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On August 08 2012 23:23 StorkHwaiting wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2012 22:31 xN.07)MaK wrote:On August 08 2012 22:18 DamageControL wrote:On August 08 2012 22:14 Poopi wrote:
Lol why was Reality put up against the worse GSL zerg?
Meh I wanted to see him lose badly, too bad he was lucky with the draw.
Creator winning as expected, surprised that DRG took a game off him, maybe he is back at his level? what do you have against reality o_O I've got nothing against him, but bw elitists and elephanters are starting to be super annoying. The guy has skills but I personally think that a good protoss should have not much trouble beating him. I'm trying to understand what your post is supposed to mean and failing. Who is him and what relation does he have to "BW elitists and elephanters"? Btw, this idiotic sentiment of "BW elitists" by fans new to the scene is 1000x more annoying to us who have been here for a decade or more. The esports you currently enjoy was built on the back of BW and its pros. Have some respect. And I'm sorry but you're greatly confused if you think this season proves anything. The BW pros are still splitting their time between two games, lack proper coaches, and haven't even had a single season to figure out the dynamic of the game, yet you're ready to make a call on their ability? I didn't see DRG owning GSL season 1. Nor season 2. That must mean he had no skill right? Or maybe it just took him time to understand the game. Just like it's going to take time for the BW pros. Besides, all of this is ignoring the giant elephant in the room: MC, Nestea, and MVP, champions of the SC2 scene, ARE former BW pros. They've already proven what BW pros can do in SC2.
I respect and agree with all of your points except those last two sentences. That's just going to confuse the noob you're arguing against as that is almost the exact opposite of the Elephant in the Room Article which he is referring to, which goes to great lengths to state it's opinion that because those players were bad at SC BW that therefore GOM Progaming is a farce and the real skill will come from KeSPA players.
The rest of what you say is accurate however.
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On August 08 2012 23:23 StorkHwaiting wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2012 22:31 xN.07)MaK wrote:On August 08 2012 22:18 DamageControL wrote:On August 08 2012 22:14 Poopi wrote:
Lol why was Reality put up against the worse GSL zerg?
Meh I wanted to see him lose badly, too bad he was lucky with the draw.
Creator winning as expected, surprised that DRG took a game off him, maybe he is back at his level? what do you have against reality o_O I've got nothing against him, but bw elitists and elephanters are starting to be super annoying. The guy has skills but I personally think that a good protoss should have not much trouble beating him. I'm trying to understand what your post is supposed to mean and failing. Who is him and what relation does he have to "BW elitists and elephanters"? Btw, this idiotic sentiment of "BW elitists" by fans new to the scene is 1000x more annoying to us who have been here for a decade or more. The esports you currently enjoy was built on the back of BW and its pros. Have some respect. And I'm sorry but you're greatly confused if you think this season proves anything. The BW pros are still splitting their time between two games, lack proper coaches, and haven't even had a single season to figure out the dynamic of the game, yet you're ready to make a call on their ability? I didn't see DRG owning GSL season 1. Nor season 2. That must mean he had no skill right? Or maybe it just took him time to understand the game. Just like it's going to take time for the BW pros. Besides, all of this is ignoring the giant elephant in the room: MC, Nestea, and MVP, champions of the SC2 scene, ARE former BW pros. They've already proven what BW pros can do in SC2.
You should stick to Korean music threads, you have very little to say of interest outside of them.
MC, Nestea and MVP may have been BW pros at some point but have been SC2 pros from the beginning, and that is all they will ever be known for.
As for respect, it goes both ways.
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Why don't we wait to see what happens? Instead of BW fans expressing their insecurities about their (our) game dying, and SC2 fans expressing their insecurities about BW players being a new force in their (our) scene, we can just ride out the wave and see whether either of their fears will be realized.
I'm personally guessing that eventually some KeSPA players will rise, some won't, and the game will continue. But hell, I could be just as wrong as anyone.
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damn drg lost to creator... also reality proving that his tvz is atleast code A level!
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fuck ya reality <3 from my flight interchange in hongkong airport, missed the games but polls show they were good =3
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Hmm, I see what you're saying. But at the same time, I think this whole elephant in the room thing is nonsense. BW pros proved long ago that they are the cut above. Hence why you see the bottom of the barrel BW players still dominating SC2. The rest of the transition is just a matter of time. Totally silly that noobies are crowing after a handful of games that the BW scene is a bunch of false hype.
Snijjer: If you're going to insult someone, you should follow it up with a strong argument not a faceplant.
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On August 08 2012 23:53 StorkHwaiting wrote:
Hmm, I see what you're saying. But at the same time, I think this whole elephant in the room thing is nonsense. BW pros proved long ago that they are the cut above. Hence why you see the bottom of the barrel BW players still dominating SC2. The rest of the transition is just a matter of time. Totally silly that noobies are crowing after a handful of games that the BW scene is a bunch of false hype.
They might be. But those who are transitioning now are only transitioning because they have to. That means they might be burnt out, not like the game as much, too set in their ways, or simply not as good at SC2. There's not reason to root for them unconditionally either, just because they are familiar. I will always love Kim Taek Yong. But that doesn't mean I can't find new players to like as well.
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I didn't say anything about not liking new players. And it's not like the BW scene didn't have fresh blood coming in all the time up until SC2. The new talent is now pooling to SC2 instead, so of course the scene is going to have plenty of new talent that can challenge TBLS. But a great gamer is a great gamer. I think the ones who planned to burn out were going to anyway.
Bisu, for instance, I've never been a fan of him, and he hasn't won a starleague in AGES. He was a monster in PL not too long ago, but other than that, nothing. I wouldn't be surprised if he just faded out. Then again, I wouldn't be surprised if he came back roaring. Bisu's hard to predict.
BLS on the other hand... I'd be very surprised if those three did not emerge to dominate the scene within the next year. All 3 of those guys have just shown way too much consistency, intelligence, passion, star sense, etc.
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What do you guys mean with elephant stuff? I don't get it.
I used google. Never mind.
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I had a feeling Creator would win. He's got so much talent. I expect him to go far into the WCS.
That game where Puzzle lost; was it because of a mistake or was he just outplayed?
Lastily I'm glad that a Kepsa player won. Yugioh must be feeling like crap right now. But Reality does seem like the strongest of the Kespa players.
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On August 09 2012 00:18 SHOOG wrote:
I had a feeling Creator would win. He's got so much talent. I expect him to go far into the WCS.
That game where Puzzle lost; was it because of a mistake or was he just outplayed?
Lastily I'm glad that a Kepsa player won. Yugioh must be feeling like crap right now. But Reality does seem like the strongest of the Kespa players.
Puzzle was outplayed and puzzle could have easily lost all 3 games. herO[join] actually had the first game pretty much won as well and game 3 was damn close and was lost because of making the wrong decision towards the end.
But you should definitely check out all games imo, they were sick from both sides.
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On August 08 2012 23:53 StorkHwaiting wrote:
Hmm, I see what you're saying. But at the same time, I think this whole elephant in the room thing is nonsense. BW pros proved long ago that they are the cut above. Hence why you see the bottom of the barrel BW players still dominating SC2. The rest of the transition is just a matter of time. Totally silly that noobies are crowing after a handful of games that the BW scene is a bunch of false hype.
Snijjer: If you're going to insult someone, you should follow it up with a strong argument not a faceplant.
I dont even need a strong argument - you've shown you have no idea what the elephant in the room argument is.
Of course BW players are going to do well in sc2 - the sequel to BW... what a novel concept. -.-
The elephant in the room was that the sc2 pros (ex bw pros being included as sc2 pros) were going to be dominated in a matter of weeks because there was no skill in sc2. The elephant has already been proven to be non existent. You're just too full of yourself to accept this.
Demanding respect? Give me a break.
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If nothing else, your punctuation is a source of great amusement.
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On August 08 2012 23:40 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2012 23:23 StorkHwaiting wrote:On August 08 2012 22:31 xN.07)MaK wrote:On August 08 2012 22:18 DamageControL wrote:On August 08 2012 22:14 Poopi wrote:
Lol why was Reality put up against the worse GSL zerg?
Meh I wanted to see him lose badly, too bad he was lucky with the draw.
Creator winning as expected, surprised that DRG took a game off him, maybe he is back at his level? what do you have against reality o_O I've got nothing against him, but bw elitists and elephanters are starting to be super annoying. The guy has skills but I personally think that a good protoss should have not much trouble beating him. I'm trying to understand what your post is supposed to mean and failing. Who is him and what relation does he have to "BW elitists and elephanters"? Btw, this idiotic sentiment of "BW elitists" by fans new to the scene is 1000x more annoying to us who have been here for a decade or more. The esports you currently enjoy was built on the back of BW and its pros. Have some respect. And I'm sorry but you're greatly confused if you think this season proves anything. The BW pros are still splitting their time between two games, lack proper coaches, and haven't even had a single season to figure out the dynamic of the game, yet you're ready to make a call on their ability? I didn't see DRG owning GSL season 1. Nor season 2. That must mean he had no skill right? Or maybe it just took him time to understand the game. Just like it's going to take time for the BW pros. Besides, all of this is ignoring the giant elephant in the room: MC, Nestea, and MVP, champions of the SC2 scene, ARE former BW pros. They've already proven what BW pros can do in SC2. Not to mention that MC, MVP, and Nestea had some of the worst records in the league in BW and they are at the top of SC2.So, if that is the case then naturally the better players will replace the current champs. There are reasons why MCMVP, and Nestea had lackluster performances on BW and those reasons will begin to show once the BW players have more than 3 months of training while practicing two games. Reality is proof of my claim. As the GSL players he has beat have more than 2 years experience in a game he has played for 3 months while dividing his time between two games. I say let's wait until heart of the swarm and a full pro league transition before we speculate. The elephant in the room will eventually come true but not as soon as most people had hoped for.
Then it isn't true as the argument in that article was that after a couple months basically every BW player would be able to obliterate every SC2 player at SC2, and that they would completely dominate the scene. It's been a couple months, that hasn't happened, the elephant is dead. Had a mass transition happened back when that article was first written (back when current SC2 pros were terrible by current standards) there was a chance for it to happen, but currently it didn't.
What we're seeing now is that the absolute best Kespa players can compete on a relatively even footing with GSL players (but rarely win), which I think is what most reasonable people expected at this point in both the transition and the game's development. In time I think some Kespa players will excel and others will struggle, much like we're seeing with them now.
Who knows what'll happen in the future. I'm curious how Kespa teams compare to GSL teams in terms of financial stability, that as much as anything else may determine any potential future Kespa dominance of SC2.
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On August 09 2012 00:23 Snijjer wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2012 23:53 StorkHwaiting wrote:
Hmm, I see what you're saying. But at the same time, I think this whole elephant in the room thing is nonsense. BW pros proved long ago that they are the cut above. Hence why you see the bottom of the barrel BW players still dominating SC2. The rest of the transition is just a matter of time. Totally silly that noobies are crowing after a handful of games that the BW scene is a bunch of false hype.
Snijjer: If you're going to insult someone, you should follow it up with a strong argument not a faceplant. I dont even need a strong argument - you've shown you have no idea what the elephant in the room argument is. Of course BW players are going to do well in sc2 - the sequel to BW... what a novel concept. -.- The elephant in the room was that the sc2 pros (ex bw pros being included as sc2 pros) were going to be dominated in a matter of weeks because there was no skill in sc2. The elephant has already been proven to be non existent. You're just too full of yourself to accept this. Demanding respect? Give me a break.
You're taking the article completely out of context, ignoring its premises and then posting a strawman, good job. ^_____^
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On August 09 2012 00:29 Dranak wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2012 23:40 BlazeFury01 wrote:On August 08 2012 23:23 StorkHwaiting wrote:On August 08 2012 22:31 xN.07)MaK wrote:On August 08 2012 22:18 DamageControL wrote:On August 08 2012 22:14 Poopi wrote:
Lol why was Reality put up against the worse GSL zerg?
Meh I wanted to see him lose badly, too bad he was lucky with the draw.
Creator winning as expected, surprised that DRG took a game off him, maybe he is back at his level? what do you have against reality o_O I've got nothing against him, but bw elitists and elephanters are starting to be super annoying. The guy has skills but I personally think that a good protoss should have not much trouble beating him. I'm trying to understand what your post is supposed to mean and failing. Who is him and what relation does he have to "BW elitists and elephanters"? Btw, this idiotic sentiment of "BW elitists" by fans new to the scene is 1000x more annoying to us who have been here for a decade or more. The esports you currently enjoy was built on the back of BW and its pros. Have some respect. And I'm sorry but you're greatly confused if you think this season proves anything. The BW pros are still splitting their time between two games, lack proper coaches, and haven't even had a single season to figure out the dynamic of the game, yet you're ready to make a call on their ability? I didn't see DRG owning GSL season 1. Nor season 2. That must mean he had no skill right? Or maybe it just took him time to understand the game. Just like it's going to take time for the BW pros. Besides, all of this is ignoring the giant elephant in the room: MC, Nestea, and MVP, champions of the SC2 scene, ARE former BW pros. They've already proven what BW pros can do in SC2. Not to mention that MC, MVP, and Nestea had some of the worst records in the league in BW and they are at the top of SC2.So, if that is the case then naturally the better players will replace the current champs. There are reasons why MCMVP, and Nestea had lackluster performances on BW and those reasons will begin to show once the BW players have more than 3 months of training while practicing two games. Reality is proof of my claim. As the GSL players he has beat have more than 2 years experience in a game he has played for 3 months while dividing his time between two games. I say let's wait until heart of the swarm and a full pro league transition before we speculate. The elephant in the room will eventually come true but not as soon as most people had hoped for. Then it isn't true as the argument in that article was that after a couple months basically every BW player would be able to obliterate every SC2 player at SC2, and that they would completely dominate the scene. It's been a couple months, that hasn't happened, the elephant is dead. Had a mass transition happened back when that article was first written (back when current SC2 pros were terrible by current standards) there was a chance for it to happen, but currently it isn't happening. What we're seeing now is that the absolute best Kespa players can compete on a relatively even footing with GSL players (but rarely win), which I think is what most reasonable people expected at this point in both the transition and the game's development. In time I think some Kespa players will excel and others will struggle, much like we're seeing with them now. Who knows what'll happen in the future. I'm curious how Kespa teams compare to GSL teams in terms of financial stability, that as much as anything else may determine any potential future Kespa dominance of SC2.
The discussion will never be settled though because of 1 key factor. The way they had to transition, all of the kespa players underwent/are undergoing the transition to sc2 by still playing 2 games actively and if you read reality's interview he even stated that he was practicing brood war all the way till yesterday.
So people will always claim that the elephant can't be disproven since they didn't put their whole effort into it.
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No, what you're seeing is nothing. What you guys don't seem to understand, despite numerous interview answers telling you this, is that the Kespa players are still busy playing SC1!! No transition has occurred yet. The Kespa players are just fking winging it. Most of the teams don't even have SC2 coaches in their houses yet and barely play the game.
Reality won while spending all his time helping his teammate train for the OSL finals. He himself stated he's barely played or improved since his prelim match.
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Keep moving that goal post 
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EPT
