someone disagrees with him. Avilo is.. well, Avilo. And he's not doing it alone - he's actively spreading his Holy Words in his fanbase, using what is a relatively accepted thing and a common feeling (balance state) to fuel people's hate and make sure they take his side because he's "the guy who dares to speak about balance!"
Comparing him to TheDWF or Idra, even if they have their bad sides, is an insult to them, because Avilo has none of the thing that allowed them to be what they've been. Idra's has the result, and the fact he actually accepted his personality he wasn't trying to hide behind his fans or a "no really i'm a good guy it is just that everyone hates me because i'm right and they can't handle my holy truth!" face, and DWF is trying to do his balance stuff in a constructive way, with datas and reflexions, instead of using it as something to justifiy his hate
On July 07 2014 07:43 Dakreyas wrote: TB is one of the most toxic people in this community.
Just ignore him like I do and move on. Dude does nothing but insult and belittle others-- the ultimate example of throwing stones in glass houses. Let him have his casual and clueless fans, and everyone else let's just enjoy SC2... thank God he hardly casts anymore. His gold league level game knowledge is always a drag.
Avilo fans ladies and gentlemen.
To Avilos defence, while I was watching for a little bit he actually told his viewers not to hate on you. Guess they didn't listen.
Guess who likes toxic whiny people?
Toxic whiny people.
Does he harm it more than TB posting he nearly wants to cut the salary of his toss players?
Lolwut. You can't distinguish the difference between an obvious joke and daily hours and hours of stream whining? Riiiight.
It doesn't matter if this is a joke, your ad hominem here is no solid argument either. Truth is, if you say something like that and only 1% of your twitter followers don't understand the intention, you already did more damage than avilo probably. QED https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKmQW7JTb6s
ok enough "trolling"
Someone's sour they missed "The Power of Axiom Protoss" video that probably went along with it.
There's missing a single joke, then there's missing the forest for the trees.
On July 07 2014 07:56 ATChriz wrote: "Avilo fans ladies and gentlemen." ~TB
Please TB don't group all Avilo fans into a crazy muddle of people, some of Avilo's fans are just there to enjoy his stream. They're not all mindless robots blindly following him!
I respect both Avilo and you as integral parts of the Sc2 community, and promoting hatred between fanbases won't help Sc2 come out of its slump!
In what sense is Avilo an "integral part" of the SC2 community..?
Ok we're done here. If all you have is intellectual dishonesty then you aren't worth the time.
The easiest of all cards " you are not worth the time" , a classic But yeah, actually this wasn't worth the time from the beginning, finally you realize what i said since my first few posts about this ridiculous situation you pushed yourself in (again). Have a nice day
To completely sidestep the current conversation, this was a great Finals for Europe. Great games! (And I don't really even like watching Protoss that much, but it was hella entertaining!)
On July 07 2014 07:57 Lyyna wrote: I haven't said he should be banned. Even though i think he shouldn't be featured. Idra was punished in the end - and at least, for some time, he was the best foreigner in the world. He had something to back it up, even if it doesn't really justify his terrible attitude, he was still the fucking best at what he did, and he didn't just whine.
Avilo doesn't just whine like a forum whiner. And don't compare him to the recent TL article, because it is an insult to Downfal. Dwf made a full article with statistics, reasonning, etc, even if it is also offensive. Avilo is nearly always fully offensive, accusing nearly all of his opponents of hacking / stream cheating, discrediting everyone, trying to steal everyone's credits for everything involving mech, trying to belittling every single rivale (even a kinda unknown high master who made a guide 2 year ago, ha !), heavily insults people (like against legend litterally minutes ago, he kept insulting him both on vocal and on in game chat). Avilo never loses because of his mistakes. Avilo always wins because he outplayed the "fucking maphacking noob". Avilo calls himself the "savior of esport", "god of mech", "creator of [insert some mech/sky related stuff here]" since months, and he does so seriously. Avilo sends his armies of followers whenever someone disagrees with him. Avilo is.. well, Avilo.
Comparing him to TheDWF or Idra, even if they have their bad sides, is an insult to them, because Avilo has none of the thing that allowed them to be what they've been
All that you're saying is that someone should be banned because you don't like what they say or how they act. None of it is offensive to the game itself. If you don't agree with what someone does on stream, don't watch it.
Also while you're at it, stop trying to equate skill-level to relevance or popularity. People get compared for their similar actions, not because of the accomplishment's they've had otherwise. A player does not need to be a pro or GM to be compared to an Idra balance whine. Look at the NFL a couple years back with all the hype around Tim Tebow. on paper he was a terrible choice for a QB. He wasn't at a pro level and didn't really succeed, but there was tremendous hype around him. For someone that was such a mediocre player, he was receiving top-tier profile and coverage which attracted lots of people to tune in and watch him play (whether to support him or laugh at his failures). The general example same could be said here.
The goal should be to get as many people interested in the game as possible. Avilo doesn't have to be a top-tier pro korean slayer to provide interest and entertainment to sc2 as an e-sport. How many people in the world are pro or on GM ladder? Everyone below that seems to be deemed as "scrub" or not on a high enough level to talk about "balance", where in fact the majority of people who make up the viewership for streams are going to be from bronze-diamond levels. This community and viewerbase would be nothing without those who contribute and watch or play regularly, and I'm sure many of those low level players can identify on some level with the balance-whine that comes from Avilo, or any other personality from whatever race they play as well.
My point being, it doesn't take player skill to have some of the admittedly bad traits others have. And just because you may be of higher skill/level than other players or feel that some things aren't an issue for you, it doesn't mean it's not an issue for a majority of the playerbase as a whole.
Ok we're done here. If all you have is intellectual dishonesty then you aren't worth the time.
The easiest of all cards " you are not worth the time" , a classic
When the person you're speaking too is obviously trying to use whatever manipulation it takes to win the argument, it is sometimes the best thing
I don't manipulate anything, avilo has 13k followers on twitch, around 1k viewers on a daily basis. TB has numbers that go far beyond that, even if he makes a joke and his intentions aren't to whine, well do the math yourself... So yeah, obviously this isn't 100% serious, but the argument is still relatively solid. TBs consant use of false arguments to look "smart" is pretty telling too. Also it was only a little example of TB being toxic for sc2 AT TIMES. I didn't even argue that he is in general (wich would be hilarious, just like all this bs in this thread, including me joining the conversation)
Ok we're done here. If all you have is intellectual dishonesty then you aren't worth the time.
The easiest of all cards " you are not worth the time" , a classic
Well I'd have used a term like false equivalency, in which you compared a joke to years of constant daily balance whine and toxicity.
But considering your previous posts it seemed unlikely that you would understand it.
Yeah i know i am way too stupid to even grasp 1% of your intellectual references and argumention methods. You are blessed with wisdom that goes far beyond any human on this planet and even in the future noone will ever reach this level of mental skills ever again. We (the stupid people) can be lucky to live in this day and age to watch firsthand how you make this world a better place to live in, i hope all of your followers will soon call themselves the 300k apostles and found a new religion, the biscuitism. Maybe you even can make money with it
Came to see how was the eu final. Saw that much BS from the last pages. Congrats to all of you, and you guys allways say the LOL/Twitch chat is bad. Anyone want a mirror?
EPT
