HoSeo has to have practiced a lot of HoTS since no one is in any individual leagues. I could definitely see them getting a win here due to more experience with the game.
On February 17 2013 03:35 Shellshock1122 wrote: HoSeo has to have practiced a lot of HoTS since no one is in any individual leagues. I could definitely see them getting a win here due to more experience with the game.
I could as well especially because MVP's greatest strength is in the zerg lineup.
I picked NSHS. They had to have been playing HotS to have any shot at making a comeback in sc2. Jjakji I know from seeing his play seems to be one of the best in HotS atm.
DRG is a really good Zerg as well so watch out for him.
On February 17 2013 03:35 Shellshock1122 wrote: HoSeo has to have practiced a lot of HoTS since no one is in any individual leagues. I could definitely see them getting a win here due to more experience with the game.
Hoseo have clearly disappeared because they were practising hots, next code S ro32 all hoseo as hoseo gets all the sponsors and saves esports.
On February 17 2013 10:45 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:
On February 17 2013 10:30 PhoenixVoid wrote: This could be a repeat of Sniper vs SlayerS again.
MVP 5-1 NSHS
In which he somehow wins while not building any of Zerg's new stuff.
No fun allowed in this house.
Not like anyone even builds Swarm Hosts anymore, and Vipers are a bit of a rare unit recently.
Viper=DRG's favorite new unit. He uses it like every ZvT ive seen on his stream so hopefully he gets to play and use it and he said he liked it in that interview before the match last night.
You never know. It's HotS, which is very hard-countery, aggressive and cheesy right now (much like early WoL), and therefore volatile. On top of that, we have no idea what the NSH team is like in it, perhaps pretty great given how little WoL they've been playing in televised matches lately.
I think MVP 4-3 NSH, but the opposite would not surprise me.
[10:31:40 PM] neo: so tommy [10:31:46 PM] neo: you think DRG will ditz out tonight? [10:31:51 PM] neo: maybe kill his own buildings? [10:31:52 PM] neo: lol
[10:32:08 PM] TommyP: he'll probably go into the booth and open up WoL [10:32:15 PM] neo: LMAO
On February 18 2013 15:34 neoghaleon55 wrote: [10:31:40 PM] neo: so tommy [10:31:46 PM] neo: you think DRG will ditz out tonight? [10:31:51 PM] neo: maybe kill his own buildings? [10:31:52 PM] neo: lol
[10:32:08 PM] TommyP: he'll probably go into the booth and open up WoL [10:32:15 PM] neo: LMAO
just read your blog and your post and drg's fan club and then your post in one day It's because of you that I am torn between seeing DRG all-kill, or NShoseo win
They live in a little dorm room, have probably not touched WoL in months, and have been practicing HotS with their lives depending on it.
You going to bet against HoSeo's new crew of MadBull, Ssassne, EllenKey? They're going to wreck MVP. It's over. $3,000 to MVP is just some extra party money they can use to go out and eat more Korean BBQ. $3,000 for HoSeo would be more money than the entire team has made in a year.
On February 18 2013 17:01 Fionn wrote: People underestimating HoSeo.
They live in a little dorm room, have probably not touched WoL in months, and have been practicing HotS with their lives depending on it.
You going to bet against HoSeo's new crew of MadBull, Ssassne, EllenKey? They're going to wreck MVP. It's over. $3,000 to MVP is just some extra party money they can use to go out and eat more Korean BBQ. $3,000 for HoSeo would be more money than the entire team has made in a year.
On February 18 2013 17:01 Fionn wrote: People underestimating HoSeo.
They live in a little dorm room, have probably not touched WoL in months, and have been practicing HotS with their lives depending on it.
You going to bet against HoSeo's new crew of MadBull, Ssassne, EllenKey? They're going to wreck MVP. It's over. $3,000 to MVP is just some extra party money they can use to go out and eat more Korean BBQ. $3,000 for HoSeo would be more money than the entire team has made in a year.
They're hungry.
Where's the "Why NSHoseo will win the GSTL" post?
The last time he made one of those the team died. Then again their players went on to a better place and won 2 GSL titles. Do it for jjakji, Fionn!
I can guarantee you that Hoseo cares about this preseason more than any other team so I totally agree Fionn. I still don't think that's going to matter lol.
On February 18 2013 17:01 Fionn wrote: People underestimating HoSeo.
They live in a little dorm room, have probably not touched WoL in months, and have been practicing HotS with their lives depending on it.
You going to bet against HoSeo's new crew of MadBull, Ssassne, EllenKey? They're going to wreck MVP. It's over. $3,000 to MVP is just some extra party money they can use to go out and eat more Korean BBQ. $3,000 for HoSeo would be more money than the entire team has made in a year.
They're hungry.
Fionn: hoping his hipster bets will pay off since 2012.
On February 18 2013 17:01 Fionn wrote: People underestimating HoSeo.
They live in a little dorm room, have probably not touched WoL in months, and have been practicing HotS with their lives depending on it.
You going to bet against HoSeo's new crew of MadBull, Ssassne, EllenKey? They're going to wreck MVP. It's over. $3,000 to MVP is just some extra party money they can use to go out and eat more Korean BBQ. $3,000 for HoSeo would be more money than the entire team has made in a year.
They're hungry.
Fionn: hoping his hipster bets will pay off since 2012.
3. The Life Line of ZeNex In 2011, ZeNex looked like they might become a new power in the Korean scene. They had Byun, GSL semifinalist, someone who was able to beat MVP in the GSL, conquering the Korean Ladder with numerous accounts and having the personality to become a star in the international scene; Coca, the young Zerg who had already made a GSL quarterfinal, getting a lot of hype in the Korean scene for his unbelievable ZvP; and finally, Puzzle, the Code A champion, the man with the fastest APM in the entire GSL, destroying everyone on his way to Code S. They had a core that most teams would be jealous of. Sadly, these three didn't end the year on ZeNex, with Coca first leaving to join Slayers and promptly making the finals of MLG Raleigh; Puzzle moving to Slayers also, taking his Code S spot with him; and finally, Byun, the face of the team, leaving to join his friend MarineKing on Prime, leaving ZeNex with nearly nothing nothing. Their best prospect after those three, Hack, also decided to leave, joining Startale.
Now, at the start of year, there is a little bit of light. Line (aka Suhosin), their captain and the player who made the amazing run to the Super Tournament quarterfinals, has finally made it into Code A and looks like he might live up to the potential people thought he had at the end of his Super Tournament run. Also, the player who I think you should really look out for, the 14-year-old Life, has also made Code A, after being atop of the Korean Grandmaster ladder for a lot of 2011. With these two players, you could believe that we could be seeing two new ZeNex players in Code S very soon.
Sadly, my prediction for 2012 is that, no, ZeNex will not get these two players to Code S, as I see both of them, at least Life, being poached by another team. Life is everything you would want in a player; he's young, has major potential, and the work ethic that you would want out of a player. He practices on the ladder endlessly, playing the best players in Korea for hours at a time. His play reminds me of Coca before he broke out in the GSL, and I wouldn't put it past a team like TSL, Slayers or another Korean team to pick him up if and when he does well in GSL. I would really like to see ZeNex make a return to prominence, but it's going to be hard without a stable sponsor and money coming into the team. If they want to be around in 2013, they'll need to keep both their star Zergs, but it's going to be extremely difficult.
I was actually pretty spot on last year with my Year 2012 predictions. Except for Keen/sC winning a GSL. Keen didn't do any better than Ro16, and sC quit the fucking game.
Also MadBull better be 7 feet tall and 400 pounds, or he at better least wear a bull head into his matches.
On February 18 2013 17:01 Fionn wrote: People underestimating HoSeo.
They live in a little dorm room, have probably not touched WoL in months, and have been practicing HotS with their lives depending on it.
You going to bet against HoSeo's new crew of MadBull, Ssassne, EllenKey? They're going to wreck MVP. It's over. $3,000 to MVP is just some extra party money they can use to go out and eat more Korean BBQ. $3,000 for HoSeo would be more money than the entire team has made in a year.
They're hungry.
Well that made me feel kind of bad. MVP winning is like taking food from the homeless.
...but there might just be one guy on team MVP that's so much of a sociopath that he no care about starving children....
On February 18 2013 17:01 Fionn wrote: People underestimating HoSeo.
They live in a little dorm room, have probably not touched WoL in months, and have been practicing HotS with their lives depending on it.
You going to bet against HoSeo's new crew of MadBull, Ssassne, EllenKey? They're going to wreck MVP. It's over. $3,000 to MVP is just some extra party money they can use to go out and eat more Korean BBQ. $3,000 for HoSeo would be more money than the entire team has made in a year.
They're hungry.
Well that made me feel kind of bad. MVP winning is like taking food from the homeless.
...but there might just be one guy on team MVP that's so much of a sociopath that he no care about starving children....
On February 18 2013 17:01 Fionn wrote: People underestimating HoSeo.
They live in a little dorm room, have probably not touched WoL in months, and have been practicing HotS with their lives depending on it.
You going to bet against HoSeo's new crew of MadBull, Ssassne, EllenKey? They're going to wreck MVP. It's over. $3,000 to MVP is just some extra party money they can use to go out and eat more Korean BBQ. $3,000 for HoSeo would be more money than the entire team has made in a year.
They're hungry.
Pretty sure jjakji made more from IPL ToC alone compared to this but then again jjakji is probably sick of charity.
On February 18 2013 17:01 Fionn wrote: People underestimating HoSeo.
They live in a little dorm room, have probably not touched WoL in months, and have been practicing HotS with their lives depending on it.
You going to bet against HoSeo's new crew of MadBull, Ssassne, EllenKey? They're going to wreck MVP. It's over. $3,000 to MVP is just some extra party money they can use to go out and eat more Korean BBQ. $3,000 for HoSeo would be more money than the entire team has made in a year.
They're hungry.
Pretty sure jjakji made more from IPL ToC alone compared to this but then again jjakji is probably sick of charity.
Eh, that was still like eight months ago.
Pretty sure HoSeo live off cheap ramen and the housing they receive from the university. They must win, or they shall die from malnutrition. Life saved ZeNex by doing well and getting the entire team picked up by Startale.
I'm excited to seeing these new players that will bring HoSeo back from the grave.
On February 18 2013 17:01 Fionn wrote: People underestimating HoSeo.
They live in a little dorm room, have probably not touched WoL in months, and have been practicing HotS with their lives depending on it.
You going to bet against HoSeo's new crew of MadBull, Ssassne, EllenKey? They're going to wreck MVP. It's over. $3,000 to MVP is just some extra party money they can use to go out and eat more Korean BBQ. $3,000 for HoSeo would be more money than the entire team has made in a year.
They're hungry.
Well that made me feel kind of bad. MVP winning is like taking food from the homeless.
...but there might just be one guy on team MVP that's so much of a sociopath that he no care about starving children....
I haven't caught many HotS games yet so I'm looking forward to this. GSL and SPL are the only tournaments I usually get to watch live because of timezones.
SSanaEE playing like a guy who has been slaying nerds in HotS for a looong time. Awesome to see zerg played well haha, maybe the casters will stop the balance whine.
On February 18 2013 18:35 Kasaraki wrote: SSanaEE playing like a guy who has been slaying nerds in HotS for a looong time. Awesome to see zerg played well haha, maybe the casters will stop the balance whine.
That's probably what all of hoseo has been doing I wouldn't be surprised if a decent amount of barcodes in hots are hoseo.
On February 18 2013 18:35 DarkLordOlli wrote: Locusts > colossi
PvZ is so great in HotS, except swarm hosts.
Oh come on, he gave the colossi away.
True but they'd have been worn down anyway. I'm not talking balance anyway, just a HUUUUGEEEEE antifan of the swarm host concept
Free units are just kind of not cool, seeing nothing get traded for value feels bad to watch.
Especially because the value is so damn high. Everytime a gateway unit dies like trash it already stings enough. Now colossi are in danger too and that's a bit... eh, questionable in my eyes.
On February 18 2013 18:35 DarkLordOlli wrote: Locusts > colossi
PvZ is so great in HotS, except swarm hosts.
Oh come on, he gave the colossi away.
colossi with range shut down swarm hosts...kills the locust before they get in range.
Depends on the amount of colossi vs swarm hosts. You really need critical mass and swarm hosts are lower tech, so SHs reach critical mass earlier than colossi. Plus, you should get corruptors to cover your SHs vs air anyways, so it becomes a game of trying to sniper the colossi, they pull back so the stalkers shoot at the corruptors, at which point the locusts need to come in chewing at the stalkers. What I want to say is, that it really comes down to micro battles, which take a lot of practice from both sides until we can come to a real conclusion.
On February 18 2013 18:35 DarkLordOlli wrote: Locusts > colossi
PvZ is so great in HotS, except swarm hosts.
Oh come on, he gave the colossi away.
True but they'd have been worn down anyway. I'm not talking balance anyway, just a HUUUUGEEEEE antifan of the swarm host concept
Free units are just kind of not cool, seeing nothing get traded for value feels bad to watch.
Especially because the value is so damn high. Everytime a gateway unit dies like trash it already stings enough. Now colossi are in danger too and that's a bit... eh, questionable in my eyes.
swarm host won't be this powerful if his stargate did more damage earlier and also he had to go for a gateway expand. colossus shut down swarm host really well actually, but not when there are so many swarm hosts
On February 18 2013 18:35 DarkLordOlli wrote: Locusts > colossi
PvZ is so great in HotS, except swarm hosts.
Oh come on, he gave the colossi away.
True but they'd have been worn down anyway. I'm not talking balance anyway, just a HUUUUGEEEEE antifan of the swarm host concept
Free units are just kind of not cool, seeing nothing get traded for value feels bad to watch.
But they're so swarmy
TBH I don't like them as well. I play random and I never lost when i had enough of them, which shouldn't be the case since there should be a good counter as well, even though the unit is expensive. Anyways, I think at least you CAN kill the free units, which is btw only something graphical. How would it be, if you cannot target the shots of em? Would that be IMBA? Answer would maybe be no, if we look at the lurker from BW which of course was different, but also a similar concept (siege unit)
Right now swarm hosts seem a great engagement forcing tool imo and I like that. I still dislike the concept of the swarm host because it's the brood lord. But cooler.
So maybe its the brood lord I don't like. Maybe they'll make that cooler one day in HotS. Alongside the majority of t3 units that just aren't very cool. BC and ultra are the only things I like of all t3 units. Early and mid-game armies still better for viewing and personal enjoyment.
On February 18 2013 18:57 Salient wrote: Wow Terran is insanely good in HoTS with Crack-Vacs and Hellbats. GoM TvT 2.0.
Wow 80 Drones are so bad at fighting an actual army. Clearly Drones need a buff so they can defend everything and Zerg doesn't need to build any units against a 2-base Terran attack at all...
On February 18 2013 18:53 Qikz wrote: Is anyone else not able to use the fullscreen button on the gom streamer on their website?
I had that problem last Friday, but it's working fine now.
did u open 2 windows? It only occurs to me if I have 2 open windows of firefox. The system identificates 1 as the "main" window, where every flash related thing behaves normal, on the other window the buttons seem misplaced. IF(!) that's tha same at your PC: 2 choices here: either open 1 or 2 new tabs in the window where GOMTV is open, this sometimes makes this window the main one. Or you put the open GomTV Tab back to the other window and click fullscreen
On February 18 2013 18:57 Salient wrote: Wow Terran is insanely good in HoTS with Crack-Vacs and Hellbats. GoM TvT 2.0.
Wow 80 Drones are so bad at fighting an actual army. Clearly Drones need a buff so they can defend everything and Zerg doesn't need to build any units against a 2-base Terran attack at all...
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
So was beta WoL Terran until Blizz killed them after awhile.
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
On February 18 2013 19:14 iky43210 wrote: gets outplayed, better blame the medivac speed
It's alright, Dream only tore By.Sun apart with the same sort of thing in WoL. This had nothing to do with 0 templar, 0 colossus range, 0 cannons, and unit positioning falling apart in the face of constant and well managed harass =D
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
On February 18 2013 19:14 iky43210 wrote: gets outplayed, better blame the medivac speed
It's alright, Dream only tore By.Sun apart with the same sort of thing in WoL. This had nothing to do with 0 templar, 0 colossus range, 0 cannons, and unit positioning falling apart =D
yeah madbull completely fell apart by a single drop and attack on his 3rd, he didn't do anything at all to stop ethier attack just sat there. infact i think he would have died alot earlier if it wasnt for the nexus attack
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
It's John the Translator, he can say whatever his heart desires.
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
On February 18 2013 19:14 iky43210 wrote: gets outplayed, better blame the medivac speed
It's alright, Dream only tore By.Sun apart with the same sort of thing in WoL. This had nothing to do with 0 templar, 0 colossus range, 0 cannons, and unit positioning falling apart in the face of constant and well managed harass =D
But but...it's so much easier to blame imba than to think about what went wrong...
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
medivac speed is too imba. I don't know what zerg players can do against a Terran with crazy multi tasking
Hey check out this new terran, I haven't seen him forever didn't he get to IPL or something once. Whatever he looks decent maybe not win a GSL and certainly not on the level of leenock.
On February 18 2013 19:14 iky43210 wrote: gets outplayed, better blame the medivac speed
It's alright, Dream only tore By.Sun apart with the same sort of thing in WoL. This had nothing to do with 0 templar, 0 colossus range, 0 cannons, and unit positioning falling apart =D
yeah madbull completely fell apart by a single drop and attack on his 3rd, he didn't do anything at all to stop ethier attack just sat there. infact i think he would have died alot earlier if it wasnt for the nexus attack
He also was supply-blocked way to often. Maybe he was just too nervous going into the booth for the first time and then also against a great TvP player
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
medivac speed is too imba. I don't know what zerg players can do against a Terran with crazy multi tasking
Spines & spores are still good.
medivac speed is way too strong, you were defending the warhound too i guess? ^^
On February 18 2013 19:18 Megiddosc wrote: Oh man, can somebody get this wub wub wub crap off the GSL stream? I knew once snowbird left that the music selection would go to hell.
They should just not have music, you inevitably annoy half the people watching.
Crackivacs look hilarious and fun, no idea if they are imba.
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
medivac speed is too imba. I don't know what zerg players can do against a Terran with crazy multi tasking
Spines & spores are still good.
Also speedlings still pretty fast, same as speed roaches, speed hydras and mutalisks _/(o_O)\_
On February 18 2013 19:18 Megiddosc wrote: Oh man, can somebody get this wub wub wub crap off the GSL stream? I knew once snowbird left that the music selection would go to hell.
Yeah, GOM music hasn't been what it used to be for quite a while
I guess I probably scream op because I haven't played hots yet(I've been wasting my beta key for months now ) I'll probably go HELL YEAH TERRAN once I start playing
On February 18 2013 19:18 Fusilero wrote: Hey check out this new terran, I haven't seen him forever didn't he get to IPL or something once. Whatever he looks decent maybe not win a GSL and certainly not on the level of leenock.
On February 18 2013 19:18 Megiddosc wrote: Oh man, can somebody get this wub wub wub crap off the GSL stream? I knew once snowbird left that the music selection would go to hell.
Yeah, GOM music hasn't been what it used to be for quite a while
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
medivac speed is too imba. I don't know what zerg players can do against a Terran with crazy multi tasking
I know, how about a zerg with crazy multi-tasking! Speedlings on creep are still crazy fast
There's also mutas and infestors for the slower folks
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
medivac speed is too imba. I don't know what zerg players can do against a Terran with crazy multi tasking
Spines & spores are still good.
medivac speed is way too strong, you were defending the warhound too i guess? ^^
A lot of the new things look broken when they work. Oracles, Void rays, swarm hosts...
On February 18 2013 19:18 Megiddosc wrote: Oh man, can somebody get this wub wub wub crap off the GSL stream? I knew once snowbird left that the music selection would go to hell.
Yeah, GOM music hasn't been what it used to be for quite a while
what had snowbird to do with music selection ?
Did he not do music selection? Is it the same person it has always been? Snowbird always had a lot of music blogs and it was usually him who posted playlists so I thought it was him.
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
medivac speed is too imba. I don't know what zerg players can do against a Terran with crazy multi tasking
Spines & spores are still good.
Also speedlings still pretty fast, same as speed roaches, speed hydras and mutalisks _/(o_O)\_
Speedlings, speed roaches doesn't trade well against drops. Not enough games we have seen roach hydra against T yet.
Muta is slower than medivac with speed.
You can't afford spines and spores until you have a good number of drones. Drops hit mid game
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
medivac speed is too imba. I don't know what zerg players can do against a Terran with crazy multi tasking
I know, how about a zerg with crazy multi-tasking! Speedlings on creep are still crazy fast
There's also mutas and infestors for the slower folks
I agree everyone is overreacting for the time being. But lol @ mutas and infestors.
Good luck wiffing fungal and the medivacs lol'ing as they dust the mutas.
On February 18 2013 19:18 Megiddosc wrote: Oh man, can somebody get this wub wub wub crap off the GSL stream? I knew once snowbird left that the music selection would go to hell.
Yeah, GOM music hasn't been what it used to be for quite a while
what had snowbird to do with music selection ?
Did he not do music selection? Is it the same person it has always been? Snowbird always had a lot of music blogs and it was usually him who posted playlists so I thought it was him.
it has always been the same person or same team rather
On February 18 2013 19:17 monkybone wrote: Stop screaming OP. Do you want blizzard to come in with the nerf-hammer and make another WoL out of HotS?
Anyway, it's beta, no one has figured anything out yet.
Sure not, but the medivac boost is obviously broken.
Just like BL/infestor were 'obviously' broken after the Queen patch and yet it took Blizzard 6+ months for fix?
Awful logic, and broodlord infestor was known as a stupid combination before the queen patch, just got a hell of a lot easier to get. The brokenness never really changed.
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
medivac speed is too imba. I don't know what zerg players can do against a Terran with crazy multi tasking
I know, how about a zerg with crazy multi-tasking! Speedlings on creep are still crazy fast
There's also mutas and infestors for the slower folks
I agree everyone is overreacting for the time being. But lol @ mutas and infestors.
Good luck wiffing fungal and the medivacs lol'ing as they dust the mutas.
medivacs with boost still fly a bit faster, but you'll have denied the drop attempts until you reach past 3+ base. medivac speed doesn't last forever and loading takes time
and there's also this thing call aim. Its not like the medivac is going to zigzag away
On February 18 2013 19:18 Megiddosc wrote: Oh man, can somebody get this wub wub wub crap off the GSL stream? I knew once snowbird left that the music selection would go to hell.
Yeah, GOM music hasn't been what it used to be for quite a while
what had snowbird to do with music selection ?
Did he not do music selection? Is it the same person it has always been? Snowbird always had a lot of music blogs and it was usually him who posted playlists so I thought it was him.
it has always been the same person or same team rather
Oh ok. Then their tastes and mine diverged a while ago I guess I hate dubstep...
On February 18 2013 19:17 monkybone wrote: Stop screaming OP. Do you want blizzard to come in with the nerf-hammer and make another WoL out of HotS?
Anyway, it's beta, no one has figured anything out yet.
Sure not, but the medivac boost is obviously broken.
Just like BL/infestor were 'obviously' broken after the Queen patch and yet it took Blizzard 6+ months for fix?
It was not as obvious as this. Because going to brood infestors was related to many other factors, while free medivac boost is way more obvious. But yes, I'm a bit worried about how long Blizz will figure out there is something strange with this free ability.
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
medivac speed is too imba. I don't know what zerg players can do against a Terran with crazy multi tasking
Spines & spores are still good.
Also speedlings still pretty fast, same as speed roaches, speed hydras and mutalisks _/(o_O)\_
Speedlings, speed roaches doesn't trade well against drops. Not enough games we have seen roach hydra against T yet.
Muta is slower than medivac with speed.
You can't afford spines and spores until you have a good number of drones. Drops hit mid game
Good number of drones for WoL meta or HoTS meta? I am not saying that medivacs aren't OP, but let's wait a bit before we judge. Remember when the Queen patch happened and all the terran timings were getting crushed. It feels like that now. Zerg in HoTS just cannot drone to 60 with little army and get away with it anymore. Do the new units make it so zerg doesn't have to have 10+ worker count in the mid game? Let see the players experiment more first.
On February 18 2013 19:17 monkybone wrote: Stop screaming OP. Do you want blizzard to come in with the nerf-hammer and make another WoL out of HotS?
Anyway, it's beta, no one has figured anything out yet.
Sure not, but the medivac boost is obviously broken.
Just like BL/infestor were 'obviously' broken after the Queen patch and yet it took Blizzard 6+ months for fix?
It was not as obvious as this. Because going to brood infestors was related to many other factors, while free medivac boost is way more obvious. But yes, I'm a bit worried about how long Blizz will figure out there is something strange with this free ability.
Actually, BL/infestors were due to one factor. The queen and OL buff made early/mid game overly safe for zerg and they could tech to t3 with little risk.
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
medivac speed is too imba. I don't know what zerg players can do against a Terran with crazy multi tasking
Spines & spores are still good.
Also speedlings still pretty fast, same as speed roaches, speed hydras and mutalisks _/(o_O)\_
Speedlings, speed roaches doesn't trade well against drops. Not enough games we have seen roach hydra against T yet.
Muta is slower than medivac with speed.
You can't afford spines and spores until you have a good number of drones. Drops hit mid game
Good number of drones for WoL meta or HoTS meta? I am not saying that medivacs aren't OP, but let's wait a bit before we judge. Remember when the Queen patch happened and all the terran timings were getting crushed. It feels like that now. Zerg in HoTS just cannot drone to 60 with little army and get away with it anymore. Do the new units make it so zerg doesn't have to have 10+ worker count in the mid game? Let see the players experiment more first.
And the queen patch was the worst thing to happen to wol, some of us don't want a repeat of that.
On February 18 2013 19:14 JunkkaGom wrote: can't believe the day would come that I would say this(and I'm one of those Terran players who felt marauders were never OP), but HotS Terran IMBA
Umm...he was just completely outplayed. The only HotS power that he used was medivac speed, and while that is useful, you shouldn't start screaming imba because of it.
medivac speed is too imba. I don't know what zerg players can do against a Terran with crazy multi tasking
Spines & spores are still good.
Also speedlings still pretty fast, same as speed roaches, speed hydras and mutalisks _/(o_O)\_
Speedlings, speed roaches doesn't trade well against drops. Not enough games we have seen roach hydra against T yet.
Muta is slower than medivac with speed.
You can't afford spines and spores until you have a good number of drones. Drops hit mid game
Good number of drones for WoL meta or HoTS meta? I am not saying that medivacs aren't OP, but let's wait a bit before we judge. Remember when the Queen patch happened and all the terran timings were getting crushed. It feels like that now. Zerg in HoTS just cannot drone to 60 with little army and get away with it anymore. Do the new units make it so zerg doesn't have to have 10+ worker count in the mid game? Let see the players experiment more first.
I think it would be better to have the medivac speed upgrade coming in mid game. I don't mind it being this fast, but the biggest problem is how early it comes and you only have units to defend against them because static defense are not affordable this early. And not a lot of units are mobile enough to defend.
On February 18 2013 19:17 monkybone wrote: Stop screaming OP. Do you want blizzard to come in with the nerf-hammer and make another WoL out of HotS?
Anyway, it's beta, no one has figured anything out yet.
Sure not, but the medivac boost is obviously broken.
Just like BL/infestor were 'obviously' broken after the Queen patch and yet it took Blizzard 6+ months for fix?
It was not as obvious as this. Because going to brood infestors was related to many other factors, while free medivac boost is way more obvious. But yes, I'm a bit worried about how long Blizz will figure out there is something strange with this free ability.
Actually, BL/infestors were due to one factor. The queen and OL buff made early/mid game overly safe for zerg and they could tech to t3 with little risk.
But to understand that you have to see a few complete games right ? To understand that this medivac spell is free in energy and research and gives you the fastest air speed of the game for what is basically your harassment base unit, it doesn't take that long...
I actually love the concept of Medivac boosts, just wish it came out slightly later. Having strong units which scale with skill on each race is fun to watch.
On February 18 2013 19:17 monkybone wrote: Stop screaming OP. Do you want blizzard to come in with the nerf-hammer and make another WoL out of HotS?
Anyway, it's beta, no one has figured anything out yet.
Sure not, but the medivac boost is obviously broken.
Just like BL/infestor were 'obviously' broken after the Queen patch and yet it took Blizzard 6+ months for fix?
It was not as obvious as this. Because going to brood infestors was related to many other factors, while free medivac boost is way more obvious. But yes, I'm a bit worried about how long Blizz will figure out there is something strange with this free ability.
Actually, BL/infestors were due to one factor. The queen and OL buff made early/mid game overly safe for zerg and they could tech to t3 with little risk.
But to understand that you have to see a few complete games right. To understand that this spell is free and gives you the fastest air speed of the game for what is basically your harassment base unit, it doesn't take you that long.
Yeah but it doesn't prove that it's imba. Welcome to the end of the thought process.
On February 18 2013 19:17 monkybone wrote: Stop screaming OP. Do you want blizzard to come in with the nerf-hammer and make another WoL out of HotS?
Anyway, it's beta, no one has figured anything out yet.
Sure not, but the medivac boost is obviously broken.
Just like BL/infestor were 'obviously' broken after the Queen patch and yet it took Blizzard 6+ months for fix?
It was not as obvious as this. Because going to brood infestors was related to many other factors, while free medivac boost is way more obvious. But yes, I'm a bit worried about how long Blizz will figure out there is something strange with this free ability.
Actually, BL/infestors were due to one factor. The queen and OL buff made early/mid game overly safe for zerg and they could tech to t3 with little risk.
But to understand that you have to see a few complete games right. To understand that this spell is free and gives you the fastest air speed of the game for what is basically your harassment base unit, it doesn't take you that long.
Yeah but it doesn't prove that it's imba. Welcome to the end of the thought process.
At least it looks like a very weird concept to me. If at least it costs some energy, so that you can choose between having better healing power or more harass power, I think that would be much more logical.
On February 18 2013 19:24 Fjodorov wrote: First TvT i see in hots. Is it still a great matchup?
How do you feel about hellbat drops?
haven't seen one yet. And the drop action is more fun to at least look at: drops makes little damage - actually has a chance to escape. If scouted a drop will income, it is still possible with ease to defend. Just more skill is needed...but there were also tons of harassementoptions in midgame for other races that were equally easy to pull of and equally hard to defend, just think about mutas and the new possibilities the races have. I hate hellbats though, but i think boost is strong but will be dealt with over time. We are still just watching a game in it's very early stages of meta game developement
high level tvt with medivac speed is fun to watch. so much extra stuff is going on with the usual tank lines versus tank lines. constant scans and sensor towers too :D
On February 18 2013 19:48 Talack wrote: this is actually some pretty low end, late game, tvt right now
both are just massing bio/tank and not making any sort of transition or forcing their opponent into positions of any kind. strange to see
Yep. It's been in "late-game" for like 20 min and still no ravens in production, or nuke silos. Low end late game TvT indeed. The early/mid-game was standard korean gosuness tho, their lategame is meh.
okay sad that the boost isn't there anymore i thought it was quite fun
but can't really tell because have no beta-kay ^^ going to take one day off work on march 12 and rush to the store in the morning playing the whole day
On February 18 2013 19:48 Talack wrote: this is actually some pretty low end, late game, tvt right now
both are just massing bio/tank and not making any sort of transition or forcing their opponent into positions of any kind. strange to see
They have to defend the expands and both are transiting to BC
It's been 30 min of making tanks and attacking each other in the mid with nothing really happening. No banshees, no successful drop, no change at all in the composition. It's a boring game.
On February 18 2013 19:47 TrumpetWilli wrote: is the BC Speed-Boost still in the game?
No. that was removed very early in the beta.
they made bc attacks alot stronger though right?
That ended up being a bug apparently.
The only changes the Battlecruiser has had is that Yamato Cannon costs 100 energy instead of 125 and Ship Armor is shared with Vehicle armor.
EDIT: have these two really split Whirlwind in half completely now? This game is ridiculous, i didn't think it was possible to split this map like this.
On February 18 2013 19:47 TrumpetWilli wrote: is the BC Speed-Boost still in the game?
No. that was removed very early in the beta.
they made bc attacks alot stronger though right?
That ended up being a bug apparently.
The only changes the Battlecruiser has had is that Yamato Cannon costs 100 energy instead of 125 and Ship Armor is shared with Vehicle armor.
EDIT: have these two really split Whirlwind in half completely now? This game is ridiculous, i didn't think it was possible to split this map like this.
TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
I think I just want so see a game where things change.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
I think I just want so see a game where things change.
Yeah. Which is what we're getting here. Stuff changes every single minute. Every other matchup, a lot changes once every 10 or so minutes.
Haha, I remember when Blizzard was talking about the TvT standoffs and that was one of the reasons they made the "rocket" (or whatever it was called) on the Warhound.
And now look at this game... zzzzzzzzz. Sorry but this isn't fun to watch. I can't even understand why this would be fun to play. Imagine playing these kinds of games on the ladder.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
I think I just want so see a game where things change.
Yeah. Which is what we're getting here. Stuff changes every single minute. Every other matchup, a lot changes once every 10 or so minutes.
I see what you are saying, but all I can see is a seige line. Virtually the same siege line that was set up 20 mins into the game.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
Dropping, counterattacking, and jockeying for position all the time is the opposite of nothing.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
I think I just want so see a game where things change.
Yeah. Which is what we're getting here. Stuff changes every single minute. Every other matchup, a lot changes once every 10 or so minutes.
I can understand that some people just doesn't like this but I always enjoyed these long drawn-out TvT matches in BW. It becomes sort of hypnotic and is IMO more entertaining than 15min max armies and GG.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
If you see nothing happening, you don't understand TvT.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
Dropping, counterattacking, and jockeying for position all the time is the opposite of nothing.
Nothing as in neither person actually achieving something.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
If you see nothing happening, you don't understand TvT.
I'm really enjoying this, so much going on, a lot of army movement, positional play. The only thing I'm concerned about is the early game in TvT, it seems a bit shaky at the moment.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
Do you like the 15 minute macro fests that end in 15 seconds? So lame spectating 2 people macro up for so long with no action and then it ends so quickly.
On February 18 2013 20:03 Morphage wrote: I'm really enjoying this, so much going on, a lot of army movement, positional play. The only thing I'm concerned about is the early game in TvT, it seems a bit shaky at the moment.
On February 18 2013 20:03 Morphage wrote: I'm really enjoying this, so much going on, a lot of army movement, positional play. The only thing I'm concerned about is the early game in TvT, it seems a bit shaky at the moment.
It'll calm down eventually. I'm sure it will.
Well this TvT went without a hellbat drop so maybe the nerf worked out.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
Do you like the 15 minute macro fests that end in 15 seconds? So lame spectating 2 people macro up for so long with no action and then it ends so quickly.
I hate it when people say this, but that is a strawman. I want to see games like Leenock vs Jjakji, like mma vs drg, like mma vs gumiho, like the first two games of losira vs gumiho, like ryung vs flash etc etc.
It seems like Dream just didn't transition into the super late game. Once they split the map, jjakji made ravens, nukes, and pre-emptive starports while Dream stuck to marines/medivacs/siege tanks only mixing in marauders at the very end.
On February 18 2013 20:05 bo1b wrote: Whats happening now is interesting, watching jjajki make 4 tanks at a time then lose them 20 seconds later to a medivac for 10min straight is not.
On February 18 2013 20:05 Vindicare605 wrote: LOL. Takes out a CC and immediately lands his own there while the wreckage of the first one is still there.
It's literally Flash vs Fantasy in BW all over again :p
On February 18 2013 20:03 Morphage wrote: I'm really enjoying this, so much going on, a lot of army movement, positional play. The only thing I'm concerned about is the early game in TvT, it seems a bit shaky at the moment.
I would enjoy this if it was WoL.
The fact that it was 45 minutes of marine/tank with eventual ghost and ravens in HotS just seems so wrong
TvT is by far the best matchup because there are usually no death balls in TvT, you get a lot of small skirmishes all over the map.
If at some point blizzard reduces the amount of units you can get inside a control group, this game would get like 10x better (because of protoss and zerg).
It's also the same reason Terran is the least played race, since its harder to Deathball a move with a Terran army, new players just decide to go for the easier races, protoss and zerg. Terran is not weak, but is without a doubt the harder race to play in the game.
totally reminds me of the game where mr. bitter and rotterdam were betting if a game was going to end before or after the 1 hour mark, this one clocking in at 58 minutes xD
jjakji showing his experience and making a ton more tech and utilizing it, winning him the game handily. sick!
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
Do you like the 15 minute macro fests that end in 15 seconds? So lame spectating 2 people macro up for so long with no action and then it ends so quickly.
I hate it when people say this, but that is a strawman. I want to see games like Leenock vs Jjakji, like mma vs drg, like mma vs gumiho, like the first two games of losira vs gumiho, like ryung vs flash etc etc.
Yes, we all do. Those games are one in a million though which is why we love them.
If they were the only games we liked though why bother watching the rest?
This is a decent game. As a TvT fan I'm enjoying it, but it's definitely not mma vs gumiho. Does that mean it's a bad game? Heck no, entertainingly close.
On February 18 2013 20:06 forsooth wrote: To all the people mad about the scanning, you need to play more 45 minute TvTs on the ladder. You won't even notice anymore.
I just medivac reaper rush every match on ladder so I never hear that many scans.
On February 18 2013 20:05 bo1b wrote: Whats happening now is interesting, watching jjajki make 4 tanks at a time then lose them 20 seconds later to a medivac for 10min straight is not.
do you ever not complain?
People are pretending this is the most amazing tvt of all time lol.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
Do you like the 15 minute macro fests that end in 15 seconds? So lame spectating 2 people macro up for so long with no action and then it ends so quickly.
I hate it when people say this, but that is a strawman. I want to see games like Leenock vs Jjakji, like mma vs drg, like mma vs gumiho, like the first two games of losira vs gumiho, like ryung vs flash etc etc.
Yes, we all do. Those games are one in a million though which is why we love them.
If they were the only games we liked though why bother watching the rest?
This is a decent game. As a TvT fan I'm enjoying it, but it's definitely not mma vs gumiho. Does that mean it's a bad game? Heck no, entertainingly close.
I am enjoying it, people are just making it out to be some sort of miracle game with a line being set up straight down the middle for ever.
On February 18 2013 20:06 forsooth wrote: To all the people mad about the scanning, you need to play more 45 minute TvTs on the ladder. You won't even notice anymore.
Good game! Of course the late game transitions were really lackluster (or rather, non-existant for Dream), but I still love this kind of positional games <3
On February 18 2013 20:05 bo1b wrote: Whats happening now is interesting, watching jjajki make 4 tanks at a time then lose them 20 seconds later to a medivac for 10min straight is not.
do you ever not complain?
People are pretending this is the most amazing tvt of all time lol.
On February 18 2013 20:06 CSSolutionstv wrote: TvT is by far the best matchup because there are usually no death balls in TvT, you get a lot of small skirmishes all over the map.
If at some point blizzard reduces the amount of units you can get inside a control group, this game would get like 10x better (because of protoss and zerg).
It's also the same reason Terran is the least played race, since its harder to Deathball a move with a Terran army, new players just decide to go for the easier races, protoss and zerg. Terran is not weak, but is without a doubt the harder race to play in the game.
Why is it that you always have the need to downplay the other races in order to feel good about yours? Can't we all just get along while killing each other's units?
On February 18 2013 20:05 bo1b wrote: Whats happening now is interesting, watching jjajki make 4 tanks at a time then lose them 20 seconds later to a medivac for 10min straight is not.
do you ever not complain?
People are pretending this is the most amazing tvt of all time lol.
I thought it was pretty good.
He always complain about TvT no idea he doesn't like Terran at all
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
Do you like the 15 minute macro fests that end in 15 seconds? So lame spectating 2 people macro up for so long with no action and then it ends so quickly.
I hate it when people say this, but that is a strawman. I want to see games like Leenock vs Jjakji, like mma vs drg, like mma vs gumiho, like the first two games of losira vs gumiho, like ryung vs flash etc etc.
No way. It plagues SC2 games. Players don't really attack until max outs. Can not blame them, though. That is just the best way to approach the game, in general. Macro/maxing out is way too easy, as the SC2 economy is broken.
The most exciting matches are the aggressive ones. Sure, you can have back and forth games that can be exciting where people just max out, fight, remax, repeat. However, if they are not going to attack in the first 15 minutes, just give them 3k/3k starting resources to speed it up. </sarcasm>
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
Do you like the 15 minute macro fests that end in 15 seconds? So lame spectating 2 people macro up for so long with no action and then it ends so quickly.
I hate it when people say this, but that is a strawman. I want to see games like Leenock vs Jjakji, like mma vs drg, like mma vs gumiho, like the first two games of losira vs gumiho, like ryung vs flash etc etc.
Yes, we all do. Those games are one in a million though which is why we love them.
If they were the only games we liked though why bother watching the rest?
This is a decent game. As a TvT fan I'm enjoying it, but it's definitely not mma vs gumiho. Does that mean it's a bad game? Heck no, entertainingly close.
I am enjoying it, people are just making it out to be some sort of miracle game with a line being set up straight down the middle for ever.
To be fair, I never expected to see a hyper-positional, split-screen, all-bases-taken game on Whirlwind, arguably one of the biggest maps in GSL ever.The map just feels too awkwardly large for such kinds of games, yet we saw one today.
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
Do you like the 15 minute macro fests that end in 15 seconds? So lame spectating 2 people macro up for so long with no action and then it ends so quickly.
I hate it when people say this, but that is a strawman. I want to see games like Leenock vs Jjakji, like mma vs drg, like mma vs gumiho, like the first two games of losira vs gumiho, like ryung vs flash etc etc.
No way. It plagues SC2 games. Players don't really attack until max outs. Can not blame them, though. That is just the best way to approach the game, in general. Macro/maxing out is way too easy, as the SC2 economy is broken.
The most exciting matches are the aggressive ones. Sure, you can have back and forth games that can be exciting where people just max out, fight, remax, repeat. However, if they are not going to attack in the first 15 minutes, just give them 3k/3k starting resources to speed it up. </sarcasm>
nice tvt just now. I saw only from minute 30, and i took me like 5 minutes to know it was hots :') Speedy medivacs are nice, seeker missile felt better as well, imo.
When wolf and khaldor mentioned race levels for the team account I wonder what TSL's would have been probably level 5 terran, level 0 protoss and level 15123412 zerg.
That was basically early 2011-esque wings of liberty TvT (think jinro vs ensnare) with medivacs on steroids. At least this time jjakji showed the prescience to tech into nukes and ravens, which were conspicuously absent in that previous era of tvt. Hopefully we get more tvts that get into the late game so we can see this matchup develop.
On February 18 2013 20:06 CSSolutionstv wrote: TvT is by far the best matchup because there are usually no death balls in TvT, you get a lot of small skirmishes all over the map.
If at some point blizzard reduces the amount of units you can get inside a control group, this game would get like 10x better (because of protoss and zerg).
It's also the same reason Terran is the least played race, since its harder to Deathball a move with a Terran army, new players just decide to go for the easier races, protoss and zerg. Terran is not weak, but is without a doubt the harder race to play in the game.
Why is it that you always have the need to downplay the other races in order to feel good about yours? Can't we all just get along while killing each other's units?
I'm Highmasters with protoss and zerg, i don't play terran
zerg had to go dronescout, 15 pool, add roach warren and spore on 2 base just to deal with the little pressure of a 3 orbital build, its impossible to get ahead in economy as zerg if youre also playing safe
On February 18 2013 20:06 CSSolutionstv wrote: TvT is by far the best matchup because there are usually no death balls in TvT, you get a lot of small skirmishes all over the map.
If at some point blizzard reduces the amount of units you can get inside a control group, this game would get like 10x better (because of protoss and zerg).
It's also the same reason Terran is the least played race, since its harder to Deathball a move with a Terran army, new players just decide to go for the easier races, protoss and zerg. Terran is not weak, but is without a doubt the harder race to play in the game.
Why is it that you always have the need to downplay the other races in order to feel good about yours? Can't we all just get along while killing each other's units?
I'm Highmasters with protoss and zerg, i don't play terran
You're just trolling then, but terran is a state of mind anyway.
Holy hell, that positioning for that battle! marauder wall against banes, then hellbats and marines at the back. Cannot imagine Shine took that fight. It was like deciding to engage the 300 spartans led by Leonidas!
i think that game was a combination of jjakji being three times as good as shine as well as hots terran being abusive as shit pretty easy to leap to the conclusion that it was just the latter though
Haha... only caught the end of the game. Seemed like a pretty stupid gameplan from Shine. "Hey, let me try mutas against the best TvZ-player of the TvZ-muta-era."
On February 18 2013 19:57 purakushi wrote: TvT is great. People don't like it, because all they want to see is 200/200 max battles that end in 15 seconds. Sure it's flashy, but it's just so silly.
No your completely right watching nothing happen for 20min is great!
Do you like the 15 minute macro fests that end in 15 seconds? So lame spectating 2 people macro up for so long with no action and then it ends so quickly.
I hate it when people say this, but that is a strawman. I want to see games like Leenock vs Jjakji, like mma vs drg, like mma vs gumiho, like the first two games of losira vs gumiho, like ryung vs flash etc etc.
No way. It plagues SC2 games. Players don't really attack until max outs. Can not blame them, though. That is just the best way to approach the game, in general. Macro/maxing out is way too easy, as the SC2 economy is broken.
The most exciting matches are the aggressive ones. Sure, you can have back and forth games that can be exciting where people just max out, fight, remax, repeat. However, if they are not going to attack in the first 15 minutes, just give them 3k/3k starting resources to speed it up. </sarcasm>
Good job completely missing the point.
Apologies, I misread what you said. ;; I'd like to see more games like those, too.
On February 18 2013 20:21 Ghanburighan wrote: Holy hell, that positioning for that battle! marauder wall against banes, then hellbats and marines at the back. Cannot imagine Shine took that fight. It was like deciding to engage the 300 spartans led by Leonidas!
except jjakji's army was double or more of Shines. That game was decided after Jjakji sniped the third with his harass play. Jjakji looking scary! Or maybe zerg just looking sad, I haven't seen zerg take a game yet in HotS T_T
On February 18 2013 20:18 Lukeeze[zR] wrote: Terrans should always keep 1 hellion to chase down those low-hp drones (instead of going full lolbats).
No. Hellbats>All.
(seriously though, I agree. I would like to see more Terrans keeping standard hellions in their army. It's really good for harassment and chasing after a big battle)
On February 18 2013 20:21 Ghanburighan wrote: Holy hell, that positioning for that battle! marauder wall against banes, then hellbats and marines at the back. Cannot imagine Shine took that fight. It was like deciding to engage the 300 spartans led by Leonidas!
except jjakji's army was double or more of Shines. That game was decided after Jjakji sniped the third with his harass play. Jjakji looking scary! Or maybe zerg just looking sad, I haven't seen zerg take a game yet in HotS T_T
Zerg has won two games, both of them from allins. The last game really was just a showing of Jjajki outclassing his opponent.
Never was really impressed by him, but maybe he's better in HotS and at least we get another Zerg sampling....or rather Jjakji gets another Zerg sample as he's going to eat Monster alive
On February 18 2013 20:21 Ghanburighan wrote: Holy hell, that positioning for that battle! marauder wall against banes, then hellbats and marines at the back. Cannot imagine Shine took that fight. It was like deciding to engage the 300 spartans led by Leonidas!
except jjakji's army was double or more of Shines. That game was decided after Jjakji sniped the third with his harass play. Jjakji looking scary! Or maybe zerg just looking sad, I haven't seen zerg take a game yet in HotS T_T
Zerg has won two games, both of them from allins. The last game really was just a showing of Jjajki outclassing his opponent.
Yeah I'm sure the Lannisters felt like Robb Stark was OP too right after the Battle of Oxcross. Give it a few more damn games please.
On February 18 2013 20:26 hasuterrans wrote: Jjakji had his marauders on a separate control group than his marines. This is not something I see many terrans do in TvZ.
On February 18 2013 20:25 Gevna wrote: I just don't get how the hell Jjakji disappeared like that after his gsl win. I mean he was really good, and still looks strong.
Jjakji basically ran up against some strong players, but in addition had a weaker TvT which is almost death for GSL. And then post queen patch he seemed incapable of winning vs zerg and constantly complained on twitter about it haha.
Still what you say is true. Jjakji still looks quite strong, but he's yet to really make a splash in a tournament since. His TvT honestly still needs work. It looked ok vs Dream, but Dream is not yet a championship contender. "Ok" isn't enough.
On February 18 2013 20:21 Ghanburighan wrote: Holy hell, that positioning for that battle! marauder wall against banes, then hellbats and marines at the back. Cannot imagine Shine took that fight. It was like deciding to engage the 300 spartans led by Leonidas!
except jjakji's army was double or more of Shines. That game was decided after Jjakji sniped the third with his harass play. Jjakji looking scary! Or maybe zerg just looking sad, I haven't seen zerg take a game yet in HotS T_T
Zerg has won two games, both of them from allins. The last game really was just a showing of Jjajki outclassing his opponent.
Yeah I'm sure the Lannisters felt like Robb Stark was OP too right after the Battle of Oxcross. Give it a few more damn games please.
F*cking Lannister cheesers. I still hate them for the build order win they took.
On February 18 2013 20:28 Fusilero wrote: I don't get what's wrong with munster, he was great, he's reliable in team leagues and he's probably practised hots the most.
On February 18 2013 20:28 Fusilero wrote: I don't get what's wrong with munster, he was great, he's reliable in team leagues and he's probably practised hots the most.
On February 18 2013 20:28 Fusilero wrote: I don't get what's wrong with munster, he was great, he's reliable in team leagues and he's probably practised hots the most.
On February 18 2013 20:28 Fusilero wrote: I don't get what's wrong with munster, he was great, he's reliable in team leagues and he's probably practised hots the most.
On February 18 2013 20:21 Ghanburighan wrote: Holy hell, that positioning for that battle! marauder wall against banes, then hellbats and marines at the back. Cannot imagine Shine took that fight. It was like deciding to engage the 300 spartans led by Leonidas!
except jjakji's army was double or more of Shines. That game was decided after Jjakji sniped the third with his harass play. Jjakji looking scary! Or maybe zerg just looking sad, I haven't seen zerg take a game yet in HotS T_T
Zerg has won two games, both of them from allins. The last game really was just a showing of Jjajki outclassing his opponent.
Yeah I'm sure the Lannisters felt like Robb Stark was OP too right after the Battle of Oxcross. Give it a few more damn games please.
F*cking Lannister cheesers. I still hate them for the build order win they took.
I want to see some special Zerg tactics man, like using a Viper to snatch a Speedvac out of the air then use Fungal and/or Hydras to kill it. Would look so cool. Seems our Swarm brethren always take the longest by far to utilize their new units to their full potential so I won't get my hopes up yet but it would be awesome.
I actually hardly ever see Vipers ever, on all the streams I watched. Are they really that bad? Their abilities seem pretty sick o_O At least just throwing a handful as supports into a lategame army can never hurt.
On February 18 2013 20:28 Fusilero wrote: I don't get what's wrong with munster, he was great, he's reliable in team leagues and he's probably practised hots the most.
We want DRG!!
I wanted Sniper
I wanted noblesse so the you both suck.
I actually wanted Genius to come back to MVP and then build void rays and win but I didn't want to put all my marbles in one basket so I thought, I'll hope for DRG.
On February 18 2013 20:21 Ghanburighan wrote: Holy hell, that positioning for that battle! marauder wall against banes, then hellbats and marines at the back. Cannot imagine Shine took that fight. It was like deciding to engage the 300 spartans led by Leonidas!
except jjakji's army was double or more of Shines. That game was decided after Jjakji sniped the third with his harass play. Jjakji looking scary! Or maybe zerg just looking sad, I haven't seen zerg take a game yet in HotS T_T
Zerg has won two games, both of them from allins. The last game really was just a showing of Jjajki outclassing his opponent.
Yeah I'm sure the Lannisters felt like Robb Stark was OP too right after the Battle of Oxcross. Give it a few more damn games please.
F*cking Lannister cheesers. I still hate them for the build order win they took.
On February 18 2013 20:25 Gevna wrote: I just don't get how the hell Jjakji disappeared like that after his gsl win. I mean he was really good, and still looks strong.
Jjakji basically ran up against some strong players, but in addition had a weaker TvT which is almost death for GSL. And then post queen patch he seemed incapable of winning vs zerg and constantly complained on twitter about it haha.
Still what you say is true. Jjakji still looks quite strong, but he's yet to really make a splash in a tournament since. His TvT honestly still needs work. It looked ok vs Dream, but Dream is not yet a championship contender. "Ok" isn't enough.
This is probably the most accurate description of his fall.
Does Jjakji mech btw? I've not seen that in a long time.
On February 18 2013 20:25 Gevna wrote: I just don't get how the hell Jjakji disappeared like that after his gsl win. I mean he was really good, and still looks strong.
Jjakji basically ran up against some strong players, but in addition had a weaker TvT which is almost death for GSL. And then post queen patch he seemed incapable of winning vs zerg and constantly complained on twitter about it haha.
Still what you say is true. Jjakji still looks quite strong, but he's yet to really make a splash in a tournament since. His TvT honestly still needs work. It looked ok vs Dream, but Dream is not yet a championship contender. "Ok" isn't enough.
This is probably the most accurate description of his fall.
Does Jjakji mech btw? I've not seen that in a long time.
I don't recall seeing him play anything other than marine-tank in tvt but it has been a while
On February 18 2013 20:25 Gevna wrote: I just don't get how the hell Jjakji disappeared like that after his gsl win. I mean he was really good, and still looks strong.
Jjakji basically ran up against some strong players, but in addition had a weaker TvT which is almost death for GSL. And then post queen patch he seemed incapable of winning vs zerg and constantly complained on twitter about it haha.
Still what you say is true. Jjakji still looks quite strong, but he's yet to really make a splash in a tournament since. His TvT honestly still needs work. It looked ok vs Dream, but Dream is not yet a championship contender. "Ok" isn't enough.
This is probably the most accurate description of his fall.
Does Jjakji mech btw? I've not seen that in a long time.
I can't recall having seen him mech, now that I think about it. Could be wrong though.
On February 18 2013 20:25 Gevna wrote: I just don't get how the hell Jjakji disappeared like that after his gsl win. I mean he was really good, and still looks strong.
Jjakji basically ran up against some strong players, but in addition had a weaker TvT which is almost death for GSL. And then post queen patch he seemed incapable of winning vs zerg and constantly complained on twitter about it haha.
Still what you say is true. Jjakji still looks quite strong, but he's yet to really make a splash in a tournament since. His TvT honestly still needs work. It looked ok vs Dream, but Dream is not yet a championship contender. "Ok" isn't enough.
This is probably the most accurate description of his fall.
Does Jjakji mech btw? I've not seen that in a long time.
Triple J did run some mech in the era of GomTvT and even did some mechvP in his GSL championship run, but he never looked as good at is as he did with his ghost and marine play.
I'd say he's a bio specialist from what I've seen, though I'm probably not the most hardcore JJJ fan.
On February 18 2013 20:25 Gevna wrote: I just don't get how the hell Jjakji disappeared like that after his gsl win. I mean he was really good, and still looks strong.
Jjakji basically ran up against some strong players, but in addition had a weaker TvT which is almost death for GSL. And then post queen patch he seemed incapable of winning vs zerg and constantly complained on twitter about it haha.
Still what you say is true. Jjakji still looks quite strong, but he's yet to really make a splash in a tournament since. His TvT honestly still needs work. It looked ok vs Dream, but Dream is not yet a championship contender. "Ok" isn't enough.
This is probably the most accurate description of his fall.
Does Jjakji mech btw? I've not seen that in a long time.
I don't recall seeing him play anything other than marine-tank in tvt but it has been a while
Yes he mechs. It's pretty good (still plays it sometimes vZ), but he's prone to missing lategame transition timings which I think is why he tends to stick to a more manoeuvrable composition.
On February 18 2013 20:31 Big J wrote: Haha... Love it how people complain about beta balance.
I'm not expecting that there will be any useful winrates until fall... And that is pretty optimistic, after watching 2010 and 2011 WoL winrates...
Afaic, I don't complain about balance as a whole, but more about some units/spells whose concept look a bit broken to me. For instance medivac and its free boost spell not costing any energy. I don't like this concept and it's contrary to any standard that has existed in SC imo.
On February 18 2013 20:25 Gevna wrote: I just don't get how the hell Jjakji disappeared like that after his gsl win. I mean he was really good, and still looks strong.
Jjakji basically ran up against some strong players, but in addition had a weaker TvT which is almost death for GSL. And then post queen patch he seemed incapable of winning vs zerg and constantly complained on twitter about it haha.
Still what you say is true. Jjakji still looks quite strong, but he's yet to really make a splash in a tournament since. His TvT honestly still needs work. It looked ok vs Dream, but Dream is not yet a championship contender. "Ok" isn't enough.
This is probably the most accurate description of his fall.
Does Jjakji mech btw? I've not seen that in a long time.
Triple J did run some mech in the era of GomTvT and even did some mechvP in his GSL championship run, but he never looked as good at is as he did with his ghost and marine play.
I'd say he's a bio specialist from what I've seen, though I'm probably not the most hardcore JJJ fan.
It wasn't really MechvP it was a thor/banshee timing that he blew puzzle up with.
On February 18 2013 20:21 Ghanburighan wrote: Holy hell, that positioning for that battle! marauder wall against banes, then hellbats and marines at the back. Cannot imagine Shine took that fight. It was like deciding to engage the 300 spartans led by Leonidas!
On February 18 2013 20:31 Big J wrote: Haha... Love it how people complain about beta balance.
I'm not expecting that there will be any useful winrates until fall... And that is pretty optimistic, after watching 2010 and 2011 WoL winrates...
What does this even mean? Isn't the whole point of a beta to find out imbalances so they get fixed before release?
The point of a beta is to ensure that the game works, to generate hype and do a larger test on the populace. Until all pros switch and people start to develop proper strategies, what balance we get now isn't really indicative of anything close to final balance.
Unfortunately I think blizzard have been hit by the community to make things more balanced over exciting. I want the warhound back =(
On February 18 2013 20:25 Gevna wrote: I just don't get how the hell Jjakji disappeared like that after his gsl win. I mean he was really good, and still looks strong.
Jjakji basically ran up against some strong players, but in addition had a weaker TvT which is almost death for GSL. And then post queen patch he seemed incapable of winning vs zerg and constantly complained on twitter about it haha.
Still what you say is true. Jjakji still looks quite strong, but he's yet to really make a splash in a tournament since. His TvT honestly still needs work. It looked ok vs Dream, but Dream is not yet a championship contender. "Ok" isn't enough.
This is probably the most accurate description of his fall.
Does Jjakji mech btw? I've not seen that in a long time.
Triple J did run some mech in the era of GomTvT and even did some mechvP in his GSL championship run, but he never looked as good at is as he did with his ghost and marine play.
I'd say he's a bio specialist from what I've seen, though I'm probably not the most hardcore JJJ fan.
It wasn't really MechvP it was a thor/banshee timing that he blew puzzle up with.
Ah right. Sorry memory was hazy, I missed most of that match then got the displeasure of watching Jjakji vs Oz which was a mess of a semi final to the point where a Leenock victory seemed to be 99% secured.
On February 18 2013 20:31 Big J wrote: Haha... Love it how people complain about beta balance.
I'm not expecting that there will be any useful winrates until fall... And that is pretty optimistic, after watching 2010 and 2011 WoL winrates...
What does this even mean? Isn't the whole point of a beta to find out imbalances so they get fixed before release?
The point of a beta is to ensure that the game works, to generate hype and do a larger test on the populace. Until all pros switch and people start to develop proper strategies, what balance we get now isn't really indicative of anything close to final balance.
Unfortunately I think blizzard have been hit by the community to make things more balanced over exciting. I want the warhound back =(
This is the part where I post that image that says "not sure if trolling".
On February 18 2013 20:31 Big J wrote: Haha... Love it how people complain about beta balance.
I'm not expecting that there will be any useful winrates until fall... And that is pretty optimistic, after watching 2010 and 2011 WoL winrates...
What does this even mean? Isn't the whole point of a beta to find out imbalances so they get fixed before release?
I wouldn't even go that far. Usually a beta is mostly to provide a playable test version to get a feel for the game and find out bugs. That blizzard uses the beta for balance and design feedback and work so much on such problems is more than awesome to begin with. Somewhat needed for an esports game for sure, but the fact that all 3races seems somewhat capable of winning when outplaying an opponent is already great.
On February 18 2013 20:38 pdd wrote: Anyone care to tell me why there's a green square partially blocking the Terran symbol on the production tab in the top left?
It looks like a button to close that tab, I agree it is annoying.
On February 18 2013 20:31 Big J wrote: Haha... Love it how people complain about beta balance.
I'm not expecting that there will be any useful winrates until fall... And that is pretty optimistic, after watching 2010 and 2011 WoL winrates...
What does this even mean? Isn't the whole point of a beta to find out imbalances so they get fixed before release?
The point of a beta is to ensure that the game works, to generate hype and do a larger test on the populace. Until all pros switch and people start to develop proper strategies, what balance we get now isn't really indicative of anything close to final balance.
Unfortunately I think blizzard have been hit by the community to make things more balanced over exciting. I want the warhound back =(
This is the part where I post that image that says "not sure if trolling".
Well a better image of the warhound probably.
I guess those words are at odds haha. Basically I want more exciting things. And thus I wanted more units for more variation. Warhound was almost a good idea terribly executed (like the carrier). Blizzard don't seem to be interested in changing half of their units though =(
On February 18 2013 20:42 mataxp wrote: oh jjakji you're re-gaining some fans here
True fans never left.
They just cried as he lost to every. single. zerg. ever.
I don't recall that honestly. He won vs Whale and Sirius before falling to Leenock in NSH vs FXO. I mostly remember him losing to terrans a lot. And I mean a lot.
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
Do you prefer the 33% win rate terran is currently experiancing in wol?
Monster did a massive attack that didn't do nearly the damage required, after that he massed up lings while jjakji had a hard counter to them and when he fought his army he didn't have nearly enough units to hold it off.
so...jjakji outplayed the hell out of him and the zerg before him.
It is still questionable balance and pretty much far from something to be hyped about. It feels like open season 1-3 again. Nothing is certain, some stupid unit combos that have been not toned down yet, and overall a mess.
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
zerg who hasn't been great in WoL vs. a GSL champ
A gsl champ who has been completly of the radar for a year. Terran is just too strong right now. Did you see how those hellbats completly owned monster? even with banelings conecting
Oha, haven't seen a TvZ in HotS yet, but a Terran-ball with MMHellbat (mech being healing?) looks strong as hell... how do you beat this as Z? Guess Inf/Roach? Mutas seem useless anyway with speedymedivacs... But nice metagame switch
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
Do you prefer the 33% win rate terran is currently experiancing in wol?
Monster did a massive attack that didn't do nearly the damage required, after that he massed up lings while jjakji had a hard counter to them and when he fought his army he didn't have nearly enough units to hold it off.
so...jjakji outplayed the hell out of him and the zerg before him.
and the other zerg that lost had like no units vs a 2 base terran haha. totally balance related
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
zerg who hasn't been great in WoL vs. a GSL champ
A gsl champ who has been completly of the radar for a year. Terran is just too strong right now. Did you see how those hellbats completly owned monster? even with banelings conecting
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
zerg who hasn't been great in WoL vs. a GSL champ
A gsl champ who has been completly of the radar for a year. Terran is just too strong right now. Did you see how those hellbats completly owned monster? even with banelings conecting
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
zerg who hasn't been great in WoL vs. a GSL champ
A gsl champ who has been completly of the radar for a year. Terran is just too strong right now. Did you see how those hellbats completly owned monster? even with banelings conecting
munster is pretty off the radar himself tbh
yeah but code b zergs are supposed to beat code b terrans. otherwise the game is broken, right?
On February 18 2013 20:49 NightOfTheDead wrote: It is still questionable balance and pretty much far from something to be hyped about. It feels like open season 1-3 again. Nothing is certain, some stupid unit combos that have been not toned down yet, and overall a mess.
shouldn't really be a surprise though that the balance will be off for a while after adding so much new stuff
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
zerg who hasn't been great in WoL vs. a GSL champ
A gsl champ who has been completly of the radar for a year. Terran is just too strong right now. Did you see how those hellbats completly owned monster? even with banelings conecting
banelings connecting on non light units. Best strat evar
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
Another comment about T winning vs Z, when will it end
On a more serious note, great play from Jjakji. Monster had a weird build. Ah well, GG NSH!
And it ended when JKS beat Byun and Maru
Exactly. :p It's beta. Shit might be OP, but you are watching people try to innovate and create builds to counter this. It's awesome. Maybe they should try some hydraling or something.
pfffff... Coach: "Monster, you are our last hope. You can do it!" Monster: "Time to flip a coin and try an allin that is hardly ever being played in WoL anymore!" ...
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
zerg who hasn't been great in WoL vs. a GSL champ
A gsl champ who has been completly of the radar for a year. Terran is just too strong right now. Did you see how those hellbats completly owned monster? even with banelings conecting
banelings connecting on non light units. Best strat evar
The next time I run a mass of hellions into roaches and they lose, I'm gonna be mad.
So jjakji used sick multitasking and micro to win the game, I'm fine with that. What exactly did Monster do right to deserve a win? Fail a massive Ling/Bling attack and explode Blings on the wrong units. Yeah, that balance man.
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
zerg who hasn't been great in WoL vs. a GSL champ
A gsl champ who has been completly of the radar for a year. Terran is just too strong right now. Did you see how those hellbats completly owned monster? even with banelings conecting
banelings connecting on non light units. Best strat evar
The next time I run a mass of hellions into roaches and they lose, I'm gonna be mad.
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
zerg who hasn't been great in WoL vs. a GSL champ
A gsl champ who has been completly of the radar for a year. Terran is just too strong right now. Did you see how those hellbats completly owned monster? even with banelings conecting
banelings connecting on non light units. Best strat evar
The next time I run a mass of hellions into roaches and they lose, I'm gonna be mad.
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
zerg who hasn't been great in WoL vs. a GSL champ
A gsl champ who has been completly of the radar for a year. Terran is just too strong right now. Did you see how those hellbats completly owned monster? even with banelings conecting
banelings connecting on non light units. Best strat evar
The next time I run a mass of hellions into roaches and they lose, I'm gonna be mad.
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
zerg who hasn't been great in WoL vs. a GSL champ
A gsl champ who has been completly of the radar for a year. Terran is just too strong right now. Did you see how those hellbats completly owned monster? even with banelings conecting
So Monster gets a perfect read with a 6' speedover, decides to reactively go for a massive semi all-in timing attack, fails rather miserably despite jjakji having 0 bunker but he should somehow still have an even game afterwards despite being behind in upgrades and tech?
On February 18 2013 20:45 DrPhilOfdOOm wrote: Another Z crushed by Terran, when will it end
zerg who hasn't been great in WoL vs. a GSL champ
A gsl champ who has been completly of the radar for a year. Terran is just too strong right now. Did you see how those hellbats completly owned monster? even with banelings conecting
munster is pretty off the radar himself tbh
munster is the most scented French cheese (not an easy achievement), it made me laugh.
Hehe, yeah, I also had that freeze frame at the end of the broadcast. It looks like Wolf wanted to do some kind of ceremony and Khaldor simply pulled the plug, LOL.
After this i wish WoL would go on for some 4 months longer, tournament wise. Hots is such a mess, and this last WoL GSL has been really amazing. Too bad everyone just ditched WoL asap. Sure it makes total sense from progamer point of view, but matches are light years away from if you compare to skill of latecomers of WoL, like Innovation and Roro, and similar quality of games.
On February 18 2013 21:02 NightOfTheDead wrote: After this i wish WoL would go on for some 4 months longer, tournament wise. Hots is such a mess, and this last WoL GSL has been really amazing. Too bad everyone just ditched WoL asap. Sure it makes total sense from progamer point of view, but matches are light years away from if you compare to skill of latecomers of WoL, like Innovation and Roro, and similar quality of games.
I'm fairly sure blizzard would be making them play HOTS, it only makes sense. They want to sell the expansion.
On February 18 2013 21:02 NightOfTheDead wrote: After this i wish WoL would go on for some 4 months longer, tournament wise. Hots is such a mess, and this last WoL GSL has been really amazing. Too bad everyone just ditched WoL asap. Sure it makes total sense from progamer point of view, but matches are light years away from if you compare to skill of latecomers of WoL, like Innovation and Roro, and similar quality of games.
well if you keep that opinion haha then the switch to HOTS would never happen
On February 18 2013 21:02 NightOfTheDead wrote: After this i wish WoL would go on for some 4 months longer, tournament wise. Hots is such a mess, and this last WoL GSL has been really amazing. Too bad everyone just ditched WoL asap. Sure it makes total sense from progamer point of view, but matches are light years away from if you compare to skill of latecomers of WoL, like Innovation and Roro, and similar quality of games.
It sucks for people like innovation who were on the cusp of something great in WoL but now have to play hots. Reminds me of at the end of BW if we were going to see a new era of fantasy/jangbi as they seemed just a class above everyone but that'll remain forever a mystery.
On February 18 2013 21:02 NightOfTheDead wrote: After this i wish WoL would go on for some 4 months longer, tournament wise. Hots is such a mess, and this last WoL GSL has been really amazing. Too bad everyone just ditched WoL asap. Sure it makes total sense from progamer point of view, but matches are light years away from if you compare to skill of latecomers of WoL, like Innovation and Roro, and similar quality of games.
WoL going longer would just mean that all tournaments would push back HotS stuff and we'd be in the same situation in 4 months time. There would be 0 difference. And then when they eventually switch to HotS, we'd get the exact same stuff again.
So I enjoy this searching in the new game for builds, strategies and techniques. This is the time period where we see stuff and go "Omg you can do that!?" before we get to the time period where we go "Now that's some exquisitely refined play you have there sir".
I like seeing both which is why come the later stages of WoL I started getting into LoL a bit more because I have less of an understanding and I'm still amazed by a lot of strategies. Though sc2 still some of the highest level gameplay at pro level around and I like watching people reach at and push these boundaries too.
On February 18 2013 21:02 NightOfTheDead wrote: After this i wish WoL would go on for some 4 months longer, tournament wise. Hots is such a mess, and this last WoL GSL has been really amazing. Too bad everyone just ditched WoL asap. Sure it makes total sense from progamer point of view, but matches are light years away from if you compare to skill of latecomers of WoL, like Innovation and Roro, and similar quality of games.
I'd much rather go through the instability and unpredictability of HotS than sit through any more WoL. Most of the matchups in WoL are just garbage anymore.
On February 18 2013 21:02 NightOfTheDead wrote: After this i wish WoL would go on for some 4 months longer, tournament wise. Hots is such a mess, and this last WoL GSL has been really amazing. Too bad everyone just ditched WoL asap. Sure it makes total sense from progamer point of view, but matches are light years away from if you compare to skill of latecomers of WoL, like Innovation and Roro, and similar quality of games.
It sucks for people like innovation who were on the cusp of something great in WoL but now have to play hots. Reminds me of at the end of BW if we were going to see a new era of fantasy/jangbi as they seemed just a class above everyone but that'll remain forever a mystery.
I dunno. Innovation's aggressive style actually lends itself to HoTS game play. And the game is always changing (granted, HoTS is a bigger change) but changes nerfs, buffs, and map changes shifts the game quite a bit as well. So players are always adjusting.
On February 18 2013 21:02 NightOfTheDead wrote: After this i wish WoL would go on for some 4 months longer, tournament wise. Hots is such a mess, and this last WoL GSL has been really amazing. Too bad everyone just ditched WoL asap. Sure it makes total sense from progamer point of view, but matches are light years away from if you compare to skill of latecomers of WoL, like Innovation and Roro, and similar quality of games.
It sucks for people like innovation who were on the cusp of something great in WoL but now have to play hots. Reminds me of at the end of BW if we were going to see a new era of fantasy/jangbi as they seemed just a class above everyone but that'll remain forever a mystery.
I dunno. Innovation's aggressive style actually lends itself to HoTS game play. And the game is always changing (granted, HoTS is a bigger change) but changes nerfs, buffs, and map changes shifts the game quite a bit as well. So players are always adjusting.
I would love to see hellbats in the hands of innovation he'd have some sick timings with them probably.
On February 18 2013 21:02 NightOfTheDead wrote: After this i wish WoL would go on for some 4 months longer, tournament wise. Hots is such a mess, and this last WoL GSL has been really amazing. Too bad everyone just ditched WoL asap. Sure it makes total sense from progamer point of view, but matches are light years away from if you compare to skill of latecomers of WoL, like Innovation and Roro, and similar quality of games.
It sucks for people like innovation who were on the cusp of something great in WoL but now have to play hots. Reminds me of at the end of BW if we were going to see a new era of fantasy/jangbi as they seemed just a class above everyone but that'll remain forever a mystery.
I dunno. Innovation's aggressive style actually lends itself to HoTS game play. And the game is always changing (granted, HoTS is a bigger change) but changes nerfs, buffs, and map changes shifts the game quite a bit as well. So players are always adjusting.
I agree, I think if WoL ran another 4 months Bogus would find his aggressive gambits countered with much higher frequency than they are now (many times he just goes for openings that other people won't try). In HotS though with speedivacs he can still be very aggressive while having a bit more freedom to back out of things when his opponent has shut down an option.
zerg players mad after the very first sc2 hots offline tournament games, even though they just dominated for quite long time in WoL, didn't see much rage from them at that point. It is still beta and the builds are not established yet. Ofc there can be some imbalances that's why blizzard release new patches constantly.
I think it is good that we switch into HotS it is easier for blizzard to focus on balance when they can actually see offline tournaments with players, who really are doing everything for the game. If we just tolerate these short games for little while i'm sure it will get better
Missed it live, but saw it now. Reaaaally happy NSH won, and especially in a jjakji dominating fashion! Not unexpected though, with TvZ being way better for terran atm jjakji has no weak matchups.
People who are surprised at his great TvT should check out the GSTL match between him and Mvp a couple of months ago, really insane game.
NSH for GSTL champions, both pre-season and real season!
On February 18 2013 21:02 NightOfTheDead wrote: After this i wish WoL would go on for some 4 months longer, tournament wise. Hots is such a mess, and this last WoL GSL has been really amazing. Too bad everyone just ditched WoL asap. Sure it makes total sense from progamer point of view, but matches are light years away from if you compare to skill of latecomers of WoL, like Innovation and Roro, and similar quality of games.
It sucks for people like innovation who were on the cusp of something great in WoL but now have to play hots. Reminds me of at the end of BW if we were going to see a new era of fantasy/jangbi as they seemed just a class above everyone but that'll remain forever a mystery.
I don't agree. Bogus' style should work very well in hots and so far Terran seems to be in a better state overall, too.
Wow just watched game 4, one of the best TvT games I have seen, seriously at one point they had a siege line that was crossed around the entire map, freaking sick!!
Just watched the VOD for Jjakji vs Dream, that was sick. Whirlwind is an amazing map and the medivac speed boost adds even more complexity and a way to outplay your opponent in TvT, love it.
On February 19 2013 03:48 Dodgin wrote: Just watched the VOD for Jjakji vs Dream, that was sick. Whirlwind is an amazing map and the medivac speed boost adds even more complexity and a way to outplay your opponent in TvT, love it.
I just watched the game and it was a truly excellent TvT. The observer seemed a bit desperate about the new medivacs, though...
On February 19 2013 03:48 Dodgin wrote: Just watched the VOD for Jjakji vs Dream, that was sick. Whirlwind is an amazing map and the medivac speed boost adds even more complexity and a way to outplay your opponent in TvT, love it.
I just watched the game and it was a truly excellent TvT. The observer seemed a bit desperate about the new medivacs, though...
I think they're pretty much getting paid to show off all the new toys in HoTS, though :p
I am so glad to see jjakji doing well against Zerg again. Part of this may be due to hellbats in their current form, but his micro during engagements was extremely good. I was really happy to see him layering his MMH to wall off against banelings, with marines and marauders on different hotkeys.
On February 19 2013 03:48 Dodgin wrote: Just watched the VOD for Jjakji vs Dream, that was sick. Whirlwind is an amazing map and the medivac speed boost adds even more complexity and a way to outplay your opponent in TvT, love it.
I just watched the game and it was a truly excellent TvT. The observer seemed a bit desperate about the new medivacs, though...
I think they're pretty much getting paid to show off all the new toys in HoTS, though :p
I didn't mean that he tried too hard to focus on them, but that he had a hard time following the haf-a-dozen medivacs boosting their way in three different places and three different directions every minute or so, while ravens were using SM and nukes were landing. Whirlwind TvT was hard to observe in WoL, and this is even harder.
I know how fun it is to rewrite history but really jjakji didn't fall to zerg... He beat Monster in code A, beat whoever zerg he beat when NSH got terran all-kills at a time no one thought that was possible. He just repeatedly lost to terrans. A lot. In fact his vZ is his higher korean winrate on TLPD... I understand he wouldn't want to write about the OPness of other terrans on his twitter tho :p
On February 19 2013 09:00 Nebuchad wrote: I know how fun it is to rewrite history but really jjakji didn't fall to zerg... He beat Monster in code A, beat whoever zerg he beat when NSH got terran all-kills at a time no one thought that was possible. He just repeatedly lost to terrans. A lot. In fact his vZ is his higher korean winrate on TLPD... I understand he wouldn't want to write about the OPness of other terrans on his twitter tho :p
He lost in the qualifiers to zergs often (OSL, GSL, IPL etc) and he was eliminated in his last Code A appearance by BBoongBBoong. Yes he struggled with TvT in his career but he went from 1 weaker matchup to 2
last gsl qualifier he lost to Mercury who plays terran, the one before that he qualified (then lost to BBoong). I mean I'm not saying he was at his peek in TvZ obviously but given stats and what I saw of the games I hardly think it was his downfall as much as it is insisted in this thread. (Also he won 1/3 of his 15 last vP games so by these standards I wouldn't deem it a strong match-up either :p )
On February 19 2013 09:00 Nebuchad wrote: I know how fun it is to rewrite history but really jjakji didn't fall to zerg... He beat Monster in code A, beat whoever zerg he beat when NSH got terran all-kills at a time no one thought that was possible. He just repeatedly lost to terrans. A lot. In fact his vZ is his higher korean winrate on TLPD... I understand he wouldn't want to write about the OPness of other terrans on his twitter tho :p
He lost in the qualifiers to zergs often (OSL, GSL, IPL etc) and he was eliminated in his last Code A appearance by BBoongBBoong. Yes he struggled with TvT in his career but he went from 1 weaker matchup to 2
His TvT was weak at the peak of his career and for some time after that, but starting 6-8 months ago his TvT stopped being a weak matchup for him. He did well against several competent TvTers and performed better than expected vZ in the aftermath of the queen patch (he was second-best T versus zerg in GSTL during that time, tied with MKP for a while), but his vZ kept degrading until he was losing to basically every zerg he met. The same is partially true for his vP, which struggled to keep up first with the Parting-led stormfest and then again for no particular reason other than protosses were more apt at countering his style. Since then, though, his TvT has been fair. In WoL at least.
That TvT with jjaki and dream, so incredibly good. Surprised to not see that many widows mine in that situation though
Also just want to say that Khaldor + Wolf confirmed that the Code A games begin at 16:10 KST and not 18:10 as the Teamliquid side bars says. So it's in 5 hours 10 minutes, not 7 hours 10 minutes. Around 23:40~ in the last GSTL Vod
On February 19 2013 11:01 nomyx wrote: That TvT with jjaki and dream, so incredibly good. Surprised to not see that many widows mine in that situation though
Also just want to say that Khaldor + Wolf confirmed that the Code A games begin at 16:10 KST and not 18:10 as the Teamliquid side bars says. So it's in 5 hours 10 minutes, not 7 hours 10 minutes. Around 23:40~ in the last GSTL Vod
On February 19 2013 11:01 nomyx wrote: That TvT with jjaki and dream, so incredibly good. Surprised to not see that many widows mine in that situation though
Also just want to say that Khaldor + Wolf confirmed that the Code A games begin at 16:10 KST and not 18:10 as the Teamliquid side bars says. So it's in 5 hours 10 minutes, not 7 hours 10 minutes. Around 23:40~ in the last GSTL Vod
On February 19 2013 11:01 nomyx wrote: That TvT with jjaki and dream, so incredibly good. Surprised to not see that many widows mine in that situation though
Also just want to say that Khaldor + Wolf confirmed that the Code A games begin at 16:10 KST and not 18:10 as the Teamliquid side bars says. So it's in 5 hours 10 minutes, not 7 hours 10 minutes. Around 23:40~ in the last GSTL Vod
jjakji will always be one of my absolute favorite players. with the way he won the gsl (against my #1 fav player leenock), i was able to truly realize the staggering potential which exists within him, and i knew said potential would always be there...i can simply see it in the way he plays. even when many others did, i never gave up hope on him and i never will. his gsl win should never be regarded as a fluke.
Just saw Jjakji vs Dream(my first Hots TvT) and damn...this was awesome. I loved TvT in WoL, but in Hots it seems even better and the speed-medivacs are a huge part of it. It just felt like the game was twice as fast because of them, since there was always somwhere on the map atleast on drop going on. I'm also impressed with the players. They showed incredible skill here and I expect big things of them in Hots if they keep it up.
Btw 45mins into the game and Jjakji still had 400average APM o.o
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/wtYxxAj.jpg)
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GOMTV![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/7/7f/Twitch_ico.png)
TwitchTV![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/GnEze.png)
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SSanaEE <Howling Peaks> 
Killer![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/bv8Kw.png)
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intrigued to as what the MV was that noone else knew lol
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