EPT[G] Hyper-Aggressive ZvT: Countering the 2Rax (GM) - Page 9
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Moldwood
United States280 Posts
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TangSC
Canada1866 Posts
On October 13 2011 09:50 Ballistixz wrote: sry but i have to disagree with this to. if the terran has any kind of knowledge about this game then he will know that a 1 base zerg can only mean ONE thing, and that is a all in of some sort. if he knows ur on 1 base (which is not hard to find out since all zergs get there expos insanely early) then t he should come to the LOGICAL conclusion that its a baneling bust all in. lets face it, its not that hard to scout out a 1 base zerg. especially when u see he is making a damn baneling nest before his first hatch ffs -_- Your usual time to put down a hatchery as a 14g14p opener will be roughly 4minutes. If you think there aren't terran players who will push out and try to delay this by putting down bunkers or doing marine/scv pressure, then you're mistaken - it has happened to me countless times. If they pull out with 3 scvs and constant stream of marines via 2rax pressure and see no expo, it's very uncommon for them to instantly pull back to their base. They'll almost always try to pressure or contain, and very frequently will over commit and be incapable of holding a ling/bane counter attack. If they wall in your ramp, you get banelings bust out and then counter attack immediately hoping they put up a CC and are low on minerals to bunker (almost always the case). It's not that hard to deny scouting of your nest if you have lings. Once you've held his contain, you'll have speed done - how's he going to scout you? If they put up one bunker at your natural, then you can surround it by producing only speedlings, saving the gas to baneling bust at the terran's main. | ||
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dicksonlam708
Canada31 Posts
http://i.imgur.com/UKLXb.jpg | ||
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TangSC
Canada1866 Posts
Taken completely out of context lol | ||
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forevernerdy
England31 Posts
EDIT: On second thought, this may not be the worst response because it would be pretty hard for terran to scout the baneling nest if the zerg has speedlings. I think you'd have to use a scan to see the main or the expansion to know whether this type of bust is coming. Against proxy raxes, like the Richman game, it's definitely a viable response. | ||
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iAmJeffReY
United States4262 Posts
On November 08 2011 04:47 TangSC wrote: http://s1141.photobucket.com/albums/n587/tang442244/?action=view¤t=DizonBlackmail.jpg Private photobucket there, chief. Try link again. | ||
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iiGreetings
Canada563 Posts
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nanaoei
3358 Posts
i would personally be content with the fact that a zerg is not expanding at 15 supply, and use a defensive 2-rax as well as a defensive pos. at home in order to defend and tech safely. we all obviously play different styles, but even as a zerg i find it easy to make extra lings and to destroy an aggressive 2-rax with 14/14. what you're proposing in your guide is different though since you want to make a kill-move out-right, and i can only imagine that working atleast most of the time when the terran uses proxy-raxes. it would also work if you caught them as they were finishing a barracks wall on certain maps---other than that, i would feel like it would be a situation where i'd always be ahead. | ||
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TangSC
Canada1866 Posts
On November 25 2011 01:30 nanaoei wrote: with how its been said many times already, i would personally be content with the fact that a zerg is not expanding at 15 supply, and use a defensive 2-rax as well as a defensive pos. at home in order to defend and tech safely. we all obviously play different styles, but even as a zerg i find it easy to make extra lings and to destroy an aggressive 2-rax with 14/14. what you're proposing in your guide is different though since you want to make a kill-move out-right, and i can only imagine that working atleast most of the time when the terran uses proxy-raxes. it would also work if you caught them as they were finishing a barracks wall on certain maps---other than that, i would feel like it would be a situation where i'd always be ahead. Definitely true. It certainly catches a lot of terran players off guard though - they'll either try to tech too fast, expand too fast, or be too aggressive and this push will roll any of those options. You have to play it defensively and keep constant marine production, wall in, and bunker to defend it (and a lot of players don't do this after their 2rax fails) | ||
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Masq
Canada1792 Posts
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TheSubtleArt
Canada2527 Posts
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rkffhk
474 Posts
its like they're scared and trying to trick you into not making this apart of the metagame. | ||
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TheSubtleArt
Canada2527 Posts
On November 25 2011 10:32 rkffhk wrote: I love how all the Terrans in this thread are like 'dude if T scouts you its so over and you lose gg lol" its like they're scared and trying to trick you into not making this apart of the metagame. Or cause it's true... the trick is to look at Zerg's gas directly after the spawning pool finishes. With 14/14 you get 100 gas as soon as the pool is done. If Zerg pulls drones off gas after that 100, it means speedling expand. If Zerg keeps mining gas, it means an all in is coming. Incredibly easy tell. | ||
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TangSC
Canada1866 Posts
On November 25 2011 13:31 TheSubtleArt wrote: Or cause it's true... the trick is to look at Zerg's gas directly after the spawning pool finishes. With 14/14 you get 100 gas as soon as the pool is done. If Zerg pulls drones off gas after that 100, it means speedling expand. If Zerg keeps mining gas, it means an all in is coming. Incredibly easy tell. That's actually a really good point that a lot of players don't do, scouting gas timing / whether zerg takes guys out of gas is crucial. After zerg gets 100 gas you should see whether they continue mining gas or take them out - even if they hatch first, it's important to note whether they go gas before or gas after pool, as gas-first is more indicative of aggression. | ||
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frankster
United Kingdom8 Posts
Stop putting GM in your post titles until you've actually made it into GM. Until then you are basically a fraud, tricking people into paying for coaching on the basis that you're GM level when you're not. | ||
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Nate.F
918 Posts
On November 25 2011 03:10 TangSC wrote: Definitely true. It certainly catches a lot of terran players off guard though - they'll either try to tech too fast, expand too fast, or be too aggressive and this push will roll any of those options. You have to play it defensively and keep constant marine production, wall in, and bunker to defend it (and a lot of players don't do this after their 2rax fails) it catches them off-guard if they dont scout. in order words, it'll work if your opponent is bad. and, when your opponent scouts you on one-base, he'll respond to that 1-base play by building bunkers and pumping non-stop marines. the reason why this build doesn't work is that you can't use it as a response to 2 rax, because you have essentially committed to it before even scouting the 2 rax by going 14 gas 14 pool. stop claiming that its a response. | ||
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BossPlaya
United States141 Posts
On November 26 2011 01:03 frankster wrote: So tang you lost all credibility for me when you say "GM" in the title, yet looking on sc2ranks, you are in masters. and you are currently #1000 in your region, which means there are 1200 higher scored thus better players than you in your region, which means you don't have a bats chance of getting into GM as only 200 people fit in there. Stop putting GM in your post titles until you've actually made it into GM. Until then you are basically a fraud, tricking people into paying for coaching on the basis that you're GM level when you're not. He was GM last season, dick. Watch his Waterloo lecture (about an hour long) and he explains his GM status in the beginning. | ||
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TangSC
Canada1866 Posts
On November 26 2011 01:03 frankster wrote: So tang you lost all credibility for me when you say "GM" in the title, yet looking on sc2ranks, you are in masters. and you are currently #1000 in your region, which means there are 1200 higher scored thus better players than you in your region, which means you don't have a bats chance of getting into GM as only 200 people fit in there. Stop putting GM in your post titles until you've actually made it into GM. Until then you are basically a fraud, tricking people into paying for coaching on the basis that you're GM level when you're not. When I created this article I was in GM. I've never tricked anyone, I'm just trying to contribute. | ||
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Harstem
Netherlands263 Posts
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Moosegills
United States558 Posts
On November 26 2011 02:37 Harstem wrote: Holy shit, all the hate in this thread. This guy is trying to help you with a guide. He never claims this is a solid build, nor does he claim that this will win all your games. He just gives you guys a build which might work. Maybe be thankful for people like him. If he didn't think it was a solid build (which it definitely is not) why would he make a guide about it? | ||
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