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Players such as Jinro, HuK, and Adelscott did not apply for this tour, so don't ask why they aren't on this list. DIMAGA, Kas, and LaLush turned applications in late so they will not appear either. Please take some time to learn who exactly applied. Please inform yourself about who applied and who didn't. |
On March 24 2011 03:27 DoomsVille wrote:
Americans are patriotic to a fault. Trust me, they won't want to see a tournament full of koreans. The only way they would be willing to is if that tournament was loaded with the very best koreans (fruitdealer, nestea, mkp etc.) and not bomber, ace, thewind, squirtle etc.
I also think a lot of you are underestimating the delay. It's hard to show good games with 2 second delay. With some players it won't matter (they're way more skilled than others). But I really don't think mid level koreans would go very far in this tournament anyways.
If it was about patriotism, people would be screaming just as hard about not accepting Europeans to the league. It's clearly not about that.
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On March 24 2011 03:17 alexhard wrote:Show nested quote +On March 24 2011 03:10 DoomsVille wrote:
b) While many will agree with you (especially on this forum), but the majority of the audience at the LAN won't be a diehard SC2 fan. They will be some random guy that heard of the tournament from a friend and are going with them. And they will want to see someone they can cheer for.
What are you trying to say here, I really don't understand. Americans can only cheer for other Americans and Europeans, but not for Koreans? That makes absolutely no sense. From the diehard fan to the noob who just happened to pass by, I am absolutely sure that they primarily care about and want to see good games, not just people of a certain nationality.
I agree with this guy, how can you possibly justify your point by saying that people who don't play the game want to have a ''Westerner'' to cheer for? They'll cheer for whoever plays nice games, it's just like that in any other game. If it happens to be a Korean then so be it, if it happens to be an American, then so be it.
If it was like a continent vs continent thingy like the Gom WC then yeah, I'd see your point of them wanting to cheer for the hometown guys, but it isn't.
People who don't play the game want to be entertained (I guess, why the hell would they come otherwise ^^), and if the Koreans bring the most entertaining games, then they can and should be invited over lower-level Americans/Europeans/whatever.
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On March 24 2011 03:27 DoomsVille wrote:
Americans are patriotic to a fault. Trust me, they won't want to see a tournament full of koreans. The only way they would be willing to is if that tournament was loaded with the very best koreans (fruitdealer, nestea, mkp etc.) and not bomber, ace, thewind, squirtle etc.
I also think a lot of you are underestimating the delay. It's hard to show good games with 2 second delay. With some players it won't matter (they're way more skilled than others). But I really don't think mid level koreans would go very far in this tournament anyways.
I would rate Bomber, Ace and Squirtle above Fruitdealer in his current state tbh.
Nestea/mkp didn't apply, and even without them there are very high-class Koreans who did.
E: I realize I come across as a Korean fanboy, but I'm really not  , just saying that I would invite guys like Ace, Top and Squirtle over someone like Cruncher (No offense or something, he's a good player), and even someone like Grubby who has shown incredible improvement lately.
Then again, I shouldn't complain because not every invitée has been announced already.
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Why would anyone say anything about not accepting europeans? There are roughly an equal number of europeans and americans accepted so far...
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On March 24 2011 03:30 Mephiztopheles1 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 24 2011 03:12 MgZ)ResT wrote:atm I completely agree with theirs choices  I hope that they'll continue on this way! With CrunCher? Naniwa?! Really? One of the most volatile and temperamental players of the scene... Not jumping on the "let's make the other 26 remaining players koreans" bandwagon but so far, NASL is far from fulfilling their "Star" League name.
so you don´t want one of the best or propably even the best european protoss in the nasl just because he is "volatile and temperamental" but want to have a star-league with the best players? makes no sense to me
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Totally happy with the list so far, people whinging wanting the league to be 80% Koreans or whatever need to get over it, it was never going to happen and nor should it happen, although I hope they add at least a few more Koreans as I love Korean vs "foreigner" battles. Plus there's still a large amount of people still to be added!
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On March 24 2011 03:35 DoomsVille wrote:
Why would anyone say anything about not accepting europeans? There are roughly an equal number of europeans and americans accepted so far...
You did... because American's are too patriotic.... we don't want Euro's we want only 7th generation Americans!
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Has NASL said how players were placed in the divisions? Was it a random draw(other than splitting teammates) or were players "placed" in the divisions by staff? I'm curious.
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On March 24 2011 03:35 Fyzar wrote:I would rate Bomber, Ace and Squirtle above Fruitdealer in his current state tbh. Nestea/mkp didn't apply, and even without them there are very high-class Koreans who did. E: I realize I come across as a Korean fanboy, but I'm really not , just saying that I would invite guys like Ace, Top and Squirtle over someone like Cruncher (No offense or something, he's a good player), and even someone like Grubby who has shown incredible improvement lately. Then again, I shouldn't complain because not every invitée has been announced already.
Yea I see what you're saying. I totally agree that Bomber, Ace and Squirtle are probably 50x better than some of the americans accepted. But it isn't always about who the very best players are... Part of it is a popularity contest and bomber, ace or squirtle just won't win a popularity contest. Fruitdealer may be in weaker shape right now, but everyone and their mother knows who he is. Unless you follow korean tournaments you'd have no idea who Bomber is. And when the tournaments are on at 4 am... not many americans stay up to watch bomber play... I certainly haven't seen a single game of his because I don't want to stay up all night to watch it.
Like Grubby, he has an awesome chance of being accepted. And that is purely because he is perhaps the most progamer outside of Korea.
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Lots of ROOT players one in every division.
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Someone has absolutely no understanding of real American culture - just what they hear on the news and see on TV.
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On March 24 2011 03:40 Hrrrrm wrote:
Has NASL said how players were placed in the divisions? Was it a random draw(other than splitting teammates) or were players "placed" in the divisions by staff? I'm curious.
Probably placed them or a combination of both. They asked questions like "who are your biggest rivals?" in the application videos. Which leads me to believe that they will intentionally match a few players against each other. Atleast I hope they do. I'd love to see some Zenio/Drewbie vs. IdrA grudge matches lol
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Pretty stacked so far so I'm pretty excited. People are forgeting that if the Koreans really want be in this all they have to do is play in the open tournament and they would probably sweep all 8 spots
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On March 24 2011 03:43 justdweezil wrote:
Someone has absolutely no understanding of real American culture - just what they hear on the news and see on TV.
I think the bigger issue is people are misinterpreting what I'm saying. I'm not trying to say American fans want to only see an American tournament and want the rest of the world to burn.
Let's put it this way. Given the choice between some north american player like Slush vs. some korean that most americans have never seen play like Bomber, the american will choose to want to see Slush play. Support the home town kid if you've never heard/seen the foreigner.
For that reason, the best/most popular koreans will get in. But the majority won't.
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I can't believe how bad the presentation of this is. This is the only thing that bugs me about NASL. I mean, this is supposed to be the foreigners answer to GSL, boasting 400k in prize pools. But they can't do something a drunk kid could do in Microsoft FrontPage.
That aside, I'm still unbelievable pumped for this. They're obviously saving the real big hitters for last. I really, really hope this turns awesome.
Good luck to everyone working on this.
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On March 24 2011 03:43 Acidrain77 wrote:
Lots of ROOT players one in every division.
not division 5
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On March 24 2011 03:50 DoomsVille wrote:Show nested quote +On March 24 2011 03:43 justdweezil wrote:
Someone has absolutely no understanding of real American culture - just what they hear on the news and see on TV. I think the bigger issue is people are misinterpreting what I'm saying. I'm not trying to say American fans want to only see an American tournament and want the rest of the world to burn. Let's put it this way. Given the choice between some north american player like Slush vs. some korean that most americans have never seen play like Bomber, the american will choose to want to see Slush play. Support the home town kid if you've never heard/seen the foreigner. For that reason, the best/most popular koreans will get in. But the majority won't.
I have no idea where Slush is from.... because he's not been a good enough player to warrant me knowing that. I've heard of him... even seen some of his games and read some of his posts.
But you say he's American? Well, he's my new favorite then! I hope he's got 2 white parents.... then i could really get into it!
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On March 24 2011 03:46 DoomsVille wrote:Show nested quote +On March 24 2011 03:40 Hrrrrm wrote:
Has NASL said how players were placed in the divisions? Was it a random draw(other than splitting teammates) or were players "placed" in the divisions by staff? I'm curious. Probably placed them or a combination of both. They asked questions like "who are your biggest rivals?" in the application videos. Which leads me to believe that they will intentionally match a few players against each other. Atleast I hope they do. I'd love to see some Zenio/Drewbie vs. IdrA grudge matches lol
Yeah I figured they would do something like that but, I want to know how it was finally done. Official response or what have you. Since lately they've all been about "integrity" I want to see if that was present in the group placement process.
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On March 24 2011 02:42 Kazeyonoma wrote:
I hope the finals have a ton of Europeans too then which strangely enough, isn't ever argued by the "pro-american only" people. Why so much hate for koreans but not for other non-US players?
Three major reasons for me:
If you invite many many Koreans and they dominate this, then where is the difference to GSL? If one wants to see the Koreans duke it out, he should just watch GSL cause that's the Korean's league.
And the Koreans don't really make it easy for foreigners to participate in their league either cause you have to move to Korea and go through the whole qualification process until you can finally compete in Code S and make money. So GSL will always be mainly Koreans with very very few foreigners in it and NASL will hopefully be the best foreigners with some Koreans in it.
Second reason is that if Koreans dominate this it would not be because foreigners are not physically able to be as good but just because Koreans have the infrastructure and professionalism with their team houses and everything. Now apart from the occasional upset of an "underdog foreigner" winning, I don't see the fun in this.
That just sounds as much fun as putting a team of hobby football players in a professional league. Sure that's a team you might root for, but when they lose (and they will lose all the time), what can you say? Well the other team can actually train every day cause they are professionals?! I want to see players competing on an equal footing and have no excuses like that.
Third reason is the cultural and language barrier. They simply can't interact as well with the community. They just won't be as interesting for us. They will not post here, they will not stream for us, they will not joke around with the other players and commentators, they won't be friends or rivals of any of our players. It's just that much more interesting when you have foreigners.
Now obviously if Koreans do not dominate, reason one and two do not apply. But why then invite many Koreans over foreigners anyway?
I'm not saying no Koreans at all, but I want this to be a league for the best foreigners as opposed to a league for the best Koreans which already exist. So for me, the limit of Koreans is 10. I think 2 Koreans in every division would be fine, just so we can see what the foreigner level is compared to that of the Koreans at all time.
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On March 24 2011 03:56 dsousa wrote:I have no idea where Slush is from.... because he's not been a good enough player to warrant me knowing that. I've heard of him... even seen some of his games and read some of his posts.
But you say he's American? Well, he's my new favorite then! I hope he's got 2 white parents.... then i could really get into it!
Me and pretty much everyone else that has followed NA SC2 (MLGs mostly) do know who he is and have seen him compete. Which is the point.
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EPT
