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On July 12 2011 21:50 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:48 Dante08 wrote:On July 12 2011 21:46 TranceStorm wrote:On July 12 2011 21:45 Medrea wrote:
Overlords should have a separate really destination from units. Thats like the one real clunky thing left in SC2. Ehh...I like it the way it is right now. If you could have different rally points for different units, macroing might be a bit too easy. I think its the obligation of the player to separate the units he's been producing regardless of their purpose. SC2 players have it too easy already :p This makes no sense to me. How can a competition game be too easy when its also easy for your opponent?
Tic Tac Toe :D
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On July 12 2011 21:49 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:47 Daralii wrote:On July 12 2011 21:45 Medrea wrote:
Overlords should have a separate really destination from units. Thats like the one real clunky thing left in SC2. Wasn't everyone on TL just complaining that SC2 isn't clunky enough? x_x Well, I am hella against poor control schemes that take away options from the player. Intentionally making a game control terribly is prob the silliest thing you can do. Control should always be granted, never taken away. Same goes for elements that do things automatically, they take control away.
Toss can't warp using the Mini map. .
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On July 12 2011 21:50 Dfgj wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:49 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:47 Daralii wrote:On July 12 2011 21:45 Medrea wrote:
Overlords should have a separate really destination from units. Thats like the one real clunky thing left in SC2. Wasn't everyone on TL just complaining that SC2 isn't clunky enough? x_x Well, I am hella against poor control schemes that take away options from the player. Intentionally making a game control terribly is prob the silliest thing you can do. Control should always be granted, never taken away. Same goes for elements that do things automatically, they take control away. Having an overlord rally sends them automatically to another place. Currently, you can manually rally them as eggs, or adjust their path once they spawn. Sounds like control to me.
Hmm fair point good sir. Well alright then.
Finding said eggs sounds painful. Though.
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Very early second gas from Losira.
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On July 12 2011 21:51 lunchforthesky wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:49 Freerider wrote:
Now everyone should know that you can`t win against a good terran with just ling/bane/muta nowadays... Damn, someone should really tell July to stopping winning all the time with that comp.
Or DongRaegu -.-
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On July 12 2011 21:52 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:50 Dfgj wrote:On July 12 2011 21:49 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:47 Daralii wrote:On July 12 2011 21:45 Medrea wrote:
Overlords should have a separate really destination from units. Thats like the one real clunky thing left in SC2. Wasn't everyone on TL just complaining that SC2 isn't clunky enough? x_x Well, I am hella against poor control schemes that take away options from the player. Intentionally making a game control terribly is prob the silliest thing you can do. Control should always be granted, never taken away. Same goes for elements that do things automatically, they take control away. Having an overlord rally sends them automatically to another place. Currently, you can manually rally them as eggs, or adjust their path once they spawn. Sounds like control to me. Hmm fair point good sir. Well alright then. Finding said eggs sounds painful. Though.
Just make overlords and before you do anything click somewhere safe. It will rally the overlords, select something else and then make more units.
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On July 12 2011 21:50 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:48 Dante08 wrote:On July 12 2011 21:46 TranceStorm wrote:On July 12 2011 21:45 Medrea wrote:
Overlords should have a separate really destination from units. Thats like the one real clunky thing left in SC2. Ehh...I like it the way it is right now. If you could have different rally points for different units, macroing might be a bit too easy. I think its the obligation of the player to separate the units he's been producing regardless of their purpose. SC2 players have it too easy already :p This makes no sense to me. How can a competition game be too easy when its also easy for your opponent?
Why isn't checkers a sport like Chess? That's a totally ridiculous statement; things that are competitive can have different difficulty levels/learning curves/skill ceilings. Not to mention you're taking a joke statement seriously; lighten up dood!
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On July 12 2011 21:51 human_ko wrote:
gogogogo TOP!
also, guys seem so concentrated!! these games are so high level, im neither terran nor zerg but i enjoy this much more than tvp or pvp. weird eh
My favourite match-up too. Not to knock protoss but ZvT feels like what SC was made for.
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On July 12 2011 21:52 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:50 Dfgj wrote:On July 12 2011 21:49 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:47 Daralii wrote:On July 12 2011 21:45 Medrea wrote:
Overlords should have a separate really destination from units. Thats like the one real clunky thing left in SC2. Wasn't everyone on TL just complaining that SC2 isn't clunky enough? x_x Well, I am hella against poor control schemes that take away options from the player. Intentionally making a game control terribly is prob the silliest thing you can do. Control should always be granted, never taken away. Same goes for elements that do things automatically, they take control away. Having an overlord rally sends them automatically to another place. Currently, you can manually rally them as eggs, or adjust their path once they spawn. Sounds like control to me. Hmm fair point good sir. Well alright then. Finding said eggs sounds painful. Though.
If you're occupied, it is next to impossible to do, but if you're in your base and you just got larva I build OL's first, double click and re-rally them. Then I use remaining larva for other units, but always try to remember to build OL's first just for re-rally
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Losira has changed from the guy who goes super late Spire to going super early Spire.
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TOP going reactored hellions, Losira got a quick lair and getting a spire up
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United Kingdom10823 Posts
On July 12 2011 21:52 ooni wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:50 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:48 Dante08 wrote:On July 12 2011 21:46 TranceStorm wrote:On July 12 2011 21:45 Medrea wrote:
Overlords should have a separate really destination from units. Thats like the one real clunky thing left in SC2. Ehh...I like it the way it is right now. If you could have different rally points for different units, macroing might be a bit too easy. I think its the obligation of the player to separate the units he's been producing regardless of their purpose. SC2 players have it too easy already :p This makes no sense to me. How can a competition game be too easy when its also easy for your opponent? Tic Tac Toe :D
A professional Tic Tac Toe tournament may be the worst thing to watch in the history of sports
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On July 12 2011 21:52 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:50 Dfgj wrote:On July 12 2011 21:49 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:47 Daralii wrote:On July 12 2011 21:45 Medrea wrote:
Overlords should have a separate really destination from units. Thats like the one real clunky thing left in SC2. Wasn't everyone on TL just complaining that SC2 isn't clunky enough? x_x Well, I am hella against poor control schemes that take away options from the player. Intentionally making a game control terribly is prob the silliest thing you can do. Control should always be granted, never taken away. Same goes for elements that do things automatically, they take control away. Having an overlord rally sends them automatically to another place. Currently, you can manually rally them as eggs, or adjust their path once they spawn. Sounds like control to me. Hmm fair point good sir. Well alright then. Finding said eggs sounds painful. Though.
say you have 20larva. you select em, make 5 overlords, rally them somewhere else
then you select something random that has nothing to do with hatcheries. you select your hatcheries again, you select your 15 larva remaining and make whatever out of them which you can rally somewhere else
it sounds rather complicated but it's not too bad really :p only in the lategame can it become really annoying
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really early spire from losira again
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On July 12 2011 21:52 Ysellian wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:49 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:47 Daralii wrote:On July 12 2011 21:45 Medrea wrote:
Overlords should have a separate really destination from units. Thats like the one real clunky thing left in SC2. Wasn't everyone on TL just complaining that SC2 isn't clunky enough? x_x Well, I am hella against poor control schemes that take away options from the player. Intentionally making a game control terribly is prob the silliest thing you can do. Control should always be granted, never taken away. Same goes for elements that do things automatically, they take control away. Toss can't warp using the Mini map. .
I always felt like they should be able to given the space is powered obviously.
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On July 12 2011 21:49 Alric wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:42 gakkgakk wrote:On July 12 2011 21:36 Alric wrote:On July 12 2011 21:33 gakkgakk wrote:On July 12 2011 21:32 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:29 Snowbear wrote:On July 12 2011 21:27 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:24 Snowbear wrote:I don't see a possibility to win againt this broodlord infestor combo, unless the terran is much ahead. Ghost are okay but very expensive  200/100 is not expensive. And they have snipe which is good against bio units. Which just so happen to be every single zerg unit and structure. And they have EMP which is good against units with energy or shields, which just so happens to be every protoss unit and structure. They are good! They are good when you got 10 or more. 10 = 2000/1000. You can not just get that if you are not on 4+ bases... Then when you got them, they are not very cost effective, unless you can emp clumped infestors. They will get some snipes off, but broodlords will kill them. Ghosts are awesome against broodlords. Snipe! 10 or more!? Holy crap that is a lot of ghosts. Im not talking about canister rifle DPS you know! Either way. Colossus are 300/200. I dont see the gripe. Ghosts are great against toss. Can be good vs infestors if you manage to get sick EMPs off. For sniping broodlords? Not so much. I disagree, snipe is super effective against broodlords. The range of snipe exceeds the range of brood lords, and it has zero cooldown so broodlords just melt against it. I respectfully disagree. If snipe didnt have energy cost it would be great, but unfortunantely it does cost energy. Also the broodlings makes it difficult for ghosts to get close to the broodlords. Also the zerg will probably have some lings/infestors near the broodlords, making it even harder to get snipes of. You make a good point, but I think cloak changes things. Zergs don't usually have overseers with their army, but even if they do, overseer sight is only 1 more than ghost range, and ghosts can snipe an overseer very quickly. Zerg does have fungal, but if the ghosts are spread out or EMP the infestors then they have free reign to snipe broodlords. It can also be hard in a hectic late-game to spot cloaked ghosts to fungal them. So zerg does have responses to ghosts as you say, but I still think ghosts are very strong against the broodlord/infestor mix, if you have enough of them.
Its hard to get enough ghosts out. And when you finally have enough ghosts out, your tank count will be pretty small, making ling/infestor a really awesome combo.
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Losira starting a baneling nest and researching burrow, TOP getting a starport and stim
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On July 12 2011 21:51 gakkgakk wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 21:45 Eufouria wrote:On July 12 2011 21:42 gakkgakk wrote:On July 12 2011 21:36 Alric wrote:On July 12 2011 21:33 gakkgakk wrote:On July 12 2011 21:32 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:29 Snowbear wrote:On July 12 2011 21:27 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:24 Snowbear wrote:I don't see a possibility to win againt this broodlord infestor combo, unless the terran is much ahead. Ghost are okay but very expensive 200/100 is not expensive. And they have snipe which is good against bio units. Which just so happen to be every single zerg unit and structure. And they have EMP which is good against units with energy or shields, which just so happens to be every protoss unit and structure. They are good! They are good when you got 10 or more. 10 = 2000/1000. You can not just get that if you are not on 4+ bases... Then when you got them, they are not very cost effective, unless you can emp clumped infestors. They will get some snipes off, but broodlords will kill them. Ghosts are awesome against broodlords. Snipe! 10 or more!? Holy crap that is a lot of ghosts. Im not talking about canister rifle DPS you know! Either way. Colossus are 300/200. I dont see the gripe. Ghosts are great against toss. Can be good vs infestors if you manage to get sick EMPs off. For sniping broodlords? Not so much. I disagree, snipe is super effective against broodlords. The range of snipe exceeds the range of brood lords, and it has zero cooldown so broodlords just melt against it. I respectfully disagree. If snipe didnt have energy cost it would be great, but unfortunantely it does cost energy. Also the broodlings makes it difficult for ghosts to get close to the broodlords. Also the zerg will probably have some lings/infestors near the broodlords, making it even harder to get snipes of. Snipe is pretty cheap. It takes about 125 energy to kill a broodlord, so ghosts can generally be at least 1:1 in cost effectiveness. On July 12 2011 21:44 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:42 gakkgakk wrote:On July 12 2011 21:36 Alric wrote:On July 12 2011 21:33 gakkgakk wrote:On July 12 2011 21:32 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:29 Snowbear wrote:On July 12 2011 21:27 Medrea wrote:On July 12 2011 21:24 Snowbear wrote:I don't see a possibility to win againt this broodlord infestor combo, unless the terran is much ahead. Ghost are okay but very expensive 200/100 is not expensive. And they have snipe which is good against bio units. Which just so happen to be every single zerg unit and structure. And they have EMP which is good against units with energy or shields, which just so happens to be every protoss unit and structure. They are good! They are good when you got 10 or more. 10 = 2000/1000. You can not just get that if you are not on 4+ bases... Then when you got them, they are not very cost effective, unless you can emp clumped infestors. They will get some snipes off, but broodlords will kill them. Ghosts are awesome against broodlords. Snipe! 10 or more!? Holy crap that is a lot of ghosts. Im not talking about canister rifle DPS you know! Either way. Colossus are 300/200. I dont see the gripe. Ghosts are great against toss. Can be good vs infestors if you manage to get sick EMPs off. For sniping broodlords? Not so much. I disagree, snipe is super effective against broodlords. The range of snipe exceeds the range of brood lords, and it has zero cooldown so broodlords just melt against it. I respectfully disagree. If snipe didnt have energy cost it would be great, but unfortunantely it does cost energy. Also the broodlings makes it difficult for ghosts to get close to the broodlords. Also the zerg will probably have some lings/infestors near the broodlords, making it even harder to get snipes of. Free snipe. Lol. yeah lets do that. Theres an army next to the ghosts. We're not talking about monobattles! All those hours spent playing 'how many times can you click in a minute' would finally pay off. Unless you get 5 snipes of instantly its 6 snipes afaik. And when trying to snipe broodlords, theres the risk of your ghosts dying to fungal, and getting trapped by lings. Unless ofcourse you cloak, and the zerg doesnt have overseer/you snipe it. So that leaves rather little energy left to use snipe. Im just saying, ghost usage vs broodlord isnt some magic trick that will make tvz imba once terrans start to use it.
I don't think it will make Terran imba, but I think it would reach a stage where the player who micro's better will win the battle. Like late game TvP Bio vs Deathball is at.
Snipe barely out-ranges fungal growth (I think with the aoe of fungal it can barely hit before snipe, but that would only be one ghost caught) so ghosts can also kill Infestors.
edit:Ghosts can also EMP an infestor before its in range to fungal.
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On July 12 2011 21:50 Meancookie wrote:
I feel like zerg players often get stuck in the midgame in ZvT where they stop expanding/upgrading/getting higher tech units and just stick with 2/0 or 2/1 upgraded muta/ling/bling >.>
That's when the terran manage to keep attacking non stop yes, that's basically the whole TvZ game plan here. Forcing the zerg to spend larvas on units and not on tech or drones, limiting his expansions and his economy and trading units until you kill him. Textbook TvZ there 
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