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Quantic lost to mouz=go Quantic!
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If the Quantic Korean Terrans can pull their weight, I can see Quantic winning this handily, though HyuN will definitely need to assist against the Duran brothers. Predicting a close Quantic victory.
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Close quantic victory imo.
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I think that ViPro and Luci&Vortix will take this. Does anyone know if center will play?
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I thing that Karont3 even has a slight edge here. With VortiX,Lucifron,Socke and viPro, they should be okay vs Hyun, Akopalypse, Center and HwangSin. But it will be close, as they have to beat Hyun twice. 
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First game is LucifroN vs HyuN apparently.
Totalbiscuit @Totalbiscuit 8m
Sh*t has already got real, the first match is LUCIFRON vs HYUN, OH GOD
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Horray, lag issues fixed!
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HyuN just realized LucifroN was going Mech, when he decided on Mutas.
Such poorly prepared defenses and late scouting for HyuN.
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I was going to say Hyun was going to tear Karont3 apart, but with Lucifron looking as good as he is... Quantic might be in trouble.
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Wow, Lucifron is looking amazing right now.
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Don't know whether it is lag, tiredness or simply sloppy play, but HyuN is doing so bad right now.
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This build is sick. I use this all the time vs zerg. Hellbat drops ftw :D
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Lorning
Belgica34432 Posts
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Wow Lucifron destorying HyuN :o
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luci shouldn't have taken any damage from those mutas, a bit sloppy.
Oh well, a win is a win, nice work!
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So, that's the Lucifron's 80% winrate ladder TvZ build.
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those hellbat drops absolutley annihilated HuyN. Well played by Lucifron.
Would not be surprised if hellbats will get nerfed a bit.
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Netherlands4515 Posts
On April 07 2013 00:29 arkedos wrote:
those hellbat drops absolutley annihilated HuyN. Well played by Lucifron.
Would not be surprised if hellbats will get nerfed a bit.
it aint just hellbats, but that's been clear for a few months now we just REALLY need a gsl to prove it! And then a zerg will own with timing attacks and we will pretend it's all fine :D
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hyun took a lot of damage from hellbats and didnt care that lucifron went mech... really sloppy play
Although it didnt matter anymore but swarmhosts are a pretty bad reaction against mech. Hellbats destroy locusts so easily.
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On April 07 2013 00:31 Liquid`Ret wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 00:29 arkedos wrote:
those hellbat drops absolutley annihilated HuyN. Well played by Lucifron.
Would not be surprised if hellbats will get nerfed a bit. it aint just hellbats, but that's been clear for a few months now we just REALLY need a gsl to prove it! And then a zerg will own with timing attacks and we will pretend it's all fine :D
ye we just pretend for almost a year that pvz in wol was fine because immortal allin evened out the odds so protoss doesnt lose every time.
but yeah... hellbats are op. Even in TvT. You either play with them or you loose. 20 dmg against everything :D
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On April 07 2013 00:31 Liquid`Ret wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 00:29 arkedos wrote:
those hellbat drops absolutley annihilated HuyN. Well played by Lucifron.
Would not be surprised if hellbats will get nerfed a bit. it aint just hellbats, but that's been clear for a few months now we just REALLY need a gsl to prove it! And then a zerg will own with timing attacks and we will pretend it's all fine :D
you mean like in WoL except that Zerg didn't have any timings back then, but just leaning back and teching to Broodlord infestor ? :D
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Netherlands4515 Posts
On April 07 2013 00:34 SpikeStarcraft wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 00:31 Liquid`Ret wrote:On April 07 2013 00:29 arkedos wrote:
those hellbat drops absolutley annihilated HuyN. Well played by Lucifron.
Would not be surprised if hellbats will get nerfed a bit. it aint just hellbats, but that's been clear for a few months now we just REALLY need a gsl to prove it! And then a zerg will own with timing attacks and we will pretend it's all fine :D ye we just pretend for almost a year that pvz in wol was fine because immortal allin evened out the odds so protoss doesnt lose every time.
pretty much exactly like that, except that the zerg timing attacks are a bit weaker and have counters for them, immortal allins only counter was the protoss missing forcefields or fucking up his build order :D
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
Just out of curiosity then ret what do you suggest for terran nerfs.
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Lol it's still battle hellion in german.
Ok, defending his own SCVs with a tank versus melee units isnt that smart I guess.
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Lucifron is such an harassing player.
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absolute ownage. LucifroN looking so strong. he must be the barcode at the top of the EU GM Ladder with 74% wins 
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Lucifron is such a beast. Cant wait for the replay pack of this clanwar :>
On April 07 2013 00:45 AxionSteel wrote:absolute ownage. LucifroN looking so strong. he must be the barcode at the top of the EU GM Ladder with 74% wins
He is :>
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On April 07 2013 00:34 SpikeStarcraft wrote:
but yeah... hellbats are op. Even in TvT. You either play with them or you loose. 20 dmg against everything :D
called it!
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On April 07 2013 00:45 AxionSteel wrote:absolute ownage. LucifroN looking so strong. he must be the barcode at the top of the EU GM Ladder with 74% wins
it is him, I thought that was relatively well known (?)
I think a large part of lucifron's play in this is the early +1 mech attack he gets, gives hellbats the extra boost they need to be so cost-efficient
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Luci is looking so strong. WOW!! So Luci smashed Apoc and Hyun, who is the next player to add to the list? Hwangsin, Center? Maybe both?
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On April 07 2013 00:46 Sabre wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 00:45 AxionSteel wrote:absolute ownage. LucifroN looking so strong. he must be the barcode at the top of the EU GM Ladder with 74% wins it is him, I thought that was relatively well known (?) I think a large part of lucifron's play in this is the early +1 mech attack he gets, gives hellbats the extra boost they need to be so cost-efficient
As if his placement match with Vortix doesn't give it away
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On April 07 2013 00:46 Sabre wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 00:45 AxionSteel wrote:absolute ownage. LucifroN looking so strong. he must be the barcode at the top of the EU GM Ladder with 74% wins it is him, I thought that was relatively well known (?) I think a large part of lucifron's play in this is the early +1 mech attack he gets, gives hellbats the extra boost they need to be so cost-efficient
Never seen it written anywhere and I don't know any pros personally! Did watch him slaughter grubby yesterday on grubby's stream though :D
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On April 07 2013 00:47 AyaaLa wrote:
Luci is looking so strong. WOW!! So Luci smashed Apoc and Hyun, who is the next player to add to the list? Hwangsin, Center? Maybe both?
And Hyun again :D.
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Is Lucifron full-time SC2 now, I though he was studying before (or he still is of course), he is getting better and better
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
On April 07 2013 00:48 Ketch wrote:
Is Lucifron full-time SC2 now, I though he was studying before (or he still is of course), he is getting better and better
I believe the brothers duran are taking a year off to go all in.
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On April 07 2013 00:47 AxionSteel wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 00:46 Sabre wrote:On April 07 2013 00:45 AxionSteel wrote:absolute ownage. LucifroN looking so strong. he must be the barcode at the top of the EU GM Ladder with 74% wins it is him, I thought that was relatively well known (?) I think a large part of lucifron's play in this is the early +1 mech attack he gets, gives hellbats the extra boost they need to be so cost-efficient Never seen it written anywhere and I don't know any pros personally! Did watch him slaughter grubby yesterday on grubby's stream though :D
And it was in that stream session of Grubby where he mentioned that the barcode terran IS lucifron.
Well maybe it wasn't in that particular stream session but it was definitley Grubby who mentioned it.
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Denmark145 Posts
Double hellbat drop all in incoming. Feels so boring to play TvT when hellbat drops are so good :O
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France12909 Posts
When there is a barcode terran at the top of the EU ladder, it's either ForGG or LucifroN. And it's more likely to be LucifroN.
Such a beast :D.
Gogo 5-0 Quantic, Luci!
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On April 07 2013 00:49 arkedos wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 00:47 AxionSteel wrote:On April 07 2013 00:46 Sabre wrote:On April 07 2013 00:45 AxionSteel wrote:absolute ownage. LucifroN looking so strong. he must be the barcode at the top of the EU GM Ladder with 74% wins it is him, I thought that was relatively well known (?) I think a large part of lucifron's play in this is the early +1 mech attack he gets, gives hellbats the extra boost they need to be so cost-efficient Never seen it written anywhere and I don't know any pros personally! Did watch him slaughter grubby yesterday on grubby's stream though :D And it was in that stream session of Grubby where he mentioned that the barcode terran IS lucifron. Well maybe it wasn't in that particular stream session but it was definitley Grubby who mentioned it.
Good for him.
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LucifroN is on an absolute killing streak, taking out HyuN, Apocalypse and nearly Center.
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Oh dear what a slaughter xD 3 games, 3 wins with hellbats. although the first defense was pretty decent.
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Wow, Lucifron is a monster. (and yea, he's the barcode at the top of EU ladder)
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So Lucifron's winning strategy in all matchups is to just build a lot of Hellbats and drop them with turbovacs..
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Seems like Koreans on foreign teams are getting left behind on the wrong side of the increasing skill gap.
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I am speechless. Haha, if he does this in more tournaments its gonna get nerfed.... LUCI!!!
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
A reminder that socke and vortix are still in the wings as well as reviving lucifron this will be rough for probably hwangsin + revived hyun.
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On April 07 2013 00:45 SpikeStarcraft wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 00:34 SpikeStarcraft wrote:
but yeah... hellbats are op. Even in TvT. You either play with them or you loose. 20 dmg against everything :D called it!
double checked!
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Jesus Christ, LucifroN.
He is lucky Blizzard doesn't watch EU tournaments...
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Lucifron Logic: Hellbat drop didn't work? Moar hellabat drops!
lol i like that
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On April 07 2013 00:58 SinCitta wrote:
Jesus Christ, LucifroN.
He is lucky Blizzard doesn't watch EU tournaments...
although you cant say that its op in TvT xD
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Center is playing really bad. Hopefully it's latency, or else...
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Worker extinguishers. Just hose 'em.
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I haven't seen hellbats play yet, jeesus! 
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What are the foreigners doing in ATC, killing koreans left and right
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makes me frightened of tvt on the ladder 
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On April 07 2013 00:58 DifuntO wrote:Lucifron Logic: Hellbat drop didn't work? Moar hellabat drops! lol i like that
Center didnt expect and certainly didnt like it.
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On April 07 2013 01:01 AxionSteel wrote:makes me frightened of tvt on the ladder
have a heart, the replays will be released, so you can copy the exact build and slaughter workers yourself xD
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On April 07 2013 00:57 sitromit wrote:
So Lucifron's winning strategy in all matchups is to just build a lot of Hellbats and drop them with turbovacs..
Don't blame the players, blame the game (or the game designer).
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And some people wonder why LucifroN gets hyped...
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ahhh fuck what stream should i watch ... taketv and shoutcraft both are soooo good :/
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*Preparing to meet Hellbats on ladder*
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On April 07 2013 01:02 arkedos wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:01 AxionSteel wrote:makes me frightened of tvt on the ladder have a heart, the replays will be released, so you can copy the exact build and slaughter workers yourself xD
i am a Bio whore though Guess i will be learning these builds now though, they're bound to become far more popular in low masters soon
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On April 07 2013 01:03 a3den wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 00:57 sitromit wrote:
So Lucifron's winning strategy in all matchups is to just build a lot of Hellbats and drop them with turbovacs.. Don't blame the players, blame the game (or the game designer).
Well centers initial defense against this was perfect, but I think he did not expect lucifron to be so persistent with his hellbat play. If he defended one more time like the first I think LucifroN would have stopped and wited until Center's attention would be elswhere on the map.
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Aww... There's Quantic's last Hyun-revive for the entire season. Not sure if that's a good idea since it looks like K3's gonna win eventually.
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As long as HyuN can focus and scout well, he can defeat LucifroN compared to that last game.
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On April 07 2013 01:06 Darkaros wrote:
Aww... There's Quantic's last Hyun-revive for the entire season. Not sure if that's a good idea since it looks like K3's gonna win eventually.
Then again HyuN is easily their best bet for an all-kill, regardless of the opposing team. So it makes sense...
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I presonally think Hellbats will get a change somewhere down the line .
Those things deal insane damage to just about anything that gets into their range and don't really die against low tech units. Maybe they'll have to be pushed back even further. Early Hellbats is not just strong in TvT . This is pretty strong in TvP as well. In TvZ you can't open with 1 Base Hellbat drop but once you made sure your not too far behind in eco you can start dropping them all around as well.
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On April 07 2013 01:05 arkedos wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:03 a3den wrote:On April 07 2013 00:57 sitromit wrote:
So Lucifron's winning strategy in all matchups is to just build a lot of Hellbats and drop them with turbovacs.. Don't blame the players, blame the game (or the game designer). Well centers initial defense against this was perfect, but I think he did not expect lucifron to be so persistent with his hellbat play. If he defended one more time like the first I think LucifroN would have stopped and wited until Center's attention would be elswhere on the map.
Simply a case of the rewards outweighing the risks when you invested this much into hellbats/1 base play.
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On April 07 2013 01:02 Emzeeshady wrote:
They should send Center again. I think if he prepared better for the hellbats then he would have it. Hyun seems like a poor choice to em but I guess we will have to see.
he was already trying to blind counter lucifrons build. After shutting down the first drops pretty good he didnt expect lucifron to just bang his head against the wall again so he just salvaged the bunker and his defense.
but your gonna be behind if you play too safe because lucifron is on 3 base pretty fast and you cant move out. because the mech player can also build some widow mines and then you cant scan all the way to your opponent.
so at the moment i havent seen anybody who has found a good response to hellbat drops except doing it yourself and hoping you handle it better than your opponent.
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LucifroN going for the same +1 Hellbat drop timing.
HyuN is prepared with a Roach Warren at least.
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Bad micro at the natural...
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LucifroN may be a one-trick pony, but a good one-trick pony. Though HyuN was prepared with Roaches and Queens, he still killed off 13 Drones.
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Has 4 Queens target firing medivacs, a ton of 1/1 Roaches, loses 13 Drones to Hellbat drops...
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On April 07 2013 01:12 PhoenixVoid wrote:
LucifroN may be a one-trick pony, but a good one-trick pony. Though HyuN was prepared with Roaches and Queens, he still killed off 13 Drones.
Have you watched any LucifroN game in WoL?
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On April 07 2013 01:12 MasterOfPuppets wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:12 PhoenixVoid wrote:
LucifroN may be a one-trick pony, but a good one-trick pony. Though HyuN was prepared with Roaches and Queens, he still killed off 13 Drones. Have you watched any LucifroN game in WoL?
Not saying it about LucifroN in general, but about this series.
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At this point Koreans only have two more win in Korean vs foreigners in ATC 19-17 With MaNa scoring 9-2 vs Koreans
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hellbats counter roaches.
hellbtas counter swarm hosts.
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Lucifron with crazy overmins Oo
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On April 07 2013 01:14 Treetime wrote:
Lucifron with crazy overmins Oo
Imagine more factories pumping hellbats hahaah.
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On April 07 2013 01:13 SpikeStarcraft wrote:
hellbats counter roaches.
Anything low tech that gets in range of Hellbats dies to them only weakness the have is that they're slow and have very small range.
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Yeah I don't think Hyun holds that if Lucifron actually builds the 30 more Hellbats he has the money for.
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Never thought I'd be rooting for a Korean Zerg over a foreign Terran, but...go Hyun!
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Somehow I don't think roaches with a few swarm hosts are the best composition to go for against mech. ^^
Maybe if he attacked from more angles and on multiple fronts...
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Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage.
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bye bye HyuN.
Luci too strong :D
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On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage.
Yeah, Swarm Hosts weren't the best choice for HyuN there.
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On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage.
Funnily enough TB called it right, a spire transition would've worked out pretty well. No anti-air for Luci and all that. ^^
GG though.
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Lorning
Belgica34432 Posts
What the Hellbat, Lucifron
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On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage.
Bad vs mech maybe, but the unit by itself is great.
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On April 07 2013 01:17 SwansGoMoo wrote:
Never thought I'd be rooting for a Korean Zerg over a foreign Terran, but...go Hyun!
Why though?
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On April 07 2013 01:20 PhoenixVoid wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage. Yeah, Swarm Hosts weren't the best choice for HyuN there.
Well, 5 swarm hosts against waves and waves of tanks and hellbats, you can't expect much
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On April 07 2013 01:21 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:18 MasterOfPuppets wrote:
Somehow I don't think roaches with a few swarm hosts are the best composition to go for against mech. ^^
Maybe if he attacked from more angles and on multiple fronts... It is the best you can hope for at this point.
See my post above. Mutas? ^^
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On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage.
Nope they do fine. They just dont work if the terran has double the tanks.
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On April 07 2013 01:21 XupinatoR wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:20 PhoenixVoid wrote:On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage. Yeah, Swarm Hosts weren't the best choice for HyuN there. Well, 5 swarm hosts against waves and waves of tanks and hellbats, you can't expect much
Indeed.
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And Hyun as Ace again , Luci 3-0 against Hyun and all-kill against Quantic?
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On April 07 2013 01:20 mec wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage. Bad vs mech maybe, but the unit by itself is great.
We had people saying in another thread just a couple of days ago that they may be bad vs Bio, but they're good vs mech...
What's funny is since the game came out, we've seen more people lose with them than be successful with them in broadcast games, but some people keep saying how good they are.
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HyuN going up for a third time according to TB.
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mutas into broodlord infestor i think.
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France12909 Posts
LucifroN so good =D. One more game for the all-kill Luci, show them foreign team koreans who is boss!
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Well everyone has to admit, whether hellbats are op or not, LucifroN is playing really really good.
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On April 07 2013 01:22 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:21 Bagi wrote:On April 07 2013 01:17 SwansGoMoo wrote:
Never thought I'd be rooting for a Korean Zerg over a foreign Terran, but...go Hyun! Why though? He is the underdog. People love underdogs
I don't think HyuN gets the new expansion very well yet... :/
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So what's the most op guys ? Void rays, hellbats or vipers ?
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On April 07 2013 01:23 arkedos wrote:
Well everyone has to admit, whether hellbats are op or not, LucifroN is playing really really good.
Indeed, the TvT's were equally lopsided.
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On April 07 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:22 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:21 Bagi wrote:On April 07 2013 01:17 SwansGoMoo wrote:
Never thought I'd be rooting for a Korean Zerg over a foreign Terran, but...go Hyun! Why though? He is the underdog. People love underdogs I don't think HyuN gets the new expansion very well yet... :/
Nah, HyuN did pretty well in other HotS tournaments, but ZvT seems to be his bane recently.
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On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:21 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:21 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:18 MasterOfPuppets wrote:
Somehow I don't think roaches with a few swarm hosts are the best composition to go for against mech. ^^
Maybe if he attacked from more angles and on multiple fronts... It is the best you can hope for at this point. See my post above. Mutas? ^^ That can be effective but it really has to be a surprise. If Luci has even one thor out then it would be GG. He would also have to save a ton of gas to have enough Mutas out and he would probably be dead by then.
I think muta roach is doable. Instead of making a dozen worthless swarm hosts that don't do much, mutas would give him some map control and harass possibility. And yeah, Luci toned down the drop aggression as the game went on, so I think the surprise factor would be there.
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On April 07 2013 01:23 sitromit wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:20 mec wrote:On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage. Bad vs mech maybe, but the unit by itself is great. We had people saying in another thread just a couple of days ago that they may be bad vs Bio, but they're good vs mech... What's funny is since the game came out, we've seen more people lose with them than be successful with them in broadcast games, but some people keep saying how good they are.
The thing with swarm hosts is that they are a siege unit, they need support. Once you have that support they are just amazing..
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On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:22 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:21 Bagi wrote:On April 07 2013 01:17 SwansGoMoo wrote:
Never thought I'd be rooting for a Korean Zerg over a foreign Terran, but...go Hyun! Why though? He is the underdog. People love underdogs I don't think HyuN gets the new expansion very well yet... :/ Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common...
And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD
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On April 07 2013 01:22 Treetime wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage. Nope they do fine. They just dont work if the terran has double the tanks.
The reason the tank count got so big eventually in the first place is because Hyun kept losing units while Lucifron did not.
He could have had a 100 swarmhosts, would have made no difference. 200 locusts die the same as 10 locusts to tank fire. They all die before they get in range to do damage.
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On April 07 2013 01:23 sitromit wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:20 mec wrote:On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage. Bad vs mech maybe, but the unit by itself is great. We had people saying in another thread just a couple of days ago that they may be bad vs Bio, but they're good vs mech... What's funny is since the game came out, we've seen more people lose with them than be successful with them in broadcast games, but some people keep saying how good they are.
They have their use but those are limited. They're great when you siege an opponent and he constantly loses stuff while defending locus. They're useless when the locust die before actually doing anything .
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On April 07 2013 01:26 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:25 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:22 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:21 Bagi wrote:On April 07 2013 01:17 SwansGoMoo wrote:
Never thought I'd be rooting for a Korean Zerg over a foreign Terran, but...go Hyun! Why though? He is the underdog. People love underdogs I don't think HyuN gets the new expansion very well yet... :/ Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common... And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD Well Life was already playing mostly aggressive in WOL so he had the least adapting to do. Also Life is simply the best there is :p.
Life is on a completely different level, not sure Hyun comes close when it comes to aggressive and extreme multi-tasking and control with ling/bling/muta. He's the only Z player brave enough to effectively run past mines and almost always take minimal damage.
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On April 07 2013 01:25 mec wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:23 sitromit wrote:On April 07 2013 01:20 mec wrote:On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage. Bad vs mech maybe, but the unit by itself is great. We had people saying in another thread just a couple of days ago that they may be bad vs Bio, but they're good vs mech... What's funny is since the game came out, we've seen more people lose with them than be successful with them in broadcast games, but some people keep saying how good they are. The thing with swarm hosts is that they are a siege unit, they need support. Once you have that support they are just amazing..
I think they are the opposite of DTs (when behind, Dark Shrine), you have to be ahead to use them.
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Not sure what this Infestor rush build is exactly designed to accomplish. Maybe some weird Infested Terran assault or something, but it won't work well.
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On April 07 2013 01:31 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:29 Novacute wrote:On April 07 2013 01:26 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:25 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:22 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:21 Bagi wrote:On April 07 2013 01:17 SwansGoMoo wrote:
Never thought I'd be rooting for a Korean Zerg over a foreign Terran, but...go Hyun! Why though? He is the underdog. People love underdogs I don't think HyuN gets the new expansion very well yet... :/ Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common... And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD Well Life was already playing mostly aggressive in WOL so he had the least adapting to do. Also Life is simply the best there is :p. Life is on a completely different level, not sure Hyun comes close when it comes to aggressive and extreme multi-tasking and control with ling/bling/muta. He's the only Z player brave enough to effectively run past mines and almost always take minimal damage. Hyun is a macro beast though. I don't know if you saw his ZvZs vs Life in IPL fight club but Hyun won mostly because he has superior macro (to almost anyone). The sheer amount of units he always seems to have is unbelievable. Hyun is capable of doing great. Once he adapts and Zerg gets buffed a bit he should be Code S level again.
I think HotS is more of HyuN's game than WoL because of the buffed Zerg units in the mid-game where HyuN really excels at.
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On April 07 2013 01:31 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:29 Novacute wrote:On April 07 2013 01:26 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:25 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:22 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:21 Bagi wrote:On April 07 2013 01:17 SwansGoMoo wrote:
Never thought I'd be rooting for a Korean Zerg over a foreign Terran, but...go Hyun! Why though? He is the underdog. People love underdogs I don't think HyuN gets the new expansion very well yet... :/ Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common... And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD Well Life was already playing mostly aggressive in WOL so he had the least adapting to do. Also Life is simply the best there is :p. Life is on a completely different level, not sure Hyun comes close when it comes to aggressive and extreme multi-tasking and control with ling/bling/muta. He's the only Z player brave enough to effectively run past mines and almost always take minimal damage. Hyun is a macro beast though. I don't know if you saw his ZvZs vs Life in IPL fight club but Hyun won mostly because he has superior macro (to almost anyone). The sheer amount of units he always seems to have is unbelievable. Hyun is capable of doing great. Once he adapts and Zerg gets buffed a bit he should be Code S level again.
I don't think it's a matter of getting buffed... Zerg just kinda forgot how to play properly because of that long, grueling period of ZvT in WoL. ^^ (grueling for Terrans haha)
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On April 07 2013 01:30 Boucot wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:25 mec wrote:On April 07 2013 01:23 sitromit wrote:On April 07 2013 01:20 mec wrote:On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage. Bad vs mech maybe, but the unit by itself is great. We had people saying in another thread just a couple of days ago that they may be bad vs Bio, but they're good vs mech... What's funny is since the game came out, we've seen more people lose with them than be successful with them in broadcast games, but some people keep saying how good they are. The thing with swarm hosts is that they are a siege unit, they need support. Once you have that support they are just amazing.. I think they are the opposite of DTs (when behind, Dark Shrine), you have to be ahead to use them.
i think this is very well described :D
as soon as the army dps is high enough to clear locust fast enough swarmhosts look incredibly bad. but if you manage to mass them beyond that point they are invincible and weaken your army more and more.
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Wow Hyun controlled his infestors poorly. A lot of them were running into the bio army head first. He also threw 3 infestors away by not moving them back after casting fungal. Is this really Hyun playing?
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Yeah I don't think HyuN has the economy to win this anymore... That bit of denial at the third is good and all but I think he's too far behind at this point. :s
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Big Zergling run-by somewhat equalizes, but HyuN is still incredibly behind.
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On April 07 2013 01:30 Boucot wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:25 mec wrote:On April 07 2013 01:23 sitromit wrote:On April 07 2013 01:20 mec wrote:On April 07 2013 01:19 sitromit wrote:
Swarm hosts are so bad, the locusts die before they get in range to do any damage. Bad vs mech maybe, but the unit by itself is great. We had people saying in another thread just a couple of days ago that they may be bad vs Bio, but they're good vs mech... What's funny is since the game came out, we've seen more people lose with them than be successful with them in broadcast games, but some people keep saying how good they are. The thing with swarm hosts is that they are a siege unit, they need support. Once you have that support they are just amazing.. I think they are the opposite of DTs (when behind, Dark Shrine), you have to be ahead to use them.
I cant be disagree with that, when ahead use .... SH. Not really the same sound to it tho
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terrans really hate ravens :[
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On April 07 2013 01:37 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:33 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:31 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:29 Novacute wrote:On April 07 2013 01:26 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:25 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:22 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:21 Bagi wrote:
[quote]
Why though? He is the underdog. People love underdogs I don't think HyuN gets the new expansion very well yet... :/ Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common... And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD Well Life was already playing mostly aggressive in WOL so he had the least adapting to do. Also Life is simply the best there is :p. Life is on a completely different level, not sure Hyun comes close when it comes to aggressive and extreme multi-tasking and control with ling/bling/muta. He's the only Z player brave enough to effectively run past mines and almost always take minimal damage. Hyun is a macro beast though. I don't know if you saw his ZvZs vs Life in IPL fight club but Hyun won mostly because he has superior macro (to almost anyone). The sheer amount of units he always seems to have is unbelievable. Hyun is capable of doing great. Once he adapts and Zerg gets buffed a bit he should be Code S level again. I don't think it's a matter of getting buffed... Zerg just kinda forgot how to play properly because of that long, grueling period of ZvT in WoL. ^^ (grueling for Terrans haha) What are you talking about? What is properly to you? Anyway if you honestly think that Zerg has a fair chance in HOTS that is your opinion but it just makes no sense to me.
Give them more time to figure out the new units and new timings (and by new units I don't mean only their own units). You can't expect the match-up to get figured out within a couple of months after release, even with this many talented progamers having at it.
Still it's not as bad as TvZ was in the last months of WoL ^^
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Lucifron is playing with fire with so many low HP medivacs
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On April 07 2013 01:37 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:
terrans really hate ravens :[
What comment is that? He doesn't nearly have the infrastructure or economy to support ravens at this point in the game. He's nowhere near getting a 4th and is trying to kill Hyun before ultras. That would just delay him and make his bio attacks weaker until he gets enough energy.
I agree that ravens aren't as common then they should be but using this game as an example is horrific to make your point.
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This game is super scrappy with both players down on economy badly.
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On April 07 2013 01:40 Badfatpanda wrote:What comment is that? He doesn't nearly have the infrastructure or economy to support ravens at this point in the game. He's nowhere near getting a 4th and is trying to kill Hyun before ultras. That would just delay him and make his bio attacks weaker until he gets enough energy. I agree that ravens aren't as common then they should be but using this game as an example is horrific to make your point.
I'm not talking about mass ravens support for pdd/HSM, but one can save you a ton of scans against burrowed infestors, especially when you can't afford to sacrifice mules for scans.
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On April 07 2013 01:42 PhoenixVoid wrote:
This game is super scrappy with both players down on economy badly.
But Luci has had the economic and macro edge on HyuN for a while now... Maybe these infestors might save him, if used phenomenally well. :S
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On April 07 2013 01:43 MasterOfPuppets wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:42 PhoenixVoid wrote:
This game is super scrappy with both players down on economy badly. But Luci has had the economic and macro edge on HyuN for a while now... Maybe these infestors might save him, if used phenomenally well. :S
Except Hyun keeps move commanding his infestors into marines or marauders,
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Lorning
Belgica34432 Posts
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im glad i woke up and watched this one
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On April 07 2013 01:37 Emzeeshady wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:33 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:31 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:29 Novacute wrote:On April 07 2013 01:26 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:25 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:22 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:21 Bagi wrote:
[quote]
Why though? He is the underdog. People love underdogs I don't think HyuN gets the new expansion very well yet... :/ Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common... And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD Well Life was already playing mostly aggressive in WOL so he had the least adapting to do. Also Life is simply the best there is :p. Life is on a completely different level, not sure Hyun comes close when it comes to aggressive and extreme multi-tasking and control with ling/bling/muta. He's the only Z player brave enough to effectively run past mines and almost always take minimal damage. Hyun is a macro beast though. I don't know if you saw his ZvZs vs Life in IPL fight club but Hyun won mostly because he has superior macro (to almost anyone). The sheer amount of units he always seems to have is unbelievable. Hyun is capable of doing great. Once he adapts and Zerg gets buffed a bit he should be Code S level again. I don't think it's a matter of getting buffed... Zerg just kinda forgot how to play properly because of that long, grueling period of ZvT in WoL. ^^ (grueling for Terrans haha) What are you talking about? What is properly to you? Anyway if you honestly think that Zerg has a fair chance in HOTS that is your opinion but it just makes no sense to me.
I've seen Zerg win three out of four tournaments so far (Life, Snute and Monster). Fairly fair.
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Holy crap wall off your third
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1 bunker would have won lucifron the game 10 minutes ago lol.
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On April 07 2013 01:44 Novacute wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:43 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:42 PhoenixVoid wrote:
This game is super scrappy with both players down on economy badly. But Luci has had the economic and macro edge on HyuN for a while now... Maybe these infestors might save him, if used phenomenally well. :S Except Hyun keeps move commanding his infestors into marines or marauders,
Well looking at it now, I think he managed to pull it off regardless. ^^
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Lol, down to three SCVs. Bunker would have won the game.
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the lack of bunkers and proper defense is annoying me to no end, lucifron should be ashamed if he loses this one, he was up 40 supply against a zerg with pure lings.
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On April 07 2013 01:46 Severian wrote:
Holy crap wall off your third
With what minerals? And what SCVs? :/
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Amazing play by HyuN but also Lucifron throwing the game a little but.
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Netherlands4515 Posts
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On April 07 2013 01:46 MasterOfPuppets wrote:With what minerals? And what SCVs? :/
Ideally before he lost all of those
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Lorning
Belgica34432 Posts
You beat Lucifron after the third time? Too bad, here he is again.
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omfg that was a crazy game
luci almost all-killing
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the games are good, but my complaint with this league is that it turns into team As best player vs Team Bs best player show match for a few games lol
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HyuN barely pulled it off with great use of Burrowed Zerglings and Infestors. He really knew how to exploit LucifroN's lack of proper wall-offs and kept an admirable defense. LucifroN did seem a bit lost near the end with him making some sloppy decisions, but that was a great game.
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United States4991 Posts
Lucifron played really well overall, but if he'd just made a bunker at his 3rd it seems like that would've helped shutdown the runbys (or at least made Hyun have to commit a lot more for it to do anything), without costing Lucifron very much.
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Man Lucifron, one bunker and maybe a wall at your third... but holy shit what a great game, so good!
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On April 07 2013 01:47 Liquid`Ret wrote:
Lucifron insanely good :D
Fixed
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On April 07 2013 01:45 AlternativeEgo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:37 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:33 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:31 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:29 Novacute wrote:On April 07 2013 01:26 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:25 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:22 Emzeeshady wrote:
[quote]
He is the underdog. People love underdogs I don't think HyuN gets the new expansion very well yet... :/ Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common... And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD Well Life was already playing mostly aggressive in WOL so he had the least adapting to do. Also Life is simply the best there is :p. Life is on a completely different level, not sure Hyun comes close when it comes to aggressive and extreme multi-tasking and control with ling/bling/muta. He's the only Z player brave enough to effectively run past mines and almost always take minimal damage. Hyun is a macro beast though. I don't know if you saw his ZvZs vs Life in IPL fight club but Hyun won mostly because he has superior macro (to almost anyone). The sheer amount of units he always seems to have is unbelievable. Hyun is capable of doing great. Once he adapts and Zerg gets buffed a bit he should be Code S level again. I don't think it's a matter of getting buffed... Zerg just kinda forgot how to play properly because of that long, grueling period of ZvT in WoL. ^^ (grueling for Terrans haha) What are you talking about? What is properly to you? Anyway if you honestly think that Zerg has a fair chance in HOTS that is your opinion but it just makes no sense to me. I've seen Zerg win three out of four tournaments so far (Life, Snute and Monster). Fairly fair.
uhm what did Monster win?
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Surprised that infested terran could work so well in late game. Did Lucifron get 3/3 for his bio?
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luci lost 4k just in scvs, make bunkers, bunkers are good, especially when your opponents has nothing.
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Kinda hope they revive LucifroN just so he gets the all-kill xD. Glad that Hyun won that though, so we can see some more games
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On April 07 2013 01:48 krutopatkin wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:45 AlternativeEgo wrote:On April 07 2013 01:37 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:33 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:31 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:29 Novacute wrote:On April 07 2013 01:26 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:25 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:
[quote]
I don't think HyuN gets the new expansion very well yet... :/ Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common... And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD Well Life was already playing mostly aggressive in WOL so he had the least adapting to do. Also Life is simply the best there is :p. Life is on a completely different level, not sure Hyun comes close when it comes to aggressive and extreme multi-tasking and control with ling/bling/muta. He's the only Z player brave enough to effectively run past mines and almost always take minimal damage. Hyun is a macro beast though. I don't know if you saw his ZvZs vs Life in IPL fight club but Hyun won mostly because he has superior macro (to almost anyone). The sheer amount of units he always seems to have is unbelievable. Hyun is capable of doing great. Once he adapts and Zerg gets buffed a bit he should be Code S level again. I don't think it's a matter of getting buffed... Zerg just kinda forgot how to play properly because of that long, grueling period of ZvT in WoL. ^^ (grueling for Terrans haha) What are you talking about? What is properly to you? Anyway if you honestly think that Zerg has a fair chance in HOTS that is your opinion but it just makes no sense to me. I've seen Zerg win three out of four tournaments so far (Life, Snute and Monster). Fairly fair. uhm what did Monster win?
The Korean GSL caster casted a smallish tournament in English with all Koreans (I think that's what he means). Don't remember what it was called.
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As a HyuN apologist, I can only hope HyuN's ZvT was looking vulnerable because he was preparing for INoVation and GuMiho, and simply got caught off guard with LucifroN's style that contrasts heavily against the Korean Terrans.
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On April 07 2013 01:50 PhoenixVoid wrote:
As a HyuN apologist, I can only hope HyuN's ZvT was looking vulnerable because he was preparing for INoVation and GuMiho, and simply got caught off guard with LucifroN's style that contrasts heavily against the Korean Terrans.
Maybe he was just playing a damn good player in an online tournament?
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On April 07 2013 01:51 AxionSteel wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:50 PhoenixVoid wrote:
As a HyuN apologist, I can only hope HyuN's ZvT was looking vulnerable because he was preparing for INoVation and GuMiho, and simply got caught off guard with LucifroN's style that contrasts heavily against the Korean Terrans. Maybe he was just playing a damn good player in an online tournament?
Not denying that at all, just giving a possible explanation.
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Lorning
Belgica34432 Posts
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On April 07 2013 01:50 nihlon wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:48 krutopatkin wrote:On April 07 2013 01:45 AlternativeEgo wrote:On April 07 2013 01:37 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:33 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:31 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:29 Novacute wrote:On April 07 2013 01:26 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:25 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:
[quote]
Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common... And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD Well Life was already playing mostly aggressive in WOL so he had the least adapting to do. Also Life is simply the best there is :p. Life is on a completely different level, not sure Hyun comes close when it comes to aggressive and extreme multi-tasking and control with ling/bling/muta. He's the only Z player brave enough to effectively run past mines and almost always take minimal damage. Hyun is a macro beast though. I don't know if you saw his ZvZs vs Life in IPL fight club but Hyun won mostly because he has superior macro (to almost anyone). The sheer amount of units he always seems to have is unbelievable. Hyun is capable of doing great. Once he adapts and Zerg gets buffed a bit he should be Code S level again. I don't think it's a matter of getting buffed... Zerg just kinda forgot how to play properly because of that long, grueling period of ZvT in WoL. ^^ (grueling for Terrans haha) What are you talking about? What is properly to you? Anyway if you honestly think that Zerg has a fair chance in HOTS that is your opinion but it just makes no sense to me. I've seen Zerg win three out of four tournaments so far (Life, Snute and Monster). Fairly fair. uhm what did Monster win? The Korean GSL caster casted a smallish tournament in English with all Koreans (I think that's what he means). Don't remember what it was called.
HSL. I think Engine was the real winner though. ^^
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Karont3 going for the Socke-out! GOGOGO
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On April 07 2013 01:48 krutopatkin wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:45 AlternativeEgo wrote:On April 07 2013 01:37 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:33 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:31 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:29 Novacute wrote:On April 07 2013 01:26 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:25 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:23 MasterOfPuppets wrote:
[quote]
I don't think HyuN gets the new expansion very well yet... :/ Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common... And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD Well Life was already playing mostly aggressive in WOL so he had the least adapting to do. Also Life is simply the best there is :p. Life is on a completely different level, not sure Hyun comes close when it comes to aggressive and extreme multi-tasking and control with ling/bling/muta. He's the only Z player brave enough to effectively run past mines and almost always take minimal damage. Hyun is a macro beast though. I don't know if you saw his ZvZs vs Life in IPL fight club but Hyun won mostly because he has superior macro (to almost anyone). The sheer amount of units he always seems to have is unbelievable. Hyun is capable of doing great. Once he adapts and Zerg gets buffed a bit he should be Code S level again. I don't think it's a matter of getting buffed... Zerg just kinda forgot how to play properly because of that long, grueling period of ZvT in WoL. ^^ (grueling for Terrans haha) What are you talking about? What is properly to you? Anyway if you honestly think that Zerg has a fair chance in HOTS that is your opinion but it just makes no sense to me. I've seen Zerg win three out of four tournaments so far (Life, Snute and Monster). Fairly fair. uhm what did Monster win?
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=402602
Played amazingly well in this, really quite impressive.
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On April 07 2013 01:50 nihlon wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:48 krutopatkin wrote:On April 07 2013 01:45 AlternativeEgo wrote:On April 07 2013 01:37 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:33 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:31 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:29 Novacute wrote:On April 07 2013 01:26 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:25 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:
[quote]
Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common... And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD Well Life was already playing mostly aggressive in WOL so he had the least adapting to do. Also Life is simply the best there is :p. Life is on a completely different level, not sure Hyun comes close when it comes to aggressive and extreme multi-tasking and control with ling/bling/muta. He's the only Z player brave enough to effectively run past mines and almost always take minimal damage. Hyun is a macro beast though. I don't know if you saw his ZvZs vs Life in IPL fight club but Hyun won mostly because he has superior macro (to almost anyone). The sheer amount of units he always seems to have is unbelievable. Hyun is capable of doing great. Once he adapts and Zerg gets buffed a bit he should be Code S level again. I don't think it's a matter of getting buffed... Zerg just kinda forgot how to play properly because of that long, grueling period of ZvT in WoL. ^^ (grueling for Terrans haha) What are you talking about? What is properly to you? Anyway if you honestly think that Zerg has a fair chance in HOTS that is your opinion but it just makes no sense to me. I've seen Zerg win three out of four tournaments so far (Life, Snute and Monster). Fairly fair. uhm what did Monster win? The Korean GSL caster casted a smallish tournament in English with all Koreans (I think that's what he means). Don't remember what it was called.
HSL, the games were fucking fantastic.
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United Kingdom3482 Posts
On April 07 2013 01:51 AxionSteel wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:50 PhoenixVoid wrote:
As a HyuN apologist, I can only hope HyuN's ZvT was looking vulnerable because he was preparing for INoVation and GuMiho, and simply got caught off guard with LucifroN's style that contrasts heavily against the Korean Terrans. Maybe he was just playing a damn good player in an online tournament?
But HyuN completely destroyed LucifroN twice last week in RSL. I'm guessing HyuN just hasn't got used to HotS yet.
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On April 07 2013 01:53 StarVe wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:48 krutopatkin wrote:On April 07 2013 01:45 AlternativeEgo wrote:On April 07 2013 01:37 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:33 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:31 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:29 Novacute wrote:On April 07 2013 01:26 Emzeeshady wrote:On April 07 2013 01:25 MasterOfPuppets wrote:On April 07 2013 01:24 Emzeeshady wrote:
[quote]
Yah, a lot of Zergs seem to have that in common... And then you look at Life and get even more frustrated haha XD Well Life was already playing mostly aggressive in WOL so he had the least adapting to do. Also Life is simply the best there is :p. Life is on a completely different level, not sure Hyun comes close when it comes to aggressive and extreme multi-tasking and control with ling/bling/muta. He's the only Z player brave enough to effectively run past mines and almost always take minimal damage. Hyun is a macro beast though. I don't know if you saw his ZvZs vs Life in IPL fight club but Hyun won mostly because he has superior macro (to almost anyone). The sheer amount of units he always seems to have is unbelievable. Hyun is capable of doing great. Once he adapts and Zerg gets buffed a bit he should be Code S level again. I don't think it's a matter of getting buffed... Zerg just kinda forgot how to play properly because of that long, grueling period of ZvT in WoL. ^^ (grueling for Terrans haha) What are you talking about? What is properly to you? Anyway if you honestly think that Zerg has a fair chance in HOTS that is your opinion but it just makes no sense to me. I've seen Zerg win three out of four tournaments so far (Life, Snute and Monster). Fairly fair. uhm what did Monster win? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=402602Played amazingly well in this, really quite impressive.
Oh, must have missed it. So that's why everybody is hyping him.
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On April 07 2013 01:55 Emzeeshady wrote:
since when is Socke on Karonte?
He is a mercenary for Karont3 I think.
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On April 07 2013 01:53 imallinson wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:51 AxionSteel wrote:On April 07 2013 01:50 PhoenixVoid wrote:
As a HyuN apologist, I can only hope HyuN's ZvT was looking vulnerable because he was preparing for INoVation and GuMiho, and simply got caught off guard with LucifroN's style that contrasts heavily against the Korean Terrans. Maybe he was just playing a damn good player in an online tournament? But HyuN completely destroyed LucifroN twice last week in RSL. I'm guessing HyuN just hasn't got used to HotS yet.
That was WoL and if you watched the games they were an absolute joke, like WoL's balance.
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United Kingdom3482 Posts
On April 07 2013 01:55 Emzeeshady wrote:
since when is Socke on Karonte?
This tournament allows teams to bring in one extra player from another team.
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On April 07 2013 01:55 Emzeeshady wrote:
since when is Socke on Karonte?
Apparently Karont3 registered with him as their 5th man since they don't seem confident in fielding more than 3 Spanish players and viPro...
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United Kingdom3482 Posts
On April 07 2013 01:55 Enchanted wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:53 imallinson wrote:On April 07 2013 01:51 AxionSteel wrote:On April 07 2013 01:50 PhoenixVoid wrote:
As a HyuN apologist, I can only hope HyuN's ZvT was looking vulnerable because he was preparing for INoVation and GuMiho, and simply got caught off guard with LucifroN's style that contrasts heavily against the Korean Terrans. Maybe he was just playing a damn good player in an online tournament? But HyuN completely destroyed LucifroN twice last week in RSL. I'm guessing HyuN just hasn't got used to HotS yet. That was WoL and if you watched the games they were an absolute joke, like WoL's balance.
That's my point HyuN was obviously still fairly invested in WoL whereas LucifroN wasn't hence the 3-0, 4-0 win.
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On April 07 2013 01:55 imallinson wrote:This tournament allows teams to bring in one extra player from another team.
Beside socke, are there other "mercenaries" in ATC ?
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Ohhhhh, big Stargate fake-out by Socke, into tons of Gateways instead.
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
On April 07 2013 01:58 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:55 imallinson wrote:On April 07 2013 01:55 Emzeeshady wrote:
since when is Socke on Karonte? This tournament allows teams to bring in one extra player from another team. Beside socke, are there other "mercenaries" in ATC ?
ToD for millenium and grubby for FXO well FXO in the qualifiers only ToD and socke in the actual tournament.
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On April 07 2013 01:57 imallinson wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:55 Enchanted wrote:On April 07 2013 01:53 imallinson wrote:On April 07 2013 01:51 AxionSteel wrote:On April 07 2013 01:50 PhoenixVoid wrote:
As a HyuN apologist, I can only hope HyuN's ZvT was looking vulnerable because he was preparing for INoVation and GuMiho, and simply got caught off guard with LucifroN's style that contrasts heavily against the Korean Terrans. Maybe he was just playing a damn good player in an online tournament? But HyuN completely destroyed LucifroN twice last week in RSL. I'm guessing HyuN just hasn't got used to HotS yet. That was WoL and if you watched the games they were an absolute joke, like WoL's balance. That's my point HyuN was obviously still fairly invested in WoL whereas LucifroN wasn't hence the 3-0, 4-0 win.
lucifron was invested pretty heavily in wol too. They both played RSL and the spanish EPS was still wol and not too long ago.
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Socke used to nexus cancel 4 gate in WoL? Or was it Adele?
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On April 07 2013 01:58 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 01:55 imallinson wrote:On April 07 2013 01:55 Emzeeshady wrote:
since when is Socke on Karonte? This tournament allows teams to bring in one extra player from another team. Beside socke, are there other "mercenaries" in ATC ?
There would be ToD, also listed as Joker (that's what they call it) for his old team Millenium.
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Ouch, MsC sniped and no Mass Recall.
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So when's the last time a 7 or 8-gate worked against Zerg? I certainly can't remember any date remotely recent. :s
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On April 07 2013 02:01 MasterOfPuppets wrote:
So when's the last time a 7 or 8-gate worked against Zerg? I certainly can't remember any date remotely recent. :s
Worked against HyuN when MaNa faced him on Neo Planet S.
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Thanks for the answers.
First time I see a recall being denied, haha it's priceless.
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Looked like Hyun was dancing his units (like people would dance Stalkers in WoL) as he chased Socke to the corner there?
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Netherlands4515 Posts
On April 07 2013 02:01 MasterOfPuppets wrote:
So when's the last time a 7 or 8-gate worked against Zerg? I certainly can't remember any date remotely recent. :s
game was a bit strange because normally you can't go 3 hatch vs 1 gate ... coulda just died to 4 gate idk :/
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I'm guessing VortiX or LoLvsxD to snipe HyuN in ZvZ.
HyuN does pretty well in ZvZ as long as he doesn't face Snute in terms of Europeans, and he defeated VortiX 3-0 last time they met. ZvZ hasn't changed too much except the focus on Mutas, and HyuN is pretty good in HotS ZvZ from what I've seen.
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When did they change MSC's recall to cancel on death?
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On April 07 2013 02:04 Discerpo wrote:
When did they change MSC's recall to cancel on death?
It was always the case. No ?
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On April 07 2013 02:05 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 02:04 Discerpo wrote:
When did they change MSC's recall to cancel on death? It was always the case. No ?
No it was an unlisted change at the release or the last patch before release I think.
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On April 07 2013 02:03 PhoenixVoid wrote:
I'm guessing VortiX or LoLvsxD to snipe HyuN in ZvZ.
HyuN does pretty well in ZvZ as long as he doesn't face Snute in terms of Europeans, and he defeated VortiX 3-0 last time they met. ZvZ hasn't changed too much except the focus on Mutas, and HyuN is pretty good in HotS ZvZ from what I've seen.
Don't waste a spot with LoLvsxD.
Send VortiX, then revive Luci and then field Luci as the ace again if he loses.
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Hyun should have gone for burrow though, seems like zerg players still dont got that one into their builds/counters.
I mean no tech required and only cost 100/100, why would you not do that when you go mass roach.
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On April 07 2013 02:07 StarVe wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 02:03 PhoenixVoid wrote:
I'm guessing VortiX or LoLvsxD to snipe HyuN in ZvZ.
HyuN does pretty well in ZvZ as long as he doesn't face Snute in terms of Europeans, and he defeated VortiX 3-0 last time they met. ZvZ hasn't changed too much except the focus on Mutas, and HyuN is pretty good in HotS ZvZ from what I've seen. Don't waste a spot with LoLvsxD. Send VortiX, then revive Luci and then field Luci as the ace again if he loses.
I'm expecting Karont3 to follow your line of planning, but LoLvsxD might have a good snipe build ready.
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On April 07 2013 02:09 PhoenixVoid wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 02:07 StarVe wrote:On April 07 2013 02:03 PhoenixVoid wrote:
I'm guessing VortiX or LoLvsxD to snipe HyuN in ZvZ.
HyuN does pretty well in ZvZ as long as he doesn't face Snute in terms of Europeans, and he defeated VortiX 3-0 last time they met. ZvZ hasn't changed too much except the focus on Mutas, and HyuN is pretty good in HotS ZvZ from what I've seen. Don't waste a spot with LoLvsxD. Send VortiX, then revive Luci and then field Luci as the ace again if he loses. I'm expecting Karont3 to follow your line of planning, but LoLvsxD might have a good snipe build ready.
Maybe, but even if he did, VortiX could execute it much better.
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They used to go through regardless but they've since patched it so if you kill the MSC, you don't warp back.
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damn, looks like Lucifron went full korean?
beastmode activated. but Hyun is still a beast himself though so maybe he'll end up still winning this match
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On April 07 2013 02:06 a3den wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 02:05 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:On April 07 2013 02:04 Discerpo wrote:
When did they change MSC's recall to cancel on death? It was always the case. No ? No it was an unlisted change at the release or the last patch before release I think.
Ok, I didn't know that. Ninja patching is kind of dickish.
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Funny, HyuN did hardly any damage with the Ling/Bane attack, but still ahead on Drones.
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Man that 60fps is a blessing for ling/bling fights <3
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On April 07 2013 02:14 Schelim wrote:damn, looks like Lucifron went full Hellbat? Hellbatmode activated. but Hyun is still a beast himself though so maybe he'll end up still winning this match
Fixed that for you. He played great though
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I don't get why people always assume hydras beat mutas.. They really don't. You need a pretty overwhelming force of hydras to beat mutalisks because of their damage.
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The Roach/Hydra attack on VortiX should have done way more damage, but HyuN's focus firing was terrible. Now VortiX has a nice upgrade advantage and the Infestors.
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TB's stream lagging for anyone else now?
edit: Gratz @ Vortix!
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On April 07 2013 02:27 Na_Dann_Ma_GoGo wrote:
TB's stream lagging for anyone else now?
Twitch as a whole has been lagging significantly for the past hour or so... :/
GG.
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Lorning
Belgica34432 Posts
gg, well played by Vortix
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mouz and karont foreign powerhouse
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K3! Good fight. Thanks for the games.
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I don't know much about zvz, but would the viper be an option in long macro roach/hydra games ?
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Duran brothers definitely pulled it off well, especially LucifroN. I would have liked to have seen HyuN play better because he just seemed asleep or sloppy at times, but he did okay.
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
On April 07 2013 02:28 Killmouse wrote:
mouz and karont foreign powerhouse
Mana and karont3 foreign powerhouses.
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On April 07 2013 02:29 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:
I don't know much about zvz, but would the viper be an option in long macro roach/hydra games ?
I don't either, but would the gas and supply be better used in infestors? People are tentative in using them because the projectile, but they're still very strong in Roach-Hydra midgame battles. Fungal makes it so you can't move (which you can in Blinding Cloud) and does damage.
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the power of Moreno Durán :D
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On April 07 2013 02:22 Glurkenspurk wrote:
I don't get why people always assume hydras beat mutas.. They really don't. You need a pretty overwhelming force of hydras to beat mutalisks because of their damage.
Nobody said they did, you need to use them in combination with other stuff and as you saw, the better option is to just attack (unless you fail, in that case, maybe not)
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Cool to see the spanish fighting ! And to figure at IEM Vortix was nothing but a patchzerg, keep proving those fools wrong !
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Congrats, very well played by the brothers, good to see EU teams standing strong against the dominant full-Korean teams. MaNa and the Moreno Durán bros already seem to be in great shape again.
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Next game for Karont is vs mouz(MaNa) for best foreign only team
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On April 07 2013 02:38 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 02:22 Glurkenspurk wrote:
I don't get why people always assume hydras beat mutas.. They really don't. You need a pretty overwhelming force of hydras to beat mutalisks because of their damage. Nobody said they did, you need to use them in combination with other stuff and as you saw, the better option is to just attack (unless you fail, in that case, maybe not)
That's why I didn't really get the build that Hyun did. The mutas are going to crush the few hydras you send across the map, and then the roaches will die to whatever mutas are left. If you're gonna try to cripple a muta opening you'd think roach bane would be better, right?
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On April 07 2013 03:06 Glurkenspurk wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 02:38 TotalBiscuit wrote:On April 07 2013 02:22 Glurkenspurk wrote:
I don't get why people always assume hydras beat mutas.. They really don't. You need a pretty overwhelming force of hydras to beat mutalisks because of their damage. Nobody said they did, you need to use them in combination with other stuff and as you saw, the better option is to just attack (unless you fail, in that case, maybe not) That's why I didn't really get the build that Hyun did. The mutas are going to crush the few hydras you send across the map, and then the roaches will die to whatever mutas are left. If you're gonna try to cripple a muta opening you'd think roach bane would be better, right?
There's still some allinish ways to crush your opponent just before he gets his mutas going, notably with some roach bling play, and they work really way on the ladder cause people are playing greedier and greedier to get early mutas with a big gas bank. I never saw hydra play work vs "classic" mutas on hots during a non-scrappy game, and coming from a balanced position tho. You should nevertheless remember that if the hydra/roach player manages to get his third going without too much trouble (coming from a dominant position during the early ling bling skirmishes f.ex.), then there will most probably be a gigantic window during which he will be able to bust you with his superior army and upgrades.
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On April 07 2013 02:30 AgentW wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 02:29 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:
I don't know much about zvz, but would the viper be an option in long macro roach/hydra games ? I don't either, but would the gas and supply be better used in infestors? People are tentative in using them because the projectile, but they're still very strong in Roach-Hydra midgame battles. Fungal makes it so you can't move (which you can in Blinding Cloud) and does damage.
Sure infestors are a safer bet, i'm just thinking about a couple of vipers in addition. I'm theorycrafting out of my ass, but fungal+cloud is a damn stronk combo on ranged units like roaches, hydras and infester terrans. On top of that, those units have rather short range, the viper would be rather safe.
Well in practice it's probably a whole other story :D
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On April 07 2013 03:41 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 02:30 AgentW wrote:On April 07 2013 02:29 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:
I don't know much about zvz, but would the viper be an option in long macro roach/hydra games ? I don't either, but would the gas and supply be better used in infestors? People are tentative in using them because the projectile, but they're still very strong in Roach-Hydra midgame battles. Fungal makes it so you can't move (which you can in Blinding Cloud) and does damage. Sure infestors are a safer bet, i'm just thinking about a couple of vipers in addition. I'm theorycrafting out of my ass, but fungal+cloud is a damn stronk combo on ranged units like roaches, hydras and infester terrans. On top of that, those units have rather short range, the viper would be rather safe. Well in practice it's probably a whole other story :D
While non-Zerg players are theorycrafting about ZvZ, I'll have a go then! What if the cloud plus fungal with roach range only being 4 causes the offensive player to get in close range and do tons of damage with his roaches/hydras so the guy who gets fungaled/clouded just gets out DPS'd? It would take potentially a third control group, more APM, and better control due to the squishiness of vipers against hydras, but it would reward the player with better control and engagement choice. With infestors, I'm of the opinion that the player with the better engagement location and by extension concave will almost always win. Infestor control and retention is also very important in said fights. Thoughts?
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I think you and I are potentially the next zergs B-word. We're meant to meet in the gsl code S finals and be aware, I won't miss my clouds.
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I better go play the campaign again so I can learn Zerg macro
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Lucifron is simply the sickest foreign terran by a good bit if he plays his best
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