EPTPvP: 2-Gate Robo Expand in HotS
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/5iyPoCA.jpg)
Contents
- Introduction
- PvP Timings: what any build needs to deal with
- Opening build
- The Probe scout / Warpgate timings
- The Observer scout / Reactions
- Replays and Resources
- Acknowledgements
- Changelog
Introduction
- Hi! My name's Adrenal and I've been around since Wings beta. I used to play competitively in UK LANs through 2010 and early 2011. After my uni exams that year I slowed down, did some free coaching, did a bit of commentary and then eventually quit. I've come back to the game for HotS and have rediscovered some of the fun I used to have with it. Nowadays I'm just your average Masters player, but I've been slowly improving on the ladder and long may that continue.
Back in the day, I used to love coming up with builds and that hasn't changed; yet I've never written a SC2 guide on TL. This is partly because I was concentrating more on actually getting good at the game back then, but mostly because I used to come up with seriously freaky stuff that people would laugh out of the room.
As a chronic problem-solver (and Maths PhD student) I really enjoyed applying myself to get around issues I had with existing builds. I did everything from FFE double Robo against Zerg to the classic mass DT/Phoenix/Observer PvP (surprisingly effective). Sadly, the build presented here is not quite so clinically insane.
It's worth mentioning: I make no claim of originality with this build. While my previous efforts were motivated out of a desire to come up with something wildly different, this build was motivated by a desire to play a safe style in PvP and get to the midgame in as solid a situation as possible. As such, the title (2-Gate Robo Expand) is definitely not new. In fact, you might already be furiously composing an expletive-laden response which compares me to some form of barn animal. Stick with it, though. Since there seems to be a lack of "current" Protoss guides hanging around, I feel duty bound to offer this up.
So the goal of the build, in a nutshell, is to get you an expansion, tech and good scouting with constant Probe production whilst remaining very safe against several common early PvP openings. It'll fit the style of anybody who prefers to play safer, lengthier macro games.
In short, while I am no professional, I hope this helps some of you. Best of luck!
PvP Timings: what any build needs to deal with
- So when I started playing HotS and was looking for builds, I stumbled across one of Hellokitty's excellent Protoss replay packs. He was using this neat 3-Gate timing, courtesy of I-don't-know-who, that seemed to stomp pretty much everyone. I promptly adopted the build on ladder.
After dozens of PvPs, the problem I had was that while the build seemed to do excellently against Stargate openings the majority of the time - and plenty of Gateway openings - it didn't perform so well against Robo or DT players. DT builds in particular hurt it pretty badly, because the Dark Shrine would finish a little after the Warpgate push hit.
Robo builds also had a pretty good chance. With the inclusion of the Mothership Core, the defending player essentially gets an extra minute to prepare a defense; more than enough time to get an Immortal out (generally with a second finishing as the Photon Overcharge wore off) so all I could do was back off and play a standard game from an inferior position.
So as many games as that rush won me, I decided to start constructing a more solid build. With the above timings in mind, let's take a look at what our proposed build has to deal with.
Warpgate Timings
- The addition of the MSC to HotS has seriously changed the earlygame PvP dynamic. In Wings the viable builds were - at least in the early days, before 4-Gate fell out of favour - limited to those which were capable of such a defense by 6:00.
- Gas Timings: Players are generally taking two quick gasses before their Core, causing the mineral timings to line up a little worse and slow WGR slightly.
- Mothership Core: Pretty much any PvP build has an MSC out by ~4:30, maybe 15 seconds later at the most. This, combined with your first 2-3 Gateway units and the sedate pace at which your opponent's MSC moves across the map, makes it easier to deny Pylons near your base, slowing the rush.
- Photon Overcharge: This essentially gives you an extra minute to prepare after the push hits. Anybody who engages into a PO Nexus with 6-8 Stalkers has one hell of a deathwish.
The end result of all this is that the most vicious Warpgate timing I know of will hit with an MSC and 8 Stalkers at ~6:15, boosting that to anywhere between 11 and 14 by the time the Overcharge wears off at about 7:15. We'll need enough to beat that amount at that timing, or at least the capability to get enough.
These days, a few factors have changed:
Oracle Timings
- This is more simple; although the Oracle timing does depend on whether it's proxied and the path it takes. If your opponent goes for a suicidally fast proxy Stargate then the Oracle can hit as early as 5:30, but it's more likely the earliest it'll hit is ~6:00. We'll need something out to deal with that, ideally not Photon Overcharge.
DT Rushes
- This is even simpler. A typical DT build will have the Dark Shrine finish at ~6:45, so you can expect DTs in your base a little after that. We'll need some form of reliable detection by then.
Opening Build
- Put simply, the build is as follows:
- Spend all chronos on your Nexus as soon as you get the energy until mentioned otherwise. Constant Probe production unless mentioned otherwise. 3 on each gas immediately.
- 13 Gate, 15 Pylon, 17 Gas (I use the completed 16th Probe for this)
- 18 Cyber Core + second Gas (+ scout)
- 20 Gate, 21 Pylon. Bank the next Chrono until after you begin the Stalker for slightly smoother timings.
- WGR when Core finishes, Stalker as soon as possible. (It doesn't line up immediately but isn't too much of a problem. You might have to wait 5 seconds.)
- 25 MSC
- Stalker/Zealot from your Gates. Bank chrono, continue Probes.
- 32 Robo, +1 Pylon in base, +1 Pylon on map (more on this later).
- Once Pylon finishes, two Stalkers (chrono both). Chrono Obs or Immortal when Robo finishes. Cut Probes if you're getting rushed.
- (Note: in most of my games, I make a Robo Bay blind while my Obs is heading to his base. I sometimes cancel it and sometimes let it finish. More on this later.)
- Build diverges.
The timings line up nicely. Here are the key points for a perfect execution of the build:
The 17 Gas: A small thing I do because I noticed that I didn't really need the double gas that early and going 15 Gas resulted in me getting a slower Cyber Core. The end effect of this is that you could replace the Zealot with another Stalker if you went for an earlier gas, but the timings would be really awkward.
Photon Overcharge: Your MSC will have energy for a Photon Overcharge at ~6:15, which should allow you to delay Warpgate timings.
Robo: Finishes at ~6:00, allowing you to get one (and a half!) Immortals out before 7:15 in the event of a Warpgate timing - or two Obs out at ~6:50 in the event of a passive start, allowing you to scout with one and defend DTs with the other.
WGR: Finishes just after those two chronoed Stalkers. The extra Pylon after the Robo allows you to quickly warp in two more Stalkers and start Immortal production, giving you a Zealot and 6 Stalkers at ~6:30 with pretty much constant Probe production.
Expansion: A little after WGR finishes, you'll have enough for a Nexus. This allows you to expand as soon as the window for a Warpgate timing passes, with an Obs scout to see what to follow up with.
I'll cover build divergence in the next two sections.
The Probe scout / Warpgate timings
The Initial Scout
- So you've sent your Probe out at 18ish. This timing is designed so that on a 2-player map you'll have time to take one good look at their base and get away before the Stalker comes out. On a 4-player map it's a bit less useful; unless you get lucky, you'll only find out where their base is rather than what they're doing. By the way, that's a great song. Give yourself a pat on the back for reading this far and enjoy the music.
- Gasses: If he's only taken one gas or has four Probes total on gas, he could be doing an aggressive build.
- Chronos: If he's spent two or less chronos on Probes or is spending chronos on WGR, he could be doing an aggressive build.
- Gateways: If he's dropped a second Gateway on two gasses, an aggressive build is still a possibility (but this is symptomatic of many tech builds as well).
The skill of being able to read a build from Wings PvP, unsurprisingly, carries over to HotS. The difference is here there's slightly less indication that somebody's doing an aggressive Gateway or Warp Prism build because everybody takes two quick gasses in mirror now. Here, though, are some key indicators of an aggressive build:
Really, though, these points aren't much to go off. I'm sure several of you are foaming at the mouth right now about how I know nothing and should go stick my head somewhere dark and smelly. That's why I've included the word could in the above points.
Remember, reading PvP builds is often an art and not a science and you should always account for every possibility. Of the above three, the chronos one is most important - that's a good indicator of some sort of rush.
If you're on a 4-player map and your Probe doesn't get into his base (or worse, dies) then you'll just need to add a warpgate timing to your list of possible builds he could be doing.
The Secondary Scout
- Now this bit is super-important, so listen closely. Save. The. Probe. If it dies, you're going to be a whole lot more in the dark with regard to his build than if it doesn't.
- If you see units at his ramp, like a Sentry or several Stalkers, you can be fairly safe in the knowledge that he's not doing an aggressive build (a Sentry is a great indicator of this). Feel free to expand immediately and start pumping Obs from your Robo.
- If you see no units at his ramp, run into his base and scout his tech/structures. 3+ Gateways indicates some form of pressure or all-in; if he's cutting Probes, it's going to be particularly vicious. Start pumping Immortals and position your MSC so it won't die to a bumrush. I also like to make a Pylon in the back of his base with my Probe (see later).
- If you scout less than 3 Gateways or some form of tech, you can be sure that you'll win pretty much any fight with the initial units you made during the opening build. Feel free to move out to your natural and expand. Only bother making an Immortal here if you feel particularly pressured - I have experienced some surprisingly aggressive delayed Gateway + Oracle builds (see replays).
Run it somewhere he's not likely to check and make your pylon. Immediately afterwards, you should run the Probe back in. If you got the timings right he'll reach the ramp at 6:00 or so and this allows you to tell whether or not you're playing against an aggressive build for certain.
Warpgate Timing - the Response
- This is a surprisingly simple response, because it's a very safe build. As soon as he runs his Stalkers up the ramp, Photon Overcharge your Nexus with your well-positioned MSC (!) and dump all remaining chronos into Immortal production. Add Stalkers and Pylons as money allows.
If you did the build correctly, you should have one Immortal out by the time Photon Overcharge wears off, with another about halfway to two-thirds done. From here, it should be a fairly comfortable defense if you micro correctly. Remember those Pylons from earlier? It's probably a good idea to make four Zealots and run them into his base now.
NB. In the event your Probe dies, if he hasn't arrived at your ramp by 6:30, you can be reasonably confident in placing a Nexus and making Obs.
The Observer scout / Reactions
- So let's assume he didn't Warpgate rush you. You've got an Obs out trundling towards his base and a Nexus going up, with a second Obs in your base. One of four or five things tends to happen here and this section will be devoted to what I like to do in each situation. I don't always get it right and these aren't set in stone; they're simply suggestions. Because the guide is about an opening, you could pretty much segue into whatever you like.
Dark Templar
- If he's gone for a DT build, you'll have DTs in your base before the scouting Obs actually reaches his base - so you essentially already know what's happening.
- Has He Expanded?: If he drops a Nexus you can just macro up safely with very little alteration to your build. I like to go Colossi and double upgrades because chances are he's not going to be attacking me any time soon.
- Council Upgrades?: If he hasn't expanded, it's imperative that you try and keep tabs on what units he's making and whether he's upgrading on the Twilight Council. He could be going Chargelot/Archon, in which case you want to wall off your natural with buildings and get some Colossi. He could be going Blink, in which case a building wall would be completely ineffective and instead you'll probably want some Immortals.
If he's not upgrading from the Council, he could be going for some funky quick Gateway timing with Archons, which Photon Overcharge on your natural should defend against. You should have enough for two Overcharges, during which you can add a couple of Gateways and pump some Colossi or something (don't bother with +range if you need units quickly). I never really see this, though, so it's sort of theorycraft. - Some Other Tech?: If he's transitioning into something else - probably with an expansion - just keep tabs on what he's doing and use some common sense. Remember, with your Obs you get complete information against a DT build because he has no detection. Use that information! It's quite difficult to really cover every possible transition here - that's the domain of a proper, entire PvP guide.
It should probably go without saying that you've just about build-order-won here. You have a free scout on everything in his base because he has no detection, so make the most of it. You're looking for a few things here:
Oracles/Phoenixes/Stargate
- Again, you'll probably see this quickly because Oracles tend to arrive in your base before your Obs arrives in theirs. I've tested this build quite a bit against Stargate with a friend of mine and I think it comes down to personal preference what you do. The Help Me Thread has two or three good suggestions catalogued in the OP. I generally like to go Blink if I see heavy Phoenix production and a slow double Stargate Phoenixes if I see Voids.
Robo
- This is why I tend to make the blind Robo Bay before my Obs reaches their base. If I scout a Robo I can just immediately go +range Colossi. Obviously you've got to be fairly careful with losing your Obs, but you should still try and keep tabs on whether your opponent techs or expands.
Generally in this situation I just try and aim for a nice Colossus/Void --> Archon lategame and use my wits to win it! Given that this is the best Robo build I could come up with, I think you should be either slightly ahead or equal in Colossus production against an opponent going into the midgame unless they played it super-risky.
Council Play
- Similar methods apply here to the ones described in the DT section; the difference being that your opponent has their choice of upgrade out a little faster. Again, Photon Overcharge buys you a bit of time to get the right units out; you won't have two Overcharges at this point, though.
1-Gate Expo
- I actually haven't played against this, ever, so take these words with a grain of salt. Apparently it's something rsvp has been doing on ladder and so I assume other people are too. I've taken a look at the replays and if you kept the Probe alive then it would scout the Nexus timing so you'd at least have that information. I think this opening is probably the only one against which you really come out behind and is definitely a weakness. It'd be cool to have some input from rsvp and co. about whether this is common or what 2-Gate Robo could do against it, because any early pressure would run into Photon Overcharge.
Replays and Resources
- These will be added to as more games and VoDs become available. Here is a small selection of a variety of styles to get people started. It's also worth noting I screw up the build a little in several of these.
- http://drop.sc/325741 -- vs proxy Stargate into 3-Gate Stargate all-in. I actually don't screw up the build too much here! I lose 4 Probes to the Oracle but come out of the opening with equal Probes and an expansion.
- http://drop.sc/325744 -- vs 1-Gate Robo --> Nexus. I miss the third Pylon for a few seconds but it's essentially fine. He goes double Stargate, I match it and Phoenixes > Voids. We come out of the opening equal on Probes with a slightly faster expansion for him.
- http://drop.sc/325743 -- vs 1-Gate Stargate --> Nexus. He goes double Stargate in the midgame, I go for a cheeky 5-Gate Blink and hammer the door down. After a while. I come out of the opening with more Probes and a faster Nexus.
- http://drop.sc/325745 -- vs 2-Gate Stargate --> Nexus. Perhaps not a great execution of the build (I forget my Robo for a bit!) but an amusing game and an interesting + very aggressive build from him. Midgame is Blink for me against Charge/Phoenix for him. I come out of the opening waaaaay behind and probably shouldn't have won.
- http://drop.sc/325742 -- vs a DT expand. I come out of the opening miles ahead and it turns into a macro game, which I (eventually!) win. My Observer scouting a bit lacking in this game and I screw up the midgame a bit, but at least it demonstrates how the build crushes a DT opener.
- http://drop.sc/325753 -- here's one I lose, but I've included it to demonstrate how it deals with a Warpgate timing. I mess a few things up here, including a lack of constant Probe production after I fight off the rush. Even though he had an earlier expansion, I feel like if I'd just gone for a Colossus and played as normal rather than being clever with a Warp Prism and Blink then I would have had a higher Probe count and earlier tech.
- http://drop.sc/331288 -- added by request, a replay of this beating a 4-Gate. I even fail to pick off the Probe during the initial rush, resulting in a Pylon on the high ground inside my base. Luckily, it's quite possible to beat a 4-Gate with this build. I just run down the other end of the map and put the poor guy out of his misery.
Acknowledgements
- Even if they weren't aware of it, a lot of people helped with the creation of this guide!
Thanks for blade55555 whose excellent Zerg overview gave me some ideas and techniques for the formatting of this post. Thanks also to rsvp, Hellokitty, Teoita and the entire Protoss Help Me Thread for giving me lots of ideas along the way. Replay packs are a great service to the community and I hope you guys continue to release them!
Finally, thanks to Haz for repeatedly stomping early versions of the build in CGs.
Changelog
- version 1.0.0: Guide released (20/04/13)
- version 1.0.1: 4-Gate replay added by request. See my response on page 2 regarding additional potential replays. (07/05/13)
