EPT[G] The Great Book of Protoss Bullshit - Page 17
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Rasias
Germany51 Posts
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Waise
3165 Posts
On April 04 2014 05:23 Rasias wrote: I would love to see similar guides for Zerg and Terran, as i've quite some problems with cheesing myself (as Zerg). the closest thing i can think of to this type of bullshit for zerg is in zvz where you just build a bunch of lings off 2hatch/1base saturation and yolo it at your opponent. it's nowhere near as strong as protoss bullshit, but it's still good for some free wins against zergs who just want to lazily macro up to 2base roach. scout his overlord positioning with your overlords and use a wonky attack path for extra points another fun total bullshit build that can beat good players based on pure "what the fuck, is he really doing this?/there's no way this will work" surprise factor if they underreact is zvt 7pool + timed pull of 1-3 drones to block the wall from going down and in zvp/zvz, good old 2-3 hatch nydus roach/queen all ins can still make people rage pretty hard sadly of course none of these are as good against mid-high level players as the stuff in the OP  | ||
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Mahtasooma
Germany475 Posts
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seak99
Canada69 Posts
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exog
Norway279 Posts
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iFVeritas
Ireland29 Posts
- Build Swarmhost The End | ||
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SC2Toastie
Netherlands5725 Posts
On April 03 2014 22:17 johnbongham wrote: I wish this were funny but this exact bullshit is the reason why people tune out for the finals of pretty much any big tournament. That last final in Katowice seemed to be completely forgettable - but I wouldn't know - because I stopped watching when Jjakji got beat 3-0 in the quarters or semis or whatever. Also this upcoming gsl final? Nope, not watching that either, couldn't care less...I fail to see how something is funny when its quite clearly hurting the viewership of our 'beloved' game. As an oldshcool counterstrike fan who switched to sc2 upon release, it blows my mind that CSGO crushed sc2 in viewership for the final. I never would have expected that in a thousand years. Are free wins for protoss players really worth the damage its doing to the game in terms of playerbase and spectators? I mean, I know most kids are playing protoss because they don't want to actually learn how to play, but not everybody is hopping on the bandwagon. Many people are just playing a different game altogether. The idea that terran and zerg players(mostly terran) are whining for the sake of whining is ludicrous. They are whining because the game is clearly broken. Maybe protoss can't win 100% of the time, but anytime I DO beat a protoss, it is usually the result of my protoss opponent being incompetent and making terrible decisions. If a protoss player is at all competent at executing builds, the sky is the limit really. Hit your timing, do your damage, and if no GG is called then jus take a 3rd make a deathball and finish the job. Its great that the tl "strategy writers" can propagate this stuff and think its funny, but at the same time this site bans people for opening their mouths about problems which have gone on way too long without being fully addressed. You cant instigate stuff and a the same time punish people for giving their opinion. The arrogance is maddening. Don't even try. This thread is full of hypocrits and trolls. Every ladder player between platinum and masters knows most Protosses just win because the cheese is strong and easy and they can't really be cheesed themselves. I laugh my pants loff everytime I hold a cheese and see them struggle with anything macro-oriented for the entire game (no ups, 100/100 on every nexus, no expand, no extra gates, forgetting tech, floating 2k/1k). That being said, playing Protoss is just as frustrating, because every game you win is instantly devalued because your race is op/bullshit. And playing macroToss isn't that much fun because you feel abused because your army can't do anything when under 100supply... The race needs fixing, but well, who am I... User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On April 04 2014 16:58 SC2Toastie wrote: Don't even try. This thread is full of hypocrits and trolls. Every ladder player between platinum and masters knows most Protosses just win because the cheese is strong and easy and they can't really be cheesed themselves. I laugh my pants loff everytime I hold a cheese and see them struggle with anything macro-oriented for the entire game (no ups, 100/100 on every nexus, no expand, no extra gates, forgetting tech, floating 2k/1k). That being said, playing Protoss is just as frustrating, because every game you win is instantly devalued because your race is op/bullshit. And playing macroToss isn't that much fun because you feel abused because your army can't do anything when under 100supply... The race needs fixing, but well, who am I... Macro Protoss players are by far the most scary thing on the ladder. The few Protoss that always play macro - they are so good at it and you are so shit at macro game because you hardly ever get to train one, since everybody is just cheesing. It's frustrating, because I feel like I'm so shitty at ZvP despite it usually being the MU with my highest Winrate. | ||
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SC2Toastie
Netherlands5725 Posts
On April 04 2014 17:50 Big J wrote: Macro Protoss players are by far the most scary thing on the ladder. The few Protoss that always play macro - they are so good at it and you are so shit at macro game because you hardly ever get to train one, since everybody is just cheesing. It's frustrating, because I feel like I'm so shitty at ZvP despite it usually being the MU with my highest Winrate. Macroprotoss is scary to play against, but so is macro terran or macro zerg. It's just that macro protoss is a bit boring to play. You're never safe to take map control until late in te game. Also, it is really easy to die to obnoxious stuff. You as a Zerg should know the feeling: you scout some attack, but aren't sure how exCtly to hold it of, or your tech is slightly late. Protosses that want to take a third have that happen to them all the time. What I want to say is, Protoss cheese is so easy and powerful, while macro is actually pretty hard (despite what some Terrans think, Toss isn't trollol F2a click t click t click). Protoss is weak until an army is established. Makes macro games boring and hard, compared to fastpaced, easy cheeses. | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On April 04 2014 18:13 SC2Toastie wrote: Macroprotoss is scary to play against, but so is macro terran or macro zerg. It's just that macro protoss is a bit boring to play. You're never safe to take map control until late in te game. Also, it is really easy to die to obnoxious stuff. You as a Zerg should know the feeling: you scout some attack, but aren't sure how exCtly to hold it of, or your tech is slightly late. Protosses that want to take a third have that happen to them all the time. What I want to say is, Protoss cheese is so easy and powerful, while macro is actually pretty hard (despite what some Terrans think, Toss isn't trollol F2a click t click t click). Protoss is weak until an army is established. Makes macro games boring and hard, compared to fastpaced, easy cheeses. My point simply is: The macro Protoss players usually have the luxury of always training useful games. As their opponent, you need to have two times the amount of games played against Protoss to have the same amount of macro experience. Whether or not it is harder or boring, I don't care. It's their own choice to play Protoss. If they wouldn't like to play like that, they wouldn't play Protoss. But in fact, Protoss has the most players, and I think it is because most people actually like Protoss gameplay. It makes for shit games for the opponent and the viewers, but the Protoss player himself has a ton of fun executing a rush. Similarily to Swam Hosts or turtle mech or macro Protoss, which is very fun to play with if you like that slow methodical gameplay. But playing against it, with the opponent just building one inpenetrable position after the other is pretty boring. | ||
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
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KOtical
Germany451 Posts
User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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SC2Toastie
Netherlands5725 Posts
On April 04 2014 18:35 Big J wrote: My point simply is: The macro Protoss players usually have the luxury of always training useful games. As their opponent, you need to have two times the amount of games played against Protoss to have the same amount of macro experience. Whether or not it is harder or boring, I don't care. It's their own choice to play Protoss. If they wouldn't like to play like that, they wouldn't play Protoss. But in fact, Protoss has the most players, and I think it is because most people actually like Protoss gameplay. It makes for shit games for the opponent and the viewers, but the Protoss player himself has a ton of fun executing a rush. Similarily to Swam Hosts or turtle mech or macro Protoss, which is very fun to play with if you like that slow methodical gameplay. But playing against it, with the opponent just building one inpenetrable position after the other is pretty boring. Actually, playing verse Mech is fun, because Mech can be caught out of position regularly. Protoss is actually pretty damn mobile for a turtle race. I recently read something about area control and how fun it was. Area control is very fun for the player executing it, and supercrustrating for those fighting against it. What can we call are control...? Sieged tanks, PF, PDD, HSM, EMP, Nuke (the last four are situational, PF is only defensivd) Fungal Growth, Broodlord, Abduct, Hosts, Creep, Blinding Cloud (Zerg being the super fast race, their area control is pretty weak, but less important) Storm, Time Warp, Forcefield, Collosi, Tempest, Overcharge, "Pylon" Obviously, some stuff is situational, etc, but these are the most regularly seen. Protoss has by far the best control of area's, which should come at a loss of mobility (See: BW Terran Mech). An interesting dynamic occurs when the opponent used superior mobility to abuse the powerful but limited zoning abilities of the slower race. This dynamic is missing with Protoss on the current easy 3 base maps, which, assuming what I sais is true, makes Protoss more fun and the other side of the matchup more frustrating. However, I'm far offtopic, so PM for anyone who wants to discuss this any further :-) | ||
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User15937
68 Posts
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Catch]22
Sweden2683 Posts
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covetousrat
2109 Posts
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BlueSky308
United States12 Posts
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On April 06 2014 03:19 SatedSC2 wrote: One build per matchup is enough to get you to Masters if you do it well enough. Just look at people who Cannon Rush or 6 Pool or 11/11 to Masters  "the people" are like 1-2 guys we know off... that did so 1-3years ago... | ||
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