EPTWCG 2011 Grand Finals - Page 136
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DarkMatter_
Canada1774 Posts
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Lord_J
Kenya1085 Posts
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bgx
Poland6595 Posts
On December 08 2011 19:08 shr0ud wrote: *sigh* If only a matchup would have 10 years to evolve. collosus won't evolve into reaver  | ||
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dinsim1
67 Posts
Obviously a double elimination bracket starting with ~50 players would take more than 4x the amount of time available. Putting all the players in the single elimination bracket right away instead of using pools to cut it down to 16 would take less time than the current system because the average simultaneous games would be higher and also the total number of games lower. But then we are left with the distasteful proposition of having 3 of the best 4 players eliminated in the first 2 rounds, with 1st place still going to the best player and second and third to perhaps the 6th and 7th best players even if the best player wins, and also a much higher chance of the best player being cheesed out compared to the double elimination bracket. Obviously, an optimal approach would involve some kind of seeding which would prevent the best players from suffering for being placed together in early matches, and allow the bracket to pick matches that have a better chance of rewarding more skilled players with farther finishes (thats how seeding works after all). We'd also like a larger distribution of opponents per player to both strengthen the accuracy of the seeding as well. Now the proposed system splits the players into groups of 7, so it takes 6 games to finish the seeding process. Since the tournament only pays to the best 3 players, we are most interested in ensuring their survival to the final rounds. Not only do they have low chances of being in the same groups, the top 2 make it out of each group anyway, so that serious bullshit has to happen to ruin their statistical edge on the competition (i.e. being placed in the same group + losing more than one game to worse players who manage to hold their own against other competition). All this is accomplished in the time of 6 games if the groups play simultaneously, or 12 games if they play as they are (half the groups at a time). Then the Ro16 single elimination starts: 8+4+2+1 series, each round of the bracket not beginning till the previous finishes in full, so unless not a single series goes to 3 games in a round (highly unlikely and not able to planned for), thats 15x3 = 45 games. So we have a tournament format with seeding, extremely high insurance for the top 3 to make it to the Ro16, and a total 57 game format. Making a change to the format like "lol Bo1 is gay wut about Bo3 for the pools", keep in mind the following: 12 series have to be played for the pools to complete, with winners having to wait on conclusions of Bo3's, so this now makes the tournament running time 12x3 + 15x3 = 93 games if my math and estimates are correct. And we're now almost DOUBLING the time of the tournament for what? All we want is the best chance for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd to go to the best 3 players. If they don't, the most probable way this will occur is in the round of 16, where a bad Bo3 can send them packing to a worse player, or the top 3 can meet with each other earlier in the bracket. The latter will occur if 2 of the top 3 are pooled together and thus don't achieve the highest seeds, which changing to Bo3 in pools will do nothing to affect. The former occurs entirely in the Ro16 so also benefits in no way from a Bo3 in pools. So all we really get is noticeably more accurate seeding and a very, very slightly better chance a top 3 player won't get knocked out before the Ro16 - and for this we double the tournament time? Looking at my top 3-4 picks for the tournament and the pools, I find it hard to believe the tournament format is not working as intended or that it will jeopardize the results. I actually am curious as to what people think about how the format could be adjusted to be more efficient/accurate, but all I'm seeing is a lot of idra fanboys flooding the thread with their tears alongside nonconstructive criticism. But if anyone who has experience with this, especially people who participated in these kind of events, I'm interested in what you think about it. | ||
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Holgerius
Sweden16951 Posts
 Lots of probes dying to reavers+HTs is always fun to see. :D | ||
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ZeaL.
United States5955 Posts
If it wasn't for the reaver and storm bw pvp would be pretty terrible to watch. | ||
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Sareth
Germany1008 Posts
On December 08 2011 19:06 mcmartini wrote: Read his interview he said he didn't want to go macro game with protoss and likens his build to same functionality as 1-1-1 But i still wouldn't call it cheese. Cheese is a strategy which looses almost instantly if scouted. Huk would have been fine, if he just have played standard. A 3 Gate-Expo; 1Base-play or maybe a 1 Gate-Expo and he would have won. I dont say Huk played bad, he just played to greedy. | ||
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DarkMatter_
Canada1774 Posts
Maybe Blizzard will get the memo when developing Legacy of the Void. | ||
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Provocateur
Sweden1665 Posts
On December 08 2011 19:09 ZeaL. wrote: If it wasn't for the reaver and storm bw pvp would be pretty terrible to watch. That's the thing though, the reaver is such a dynamic unit that adds a ton of excitement. Compare that to the supposed sc2 reaver, colossus wars are nowhere close as exciting =( | ||
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Lavi
Bangladesh793 Posts
On December 08 2011 19:07 Asha` wrote: HerO does a good job. SC2 PvP is getting there now we see a more developed midgame, but reliance on Colossus still wins most of the time late game which takes the fun out of big battles. Don't like bw PvP much either tbh though =p I honestly think colossus hold back protoss... hero and huk both show great micro and multitasking in midgame before it turn into turtly build up of colossus and upgrade game then it gets so one dimensional :| | ||
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mcmartini
Australia1972 Posts
On December 08 2011 19:11 Provocateur wrote: That's the thing though, the reaver is such a dynamic unit that adds a ton of excitement. Compare that to the supposed sc2 reaver, colossus wars are nowhere close as exciting =( Maybe we should give collussus attack terrible Ai too, could make it super exciting if those lasers just randomly mess up I do love the reaver though, but half the excitement for me is seeing if it's gonna bug out or not haha :D | ||
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ZeaL.
United States5955 Posts
On December 08 2011 19:11 Provocateur wrote: That's the thing though, the reaver is such a dynamic unit that adds a ton of excitement. Compare that to the supposed sc2 reaver, colossus wars are nowhere close as exciting =( Oh I totally agree. The only things that are exciting about sc2 pvp is... what blink micro and forcefield? =/ | ||
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jalstar
United States8198 Posts
On December 08 2011 19:13 mcmartini wrote: Maybe we should give collussus attack terrible Ai too, could make it super exciting if those lasers just randomly mess up I do love the reaver though, but half the excitement for me is seeing if it's gonna bug out or not haha :D It's not a bug, it used to hit almost all the time but it was too strong. | ||
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Tppz!
Germany1449 Posts
10:54 Uhr: GoOdy hat es geschafft. Er konnte das Three-Way-Tie gewinnen und zieht somit in die Playoffs der WCG 2011 ein! Unglaublich. http://www.escgaming.de/artikel,996,world-cyber-games:-esc-icy-box-on-the-road-again.html The team announced that GoOdy just won the Three way tie and advances to the playoffs | ||
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ceaRshaf
Romania4926 Posts
On December 08 2011 19:14 ZeaL. wrote: Oh I totally agree. The only things that are exciting about sc2 pvp is... what blink micro and forcefield? =/ And....a hidden pylon. | ||
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
On December 08 2011 19:14 jalstar wrote: It's not a bug, it used to hit almost all the time but it was too strong. Yup, they used to be a lot more devastating. T_T | ||
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Bromazepam
820 Posts
On December 08 2011 19:09 dinsim1 wrote: -snip- You should consider posting this in its own thread, since in a LR it will get buried pretty quickly. Personally I'm kinda fine with big groups and Bo1, although I'd enjoy Bo3s more. However the "time" argument doesn't really hold in this context. They are broadcasting only a few games, while most of them are being played at the same time. | ||
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Ramuh
Germany238 Posts
On December 08 2011 19:14 Tppz! wrote: http://www.escgaming.de/artikel,996,world-cyber-games:-esc-icy-box-on-the-road-again.html The team announced that GoOdy just won the Three way tie and advances to the playoffs Yay Goody, me likes that | ||
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
Sick! Thanks for the update. | ||
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HwangjaeTerran
Finland5967 Posts
woot Panzaren Brewmaster /,,/ | ||
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